Rebel FM
Rebel FM Episode 37 - 10/22/09
This weeks show starts with what we've been playing, including Borderlands, Dante's Inferno PSP, Saw, Forza 3, Uncharted 2 (Tyler's playthrough), Plants vs. Zombies, and World of Goo. After an extensive games talk we move onto your topics from Twitter, covering a host of various topics pertinent to our audience. Last, but certainly not least, we close out with your letters, doing our best to avoid any and all relationship questions. Enjoy!
(upbeat music) (upbeat music) ♪ Nothing good on the radio ♪ ♪ Once again I didn't know ♪ ♪ It's your hard time to ♪ ♪ The rebel of hell ♪ ♪ The rebel of hell ♪ ♪ The rebel of hell ♪ ♪ The rebel of hell ♪ - Welcome to Rebel FM Number 37. - Yes, this time it is 37. - Last time I said 37, but actually this time it's 37. - It's all right, they wouldn't have known if you hadn't said the thing. - Well the thing was that it was me from the future coming to do an episode in the past and I got confused. Because in the future we were on episode 37 already. So, but that future self left. He was only covering for me while I was in another realm. - Did your mom give you the mistaken impression that you were clever once? - I'm sorry, that was me. - Is there green stuff in the other realm? - I was being wholeheartedly serious. - I was actually with my larp crew. (laughing) - And Nero. - What's the the wolf? - You know what, I hate it all. - Yeah, I forget. - I'm glad you brought up larping because I watched the documentary I wanted to share that I thought was really good. - Okay, do so. - It was called Monster Camp. - Hold on before we do that real quick. I'm Anthony Gaiagost from gamespite.com and eatsleepgame.com. With me is Tyler Barber. - Hello, how's it going? - From eatsleepgame.com, as well as Arthur Giefs. It's where you say hello to people in your voice. - Hello. And that horrible mewling noise you hear in the background is Anthony's cat. - Be the cat battling her tail on top of a box. - That had an Xbox 360 debug in it at one time. So Tyler, you saw a documentary that you wanted to talk about? - It's called Monster Camp. And it's basically like this camp where people larp and there's a whole game built around it called Nero. - Like that camp about Jesus. - Kind of like a Jesus camp, but for larpers. - Maybe not quite as doable. - But they got like rule books and everything that goes along with this game. It was, it's a very entertaining, and it's on Netflix instance. - There's a dungeon expert walking around with the larpers at all time being like, basically you are breaking X and X rule. - Well, there's guys that like overlook their battles. And so they have people who are the monsters. And basically, these are the kids who paid like 20 bucks for the weekend, or you could be a character player. So like you threw in $60. And so you're an actual part of the plot. So like the monsters basically get beat on while all the other dudes are like. - Like physically beat on. With their little fuzzy, they're not fuzzy actually there. - Like foam swords. - Like foam swords. You know, and they say like 15 fire strikes, 15 out. - Is that on Netflix? - Stone death. Yes, it's on Netflix instant, Monster Camp. And it's very entertaining. Like even though it's kind of Waja watching it, it's still a really good documentary. And there's some really colorful characters in it. Yeah, I wanna see that. - Yeah. - Every time I hear, I think about larping now, I just think of that movie role models. - Oh, is that what that is too? Really larping in that game? - Yeah, there's a huge warping subplot in that movie. It's actually pretty funny. - With Paul Rudd's in that? - Paul Rudd and Sean William Scott. - Yeah. So let's talk about games we've been playing. Let's just get Borderlands out of the way. Now we can talk about it with the review scores and stuff. - What did you end up giving it? - I ended up giving it a four out of five. - I think that that isn't it. - Which Metacritic probably equates to something like an 80. - Yeah, that's exactly what Metacritic would give it. But I mean, that's, I feel like, a B is a perfectly valid score for Borderlands. - Yeah, you know, I would have liked some deeper RPG stuff in some ways. Like, man, even just having the ability to socket weapons would have been really cool. Because weapons are the main item you mess with, having ways to tinker them, rather than only relying on picking them up. Like having being able to add like acid mods to weapons that you really liked and stuff seems like a no brainer to me. - And so much what you find is trash. Like, it seems like a disproportionate amount of what you find is trash. And even, I mean, most of it's not even worth selling. It's just like you leave it on the ground. - I just said, I played that the way I played like the Baldur's Gate games. I set quotas, like if it didn't break X, I did not pick it up. - Right. Yeah, yeah. And you know, speaking of selling, I mean, there's even enough cash hidden around. And when you're selling all your weapons, it's like, I don't know about you guys, but I'm pretty early in the game. And man, my cash flow is pretty, you're pretty much always in the black unless you're spending your money on really stupid stuff that you don't need to spend it on. Like if you're the type of person that buys weapon out of a vendor, which is basically no reason to ever do it. - Right. - I mean, early on, like buying ammo was expensive. - Buying ammo, yeah. But as I'm saying, like the first five levels or so, you're kind of like, oh, money's kind of tight. But then after that, you just start racking it in 'cause quests start giving pretty extravagant amounts of money too. - Yeah. - Yeah, I mean, one of the achievements you pretty much get by the time you beat the game is break a million dollars, like, you know, throughout the whole entirety of the game. I mean, when I beat the game, I had like 800,000 left over, so. - One thing I like is that in addition to the achievements, there are like sub-achievements and challenges that you can do, and those give you experience in addition to achievement points? - Those are the only type that I haven't got that I'll actively go for. I don't actively go for achievements because nerd score isn't important to me personally, but when it comes to things that'll give you a level up, I totally go for this. Like give 15 cross of kills, I'm like, yes, I will, because it's also 3000 experience. - Yeah, exactly. I mean, that's as much as a normal quest at the beginning of the game. - Right, yeah, I totally went for those just because they're worth it. So when you reviewed it, what character class did you play? - I played there as a soldier, and then I played till about like level four or five as a hunter, I wanna say, and then I played through till like level 11 or something before that, maybe as a siren, I think, at a preview of it. - Did you play as a siren? - At a preview thing, I think. - So the hunters are the snipers, right? - I guess. - The sirens are like, what is that? - According to the game, there are the elemental damage people, so they get extra bonuses any time they use a weapon that does like corrosive electrical fire damage. - Right, okay. - If you like a phase walking thing, where they sort of turn half invisible and move super fast and eventually as you add points into some of your different skills, like it will just do a shit ton of damage as you walk by stuff and it'll have these explosions of fire and lightning as you go into and out of it. - Yeah, that game's not nearly as long as people made it out to be. Like, it's long, I'm not saying it isn't long, it's long, but I'm saying when I talk to people that were involved with the game, like they said that the storyline took a lot longer than 20 hours. - I mean, maybe they just feel like the storyline includes the side. - Yeah, I'm gonna say, 'cause I mean, if you just wanna play the storyline, you can do it in like 20 hours. But if you wanna do all the side missions and stuff, I mean, like the side missions I didn't do at this point in my character, so many of them are now trivial, like not even worth doing, it's for experience. So that's why I'm gonna go through and do those on playthrough number two, because then when I do them, they'll be with guys updating that level. - Okay, so yeah, and on playthrough number two, you'll probably hit the level cap, which is where some people might even view like, well, that's the end of this type of game. - Yeah, pretty much. - It's a level cap. - I mean, but even then, I suspect they'll probably even up that possibly with some DLC down the line. - I mean, they, when do they announce this? - They announced the DLC, when does that come out? But I don't know when it comes out and I don't know if it is the level cap or if it's just more area sticks. - I mean, it's a new, it's a completely new area, it sounds like, which is like Dr. Zedd's, some of that one. - Yeah, some of the zombies, and there's like a Frankenstein or the monster, it's the king thing. - Right, what level were you at when you finished? When I finished, I was 34. So in the level cap's 50, and like, I know like, some people were over 40 when they beat it, because they did so many side quests, okay? - I mean, Jeff Gerstman is, I think, he was saying on his Twitter that he's probably the first person in the world to have level 50 on a retail. - Yeah, I mean, that guy obviously also poopsocked it. - Yeah, I mean, seriously, like, if Jeff Gerstman is probably the world's leading authority on Borderlands, it does not work for Gearbox right now. - Yeah, yeah, I don't, I just don't, honestly, I just do not have that much time. - I never play games like that, I just don't have that much time to dedicate into any one game, really. - I don't even, whoa, what was that? - That was Anthony's cat attacking her tail. And accidentally hooking herself. She's all right. - She's been in kind of a pissy mood lately because we put her on a diet. - Well, probably for our own good. - I mean, when she runs, like, her stomach swings back and forth between her legs. - Yeah, and I need to get flea medication for her. - True. - So she's probably scratching it herself. Anyways. - Co-op, co-op is, co-op is good as long as people are within, like, a certain level area of each other. - Yeah, I mean, otherwise, you'll run into enemies that it's like the person that's the highest levels, like, doing good damage against in here, like, hitting it, one, one, one, one, one. - If you're lucky, I mean, we definitely went into a cave at one point when I was, like, level 17 and you were 11 and you were doing, I think you were firing an SMG or a heavy machine gun at the, at the arachnid things and it just, like, a ton of zeros. - Yeah, that's why I just left immediately. I was like, okay, not doing this. - Wow, so not only might it be advisable to only play this game if you have a friend that will play it with you, but also, like, if you're gonna play it at the same time with the friend, like, start at the same time. - I mean, you can make multiple characters. - Yeah, that's true, that is true. - Yeah, like, I told you when, if I end up playing with you, I'll probably start a berserker character, just 'cause I'd rather, I mean, I just point the soldiers. So, the soldiers, what everyone picks most, like, amongst the people that reviewed it, 'cause it's such a no-brainer for that type of game because he's good with rifles and shotguns. It's like, you know, hey, I'm playing a shooter. So, a lot of people go with that, but now I wanna play berserker because having a guy focused on melee damage and stuff would make for, I complete, like, a pretty different game, I feel, so. And, you know, I don't know, I wouldn't mind doing some, like, the second time doing those quests at a faster pace with you wouldn't really bother me, whereas I said in my review and I said to Arthur, like, I played solo a lot because I liked moving at my own pace and not always being with people that were like, go, go, go, go, go, go, go, go. - I mean, like, we said last time, like, the first eight levels or so kind of drag. - It's like a really long extended tutorial. So, in that way, if you can find someone that's a higher level that can sort of drag you through that faster, like, I dragged Anthony from level four to level 14 in like an hour and a half. - Oh, nice. Yeah, and you would get a lot of experience 'cause even if you weren't doing that much damage to them, even like, me or Arthur killing them would give you huge chunks of experience 'cause they're worth more as well, okay. Well, yeah, you know, I've started my first playthrough as a soldier on the retail build, but I'm actually kind of intrigued by the sniper because I find that I just, most of the time, stick to my sidearm. - I mean, even with my soldier, like Arthur saw, like, I didn't just, he may have had bonuses initially to machine guns and shotguns, and those were still my two preferred weapons. But inevitably, I ended up using pistols if I found a really good one or even sniper rifles. - I mean, there's not enough of an incentive to, for most of the classes, to stick to one kind of weapon. - Right, it's not like they get such a huge bonus that you're like, this is the only thing I wanna use. Like the hunter gets a bonus to sniper rifles in that when you're any other character, after you take a shot with a sniper rifle, it takes a while for the reticule to slow down and zoom in on the center of the screen, whereas the hunter has a much faster sort of cool down to the shots that he can take accurately. - Right, but like my guys still use the sniper rifle sometimes if like, I knew there was a lot of guys that getting close enough to use my assault rifles were gonna be kind of trouble. I would try and soften up a few guys with the sniper rifle, then I would like switch it out of my loadout and go in with my normal thing. So I mean, there's still reasons for every class to use every sort of weapon. 