Creative Pep Talk
012 - Life vs Work
(upbeat music) Hey y'all, just a quick heads up. The episode you're about to listen to is eight to 10 years old. Now, these episodes were intended to be evergreen, and I still believe there's a lot of good information in these early episodes, but I do wanna let you know that some of my ideas have evolved over time. Times have changed since we made these episodes, and ultimately, I'd like to think I've grown a lot as an artist and a human, and that these don't necessarily represent my best work, or the best of the podcast. If you're new around here, I suggest starting with the most recent episode, or at least go back to around 300, and move forward from there. Enjoy the episode. The holidays are upon us, and finding the right gift for your kids, nieces, and nephews, and partner, and family members can be super difficult, but it doesn't have to be. Go check out Uncommon Goods. Sophie and I were checking it out the other day, looking for gifts for our kids. They have a make your own storybook kit, which we love. There's this cardboard tool kit, with a cardboard saw that's safe and connectors, so you can build cool stuff and forts and whatnot. They also got these building connectors where you can connect sticks and make them for it. Mainly, I just like forts, but there's tons of cool, creative gifts that will inspire your kids to go make stuff, but we could also easily have just bought stuff for each other, or even ourselves. This curated selection of goods means you don't have to scour the internet for something unique and exciting, and you're supporting artists and small businesses at the same time, which you know I love. To get 15% off your next gift, go to uncommongoods.com/peptalk. That's uncommongoods.com/peptalk. For 15% off, don't miss out on this limited time offer, uncommon goods. We're all out of the ordinary. (soft music) It's the creative Peptalk podcast, and this is me, Andy J. Miller, illustrator/designer. You know, I'm gonna be kind of switching gears a little bit. If you're not an illustrator, designer, or visual artist, you can keep listening, and a lot of this will apply to all kinds of different creative professionals, but I'm gonna gear it a little bit more directly to that crowd, just because that's what I know, that's what I do, and I don't think there are enough resources out there geared directly towards that field, and so, yeah, so this is gonna become a little bit more focused on illustration and design, and so, hope that is good for you. Today, I wanna talk about something that I was asking on Twitter if there were any topics that came up, or any topics that you guys wanted me to tackle, and one of the ones that came up from a buddy of mine, Daniel Fischl, and also then reiterated by, I think it's Chris Carfalaite, sorry if I'm saying that wrong, Chris, and they were both asking about this idea of professional life versus personal life, or juggling these things, and I think in the question, kind of lies the answer, Daniel said it like, personal life versus professional life, and here's my kind of the idea behind this episode, it's that the biggest thing that I think needs to happen is, and I'm not sure exactly if this is what you think, Daniel, but this is kind of what I try to view things as, which is changing that attitude altogether, and not seeing my personal life and my professional life as things that are competing for each other. Now, Chris was saying, how do you balance a day job and being an active freelancer, and so it's a little bit different, but it's similar, this balancing question of these two separate lives that you have, and I think that the detriment, the thing that really kills it is, is thinking that these things are opposing forces. You know, I think I was recently talking to my dad, we talk a lot, and we were talking about just different relational things, and he was saying that something that he's noticing is that often things come at us as opposing forces when really they're working in conjunction with each other, they're working in concert together, and I really do believe that this is the case for this, and actually, the more that you can see your personal life and your professional life as being one thing that works in concert together, the more successful I think that you'll be. The kind of my analogy for this, or my example is, thinking about music, and I, you know, for whatever reason, for good or for bad, the way that I view creativity is through an analytical spectrum, and I'm always analyzing other people's professional, creative careers, and I'm always trying to glean what I can take from it, the good and the bad, you know, and one of the things that, the phenomenon that I'm, oh, I'm very interested in, I thought a lot about is, the idea of the sophomore slump, what's happening there when it comes to music. You know, a band will come out with this amazing first album, and then they'll come out with another album a year later, and that next album almost never lives up to the first album, almost never, and sometimes, that creates a pattern of kind of poor work afterwards. Now, I have a theory on why this is. Don't mind my coffee, you won't wanna grab one. I have a theory on what this is. My theory is that the first album, you know, I've heard people say like, you know, the first album they spend a whole lifetime making and the second album they make it in a year. I think that that's true, but I think it's something deeper than that, and it goes back to this personal life thing, is that the first album is on the back of life lived, and the music is about life. I'm a believer in the idea of dressing for the job you want, not the job you have, and I have applied this to my creative practice too, which means if you want professional results, you need to present online like a pro, and that means going beyond social media and having a professional website that reflects your style and looks legit. I rebuilt my site this year with Squarespace's fluid engine and was so happy with how easily I could build my vision without coding that when they approached me to support the show, I jumped at the chance because I love and use this product. So go check it out Squarespace.com/peptalk to test it out for yourself, and when you're ready to launch your site, use promo code PEPTALK, all one