Payne & Pendergast
What's Wrong with Texans QB CJ Stroud?
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And I think both things can be true. I will tell you, Seth, the one thing that I'm seeing a lot of over the last 48, 72 hours that needs to stop. And it won't, because it's Twitter. If anything, I'll get copied on more of these now, because I'm requesting they stop. These graphics that could put up with CJ's stats from this season in a column next to, say, Blake Bortles' stats from his second season in the NFL. And they pick out-- I haven't seen that, yeah. Blake Bortles, I've seen a lot of Trevor Lawrence. It's basically cherry-picking a bunch of quarterbacks who have been, since CJ came into the league, generally been viewed as inferior to CJ Stroud. Blake Bortles, obviously, inferior to CJ Stroud. I don't know if Blake Bortles is in the league anymore. Well, Bortles, the bending about Bortles was that he amassed a lot of garbage time yardage. And that-- It was like a record for yards when playing from behind and all that. In his second year. Several Lawrence, I'll listen to Trevor Lawrence, because this has been my issue. I long said, well, look, I'm not interested in making excuses for Trevor Lawrence because of his injuries that he's played through. And yet now I find myself saying, wow, maybe CJ's a little banged up. I don't know, he's been playing through something. So I'm a bit of a hypocrite there. But I also think that, like with Blake Bortles, or, excuse me, with Trevor Lawrence, Trevor Lawrence also had offensive line issues and protection issues and everything else. So it's really hard to separate some of CJ's play from the poor past protection, the lack of speed in the wide receiving core now, especially, and everything else. The complete and total absence of a run game is really, I think, the most devastating thing. Because CJ has still done some really good things. It's just a lot of it's on third and long because they're in third and long all the time, because they can't run the football. Yeah, the only thing I would say, like specific to Trevor Lawrence-- and Trevor Lawrence in his second year got the jags to the postseason, went on that great run at the end of the year where they won five out of six. And he was very good for that stretch. The only thing I would say in making an injury excuse for CJ is that Trevor Lawrence never touched the level that CJ was last year. Like Trevor Lawrence has never been mentioned in conversations about top five or even barely top 10 quarterbacks, whereas CJ came into this year and a lot of people were expecting a top five quarterback performance and they haven't gotten that. So with CJ and the injuries, I don't view them as much as excuses as reasons. Like if it were to turn out at the end of the year that he went in for some sort of procedure right after the year was over, I would feel relief that we would maybe now have an explanation for him missing some of the easy throws, or at least easy for him. He made him look easy last year. Like he, in that Baltimore game, he missed-- there was a period in the first half where he missed like four passes in a row. Well, no, then he missed four batting completions. And the only completion in that stretch was one that maybe should have been intercepted if Dalton Schulz doesn't snare the ball and moss the guy. You know, and he missed him to everybody. He sailed one to Nikko. He sailed a wheel route to Joe Mixon. He missed John Metche on a pass. Like it wasn't one of these things where he's throwing it to a guy. But he had missed three straight passes to Deontay Johnson. If he were active in that game, I'd have been like, all right, well, they're just not on the same page. You know, these are guys who were wide open and he's sailing these balls. So, you know, there were to be something after the year set that were medical, I would be a lot more relieved about some of the things that I do think are CJ's fault. He's got to make those throws. - The thing that I'm open to, injury is being at least part of the explanation. It goes all the way back to his misfire to Tank Dell in the Detroit game, where it's sometimes when a quarterback just doesn't feel right, that's where there's a little bit of hesitancy to pull the trigger on some of the big time throws. And on that play, it just felt like, man, he waited too long to make the decision and then he did not and then he didn't throw a good ball on top of it. The game the other day, the interception that he threw, man, that was gonna be a risky throw. And he was out on the run, scrambling, but I feel like he's regressed a little bit because on that play, he had time to plant his foot and throw it, but he kind of threw it on the run because there was pressure. But, all right, does he now feel that pressure more intensely because he's been hit so many times and because he's banged up because of those hits? It's