'Cause even like your sniper guy, once you get like four gun slots, you have like one sniper rifle, maybe like two pistols or something, you might get a really awesome shotgun and be like, oh, this is my oh shit gun. Like when guys get really close, I'll just pull this out and try and blast at him, so. - I mean, as far as like the gear grind in the game goes, it succeeds largely. Like it definitely does better than pretty much any other game, like this console generation, as far as something that tries to emulate the sort of Diablo II. - Yeah, I mean, you feel pretty constantly recorded. - It just doesn't like, like we were talking, I don't know if we talked about this last week or not, but it just doesn't like the nice thing about Diablo II, which is again, the standard that all of this shit is compared to and that's what. - Well, obviously, if everyone's drawing upon it with like the blue weapons, green weapons, purple weapons. - I mean, in gearbox, like has made direct comparisons. It's like in Diablo II, there were so many different kinds of items that you could find, like you can have two different rings in the amulet, a helmet, armor, gloves. - Sock it a bite. - It's the belt, socket items, like charms. - And some of those would actually reflect on your character in game. - Yeah, it actually changed your appearance. - Yeah, and there's just, I mean in Borderlands, you get guns, shields, grenade mods. - And one class mod. - And one class mod at a time. - Yeah, I mean, it is pretty much like a light version of an RPG, but at the same time, you know, it is the most successful game at combining an actual first person shooter with RPG elements and not sucking. - I mean, it just gets, it needs to be giving out loot just all the time. - And I like the fact that it goes with the Diablo style loot like on, you know, World of Warcraft, you don't get the loot blasting off guys when they die. When they die, you have to actually right click them and then you see it, but there's something awesome about seeing a boss and then you see like, boom, and you see a blue thing and you're like, oh, blue thing. - That's like fireworks. - Yeah, I mean, just, you know, that moment where you're like, oh shit, he dropped a purple item, you know? So, I-- - Usually that purple item would suck, but sometimes-- - Yeah, sometimes it'd be good, but otherwise even if it sucked, you were like, oh, at least it's $20,000, so I don't like that, so. - Have I asked this before? Is this four-player co-op? - It is four-player co-op, yeah. - I feel like maybe I've asked that before. - I think one of the things that they should patch in is they should really patch in a four-player vehicle. Like, that just seems, I don't like the fact that the vehicles only seat two, so you have to have two vehicles, two drivers. - They should have like the Fantastic Four jet. - Exactly, they need, like, even if you're right, what if it was like a hover vehicle that would fit in so well with that whirl, like it's-- - I know what you're thinking in your head, you're thinking of like the-- - The thing eventually. - The fan was jetting venture brothers? - Yeah, exactly, and like-- - Like the Fantastic Four parodies jet. - Two people sit on side with machine gun turrets one person sits upside through the rocket launcher, or even if the people on the side can just fire their normal guns off of it. Like, just the idea of rolling around as four people sounds fun, because yeah, rolling around with two cars is fun, but then someone might hit a wall and get stuck and, I don't know. - I mean, and the other thing that's kind of annoying, when I was playing it, I would always be impressed that it would keep me playing. Like, I would just feel compelled to do one-- - Right, 'cause one quest leads into another-- - Exactly, it's very much like a Bolivian or Fallout in that-- - Or World of Warcraft. - Or World of Warcraft. But also like a Bolivian or Fallout, there are so many areas where you can just go somewhere where they didn't expect you to and get stuck in geometry, and the only way out is to quit. - Yeah, I never actually had, except for the one time you and I did co-op, where I just had to actually quit the game. Other times, I would have to like, mash every button and like, through a thing of like, crouching and throwing my turret, all of a sudden I would be out of it. But you're right, I mean, those instances are relatively few and far between for how big the world is. - I mean, they're still frustrating enough to like, just say, okay, I am not playing this game right now. That was, I am pissed off. - I am the middle of the quest and now I have to stop-- - Right, or the occasional rock that you roll up on me take a car that looks like there's no reason it should stop your car, it's just like dead stop wall. - What the areas where they basically say, oh, we don't want you to have a car here. - Yeah. - That would break the game. - But it looks like the car should clearly fit and it's just like, whoop, wall. - Or a light guy could melee it through. - Yeah, but you can't. - And the quest marker is occasionally borked. - Well, it's, it's, so what have we discovered through playing it a lot at work? I mean, everyone at work's been playing it. Is that the quest marker, like I didn't even mention this review because ultimately it's not that big of a deal but it is pretty annoying sometimes that like the quest marker will, will, for some collection quest will be like, go to this item, go to this item and it will lead you physically to the place where that item is sitting. And then other times arbitrarily, all of a sudden it'll be like, and you're in the area where four items are that you need to find them. And it's like, how come you led me like straight up to everything and now you're not? I guess it doesn't make sense. - And you'll just like spend all this time trying to get exactly where the marker is pointing to and then there'll be nothing there and you're, I don't understand. - Yeah, you'll be like trying to jump upon top of buildings and do crazy ninging, assuming it's gotta be above me. - And you'll get up somewhere where there's no reason you should have ever been able to get to and it's just like, there's nothing. - Yeah, so it's just weird, the way they switch that but all those things aside. - It's a fun game. I mean, as a value proposition, there is an awful lot of play time in there. - Yeah, I mean, if you were just going by an enjoyment per hour per dollar, it's pretty good. It's like three bucks an hour if you just played the story. - Yeah. - So. - I mean, it works pretty well as a shooter. - Yeah, I think the shooting's just fine on it, actually. You know, it's pretty-- - It's pretty immaculate. - So far all the guns that I've seen, like when you aim down the sides, they look really, really skinny. You guys noticed that about the design of the guns in this game. - No, not really. - I don't know, I think-- - No, Tyler, you're just retarded. - There are some guns you get that are really, like I had some shotguns and stuff that were oddly opposite. - Yeah, bulky, yeah, yeah, I guess later in the game. - I think I would have liked if they had done this and I mean, maybe there's just no reason for them too. It would have been nice if they had offered a third person mode. Because I mean, it is the Unreal Engine 3. It would have been nice to see your character using these ridiculous weapons, but I mean, whatever, it's still, I mean, it's generally a good looking game like the direction of the way with the yard is fine. - Really kind of frustrates me that my cat likes to come sit on Tyler's lap and not mine. Anyways. - It's 'cause he smells like Tyler's cat. - So let's talk about some other games. - What else have you been playing? - I'm pretty, oh well, I mean, I guess I can talk about Dante's Inferno. - Yeah, you can talk, I mean, this isn't gonna go until Thursday. - Yeah, I played some Dante's Inferno PSP and I'm probably not gonna write a preview on it. And I don't know. I feel like that game, like Dante's Inferno, I really have high hopes for it because I think Visceral's games is a good studio. But I just like, I was telling Arthur earlier and I was telling you in the car, Tyler, it's like, I just feel like the way they choose to show it just makes it like, because they don't show any of the story elements, they just kind of explain it to you and expect you to understand what they're talking about, but they don't show it, kind of makes it just seem like incredibly derivative, really competent God of War clone, but it's like God of War to the point where it's like the little things. Like, I was doing this quest to the box and he's like, all right, hold onto the box and now what you're holding onto. If you hold down Circle, he'll charge up a kick and kick it so it slides. And I was like, oh my God, that is exactly what Kratos does. - I mean, to be fair, there is still room for that on the PSP. If that's all it is, if it is just like a boring sort of semi-story driven action game that's an extremely compelling war clone. I mean, there's only one other God of War game on the PSP. - Right, and I'm just saying that even with the, you know, the next-gen versions, like when I've seen them, they always show these chunks that don't let the game, like, I really think what's gonna be the cool part about that, just like God of War for me, is I actually do like the story in those games. I think they're kind of cool. - I do. - And so like, and that's what I think it's gonna be like the selling point of Dante's Inferno for me is like this actually weird story with all these, like, liberties taken about, you know, this famous poem and stuff. - You don't feel like you've been able to pull that in. Have you played it? Like the next-gen one? - Oh no, no. - I mean, every time I've played it, I've played it a few times now. Like it's always, there's enough, it's a big enough chunk of the game that it's possible to sort of get a context for the feel of the game and the presentation. - I don't know, it just seems like when you show these parts where it's just like, you beat on some things and then you climb on some things and then you pull a few switches. It's like, all right, I understand, I've played this game before and it was called God of War, you know, and I, but I really think that I really wanna see the story. 'Cause that's for me. 'Cause I'm a big story person. Like I think I probably talk about it in every review I write a story. 'Cause I am the type of person that really likes a good story and I am really intrigued to see it. 'Cause you know, there were certain things like today I saw like crossing the river sticks and I was like, where's the boatman? 'Cause I was like on the raft and I was like, where the fuck's the boatman? Did you guys not put a boatman? And he's like, oh no, there's a boatman. And then it turned out that the raft lifts up and I'm writing, the boat is actually just-- Which is exactly the same. Yeah, it's exactly the same as it is in the console version, which is kind of cool actually. Yeah, I mean, they are following it pretty faithfully. That being said, the one thing that he said that kind of put me off about it was he was like, yeah, this isn't being developed in house, it's being made by the same people who made wet. And I was like, I hope they do a good job with it. You mean the unfortunately named A2M? Yeah, so. I feel like there's this weird sort of war of parallel marketing strategies for that game. Like on the one hand, you have the marketing company that's putting out all these really stupid promotions that are sort of offensive and not really gaining at any friends and then on the other-- Although I enjoyed the fake protest. Yeah, and then on the other, you have like the developer diaries that they're putting out that are really cool that are giving sort of you on the concepting stage of it and like the sort of ideas behind where they wanna take it. And that's all really cool. Yeah, you know, sorry. No, no, I mean, it's just, it's weird to me. It's like there is an element that wants that game to fail. Another thing I like is that the cinemas look really great. It's done by the same company that did like that Republic Star Wars, the old Republic trailer. Yeah, which was pretty awesome. I can't think of the name of that company, but I'm pretty sure they did like Don of War videos and stuff to like, you know, they're famous. They're a party like video game trailer. I know they're that famous. Well, they're very prolific, but, and they actually use the PS3 and Xbox 360, CG, like the cutscenes are in the PSP one as well. Like, you know, Lorez of course. Yeah, but they're all still there. Like, yeah, so that's, I mean, it is telling the same story. Comes out day and day, which for me, it's kind of, I almost have a conundrum because I do want to play it, but there's like a weird part of me that really loves handheld games and almost wants to play it on PSP more than a console, which I will be picking it up on console. So you don't have to pick it up on console if you don't want to. Yeah, I just like handheld games a lot. Whereas I just like, has such a hard time finding reasons to turn on my DS. Me too, but every now and then you'll get one and I'll play it for four hours and then. Yeah, see, I've spent probably like 50 plus hours playing the Phoenix or I games alone in those games. Looking forward to the next one in February. Yeah, those were the two games that I really played. I mean-- Did you see anything else over the last-- No, I mean, tonight there's an army of two event, but obviously I'm not there. The 40th day. Yeah, the 40th day. I mean, and honestly, I've seen that once and-- I mean, then until they-- if they don't fix the frame rate on that game, that's-- that game is gonna get ripped apart. Yeah. Last time we saw it, it was in pretty rough shape. But yeah, you know, I'm looking forward to trying some games this week, including Tropico, now that it's out. Oh yeah, I saw that. Yeah, Ryan's review. Ryan liked it a lot. I don't know what he gave it just yet, but I know he loved it. So Ryan told me that his way he played Tropico, which Tropico is a game. It's like SimCity talked about it previously, except SimCity, but you're also playing a dictator of an island. And Ryan played one where he made his people love him. He built all these really nice housing for them. And then like towards the goal of the game is to stay in power till X year. And so in the last decade, I was rain that he had to stay in power to win the game. Ryan all of a sudden declared like made a martial law and paid his military like three times as much as like anybody else made. Doctors and stuff all got paid with it. So the military is super loyal and then Ryan banned religion and looked up a roster of person by person citizen list of who was really into religion and had them all murdered. Whoa. Because Ryan said he was their god. [LAUGHTER] I would say like fucking Jim Jones or something. Fuck it, hey, dude. I just love that he can do stuff like that in that game. That's why I-- Of course you do. That's why I just-- I can't wait. That sounds rad. It sounds like a fun game to play, man. Is it multiplayer? I mean, when I played it, I was just like wanting to build for Velas the whole time. And then people would be like, ah, we want better housing. And I'd be like, ah, you want a gun in your face. [LAUGHTER] You were the guy that gets overthrown. Yeah, it probably would be. That's the cool thing about that game is you can't just be a dick. You have to really balance it. And you have to balance international relations lest the USSR comes in and is like, you know, we're tired of you. So yeah, that's the game I'm looking forward to. What has everyone else been playing? Tower. So I almost finished four games this weekend and ended up finishing two. I thought you were going to say it ended up finishing nine. No, no, I came really close to two. You played Borderlands. Well, no, I just played a little bit of Borderlands today before I came up here, other than the debug version, which I was really confused last week when you guys were talking about the long intro and stuff, because the debug version that I had didn't have that stuff. So I was like, what are you guys talking about? But now that I have my retail copy, I understand. Yeah, I like the whole car part and stuff. Yeah, yeah, I didn't. I was just like, what are these dudes? Really? Really? What are they talking about? No, the game I'm talking about, like, I jumped on the world of goo sale. Oh, man, I'm so bad that I