word, all caps for 10% off your first purchase. Thanks goes out to Squarespace for supporting the show and supporting creators all over the world. Hey, in case you don't know, we have a monthly live virtual meetup every last Monday of the month with supporters of the show from Patreon and Substack. We have so much fun on these calls and they are the warmest, most encouraging creatives that I have ever met, and we also talk real creative practice stuff. We have authors, illustrators, lettering artists, picture bookmakers, fine artists, musicians, and folks that work in video and film as well, and we have people that are just starting out, people super established in their creative careers and everything in between. For the rest of this year, we're gonna chat through our new "Journey of the True" fan series exploring questions and ways to apply these ideas to your own creative practice so that you can leave 2024 stronger than you came in with more visibility, connection with your audience, and sales. Sign up to whichever suits you best at either patreon.com/creativepeptalk or antijpizza.substack.com. And I hope to see you at this month's meetup. And then the second album is about making music. It's about being a band touring, and then it's about being in the studio. That is their life now. That's so not relatable to almost anyone, first of all. And second of all, it's not really a picture of life because life is about relationships and meaning and a hardship and wrestling with existential things and all these things, like that's what life is made up of. And I heard another, put another way, and I don't know who said this, I apologize, but that before you can write a book, you need to live a book with authors. Before you have another book in you to write, you've got to live, live it out first. You have to live, you have to, it takes time to go through the experiences. I feel like I've seen this in my own work where when I was 22 or something, struggling with the depth of my work, just not being super strong. And I can say as a 28-year-old, I feel like the depth of my work is growing and the pieces of work that I'm making, there's a lot more going on there. And I think that comes from growing up and having to deal with bills and fear for things happening to my kids and a marriage that has lasted for six years and the emotion and the depth and the power of all that stuff actually has given me something to actually talk about. And so what I always say is that you have to nurture your personal world, your personal life. You'll work away from, or your life away from work. And actually, not only do I think you have to do that because it's actually more important than your work, but I think the other reason I think that is because it actually makes your work so much better. I've always said, if you don't have a life, your work will lack life. And I think the more you see those, I feel like if I'm not present with other people, if I'm always obsessed with working, if I'm always thinking about the next piece of work I'm working on or the next goal I want, and I'm never connecting with other people. I'm never actually present in the moment with my kids and my wife and my family and my friends and my students. If I'm not there in the moment, then I'm becoming less human. I'm not going to be able to relate to anything else. And if I work becomes like that, no one will be able to relate to it other than maybe other people that do what I do. And I think you see this sometimes. Have you ever seen illustration that's about illustration for other illustrators? Yeah, sometimes illustrators kind of get into that. But I tell you what, you can't make money on it because illustrator, those are your competition. They're not trying to spend money on illustration. I mean, maybe you can make a little bit of money, but not a living. You can't make a living because those people, what they do, they're going to be influenced by what you're doing, that illustration about illustration for illustrators. And they're going to go make something for people. So I think the more that you think like that and you nurture your personal life, knowing that that's actually those experiences, those are what's going to make your work really come to life and animate. Now, I do believe, I think one of the things I've thought a lot about recently is believing, you know, believing in what you're doing. I think somebody, Sam Weber from "Your Dreams by Nightmare" talks about how early on his career, it was self-delusion. You know, he says that his work was so bad, but he believed that it was good or believed that he could still make it. And it was that delusion that kept him going. But I think what you find there is he's saying that from an early age he believed he could do this thing. And I think really believing in your beliefs are so powerful. And I think when it comes to your personal life or it comes to having to have a full-time job, I think one of the strongest things you can do, and I think that you hear tons of successful people talk about this, is believing that everything in your life is there for a reason. And one of the main reasons is to teach you the things you need to know to go on to do the things that you're supposed to do. You know, this is a worldview thing, and not everybody's stoked on this, but I'll just tell you my personal opinion. You know, I'll make a confession first. My confession is that I really love Harry Potter. And I realize that that's not the coolest thing. And you know, I grew up reading the books and I watched the movies, and as I became an adult, I didn't think I was that into it. And then recently, a few years back, my younger brother, as a joke, bought every Harry Potter movie for my wife, who she loves Harry Potter, for Christmas, 'cause he got him cheap, and he wrapped each one individually. So he sat there, giving her present after present, and she knew exactly what she's opening. Ah, and it was ridiculous. But we watched them all in a short, we binge-watched all these Harry Potters. And you know, I came out on the other side just being obsessed with Harry Potter, and I was thinking a lot about, there's a guy who's kind of a new-agey guy who is like an expert in mythology called Joseph Campbell. And he wrote a book called "The Hero of a Thousand Faces." And that's just about