just, it doesn't, it's not an excuse for the sum total of it all, but it would at least be a reasonable explanation for why there's some things that just aren't right. There's just too many times where, even the incompletion of Dalton Schultz in the flat, where Dalton was wide open. - Yeah, yeah. - Yes, yes, it's a tight pocket. Yes, Laramie Tunsel was getting trucked backwards badly and CJ was getting hit as he threw it. But I feel like there was a version of CJ that takes a half step to get away from it and then throws it or steps up in the pocket a little bit to make that throw. And I just don't know if it's either the lack of timing or trust or whatever else it is. Some of these hard throws, he's not making any easier on himself. And there's just everything's off. Now Dalton Schultz didn't get out of the backfield as quickly as he normally would on that because Laramie's getting trucked backwards and Dalton's checking for the blitz. There's just so many things that are off with the tight ends, with the wide receivers, with the offensive line that some of it might be injury, but some of it also might be that CJ is just, his clock is screwed up now. - This has been the hardest season in recent memory for me to watch other teams play football, especially other teams that run this system, to play football. Like I can watch other games, during seasons like 2021 or 2022 and not get angry 'cause the Texans are just a bad football team. Like it's whatever, it's a rebuild. I know the Texans need a lot more pieces to even be comparable to these other teams that I'm watching play. But you know, I'm watching Green Bay in Minnesota yesterday and I'm watching Minnesota just operate with Sam Darnold and with and with Cam Acres making big plays at the end of the day. Cam Acres had a touchdown and he had the catch that sealed the deal that basically made it so that Minnesota could just take knees. He was the guy that was in at the end of the game, not Aaron Jones, it was Cam Acres. So there were a few things to get a little upset about in that game, but the main thing, because it's not just that game, it's other games, it's teams that aren't even considered very good NFL offensive teams, but at least they're operating in a way that doesn't look, make everything look hard. Everything, everything looks hard. With even the plays that they convert, you know, even the third and 15s that they convert, it's usually something of, there's usually some element of CJ having to navigate some massive difficulty in order to do it and put a cape on in order to convert those plays. That's what's so infuriating to watch is it's now the Texans are a relevant team, they're a playoff team. We've seen good offense at times, mostly last season with this team. How is it that these other teams that are very average offensively, at least make their, at least on first and 10, they hand it off and like, wow, there's an easy seven-yard run. That never happens with the Houston Texans. - Honestly, the Cam Acres scenario and the fact that they traded him away is still so puzzling to me. I mean, you look at him versus Damian Peirce. It's not like Cam Acres is having all pro season or anything. He's only averaging 3.9 yards per attempt, but he's got 98 rushing attempts to Damian Peirce's 21. - You can't, you can, I'll sum it up so you can put him on the field. You can't put Damian Peirce on the field. Do you know why I know that? They're not putting Damian Peirce on the field. - Well, that's, I mean, Cam Acres has 12 receptions to Damian's too. Good, Cam Acres at the very least provides you some kind of dual threat at the running back position that, and maybe, you know, with the Texans, he's gonna have to manufacture a lot of that yardage, but I feel like he's at least capable of it. - You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy, just use Indeed. Stop struggling to get your job posts seen on other job sites. Indeed, sponsored jobs help you stand out and hire fast. With sponsored jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people you want faster. And it makes a huge difference. According to Indeed data, sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed have 45% more applications than non-sponsored jobs. Plus, with Indeed sponsored jobs, there are no monthly subscriptions, no long-term contracts, and you only pay for results. 