The Unmistakable Creative Podcast
Why Entrepreneurs are the Artists of the Business Community with Bruce Poon Tip
Bruce Poon tip is not the typical CEO of a travel company. Starting with nothing but his college credit cards, over the last 20 years Bruce has built G adventures into a 250 million dollar business.
Here are the hlighlights from our chat
- Learning to recognize when your Eureka moments
- Why self awareness is such an important skill to develop
- The early parts of Bruce's childhood and his influences
- Stories of entrepreneurship from Bruce's childhood
- Why working at Mcdonald's was a meaningful experience for me
- A look at the things we take for granted every single day
- Having the guts do things that will make you unpopular
- Why building a business is actually a spiritual journey
- Why everybody has a journey that enlightens them in their own way
- The importance of learning from other people's stories
- The role of community, culture and karma in business
- Why the separation between work and life is disappearing
- Looking at how business can impact people, planet and profit
- Why our brand must transcend just being about a product
- Treating travel as the greatest form of wealth distribution
- The power of creating connectedness through your business
- A look at conflicting desires involved in righting the book
- The role that patience plays in your ability to achieve something
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- Broadcast on:
- 05 Feb 2014
- Audio Format:
- other
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I came across you by way of actually one of my listeners, Gary Arnt, actually. He sent me your book. He said, "Hey, Streamy, I think this would be right up your alley." And I remember reading the description and I thought, "Yeah, you pretty much nailed it. You really understand what I look for and I guess." I mean, you really do fit the whole label of being unmistakable. So I guess really where I want to start is really your story of how you built G-Adventures and how something like loop tail came to be. Well, that's a long question. G-Adventures in itself has a 23-year history and the story of how G-Adventures became a company and how we grew to where we are today is more of an entrepreneurial story. I mean, seeing, I was 22 at the time and saw a need or had my own Eureka moment to want to start a business. And at that time, it could have been anything, but over the course of 23 years and the story, the incredible story in which we've gone from taking my college credit card and starting a business to being over $250 million and revenue being the largest kind of small group of venture company in the world, I mean, the story itself is what motivated loop tail writing the book because it's been such an incredible journey and I wanted to kind of have a positive impact on others through my story. But starting the business and why I started the business was like any other entrepreneur who gets out of school and sees that there's an industry that needs issues or has a problem and you think you can do it better. And that's how I came with G-Adventures because I entered the travel industry. When I started G-Adventures, the world didn't need another travel company. So I had to create differentiation, create something unique enough that would be able to change the way people looked at their holiday time. Well, you're talking about this Eureka moment and I mean, it's funny, right? I was just having this conversation with somebody this morning. I think that there's something to be said for those moments. I think sometimes they come in very unusual ways. I mean, for me, it was in the form of an email from a friend who said that I should start this show because I had interviewed him for my other blog. But I think recognizing those moments is really, really important and I'm curious, how you knew that was kind of one of those moments, and then, I mean, how do we take that in our own lives? How do we take advantage of our Eureka moments and make sure we don't miss out on them? I think you have to be fairly self-aware to know when opportunities are knocking. When destiny turns on the radio, some people listen and some people don't. I'm a real believer that everyone has their opportunities before them and everyone has their destiny and their place in the universe, and some people actively search and look and find their place in the universe, and a lot of people just don't care or are unbothered and sleep walk through life, but I believe that everyone has destiny and there's people who pick up on those clues and there's just people who don't, people who get it and people who don't. What do you think separates those two groups? I mean, do you think there's something inherently built into people that differentiates those two groups of people? I think there's an argument between whether it's nature or nurture, right? I mean, my mother always used to tell me, don't waste your people on people that don't get it. There's two people in this world, my mother used to say, it's people who get it and people who don't, and the people who don't, they're sold on their own destiny in their own where they want to be in the world, and as entrepreneurs, we find people that want to believe in a story, want to believe in what we're doing, want to believe that a company can change the world though, an idea can change the world, and that's part of their destiny, is it this part of my destiny. You mentioned your mother, one of the things I love looking back at is looking at early influences in somebody's life, I mean, was this something that you knew when you were a kid, that you had some sort of destiny, and what was your childhood like, I mean, growing up, I mean, what kinds of influences kind of led you to this point of saying, okay, you know what, I'm going to take out my college credit cards, and I have it in me to do this. Yeah, I mean, it's very easy for me to say that, oh yes, I always knew what I was doing, I certainly, I had three companies, I started three companies before I turned 16, so I always knew that business was in my blood, and it was always something that I wanted to do. And it was always part of my, you know, what I say, it was my destiny, you know, and when I look back, there was a lot of things that happened in my life that made me, that, you know, that it was very clear to me that I knew very early, you know, what I was meant to do, and then there's, you know, I had three companies before I turned 16, and my first job was McDonald's, I got fired after two weeks, and then got fired at McDonald's, so I got fired from James McDonald's, and that's at the age of 16 that was tragic, but it was all part of my story, right, it was all part of, you know, everything that made me what I am, and it was, and I knew that the only time I'd been successful was when I started businesses prior to turning 16, and so that's what I focused on, you know, what I knew and what I was successful at, and that's what started, you know, had me looking for ideas of a company to start when I was, you know, 22 years old. Well, I can relate to the McDonald's thing, because my first job in high school was working at McDonald's, coincidentally. And was it a great working experience? Okay, so I happen to work for the one and only, I'm pretty sure, you know, when you watch the movies and you see Jamaican people, they're pretty laid back, you know, you see like you're thinking Bob Marley, Rastafarian's, and I think I worked with the only angry Jamaican person on the entire planet, because she was vicious, I mean, she was pissed off all the time, like I was terrified of her, she was my manager at McDonald's. Oh, wow, I mean, I didn't even make it past the training program at McDonald's, I got fired during the training program, so better than me, as you made it on the floor. Yeah, I lasted eight months, that was probably one of the most humbling experiences of my life to go and work in an environment like that, you know, I think, you know, despite the fact that, you know, I knew that that was not my career, one of the things that gave me a deep appreciation