didn't do that. I paid, like, the majority of the people I paid a dollar for it. That was the son of a bitch. Why are you glad you didn't jump on it? No, I'm mad that I didn't do it before. Well, you know what? They extended it until the 25th. Oh, wow, I should do that then and pay them more than a dollar. Yeah, even if you pay them a dollar, it's better than it pirated, right? Yeah, you wrote something about it being a success overall. Yeah, actually, the 2D Boy developer released a bunch of statistics about it today, and I just did a little news right up about it. And there's some really interesting stuff in there, actually. I think about just about 17,000 people paid one cent for it, which is like anything below 30 cents because of the PayPal transaction fee. They don't get any money for it, so like a giant chunk of them. But it was weird there, if you look on the graph, there were even a few people who threw down even way over the price of the game. They were like quite a few people who dropped 40 bucks on it, 50 bucks. Right, there's always those people. I mean, they got more affluent people or something. They have more money they can kick around, and they're like-- Trying to make-- I mean, that's why that system, in theory, could work so well, because just like Radiohead album right there might be someone that's like, I've loved Radiohead for 12 years. Here's $1,000 because I love you so much. Yeah, and then if they even embrace it fully like the way Radiohead did, where the people who paid $80 or something for in Rainbow Scott like, yeah, they did a box. I mean, I'm pretty sure that the bands who have done that have declared that it was a failure. I think so, I don't know. I mean, I know that Trent Reznor did the same thing and he said that it will be about again. Well, Trent Reznor. Trent Reznor, but they're no Radiohead. Tower, I will reach across the couch. They are not. Dude, World of Goo, and-- We will see how far up your ass that might stay can go. There's-- that's a hard game. That game gets hard at some point. It does. It's a certain one-- you know the one that gave me the most trouble? It's pretty early on. I'd probably 10 or 12 levels in, and it's just this one where you have to build a ridiculously tall tower. You have to get over 100 meters up. It's huge, but eventually it just starts bending and it'll snap and it can get so frustrating. Right, I mean, not in like a bad way. It's like it's usually your own engineering fault that you've made something so poor. Yeah, I mean, I felt like it was the perfect level of challenge for me because there were levels that would stunt me a lot. And so if you're unfamiliar with the game, you're basically like there are these goo balls that are all around the world, and it's kind of like a game sort of like lemmings where you're building these structures and you basically make triangles. You know, I'm trying to describe it. You take these balls and when you stretch two of them apart, a Lionel form in between, and if you stretch like three, you can make a triangle. You're basically forming girders that you use to build a structure to reach like a vacuum pump. Yeah, but there's all like different types of goo balls. So like some you can, you know, once you make something, you can take them apart and place them somewhere else again. Some are permanent. You know, it's just all kind of variation. The art style is amazing. The music. The music's pretty good to keep it like driving. So good. I mean, I sat down. I played through it over the entire weekend. I could not stop playing. And it runs on basically most anything. Yeah. The aspects are really low. Yeah, Mac, Linux, PC. And I'm even now just obsessing going back over the levels to get more goo balls because they have one stage that's just open. Like there's no goals or anything. It's just build bridge. And it's however many goo balls, extra goo balls you collected and all the levels over the par. And that's how you build the bridge. Yeah, so it's like right now I have like 222 goo balls in my free build area. But I was saying that, man, I kind of wish the developers would give you some of the other goo balls in the free build area, at least like the balloons. You know how the balloons would help you build structures so well? Right. Because it would stabilize them. But dude, that game is just so fun in the art direction. And it even kind of has a little bit of a political message, a little bit of a statement. How so? You don't think an environmentalism sort of statement? How so? I want you to explain. Well, there are these little signs that you click on there, are supposed to be the information signs that help you out with the gameplay tips. But they really don't help you out. They're just sort of like the way the guy implants versus saw me the way you click on him. And he says crazy shit. [INTERPOSING VOICES] But every now and then, it'll say stuff about how there's always this running commentary of this fog, this pollution that's overhead and the telescope that you're ultimately trying to raise at the end, is trying to see over the fog. Yeah, I mean, that could very well be. It wouldn't surprise me that it ended up-- Industrialism. --put some sort of message in there. I mean, the whole thing is like you're collecting all these goo balls and you're making like makeup products or like-- Right. You know, I don't know. It's interesting. Have you ever played a ball of goo? I haven't. I've only seen it. And I've been meaning to buy it over and over again. And I just keep forgetting. Dude, I'm telling you-- --put to me. I feel like for whatever reason, seeing it-- I think I've seen it at 30 and 20. And I just feel like I don't want to pay that much. Yeah, that-- you know what? You bring up a good point because in the survey that a 2D boy attached to the cell, they asked how much people thought the game should be priced at. And the majority of 10 bucks. The majority of people said 10. Like how much was the price of 20? The majority was 15, I think. I mean, I could see 15 from a little goo. Yeah, it is a pretty long game. It's probably about its deep exposure, man. It's not that long, dude. I mean, it's not a long game, it's not. It doesn't seem like the production costs would warrant-- would make it hard to make it a longer game so much as it would just be like, oh, well, this is a different scenario where we throw the same assets we were using for everything else together. Yeah, it does a lot of asset repetition, yeah, for sure. And I mean, I don't have any problems that I'm wanting $20 for it. Well, you're talking about, well, do goo doing asset? Dude, how far have you guys played? I mean, apparently, I just haven't seen very far into it. Dude, it changes up drastically, like the third world you go to, it is completely, complete different art style. 100% but then throughout the whole world, three is at the same the whole time. And then afterwards, there's this power crystal because it's the shield. It's the style, dummy. We keep quoting Dr. Steve Bruell, which is a Tim and Eric's kit, and Tyler was looking up in the air thinking so hard it looked just like it, especially because you got glasses. Just like his, too, that magnifying of that. I know they make your eyes bigger. Actually, the first time I ever saw Tyler take office glasses, it kind of looked weird to me because I was like, your eyes aren't that big. You're like a mole person. Yeah, like I just thought your eyeballs were that size. Yeah, yeah. Really, Tyler's like a walking anime character. All right, so do you have anything else to say about World of Goo? Yeah, man, that it is in my top three games I've played so far this year list, which would be like-- Didn't it come out last year? It came out last year. So would that space also be on the list? No, actually, my top three games this year so far, Civ 4, Plants vs. Zombie, in World of Goo. Those are my top three games this year. Maybe you should get a job at what they play. Where's Uncharted, Tyler? It's up there, dude. That was another game I got for Plants vs. Zombies is a better game than Uncharted 2. Oh, man. Because that's sort of what it sounds like you're saying. Dude, hey, man, I like Uncharted. I like a lot of games, dude. I really couldn't help it. I'm sorry. That's all good. But, dude, man-- Plants vs. Zombies is a great game. It's a fucking excellent game. That's a game I occasionally sit down just when I-- I don't know what to play at night. And then I'll sit down and just play six levels of that. And then I'm like, all right. Dude, now that's a game that is fairly priced at $20. Because in addition to the story levels, the story missions, which I also beat this weekend-- it was the second game I beat-- they have the puzzles, which are complete variations on the gameplay. Like, there's somewhere-- you're the zombies. And have you played those types of many games or no's? Oh, they're so fun. I mean, it's typical pop cap, right? Where you know, not on top of the normal peggle game, they give all those challenge things that are like encourage you to play in a different way, even though you're still using the same basic ideas. Right. Yeah. They even have a bejeweled version, where you're taking your plants and matching three, and it drops down new ones. Nice. Yeah. Yeah, man, I love-- So what else did you beat this weekend? It was Plants vs. Zombies. That's the game you beat. Well, it was like the story, the quote unquote, campaign. Yeah, the missions. So it was-- I played a beat, World of Goo, and Plants vs. Zombies. And what did you not beat? I did not beat Uncharted, though I came really close, and ODST, though I came really close with Mr. Hoots. Hala, hala. Listen, Mr. Hoots, OK. Yeah. Yeah, we play a lot of co-op. Of ODST. Multi-player. Yeah. Yeah, because my furthest save is the campaign that I ran with you. So we picked up right there. What are you thinking about Uncharted 2 now that you're most the way through it? Dude, I think it's fucking awesome. The campaign is really good. There are a few parts where it's just like, I really have to go five feet, die, learn what they want me to do, repeat. Go five feet, die, learn what they want me to do, and get the next five feet. There are a few parts I can think of like two right now on the top of my head. But other than that, dude, it's really good. Really fucking good. Yeah, I like it a lot. What chapter are you on? I am-- I just got to the village, the Tibetan village, where it brings you back to the beginning, basically. You still have like three hours, probably. Yeah, like for chapter 18, maybe? Yeah, somewhere around. Yeah, it's 26 chapters. 26, yeah. I just did the train section, which I'm trying not to spoil anything. I mean, there's a train. There's a train and a game. Whoa. In case it wasn't clear to you from the fucking marketing for Uncharted 2, there is a train that plays a role. That section, the action section on the train, it seems like something that would have been really bad ass, but it was like what I was describing where I would just get on one train car and I would die on that car and then figure out, OK, this is where it'll actually be the fell state. Like, it'll shoot the rest of the trains away. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. And then it ends with a frustrating-- Yeah, one of the most frustrating moments in the game. He didn't give me any trouble. I mean, did you hear us rant about that guy? Yeah, yeah, he didn't give other people trouble. I know that other people did it just fine too, but that is a divisive point right there. Really? There are actually a lot of points like that. I feel like there are a lot of people that get stuck at different parts or don't get stuck at all. Like my experience with the courtyard in the beginning, where it was stealth, and I just got stuck and tried over and over and over. But this guy and the green guy, right? I feel like you-- Beat him on the first-- You also heard us rant at length about how that thing was specifically how that boss was broken. Do you think that caused you not to get stuck on it? I didn't remember at all what-- How did you guys remember anything from 10 minutes ago? I remember-- I remember what you guys were saying about-- I don't even remember where I am, right? Where am I? But I mean, I just threw grenades at his feet and did the melee when it was time to do the dance. Did that like three times, and it was good? Grenades in that game were satisfying if-- questionably accurate. Dude, they were very questionably accurate. Man, when you kill people with grenades in that game. Yeah, it is kind of cool. It was fun. And ODST? Yes, that as well, which continues to kick ass if that's not too cliché to say. But yeah, man, it's just-- the fun halo weapons and scenarios that we wanted more of. And I feel like the best level designs so far, other than the first halo. I think you might be looking at the first halo more rosy colored than I do. I went back and tried to play it after playing ODST. Which level did you try to play? Dude, because there are some stand outs actually. Like the-- I feel like the silent cartographer is still one of the best halo levels that they've ever known. And you know, that's the one in the snails I always like. No, the silent cartographer is the one where you come in on the pelicans on the beach. And you went on the beach on the firefight. That's like the beginnings of halo too are some of my favorite halo levels. Like when you're in the space station. Really? I fucking hate that level. I love the space station part. I don't know. And you do the parts where you're fighting out in space and it's got the good sound. Yeah, that is fun. Yeah. And stuff. Yeah, I don't know. I really like that part. That's me. It's just me. I just really-- yeah, I really dug on that. That's six of my fans. To me, all the outside sections of the first halo were just great everyone. The first time you get the wort hog and you're going, it fills huge. All the snow missions in that are awesome. It's really good. Even though you're going basically through the same environment backwards-- The snow part that I always come back to is you come out of this elevator or you come out of the hallways and the level after the silent cartographer. And you go out and you see an elite on a-- you see a grunt in a turret and you see an elite on a ghost off in the distance and a firefight between Marines and a bunch of elites on ghosts. And then you go over and find a rocket launcher and you flip over a wort hog and then you go forward. I don't know if that part makes-- I think I know where-- and you get a-- That should be too specific, I think, for a lot of people. Like there's a big ass ramp in the nice pond next to it with a bunch of covenant elites. Yeah, yeah. I know Charlie, it's a big-- yes. And then the parts of the covenants and the guns. There's a lot of blue shit. I just want to throw something at your balls. I'm just being reductive, because being reductive sometimes is really funny. I mean, it's true. It is. The parts with the covenants. But you got referred to them like with an S, so it doesn't-- it's like an old person talking. You got the covenants and the guns. Where's my floods? Yeah. What have you been playing, Arthur? Or doodle. Played some more brutal legend. Brutal, man, I want to-- Yeah, I've seen far too much of that when I was with my friend, John, I got some plot lines spoiled for me unfortunately. Yeah, oh, really? Yeah, just because I was sleeping on the couch and I woke up to him playing it and so on. Which is disappointing, because honestly-- Pretty major twist. --like the plot and just like the story presentation of that game is like the best reason to play it. Right. Like I will be honest, I am surprised that that game is scoring as high on Metacritic as it is. From what I've seen him from even like my friend, John, talking to me about it, they say they all say it's pretty easy. Like if you just play on like the not brutal, you know, just like the difficulty below brutal, which is weird to me because my friend John is really not good at games. So him saying it's easy makes me wonder. Like maybe I should just start it on brutal. I mean, it's not that it's hard necessarily. It's just that like there are parts where it's like, OK, well, this is just dumb and I'm going to stop because this is just frustrating. I have seen parts when I was watching him play where it seemed like, you know, there's a lot of quests where it's like, don't let X die. Yeah. And so it's like, X died, you failed. 