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A good rushing attack would be incredible. But we know that it's not even a, - That would be good. - Games in which Joe Mixon has over 100 rushing yards were still saying like, man, they did not run the ball well. - Right. - Because it's Joe Mixon has a couple big runs, but man, they're not churning out yardage and it's putting the offense in third and long, second and long way too often. That's one of the things that, I know individually the offensive lineman are not playing well, obviously, but there's plenty of teams that run the ball better than the Texans who have journeyman offensive line across the board or at least one or two really good linemen, but not other guys to write home about. There's a disjointedness that it's impossible for me not to look at the whole operation and say, at the end of the day, Bobby Sloane's not getting enough out of these guys. - Yeah. - I don't care. As angry as I get at individual offensive lineman, to be as bad as they are in the run game and to be as bad as they are at some of the things, simple things in the passing game. When you couple that with the tight ends and the wide receivers and everything else, there were no, is there a position group on the offense right now that you feel good about? Even with the, even before Stefan Diggs and Tank Dell got injured, you still didn't feel great about the wide receiving group other than Nico Collins. - Right. Well, you and I led into this, I would have said quarterback, but the lead into this segment was, what's wrong with CJ right now? - Right. Yeah, no, I don't. - And just to be very clear, so it doesn't get misconstrued or twisted, I still feel great about CJ Stroud as the future quarterback of this football team. There's a big element and I was feeling it during that Ravens game and I was seeing it during the Ravens game on social media and just talking to people. I think there's a big element for people right now that feels like A, this offense ain't getting fixed this year and B, everybody just needs a big reset, especially in the offensive side of the ball. - And look, I just, and this is where, when you talk about there's just so many things off that you can make an excuse for somebody, you can make an excuse for somebody on the team almost every single down. And I'll criticize Bobby sometimes we're not attacking the middle of the field enough, but then you get into that game on Wednesday and there's times where yeah, there's supposed to be quick hitters over the middle and mesh concepts and stuff, but even versus a four man rush, where CJ's taking the ball in the gun, taking two steps backwards and he's getting hit at the top of his drop when he's trying, like I just, the defensive linemen are coming free so quickly and ferociously up the middle at times that you can't even throw over the middle. It's just so frustrating. It's really, it's, 'cause then when I'm watching on TV, I wanted to blame CJ for not getting rid of the ball quickly enough, but then I'm watching in the game and well, okay. Yeah, he could, he's got Xavier Hutchinson open on a target, but Kyle Van Neuoy is on CJ as he would be starting his motion. And it's just, you can't function that way. - Right. - You just can't function that way. - Yeah, I think it's a great, it's a great question. Like what, on the offensive side of the football, what group do you feel good about right now? - I probably went healthy, even when they weren't moving the football all that great with Tank and Stefan Diggs, both still healthy, I felt good about that room. You know, like those are three good receivers. - Well. - Now it's Nico and a bunch of dudes, you know? - The thing about when they had the three guys out there were just even two of them. They were still affecting the offense, even though the passing game or affecting the defense where the passing game wasn't what you wanted to be, but man, they're facing cover two all the time and you should be able to run the ball versus that. You should be able to complete short stuff, but they couldn't even do that because the ineptitude of the blocking. And by the blocking, I'll say by the offensive line, the tight ends, the running backs, all of it. And then you add on to that, you know, Joe Mixon, I could make some of the same excuses for Joe Mixon that I make for CJ Stroud. I don't think Joe Mixon's always doing a great job of making the right read. But then you're like, my knee jerk reaction is, but yeah, he's hardly ever getting good looks in front of him. And I think he and CJ both at times are pressing too hard to try to get the big shots. And it's just a quagmire. - I don't feel great about any room on that side of the football. And yet I feel like if they fix the offensive line room, that has an effect on all the others. You know, I saw a cut, there's a cut out there that I think a lot of, if you're a football fan and you're on social media, you've probably seen, I think it's from the draft or it was after Jim Harbaugh was named the head coach of the Chargers. And I think it was at the draft of the combine when all the coaches do availabilities at the press conference. So they sit down for breakfast with the reporters there in the room and Harbaugh has a great cut. And this is, and he kind of tipped his hand as to what they were going to do in the draft because they end up drafting Joe Alt, the tackle from Notre Dame to go with Ration Slater as their