for is the fact that, you know, we said, you know, we complain about our lives in so many ways, but like, when I looked at that and I saw, wow, some of these people here are basically going to make their entire living, this is how they survive, and I have the gift of being able to go get an education, and I really, I realized how much we take so many things for granted. Oh, yeah, I mean, that's a big thread that I want to get across in my book in Luteo about how we take, we take, we take a lot of things for granted every day, and those are the, those are the cues and those are the notes that we have to remember when we, you know, when people look for their place in the universe and believing in your destiny and believing that, you know, there's a, there's a higher purpose for what you do or whatever it is you do, in whatever field or whether it's, you know, whether you're working for someone or whether you're an entrepreneur, everyone has their place in the universe and our destinies before us. I just believe that, and more so in business, we're actually running a business and, you know, we're evidence of that success. So before we get into Loop Tail and G Adventures on, I, I want to actually start with their high school businesses because you actually jogged my memory and I remember reading about them and I remember that, that was one of the funniest parts of the book. So I'm not going to let you off the hook without telling us about some of those businesses and your classmates, that story just, it brought a smile to my face because it was so funny. Well, my first business was back in the days when our home newspapers were being delivered and I used to, you have to be 12 years old to have a newspaper and a newspaper route and I thought that that was just the golden ticket to making money and we'd be getting a newspaper route, but I was 11. So I had to wait and so when I turned 12, I applied for paper, it's in various areas of the city so I could have multiple routes and I, and then I said, contracted them to 11 year olds and get, who couldn't get newspaper routes yet and I used to split the profits with them. And so it was, you know, that was the first thing that, and then the next one was, you know, a rabbit business when I, you know, came to the, my degree, your week moment was, you know, people buy rabbits when they're tiny furry, cute little bunnies, but then they grow up to be, you know, quite, you know, livestock. They're no longer cute anymore. So I saw and read about a, a breed of rabbit out of the Netherlands called the Dutch Dwarfs. There were dwarf rabbits that never grew and so I imported them into Alberta to, and started breeding them and selling them a pest horse and that was my, and then my next business was a bookmark business, which I did with a junior achievement program, which was offered in my school. And I was, I was always quite business focused, like when, and I was quite odd, my parents were very concerned that I was doing these things when, you know, my brothers, you know, are playing hockey or, you know, do swimming and doing other sports and I was, you know, I was interested in doing after school programs, starting a business, but I, to me, it was the most natural thing in the world. Well, I remember you saying something about the rabbit business, like you had classmates who were really pissed off at you because the rabbits died or something along those lines. And I remember that very distinctly, and that made me laugh so hard when I was reading the book. No, you know, yeah, it was, it was, it was, it was kind of making reference to Facebook because I, I was, I haven't been on Facebook. That's right. Seriously. And the guys at our marketing department were doing a promotion where they registered me on Facebook for a day to do some kind of contest. And within minutes, you know, I got flooded with all these people that wanted to, you know, I sat behind during grade four and I, you know, I, you know, I don't know if I guess, you know, I knew you when you were, you know, 12 years old living on the street, whatever. People were kind of making contact. And then I got an email from someone that said, you sold me a rabbit many years ago that turned out to be the worst pet ever. I wish I'd be friends on Facebook. Anyway, so, you know, Facebook, that was my first introduction to Facebook. And then we immediately canceled the account after that, actually, on Facebook for years. And just for the book, we have a Facebook account now. All right. Perfect. Well, let's get into, into loop tail and, and, and building G adventures. I mean, you started a company with a bunch of credit cards. I mean, like, from reading loop tail, I don't get the sense that this was sort of like the easiest journey by any stretch of the imagination. I saw a lot of ups and downs and moments in which this whole thing could have fallen apart, it seems like. I mean, multiple times. And so I'd love for you to walk us through sort of those moments and, and you know, how you overcame them. And I mean, how your philosophy as a leader and, you know, the way you approach business is, is very, very refreshing. It's so different than anything I've come across. I mean, you've always, from what I've seen, been willing to challenge the status quo and do things despite the fact that they might not make you very popular. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's, that's part of being, well, part of being an entrepreneur, but part of being innovation, as a lot to do with, you know, self-confidence to put things in front of people that they didn't even know they wanted. And at times that's, you can be very popular and at times you can be very unpopular. And you think that that doesn't change your decision with progressing, though. Mm-hmm. Go ahead. Sorry. No, I mean, I mean, the, for me, when I said, you know, starting the company, there was never, it was never a point where, you know, I thought that it was, you know, gonna be easy. I mean, entrepreneurs have their ups and downs. In my case, you know, because we were self-funded and, you know, you know, bootstrapped our way for so long, like, people have to understand, like, deep branches is 23 years old. I've been doing this for quite a long time. So it's not, it's not a, you know, a quick success story, but I was very passionate and motivated. And it, and it was, it's what got me through those difficult times. Mm-hmm. Let me ask you, in those difficult times, I mean, are there, are there specific moments that, that you recall that, you know, you, you really saw a sort of defining moments that basically kind of, you know, shaped this entire philosophy of the loop tail? Yeah. I mean, the defining moment for me was that, where the book opens, where, when I'm at Tibet in March 14, 1997, it is the exact date. That is with the, the, the, the defining moment for me. And I knew, I knew that, you know, I, I did, went to Bhutan during that trip as well, where I saw, you know, the idea of gross national happiness, which has been developed by the king at that point. And then I went through the spiritual journey through Tibet, which, you know, showed how people, how Tibet has lived for so many centuries as a, as a country that makes its decisions based on oracles and, you know, karma. And, you know, and even though I was, you know, I, my mind wasn't wired that way, and it still isn't to a certain extent. The idea, you know, really resonated with me. And, you know, it was one of those things that I, you know, it changed the way I thought about my life. And then it was natural that it would change the extension, you know, of my business, how I looked at my business. Because at that point, you know, when you're in the trenches of starting a business, especially when you're boot shopping for credit cards, your life is your business. So when your life changes, your business changes as well. You know, it's interesting. I mean, you brought up the spiritual journey, and I can honestly tell you, you know, one of the things I can, I could easily find as a common thread between our guests here in this show is a spiritual journey of