20 minutes into it too bad. Yeah, and the checkpointing on the escort parts is fucking balls. Like you have to do the whole thing all over again. But like I could understand like a B or a C plus. But I'm seeing like a lot of B pluses and like A minuses and shit like that for it. I'm just really surprised. I just think sometimes, you know, I mean, granted some of those scores are from outlets that I think have a very close association with certain game developers and maybe that might explain. Some of it also is just that like, you know, the humor is so good that it like colors people's opinions of it because they're like, oh man, I just remember this one part. It was so funny and that sticks like so far out in their mind that it like colors the rest of their review experience. Yeah. Because when it's because when it's cool, it's really cool. And the relationships are good. Like everything is just really well realized as far as the characters go. And again, I'm just constantly surprised by how not obnoxious Jack Black plays in this. I mean, like School of Rock is a toned down tenacious D Jack Black. Like this is not a tenacious D Jack Black. It's like all of the wildness sort of like cut or seriously reduced. Well, they keep him pretty cut down. And then when he's doing combat, he can still say some things. It's like, oh, yeah, it's Jack Black. Yeah. I mean, I'm just like, even if you dislike Jack Black, like is the persona that you see usually, I feel like in this game, you might be surprised. I mean, I could see how he could be annoying. Like, I don't think he's annoying. Like, I like Jack Black. Yeah, yeah, some people are really don't like Jack Black. And I like, I'm not going to pretend that I don't get it. Like I get it. But I don't know, like it's just there are parts of it that are just hard for me to get through because I don't feel like they're particularly well designed or it just feels like I'm sort of throwing myself against something over and over again. I'm not dying, but I'm not succeeding very quickly either. And I mean, like, I don't know. I don't know. I'm interested in just the crazy action game play twists. I mean, I don't know. I hear people talk about it sort of like RTS. And Tim Shafer come out and said, don't think of it as an RTS. You need to play it like an action game. I mean, it has RTS elements, but it doesn't work as an action game because I mean, if you go forward into a group of enemies, like just waiting forward, you will hit them over and over again and you just will not fucking kill them. And that's extremely unsatisfying. Like, there's no gratification in playing the game that way, even if you don't die. I mean, your guy isn't like totally incompetent. I've seen people get decapitated when you're attacking. Well, yeah, but that's after hitting them like 17 times. Like, it just takes way too much to kill things. It's like, it's like shooting things in the first Uncharted. That is how it feels lacking at things, except they're fucking way more of them than this. I, you know, I was reading on, you know, made the rounds on the news blogs that, like, after Tim Shafer was seeing some of the criticisms, like he sort of gave a few gameplay pointers. You see how they were just like, they kept saying like, use double team attacks, use double team attacks. And I started doing that more and that did help. And I do think that a slight disservice was played to the game and that everyone wanted to characterize it a certain way and the easiest way to do it, the most boilerplate way, to write a preview quickly for this game is to say, it's a real-time strategy game with action game elements instead of something which is kind of a different animal. But I still, I don't feel like that is a particularly well-implemented animal. But again, the story and the presentation and all that is good enough to make me want to keep playing it, even though like there's literally a section where I'm supposed to trap something by riding a vehicle and laying down a fire circle around it. And the controls just are not good enough to make that a really fun thing to do. And then one of the things I was supposed to lure back in trap got stuck on geometry and I had to restart. - It's not like the toe cable in the good old Star Wars games? - I know, much more frustrating. - The toe cable in the first, in the 64 Star Wars games has the environment. - That was fun. - That was fun, that was a good time. - I have fond memories of that game, even though apparently it's not very good out. - It is good. - I mean, in hindsight, most people say that that game sucks. - In hindsight, most people are wrong. - Yeah, it couldn't be us that are wrong. - No, that game is just like people love to hate on that game. I mean, that game is still not bad. Like I played it like two years ago and yeah, it looks terrible at this point comparatively. - For sure. - But it's still fun. Like it still did so many things that were so cool. Like I just did aircraft combat. I say fuck those people. - All right. - All right, man. - Even if they're my boss. - I agree. So how's the empire? - Well, is your boss Ryan Scott or your boss full title? - Oh, I don't know. If any of them think that, fuck them. - Oh, okay. - Dude, shit. - I don't know if they think it, but then they're gonna tell me they did and I'm gonna be like, yes, sir, sorry, sir. Would you like a coffee, sir? - You don't get your boss's coffee unless you're-- - No, but I did bring Ryan an orange juice today and then he didn't even show up to work. - Bad. - Oh. - He was out with AIDS. Moving on. (laughing) Someone's gonna ride it. - I have a friend who has AIDS. Ah. (laughing) - I played, I played a lot of Borderlands over the last week, but we just fucking talked about Borderlands. I played a couple of hours of a boy in his blob last night. - Oh, what's that, man? - Did you play that much of it? Yeah, I didn't even know. - I figured I had an hour and a half. - Interesting. - I didn't really get frustrated. I was like, okay. - Kind of got bored. - I'm done with this for a little while. I wanna go back and play it. - How was the dying on one hit thing? Does that get old or does it doesn't really bother you because it just makes sense? - I mean, the levels are so short. - And it has pretty good checkpoints it looked like. - I don't feel like the checkpoints are even that good, but the levels are so short that it makes so little difference that you have to repeat. - And it's very clearly broken up into levels? - Yeah, like you have a hub, which is your treehouse, and that has this map that you go to to play levels, and then as you play levels, you unlock more stuff in the treehouse, like you unlock these sort of mementos that you go over and touch, and they show you like the production process of the game and like the character design and development and level design and stuff like that. And then there's this other room that's up a couple flights of stairs that shows mementos that are levels that you can go in and use to unlock more of that stuff. And there are challenge missions apparently, although I don't think I've unlocked any yet. - What's the point, like what are you doing in each level? - You were collecting chests with the blob, and the way that you do that is the blob consumes them, and then when you lead the level, he spits them out in your treehouse. - What's the point of the chest, like are you trying to like gather parts so the blob can like make it back to his planet or some shit? - There, it does so little in this game to tell you what the fuck is going on. Like there's not even a menu or tutorial. - Well, okay, see, I thought the whole point of this way. - It starts you like- - You're helping blob get back to blob world where some shit- - It's so obscure, like the narrative, like there's, the narrative is so subtle, and so like it makes half life look direct. - That doesn't surprise me. I mean, people have such fond memories of the original boy in this blob, and that had no story whatsoever. It was like, you got this blob, and it does shit. Figure out what these jelly bellies do. - It's super cute. - I know there's a button dedicated to hugging. - Yeah, so you can hug your blob at will, and you just sort of squeeze them, and it's very cute. You play an extremely fucking demanding six year old. Like there's a button to call- - To call him right now. - Like you have to, not just follow, but like if you feed him, you feed him jelly beans to turn him into things, and to get him back into blob form, you have to yell for him. And I mean, sometimes he goes, he just says, "Blob, blob, Bob, Bob, Bob." - He never seemed too much of a, like a little- - You were not listening. - Like he is a little- - He is a little- - He is a six year old little boy that I wanna smash when I talk him to their mom. I'm like, don't talk to your mom that way. He's very demanding, but I mean, it's fun. It's cute. Like it has a decent platforming thing. I find myself occasionally trying to blast through things too fast and dying like I would in an old school Mario game. - 'Cause you're just trying to be like it? - 'Cause I'm not taking my time, and you touch an enemy and you die, period. - Right, just kind of have that Mario appeal with like traps that are spinning back and forth, and it's about timing and stuff. - Like there are these bull type enemies that what you wanna do is throw down a jelly bean to turn the blob into a hole like a Looney Tunes hole, and then that enemy will fall through down a level or like into water or whatever. - So it very clearly tells you like, this jelly bean makes a parachute? - Yeah. - Yeah, 'cause in the original, it wasn't originally used to figure it out and remember. - And also, it only- - was to bring, was how you caught your blob up to you, catch up. - Yeah, like you had to throw him a blue jelly bean and he turns into a balloon and floats up to where you are. - Ah, oh my god. - But it only gives you certain jelly beans per level. Like there's no collecting new jelly beans or anything like that. So in that regard, it's not that game anymore. But I mean, it's fun. It's a palette cleanser from everything else that I'm playing. - Right, that's why I picked it up. I've been meeting to play it, but- - It's a very, it's a really nice looking game. Like I'm not gonna say, it's beautiful. Like it's not like, I feel like Lucidity is a beautiful game. I feel like a boy and his blob is very sweet and cute and animated. - Yeah, I like the animation style. Like it's gonna make games on Wii, make 'em look like that. - It's really weird though. Like the character looks like he's running it. Like a cartoon level frame rate and everything else moves at 60 frames a second. - Yeah, like when he goes to hug and stuff, it looks like I'm watching like a- - Like a Don Bluth cartoon from the '80s. - Yes, exactly. Yeah, like- - But everything else just moves. - He almost moves at like 10 frames a second or something. Like he moves in stages and then he like goes and hugs them. - Like in everything, it's like that is super imposed on a world that is running at 60 frames a second. And it's kind of jarring in spots. But it still looks good. And like upscaled through my receiver on my TV, actually it looks really good. But uh. - It's just funny when we start talking and stuff like that 'cause it's almost like, nowadays I think of like TVs and stuff. At least when I worked at the old one-up offices, it was like the equivalent of like, guys talking about their cars. - Yeah. - I got a Mustang. - Yeah, well, I got an original Corvette. - Well no, but I mean- - I got this TV, oh yeah, it's 120 Hertz. Yeah, shut the fuck up. - Like playing Dead Space Extraction through that looked a hell of a lot better than I did just by itself on a normal LCD TV too. - Oh yeah, I'm not saying that you aren't right. It's just funny that nowadays TVs are like the new thing. TVs and equipment amongst people we know, you know, are such a thing to like point out. - And then amongst their friendly nerdier- - Non-trust ratios. - niche building computers. - Right. - We had to fall into that category. And then today I spent a lot of time playing Forza, which is really good. - Looks pretty too. - Yeah. - I mean, I did not like the way it looked. I don't know if it looks kind of fake. - I think, I've been trying to figure out what it is about Forza that looks weird because there is something about it that's sort of jarring. And I think it's that everything is just super sharp. Like it doesn't, like in real life, there's just not that much like delineation between edges and surfaces. - So saying where it looks fake, almost like when I see like those 120 Hertz TVs and things are moving it away, then I'm like, ah, it's jarring because it's not real. - It's like hyper saturated and the frame rate is 60. Like it does not break from 60. And that helps. Like that's really cool that it's always at 60 frames a second unless you change views and then it'll drop for a second and then go right back up. And that helps with racing. Like I'm never hampered by frame rate or anything like that. But I think that combined with this sort of hyper saturated, really super sharp look is kind of jarring. It is sort of like a fantasy reality as opposed to a sort of more mundane reality. And I feel like that's something that the Gran Turismo games have always done really well. Like they've sort of worked out their visual cheats and their visual tricks to such a way that they know how a scene is supposed to look as opposed to like using science like to paint a scene the way that it's supposed to look. And I'm sure that someone is gonna say that's me taking a shot at Gran Turismo but it's basically just like they use art design in such a way that it sort of tries to recreate a scene as opposed to making like these super sharp images. - Right, I almost feel like that that's like the exact, like that's why it's so divisive amongst people that are going to like things like Forza or people that are gonna like things like