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WHY ARE WE BULLISH: Phil Champagne, Alana Mediavilla, Big Sean Harris ep425

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Duration:: 1h 38m
Broadcast on:: 12 Jul 2024
Audio Format:: aac

[MUSIC] >> Yo, what's going on everybody? Welcome to the show another Friday, another episode of Why Are We Bullish. We've got an awesome panel today, very excited to catch up with everybody that's here, and we'll be bringing them in just momentarily for intros. But I hope you guys are all having a fantastic week. I mean, some good news, Germany's done dumping, so that's fantastic. A state has now has zero Bitcoin, which is always a positive thing in my though has Bitcoin in the hands of the state, the better and it's hilarious that they dumped it for something that they could print for free. We can all celebrate in that this Friday. Besides that, it's going to be a fantastic show, and of course, this is live, so anything can happen. I defer to my friend Bill here. [MUSIC] >> We'll do it live, do it live. I can go and write it and we'll do it live. [MUSIC] >> Thing sucks. >> If you have not already, please do like, subscribe, share, all those things. They help a ton getting this content in front of more eyeballs. I am Ben with the BTC sessions. This is your daily session. [MUSIC] >> Before we bring in our guests, let's take a quick look at where we are in the market right now. I am pulling up timechaincalendar.com and simultaneous. I'm going to get that live chat over there on the right. Everything you say in there from here on in is live for the world to see for better or worse. Back to timechaincalendar, we're sitting at $57,654 per coin. A single US dollar will snag you 1,734 sats. And in terms of fees, still single digits, nine sats, next block, any time fee, seven sats per V by, and Bitcoin mined 19.72 million of them. That is 93.92% of the total supply. We're going to give a quick shout out to our sponsors, and then we will bring in our guests. So we'll see in just a moment. Mission to enable independence by being one of the easiest and quickest ways to purchase Bitcoin in Canada and the US. And the best part about it, every buy goes directly into your own self custody. They never hold your coins. You can add a Bitcoin address as part of onboarding. There's a transparent 1% spread, no hidden fees, no withdrawal fees. Plus they have KYC free cells and bill payments on their website. They're also a publicly traded company under the ticker BTCW on the TSXV. Check them out over at bitcoinwell.com. Check out my full tutorial on how to use them. And you can check out the links in these show notes down below and sign up today. It allows you to borrow against your Bitcoin in a non-custodial way. Collateral is held in a three of four distributed multi-sig with trusted parties. It provides institutional liquidity providers, loan periods of up to five years with flexible conditions and the best rates. And best of all, no re-hypovocation of your funds. If you want to check them out today, head over to debified.com or hit the link in these show notes down below. All right, we are back in and it's time to bring in our guests for the show. So I want to welcome to the stage Sean, Phil and Alana. I'm very excited to have them all. And we're going to do a quick round of intros right now to get you guys familiar with them. Sean, many time returning guests of the show. You know, also much taller than me. I've been using that, but dude, very glad to have you. I haven't seen you in person since El Salvador. You killed it down there and it was fantastic. So give yourself an intro. Who are you? What do you do? Thanks, Ben. My name is Sean Harris, and this is my fourth or fifth time on the show. And I love it every time. It's an honor. And I'm a retired professional basketball player overseas. Currently, I work in the healthcare sphere and did the having party this year in El Salvador. So with the mean factory, so love it. It was a great time, man. I really, really enjoy a man time there. And yeah, you guys put on a great event. So I hope to see it again in four years. Yes. Oh, you will be there. Alana will have a documentary there as well. She also had a documentary on it, so fantastic. Also on the halving. Yeah, I'll say my halving story when it's my turn. Awesome. Awesome. I love it. All of it. So I'll toss it to Phil first, Phil. We got to share a panel in Pacific Bitcoin last year together. And I seem to catch up with you in various places around the world. So welcome to the show. And feel free. Give yourself an intro. Who are you? What do you do? Yes, Ben. Yes, I'm the author of the book of Satoshi. And this is about the writings of Satoshi Nakamoto, the creator. I noticed that by then it's like, wow, whatever happens to Bitcoin. And obviously, there was extremely bullish anyway. The writings, because it seems like it was pretty much gone, will be a historical value. You know, the more decades passes, the more value it is to know a little bit more about this modern Gelly Day old. Physically, yeah. I'm originally from Canada, but I live in the US since '96. So you escaped is what you're saying? Yeah, I didn't say it. Just a lot of others. Now, I've got a question about your book. Is there going to be a second edition with the new releases of emails from the-- Yes, yes, with several new chapters, basically, to cover on top of that the latest series of emails that were made public for. And I also introduced and created a new chapter, basically, to explain why there's a second-- why these emails are related. And we know it's all about Dr. Greg Rong. Fantastic. Well, I'm excited to see that second edition. I'll have to grab myself a coffee, for sure. And Alanna, thank you for being here as well, first time on the show. So can you give yourself a little intro? Well, thank you for having me. It's an honor to be here with you guys. I am Alanna Maria Oida, or Media Villa. And I am the director and executive producer for Dirty Coin, which is a documentary about Bitcoin mining. And I have spent over two years working on it. We recorded across four different continents for the film, visiting different Bitcoin mining operations, and yeah. And we also put out Stranded last year. And that has won a lot of awards at short film festivals. And that opened the door for Dirty Coin in many ways. And it was our proof of concept. And so, yeah, Dirty Coin is out now. We premiered it at the Having Party in Warsaw at the Bitcoin Film Festival. And so we premiered on for 2020, 2024, which in the European Time Zone was the having. So that's my having story. I feel like North America and South America got rogged a little bit with all of that. That's unfortunate. I was so happy I was in Europe, because if I would have been in the States, I would have missed it. So I'm very happy I was in Europe. Yeah, no, that's super awesome. And congrats on all the success with both endeavors. That's really, really exciting. And I've seen clips and everything, but I've not seen Dirty Coin in its entirety. And it needs to, I need it in my life. It needs to change. Where can people find it? So right now, we're doing special screenings across the world. And anybody that wants to screen the movie can. And they can pay in Bitcoin for their license fee to, or fiat. Or, you know, we accept many, many different ways of payment. And yeah, and people can screen it. And then we are going to have a global theatrical release on October 31st. So right now, everything that we're raising from these private screening events, through sponsorships, through ticket sales, everything that we're raising, we're basically bootstrapping our marketing for October 31st, so that we can be in as many theaters and as many languages across the world. That's an excellent date to choose, by the way. Awesome. Awesome. Well, we are going to dive into the show, but not before letting everybody know that Vake, his wife, just announced that she's leaving him for Big Sean. She said only men taller than six feet can turn her on. So congratulations, Sean. My goodness. I've got a girlfriend already, Vake, so, I think I'm not like, John, I think you're capable of many girlfriends based on the height, so, I'm sure his girlfriend disagrees. Yeah, I had a hiker. Awesome. Okay. So we are going to dive in. Everybody in the chat. Thank you, of course, for being here. If you can, please do give this a share, whether you're on YouTube, whether you're on X or on Noster or wherever you may be. Please do give this a share. It does help get more eyeballs in the room, and we love your commentary over on the side as well, so keep those comments coming. But if you're unfamiliar, this show is called Why Are We Bullish? It's a really simple premise to the show. Each one of us comes with a reason for being bullish, something we're currently excited about in and around Bitcoin. It can come in any form, whether it be a personal experience, something that we watched or listened to or read, maybe even something as simple as an app or a device that we've tried. Whatever it may be, the flow of the show is as follows. Number one, somebody's going to drop their reason for being bullish. This is their chance to rant and get off their chest, whatever they're excited about. Number two, altogether we're going to riff on that reason, so comments, questions, whatever rabbit holes we decide to go down. And then finally, number three, we're going to rotate to the next person until we've all had a turn. So, reason, riff, rotate, easy peasy, and I'm going to kick us off today with my reason for being bullish, and it's in the realm of fun things that I've been tinkering with and in and around my coldcard because I've been playing with it a bunch this week. I did do a video earlier this week on the coldcard as a password manager, which is actually super slick. So, that's not my main reason. It's actually the thing I just played with earlier today, but the coldcard, if anybody has no idea what this is, it's basically a Bitcoin signing device where you can approve transactions and keep your keys safely offline and it's super, super slick and I love it. It's kind of my daily driver, but the password manager thing, basically, you can input existing passwords that you have. You can generate random passwords with the device using the entropy within it and store them. Or you can do something called BIP85 to generate passwords, and what that does is you have your regular seed phrase, your 12 or 24 words that you would write down. And from that, it kind of becomes