some sort. And it happens in many forms. I mean, for one of our former guests, it happened by going to prison for two years. I mean, it was one of the most enlightening experiences of her life. For me, personally, you know, learning how to surf has been the ultimate spiritual journey. I mean, chasing waves has, has become such a defining part of my life. I guess, you know, where I'm going with this is, do you think that in order to really find what we're meant to do in this world, a spiritual journey is actually essential? I think everyone has their own path, I'll be honest with you. I mean, people don't necessarily have to, you know, face hardships to reach, to be successful. I think we all have our own defining paths. I think some roads are lumpier than others. And, you know, you can't compare the two either. I get that people want to often, especially people who read my book, they want to compare, you know, often their experience. And, you know, it's always, it's easy to relate to almost anybody's experience. But comparing might be, you know, it's not, might not be the, you know, but the right thing to do when we all just have different paths, you know, we can all relate to the journey that, you know, the journey we all take in life to get, you know, to find our own higher purpose, but at the same time, the appreciation of the diversity of other people's paths, what makes the world great, you know, the diversity of different people and different ways people get to where they need to go. But, you know, your journey, I'm sure, is just as enlightening, but just in a very different way. Yeah, I would say, I think it's really, I'm glad you brought up this idea of comparison because to me, that is, it's almost an epidemic at this point, given sort of how publicly our lives are on display, I think we really, this is something that I personally have struggled with because, you know, I spend all my days talking to people like you and I always, you know, my business partner said he's like, this completely warps your entire perspective on the world. He said, you're talking to the upper echelon of people who achieve things. He said, and if that's your basis for comparison, you're always going to feel out of your league. Yeah, I mean, that's a very dangerous road. I mean, I can't tell you how many, like, you know, especially as the book has come on, I get letters from people which I'd never received before that. And, you know, I mean, of which I can't reply them all, but I mean, it's, you know, the idea of inspiring someone by writing my book, there's a whole league of people that it might not have that positive in effect if they spend their time comparing because, you know, as I said, everyone's road is different. And the great thing about that is, you know, the celebration of diversity, you know, that the way that we get there, I mean, you don't have to have, you know, hardships and, you know, hardships to find success. You know, that's some people's paths and some people have, you know, really great family lives and really great, you know, communities to help support them and they become equally successful as people who, you know, come from more difficult circumstances and have to rise above adversity to become successful. All those things make up, you know, but in the end, it's about finding your own individual path and your, your, your individual, everyone's individual, everyone's their own person. And that's why it makes it so that there's no reason why anyone's path should be compared. Yeah, sorry, go ahead. No, no, no, nothing more to add to that. Oh, okay. Yeah, I mean, I think you bring up a really, you know, it's an interesting point because even when I talk to people here and, you know, our listeners write in, I always have to say and say, you know, you need to take everything our guests say with a grain of salt and also realize that I always say that the point of what you're learning here is to adapt it to your own particular situation model rather than mimic it because you're right. I mean, if we could, I don't, you know, we jokingly said there is not a single guest who has told me I read the four hour work week and I followed this four step formula and that's how I ended up here. Every single person that I have talked to tells me a different story. Yeah, I mean, you just hope that you get something out of it. Relate back to your own existence. I mean, that's really what it boils down to. I mean, you know, when I took some time in the last week to read some of the reviews, which I was avoiding reviews, I determined to avoid reviews from my book, but they were, you know, but surprisingly, my book has gotten such amazing reviews, but I didn't expect that, of course. Not being a writer, putting on a book was quite a daunting task, but, you know, the reviews have been so positive that I went to kind of read them and I, you know, and the people that really didn't get the book to a certain extent didn't necessarily, it's the people that compared it into what compared it directly to their lives and what it could benefit their lives, how it could benefit their lives directly. And you know, there, but the people who kind of, you look, read books or read or listen to your podcast to try to get an influencer, to try to hear about how other people find their way are the people that really find success. I mean, those are people that define themselves by becoming better people or, you know, better stronger or faster at whatever it is they do, by being coachable, by being able to listen or read and be influenced by how other people are finding their way in the world, you know? It's not the people looking for the people that are looking for that direct B line, you know, A to B direct line to success are the ones that set themselves up to fail for failure and they listen to things and they read things wanting, you know, a direct, you know, manual on how to get there and there just isn't one. Yeah. I always say straight and narrow paths very rarely lead to interesting destinations. Exactly. Very true. So let's do this. This shift gears a little bit, I want to start getting into sort of the idea of loop tail and what this means. I mean, you know, the way I understood the book and the way I interpreted the book is that the loop tail really is a framework for leadership and building organizations in the 21st century and I'd love for you to expand and talk to us about sort of the elements of that framework and sort of, you know, what are the implications for us as we go about approaching our lives, our businesses and everything else? Well, I think the original tag line for loop tail is why community culture and karma matter and business and what that what that really means is how people look at their lives and how they look at their businesses, you know, today and when we have the social revolution upon us that's bringing that's bringing, you know, a level of transparency between those two worlds. Yeah. We come from the industrial age many years ago where we're taught to separate work and personal life. You know, people separate their work like you know, your work is over here and it's you work to live and then you on this side, you live your life separate from your work, which is a horrible way to live. And then today with the social tools that are everyone's disposal and the way people are becoming so connected, it's been very it's become this become very weird that people keep these two things separated because they're not finding passion what they do. They're not finding purpose in what they do regardless of what it is you do. I mean, as I said, you don't have to be an entrepreneur or try to a huge company. You can, you know, work for, you know, an exciting company, just be passionate about its purposes and whether that's, you know, Federal Express doing career delivery or whether that's, you know, Apple putting, you know, in, you know, new devices in people's hands and making people's lives easier through technology. These are all things that you find your purpose in contributing towards. And so, you know, Luke Tale is about how, you know, you shouldn't look at