Need For Speed Shift 'cause Need For Speed Shift kinda is the opposite. Or it's like trying to like recreate it like in a science sort of way or something the way you're saying. - Yeah, it's trying to recreate like a visual experience as opposed to Forza, which is very much dedicated to. We want it to look super sharp. We want you to be able to see everything you need to do. We want it to be at 60 frames a second because the physics update like every frame. - Right. - But I mean, that being said, like the gameplay is still super solid and. - Yeah, I would hope so. I mean, it was good in the last one. So we'd be like, just don't fuck it up. - And also, it's just like, there's so much stuff that you can tweak to make it so accessible. Like. - Right, it seems like every game that's smart is doing that nowadays. - But I mean, with Forza, it's like the driving line, I think is the big thing. And now they've got the auto braking, which will basically like break you into turns. So you just have to sort of tap the brake and hold the accelerator down when needed. - Right. - And the reverse feature, basically the reverse feature will keep me playing Forza 3, whereas I stopped playing Forza 2. - Yeah. - Because I got sick of redoing races when I was like four laps in on a four and a half mile course. Like I have never felt the need to just quit playing Forza 3 so far. And like, I definitely had playing Forza 2 at this point. - Yeah, I mean, it is frustrating and you're racing game when you're like on the final lap and you're like, I'm doing it, I'm doing it. Bam, you hit a wall. Like more like you'll like look away for a second or like you'll look at your time or anything else and you'll get distracted for just a slight a second. You'll be going so fast that you'll like plowing to a retaining wall. - And it's too close of a race with people like 0.0 or something seconds behind you. - And I mean, the AI in Forza is aggressive. You have to be careful bumping people because eventually people will, I mean, not eventually, like if you are an asshole, like other drivers will be an asshole to you, which is why as I was telling Anthony earlier, I sometimes feel guilty pulling what is known in technical terms as the dick move, which is a, there will almost always be a point in some of the championship races where there is a car that is faster than me in straightaways if it has time to get up that high and it's gear. - Huh? - Nothing. - No, what'd you say? - I said dicks. - Yeah, penises. So basically the only way to keep ahead of them is to stay in front of where they want to drive. And that's hard to do it. If you're not looking behind you all the time and looking behind you, it's hard when you're doing 90 in a turn. - Right. - So you'll see them sort of coming up on your left side or your right side and you're like, they are going faster than me. They are going to overtake me. And that's where you sort of turn your car, edged into them, break a little bit, slow them down and then rocket forward from them or where you'll like intentionally ram them into a wall and keep going. Like that is the dick move. - Sounds like my regular race style, I mean, I'm not real life racing when I'm in my. - But you can't do that before, is it? Because if you do that, you'll fuck up your car. - Ah. - Like not just physically, but like you will, not just cosmetically, but you will fuck up your car to the point where you can't win a race. - Yeah. - And also the paint feature has been greatly improved. - It was already pretty good before too. - But now I don't think it had this last time around. If it did someone, it can feel free to correct me, but there is a grid, like, so I recreated our logo in Forza, and I did this by opening up our font files in Photoshop and putting a grid over it and then going by that grid and just basically making an exact copy on Forza's grid. - Nice. So there's a rebel of film hood? - Yes. - And I'll probably put that up on the marketplace if people actually want it. - $20. All right, moving on. - I mean, I don't know if I can give it away for free or not, but it's not for like points, it's just like the Forza currency. - Right. So, is that it? - No. - Can't make him funny noises. - I think the cat wants us to cut the segment. - Yeah, I mean, I kind of said that we're going to be out of town this weekend because Torchlight comes out really soon. - Torchlight. - Yeah, it's sort of like a Diablo II-type game. - Hmm. It could be good. - From former, I think, from people who were at flagship developing Mephas. - Yeah, I mean, we'll see. You know, who else was from flagship that made a terrible game? The people that made Hellgate, so. - Hellgate is such a convoluted shitty story. - But, what was he? Yeah, let's take a break and we'll come back with a random topic suggested by you, the people. And if you're one of those users who hates that we like to use things from listening to feedback, well, then stop listening right now. (upbeat music) And I. (upbeat music) ♪ If I can't help everything ♪ ♪ Well, it just gives me a taste ♪ ♪ That comes down to this ♪ ♪ Long kiss ♪ ♪ Long kiss ♪ ♪ And the stranger gets on the masking ♪ ♪ With this ♪ ♪ Take this ♪ ♪ Give that to my skin ♪ (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Hello, listeners. - Oh, you, sorry. (laughing) - I thought. - I thought you said me. - Yeah, Tyler can leave the segment to it, Tyler. - What? - Use your psychic abilities to rate my Twitter feed. - I won't go the first! - You're gonna be lucky we don't leave you in Texas. - Sorry, like, you can't just jump off a Tyler and decided to use her claws to project herself. - She needed to get a good grip. Oh, man, are you okay? - Yeah. - Okay, so what we're gonna do this segment is yesterday we solicited topic suggestions on Twitter and since-- - Normally we're really smart and creative and we think of amazing topics on our own. But lately, we've been super busy. - Yeah, well, it's just that time of year, I mean-- - So, sometimes we like to go on your feedback because you are also creative. - I mean, I like to hear their questions and these are all game related, none of these are-- - Right, it's not like they're gonna be relationship things. - Yeah, there's none of the space on Twitter for that kind of shit. Okay, the Tim Lanning on Twitter says, "Are game developers using game journalists "as QA testers in PR horse?" - PR horse, yes. Game testers to a certain extent too. Yeah, I mean, there's definitely-- - Tied times where there's a demo and there's very clearly a moment where they say, like, for instance, last time I played League of Legends, I played a new level, a 3v3 level instead of a 5v5 and after we were done, they had us in QA invent and they were like, "Just tell us what you thought "of the level and what you would change for balance." And I was like, "Oh, okay." - Also, there are game journalists and freelancers that are used as consultants for marketing companies to play games and tell companies what they think. - Well, let's not beat around the bush. Do you guys have done that? - Yes. - I mean-- - Ty and I have both done that. - A lot of people didn't-- - But-- - And guys didn't-- - I mean, that is what-- - I wouldn't say. It has a, is incorporated, I think. - Right, but let's make a distinction. I wouldn't say we do any consulting. I mean, I did a mock review. - Well, that's what I'm saying. - Which was like, what, after the game is done and said, "Where are some people?" I don't know what any guy does, but I get the impression that it comes in early. - Yeah, I mean, like I know Dan Chu has done stuff on games early, you know, like when it's like still time to make games. - Where they wouldn't even show it to the press. - Right. I mean, these things happen. - Yeah. - But I also think that most people who actually have integrity would then not review the game. - Yeah, like I won't be talking about reviewing any of the games that we've done. - Mocked. But yeah, I mean, that happens, but the PR4 thing for sure, like sometimes it's not even like they're knowledgeable about it, but, you know, all straight up say it, like the big outlets, right? Like whether it's one up by a G&R game spot. To some extent, I do feel like they get used to be PR whores because, you know, when you have a site that is trying to be comprehensive and cover every little thing where you don't, where you don't want to not skip out on a preview, even if the details are like just one new level or four new guns, but you're not gonna skip it out because you know your competitors aren't gonna skip out. You do end up in this preview cycle where you're covering every little thing to the point where basically they're just using you to write things that might as well be press releases that will reach an audience that they couldn't reach. - Yeah, which they are press release, you know, and if you try to inject some sort of editorial opinion or anything, then, you know-- - You get the phone call. - Yeah, and it seems like the audience doesn't like it. - They don't like it either. - Yeah. I mean, it's, to some extent, it seems like more and more so a vast majority of the audience, I won't say all, but a vast majority really does just want bullet pointed lists of here's what I saw this time. This is what's different, this is what the game is. Goodbye. - Yeah, I'm always surprised. - These are the facts about how good or bad this is. - Yeah, yeah, you know, I'm always baffled by the amount of people who always want, like, objective news or reviews or previews, like-- - They don't exist. - Like, what planet are they? Do you know who they subscribe to? - Tanta Claus says, talk about the tools, language, and terms, use interviewing games and how they're used and misused. More specifically, he wants us to elaborate on why, what's wrong with saying visceral or compelling, et cetera. - It's just the certain things, like, when we were one up, we had a style guide, you know, and style guides usually get composed by copy editors. And, you know, copy editors aren't content editors as much as they are people that are verifying factual stuff and making sure that you are consistent with your own tone. Like, if you say, like, I hate the story and then later on, you're somehow saying you love the story. That's the shit the copy editors catch, you know. And, I mean, a good editor catches that stuff, too, but copy editors like the last line of defense. And so there would just be these words that are just so used, like, use so abundantly and, like, sometimes repeatedly in review and previews that it just became this ongoing thing to remove certain words from discourse so that there could be more, like, a better way. - They lose their meaning. Like, they're used to most of those. - Right, like, what does even visceral even mean to people these days? - I mean, I know what visceral means, literally. - Yeah, exactly, but I just... - Like, calling something compelling is now, like, saying it's good. - Yeah, it's just an early word for good. The story was compelling. - Like, visceral is just, like, intense. Like, intense is another word. - Yeah, which, I mean, really, if you're using compelling, right, it would mean that it's something that drives you forward. It's not just that it's good. I mean, in general, a lot of the words-- - It's something that keeps you that should try and be avoided to an extent. I mean, there's a place where any sort of, you know, adjectives, a lot of times, can get abused. - Yeah, I mean, and the simple fact of it is, like, there are plenty of very layman terms that are not used, that people overlook. Like, there are plenty of terms that aren't used. - There are just plenty silly terms that internally a lot of people that write about games will joke about, and like, when you hear them compose a mock review making fun of someone off the top of their head, they'll say things like, fans of the genre. This game didn't reinvent the wheel, but, you know, just like-- - You'll hear us use the word boilerplate to describe this kind of shit. It just means it's like, you have like this pile of interchangeable terms that you pull out to describe something when you don't want to deliberate or discuss it. - Think about sites that you have writing on that you, our audience, doesn't respect, and go read those things, and you could probably find sentences in each one that say the same thing as they do in others. Like, you know, me and Ryan were joking that there are certain websites that you could literally create some sort of online format that's like, what game do you want to review? I want to review Uncharted, next dropdown menu. What score do you want to give it? I want to give it an 8.5. How many times would you like to use the word beautiful? - Two. - And then I would just like to turn out this thing that we're thinking 'cause so much of it is so formulaic and they just use the same phrases all the time, you know? Stunning visuals, you know, crisp audio. - I mean, what does that even mean? Like, did you literally, like, did you drop the controller in a day because you saw something? - And that's the other thing. So the biggest tip I'll give before we can move on or you guys can add whatever you want, is don't say literally unless it's being used correctly. Because when you say something like, my eyes literally popped out of my head, really? (laughing) So what is it like being blind now? (laughing) I don't know what to tell you. - It's just when you exaggerate when you use exclamation points and makes you look stupid. - Yeah, I mean, you can come across as a fawning person that's just like a man-baby rather than a person that deserves respect. - Or a PR, or? - Or a PR, there you go. Although that's not to discourage the use of an exclamation point when necessary. - Fuck that. There's, I have never seen a reason and a review to use an exclamation point. - Unless it's gonna be, I could see a funny one where you're like, maybe it pissed me off so much. Fuck! But you can't say fuck. - I mean, like, I cannot think of a situation where you would use an exclamation point. - Well, then the honest is wrong. - Well, you could use it ironically, maybe, if it was really cleverly done. But I mean, - Even then. - But you'd have to be a really good funny writer. And funny writers and game review writers are often not the same thing. So, as I've seen. - Good writers and game writers are often not the same thing. - All right. - I mean, that's, I don't want to talk about game's journalism, that's just more like people were asking about that. So, Misglot asks, how do you expand gaming horizons on a budget? How can someone broaden their game with only one? So, is it been a limited budget? Ow, my cat just sunk her claws. - What does he mean? Like, like, I don't know. Check out the genre of games you'd never be playing. Like, if you only play first person shooters, go pick up a crazy story-driven game that I don't know. I mean, me when I want to broaden my horizons, I play something. Wait, what's the, wait, what's the, are we understanding the question? - How do you broaden your gaming horizons on a budget? - On a budget? - Buy old games. - Yeah. - There you go. - I mean- - I mean, it's pretty much that simple, like. - Even on, like, Steam or something, you can find some older