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We're prohibited by law, 18 plus, terms, and conditions apply. ♪♪ This is the Alien UFO Podcast episode 132. And I'm your host, Simon Bowne. My mission here at the Alien UFO Podcast is to investigate all things that are part of the wider UFO phenomena. I'm looking at UFO sightings, alien abduction, historic cases, and other related events. And you can enjoy the extended version of this episode ad-free, along with over 120 hours of extended episodes on Patreon. And if you enjoyed this podcast, please leave a review and be sure to subscribe. This week, I'm talking to Ronald Kinsella about his book, Illusions, Smoke and Mirrors of the UFO ET Paranormal Enigma. Ronald is an artist, illustrator, and author. He's written numerous books, including science fiction for the mainstream media, some of which are also illustrated by him. He also jointly hosts a paranormal radio show, Twin Souls, along with his identical twin brother, which is part of a global network. He has also appeared on national television. Hi, Ronald. Thanks a lot for coming on the podcast. Oh, my pleasure. It's great to be here, Simon. So we're going to talk about your book. It's called Illusions, Smoke and Mirrors of the UFO ET Paranormal Enigma. But I wanted to start off by asking you about your experiences, and particularly the one you call the bug at Bignol. Yes, that was basically, we lived for a brief spell in Chesterton in the grounds of Bignol House, which belonged to an eminent ice surgeon and his wife. Apparently, they were lovely to my mother, and I don't remember them. I don't remember the couple, but we lived in a massive cottage on the grounds, and it was to cut it down short. We were playing in the garden, folk and I, they had loads of brass everywhere. These were segmented grounds, so I can't remember which it was, but it's all part of the property, the estate. And there's no one around. It's off-road. It's off-road. There's no one there. The property is off-road. It's private. It's basically a mansion they lived in, and we were playing in this garden, and all of a sudden, I was drawn, look at these reeds. I got puns everywhere, bits of water all over the place. There was a lake there, I think. What was it called? I think the stream was called, I can't think of it off-hand. Gagglebrook is near there. Gagglebrook, that's it. We weren't there, but we were not far from there. And I was compelled to prize open these reeds, and I was fascinated by the white stuff in them. You know, it's a kid, you're curious. We're just prising away this lead, and all of a sudden, this little thing jumped out, and I was horrified. It looked like a little insect, and within an instant, it became quite big. So we were toddlers, about four or five, I think, at four or five, and it just became big. It was massive, and it looked now, reflecting over it. It looked like a praying mantis, a large one, and it didn't speak. We were horrified, we just ran from it, and as we ran, it was a blurriness to it, but I could hear this clicking sound, like a very high-pitched clicking as it moved. And when you say it was big, do you mean like four inches long, which could be big for an insect, or do you mean four feet tall? I would imagine it would be about perhaps four, maybe five foot tall, it would have been smaller, but about that high, so it was taller than us. It just transformed into this huge thing, and it was a big one. It sounds absolutely crazy, I know, and this was back in 1973, I believe it was 1973. And of course, being toddlers would have absolutely no knowledge of aliens, or what they call cryptids, or the supernatural, nothing at all. We weren't contaminated by anything. The only program we watched on the basic channels I had on TV were Rupert the Bear. So, you know, this thing was there, and we were running from it, and all of a sudden, it all changed. We were having ice cream, or drying our tears, and having an ice cream, but no, that's so, it's very weird. So it kind of, it grew really big, started chasing you, and then was it like watching a film, and there's a cut to another scene, and then you are having ice cream? Instantaneous, we were in another point of time. Even then, as a kid, you wouldn't understand that, we were just having ice cream, and it was over. And how much time was lost? I have absolutely no idea. We had a dog, a Labrador, and ironically, his name was Prince, and he wasn't there. So, ironic, isn't it? It wasn't there. He's always with us up at dog, our Labrador, Golden Labrador. It wasn't there, he's to run off and go places, but ironically, thinking about it now, it seemed ideal, the setting, that we were in a position of tranquility. There was no one there, not even mother, she was born during the washing or something, and further off into the grounds. There's no one can hurt us there, and it's sealed off the property. So, it's very bizarre, isn't it, that the answer to the time difference, I couldn't answer that now. So, it's that question of what was it doing? It's like, if it's like ET and they want to abduct you, they don't have to do that, have a little insect jump out, and then suddenly get huge, but it was almost like a production or something. Like, they wanted to do something really weird that would really stand out to you and maybe scare you. They didn't have to do what they did, did they? No, and I don't know what they were. I mean, after that, I was terrified of insects, daddy long legs, to be sure. So, I don't know if it came from that, the compulsion of this paranoia of insects, but certainly something happened. But yes, it was there. I didn't write about it in the first book, because it was so bizarre. I think I did mention this in allusions. I was in two minds to actually publish this, but there's nothing else other than that at that time. There was nothing that I can remember, but very strange, very strange big neural house. Yes, apparently the property was built by the ascendant. So, Francis Drake, we found out. So, the place has the plot has a lot of history to it. Built for two sisters, I believe, very fascinating, very rich sisters. It was built for this mansion. I think it took four or five years to build. The grounds that the eye surgeon had in his wife, it was the only thing that remained of it, was one of the wings, but it was still massive. I mean, you know, it goes to show how big they built buildings back then, you know, in the 1800s. And was there any tales of ghosts there, or anything? I think Kathleen Martin, bless her. She did some research into it, or was interested in it from Philip, my brother. But I have no such knowledge of that at the moment. I think it requires further study. You can't even get to the place. I mean, it's privately owned. I mean, there's a number of celebrities that I think Twiki was one of them, who owned the mansion after that. So, no, not to my knowledge, Simon, no. There's a sentence I copied out of the book, because I wanted to ask you about this. It's when you said you saw the grays intermingled with yourself and your brother, with scrolls of paper partially blocking