your business and different on how you would look at your life. And you know, when people look at their lives, they, you know, people are living more sustainably. People are, you know, we're recycling at home, we're using low light bulbs at home. Yet when they go on vacation, they suspend those beliefs and they go on a cruise ship or a compound resort holiday where no money stays in local country and doesn't have local benefit. They disconnect that the kind of caters to that idea that work and life are imbalanced. So when people talk about work like balance, they talk about not working as much. So you can, as I said, you can work to live. And it's, it's, and, and you know, when you do the math and think about how much time you have to spend at work on a daily, on a daily basis, not just working itself, but also waking up in the morning, getting ready for work, commuting to work, you know, getting home from work. You know, when you look at things that you do, it's a majority of your life. So you should, you should pursue some form of passion and purpose with, with whatever you do. And so, you know, for me, Luke Tailed those further than that because it's an entrepreneurial story and how we incorporated that in our business. And when you look at your life, when you, you know, you act a certain way in your life in terms of treating people, how you'd want to be treated, and then doing that in your business because business shouldn't be any different of getting it forward, but the idea of karma, you know, karma is a very spiritual word. But in business, it means that, you know, you know, whenever something bad happens to people, you know, you often hear that expression, oh, you know, you know, there, they'll, they'll, you know, they'll get theirs one day or, you know, they'll, you know, karma is, you know, karma will come back to them or whatever those kinds of expressions. But business should be, shouldn't be any different. You know, we should look at how our businesses impact people, planet, and profit, as well as creating passion, purpose, and happiness with anyone who touches your brand. It creates that differentiation with the company that, that didn't exist before because people didn't have the social tools to engage with customers and with, sorry, with companies like they do today. You know, it's just a very different world and companies that engage in and create that transparency and that relationship with their customers engaging in that higher purpose of their business are the ones that will survive and the brands will survive in the future. And you know, the loop tail is a philosophy about how we've taken those social tools and the relationships we have with our customers and created a higher purpose around defining, redefining how people look at travel. And it's, it, it can be used on any business, like any business can think the same way. And I, you know, I give some examples, like Nike, you know, in the, in the early days, when Nike wanted to sell you clothes, they hired Michael Jordan, they put on these amazing commercials. And when you walked into a store and you felt a certain way, because that you remembered the commercial in your mind, and so it triggered you to buy Nike products. But today, if you, to be engaged to the Nike brand, you can follow their employees on Twitter. You can follow their CEO on Twitter or Facebook. You can follow their factories in China. They have Facebook pages or Twitter pages. The employees that work at those, at those factories have the ability to be on Twitter. There's a transparency and an engagement with brands that's on another level and a social level. And everyone's trying to, and now brands have a personality. And they're not just, it's just not a one way relationship. Traditionally, you know, brands put up commercials. They made you feel a certain way, but it was one way communication. But now consumers could communicate back and they want that two way relationship. And it's a much more intimate relationship. In order to mean anything to your customers now, you have to strive for your brand to mean something more than just this product. You have to transcend what you do and create a product that, you know, that engages your customers to a much higher purpose than what you do. And that's, you know, the whole philosophy behind the look tag. Let's talk about something that's not always top of mind, but still really important. Life insurance. Why? Because it offers financial protection for your loved ones and can help them pay for things like a mortgage, credit card debt, it can even help fund an education. And guess what? Life insurance is probably a lot more affordable than you think. In fact, most people think life insurance is three times more expensive than it is. So with state farm life insurance, you can protect your loved ones without breaking the bank. Not sure where to start? State Farm has over 19,000 local agents that can help you choose an option to fit your needs and budget. Get started today and contact a state farm agent or go to statefarm.com. Decisions, decisions. Wait a minute. 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And Evan, he can't stand salads, but he's still lost 50 pounds with Nume. I never really was a salad guy, that's just not who I am. Even through the pickiness, Nume taught me that building better habits builds a healthier lifestyle. I'm not doing this to get to a number, I'm doing this to feel better. Get your personalized plan today at Nume.com. Real Nume users compensated to provide their story. In four weeks, a typical new user can expect to lose one to two pounds per week. This is the book for you. We take the 100 biggest sports debates and answer them, settle them once and for all. Meanwhile, what's your favorite part of the book? It's Nikki, have no trivia points. All that and a whole lot more, it's got your answers, it's available anywhere you get your books right now. So, I love it. I mean, this is why I wanted to have you on the show because I think this is so fundamental. I don't care whether you're an artist, whether you're, you know, an individual creator. I mean, all of this matters. I want to do a bit more digging into this idea of community culture and karma. Remember, one of the things that stood out to me is kind of the way you decided to run your tours. I mean, everything is about putting back into the systems in which you're profiting from. I mean, you're all your tour guides. I love how you have local CEOs and I was wondering, can you talk about community and how you guys have embraced that? Not just on the web, but in terms of the locations where, I mean, share some of the examples of where you've done this in your life because I feel like you've done this long before we had the social web. Yeah, I mean, but before, I mean, it was very different. You know, we were seen as more of an underground and we were growing before, you know, the last seven years when, you know, that we became much bigger because of, you know, with social tools. But, I mean, we've been doing it for a very long time and, you know, in many ways it was a labor of love when it first started because it made sense with the authentic experiences we wanted to create for our customers. But our first customers were quite hardcore travelers that thought of us as the best kept secret. And they liked knowing about us, but not us, but us not necessarily putting it in the forefront of what we did. We were this cool, unique idea and, you know, and even though we were growing still by double digit for, you know, in during that time, our customers had an intimate relationship with us, but it was on a very different level. And when we started growing in the last 10 years where people started taking our trips, you know, for the first time, you know, and we were getting families who last year took a Disney cruise and suddenly were with us in Mongolia because their neighbors did it. That was a whole other market for us. That was a whole other side of the travel business, the mainstream travel business that were, you know, we were professing for years for people to get off cruise ships