like a parent key and it can generate up to 10,000 keys below it. And those can take the form of totally separate wallets, which can never be used to work backwards and compromise the master, but it can also be used for passwords. And so, what you would do is you would say, "I want account number five. Show me the password that would be generated from that." And that can actually be used as a password for a website. If you were to smash or lose the device, it's actually linked to a seed phrase. So you could get a new cold card, put in your seed phrase, and then say, "Hey, what was account number five again?" And it would spit out your password for a website, which is pretty cool. And you can plug it into a computer and hit send and it will fill any field that your cursor is in so it can fill the password for you, or it can be exported as a QR code so you can take your phone and scan the single password you need and then paste it into the appropriate field, which is super slick. But actually not the main reason I'm bullish about it. I just tried a new feature that they put in relatively recently, so I'm going to bring this up one sec here. Okay, you guys are seeing that. So this is just a video that I filmed earlier today, just while I was in the office here. But I'm going to bring it up. If you can, when I play it, give me a thumbs up, let me know that you can hear it as well. Okay, I'm trying something out here. Just did it once. It was awesome, so felt like I needed to show it. So, what I got here, I've got a cold card queue. I've got a phone not linked in any specific way, and I've got a QR code for a setup transaction on the computer. And so, we're going to be doing tap to sign. And so, all I do is on the cold card, I'm going to hit ready to sign. Okay, let's me know all about sign and give me options, I'm going to hit the QR button. So, I'm going to scan. Now what is on the computer, hopefully I've got a decent distance, I think there we go, got all the parts. It now says, hey, you're consolidating, does that look good, okay, I'll hit enter. And now, it's going to say, tap to sign. And so, I don't need to open up an app or anything on my phone, I can literally just get the NFC connection, it says, hey, do you want to open this link? I'm going to say yes. And there we go, it is now broadcast. So, scan the QR code to import the transaction, sign it, and then tap any phone to broadcast it. Pretty awesome. Yeah, so, effectively, you can create a transaction either on a phone or on a computer, scan it with this in a second, and your keys are here, and then you can sign it and say, I approve this transaction, and then just any phone, even without a Bitcoin wallet on it, just tap it, and it will broadcast that information to the Bitcoin network, which is pretty cool. So, this is what I'm excited about right now, I feel like it makes the flow of doing a fully air gap transaction very quick and very seamless. Yeah, so, I don't know, it's a nerdy thing to be excited about, but I thought it was pretty cool. Yeah. Well, after Ben just sold a million cold car queues. Yeah, well, Sean, so you were at my, I did a workshop in Miami two years ago. Two years, yeah, 20, no, that was 2023. Was it 23? Holy crap, yeah. 23. It's all melting together. You brought your dad, and he knows it. Yeah. But I think he has his own cold card now. Yeah. Even he had his own cold card by then. That's, I mean, he killed it, and I've got to say that, you know, this can be, by the way, this can be done on the mark four that you have as well. The NFC is not like as quick to scan, but it's still definitely possible. But I mean, I've been really enjoying the queue. So, yeah, I don't know, I guess I'll just kind of open it up to you guys. And my general question, because I know that not everybody's using like the cold car queue, not everybody has exactly the same hardware, but just as a general question, what, you know, what kind of hardware experiences have you had? Do you enjoy specific devices? You know, what do you look for in a hardware wallet if you're, if you're trying to choose one? I don't let anybody dive in that wants to answer. I want to start. I love being in conversations like this because I live in brief Bitcoin, and yet there's still so much in so many areas that I, it's completely new for me. So I got, I remember I bought a ledger because I was like, all right, it's been forever. I don't have a hardware wallet. I really need to get a hardware wallet. I've survived just fine, so whatever, and then I got a ledger, and then that same week, there was like some scare on Twitter that happened and I was like, fuck, no, no, no, oh, sorry, I don't know if I'm supposed to cry well now. You can say, whatever the fuck you want, Alana. Okay, okay. So I was like, oh, all right, you know, I'm just not going to do that. So I have in terms of hardware, so I'm really happy to have heard you talking about cold card. And I know that I need another solution and I've been to a couple of pitches where different people are pitching different hardware solutions and I'm super excited about all of those. But I haven't really chosen one for myself and what's going to be the right thing for me and what's going to be the right thing for my family because my husband and my kids are also, you know, using Bitcoin. So I feel like I'm responsible for giving them like the best information that I can give them. Yeah. And I haven't been able to find that. So so that's my answer. Well, if you ever need a hookup, let me know. I can maybe work some magic for you. Thank you. I would love it. Thank you. Awesome. I think my favorite, my favorite hardware device is the JBL speaker. Yeah. JBL speaker, by the way, yellow is just not approved. He's very upset. But if we're talking about Bitcoin signing devices, I myself use a cold card. I used to have a ledger. And then one day, one of my good friends, talking to me about how ledger live does like, that's not your own node. And so you have to trust ledger lives node. And so, you know, I think there's a lot of different, there's a ton of different signing devices that you can use. And I like how Ben, how you call it a signing device, because to me, that's more of what it is than a hardware wallet, you know, we just turn wallet because that's what we're used to in the fiat world, but it gives you access to the Bitcoin by signing those keys. And so, you know, I do love the Bit.85 or as Ben calls it, the Uncle Jim mode. I think that's really cool as to, you know, what is happening nowadays. I mean, back in, you know, a while back, they used to say Bitcoin gifted as Bitcoin lost, you know? So, it's fun to see how you can gift Bitcoin. You can give someone their seed phrase. And if they lose that seed phrase, you still have that seed phrase backed up for them. And I think that's what's really cool is there's just so many things. It's still very niche in my mind, you know, you talk to people about this who don't interact with Bitcoin and they go, okay, why can't I just like swipe a card, you know, and we are going to get there eventually where it all finally adds up. All these tutorials that Ben is doing will just be for not one day. But until they aren't for not, you want to avoid putting your Bitcoin in a place where people can have easy access to it. And so I love just how much optionality there is nowadays versus versus back when I was like, oh, you just have to get a ledger or a treasure, you know, it's so much options now. That's 100%. And before I jump to Phil here, I want to address so, Alanna, the scare that you heard about with ledger and anybody that is not quite privy to what went on there, they, so there was a couple of things. One was their customer database got breached. And so this was like a few years back. And so anybody who had purchased a ledger, you know, there's a good chance that some, if not, all of their data got leaked and then they were just inundated with like phishing attempts and all this stuff. So that wasn't quite data on your talking email address, you know, not their private key, obviously. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Email address sometimes. And physical, physical addresses too. Physical addresses too. Oh, shipping. Yeah. Yeah. There was a guy, there was a guy in Holland, I remember that he got, they came to his door, the actor acting like they were doing some service in his apartment or something, came to his door and then just gave him a good old $5 wrench attack until he gave up his password and stole all of his Bitcoin. And that's why it's, that's why it's even smart to get that stuff delivered to your work or don't get it delivered to, you know, to your house. And so, and when you do have it delivered, use the trick pen. That's another thing that the Colton Card does is they have a trick pen where, you know, you give someone a fake seed phrase and it gives them, you know, say you have a couple of Bitcoin on there, well, it gives them .1 Bitcoin and you go, that's all I got. That's all. Yeah, it's right there. And then they feel like, oh, I guess it's all he has, you know, so. Yeah, you can set up a key one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. And the secondary thing about the ledger that I was going to quickly mention was the big one that kind of had a lot of people end up migrating to other solutions. You know, I was busy as hell for the past calendar year of people being like, I want to move from ledger to Colton Card and so I would like walk people through it. It was a product, like a feature that they were launching called ledger recover. And the idea was they would actually take the keys to your money and they would upload them to the cloud to store them for you. Now they did say we're going to split it into three pieces and give it to three different, you know, like us and then two other counterparties. But the problem with it was, number one, when asked, they said, if a government came to you and required you or asked you to give up somebody's keys, would you? And the answer that they had was, well, if they required us to, then we would have to. That's very unlikely, which isn't a great answer. Wow. Unlikely. Yeah. Very likely. Yeah, exactly. Even in Canada, that could have come very close to happening if that was a feature that existed at that time. But then, then secondarily people were like, okay, well, how can I confirm that this is not already active and working on my device? And the answer was, you can't because it's not open source. And so that was the main issue that people had. Now I wouldn't advise people to move hastily and try to quickly move money because it's not like in all likelihood, you're not going to get like rug pulled tomorrow. It's more the trajectory of these types of products and services and policies that is worrying to some. And so I think it's reasonable that people had concerns and then opted to responsibly and conscientiously gradually shift to another solution. I think that's, you know, if somebody's going to do that, that's the best solution rather than knee jerk. Oh, quick. I need to move everything and then make a mistake along the way. So yeah. Anyways, I digress, Phil, I'm going to toss it to you. Watch the next answer will be, I use a ledger. No, I actually had a boat accident on Lake Dow and it's 1,500 feet deep. So I lost all my keys and hardware, everything at the bottom. So yeah. And when you don't have anything, you don't have to worry about it, right? Yeah, we got to start dragging the bottom of that lake and see what we can do. Have you had decent, like when you when you dealt with any type of hardware, is it as it has my first, my first wallet was the Bitcoin software. With wallet dot dot, whatever that is. And yeah, it's a little bit stressful when you think about it today. And then I switched to nano ledger before my boat accident day. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. And eventually, yeah, get I do did buy a coal card. So once I buy back those bitcoins and then yeah, you buy the back at the top of the market, right? Of course. Yes, I'm waiting for it to go. Perfect. If there's one thing I've learned about hardware wallets is they're like magnets to water. It's crazy. Like if you get near a body of water, they literally just fly out of your pocket, you know, free them. It's an dangerous thing. I don't know anything. I'm that way. Yeah. I learned my lesson though. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, yeah. So I'll put a bow on this topic, but I will encourage people like if you're, if you're kind of sitting at a place where you're uncertain and you haven't made a move or you're just, you're, you're not quite sure, you know, take, take a day, look at a few different options, look at a few videos and, and then just based on your preferences, just pull the trigger on something because it don't let perfect be the enemy of good because if you do nothing, it's always going to be worse than doing something. And so, you know, the self custody on a hot wallet is better than a custodial exchange. Self custody in hardware is better than a hot wallet. And so you can, you can take those steps and, and if you get onto hardware that you're like, I don't know if this is the best thing, you can always migrate to something that you prefer after that. But don't let a little bit of uncertainty stop you entirely in your tracks. That's what I'll say to, in general, to people watching. So with that, I'll put a bow on this topic and we'll do our first rotation. Again, everybody in the chat, everybody that's watching on, on YouTube or X or Noster. Thanks for being here. Of course, give this a share wherever you can. It really does help. And with that, I'm going to toss it to Sean first and I'm going to queue you up with the same question everybody will get. Why are you bullish? So the reason why I'm bullish on Bitcoin lately is because I would say, you know, when I first got into Bitcoin and then you got into Bitcoin a little bit before, or a lot before I did actually a couple years before me. I remember it was like, you buy this thing, like quit your job, you know, it's going to the moon, blah, blah, blah. And then over time, over a cycle and over a year's ego, you see a lot of those same people who say, you know, quit your job after you buy this thing. Now it's like, no, these people are becoming more successful. We're just seeing more and more. And I know it's like cliche to say that people, but I really do believe that something that I'm seeing about the people in Bitcoin is that we're getting people from all different walks of life that are being extremely successful in their own areas. You know, whether it's filmmaking or being an author or starting up a business, right? And education, like all these things that you guys are doing here, I think it's really cool for me to see, you know, you're seeing these politicians that are even coming to it. And I'm not about the politicians, it's just something that you're seeing is becoming like a platform for them. And so, you know, Dell, the owner of Dell, it's like, and it's not to, and it's not to create heroes in Bitcoin. It's just, there's more and more successful people that are starting to understand what Bitcoin is. And they're starting to be successful regardless if they ever touched Bitcoin or not, they'd be successful anyway. And they're realizing what an advantage Bitcoin gives them, you know, it's like when the internet was around. And the people that were already going to be successful no matter what, then they realized, well, if I plug in what I'm doing into the internet, then I become even more successful. And so that's what I see is there's just people all over the world that have caught the vision of Bitcoin. It's not stopping. And it's actually the people that are setting the example for those around them. And for me, that's just so cool to watch. If it's no longer quit your job by Bitcoin and quit your job, it's like, no, I'm getting a better job. I'm making more money so I can stack harder because I know that this thing is scarce. And if it's scarce, then it's going to hit a point where you can't buy it with fiat anymore. And so that's really what's fun for me. And that's why I'm bullish about Bitcoin lately. I like that because it's it's it's a bit of counterculture, right? Like the the the nihilism that we have today that's been bestowed upon us by our fiat culture, I suppose, is, you know, a combination of why bother and quiet quitting. And, you know, there's nothing we can do. And the only way I'm going to make it is either by gambling or winning the lottery, which is the same thing, or, you know, some sort of miracle is going to happen. And then I'll just ride off into the sunset and do nothing. But there's a little bit of an inverse, I think in Bitcoin circles for people that have kind of begun to really understand Bitcoin. It's a kind of, I guess, a proof of work mentality where it's like, no, I'm not going to just, you know, get rich and then and then disappear. I want to I want to build cool stuff. I want to be productive. I want to create value for others. And that's, you know, not nearly as common with a lot of people outside of the Bitcoin circle. Of course, you get the like the the ultra productive people in society that, you know, want want to do something. And you also get the, we'll say the the parasitic class that recognize the fiat game that's being played, but rather than rally against it or realize that there is a solution, they've just kind of plugged into that and said, how can I extract value from this for myself? And yeah, Bitcoin just kind of counters all of that and says, let's know, let's actually build for the future. Let's stop with the nihilism. We realize we have a solution. Let's, you know, build for future generations rather than stealing from them. So I love that about it. And I'm curious to hear what Phil and Alana have to say about it. I agree completely with everything you're saying. And it's, you're right, the people in the space. I'm in, I've been on the energy side of it for interacting with a lot of different Bitcoiners on different sides of the spectrum of global warming is going to be the end of us all the way to there is no such thing. And everywhere in between across the planet. And, but what they know, they have different ideas, but ultimately they are all very smart. And they have their very intellectual in the way that they, they explain themselves and what it is, the value that they see in their industry. And I agree. I just see a bunch of really, really brilliant thinkers. And you go to any random meetup and they're not, they're not big on Twitter, you know, they don't have a product, but they're like the smartest, coolest people. And so it even if they're not known, I find that Bitcoiners are usually the, the people that you want to hang out with. And on the contrary to like kind of what you were saying, sometimes you go to the crypto meetups and that feels a lot more like, what can I get out of you? And the thing is that in Bitcoin, you can't really, we don't, you can't get anything out of me. Like we are, we all have the same price to the same thing. Like we just all we, we give to this thing that not honestly it takes some, it's way harder to get funded. It's way harder in so many ways if you decide to stay in Bitcoin. But the reward is so much, it's so great that it is worth the work, it's worth doing it. So there is no corporation ultimately, we all create our own success. And we're going to find the success that is what we can make. And you're seeing a lot of people that are in the space. And I am, I agree with you that I'm bullish on the people that I see in Bitcoin. I love that. Phil, I'll toss it to you before I chime in there too. So the interesting part is before Bitcoin, the only people, the only way for people to see how to basically escape the fiat system, whatever it was to invest in gold and silver. You know, that was the thing in early 2000, that was the shift. And when we think about how, for example, the UK sold their gold at the bottom, you mentioned Germany recently sold their Bitcoin at the bottom. And so the mindset was like, yeah, okay, we're going to be investing in gold and silver as a way to pile up and to be secure without having to speculate on XYZ. Because any way you have to do, you have to speculate in any kind of asset, because you can't stay in dollars, you're going to you're going to die. So now with Bitcoin and the fact it's 21 million, and there's no Bitcoin on the moon while they're still gold in the moon and the Mars and so on, that fits in their mindset. And of everyone, just the fact that it's fixed makes it that the, well, I can invest in those things, knowing it's a fixed supply. And the perception now on the long term scale and just investing as a different perspective. So I understand what Sean was saying, and it makes sense in that sense. Yeah, I love that. I wanted to hone in again on Atlanta's point about and much more difficult to get funded or have a venture backed by others. And I think this is kind of inherent, as you