this idea that, you know, this Christ figure hero shows up over and over and over in the world. And Carl Jung, the psychologist, would say that that comes from our collective subconscious that we share these ideas throughout our evolution with each other. And they're just kind of lodged back in our brain. I think that's, I'm butchering that idea, but that's how I think of it. And the idea is that this hero story really rings true to us because it's part of who we are. And you know, anytime I watch those movies like Harry Potter or Matrix or Star Wars or whatever, you know, I always think, I'm always tempted to think, how awesome would it be to be the prophesied one? You know, it's the one who's going to save everything. And I always thought it would be so awesome because you've got someone telling you before your journey, you're gonna make it. You are going to do it. You're going to succeed because you are the one in the Lego movies like that too, and I love that movie. And, but then I realized that their struggle is the same as everyone else's. Because if you look at each movie, the struggle come from not knowing what they were supposed to do, not that, but believing the prophecy. All of them, they go back to the same thing. And I think believing that you can do this and believing that you're going to succeed. That is the, that's the power. And I think, you know, I move it over to this. Believing that there is something that is your creative thing to do. And then believing that all the things in your life are your teachers, everything, all your enemies, your friends, your job, your boss, your, you know, the trolls online, all of these things, these things are your teachers. And sometimes you got to learn how to stand up for yourself and quit your job. Sometimes that's the teaching that you need. Sometimes there's stuff that you're learning on your job that you don't understand how it's going to affect you later. You know, even, I've done a bunch of little graphic design things. I continue to do little graphic design things on the side, even when I don't need them for financial things, because they help me explore territory that I can't really explore my illustration work that I'm not comfortable exploring. And I noticed that a year later, when it's become, when those little things have become part of my, kind of muscle memory, I see them seeping into my regular work. And actually I feel like some of my biggest, my biggest breakthroughs and my style have come from things that I was doing with these side things, these things that were completely unrelated. And I think when you're in a job, especially early on, and you're wanting to do freelance, I feel like there's so many things in that environment. And I, you know, when I graduated, I had a graphic design job for eight months, and I've had little things here and there after that. And all of those things played into me going full-time for illustration, and I couldn't see it at the time. But I feel like there was part of me that believed that I was on the trajectory that I needed to be in. And if I just kept going and believing that all this stuff belonged in my life for some reason, that it would make sense later. And I do believe that those who are become really successful look back and say, this little job that I had that I hated, it taught me this, and without that, I couldn't have gone on to do this other thing. Or this boss that I couldn't stand, that was such a learning experience. You know, some of the worst jobs that I've had as an illustrator even have been some of my biggest moments of learning. And I think that in the same way, you can look at your personal life and see, you know, it's those experiences, it's that those friendship relationships, it's the significant other, it's the family, it's those things that you learn about what it is to be human. And those are the things that you get to take. If you, you know, I recently saw some illustration. It was one of the first times that I was just, I've always loved illustration, but it was one of the first times I was looking at it and I was having, it really moved me in emotional way. Like, and it was about, it was about, I think about, you know, dying or afterlife or something like that. And it's because it moved me because in my personal life, that's something that's been on my mind a lot recently. I've just, as I'm, you know, I'm 28, so I'm just starting to get older and I, and I'm, you know, I'm becoming aware that life is an infinite, at least in this world. And, you know, that reality is something that is kind of, I'm being steeped in that reality. And it's that personal life that has made me think more about my work and how do I communicate those kinds of things that are real, that are about life? And I think it's that stuff, if you don't have that stuff, how can you make work that has greater power, you know? If you don't know anything about life, how can you make work that has anything to do with life? And so I think it's believing that they work in concert together to make you the best you and the thing that you're supposed to do. Now, I just wanted to put a little disclaimer to that. I heard recently a, there's a guy called Michael Hyatt, who's kind of like a leadership guide, his podcast on leadership and stuff like that. And he did, I think it's a David Allen quote, and I thought it was absolutely brilliant. And it's said that you can do anything, but you can't do everything. And I think that that is so true, and it's so important to know. And I think that when it comes to this balance of work life versus freelance life or personal life versus professional life, you know, if you want to be creative professional and you want to be really good, and you want to do well and succeed and flourish, then it's going to take some serious work because the competition is serious. It's going to take, it's going to take you making sacrifices. Now, my point is this, I can, I can, I might be able to have anything, but I can't have everything. And right now in my life, that looks like I don't have a lot of like, I don't have a lot of friends, and I don't do a lot of socializing at this time in my life. Why? Because I've chosen to have two kids and another one coming on the way. We're, you know, I always think that sounds ridiculous. Yeah, we're going to