and get out of compound resorts and have local impact and positive impact on people's lives locally when they travel. And then this greater philosophy that, you know, travel can be the greatest form of wealth distribution that the world has ever seen if it's done right. And local communities benefit from people traveling like this holistic approach to travel was something that, you know, the world had never seen or a travel or certainly a travel company with that kind of message. But in order to accomplish that, we had to create these local benefits or local community relationships and include local communities in our success as we grew because we are like we're huge now compared to where we were creating those those relationships 10 years ago, you know, where we'll run 18,000 tours this year, 18,000 trips will depart this year with passengers for us. And that's in over 100 countries around the world. So in order for us to be successful on that level of the grassroots level that we are, we have to have a dialogue with local communities and we have to have a positive impact where we run tours. So we have our foundation, which is the Planetera and the Planetera Foundation and we build community projects around the world. We have about 40 projects around the world, whether they're street kids homes or women's weaving projects, children's day schools, you know, we have new hope in Cambodia, we have eye hospitals, which do corrective surgeries for people that need cataract surgeries. All of these things are projects that are linked and funded by our travelers, but it's to create a local benefit in order for us to preserve the authentic experiences that we promise our customers when they travel with us as well. And changing the way people look at their holiday time and, you know, and align it more with how we're living our lives more today because I said we're all living more sustainable at home. We're recycling and, as I mentioned before, we're also eating, you know, 100 mile diets, organic, all of these things in which we change, our holiday time should not be any different. We shouldn't suspend our thoughts because we're going to another country. I want you to consider, you know, where we're going and having a positive impact. And just imagine if we've got to a place in the world where, you know, you're, you're, you know, you're, you're, you're giving back, would be going on holidays, imagine that. Like, I mean, that's my idea of, you know, you know, we all kind of save money and, you know, give a certain percentage of our salary. We want to do something as good human beings. We want to do something good. And so you donate money to your local NGO that, you know, makes you feel better, whether it's animal rights or human rights or the environment, whatever it is, your causes. But imagine if you could put all those things together and, you know, save all of your money and go on holiday and have that feeling of giving back when you went on holiday. And that's what, you know, the purpose of G Adventures is anyways, and that was a story of the philosophy we built around Looptail. I wanted to extend out to other companies around how that philosophy works. Well, you know what, probably my favorite thing that you said and all of that is thinking of travel is the greatest form of wealth distribution ever. That's actually such a touching sentiment because, I mean, if you look at it, you know, clearly there's severe income inequality when we look at the world. And you know, what's coming for me from listening to that, I mean, when I look at the internet, I tell people, it's like the internet is like a developing country. And I guess the question, there's two questions that come from everything you've just said. One is around this sort of branding aspect of things. I mean, you know, you guys were known as sort of this cool, hip, underground thing, and then you sort of become mainstream, and I wondered, you know, how you maintain, like, how do you maintain sort of the authenticity, integrity of what you originally stood for when you sort of become mainstream, you know, without, you know, like, I think it sounds to me like there's sort of almost a coolness factor with being associated with G Adventures for those early customers. And like, I wonder how you keep that going. And then, of course, the other thing is that, you know, as people who are internet entrepreneurs, and when I watch what's going on in the web, to some degree, it saddens me because I realize there is severe income distribution or severe income inequality. We're not, you know, really distributing the wealth equally. And I'm wondering is there are the things that we can take from the loop tail and apply to what we're doing in this online world? Oh, yeah, I mean, there's everything, I mean, it's about connectedness and creating community, right? And striving for a higher purpose in whatever it is you do, I mean, those are the keys, and those are also the key drivers of our business, you know, we created this business model of happiness, where, you know, what drives human happiness outside of consuming, and that is, you know, connectedness, you know, being part of something greater than yourself, creating all those things as the core principles of your business, and all those things that the core principle of your decision-making from the start is the best way to start companies, because it's about that engagement with your customers and the modern consumer in the modern social world who has a much more intense and intimate relationship with any brand or company. You know, there's so many companies right now, since the book has come out, I've been asked to come and speak to, you know, governments and, you know, different, you know, counselors in different regions, because everyone wants to, or even, and also businesses, because people want to try and retrofit their business, to kind of suit the modern kind of way people are consuming today or engaging, but, you know, the, you know, with my book, I wanted people to inspire people, to put that at the forefront of the, you know, of the incubation stage of when you're, you know, you're starting a business, how you look at how you look at how you engage people online with internet businesses, because you want to create connectedness, like, you know, originally, as even with the internet, the relationship was always one way, it was a one-way relationship with customers where, you know, you sell customers' product, you offer fantastic service, and get it, you know, get it to them quickly and on time, and then you get a loyal, repeat customers, but they want more, customers are now wanting more, and there's those customers that are becoming lifestyle brands that are engaging and meaning something and making their lives better outside of just applying their product. Let me ask you this, let's talk briefly about culture, because, I mean, one of the things that I know from knowing what I do about you is, I mean, you've faced some very distinctive choices in how you've built a culture, and I'd love for you to expand on that, I mean, and kind of, you know, what are the implications for us going forward about culture? I mean, what does culture mean to you and, you know, what do we have to think about as we're going forward with what we're doing? Let's talk about something that's not always top of mind, but still really important, life insurance. Why? Because it offers financial protection for your loved ones, and can help them pay for things like a mortgage, credit card debt, it can even help fund an education. And guess what? Life insurance is probably a lot more affordable than you think. In fact, people think life insurance is three times more expensive than it is. So with state farm life insurance, you can protect your loved ones without breaking the bank. Not sure where to start? State Farm has over 19,000 local agents that can help you choose an option to fit your needs and budget. Get started today and contact a state farm agent, or go to statefarm.com. Not everyone gets B2B, but with LinkedIn, you'll be able to reach people who do. Get $100 credit on your next