said, Phil, to the cap supply where there's just not going to be more of it. And so if you're going to take your Bitcoin and you're going to invest it in a venture, it's not like, it's not like right now with dollars where it's like, oh, I have to put it somewhere, because it's again a sailor term coined to the melting ice cube. And it's just this hot potato. I got to get it out of my hands and onto something that's less likely to disappear. When you have a money that that functions, that actually is a useful measuring stick for human ingenuity, your purchasing power goes up in lockstep with human productivity. And so you are basically making a bet that somebody's idea is going to outpace the cumulative good ideas of all of society. And that's a tall order. And so you've got to be pretty convicted to do stuff like that. And it's an interesting dynamic because, yeah, you're less likely to spend, but that then spurs people into working harder to make better goods and services to convince you that at this point in time, it's worth parting with some sass to partake in buying those things or in investing in those things, whatever it may be. And so it just holds everything to a higher standard. The total inverse of what we got we have right now with, you know, the cheap, trinkety crap, the horrible food that we have, the, you know, the Ikea furniture, like in standing. Yeah, cheap everything. You're directly incentivized to build it that way because it's just like it's growth at all costs and everybody's money is burning a hole in the pocket. Yeah. So it's going to be more quality investment, basically, that this could be going to be the driver. And craftsmen, crafts people as well, because then it's like, like what you're saying, and so I want to convince you to part with, you need to create something of greater value in order to exchange. So absolutely. And what I'm already seeing, and we already see a lot of artists that are very, very successful Bitcoin artists and just artists that are using Bitcoin as well that don't necessarily, you know, put the bee on everything. So there's the fact that it's a payment rail that can be, that can go across borders. Like recently, we tried to do a transaction from Germany to the United States. And it was, there were so many things that we had to do and people that needed to be alerted and everything that had to happen that, you know, and then when we did everything, here's the kicker, we were going to do it. They denied the transaction. And we were like, whatever, let's just use Bitcoin. Like the fact that we can use it. And then it's like, why did we even like, we were just trying to appease my accountant and, you know, like it was, it was, and I just said, look, we just use Bitcoin. That's we're gonna have Bitcoin on the leisure. We need to figure out how we're going to be a Bitcoin business, because it's not because we are making a Bitcoin movie. It's because when you have an international business, if you are not using Bitcoin, you are in the old times. So you can have a new company and you should be using Bitcoin as a way of moving and transacting between your different offices, between your different vendors, between all of that, it's just going to be faster and way more efficient. So I see myself as basically from this point on just kind of having a Bitcoin company. I don't know why I went on that round, but. We filmed it in four different continents, right? Yeah. And so think about that, right? You have to swap in and out of every single currency when you go to each continent, or can you just say, hey, we don't need to use anyone's rails. We don't have to pay any exchange fees. We don't have to wire money internationally, which is a hassle, you know, and even going back to the funded, like getting funded, that part to me is if you think about what Bitcoiners do, right? Getting funded in itself can some ways be fiat because it's a form of credit, right? They're giving you money for something that you really haven't done yet. And then they take away your ownership. And so then you go, do I even want to be funding, right? Like, do I want that funding because now it's not mine. Now I respond to someone who's telling me what I have to do, and there, and then I owe them something that I've created. And so I think one of the things that I look at Bitcoin is it's not just, it's the whole mindset. It's not just the ownership of the Bitcoin itself is the ownership of your work. And as you can create something that's actually meaningful, then you own that and no one can take it away from you unless you let them buy it from you. And then you go, okay, well, what will I allow someone to buy from me? What will I create that I will just let go? And so those are kind of how I go about, do you even want to get funded? What's the point of getting funded? Because aren't I creating something in this world that's supposed to be meaningful? And so it's something that even just doing the having party that I thought about a ton, right? That we thought about a ton as the mean factory. It's like, okay, we're only going to have sponsors. We're not going to have partnerships. We're going to have people who sponsor who also believe in what we believe in, which is a Bitcoin only thesis. And we don't care if someone drops out because they want crypto. It's just, you know, those are the things that you have to say no to, and you have to really be intentional about when it comes to the work that you're doing. Yeah, yeah, I had both of them. Absolutely. Again, it's it holds everybody to a higher standard. It because people recognize the long term impacts of their decisions today. And that's something sorely needed nowadays as well. Well, Sean, thank you for the topic. I appreciate it. Enjoyed that the little rabbit hole that we ended up going down there because of it. And we are going to do another rotation. 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All right, we are back in and we're about to do another rotation here. And Phil, I'm going to toss it to you next. I'm going to queue you up with the same question. Why are you bullish? So this, actually, this question can have two parts. One is long-term and the other is short-term. And so on the long-term, it's basically the concept that we all know. 21 million Bitcoin is the max. And the market effect is just the network effects, just kept growing and growing. And it's just proven anyone who actually were skeptical five, 10 years, even well-known figures are now pro-Bitcoin. They were picking on it five years, 10 years ago, and now they're all on it. So that's the one part that is really cool. The other thing is the one thing, just the little one. Imagine that for many people here, they were dropping to a time machine and gone back to, say, 2015 or 2018. When it was $3,000, Bitcoin, say. They would be telling themselves, mortgage your dog, we need as many Bitcoin as possible. So the perspective is like, at that time, well, Bitcoin is at $3,000. It's the market price. That's the value. Right now it's $58,000. Everybody sees, well, it's $58,000. I'm not going to be mine by more or less or whatever it is. And that changes when you're looking at it and with the certainty and the more people are with time, the more people are getting more bullish and that changes as well. That's the long-term. The short-term, well, the one thing that I like is the, well, obviously, Trump saying that he's going to be part of the BTC, the Bitcoin convention in Tennessee or Nashville. That's pretty remarkable. Now, suddenly, the Democrats have to change their tunes maybe or not as much or whatever. It changes in terms of politics. It's really cool for that. So that's one thing where I really find this very cool. The other thing is, on the short-term, the pretty much every time the stock market has gone up when Bitcoin has gone up. It's being tied up together. And when I say the stock market, I'm not talking just the Dow Jones and S&P 500, but also the Russell 2000. And the last move here, I was not that much. The Russell 2000 has not gone into a new all-time eye. So pretty much all that money has been gone into the top 10 of the S&P 500. And it's very concentrated. It doesn't look sane at all. But Russell 2000 just went up in the last two days. And so if it actually keeps going up like this, I mean, we're talking in short-term for those who are interested in the short-term. It looks like we might have a big boost up. And thinking about if I have my 10-foil app, then it's like, is there, does the powers that shouldn't be or actually want to go a big push up in a stock market before the election or after the election, so that if Trump gets into power, he's got a big mother of all bubble to deal with. And then he's going to be the urban do-for kind of thing for having a crash, not kind of thing. Is this another angle? So again, it's a short-term thing. But in the end, the long-term, we know the story. So it's going to go up. Yeah. How crazy is it that Bitcoin is being discussed as an election issue, not by a third-party candidate. But I think just regardless of what side of the political spectrum you're on, or if you're just not on the political spectrum anymore, as many people have kind of just said a step back. But the fact that this is an issue, it kind of shows the shift in influence that Bitcoiners now have where the prior and possibly soon to be again president is catering to this group of people that I initially joined a subreddit of that was represented by a poorly made MSN paint wizard. And now it's influencing elections. And it's hilarious to me. But also, at this point in time, even if you had told me a year ago, two years ago, that this would actually be, have some sway in a presidential election, I would have thought you were crazy. I would have thought that it might, it would happen eventually. But it would take probably a few more cycles for that to truly play out, like maybe more years or something. But here we are. And so what does that look like in four years or eight years? And are there politicians in different sides of the globe like that are going to look out the outcome of this election and say like, oh, maybe that kind of helped tip things a little bit. Maybe those types of people that have been able to build a considerable amount of wealth to the point where they can support or help out a campaign. Maybe I should think about policies that would appeal to those types of people. Like, how does that change the global landscape from a political viewpoint? It's super interesting. I don't even know what