PC games that will run on a lot of computers that are still good and way different than what you might play. And yeah, go find an old Xbox games or old PS2 games. - I mean, if nothing else, all those fucking top 10 or 50 or 100 lists that you see all the time can be good as a way to introduce yourself to other games. - Yeah. I would go look at that. - Or if you know if, you know, if you haven't- - Oh, so drugs. - If you have either of the next gen systems, I would say, I mean, definitely do not neglect their arcade offerings, you know, whether it's the PSN. - Oh yeah, yeah, you play a lot of crazy games. - Xbox Live Arcade, I mean, both of those places have great, great games to check out. - Yeah, and I mean, even if you have a PSP too, you know, you can check out some old PS1 games and stuff nowadays. - And at, you know, at first I thought he was asking, like, what console do we think is more conducive to like a budget-friendly gaming experience. And I'd have to say the PC, man, I mean, just the amount of the way how cheaper games are on PC, the amount of free games- - Initial and bigger initial expense, but. - Yeah, yeah, bigger upfront, but. - And more game games, yeah. - Baz Taylor asks, do games need to be innovative? Like Portal to get perfect scores and/or do high quality and not new games? Like Uncharted 2, ever deserve a 10 out of 10. - I mean, Uncharted doesn't do all that much that's new. It just does a lot of things that have been done before, but it doesn't really, really, really well. - Yeah, I mean, Uncharted has gotten perfect scores. It seems like he's implying that it didn't, I mean, at the name. - So did GTA 4 and GTA 4 didn't really do anything different from that. The old GTA games did some of those things better. It did, like, it refined them. I mean, I don't think you have to do, obviously you don't. I mean, I've never given an A+ to anything. And I'm not saying that I'm like the teacher that never gives out the grade. I've just never had something that-- - Yeah, you've never been put on a review. - I have a few games like that, yeah, but they're not in ones that I got written in. - Yeah. - Yeah. - Like Bioshock got a lot of perfect scores. - Yeah. - Bioshock got a ton of perfect scores. - Which, dude, that almost did dun-dun-dun-dun-dun-dun-dun. It went pah-pah-pah-pah-pah-pah-pah. (grunts) - Hi, I'm sorry. I ate greasy food for lunch. Uh, I don't think games have to be innovative. I think it helps like a game doing something. - Yeah, I mean, I don't even think did Portal get perfect scores. - Portal got a lot of perfect scores. - Yeah, yeah, I thought Portal, I gave five-- - I mean, it doesn't hurt that Portal as part of the Orange box got a lot of extremely high scores. Portal by itself did get-- - Right, yeah. Portal by itself, I wouldn't have given it a perfect score. - Really? - Shh, yeah. - Why not? - I don't know. - Well, how could-- - Well-- - How much did Portal cost in it sound like 15? - Well, now we're getting the value proposition. - Yeah, but I don't typically go with value prepositions unless it's extremely low. - How could-- Ow, and I'm not even saying this. - I mean, Portal was a three and a half, four-hour game. I don't understand that. - Amazing puzzle game. Great story, concise. - Funny. - Funny? - Yes. Yes. One of the most like chilling moments of video games ever. I've ever had it feel it in your bones. Like when you think about a game back, you're like, yeah, I probably wouldn't have given that a perfect score. - Really? - Like, yeah, you know? - Yeah. - I don't know. - I mean, is there anything that you can think of other than fucking outcast? - I don't even think I'd give out cast for a score. I'd give an outcast of 4.5 out of five. - You were a joyless human being with a lot of gas. - I'm sorry. - I mean, I-- - You sound like the inside of the Antline Caves dude, right? - I think a game just needs to be, a game should be uniquely its own or just to cheat, like, just execute on something just so fantastically well. - Right, that's exactly. Like Borderlands does the things that a lot of different games does, but it does them well. Like, sometimes it's just about-- - But I didn't get any-- I haven't seen any perfect scores. - No, but I'm just saying it's about doing things well if it makes a good game. Like, a game can be completely derivative, but if it just refines those things and does them so well that you just have fun the whole time. - I think buzz-- - It is all about fun. - I think buzz is fixating on perfect scores, though. - Yeah, and I don't call them perfect scores, either. - Full credit. - Yeah, it's like, I mean, it's shorthand. You know, we don't mean perfect as in the game as flawless. - Yeah, so it's like a mezz-nomer. 'Cause if you think like that, then there is no perfect score games, and yeah, it's not true. - Yeah, what we mean to say is that-- - I don't know, I mean, just like, something that assaults you in every way possible that you can't think of any other score to give it. - I don't know, I might've given-- I might have given Ratchet and Clank Future a perfect score. - Perfect score. - That game literally, when I-- Literally, that game-- - Literally, literally. - When I played, when I played it, that was a game that floored me up. - No, avoiding adverbs in general is just a good policy. - Yeah, adverbs, yeah, not adjectives, sorry. - Definitely is another one that I see a lot that I try to fucking-- - Right, or even saying really, I really enjoyed this. You can say I enjoyed this, you know. But yeah, but Ratchet and Clank was a game that, like, I went into knowing nothing about it, picked it up on a whim, and it just floored me with how much I enjoyed it. Like, that I could-- - Were you literally on the floor with how good it was? - No, I'm doing that, but you can say floored me, and it doesn't mean that it took you to the floor. - I know, but it's both your balls. - I'm saying literally. - Yeah, I don't know, I mean, like I said, by a shock, 'cause the game that I can think of, the first game of the world got a lot of perfect scores because it did the cover mechanic with something that-- - But-- - I haven't really been dumb like that. - Savvy listeners will then point out that I just said I might have given Ratchet and Clank a five, but I also said Uncharted 2 is the best PS3 exclusive, and I'm like, give it a 4.5. So, I revised that. Yeah, no, I'm just kidding, I don't, I don't give a shit. I don't know. - Yeah. - I mean, game scores don't exist in a vacuum. - Yeah, and not only that, but I also kind of think about Ratchet and Clank much more fondly than I'm sure if I went back and played, I'm sure they're, you know, it's different when you play your game and you review it right then. You can remember the things that were good, the things that were not. Ratchet and Clank, I just remember being good, but I know that it wasn't always, you know, start to finish great. Continuing. - Scooby-Gee asks, what are some emotionally powerful games? Did it have any major laugh cry I think, et cetera, and why? - Yeah, definitely. - Little misty at the end of Lucidity, actually. - Really? - There's, I found it very moving. - I don't know, I had some, I guess some parts and Beyond Good and Evil that I thought were kind of moving. - Just because that game really combined like awesome music with like epic moments in the game, like our set piece that was like a big battle and then like maybe a character that you'd, 'cause they had such really well-developed characters that when one of them got hurt or something like that, it was actually kind of a big deal. Yeah, it takes that certain level of like, you know, for me to get emotionally touched there has to be characters that have been developed into being actual people. - Yeah, for me, like two recent games that had any sort of, you know, emotional pull on me would be the two you ate of games, Eco and Shadow of the Colossus. - Yeah, those didn't have any effect on it. - Really, I mean, that's not true, I mean, to be some extent like because the giants in a way were made some majestic, like whenever you killed one, it was like the sense of triumph but it was almost like the sense of regret. - And then not only that, but like after, did you notice after each giant you killed your body, became more and more decomposed, like the clothes you were wearing became more, like you're the complexion of your skin became more pale like towards the end you almost were like green. - The obvious game though that affected me emotionally was the end of Half Life 2 episode 2. - Ooh, that one was true, man, that one. - I actually got kind of a little messed up. - Man. - 'Cause I was like, just 'cause the voice acting at the very end of that is like really good. - With Alex sobbing. - Yeah, and her sobbing beyond even the credits coming up and you're just like, man, what's gonna stop? - Yeah. - That's like a really powerful moment in the game. - I mean, the end of half of my sword was kind of sad. - Yeah, the end of my sword. - For a lot of games though, like it's like, I haven't played Shadow of the Colossus. I gotta say it straight up 'cause I just- - Surprising. - Like the interest didn't occur to me at the time I came out. - And Arthur didn't have a piece too. - Yeah, I mean, at the time I didn't have a piece too. But even then like my interest in like the story and like the sort of like the weird narrative idea that you're destroying these sort of innocent creatures as a means to try to save something that matters only to you. Like that interests me but on an academic level more than sort of an emotional level. - Yeah. - And that's like, that's most games like with interesting stories. Like they don't affect me emotionally. It's like an academic. - Yeah. Half-Life 2 is probably the one I can think of most vividly. - Well, Shadow of the Colossus to be clear, it wasn't the exact story. It was your relationship with your horse. That was 'cause there's some things and things. - Yeah. - It's like a never-ending story kind of thing. - I mean, anytime they build up a pet with you and then they threaten it or hurt it. - Yeah. - And when they killed my dog and fabled too. - Oh, say I didn't know your dog died. - Neither did I. (both laugh) - You just killed our fucking dogs in our minds. - I mean, you can bring it back. - Basically. - Like there's just sacrifices to be made. - Aw, shit, bird. - Right. - I mean, yeah. - I mean, that actually, like I was upset when they killed my dog and fabled too. - Yeah, all right, let's move on. I mean, we could probably think of them, but we'd have to sit there. - Mitchie D asks, "How does preview coverage?" - Okay. - Fuck that guy. Mitchie D, friend of the podcast. "How does preview coverage affect your thought process while playing games for work otherwise, if at all?" - I don't know if I've previewed the game, maybe it affects it, but I'm gonna be honest. There are very few writers out there that I actually read their shit. Most people shit, I don't care. I don't wanna read your stuff. - Typically, the stance on that, I respect the most, is that if someone has previewed a game once or twice, chances are they won't review it. - Yeah, unless, I mean, it's kind of a case-by-case person feeling out certain writers too. Like, there are certain people that I would feel 100% comfortable, even if they did preview it. But yeah, there are some people that it's obvious that it's like, okay, yeah, no, you're not reviewing this game. Like, based off your previews, there's like no way I could take your review seriously. Because I could write your review right now for you in order to sign a score. - Like, I'm sure people can think of reviewers that would write reviews for games coming out this year that you would just, like, not even read it or not even take it seriously. - Right. - Like, because if they reviewed that game, there would just be no, like, credibility whatsoever. - Right. - But, I don't know, like, I would prefer not to write a review for a game that I wrote a preview for. - Yeah, yeah, I mean, in general, I hate writing previews to begin with, unless I'm gonna get away to read a really cool angle with the writing standard previews. - Oh, they're kind of fun. - Why don't you cry about it? - I do. Every day at my desk. - Ah. - Anyways. - I enjoyed the DJ hero preview I wrote. - Well, yeah, when you're getting to see a game for the first time, that's true, too. - That's really cool. - But when it's, like, a game that, like, gonna reveal, these are all different. - Right, and this almost jumps back into what we were talking about earlier is, like, using gaming sites as basically, like, journalism or, like, PR whores. - Yeah. - He also had a secondary part of that. Do writers preconceived notions of a game affect reviews? Yes. Yes, they do. - I mean, inevitably, reviews are completely subjective. - He mentions Brutal Legend in particular. He says that the Brutal Legend acclaim confuses him. And I mean, I did discuss that a little bit that I'm surprised about the scores of it. - I mean, I just think that, to some extent, that happens with every big release, where, especially sequels, where, like, a sequel has been really great, and I'm not, like, you know, the obvious ones to think of are things like Halo, or GTA, or, you know, any of these games that have big block, or even Call of Duty Marble 4 2, where the game is such critical acclaim, you know, there's a certain expectation that it's going to be this great, because the one was so good before. - Okay, so I have a question for us then. Excluding Halo and Grand Theft Auto 4, what is the game this generation that extremely positive reviews have confused you the most on? Is there a better way for me to phrase that? What game have you seen amazingly positive reviews on? - Yeah, the review really well, and you were like, I don't understand that. - Yeah. - I will go first. Twilight Princess. - Yeah, I mean, Twilight Princess, I played a couple hours of it, and I mean, maybe it's just, I mean, it's not for me. I don't even say maybe it's not for me. I did not enjoy it. Metroid Prime. I don't-- - That's not this trend. - Oh, sorry, 'cause it's just got released on Trilogy. - And it doesn't really count. - Okay. - And you can't say Metroid Prime 3 now either. - Well, Metroid Prime, the one that came out for Wii. - Nope. - That came out this gen. - Not a laugh. - All right. - I can think of one that we've talked about before, but-- - Well, you should name it. - Well, you've talked about Metal Gear Solid 4. - Right, I mean, Metal Gear Solid 4 is one that, that one I feel like that was definitely certain people's expectations. Like I said, like it's like what it's talking about, where we're franchise expectations that are like, no, it's just good. - You literally didn't understand how that could get such high scores. - Yeah, I literally didn't understand. I read about it and I thought about it and I-- - I really didn't. - No, and right afterwards, my fingers literally began to bleed. So. - Tyler. - Yeah, I don't know, man. I mean, because, you know, like Metal Gear 4 comes to mind, but not that I was surprised that it was getting, you know, A's and 10's or whatever, but maybe, I don't know, maybe 9.5's or four, you know, four stars out of five. I don't know. - How 