ad campaign. Go to LinkedIn.com/resolts to claim your credit. That's LinkedIn.com/resolts. In terms and conditions apply, LinkedIn, the place to be to be. Hey there, it's Greenee and HEMBO, and we are back and better than ever. Got your answers is for sale. And if you are interested in winning every sports debate you have for the rest of your life, this is the book for you. We take the 100 biggest sports debates and answer them, settle them once and for all. Meanwhile, HEMBO, what's your favorite part of the book? 100 sneaky HEMBO trivia questions. All that and a whole lot more. It's called Got Your Answers. It's available anywhere you get your books right now. When it comes to weight loss, no two people are the same. That's why NUAM builds personalized plans based on your unique psychology and biology. Take Brittany. After years of unsustainable diets, NUAM helped her lose 20 pounds and keep it off. I was definitely in a yo-yo cycle for years of just losing weight, gaining weight, and it was exhausting. And Stephanie, she's a former D1 athlete who knew she couldn't out-train her diet and she lost 38 pounds. My relationship to food before NUAM was never consistent. And Evan, he can't stand salads, but he still lost 50 pounds with NUAM. I never really was a salad guy. That's just not who I am. Even through the pickiness, NUAM taught me that building better habits builds a healthier lifestyle. I'm not doing this to get to a number. I'm doing this to feel better. Get your personalized plan today at NUAM.com. Real NUAM users compensated to provide their story. In four weeks, a typical NUAM user can expect to lose one to two pounds per week. Individual results may vary. Forging ahead together drives Colorado's pioneering spirit. At Chevron, we donate funding and volunteer thousands of hours in support of the community's We Call Home. We also employ our neighbors to deliver the energy needed as the state's largest oil and natural gas producer. All to help improve lives in our shared backyard. That's energy and progress. Visit Colorado.chefron.com. This is a mini-meditation guided by Bombas. Repeat after me. I'm comfy, comfy. I'm cozy, I have zero blisters on my toes, blisters, and that's because I wear Bombas. The softest sucks underwear and t-shirts that give back. One purchased equals one donated. Now go to bombas.com/acast and use code ACAST for 20% off your first purchase. That's B-O-M-B-A-S.com/acast and use code ACAST at checkout. I mean, company culture is something that comes from the top down. So it starts off with how you're recruiting, the people that you bring on and defining how you're going to run your business around your defined core values. And your company culture flows out of that. And again, it then becomes a part of your brand and becomes a part of your company because it becomes a part of how people relate to you. Our company has a very distinct and defined company culture, but there's many people that think we're kind of crazy and kind of hippies. I had someone, I was doing a web thing for travel agency the other day, a webinar, an agent hung up the phone saying, "Oh, this sounds way too political." And just drop him up the phone. And that's fine. When you stand for something or you go out on a limb by putting your company culture and the transparency of your business forward, you have to expect that there's a chance it'll polarize people as well. And so company culture comes from, and by the way, that's also very contrary to how many people grew up believing in how you build a business. People try and build a business by being everything to everyone. By being as generic as possible in how you define yourself, you can cater your company to as many markets as possible or be available or interesting to as many people as possible. But it just doesn't work like that today, because any company that tries to be everything for anyone and doesn't stand for anything means very little to the modern consumer, means nothing really. So it's the companies that really go out on a limb and stand for something, because people relate to your company on an intrinsic level. That's the people that become loyal. Excuse me, loyal to your brand and truly become ravers. We call them ravers, people who really, you know, 73% of people who take one of our trips becomes a raver. Meaning they don't just passively love their trip or love the company. They actively want to talk about it because their friends are right about it or tell people that they should take a trip with us or they want to tell stories about the trip they took with us. So, I mean, those building that kind of army of marketing partners, if you will, is really how we become successful. So when I say so quickly, in the last seven to eight years where we've seen phenomenal growth, it's because we've been able to engage those customers in a very different way. Well, you know, it's funny because I mean, we're talking about this in the context of a massive company, but I think that this actually is just as relevant if you're an artist, you know, who's got a gallery you're opening and you want people to buy your art or whether you're an author who wants people to read your books, I think the same principles apply. Oh, most definitely. I mean, that's a very, very good point. And there's a point in the book where I also talk about how, you know, entrepreneurs are the artists of the business community in many ways. I mean, because, you know, when you create a business and when it becomes part of, you know, and if you want to drive company culture as part of your brand offering, it becomes a very personal piece of work because it ends up becoming very much tied to your personality. It becomes a part of you. And there's no avoiding it either. Like, you know, when you get people that, you know, that are not as necessarily, I won't say bad people, but people who aren't as necessarily switched on to the outside of the idea of just making money in a business. The business comes across that way to the consumer today because of that transparency. And you can see businesses really backwards trying to change their story and trying to change the way they talk to consumers, whereas just five years ago, all they cared about is you spending as much as you could in their stores because they're trying to engage those customers. But, you know, any size business is relevant to you, but you know, it's a creative process. It's a creative process, very much like an artist, which you mentioned. I mean, I don't think it's any different. And I get, you know, I've had people, you know, especially artists actually, or musicians. I don't think it's any different, you know, when you're starting a company that I've given the writing a song or doing a painting or, you know, that working on a sculpture, you're building and you're creating something from your own mind. And you're creating a business or you're creating something that comes from your heart and it represents your, you know, your being, your soul. When you put it out there like that, and the loop tail, the book was an extremely difficult process for me to actually put it out. I pulled the plug a couple times over the course of the year on doing, I just couldn't, you know, I just couldn't bring myself to do it at some point. Because it was such a personal, it was such a personal road to take with getting my story out and, you know, going to another level in terms of, you know, creating that relationship with our customers or readers or people who are interested in our story. But I also knew the positive impact it had and that outweighed kind of my own interpretation. But, you know, being an artist, an entrepreneur are very similar in so many ways. So, for you to mention that, I mean, I, you know, when you go to any kind of business function with, you know, with Fortune 500 companies, you always see the entrepreneurs in the corner of the room. And they're the awkward ones that are usually in jeans and, you know, a hoodie and wearing, you know, sneakers. And those are the entrepreneurs in the business community, which is very different. They think differently. But, you