to expect next. And I'm curious if Sean or Alana want to dive in there. I want to see what the Democrats, how the Democrats, what's their next step? Because I feel like that's also going to be very historic. Are the Democrats also going to come out and say, yes, Bitcoin, or are they going to come out and say crypto? And they're going to say, we got it, we got to regulate it. We got it. It's good. The payment rails make sense. But we need to have something that we can turn off and we need to, okay, we see the crap out of everything. And we like, we, I don't know, I feel like I'm looking forward to seeing how they're going to come across or like what it is that they're going to say. I know that from the mining perspective, I know the Democrats are not going to clamp down on mining because of how positive it is for renewable energy. There's a lot of stranded electricity that these new renewable projects have they're not connected to the grid. So they're able to sell that electricity to somebody. So there's a lot of financial, there's a lot of other kind of people that are seeing a benefit from Bitcoin mining. So I don't think they're necessarily going to clamp down on mining, but I think they're going to want to regulate Bitcoin a lot. And they're going to be more pro crypto. And ultimately, at the end of the day, I don't see how Trump could not kind of go sideways and go left and do the same thing. Didn't he launch? Like, didn't he have an NFT collection? Like, hasn't he's already been in crypto? Let me tell you, he has the best NFTs. Nobody makes NFTs quite like him, okay? Yeah, it's it's crazy. I agree with you. I think it's going to be because obviously, like politicians want to appeal to the widest group of people. And right now, there's the, as we were talking about earlier, the general mindset of society as a whole is, I'm not going to make it unless I gamble. And what's one of the hottest ways to gamble right now? It's crypto, right? Because crypto is gambling. That's, that's effectively what it is. So, yeah, you're going to have basically appealing to all of the gamblers out there. Like, throw me your vote and I'll let you gamble without impedance kind of thing. I think you're, I think we're in for, I initially thought we were in for like nothing but crackdowns and developers being thrown into jail, but things have kind of shifted very, very suddenly. And now I think we're in for at least the next four years of an absolute shit coin extravaganza like we've never seen, which, which as horrible as I think that will be, I think it's also the path to people getting the best educated because nothing teaches better than touching a hot stove. And I think people need to do that. Like, that's how we learned over the past number of years. And so I, yeah, I, I think it's coming. And I don't, I don't know, Sean, where, what do you think? I, I think it's a lot of pandering more than anything. You know, I don't know how much Donald Trump understands about Bitcoin or not. He does keep saying he's against CBDC. So he has someone who's on, who's in his ear, who's telling him the right things at least, which is great. And he wants to make Bitcoin American. I'm all for it. Yeah. You know, Kelly wants to make Bitcoin, Salvador, and everything. That's what's going to happen is, and that's something that actually Max Kaiser talks about a lot is the hash, you know, global hash war, and where people are going to be fighting over over the hash rate more than anything else and looking for stranded ways, stranded energy and different ways to use energy. But I think right now it's probably a little bit of pandering RFK spoke last year at the same conference in Miami. Maybe Trump decides to make him his running partner. Who knows? That would be kind of insane. But it would be, it would be fun to watch. I think that at 2028, more people will understand it, and it may be more of a real topic. Maybe it's something that you'll hear in the actual debate. I mean, you're, you're hearing people like Cynthia Lumis saying, you know, it would be a good idea. You know, she's this US Senator saying it would be a good idea to put Bitcoin in the US reserves. To bolster up the US dollar, you know, and Michael Saylor says the same thing. I don't think he actually believes it. I don't think he believes that you can back the dollar with Bitcoin, but he's, he's smart enough to know to not attack the dollar because he's got a publicly traded company. And going back to Phil's point, too, with, you know, speaking of publicly traded companies, if you think about Saylor, why he even got into Bitcoin in the first place, one of them was just because he was getting ignored, right? And I think that was your point, Phil, with the Russell 2000 is basically there's 10 businesses, and every, every other publicly traded company gets ignored, and they get, they just get crapped on all day long. No one wants to invest in them. They only want these, these 10 blue chip stocks. And everyone else is growing against inflation, and there's nothing that they can do. And so if you look, if you think about Bitcoin from a corporate finance standpoint, it's, it's, it's like igniting a bomb to your stock because it's volatile. And traders love volatility. People love volatility. And so you add this thing that's Bitcoin. It's new. A lot of people don't know about it still, but they know that it's volatile. And the trading volumes go up like crazy. Your stock price goes up as Bitcoin goes up. And so, you know, I definitely can foresee, you know, we've been saying this since 2020, since when was that August of 2020, when, when MicroStrategy bought Bitcoin, it's four years later, and there's very few publicly traded companies that have followed suit. But I think you're going to start seeing more when they realize that, that, you know, all of these analysts who come to them and tell them that there's nothing to buy, there's stocks not a buy that it's just boring, then they go, well, maybe I might make myself interesting by doing what Sailor did. And all of a sudden, they watch the Sailor effect or the Bukele effect or whatever effect you want to call it, the Bitcoin effect, as they start to, start to plug in to what Bitcoin can do for them. And so it's, it's a corporate finance strategy. It's a political strategy. It's an individual strategy. I mean, you win when you start to use Bitcoin. Yeah, it's, it's the vindication, right? It's the fact that these guys haven't just lived through a bull market. It's very easy to point at them and say, like, well, they just, their timing was good, but it's all a Ponzi and it's going to fall apart. But when you have the, the, the drop that we had at the end of 2022 with the collapse of Mt. Gox, when you have that, and you still have, you know, MicroStrategy and El Salvador stick into their guns and following through with the plan in the midst of what everybody thought was going to be an absolute collapse if you're watching the means for media. And, and for them to continue adding to their reserves in the face of that, then anybody that comes out on the other side of that and they see, like, oh, holy crap, like every, every thought the world was exploding. And these guys were just stacking more Bitcoin. It's the conviction that, that is jarring because it's like, they knew something that most of the world didn't know in the worst of the worst of the bear market. Yeah, you almost want, once you, once you, and all you have to do is take a look at the past and you go, it's all based on the having cycle. And as you see that, then you almost want like an FTX collapse to happen in the bear market, right? You want those things to happen because everyone else thinks that it's a Bitcoin hack. You know, that's how they word it on the news. Your hope is telling you that Bitcoin got hacked and who's SPF and all this stuff. And you're like, it, no, it didn't get hacked. It's perfectly fine. Take the next block. But everyone else is scared of Bitcoin's at $15,000. And then you get to buy it up cheap. And you're stacking hard because you, like what you said, you know something that other people don't, which is not that hard to learn. If you just take a look at the having cycles and you understand a little bit about the scarcity function of Bitcoin. Yeah, remember a tweet, I mean, where I'd say the US dollar was hacked because the bank, the specific bank was robbed or something. Exactly. I mean, it's, again, analogous to the Bitcoin's only for criminals when the majority of criminals are using the dollar in the US banking system, right? They could just exactly that. Yeah, it's, I think people are figuring it out though, like, the gradually over time, people are understanding that something is wrong with the existing system. And more specifically that something is also wrong with the money. I've never, up until a few years ago, I've never heard anybody use the term fiat currency. Inflation was just kind of not really referenced very much. And now it's like the top of mind for most people. And on top of that, it's top of mind for most people because everything is so damn expensive. But we have the people that are running the government gaslighting us to our faces saying it's never been better. Your Thanksgiving dinner has never been cheaper. Or, you know, like inflation is coming down and people are like, but it's not. I don't see it. Yeah, exactly. My, I don't care. And my life is not getting cheaper. And they're realizing that inflation, maybe not directly realizing, but inflation is cumulative. So like, by saying that inflation is down, you're saying shit is still expensive. It's still getting more expensive, but it's getting that way less fast. Yeah, inflation is a speed, right? So it's going, if it's going down, you're still moving forward. Yeah. It has to go negative for prices to go down. Exactly. And yeah, I think people are waking up to that. Again, that video that came out last week of the dude who he had bought a cart, an online cart full of Walmart goods, like 46 items or something in 2022, I think. And then on the website, there was a rebuy all button. And he was like, I wonder what it costs today. And he hit the button originally. It was like 100 and 120, 130 bucks. And he brought it back up. And it was 400 and something dollars for the exact same items. Unbelievable. Yeah. So they're probably going to deactivate that feature pretty quickly. Oh, yeah. But people are recognizing it. It's good. Yeah. So Phil, I enjoyed that topic. Anything that you want to cap it off with before I put a ball on it? No, pretty