the view. Yes, yes, absolutely. Now, this was a recollection of the memory. I've been having more and more of them, and I can't understand them. This is not imagination. I can differentiate the two. I can determine the two, what they are. These are kind of like bursts of something, of femininity. I think we all have it. If we're honest, of color, smell of sense. And I had this with them, the grays, as you call them, we call them the grays. They are, we don't know. But yes, it was as if I'm standing on the edge of a cliff to open up this memory or something, but it was blocked by the scrolls of paper, but they were there. This was much later. So, very bizarre, isn't it, Simon? Very bizarre. That in itself, and I have always maintained, I have not seen the grays myself. I have not, only through that little vision, which I had not so long ago. I don't understand what it means, but I'm having more of these very strange occurrences. Where I feel like something has happened, but it's been blocked or it is at the past memory or something. You get magits, don't you? Yeah. Would you consider using hypnosis to try and recover memories? No, I have been under once for past like the question. This is about 25 years ago. So, it happened when a member of our family died, and that opened up the floodgates because I wanted to know the truth. I don't have any nonsense. And I know that sounds silly writing a book about this, but I don't because these things did happen. Why or how? I have no idea, but I wanted to open the floodgates. So, I went down once. They didn't come into it. None of them were mattered to the brilliant medium then. She's a brilliant, brilliant medium. I'm a hard-hearted man, so I went to see her first very, very guarded, but she had no flies on her. She was amazing, and we became friends afterwards after this mission, the initial meeting with her, and she did pass that aggression. Rather reluctantly, I did it, but I had it, but that's all I've had. So, let's talk about the 1982 experience. Yes. Well, initially, what got me involved in this, it would not have been the bug, really. I mean, in a nutshell, it'd be rather weak to write about that for the whole bulk, you know, and people would then jump on the back one and say, "You've invented these to create a book of heaven." I was very reluctant to come out with all this stuff, but it was because of the Internet, and people were driving more towards the supernatural and accepting it. It wasn't such a tongue-in-cheek kind of thing, you know, it wasn't to do, that it drove me to, I needed to tell people about this. But nicely, too, was the linchpin with us, and my grandmother hadn't seen the solver sphere that arrived over her garden and hung over her head, and it just stayed there. It was the size of a football, it was soldered. And I knew it was an electronica, some kind of observation device, you know, and it was watching us. I didn't feel threatened to agree, perhaps a little bit, perhaps a little bit apprehensive, but then it shot up and then went over the roof and disappeared. There was another incident afterwards, where I was taken up or allegedly taken up, and then placed in the presence of these so-called doctors of what armored, and they were harping on about an abrasion, and I was weeping, I was restrained to a degree in this chair, I couldn't move, and they knocked me out in a nutshell, and they tossed me back down to the bed, and to end that session, and I've never seen them in that case once, that was in 1982 after the solver orb, so the solver orb was in the summer, the winter was when the doctors, I call them, allegedly snatched, well, took me up. They ended the nightmare with a vision of a Cheshire cat on the ceiling, people said to the company, "Mind, was it protected? I couldn't tell you." It was just there, you know, this demonic head of a Cheshire cat waving and it disappeared, quitting down at me, and I did wonder later on that snatching, or if it was meant to look like a snatching, was they sealed it with a kiss, basically, in terms of evidence, because should I go and see a psychologist later on on a mention of Cheshire cat, they'll say, "Well, you're just getting confused, you're just thinking of Alice in Wonderland, it's a film," you know, something like that, so it's very ingenious, but very haunting, so in a nutshell, that's what opened me up to this whole phenomena. And the pictures in the book that you've got there depicting these doctors, they looked like they were humans, but they were wearing breathing apparatus. That's right, they were covered from head to toe, so I couldn't see them, that was very bizarre. The outfits were kind of armored, that is not exactly the depiction, because I could not record it now, exactly every detail. I've elaborated on some of it, but they had mouthpieces, it was basically that modern ultra-modern gas masks. When he knocked me out, this doctor, when I was arguing with him, basically, it was in their presence, and I said to him, "I don't want this operation," he kept going on. It's his urgency for this operation, and I couldn't understand it. I was so confused, being thrown into this situation, that he produced this device that was like a rod with a module on the end, and he placed it on the top of my left hand and knocked me out, and someone says to me, "Did you count his fingers?" No, I didn't count his fingers, I can't remember his fingers at all. I mean, you know, you're a phone into a situation like that, there's a lot, I could not remember at all, but that's the basics of it. I'll never forget the opening dialogue he used. The very first thing he said when I arrived in this thing above the house, there was something there when I was drawn up. There was something big, I couldn't determine what it was. He said, "We're going to perform an operation on you Ronald." I mean, that in itself was a nightmarish scenario. You're so stark, and to the point, a matter of fact, you're going to do it, and I realized, because I was partially paralyzed from this chair, I couldn't move. People call it paralysis, but I had no compulsion to get up on the chair. It's weird. I knew that I was licked, that's something I could do. I'm going to do it to know whatever this thing is stated, if it was an operation. So, the creepy stuff there is that they knew your name, and also that they had an English accent. Yes, pure British, middle-aged, very authoritative. I mean, he was very kind, but very forceful. He was the only one that spoke the others and said, "Well, they just watched." I didn't know what they were doing. I was just standing before this table thing. It was a long time ago, but not forgotten, because I've never forgotten that. You know, this is the thing that really grinds my gears. People try and place it like stating that, "Well, it could have been the grace." I don't think it would have been, because from my own estimations now, the grace actually won't invoke in 1982 to be coming, but rather now, more so, they spread like wildfire. Whereas before, the aliens were not set in stone. That might be a clue to driving with this book illusions. It is only our