know, but as entrepreneurs, we're also very, we're very creative, but we're also profit-driven. We're also creative. We're also interested in market share and being aggressive in the business world. But we just do it and we think very differently. Well, I'm glad you've read up the book in the process. So, let's shift gears a little bit. I want to talk briefly about the actual writing process for the book and then we'll start wrapping things up. I mean, you've said a handful of times throughout this conversation. I'm not a writer. And now you have a best-selling book, which is kind of an oxymoron, in my opinion. But talk to me about that. I mean, you know, finding your voice through this process. I mean, obviously, you had an amazing story to tell, but translating it. That doesn't always happen easily for most people. And I'm curious what that's been like for you. Well, you know, right, it's been a long process and the decision to want to write the book and then I'm getting a book agent and going through publishers and then they're getting their view of what they wanted, you know, wanted the book to be compared to what I wanted it to be. And then physically having to write it. I mean, having to write the book in itself was, as I said, I'm not a writer. So, you know, it didn't come naturally for me. And you know, I had an editor that worked with me that really pushed me and told me where I needed to, you know, add things and take things out and clean everything up and add things when, you know, to smooth out, you know, to make it a story. And so that's the technical, you know, side of the writing. You know, I wasn't motivated to do so much writing either because it's because I'm not naturally a writer. But you know what, in the end, you know, one thing I say in the book is entrepreneurs are the best stories, some of the best storytellers in the world. And you know, I am a phenomenal storyteller. But that doesn't make necessarily make me a good writer. So, I just had to find a way to get that story out. And then the personal road to getting it actually out and, you know, writing it, you know, you're quite often thinking, like, who the heck wants to read this stuff? Like, who's the audience for this? Like, who's going to buy this? And the publishers gave me such big advances in the end because it was a bit of a bidding war when I decided to write it, that, you know, you suddenly, now I suddenly feel pressured to deliver it because in order for them to make their money, you know, I'm a businessman, right? I get, when I go into partnerships, I want both sides to make money, I want them to be successful too. And so I better write a good book. And then that push and pull with the publishers to get that right balance of what I want and what they want through an editing process. And then actually putting out, putting it out and then going on, you know, the New York Times bestseller list was was was phenomenal. Like, I mean, I don't even, I can't even describe that feeling. And then as I mentioned earlier, a week ago, just actually went through some of, you know, people reviewing on Amazon and different websites and just seeing how people are, you know, getting positively impacted by the book. It's just been an amazing experience, actually. But one that has taught me a lot, but it was so not natural for me. So it pushed and challenged me in the right ways. And I think I've really grown from it. You know, I don't think I'll ever do that again. I don't write a book again. And I was so adamant about it being in my own voice that as well. And so originally I tried to hire a ghostwriter and that didn't work out. And then having to plow through it and really come up with, you know, and also be honest. And you know, because the publishers wanted a business book, you know, I was across between more like, you know, inspiration kind of memoir kind of book, I would say. And then people wanted it to be more like a self help kind of book and then the Dalai Lama got involved, the Dalai Lama wanted to write the forward and not put it on another level in terms of a level of interest for people with the book. So you know, all of those things came together and over a course of a very long time, it was over two years. And it just, it was the perfect storm. And then when it came out, it was, you know, an immediate success, which has been very rewarding. Well, I think this is great. I mean, it's funny, you know, a lot of our authors will often compare giving, writing a book to giving childbirth. It's quite a painful experience. And I love that you use the analogy of the perfect storm. Because I think a lot of things have to happen for a book to book to come together. And I really appreciate that you mentioned this idea of wanting to do it in your own voice because I think you definitely achieved that. I think you've done something very interesting with this book. I mean, for those of you guys listening, if you haven't picked it up, it's, somehow you've managed to blend all those genres of memoir, you know, business book and, you know, self-help altogether in a very compelling way that to me, you know, like I said, I think it was Gary Arne who said, Hey, Srini, there's this book you might want to be, you want to talk to Bruce on your show. And it definitely stood out to me. And I can tell you, I get a lot of books and I don't always say yes, especially when they're just standard business books, but this definitely, you know, it piqued my interest. Yeah, I mean, it's funny because a lot of people have said that because it was the confluence of a lot of influences, because I had two publishers, which were very aggressive, which was, you know, I'm from Canada. So that my story is most, is obviously most well known here. So the Canadian publishers had a completely different idea because everyone in Canada knows me. I'm a kind of a more, a bit of a famous success story here. So they want more memoir, right? They want more story. They want more personal stuff about me, the person, US, the US publishers didn't care about me, the person, they want business, they want dollars and cents, they want learnings and lessons for entrepreneurs and business people, they want a business book. And then me on the inside, I want to inspire people, you know, I want to help people become, you know, stronger and better versions of themselves by, you know, compounding their growth and their experiences. And I want to have that positive impact. And everyone kind of got their, their wish with this book in the end. And I didn't realize it was so unique until it kind of came out and people started saying things like you just said, which, which thank you very much. It's been, it's been overwhelming actually to, to with the response on just the book outside of the impact on my business or it just people's immediate impact on how they read the book and how I'm saying exactly what you said actually, that it stood out amongst other business books, other books that were on their desk. And I've heard that from professors, people who bought, you know, 50 copies to give to all their employees or whatever, that it just was, it touched, touched them in a way that they, and many couldn't explain, but, or in a way that they wanted to share it. And I couldn't ask for a better, you know, I couldn't ask for more than that. I mean, when I put this book out, the day this book came out, it was a horrible two weeks leading up to the release date in September. I was just thinking, like, who the heck is going to buy this book? Like, it's, it just sounds like me, dribbling on and on and whining the whole time about this or that. I said, if so, you know, people are going to think I'm the biggest whiner. You know, I, but it really, you know, I, I wanted it to be about overcoming adversity and, you know, overcoming obstacles and, you know, keeping your eye on the prize and, you know, building winning teams and all those things that make companies great and make people great. I wanted that book to have that influence, but in the process, you know, I have to talk about our ups and downs as you, as you, as you, as you've mentioned, I just, it