much. Yeah. Awesome. I think it's good. All right. Perfect. Perfect. Well, we're going to do a rotation here. And Alana, I'm passing it to you for a final reason for being bullish. So same question. Why are you bullish? You know, I think I've answered this in the past with more like kind of a spiritual and freedom minded answers because I have seen that. And when I go around the world and I can see that people can interact in Bitcoin and they're still learning and starting, but as soon as you know, they can start right away and it's that's really incredible. But today I decided that I want to mention just because of the amount of meetings that I've had this week regarding the subject, I'm actually going to say that I am bullish on Bitcoin and Bitcoin mining because there are so many industries, like the industries that I hadn't even considered like warehousing the shipment of the miners that are being sent in the thousands from, you know, one place to another. And there is a lot of there's a secondary market for machines is huge. And so there are so many industries and the parts that you need and the fans and the air conditioners or the fans to remove the heat. There's so many immersion coolers. So a company that I spoke with last year, I believe it was Midas, they did not originally make their immersion cooling machines for miners. They did it for data centers and for regular data center use. But Bitcoin miners were the ones that they were able to start, you know, selling more units to them. There was just more of a demand from them to pull the heat. And so they've, I won't speak for them as a company, but I know of other companies that have basically now decided to just pivot and just kind of focus on the Bitcoin mining industry. And so I'm bullish on mining and proof of work because energy, big energy is in. I hope that, you know, Trump follows through a comms, but like Shell last year sponsored the Bitcoin conference and then they pulled out and I wonder what happened there. And they were going to be one of their biggest sponsors. And I'm sure they received a bunch of backlash. But what that means is big energy is in Bitcoin. Big politics are in Bitcoin. We're housing is in Bitcoin. There's so many different industries that are profiting from Bitcoin already, even if they don't know anything about Bitcoin or they don't own any Bitcoin specifically, that I think that there is, or I see this bull market towards mining and not just mining, but other similar industries that kind of serve that mining and that data center and that that that world of basically the hardware footprint increasing as our digital lives increase as well. So it's, you know, I, and so I am seeing so, so much of a, of a desire and different people contacting me that are kind of more on the hardware and on the physical and on the energy selling end on the, all these different ends that I feel like that makes me really bullish because these are really influential industries. These are really big industries. These are industries with a lot of capital. And they stand to make a lot more money as well. So, so I guess that part for me, it's like, it's not, I'm not saying everybody's like a saint, right? Or anything, I'm just saying that a lot of people are coming in and they're coming in from all these different industries. And I think it's going to get so wild. And I honestly didn't think when I was making my film that two years ago that I would, I would be at this place today with the movie because I know I already see certain people that want to use the movie to kind of like basically forward their, what they want to say. And so I never meant for it to be used in that way, but of course, I guess it will be, I guess I'm a little bearish on that, but I'm bullish on the industry. And I can see that it's not going away and I can see all the different people that are getting involved. And that to me just makes me bullish on Bitcoin and energy money, you know, and the fact that it will continue to be energy money. And nobody, I don't think anybody wants to, anybody influential has, they've tried, they couldn't beat Bitcoin. So they're just trying to see how they can join it. And so I'm seeing a lot of, a lot of that, just a lot of different industries. Do you think that over time, because it sounds, I mean, you're basically outlining how intertwined Bitcoin is becoming with so many different industries to a point where, you know, it's, it's going to gradually become a major portion of, of a lot of these things. It's just, it, they're going to be inseparable. And so do you see that taking place to a point where the attacks begin to diminish because everybody recognizes how integral it is to what they're doing? Yes, because I think that it's better to just play the game. It's better to, to understand what, what, what are the mechanics at play? And they've definitely tried to attack it. And, you know, Germany dumping all their coins, they can, the way that I see it is there's definitely still kings and queens involved. There's people that have a lot of influence on the network. And, and we see it all the time, like these big, big whales. The thing is that now you have new whales, where before you really only had like a, you know, couple of kings and queens and the pope, you know, a couple of dynasties basically ruled the world. I kind of feel what I am seeing is, now you have dynasties in Paraguay, you have dynasties in Malawi in El Salvador, you now have like, all these new, you know, monarchs that are getting in. And a lot of actual monarchs that are getting in and are mining or are buying. And, and so I do, you know, and then there's the plebs, we can always just use the Bitcoin. So it's a really beautiful thing. But I do think that instead of beating it, it's better to join it and to learn how to play the game. And that's a better way to win than to destroy it. And in order to destroy it, you have to expend so much capital and so much energy to destroy it, that it's like, why not then control it at that, at that point and not lose, I don't know, I guess there are people that can verbalize that better than me, but I do believe that it's just kind of not worth it to attack it anymore. And big attacks are going to diminish. And I'm not talking about like Twitter haters talking about like nation states and bigger players. Yeah, 100%. It's, I mean, the incentives are there, right? The incentives are such that those that are already involved, understand why they want to remain involved. Those that are, like I saw, was it Paraguay that just recently, like they they imposed a they they upped the cost for energy on on miners, just like the other day, which effectively like makes it untenable to mine and mine there. And but a lot of that hash power is just going to relocate to like Argentina or wherever they can get machines, right? Just across just across the border. Yeah. And so like the people that don't get why they need no need to just play the game are are going to eff around and find out pretty quick. And then the ones that are, you know, are open to it and realize what's going on, they're going to benefit quite a bit. So yeah, I don't know why I did benefit quite a bit as well. And I think that it's a matter of like a lot of people were coming in. And you also start seeing some protectionist laws towards the miners are already in the space and not wanting to compete with more outsiders coming in. And so I think that you're going to see some countries kind of open their doors. And a lot of people are going to come in. And then once they get established and those hierarchies get established, then they might want to close the door for from other people. And I feel like I was able to see that in other countries as well. And Paraguay kind of seems to follow suit. It's like once they benefit and they have like a good amount. And this is all my speculation, of course, I don't, it's just based on what I've seen and studied. But yeah, I think at some point, the current people don't want to compete. They want to make sure that they can increase their hash power in that country. They already they're already set up there. And they don't necessarily want new competitors because by the time I went to Paraguay, it was already hard to get electricity. Like it was it was tough because there were a lot of miners, a lot of people from all over the world coming to get a lot of and they would just park the energy, they would just get the energy contract, pay for the energy contract, even before they got the machines there. So and then some bailed. And that was also a problem as well. So all kinds of things have happened. And so I think Paraguay has become a more much has is a little bit further on the timeline of new country that has a lot of excess energy that doesn't know what that doesn't really have currently have a client, opens doors, a bunch of people come in, and then it just kind of regulates itself. And in some countries, it's continue to open the doors. And in some countries it's going to be like, we can we can handle it from here. This is what I think. Yeah, it makes it makes it makes you feel like the like the age old question is Bitcoin a living organism, right? You think about Bitcoin on a global status for mining and or on the global stage, right? Because it will it'll just keep moving like an organism to wherever the cheap energy goes. And and people will go people will go to to that point or to those countries. And it's it's like the sovereign individual thesis playing out that people just decide that they want to move to whichever countries treat them the best and businesses wanted to want to move to whichever countries give them the best advantages because it's hard. There's inflation everywhere. And everyone's trying to get the hardest soundest money ever created. And so now people will move like an organism. Bitcoin almost decides where they go. And and it's fun to just watch. Oh, wow, there's a ton of miners in this place because because this is really getting the cheap energy, you know, China shuts it down in 2020 or 2021. They all bounce. They move out. They go to different countries and in the hash rates back at the highest it's ever been. And so I agree. I think mining is you know, Bitcoin mining is is the topic that's hard to understand at first. But as you go down the rabbit holes, you start to learn a lot about energy as well as Bitcoin. And you know, it is what protects the network. And when people try, like if you wanted to do a 51% attack at this point, like what you said, Alana, it's