hypothesis, as always, as that no proof. There's also this thing where they knocked you out when you were with them. It almost seems like they could have had the capabilities to come and get you while you were asleep, and you'd never know about any of it. Yes, that's another little telltale sign. It was lonely long afterwards. I kept thinking, "What if they have the power to knock you out of board their ship? Why not?" And they knock you out prior to snatching. It would make it so much easier, and I've maintained the fact it's because they want you to see them. That must be key. It is the only and logical thing I can think of. They want you to see them, and I was really horrified. I was crying. I cried before them. I couldn't see him in the league while he was behind me. The chief, he was behind me, but the ones I was crying before him saying, "I'm begging you not to do this operation." I was absolutely healthy. And just to reiterate afterwards, I did check my body. To me, as a 13-year-old, there were no visible scars. There's nothing. I didn't see anything at all. I wouldn't even know what I was looking for. Now you hear of these implants, so they wouldn't know what they were back then. They didn't know anything at all. The fact they didn't know much about the aliens, they were on science fiction. And it makes me wonder about the whole UFO phenomenon in a way, about lights on UFOs. I talked to a guy about his experiences, and he was talking about how he was at his bedroom window, and this large craft came over his house. He said it was four times the size of his house, and it had all these flashing lights all over it. But the craft, it was made of some sort of black material. And it's the question is, why the lights? They don't need lights. Well, moths are drawn to lights, are they not? Yeah, but I kind of feel like it was black against a black sky. It could have been very stealthy and just flown over. No one would have seen it, but it wants to be seen. They're doing it on purpose. Yes, that's right. That's correct. Yes, absolutely. I actually agree with that. Yes, it's to be noticed. I mean, it's to stand out. That's what it is, is that these doctors, the operation, you see, the cracks are beginning to form with this. And it took a lot of thought, as well as listening to a lot of people as well. But I went further with illusions. There are some things that certain things tell to our science signatures happens, which betray this, basically illustrating the fact that they may not be what they appear to be. And I made that quite conclusive in the new book. Yeah, so you've used the airships as a kind of example of weird stuff they do, because that was, what was it, 1890s, there was the airship flap. Yes, yes, that's right. I looked into that by reading a brilliant book. I think I promoted it in my book, because I hailed it all for stuff, a wonderful gentleman, the pair of them. But 1898 to 1899, I think, well, '96 to '99. Yes, basically, airships weren't new then. I mean, they had developed them before. You know, they were experimenting people. We were quite ingenious. So, incredible technicians and technology, you know, pushing it even back then. But these airships seem to be a tad more advanced. It struck me when I looked at it, and this is not my own opinion. This has been thought of before by other people. But the new ideas I put forward are mine, especially to the Star Trek. Basically, yes, it was always a step ahead. You know, I mean, Judge Proctor, he had one explode over his house, I believe it was. It looked over the town, the carestly low, and crashed, destroying his prized barb. It's a lot of that, because it was charming, so these people took very much pride in what they could develop, you know, in his house, in his garden. But the airship destroyed everything. They found a different pilot in there. It was believed they found a crew member that didn't look human at all. So, and these things change. I mean, some sheriff's, I believe, on horseback, back then, were pursuing this object. And it landed and they went up to it. And I believe they were a strange man, asking him to go and board it. I mean, my goodness, it just is so incredibly weird. And I do trust the reports. I do trust them, because as we know with media, they will try and always have done, douse it, or make it look back, tie and cheek. And I understand why they're doing it, because it's a phenomenon that they have no grip on, they have no understanding of it. So, they mock it. You know, as they do with mediums and things, even today, they still mock it to a degree. We all have somewhere we're trying to get to. As the largest energy producer in Colorado, Chevron is working to responsibly meet rising energy demand. So, everyone can get to where they want to be. You've arrived. That's energy and progress. Visit chevron.com/tankless. Judy was boring. Hello. Then, Judy discovered jumbo casino.com. It's my little escape. Now, Judy's the life of the party. Oh, baby, mama's bringing home the bacon. Whoa, take it easy, Judy. The jumbo life is for everybody. So, go to chumpakassino.com and play over 100 casino style games. Join today and play for free for your chance to redeem some serious prices. Chumpakassino.com. No purchase necessary. We were prohibited by law 18 plus terms and conditions apply. See what's like for details. And these airships were kind of steam punk, weird airships, weren't they? Yes. That's a nice word. Putting actually something. Yes, steam punk. Yes, book would say so. Yes. I mean, they're talking about even them coming from Mars. Then, I think they were intuitive enough to know that Mars was there. But you could never drive an airship from one planet to air. I mean, there's no oxygen in space. They didn't even understand that. Really, all the pressures of space or how cold they should die from it from the burns of radiation. But something here with us on the earth, it's something with us. It's been here for a very long time. And this opens up before our other ideas, not only of the aliens or assumed aliens. I'm not saying they're all from what I'm suggesting in the book. So maybe genuine. The Betty and Barney Hill, I believe, is quite true. Absolutely genuine. I believe they were the genuine grace, actually. So it would appear that we have some kind of copy-cap with us, some trickster. I've referred to it as an atomic magician. And it goes further. People say, "No, no, you're wrong." But if you read the book, it tells on to so many other encounters that I have read about the privilege to write about, which just don't make any sense at all. And it only leads to this theory or this hypothesis that we are also known here, in some interests. And the thing about the airships, it's like you kind of mentioned earlier, it's like they're presenting some kind of technology that's more advanced than ours, but not so advanced that we really can't understand it. Yes, that's right. Yes, it moves on down to Roswell. That's in 1947. I mean, we develop aircrafts and jets. And they did have more sources. They change. You see, it's rather it would appear to me or suspect to have been what's