have three kids, which is pretty ridiculous, but man, once you start having kids, they're so fricking awesome. You just want to keep doing it, but I think three is going to be it. So don't worry. - When you need meal time inspiration, it's worth shopping King Supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouth-watering meals. And no matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy our everyday low prices, plus extra ways to save, like digital coupons worth over $600 each week and up to $1 off per gallon at the pump with points. So you can get big flavors and big savings, King Supers, fresh for everyone, fuel restrictions apply. I'm choosing to have three kids and I'm a have a wife. And I, you know, I believe in prioritizing them and my kind of spiritual nurturing, my spiritual side and my family, all of those things come before work and they come before other relationships. I've got a few close friends, really close friends that are kind of like family and I nurture those relationships. But, you know, I have other people that who I like and who, you know, I don't have this close relationship with that I don't get to hang out with that much. And that's part of it. I really think that when it comes to your, both your professional life and your personal life, in order for them to work in concert together, in order for you, for all those things to be your teachers and for them to be the right teachers, I think you got to trim the fat on both areas. For both of them to be flourishing and working together, I believe you have to cut out the stuff that's unnecessary, the stuff that's getting in the way of them flourishing. You got to prune back, you know, this idea of, you know, this guy who trims the fruit tree, he has to cut off the new fruit because it's not strong enough. It's cutting back things, even things that maybe are growing, even things that are maybe worthwhile. But if they're not the things that he needs, the things that are the most important, the things that his life is all about. If he doesn't cut them back, then the other things don't have room to grow. And I think that even though I believe that you need to prioritize personal life and professional life as well, and they're supposed to work together in unison, I believe that you can't do everything and you do need to cut back in certain areas. And you know what I think, I think that that looks like getting honest with yourself. You know, one of the things I feel like is a common thread throughout illustrators and designers that I talk to is just the confusion of not really knowing which path to take. And I think, you know, I think that that comes from listening to the lizard brain, the part of your brain that's the instinct, the jealousy, the fear, the anger, the pleasure-seeking parts of your brain, listening to those, you know, lower-level impulses. And I think understanding which parts do I need to keep and which do I need to get rid of. I think that comes from, like I always say, I get feedback, but then also spend some time alone listening to the voice that's your true voice. That the voice that is beneath all of that stuff. And I think that there's a, you'll get a real sense on which things, which things are really important and which things am I doing for the wrong reasons. You know, I'm gonna keep, I'm gonna end with that same Kate Bingham and Bert thing that she said in her Creative Morning's talk. When it comes to all this stuff, you have to say which things am I gonna die if I let go of. You know, when I think about, I was thinking about comics and editorial work and animation and advertising illustration and kids' books and TV and all of these different things. And a lot of them are gonna keep going and there's definitely, and I've let go of some, you know, one I think though, I've realized is that I have to do kids' books. Kids' books, I would just, I'm gonna die if I don't pour myself into that. And when I realized that, I could cut away some of the other things. You know, I cut away comics because I really enjoy reading comics and I like making them, but they're not the thing that my life is all about. They're, there was something that was getting in the way. They're really time consuming and they're taking away from the things that I'm gonna die if I don't do. So I hope that helps this week. Hope that answered some of those questions. I don't know if it did and if not, you guys can input on Twitter and kind of get back at me. And yeah, thanks for spending time listening to me ramble on on my ideas on being an illustrator and a designer professionally. And hope to, hope you come back soon. Thanks. (upbeat music) ♪ Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh ♪ ♪ Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh ♪ ♪ Don't drink the skin, ooh ♪ (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Hey y'all, one more quick thing. Earlier this year, I rebuilt my website using Squarespace's new fluid engine and I was so pumped about how it turned out that I have been really thrilled to find as many ways to partner with them and tell you about what they can do and bring you discounts as possible. With social media going haywire, I think having a site that feels as unique as your creative work is essential to building trust with your target audience or your clients. I have had several clients point out how cohesive and fresh my site looks lately and if you wanna check that out and what I was able to do without any code, check out AndyJPizza.com. If you wanna test it out, go to squarespace.com/peptalk to test it out yourself and when you're ready to launch use promo code PEPTALK for 10% off your first purchase. Thanks Squarespace for supporting the show and for supporting creative people. (upbeat music) - Do you love hair raising allegedly true stories about the paranormal? Then some in the podcast scared to death. It's the popular horror series with more than 60 million downloads and is co-hosted by me, Dan Cummins. - And me, Lindsey, co-host and also Dan's wife. Each week on scared to death, we share bone chilling tales from old books and creepy corners of the web and some submitted by our listeners, all designed to make you sleep with the lights on. - Think you can handle the horror? Tune in to scared to death every Tuesday at the stroke of midnight to find out.