was my biggest fear that people think, oh, this is just, you know, he just comes across as such a whiner, look at how much success he has, but he goes back to talk about this and that and just being, you know, complaining about everything, but luckily that didn't happen. Well, you know, it's, it's funny. I'm not, I think that what you're feeling is what every artist feels when they put their work out into the world. Sure. Yeah. That's, that's, you know, and I, I mean, I had a woman here who's been writing for 20 years and she says, I feel that, you know, she says, you know, every morning you have to give yourself permission. Yes. I mean, that there's something said about that. That's, that's almost, that there's a bit of that in, in the karma side in terms of meditation, the meditation side, if you, you know, I've, I'm, you know, big into yoga and meditation, but that, that comes on to the self-help side, but you're, you're totally right every day. I mean, every day is your ability to make, you know, every day count. And, you know, what are you going to do today for tomorrow? All of those things and those questions are about, you know, your permission. I mean, taking advantage of every opportunity and, you know, remembering where you came from and building on all of that to make yourself a better version of yourself every day. I mean, I always say that and that, and your company shouldn't be treated any differently. So Bruce, I'm going to wrap our chat with one final question for you. You know, you've, you've built something from the ground up and clearly been very successful at it. I mean, you know, you've talked about many peers. I mean, even some of the people who, you know, wrote the back of the book, I mean, like, you know, wrote the testimonials in the back of the book are people like Alexis Ahanian from Reddit. And I mean, in the years that you've, you know, seen other entrepreneurs and people who start big projects and, and build things from the ground up, you know, I, I keep seeing this pattern and I've asked this question to hundreds of people and maybe it's, I jokingly call it for the research for the book that I don't know I'm going to write. But what do you think it is that it distinguishes the people who actually achieve what they're setting out to do from the ones who don't? Well, I don't know if I understand the question fully. Can you just ask? Oh, yeah. Let me, let me be a bit more clear. So I mean, I think there's two groups of people those who try, who set out with the best of intentions hoping to accomplish something big. And, and, you know, and then there's a group and they don't get there. And then there's a group who basically does it and they get there. They get to where they want to go. And I'm curious what you think is the difference between those two groups. I think there's, you know, life experience and, and, and awareness. I mean, I think that there's a lot of people that have, that want to get somewhere, but want to get there too fast or they don't have patience in which they want to achieve something. And, and, and that comes, that comes with a lack of awareness of, you know, what you're capable of at the time or what you're capable of, you know, presently, as opposed to what you'd be capable of five years from now or two years from now to pay the high load. So, you know, people who, you know, put their heart and soul into everything that they do. And, you know, are really, you know, committed and conscientious, no matter what it is you do, whether it's just shopping for groceries or whether it's, you know, doing a report in school or whether it's the job that you do. I think that we're in a generation of entitlement. I think there's a huge amount of entitlement without, you know, the generation that's coming, the younger generation today, and I'm tough enough, sounded on my father now, you kids today, but, but there's a, there's a certain set that people have expectations that they expect that they should, they should be successful because they just work hard or because they have great ideas. And, you know, I always tell people like that, you know what, great ideas are a dime a dozen. You know, there's tons of unemployed people that have great ideas. You know, the skill is in the execution on how you execute your ideas and how you execute your life. And in order to do that, you have to be extremely open and gracious and be able to accept everything that comes your way with an open heart and complete and continually challenge yourself at the right time to grow and to take things on when it's the right time for you in order to get you to that next level. Every step you take will get you to the, that the eventual finish line. It's the, it's people that want to be at the finish line before they put in the work or the before they put in, you know, the hours of the hard work that really never really come to fruition because they want to get there before they, and they don't see the path. And that takes a certain level of awareness. And I, as you know, because I employ almost 2,000 people now, I see that in young people all the time where, not even young people, I should say older people too, the people that are able to adapt and change and be able to grow with a business over a long period of time and are continually allowing their hard work and their effort to speak for itself and not constantly questioning, you know, and not constantly questioning, you know, where they're supposed to be because they know where they have to be. There's a big difference between those people and people who arrive and I see it all the time who, you know, we're a very cool company, we're a fast-moving company, and after a year being here, they want to know, you know, so what have you done for me lately? And what is their next step? As opposed to just, you know, putting your nose to the grind and letting your results and letting your hard work determine and just keep an open heart and wait for your opportunity, be very patient and be very pure with your intentions of what you want to do and clean that purpose in your life. I really believe that those are the people that always rise to the top. And I've seen, I see it over and over again, well, here and, you know, outside as well. Does that make sense? It makes perfect sense, and I think it's a perfect and poetic way to wrap up our conversation. Bruce, I can't thank you enough for taking the time to join us and share some of your insights with our listeners here at The Unmistakable Creative. This has been really cool, and, you know, for those of you guys who haven't read this book, it's one of the best books I've read this year, for sure. Oh, thank you. Thank you very much. And I'm going to put you on that. 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Bruce Poon tip is not the typical CEO of a travel company. Starting with nothing but his college credit cards, over the last 20 years Bruce has built G adventures into a 250 million dollar business.
Here are the hlighlights from our chat
- Learning to recognize when your Eureka moments
- Why self awareness is such an important skill to develop
- The early parts of Bruce's childhood and his influences
- Stories of entrepreneurship from Bruce's childhood
- Why working at Mcdonald's was a meaningful experience for me
- A look at the things we take for granted every single day
- Having the guts do things that will make you unpopular
- Why building a business is actually a spiritual journey
- Why everybody has a journey that enlightens them in their own way
- The importance of learning from other people's stories
- The role of community, culture and karma in business
- Why the separation between work and life is disappearing
- Looking at how business can impact people, planet and profit
- Why our brand must transcend just being about a product
- Treating travel as the greatest form of wealth distribution
- The power of creating connectedness through your business
- A look at conflicting desires involved in righting the book
- The role that patience plays in your ability to achieve something
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