in Vogue. You see another thing about this. Up in 1950s, move on now from the 1890s to the 1940s and 1950s. Science fiction films were in Vogue. They were big, especially the B movies. And if you notice them, the finance sources were more than not silver. And I estimated in my book, well, why should they be silver? But they have paid this silver all over the world. The first ones were sold, the discs, silver. And I kept thinking, well, if they're so advanced, they would have shields. They wouldn't always have to be silver, would they? You know, it's quite possible or plausible. You know, I know it's silver. We would think it common sense because it deflects radiation and it's good and strong. But the point is, these beings are so ahead of us, they would possibly think of something so more advanced than that. They would have certainly shields. And that's what draws me suspect to a number of problems with Roswell. The Roswell crash. So you feel that the Roswell crash, that something really happened there, and it wasn't just a weather balloon. Was that right? That's right, because Percy, the military, announced they had in their possession a flying disc. These are trained men. You could tell the difference from a balloon to a disc quite easily. They retracted. This is what was absolutely crucial, the evidence. They stated, firstly, they stated they had a flying disc in their possession. And you must remember, this is probably very rare when it happened, including also the news media at the time, it was becoming quite big, wasn't it? So, and they thought, oops, we better retract that, you know, because it could cause a lot of problems. So they were attracted. And they can't prove it. But there are numbers of issues we're about. Right. So, we have this alleged spacecraft or sort of where everyone's something exotic crash in there. They announced that they have in their possession a flying disc and retracted. The people have stated that if it was a flying disc from another world or dimension, surely there would have been backup. This is where I draw an underlined that, because I think more yes, you know, this, if it was from another world or dimension, with different men, there's pilots that had hazardily crashed into a hillock within us, well, and surely they would have had people on standby or a mothership or something. You know, but it seemed to me that's why I suggested in the digital demon, firstly, it appeared to me that it could have been a Trojan horse, because many others. This is what I suggested in the digital demon, many others were smashing across the world. The reports have acorn shaped things. You know, you've got many different things. All different and all exotic. Is it possible that they ships and pilots have to look different, so as not to raise eyebrows, the same species is having the same problem in dealing and able to crash their ships on earth? And also another thing that's suspect is always outside populated areas. The crash conveniently away from habitable regions. There's another key to it, so I don't know what happened there, but I do believe that something very strange occurred, and it was not weather-blown. And I have stated Simon also, but you know, it's like a tarpet. You have people publishing books all over the place, stating, you know, Roswell, the truth. There is no truth to it. The only truth they feel is driven by their own narration, however strong they may feel that narration is. There is no truth, but because it's lost, it's gone. The people have taken this to grave with them, but I certainly do believe something exotic crashed there, and it might well have been what they're suggesting. Yeah, because there are people, and I suppose this goes for all sorts of paranormal stuff, it's like there are people who were not there, who think they know better than the people who were there. Yes, that's right. You see, I mean, I have formed only a hypothesis, but I could be wrong, and I've stated this all along. It's merely a hypothesis. We have to have them. Some people argue that there was just a weather balloon. Well, they're welcome to believe it. But I think we can agree looking at the evidence of the narration, and the published details at the time that they had in their possession sounded very exotic, very different. There is some wonderful authors, Donald Snitch, who published a book on it, which I think is extremely wonderful. They believe that the source was in trouble, and they ejected a lifeboat which landed in the hillock and killed them, which might have happened, but whatever it is, something obviously a very strange did, I'm sure I do believe it, and all these military around it, there wouldn't be all that military over a weather balloon and monkele weather balloon that could just drop down any moment at this time. My goodness, it will have fast over a monkele weather balloon. So I think it's safe to assume something to crush it. That's something very, very strange. But I think what you point out in the book is one of the odd things about it is that it seems the ETs didn't have their own crash retrieval team, or there wasn't an alien ambulance that came down quickly trying to help. That's right. Yes, it would have had, it would have had backup. Another thing, if they were travelling through the vast vastness of the cosmos to reach us, I mean they're very will ill-equipped, you know, then to them has a big crash on the planet, without even an emergency beacon or some SRS distress score. I mean, it was so if they didn't, you're talking about also, we had just, we were just left a terrible world war, 1945 ended. So in 1947, the world is guarded, is hungry for new weaponry for defence. You would think these people are where they were either ignorant to our plight, or that they were just absolutely careless, and it doesn't make any sense they would be smarter than that. So I think somehow it was contrived. I think somehow it must have been contrived, deliberately down God knows why people, this is when they then state that, okay, so we got the superior race who's deliberately crashed this saucer on the earth, so that the equipment can help civilization and be back-engineered. I made a point of stating by myself that the awakening conference in February, in my talk, I made a point, I think it's in the book as well, I can't remember, the fact that, you know, that in itself is ridiculous, it's absolutely pathetic. Back-engineering technological relationship is rather like us giving the Victorians one of our modern-day cell phones, mobile phones, and asking them to replicate it. I think they tried, but there's no way they could build something like that, no way on earth. So, and what would they use? Lions, nuclear fusion, I doubt it. This romantic fantasized notion of back-engineered ships, I'm not going to knock people or believe it, they wish to, that's their right, but this is my opinion. It would be virtually impossible to understand the alien physics of another world or dimension. We just couldn't do it, and if we code it, what we'd say probably hundreds of years, is to even understand how they powered their ships, if they