other tackles. So they got their bookend tackles for the next several years. And he said that basically, and I'm totally paraphrasing here, but offensive line is the one position that everybody else is dependent upon. You know, the other positions, they're not dependent on you. I mean, there is some interdependency with each position, but none more so than that group. And that is why we're going to build through the offensive line. And I think in terms of intentionality, I think the Texans have made an effort to do that in the last couple of years. It's just they are, they're either being coached by the wrong guys or they are the wrong guys. - They're, and that's especially. - Because it ain't getting done with this group right now. - I think the frustrating thing is that, you know, I'll say that, hey, you don't have to have all pros across the board. It's good enough to have a couple of studs and a few journeymen. But in this scheme, the frustrating thing is that usually you actually do get some really good performances out of average offensive linemen. If they're good for the scheme, and if it's being coached right, that's where I think in the off-season, if they don't make a change at offensive coordinator, I'll be astounded if they don't make a change at offensive line coach read. And it's almost, I mean, this comes back to, this comes back to D'Amico's hiring. Chris Strauss never coached in a system like this. When you talk to offensive linemen, this goes back to when I was playing against this scheme or talking to Gary Kubiak about it. It's way more complicated than just what you drop on the board. It's, somebody once told me that it was, you know, you can learn the playbook in a half hour. It'll take you decades to really learn how to block all of it. - Yes. - And there's a lot of technique involved, there's a lot of mental work involved. And when you have an offensive line coach who's never coached in a system like this before, that's, it's hard to pick up on the fly and expect that he's all of a sudden gonna be just an Alex Gibbs senior. - It's just, it's not that simple or easy. - Anybody who's ever been in management at any level, not just in football, but in business, knows hiring is a skill that you get better at over time. You get better at hiring people over time. Like, and it's normal, I think, for first time head coaches. It's normal for them to have a list of guys they would want to go coach with, you know? Like D'Amico's probably been putting his list together during his time in San Francisco through the years. I would, I'd be shocked if he hadn't been. Like if any of these coaches, college or pro, don't have a list of guys. Like, boy, when I get my head coaching job, these are my first 10 phone calls I'm making. 'Cause I want this guy. We've talked about it. And all the clinics we've been to, someday we're gonna coach together. Bobby and D'Amico probably talked about it in those rooms when they were quality control guys. Like, someday, someday, someday. Doesn't mean they're the right guys. You know, like you get better at hiring over time. And I think that's gotta be the hope of your, a Texan fan, is that the same way you hope that CJ improves at this or Nico improves at that. Will Anderson Jr. gets better at the top of his edge rush? You hope that D'Amico Ryan's gets better at identifying coaching talent and what fits what he wants to do here. - The other, the other thing that happens with coaching is that the problem is people have contract. And a lot of times you're a dream list of offensive line coaches. The top five guys on there, there's a good chance they're all under contract, you know? Hey, Jeff Stoutland, the Eagles offensive line coach. Probably not getting fired anytime soon, you know? It's just like he's not there. - The, the one thing that's curious to me about the Texans run game is that I don't, I don't believe they have a run game coordinator specifically. And, you know, I, man, I don't know what's gonna happen with Kyle Shanahan, but Chris Forrester is the offensive line coach and run game coordinator for the 49ers. Yeah, he's been around forever. And I'd like, that's a guy where hopefully he's on D'Amico's list. - Yeah. - That, all right, guys that could become available this offseason, that if you got a chance, just money with that dude. Get, you know, get him as, get him as, the guy in here who actually knows what he's doing. If you're not gonna make a change of coordinator. - Agreed. - Where'd you get those shoots? Easy. They're from DSW because DSW has the exact right shoes for whatever you're into right now. You know, like the sneakers that make office hours feel like happy hour. The boots, the turn grocery aisles into runways. 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Sean and Seth break down and discuss the issues that are facing Texans QB CJ Stroud ahead of the final regular season game of 2024.