it's so capital intensive. And you have to get so much hardware to even try that at that point, your billions of dollars deep, you might as well just mind the Bitcoin and make the money instead of instead of trying to demolish this network that was going to hurt you. Yeah. And even if you tried, we would just fork it and go somewhere else, you know, and so it's it's fun to to watch out. People can make up these scenarios in their minds. The internet's going to what happens in the government shuts off the internet. What happens when me, yours hit the planet or, you know, it's like, okay, well, you're not thinking about a future that is like a place where people will live, you know, where people advance. You're thinking about going backwards into the past. And, you know, I just perceived us moving forward into a good future. You know, you say going back into the past, deindustrialization is a very real concept. And it's something that has occurred across the earth for thousands of years. I mean, you look at it, that is, you know, quote unquote primitive 400 years ago, and you see the the the pyramids that were built in that area, for example, you see that a lot of examples of deindustrialization. And I think it's erroneous to think that as we move forward, we get better and we get smarter and we have better technology. We can for sure move backwards. And I think that we're moving backwards right now when it comes to privacy topics, when it comes to so many things that we're moving backwards. And I do believe that it's important for for builders and for people that kind of see that this is a trajectory that we could go down. We can deindustrialize. We could, for example, you have a country, and this is my issue here in Puerto Rico, where they want to do all of the energy be solar. That would be a big problem. That would mean that suddenly from having 24 seven ish, because we get a lot of brown ounce, but 24 seven ish access to electricity, we would now have an unreliable grid that would mean that a few hours of the day we have no electricity. So we would actually be going backwards as a as a society here on this island, if we were to not have any kind of peak or plan or any kind of way to to like no carbon, no carbon in the grid. So and then whatever and then carbon credits, but that's a different a different rabbit hole, but I think it's important to to understand not take for granted that moving forward in time means progress, because moving forward in time can definitely mean the other direction. And I believe that it's important to be alert to understand what's coming down and build towards prosperity and a beautiful future of abundance, build on sound money. And I think that's why we're here. But not doing anything means we go towards deindustrialization and we go towards a darker future. I think that not doing anything is doing a favor to the people that are actively trying to cap human potential. And so if we want to blast through that, we do have the internet, we have Bitcoin, we have a lot of tools that we didn't have before. And I think that how we move forward is really important. It's really smart. And again, not take for granted that we are going to move forward positively because it could go the other way. This chat makes me think of a guy named Paul Erlich. He wrote a book called the population bomb. And basically it was just like so horribly wrong about literally everything for his entire career and somehow still had a successful career. It was fear mongering about how people are using energy and how there were too many people and reusing too much energy. And by the 1980s, you would have hundreds of millions of people starving across the planet. Was it 1903 or something? 1968 was wonderful. Okay, because I know that early 1900s another guy came up with this overpopulation. It's great, caring, caring, crazy, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And again, these people see it as an imperative to prevent population growth, to prevent people from having families. And he actually, I didn't realize this, but I was reading a book today. And he came up and after having one child, he ended up sterilizing himself. Because he was basically like, oh, we're all going to die. And then 2000 came and went. Population is like a billion now. And when you actually look at quality of life for people in general, we've never had less people in poverty in the past 20 years or so than for the rest of in terms of meeting your basic needs, the percentage of people on the planet continues to go down and down in regards to being able to survive. And thanks to energy and crude oil, and CO2 degenerate. Yeah. The places with the least energy other places with the most poverty, right? Yeah. And less GDP. So less GDP, so it affects everyone and lower life expectancy as well. Yeah. Yeah. But everybody, let's cut our, let's make sure that we don't use any more energy, because God forbid the people that are the most disenfranchised on this planet, at least make it up to our standard of living, right? Like who are the ones that you expect to, to cut? Yeah. So I digress. But does anybody want to chime in any other thoughts on this topic before or before? Yeah. Well, I can say that the energy angle is quite interesting. Yeah. Definitely. There are so many parts to it that is fascinating. Obviously, when you think about Bitcoin, could still be fine with half of the miners going bankrupt today, tomorrow, you know, will be or even 90%. You know, it's just a matter of the Bitcoin network will still be operating as long as there's at least, you know, a few miners, which will always be more than that. But the point is the recognition of the value of the Bitcoin mining by the society in general makes it more acceptable for other people that are looking on the sideline looking at Bitcoin. And well, okay, it's not that bad, finally, about this Bitcoin mining stuff. So they can actually be more looking into actually getting into Bitcoin, knowing, okay, I'm not contributing to the end of the world of the planet with Bitcoin mining. Yeah, that's kind of thing. So it's another angle in the psychology of raw. Yeah. Yeah, I totally agree. All right. Well, I'm going to put a little bull on this topic. I'm conscious of time here and we're going to be beginning to round out. But before we do, so I like to finish the show in a certain ways time. And that is going around one last time with any final thoughts that you guys may have on any of the topics that we had today, or just a summary of your final thoughts. And also, I'd like to challenge you guys to give a recommendation. Anything that you think people watching may find useful in their journey, whether it be Bitcoin or tangential to Bitcoin, but that could take any form. It could be as simple as a piece of life advice, or it could be something a bit more tangible, like a book or a movie to watch or a website to visit or a device to try, whatever it may be totally up to you. And I'll give you guys a minute to do with that. Because what I'm going to do first, oh, and I'll also say thank you to the, wow, like 20, 2400-ish people that tuned in so far over the course of the episode. Much appreciated. Thank you guys. And feel free to give this a share one last time before we round out. But we're going to do a little giveaway. And I've been doing this on the Thursday show with Nico, but I'm going to start integrating it here. Our panelists are unaware of this too, so they can't cheat. But this is Bitcoin well. And so they're in Canada and the US, and you can buy and sell Bitcoin there and pay bills and do all kinds of cool stuff. But we're going to be using the Bitcoin well, wishing well. And we're going to throw a coin in the well. And what's going to happen is you're going to see an LN URL for anywhere between 500 and up to potentially a million sets. And your job is to try and claim that before anybody else does. So you earn points by signing up, by buying and selling Bitcoin, and by referring friends. And then you can stack those points to throw coins in the well. So I'm going to go ahead. I'm going to throw a coin in the well right now by redeeming 500 points. And I'm going to enlarge this. And that QR code on the screen is for 500 sets. So the first person with a lightning wallet to be able to scan that and pull off those sets, congrats to you. So I'm going to leave it up there for 10 seconds or so or so. And anybody who snags them, congrats to you. If you do snag them, let me know. Hopefully you get it before the guests do. We'll see how quick they are. Phil is all over it. He's like trying to get it. No, the focus is not coming. We're looking at it from a smaller screen than you guys. Guests got rugged, but everybody else is watching the live stream. You can make it bigger. So if somebody got them, please do let me know. But congrats to anybody who did super awesome for you. But anyways, I'll wrap it up there. Actually, you know what? Screw it. I'm doing it again one more time. If you still got those lightning wallets, then best of luck. Here we go. One more time. Why not? There's another 500 stats. Anybody who wants to snag them, I'll leave it up there for five seconds or so. Somebody else got the other one. Well, maybe I'll hear about it on an extra nostril or something. All right. Well, there we go. Oh, Nat, I hope you still had that lightning wallet. I got them. I got the second one. There we go. All the 2400 viewers got rugged by a lamb. I had to check. I had to check. I didn't get the first one. That's okay. That's awesome. Simmer, get it. Rewind. That's awesome. All right. Well, sweet. So let's go do our final thoughts and recommendations then. My general final thought here is things are shifting faster than they have been as is expected. It's gradually then suddenly kind of thing with Bitcoin. And yeah, we're seeing all of these things with the presidential stuff, with the integration of Bitcoin into major industries, with the recognition of power companies jumping into this, major energy companies rather, with the, again, like the politician angle, even the just general other industries, the institutional money that's coming in, there's a lot of different aspects of people kind of getting it. And not to mention, we didn't dive down the rabbit hole, but from a human rights perspective too, I've been dealing with the HRF for quite some time now. And it's happening there too. So different pockets of people around the globe are beginning to realize how important this is and interact with it in a big way. And that's super