were powered by engines or conventional sites we are familiar with. But I come back to that idea that they're presenting technology that's advanced, but not so advanced, we don't recognize it? For the time, yes. Could it be that the crash was on purpose to give us some technology, but they gave us some really old stuff that they don't use, but something that will help us advance a little bit? Now that I'm always open to suggestions, it's a possibility, but there again, could that be have driven so that we become virtual prisoners? Is it possible that they develop a silicon chip from it, because that transistors back then, as power computers moved on to the silicon chip we don't know? Is this what we're driving for? Because people now are talking about implanting it in bits of people, or if they do, that can't help us, because if you get in there, it's a temple, the seat of humanity, and you can control anything, it's just like a switching metrolus, is this what they do? They're creating some kind of or patiently watching as we create our own electronic prison. I don't know, because then to what end? What would that prove? Do they want to arrest us and then come and take over the earth, it doesn't make sense? They could kill us off with a simple germ of theirs, they could devise something that will effectively kill every human off. I mean, it's very hard for us to do it, because people always do survive. Even for the worst scenarios, nuclear war people survive through it, some of them do. We think they're very apt in extermination methods, but it doesn't seem to be like that, doesn't seem to be like this. I don't know if that's the case to what end, but why help us? A warring affection? Why haven't we are? I'm sorry, I'm going to say we are a warring race. We're always warring. It's starting up again. It can never end. Why would they give a warring race advanced weapons or advanced technology to up the arms division? It doesn't make any sense. You see, we're going backwards and forwards, trying to work out what an earth is going on. To my mind, this peace analogy, that they're helping us, I don't believe it. I personally do not believe it. They have done nothing. They've done absolutely nothing. I have read articles, and I've seen videos of people talking about a federation. Well, I'm not being funny, and I don't be disrespectful, but there is an ethereal as the Vos warship itself. There's no truth. We've got nothing. We're beggars to roam demise in a way. There were bodies in the craft at Roswell as well, so would they have been volunteers or just genetically engineered things? I don't know what to say. I would imagine if they were that advanced or whatever it was, they would have been made. It had dolls, movable dolls, camera men. I don't know. Things just to get it there and then expendable in order to make out this scenario that they are aliens for another world. You remember, it was in Vogue, the 1950s. It was very heavy. It steeped in the fine sources. So why is it a flatter source? Is it what's been reported before, possibly? So what's doing it? What's causing them to arrive? Do you know where they're coming from? It is observation. I mean, we look at the Foo Fighters during the Second World War. They were visible. They told their crafts during battles, so they did nothing. They just observed them and just flew through them. They didn't cause any, I don't believe there was any destruction caused by them. They just watched the Foo Fighters themselves, I'm talking about. So this silver ball that we saw before in 1982, the grandma, it wasn't lit up. It was silver, the size of a football. I wonder if that was one of them. Something is evidently watching us but doing nothing you would see. And do you talk about this Brazilian case and in a way you compare it to Roswell, I think? Yes, the Vagina incident. Yes, that's James Fox did a documentary on that and I've watched it three times. It looks absolutely fascinating. Basically this ship was in peril. It was like a black, dark oval thing that it was in distress because he's finally saw it coming over their household in Vagina or somewhere near there. They crashed there, the farmland, they saw it. In trouble, there was smoke bulging from it. It was precariously hanging low and this driver narrowed to the destination of it. This driver was in his car, bless him, and he saw it come down and smashed into a field. And he got off his car and raced into the field but by the time he got there, there was this military man waving in bed. They actually held rifles to him. The poor man was horrified. Get back, get back, get back. He did, he did because he was the reason why he raced to this wreckage. There's flames everywhere and smoke. This object had crashed into this homestead, this farmer. I believe on a hill, it was like all the wet bars decided. He thought, well, people, or perhaps something in the needed rescue where you would, wouldn't you think it's some kind of exotic aircraft? I suppose he didn't know what it was, but he wanted to help, but they sure he was out of that place before you could know it. This created a whole strange scenario where James Fox was an expert on it and he kind of gave you permission to use this, as well as slides from his actual documentaries. I was very honored that the pictures in some of them I've used that I've cleaned up and used from what I could gather from the documentary. But the creatures were seen, survivors were seen by a number of people who reported after that crash. They'd seen them in the actual suburban region in town. These creatures are delirious, they were small, black things that had oily skin and big red eyes with lumps on their head, three lumps distinctive lumps on their head, they were demonic because the family of three or two sisters and a friend saw it for the past of this sort of makeshift area to get to another region of the homestead, and they saw it in a quarter, very hot and brightened, and they were horrified. And so it makes me think about that, and yet your white salmon is similar to Roswell, a 20 degree although that pilots won't report it to Roswell to actually be traversing the region on foot or being caught by anyone there, navigating through towns or things that these were, so they got absolutely no knowledge of where they were and why was the ship on fire, why was it in flames? What had happened? It struck me more as if they were trying to get away from something if that was the case. Again, we moved to this point of interdimensional, so again they had their rescue party, although in that case afterwards a rich family, they reported after the ship had crashed, they're seeing a huge flying saucer over their house, it looked like it was looking for something, so could this have been the enemy of those? And they got away and they had to be apprehended by this other force, we don't know, but in that case there was something looking for them this time, so it is extremely bizarre, isn't it, suddenly very strange, and that case was accepted again, they covered it up, it was all covered up the whole thing, and with them the poor families left it quite some time before it came, because like everything, you have to step back after a while and then put the pieces together like a jigsaw puzzle, but oh my god, this is coherent, this is what happened, it crashed, there was the aliens were seen to be traversing the town, and then you had that fire saucer looking after them, and then the military stepped in, and apparently it was reported that they apprehended them, I believe they captured them and they died shortly after, unfortunately it was rumored that one of the soldiers or police officers who at the end of one of them died as well, they were touching one of them, it was topsy. Yeah, the policeman died within two weeks, and I think he touched the alien's skin and it was really kind of oily or something. That's right, it's seeped into his and the sister, his sister, she asked for the autopsy report and some of it was missing, so that's what she says anyway, so it's very sad, and I do believe that actually happened, I mean if that's the case I feel very sorry for those little men, because they weren't bone into opposition, they had no knowledge of it, I mean you wouldn't try to solve it into the suburbs of populated areas, you know, you wouldn't traverse the town, it'd be rather than more inclined to sell me else, don't you, but they obviously had no idea of the geography, because you didn't know where they were, they didn't know what to do. Isn't there a room that the bodies were flown out and went to the US? America, that's right, there so was the US cargo aircraft military came to take the crates onboard it, I would believe that, yes, and it seems that a lot of things go to United States, doesn't it, I mean the Roswell wreckage I believe was taken to, was it like, as it's not supposed to be transferred, what knows, well I can't remember, except I've got it, I've documented, there's so much of this, I can't remember everything, but yes, the particulars are there anyway, so yes, a plane did come and collect them, and that's where the trail goes cold. Yeah, but that makes me wonder though, if the Brazilian government or military had these bodies, why would they give them to the USA, it's... Strange isn't it, very strange, yeah, very, very weird, there's obviously some great clouds in the United States, I can tell you, some great clouds, we only have to look at a certain incident that happened recently with a tank, you know, to realise the cloud they can wield, you know, anything coming out, truly you are saying, you know, anything coming out or leaked, you're not only giving a snap hand, you're giving the prison symptoms, so on that note I'm glad he's out, I'm glad he's out, God bless him, I'm glad that gentleman's out. Lucky land slots, asking people what's the weirdest place you've gotten lucky? Lucky? In line at the deli, I guess? Uh-huh, in my dentist's office, more than once actually. Do I have to say? Yes you do. In the car, before my kids' PTA meeting. Really? Yes! Excuse me, what's the weirdest place you've gotten lucky? I never win and tell. Well there you have it, you can get lucky anywhere playing at luckylandslots.com, play for free right now. Are you feeling lucky? No purchase necessary, VGW Group Wood, we're recruited by law, 18 plus terms and conditions apply. Talking about more weird stuff, the reedy man of Washington. Yeah. That's a weird story, do you think that guy really experienced that stuff? Jim, yes I do. Um, yeah, he was a driver for, was it some UPS? Uh, and it was within, I believe, if I remember quickly Washington. No, I had seen this on a program and I asked them the chats, I was so fascinated by this case, of the reedy man of Washington, that's what I called it. Um, but I wanted to document it, I was so desperate, so I wrote to them, these, these gentlemen who, who documented it. I never heard a thing back from them, I mentioned Philip Mantell, the wonderful Philip Mantell, the urofologist I'm involved with. I had nothing, so what I did was, I thought, I'm going to use it because it's not exclusive to them. I don't believe it was. It's a story that's obviously been doing the rounds, albeit loosely. Um, I promoted their site, I promoted their names everything. So I gave them four credit. So I documented this case about Jim going towards this complex. Uh, he didn't know what it was. He just had to deliver parcels. It's an heavily fortified region. And as, uh, UPS or, because I used to work in delivery. So I know how fast it is, they have to be fast. They've got a time that they've got to live and get out. So you had to try to do this, alternate gate, get clearance by signature and then just drop them off. But there's no one there. But he's the one who's gone to the loop. They'd go in to the complex. There's no one there. So he thought, well, you know, the clock is ticking. So he went on the back and he saw these strange stick-like men walking through, um, an open corridor from one complex to another. And they were walking wilders strangely. They wore fadoral hats and they had suits on it. They were painfully thin and they were tall. So they went into this as a complex. They were so shocked. He come because he was looking for loading, though. He went back and he was stopped. And one of the chaps called him and said, well, come in. And he went, he's taken to this room and, and when he was in this room, he saw, they really know that they were looking at him. He said there was quite life. Let's see. In fact, we're hoping for their eyes. It would have remained, but as I'm looking at his big mouth. And the chaps said to him, you know, what did you just see? And Jim said, you know, they're obviously very ill, you know, people you're treating. In a nutshell, basically, he was satisfied and said to him as he was leading by it. He was never coming back there again. Uh, and he left. Um, he, he kept the vacation secret is, I should imagine that's a fake name he's used, because he wants to protect his identity. And he was fine. Not long after it was inspired from the UPS. He never gave a reason he was five. And so he came up with this case, which is very bizarre. Again, very, very strange, some very fascinating, strange. And I looked into that with the paper I did, which was published in phenomenon magazine first. I was very honored that went into state mirror and a week in teams phenomenon magazine. Um, because I estimate there can't be robots, because they're too tall. They won't make robots. They won't have to do doors. They have to stick to get to the door. And why would they be wearing suits? Well, that's disguised as those. Why would they painter it then? Why they did dare to some mention? Well, no, because I have to find perhaps six and a half to seven foot bodies. And how many bodies since the seven foot skeleton since the five is impossible. So I use a method of elimination in that, you know, to try and gauge what he could have possibly seen. And to this day, we don't know. It's that thing called high strangeness very weird, but a very fascinating place. Didn't he say that while they were walking together, though, I think in the book, you say they were lumbering in sync all over the