exciting. So in terms of recommendations, my general recommendation is, we all love listening to podcasts and conversations about how great Bitcoin is, but don't let yourself stop leveling up in the sense of the technical as well. Continue to learn in that respect too. I'm loving playing around with the queue this week, but whatever it may be for you, if you haven't really used many lightning wallets, if you haven't really tried various hardware solutions, if you haven't ever played with, I don't know, liquid or e-cash or some of the cool little fringe things, the sediments and things like that that are happening, tinker, right? You can send around like 100 sats here and there and just try these things. And I think you'll have a good time and you'll be learning. So yeah, my recommendation is keep learning. Sean, I'm going to toss it to you. Final thoughts, recommendations. What do you got? Final thoughts, just keep buying Bitcoin. It's a simple thing. Buy it this whole decade and watch what happens. My recommendations, I read a book about a month or so ago. It's actually by 50 cent, all the hustle, hustle smarter, hustle harder. And I know it sounds like something that he would write, but actually it was a really good read. And so that's my recommendation. It's helped me out a lot, especially in my new life after basketball, about just how to handle my business, how to get rid of, you know, just if there's negativity, don't let that get in the way. Don't let your emotions get in the way, like focus on a specific path and make sure that you're doing whatever you can to get there. Obviously, you want to be good to the people on your in your way, but it's just to me was really good read about how to not let your emotions get in the way and stay focused on what your goals are and then just go out and crush it and not make excuses for why you don't do it and just win, you know. So that's a recommendation that I have. Not sure if anyone will ever read that book who's listening to this podcast, but 50 cent, hustle smarter, hustle harder was a good read for me. I love that. And I wonder when it is, it's inevitable to rebrand to 50 sat, right, like that's coming and actually side note, he years ago, except he was the first person to accept Bitcoin for one of his albums. Yeah. Yeah. I was like 2014. Yeah. Can you imagine? Oh my god. Yeah. Anyways, Phil, I'm going to toss it down to you. Final thoughts, recommendations. Go ahead. Yeah. Final thoughts. Yeah. We'll say the same thing. Don't be bothered by the price of Bitcoin and just keep focusing on it eventually. In 10 years, it'll be a factor of 10 more, 21 hundred, you know, you don't know, but more way more than now. Final in terms of recommendation, I guess I have a few, but I see that many people have not in the Bitcoin sphere, have not read that book. And it's so much a good book. I, the creature from Jekyll and from G Edward Griffin. And if what is describing this book didn't happen, we wouldn't be talking about Bitcoin. We'll still be in a gold standard and that kind of thing. You know, if the Federal Reserve and the fiat system was not, didn't came up, it'll be so much simpler. In the same line as this, there's the World War I conspiracy theory from Cobert Report. God, guys, a Canadian living in Japan, at cobertreport.com, something like this. And it's really excellent. You know, the one thing that, you know, everybody thinks World War II, yeah, it makes sense. World War II, Nazi, they were horrible. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But World War I, exactly why we got into this war in the first place and that is, no, that's not, that's, oh, maybe it is. I'll just give you the link after. Yeah, the World War I basically, yeah, it's the one of the horrible thing. The last thing will be the set of books from one of them is speculator, the third in the series speculator. The second is drug lords and the third one is assassin. And it's from, now what is, what is, oh gosh, yeah, the, is a in investor, a narco-capitalist. And these sets of books are really good because they're pretty much, it's fiction, but it's about a guy who basically in the first book is going to, I mean, he learns basically investment, but he learns how to play with the, all the make the stuff that we see in the world. Doug Casey. Doug Casey and John Hunt. Yes, correct. Yeah. Yeah, there are three, three good books. Yeah. So that's it. I love that. I'm going to have to, I do enjoy some, some fiction from time to time. I'm going to have to check those out. Yeah. That's awesome. There's a, the spin into that it is also gives insight into investment, you know, the mindset of an investor and how he goes through that. So it's really cool for that. That's, that's awesome. I'm going to, I'm going to have to check those out. Awesome. Well, I'll toss it to Alana finally for your final thoughts and recommendations. Go ahead. Final thoughts. If you are going to Bitcoin Nashville, I am going to have a screening of Dirty Coin on July 24th, 2024. So obviously this year and in a couple of weeks. And tickets are on Eventbrite, but if you can't afford a ticket and you can also buy with Bitcoin, of course, then we're going to be announcing something this week. If you can't afford a ticket, I, and you want to watch the movie, please let me know. And I will make sure that you can get in. We have a large menu and I would love to just fill it with good energy, watching the movie. We're going to have a panel afterwards and it's going to be, we're going to have Eric Hirschman, the CEO of Gridless. We're going to have Troy Cross. We're going to have Chester Nae and Dennis Porter is going to MC and I'll be there as well. So I'm very, really excited for, for Nashville. And we are, and I'm going to plug the fact that we're going to go to movie, to the movie theaters with Dirty Coin on October 31st. So also DM me so that I can, if you really want to see it and take your meetup to go see it, because we'll contact your local theater and we'll tell them, hey, there's a little group of people, or a big group of people that would go and watch this movie. If you play it, will you play it? And so far, every single theater has said yes. So we have a really good track record there. And some, at some point, somebody's going to say no, but so far, everybody has said, yeah. So all you have to do is just let me know where you are. And roughly many, how many, you know, people are in your meetup or whatever. It's super casual. It just contacts me. And in terms of recommendation, I know that they mentioned by Bitcoin, and I will say earn Bitcoin. I really like earn it. Earning it is so fun because you obviously buy it, whatever. It's just that, I guess, I was a commercial filmmaker for so long that just saying buy Bitcoin just never really felt good coming out of my mouth. But earn Bitcoin comes out and so naturally out of my mouth. It's come up with a way that you can add value. And there are Bitcoin or JODS.com, I think it is. And there are a lot of different telegram groups where if you have a skill, just say that you're willing to work for Bitcoin. That could be your side hustle. You could side hustle, like, if you don't have fiat to turn into Bitcoin, that doesn't mean you can't stack that. So that would be my recommendation is that you can make a living making like you can make your money. You can make your Bitcoin. You can earn it. And you're going to work with really incredible people because these are people that are willing to also work in this economy. So I would say just to sound a little different, not to in any way to dish, son or fill, but to in the same vein of what they were saying of just basically stack stats, you can also earn them. And that would be my recommendation. So it's actually a very good point. Yeah. You can stack stats by creating value for others, right? It's a different road. Love it. Awesome. Well, guys, I want to say a huge thank you to all of you for joining me and getting bullish on a Friday evening. It was a lot of fun to the now almost 2600 people that tuned in over the course of the episode. Thank you guys so much for being here. Don't forget to, of course, smash that like button, give this a share and everything. And thank you for being part of the conversation in the side chat. I always love to see people's comments and questions and everything in there as well. And for the panelists, make sure that everybody check out the show notes because you can follow them. I've got links there for their social profile and then you can find everything that they're doing from there. And I guess that's it. So the last thing I'll say to the panel is thanks again. And you're all welcome back any time. Thank you. Thank you. This was super fun. Thank you guys. What's your pleasure, man? All right. See you guys later. And everybody in the chat, everybody's still watching. Thank you guys for being here as well. I hope you had a good time. If you did, make sure you hit that like button. Make sure you give this a share and make sure you're subscribed if you're not already. Of course, if you want to help the show in another way, you can hit up the previously mentioned sponsors. They're just down in the show notes down below. And I'll throw in one other thing here that I've begun mentioning at the end of the show. And that is if you're sorting through the tutorials on the channel and you're having a little bit of difficulty, maybe you need some additional hand holding. Well, I encourage you to reach out to the team that I have built over at bitcoinmentor.io. I've assembled a team of amazing Bitcoin educators. There were 350 people that applied to be part of the team. We whittled it down to like 16. And they're all amazing. And I'm super happy to be working with them. And so yeah, you can reach out there and people from the team, they can help you with things like key management, hardware, multi-sig, running a node, layer two solutions. Really, whatever you're looking to cover, they can help you out. And you can reach out. You can do a free discovery session, which is 15 minutes, basically just trying to figure out exactly what you're looking for and what exactly what you want to learn. And then you can go forth from there and level up and save yourself hours and hours of research on the internet if it's not quite scratching that itch for you. So anyways, reach out to them bitcoinmentor.io. And with that, I am out have yourselves a wonderful day or evening, wherever you may be. And I'll see you guys next time for your daily session. [Music] [BLANK_AUDIO]