place? Yeah. Yeah, it's as they were on study. I even wondered if let's let's go, let's let's stretch out a bit. If they were an eight seven eighty race, uh, that was arriving and these people were supporting them. Could it be possible that they were put into bodies first to get used to the gravity to kind of solve and not get used to the gate, the human gate to walk like us? Well, we don't know, you know, you start from a Morris Minor to a Rolls Royce. Let's just start with men and then they become like people. I don't know. It's something I actually suggested in that paper. They didn't hide it because I kept questioning and Steve Miller actually paid me a lovely compliment. I was really honored. He said that was a good piece. You did. Good piece. Father, a little bit of journalism. I'm not a journalist, but it's a bit of journalism. But there again, when you're talking about this, it is, it's like journalism. You look at it, you step back and you think about it, you know, that's that's good journalism. You think about it, you know, and when you describe them with the overcoats and the hats, it brings up an image of my mind of men in black. Yes. Yes. They couldn't be. There were two tall and there were two reading. That and it's of men in black, you know, they're reports, they were heavily important for 50s and 60s. I believe after UFO incidents has occurred. And I wonder if that's part of the same thing. You know, it's not coming from the government. It's coming from them. They're strangeness is sending people to intimidate. But they're again, why? But did exhibit itself and then intimidate you is collecting something. This is key. Why did the doctors want to see if they want something? Is it fear? Is it fairly clean up afterwards? I mean, they could have killed them, I would have known, but they didn't. So it was fear. It is fear and intimidation, something. And you know, I think it's wonderful that we all in this together trying to work on what it's actually just been dealing with. If they are individual places, if it were the government, that's fair enough. But I personally don't think so. I think there's something more to it than that. Is it you think maybe they call it the trickster phenomenon, I think? They call it the atomic magician. You will understand also that the werewolves and aliens, everything, in fact, can only remain in our spare briefly, very reported briefly, then it disappeared big for it. They're only in for slight bit of time and then they're gone, they vanish. I mean, the skimwalk garage I was maintained after looking at all the documents on it. And it's a wonderful fascinating case. It's a fact that they're doing all these tests and experiments. Is it possible the phenomenon is enjoying it because they're paying attention to it. They're seeing all these strange things, you know, wolves, huge wolves, the poetry family, the forehand, you know, massive, massive wolf comes up to them like a pet dog being petted and then it looks to be carved in the shelter when it goes for and has to eat it and they have to get shot down and shoot it so many times it doesn't even kill it. A piece of bleach is precious, dislodged from him, but he just trots away like nothing's happened that disappears, disappears. They're always disappeared, aren't they? But the many are black, the aliens, bigfoot, the werewolves, ghosts, they're always disappear. I'm not saying they're all the same thing, but that's the majority of them are. So what do you think about this, like I'll just call it the alien abduction phenomenon for? It's so much talk there about hybrids and collecting DNA from men and women. What's your view on all that stuff? Right, clearly, I think it's an illusion, a deception. They're doing this. This agenda of theirs keeps changing. You see from the 50s, we have the fact that the atomic warfare, which the aliens, the Nordic types, beautiful blonde hair, blue white ones, are legibly informal people that they're concerned of atomic warfare, and while all they need to, quietly without being seen, it's just a nullifier and they can improve it on a number of occasions, just briefly, permanently. We build more, they do the same, we build more, they do the same, big one, we can't do it. Okay, and they can do that, right? So then we move to the 90s with the grades when they're in vote, but especially after weekly stimulus for communion, the image on that cover, it completely bombshelled the whole grades into a fashion of vote. So everyone's seeing grades. So you have their concerns then for environmental issues, so in the 90s, and again, they did nothing. And they take people out, they're there, they're everywhere, showing them the earth exploding, they're concerned for the warfare of mankind, all the beautiful world, they've been like this, and absolutely nothing is done. Now, what's interesting about these grades, what's interesting, it's as I stated from early on in history, to the 90s or late 80s, they were not set in stone. The grades were very seldom mentioned, another pilots of the Roswell crash world, similar perhaps to them. And Betty and Barney's case was similar, although I believe Betty and Barney's was perhaps some of the original grades when that incident occurred, which I did do believe occurred. And then in a doctor, a one-missionist known suggesting that it was a state-managed, I don't believe that at all happens to be insulting, but the grades have become more info. Now, people can associate with these things and everyone sees them, all the same, they don't see them, they just see them. So, and then the hybridization goes up for the purpose of what? For wiping out humanity or seeing a grade disaster to re-colonize the earth, I don't think so. I think, again, my captain tells it is a grave misconception, it is alive, they are promoting, just like the rectilions that are seen, you know, they have different kinds of rectilions, grades, is it possible that this thing, and this is another key point, which I will make, because I'm an artist and I use ZBrush or ZBrush on it, and I have stopped in software, there's no cheating to be had, it's like molding things and plasticing out there, digitally to create more wonderful masterpieces. It took me 10 years to reach the level I've reached now, but I was doing pictures of the grades in my mind or based on certain depictions people have reported, and you would not believe the amount, people said that's not how they looked, that's not how they looked, they had this, they had that sub-ruptiveness, that's not how they looked, when isn't that key, is that not suspected, but mindfully, if the AI art we have, now artificial intelligence doesn't exist, what it is true for, it's nonsense, there's no rubbish, computers can't think they do not think it is a program, I saw a program, they only process, that's all they do, they just process. So, when people use AI art, a new tool used where the computer requires an enormous bank of already painted images by artists, as I'm just doing, it's pulling into the art banks to create some random kind of randomisation, it's clever, don't get me wrong, it's clever, but it's creating a random image based on a certain amount of, you know, variables or suggestions, you know, it can't hold the same pattern twice, it can't do it, it's rather like, if you have, you'll call a gentleman, you know, handsome with dark hair, and as accurate as you are with the description of his face, the first one will be in the office, the second one will not look like him, that will go on and on, so this is something like artificial intelligence art, it can't hold the same pattern twice, you can only do it once, so this is the keys, the wells that change, it occurs, the rectinans bigfoot, to a degree, they all everything changes, so is it something rather like that, it says that the current seem to hold the same signature of the original? I've wondered if there is something to do with us and our consciousness that might imprint upon their form. At a distinct possibility and absolutely admirable, Simon, yes, that is one thing we must consider. I talked to somebody who was having the abduction experience and they said, that's what the Grey kind of said to them, they said, where we come from we don't have physical form and what we look like comes from you. Yes, you see, you see these things are using everything against us, they're very smart, all it is very smart, you know, the new trends they will grasp, I grant you the hybridization program will fizzle out, there'll be something you just the atomic warfare concerns for fizzled out, all over the environmental issues, these are things fizzled out, I'm not disrespectful to the people that have happened, they may well be true and they may well happen through this course, or whatever it is that's during it, but maybe not the way they think you see, so each encounter, I've had my own in a horrifying, I've been done it, all the tea shed, the cake, I'll say that tongue in cheek, I can now, I'm much more comfortable with it, but I went through it the same as them, mine was quite different, but this is now moving on to, oh, let's play, let's play along with it, you know, this is now part of your mind what it is, and that's key, because what this thing's doing or what they're doing is throwing us off the scent, you're made to look this way, that way, another way, I'll give an example of this, and this does come into it, this plays very importantly into this, we used to use the Ouija board 25 years ago when I got one into the spiritual stuff, we used to use the Ouija board, and it was a crude one we'd made, the first one we've made, that's our paper, the letters on them, we'll spell them out and say we'll make sure, let's just sleeve, get knocking off the paper when you're moving the punch up, we made it bored in you, but this first one, this crude makeshift Ouija board, we bought through this entity, that is very nice to begin with, but further down the use of it, we had a friend called Susan with us, so Susan was with us, and we were asking some questions, I said if I don't hold up hold up, I said I'm not the interest with this at all, we don't lie, so I put the line, Susan, we don't think, we would know, I said I can't be done with this, but he's some proof, so I said to Susan, I said Susan, you know, I put a little bit of paper in there, bring it back and put it in the pocket, she knew what we were doing, she did, and I said right, I've been Susan, it's written something, it's in her pocket, can we get out, and it's not trickering, first of all, trickering, and I said no, in our position you would, you would want the same thing, what does she reckon, and it can actually move, unless it's going to move that D-A-R-T-H, M-A-U-L, and now that at the times, the wonderful Georges gave us a fork out of the Star Wars film, I think it was a time to minute, with something called Darth Maul in one of the characters, a very popular tattoo man, she pulled out the piece of paper, her face went white, it's Darth Maul, and then it's not satisfied, well, we cut it ex, I thought uncomfortable, I stupidly thought at that time that it had read that piece of paper, but what knew that just stated Simon makes absolute sense, as we know, it is actually accessing our consciousness, it knew what she was thinking or what she was going to write down, connect to mind. Well, it's been fascinating talking to you, the books called Illusions, Smoke and Mirrors of the UFO-ET Paranormal Enigma, and that's on Amazon, isn't it? That's right, it's a hard-back paperback Kindle and also an audio book, the audio I love, because the American, I love his voice, he's got this kind of tongue-in-cheek voice and I absolutely love it, so yes, it's out on all those platforms. Great, and you mentioned your other books as well, so people can find those. The digital demon is available from Amazon, as well as far back Kindle, ebook and audio book, and I researched the Mayan temples, and that's for the Mayan diet equal book, and the spell of the serpent, I look into that, I like baking it, I can't look at it, because my mother visits her, but won't last chance and I was expecting interest. There's a pattern as to how that came about, it's fascinating, it's as if it was meant to be, I was meant to look into it, I had no interest before, but this string of events forced me into it, and he was a feathered serpent, and I mentioned on there that the feathers didn't fight and the serpent had dragon, so is it possible that they had a technology to thrive, that our ancestors misinterpreted the poor, interpreted them as a feathered god, I don't know, but it's either there, yeah, the digital demon. Great, and again, thanks a lot for coming on the podcast. Oh, thank you, it's been a pleasure, Simon, it's a pleasure talking with you, and thank you very much for having me on. That was an interview with Ronald Kinsella about his book, Illusions, Smoke and Mirrors of a UFO ET Paranormal Enigma, and a great way to support the podcast is to sign up to Patreon, where you can get exclusive access to the extended version of this episode. Just go to patreon.com/alienufopodcast. When you sign up, you get access to the episodes in the back catalogue, and they are ad free, and are released two days before the free versions, and if you want to try out the extended episodes, you can now get a seven-day free trial, and there are two tiers. In the three dollars a month tier, you get an extended episode every month, and in the six dollars a month tier, you get an extended episode every week. And please check out my other podcast, it's called Our Paranormal Afterlife, and there are over 300 episodes. My website is parsliveshypnosis.co.uk, and the link is in the show notes. And if you enjoy this podcast, please leave a review, and be sure to subscribe on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or via your favourite podcast app to make sure that you don't miss out on any episodes. And thanks for listening. And so, do you feel that they're good? Whoever is doing it, is they good? Or they bad? Or they neutral? 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This week I'm talking to Ronald Kinsella about his book 'Illusions: Smoke and Mirrors Of The UFO/ET/Paranormal Enigma'.