'bout what? - I'm surprised I reviewed as well as it did. - Did that review well? - It is, I mean, it's in the high 70's, low 80's. - They reviewed well enough. - Like when I was playing that game, I thought to myself, this game is going to be an F's. - Maybe because my mind was going to triple A titles and it wasn't, I was-- - Yeah, I mean, why doesn't something people have really talked about? - Yeah, okay. - Did you can't think of anything? - You know, no, that's getting really high scores that I just, I mean, I could definitely think of games that I'm just not interested in that get high scores, but not games that-- - Fair enough. - I'm having a mind blank too, and I know if I just went and looked at like, you know, looked at games that have gotten way too high of scores, like just looking down the list. I don't know. I can't think of any else to help my head, but yes, I know there are some, but I'm spacing out on it right now. I'm going to continue to think about it while you read more topics. - Um, this is a current issue. Adamverse says, do you think Infinity Ward's lack of dedicated servers from Modern Warfare 2 plus paid DLC for PC signals to death of PC gaming? Two things, Adamverse. First of all, they have not said that there aren't going to be dedicated servers, they're only going to be private servers. There are no private servers. Second of all, you forgot to mention that it's $60 on PC plus paid DLC. - It's that much on PC? - Yep. - Usually the PC ones don't they tend to be 50? - Exactly. - Yeah. - That is Activision saying that they can do it. - No, man, there is no death of the PC dog. - Yeah, yeah. - That ain't gonna happen. - I look at various MPD numbers and there are still a lot of PC games that are selling millions upon millions of dollars each month that are not World of Warcraft and Sims. - Okay, I was about to say, I was about to say. - And not only that, just the... All the games that we have no tracking data for, you know, like games that maybe not even be available through popular things like Steam or something, you know. It's like community games. - Yeah. - I feel like right now, and this is sort of uncovered today actually in the news cycle with the whole rebuttals to Randy Pitchford's Steam rant for developers saying that Steam is a good thing. Like, I feel like with Steam, Steam is sort of popularized digital distribution in a way that other companies didn't. And that sort of created a sort of mini renaissance for popularly accessible independent games. - Like think about, you know, a game that comes to mind a killing floor, right? This is a zombie shooter? - Yeah. - You know, I don't know how like, you know, say if Steam weren't around, never existed. I don't know how popular a game like that would be without, you know, these sort of things. And so it's like, of course not, the PC is not dying. You know, the, it's evolving different. - I have a better example to Xeno Clash. There's another game that's done surprisingly well on Steam this year that's an independently made first person like- - That's the first person brawler? - Yeah, like with some shooting elements, it's like in Unreal Engine 2.5 or whatever. They're actually making an Xbox live version. - Yes, that's right, okay. - So no, I don't think that signals the death of PC gaming and I think that that game will still sell quite a few copies on PC. - Of course. - I just think, I mean, I think that people are freaking out about that stuff, but it's such a, it's gonna be such a small minority of people. - Right, I mean, they're freaking out about just 'cause it's different. Let me people, or does this change? - Because consoles are becoming so popular. - I mean, and the biggest thing is that if it kills the ability to do modded things, people don't like that. I mean, PC modders are a very vocal minority. I mean, they're extremely vocal. - Dude, but okay, but now we're talking about like really high level franchises. Like, I'm completely ignorant. Can people mod like, well yeah, they can mod World of Warcraft, right? But they can't mod in like, I mean, they're private World of Warcraft servers that are not, you know, like a part of Blizzard. - Oh, okay. - It's free to play, but you play with like an extremely limited amount of people and it's illegal to do that. - Oh, okay. - I mean, being a-- - But I mean, being a serious, intelligent person could mod most anything, whether it's legal or how difficult that is or how other people could play is another thing. So, certain games are easier to mod than others, yeah. - I guess like where my mind is going with this is, is there a certain threshold of a game's like, popularity or, you know, when so many people want to play the game, do they have to kind of say like, okay, we need to make it more accessible to people. So, there are some things we have to trim back on. - I mean, I don't know. - You know, like Team Fortress 2 or other Valve games are super popular and they really-- - That's true. - Because it's extremely mod-able. - Yeah. - I mean, it just comes down to, I think in the future, it'll just come down to a case-by-case of developers. - And Infinity Ward is in sort of a position right now where they can kind of do it. - Let's play like-- - I feel like it's Activision. - Team Fortress 2 isn't necessarily the greatest example of a PC game that can sell well because of the way that it was released and sold and marketed. Like, that is the most aggressively a AAA game has been marketed and priced that I can think of in the last several years. - Right, and I mean, that makes sense 'cause Team Fortress doesn't have a single player campaign or anything like that. - Well, I mean, if it was released as part of the Orange Box, like it's sold by itself for what, like 20 or 30? - Right, I mean, again, this is why I think it'll come down to a case-by-case thing with developers, like in Activision, it's like-- - But you know what, dude, this is not an Activision thing actually 'cause from what my impression from the story was that Infinity Ward is kind of doing a blizzard thing where they're setting up their own, like thing. - Oh, yeah, it's a lot of you get the login to their thing. - Yeah. I mean, the company of heroes, just something similar. - Yeah, to me, it seems like, you know, Infinity Ward just wants to call their shots. I mean, do you-- - Like they've said flat out. - There are servers for company heroes, like really, but you do go through their service. So, and as far as I know, like, I don't know how moddable company heroes is, but if it is that moddable, I don't think many people do it, you know? - I mean, like, the people from Infinity Ward have flat out said, like, we are doing this for the majority of players and said that it was hard for them to find games on PC or hard for them to get into games where they felt like they could play and have fun-- - People of their rank. Like, like, this is their response to that. I mean, it's introducing the Xbox Live sort of matchmaking and player ranking. - Let's do one or two more. - Some Salute says, is there any space for a fourth console? I don't think so. - There's part of me that wishes because I like to buy things, but-- - Like the GPX or whatever that's been sitting on your desk. - You're not powered on or charged for months? - Well, it's charged, but I'm actually gonna end up giving that to a friend of mine to put a bunch of shit on 'cause he's, like, really familiar with it. So, I just want it to play-- - Is that Brian? - Yeah. It is Brian. My friend Brian, who's very savvy with all things like that. - Yeah, I don't know. I feel like three is sort of the magic number. - Yeah. - Like, it's the ecosystem. - Yeah, I feel like it's been-- - Gives it every time three constantly. - That's the demonstrate. - It's repeatedly. - Yeah. - And actually, it's sort of a miracle that three consoles are, I mean, assuming that prior to the PS3 price cut, you considered the PS3 business healthy. Assuming you think that, I think it's amazing that three consoles are co-existing. - I mean, yeah, I don't even think three consoles can co-exist anymore if they were all going for the same strategy of releasing all the games. - Yeah, yeah, I was gonna bring up that point. - The week very clearly has a different version of each game. - Yeah. - I mean, which is why it was a good idea on Nintendo's part. - Right. - Because, honestly, like, it just flat out. I don't think Nintendo would have survived if they had tried to compete with Microsoft and Sony. - I mean, they might have survived. They wouldn't have been profitable, though. I mean, Nintendo's made money. Nintendo's only, you know, hasn't been in the-- - I think they would have been marginalized to the point of irrelevance. - Right, and, you know, I mean, yeah. So, I don't know that there's even room for three that are all doing the same thing anymore, but, you know. I mean, there basically is three if you count PC. But, 'cause PC and PS3, I mean, the disparity between the type of games they offer are very small. At this point, unlike previously-- - Well, the question was specifically consoles, so. - Yeah. - He said. - Yeah, sometimes I just think about it as a platform. - Yeah. - You don't think 'cause the platform is its own platform. - Yeah. - Let's do one more. - Um. - Bish! - That was my lightning sound effect. (humming) (laughing) - Mad Max, Mad Max asks, and I suppose this is pertinent with Saw just coming out. Horror and video games, what makes them great, not great history of the horror genre, and if they were acceptable for the format. Generally, horror and video games doesn't work very well, in my opinion. - You don't think so? - I think that there are some games that-- - There are very few games that manage to pull off. - But here's what I wanna say. I think video games are well suited for that sort of fright, because you can even go as far back as like, NES, Friday the 13th, and just the music and darker graphics, got me a little scared as a kid. - The game that's still to this day is the scariest game that actually had moments that actually scared me is still silent, two, two specifically. Like, because, you know, three and four, and even five to some extent, like then I understood the formula, and I understood when things might attack me and stuff, but because two was like that first time I ever really did that, and it was different from Resident Evil, in the sense that, you know, that they never really empowered you that much with guns, and so there's so much of it that's immediately focused, and so much of that game really focuses on darkness. So I guess for me, that also comes into play because I have an innate fear of darkness. - Anthony, you kind of have like a problem with scary games too. - Right, I mean, oh, and actually, yeah, I mean, I do think that games can be genuinely scary. Like, there's, I can name specific moments to settle to this game, but actually the scariest game I've ever played is Penumbra Black Plague by Paradox. It's like a PC game. You can find it for like 20 bucks now, and that one's all physics based, and that one's terrifying to me because they never give you a way to defend yourself. There's no melee attacks, there's no guns. The only time you'll ever get past things is you have to use like physics, like block a door, and even when you block a door, eventually that enemy could probably punch through it. So it's all about hiding, and actually, now this reminds me, another game that does that really well is I reviewed it for PSN. You know, it's like that game, it's like a real PS3 game. It's fatal, not fatal frame, but uh... - Siren. - Siren, blood curse. - Yeah, that game, like there are certain levels where they gave you a weapon, and when they gave you a weapon, the scariest went all the way 'cause you were empowered to the point where you could kill things. But when the level's like where you played like, there's like this one level where you play as this little girl, and this character that you were rolling with earlier in the game has now turned into one of the monsters, but the monsters all still talk like people, but they have like this weird demon voice the whole time, and he's walking around being like, "Hey, where are you? "I just wanna help you." And it's like, and you're like sneaking from like locker to locker and hiding from him, and there might be times that he sees you, he's like, "There you are!" And he's like coming after you, and you just like have to man, that shit got to me. - I mean, to be fair though, there aren't a lot of horror movies that I find scary either, like... - Yeah. - Like I'm trying to think of the last time, like I recently saw a paranormal activity. - I mean the best, the best horror games in my opinions aren't necessarily scary in the, like where you jump like in a haunted house type thing, as much as they are, that they just make you tension. Yeah, the suspense is just there all the time. - I mean, I feel like Dead Space did a good job of that in a lot of spots. I actually found Doom 3 really scary, but a lot of that was just the way that it used surround sound to fuck with you, and do really screwed up shit. - Right, and actually not gonna lie, when I played the original fear back in the day, for its time when it was brand new, that actually scared me at times. So, 'cause that, and you know, another, if man, think about scary. - Right, so I've been thinking about it all the time. - Condemned actually shakes up a lot of people. - Yeah, and condemned, too. - Because a lot of the whole bucket gets kicked over, but you don't see a guy, like I know something's coming. - And in condemned, too, they add the sort of aspect where you're not sure if what you're seeing is real, or not, sometimes. - Right, and another game that actually scared me going even older is the first Alien versus Predator game for PC, where you're like playing as a human, and there's like 10 minutes to go by before you ever actually see an Alien. But there's all these points with like, just like in the Aliens movies where there's like a pipe that looks like it could be an Alien, and you think it is, and then it's not, and you're like, "Oh, Jesus Christ, "I was ready for that to be an Alien," and it wasn't. Now I don't know what I'm too expecting. Yeah, it's all about tension. - So, I mean, I guess, yeah, horror games can be good, but it's more about creating tension that jumpscares. - Yeah, it almost feels like horror's like the wrong name for it, it's like the tension genre. - Right, yeah. - Yeah, I mean, I never actually feel like, necessarily, an intense feeling of horror where I'm like, "Oh, no, I have to drop my controller." So, as much as I just need to like, go out and have a cigarette or something afterwards, I don't even smoke. - What was the boss in Resident Evil 2? Was that Nemesis? I don't know, I would, I'd probably be getting you on. - It was the doctor. - The guy that would chase you around? Oh, Resident Evil 2, I mean, he uses the Nemesis or something. - Yeah. - That one would scare the shit out. I mean, anytime you're fighting something that's like, relentless and you can't stop it, you just have to get away. - I think that naturally inspires that point, that part of humans is the fight or flight thing and when you realize that fighting is an option, you're just like, "I need to get away and let's get it close." - Yeah, like, just like that. - Yeah. - And on that note, we're taking very competitive footage. (upbeat rock music) ♪ I guess what I was ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ Yeah ♪ ♪ Like you're fast ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ ♪ You don't know 'cause you're so weird ♪ - I can't believe you can do this. - No, no, no, just hold on. - Oh, just, you can cut all this. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. - What's the great word? Okay. - Two mocks bucks. - Hi, we're back, hi, we're back. Two mocks bucks? - Two mocks bucks. - Two mocks bucks. Hello, and welcome back to our letter segment. The first letter is from Marco. And Marco says, "I just wanted to get your opinion on a topic "that has become quite visible recently. "Members of the gaming press are more and more frequently "posting their opinions on a game via Twitter "well ahead of their release dates. "The most recent example of this has been Borderlands "and the upcoming WWE SmackDown vs. Raw title. "Is this such a good idea? "I'm asking because Twitter being such a public forum, "it's more likely that someone from the developer "a publisher will contact you to get more information "on your thoughts or make suggestions "about something you made light of in a tweet. "There's certainly a difference between talking "about a public demo, but when you're making mention "of an unreleased game, you may accidentally mention "something that you shouldn't. "So in other words, should the members of the video game "press talk about stuff they are viewing before it is "published and made available to the public? "Along those same line, okay, blah, blah." - Dude. - You know, I do think that you have to be careful, especially with Twitter, because I do think that people are sometimes, and this actually is not any of us. I'll clarify that right off the bat. 'Cause I know Arthur's mind is like, he's talking about me, but I'm not. Actually, but there are people that I think are far too flippant about the things that they say on Twitter sometimes that I'm like, we both read that embargo. What are you thinking? - Yeah, I mean, certain people don't seem to care or they're just, I find that being vague helps. - Yeah. - Like, you can't tell, you can't embargo on emotion. - Yeah, this guy asks, he says that we've made light on embargoes and limitations for games you get access to. But we don't, actually. I take embargoes extremely seriously. - I mean, they're fired for breaking messages. - There's been times I've even asked Arthur to curb what he says sometimes, 'cause I'm just worried. Like, I'm paranoid. I just don't want someone to get mad at me. Like, you know, 'cause-- - Yeah, I mean, on the press side, it's just not cool to your other fellow press folks to-- - Right, if they're sticking to an embargo, they're really strict and all of a sudden, you break something, it's like-- - Yeah, no, I mean, you scoop just by being a dick. - Anytime I've ever been specific, it's generally been stuff that was within the preview. - Embargoes, yeah, if it's within the, hey, that's fair game. - Right, and when people talk about borderlands before it comes out or something, you know, or like, people talking about uncharted in detail, that's because the embargo for Uncharted, like to talk about it with scores, was like up two weeks before it came out. - Yeah. - Man, but one of the, what are you gonna say, sir? - Well, no, I didn't like the most specific thing I said about borderlands, like, in particular, was that the control options were not to my liking, like, and that's not really breaking content. That's like-- - Anything. - That I would consider. - You know, like, saying that softball sticks doesn't mean that people want to shoot with the left trigger isn't breaking embargo. - Yeah. Although I do have to say, like, coming from the press side, like, what I love about Twitter is it's also become sort of the global water cooler where, like, a lot of developers are, like, spilling the beans inadvertently or Mario, the voice actor of Mario, or, like, you know, people just posting shit they shouldn't be. - Right, and when there's that much interconnectivity and people assume that they have a certain degree of anonymity that they don't, like, if people want to hunt you down and because they think you might reveal something, it's not that hard. I mean, you have to be really careful, like, for us, it's not as big of a deal. 'Cause if we let slip a little bit of opinion without a score or something, that's not that bad. But when you let slip something that's, like, confirming that a game is being made or something like that, like, like recently. - Yeah, like, like breaking embargo on an announcement for something? - Right, like, Sean Elliott would never Twitter about, like, man, working on a cool game. The game I'm working on, we really made a breakthrough with X. - Jesus Christ, Sean Elliott is, like, the most paranoid person I've ever met when it comes to talking about the stuff he's working on. And I understand that because everyone wants to know what that company is working on and no one knows, but... - Yeah, so, Rob writes in and he says, he lives in the small apartment after weighing his options. He realized that 5.1 headphones are the only sensible wave for him to get a surround sound. Do you guys mention the past shows that this isn't a bad solution for gaming when you don't want to wake your neighbors or break the bank on a flubone speaker receiver system that you can get fucking headsets that are just... - Yeah, that are equally... - I gave them a PS360 and occasionally on the Wii, money isn't a huge issue and wireless would be nice. The two that I'm looking at right now aren't wireless, but they seem to get relatively high marks. The first is the Astro A40 audio system, which is what I use for my PC and I like it a lot. And the other is the Triton AX720, the one that's sitting in a box on the floor. - I mean, I guess I could test that out. - I mean, I've used them. I used them at the Bioshock event. And actually, I was like, I don't think there's comfortable. - You were floored and stunned. - I don't think there is comfortable as the Astro ones. Like at all the Astro ones. - Really, I thought they were, I tried them on and they were pretty comfortable. - Yeah, but the Astro ones, I mean, the Astro ones are really comfortable. - The thing that I like about them is that they cover my ears as opposed to only covering the hole. - That is the nice thing. Both the Astro's and those AX ones from a Triton, they both cover your hole here. - The Triton, those were the ones that had it packs, right? That a lot of places had it. - They also had Astro and Triton's. - Really? Those were good. - Yeah, but the Tritons I liked a lot actually, I was surprised 'cause even though I was in this crazy event for Bioshock, this round was still good enough that I could actually hear. Like I was like, oh, that really is behind me into my left. - But you know what? I would also suggest that I use and though it's not surround sound, I have some Bose headsets. The ones you put in your ears, they were about like 60, 70 bucks or something. And they're really good because they have really good base frequencies. - Right, but the good thing about though, that I don't know about the Triton ones and the Astro's for PS3, but I do know that like they'll give you the sound you want on Wii and both the Tritons and the Astro's will allow you to chat. They also have a cable that can, so you can listen to the headphones and chat through that same headset. - Yeah, there was 360 and PS3, they have USB hookups. - So yeah, so I mean, the ability to be able to chat is red and have it all through that one headset, so you don't have to be a tool and more two headsets at once. Yeah, both of those are good option wireless, you're gonna be a lot more limited if you actually want to be able to chat as well. - And I'll say it to worry about like battery life and all that stuff, I mean. - I mean, solutions exist, it's just much more expensive. - Yeah. - He just, there was one person that wrote in named Jared and he just said, I'll skip the metaphorical ball fondling and say that Arthur is 100% right, shaving his head. I too suffer from a case of receding God hate and after shaving my head. - I think that's not receding God hate. - Or free. - That's like expanding God hate. (laughing) - No more hairs on the pillow, no more expensive shampoo and best of all, the ladies love to run their hands over my sleek, co-check haircut. So I would be like-- - I find the girls actually like fuzz. - So I would like to be on the forefront of congratulating Arthur for letting go of the hair and not trying to grasp onto it, like so many pathetic stadium domes. - That's like four years, four years too late, but thank you. - I mean, you know, Bolic is really becoming on some guys, like I-- - Like, you know who's hot with it, Bruce Wells. - Yeah, but there goes one. - Jason Statham. - Statham. - Statham. - He looks good with the shave dead. - I was thinking Elwapo was free. - Contrary to what some people say, Jason Statham is definitely going bald and that's what he shaded to say. - Yeah, let's be clear. I'm making myself sound really gay right now and you know, I can just appreciate when guys are good looking bald heads. - Okay. - They look-- - I don't think it sounds gay. - Yeah. - I'm comfortable enough with my sexuality to say that like say Brad Pitt is a good looking dude. Brad Pitt is a good looking dude. - Brad Pitt's like an anomaly of human beings that looks good no matter what. Like, you know, he could shave his head bald and you'd be like, I have whatever, he's still Brad Pitt. - I mean, he was in, he was shaved and fight club and 12 monkeys, wasn't he? - Yeah, towards the end, yeah. I mean, I, you know, I know a lot of girls that actually have said, yes, I like Brad Pitt, even when he was crazy, 12 monkeys guy, like-- - That's so dirty in that movie. - So, sorry, I keep itching myself 'cause the goddamn fleas in her house. 'Cause we live in a goddamn shit hole. - Anthony's cat gets out and brings them back in. She's so fucking bad, like laid back right now. - Sorry, I'm skipping relationship questions. - Chillin' Dylan right here. - Because, you know, people get angry with us. - It's good too, man, and we need, I'm done with them too. - Okay, this is a letter mostly for me, but also for all of us, he says it's a Star Wars question. - Yo. - I always admire your immense level of Star Wars and I want you to tell me even though it's not that immense. - How are you gonna assume that? - 'Cause he says, Anthony. Even if it has few real world applications, that's very true. That seems like a backhand accompaniment, but I mean, I have nerd envy for people who can totally commit themselves to learning all the minutia of a fictional universe. - You shouldn't, you really shouldn't. You should look up to people that can tell you about the Roman Empire. - This guy should watch Monster Camp. That's what this guy should do. He would find peers. - Here's my question for you though. Knowing all you know about how awesome the Star Wars universe is, does it bum you out to know facts about indoor? Like how Matt's sorrow is canon or that you walks are not only adorable, are not the only adorable Muppet creature that calls indoor home. Like do-locks, which look like they were designed specifically to be colored on Star Wars placemats at Denny's. I'm gonna be honest with you, I did not know anything about Mt. Sora or do-locks. - You know what? - So if I just crushed your dreams. - Is that from the Battle of Endor or whatever? - Maybe. - Dude, I agree with this guy, 'cause I just got through reading that chronology of Star Wars that you let me borrow. And towards the end of the story when Leia already has her children and they are sort of force enabled. There's this creature they meet and there's even illustrations of it in the book in the book and it turns out to be a Jedi and it has these long floppy ears and it basically looks like a rabbit with big eyes and I was just thinking to myself, dude, that's so embarrassing. That's so embarrassing. - Why is that embarrassing? - They just look the lame as fuck. It looked like straight up that style of children's cartoons from when that book was published was probably like 1996, '97. I mean it just looked like some illustrator created that character right then and there and it was just like, man, this doesn't even look like it fits in, I don't know. Like I-- - I'm just a sine way too much to all of that, like too much. - I don't mind the Ewoks. I like the Ewoks are cool, but that little rabbit thing that was a fucking Jedi that would yield a lightsaber, come on, give me a break. - The Force does not discriminate. (laughs) - All right, I looked at the letters, most of the rest were just relationships where there was the leprechaun one that wrote in. - Someone tweeted asking when I sold out to the Greens. - I don't even know what that means. 'Cause you said you're done with leprechauns. 'Cause you're trying to-- - 'Cause Arthur got a bunch of gold teeth. - I ain't got no gray one. - It's smear campaign. Yeah, Arthur's-- - Did I even say that on the podcast that I'm over the leprechaun thing? - Yeah, I think so. - Did I? - Yeah, you did, sir. - Well, in case I didn't, I'm sort of leprechauned out. - Yeah, I don't know if he feels better. - I'm feeling a bit memed. - I think they got him just where they want him. - Mm, he's gonna be like guard down. - Next two months from now, he's gonna quit the show and move to Montana. Anyways, thank you for listening to Rebel FM. You should also listen to our other Hammer Suit Partners podcast, which is the mobcast at bitmob.com, as well as the Geekbox at geekbox.net. - You're gonna really get it not saying the Geekbox stuff. - And then you should also listen to the Game Spidey Briefings. You wanna hear me more of me and Ryan Scott, which you can see at gamespy.com, or you can find at the Game Spidey Briefings on iTunes. The latest one had Jeff Green. So that might be-- - Are you recording the Briefing tomorrow? - Yeah, we are, which is the 100th episode of the debriefings, and I think if we record tomorrow, it's supposedly gonna have Patrick Joint, Karen Chews has been on it, and founder of that podcast. So-- - Oh, that makes sense. - So yeah, you can find me at twitter.com/Jeffmany as well as my reviews, previews, et cetera at gamespy.com. You can find Tyler at gamespy.com. - For news, as well as twitter.com/DirtyT. - You need to update your fucking Twitter. - You don't have to, Tyler. - No, you have to. - I'm scared, I am literally afraid to-- - Do it from your Mac. - I'm afraid. - Man, Twitter's over with, Tyler, we're-- - Tyler has had a PC for four months and has already destroyed it with a virus. - And my sister's had that laptop for two months and she destroyed the virus. Where can the internet find you, Arthur? - Twitter.com/eegieess. - All right, I feel like there was something else I was supposed to mention, but I don't really know what it was, so my theory with that-- - You should watch co-op at area5.tv. - Yes, you should. - And the revision3.com/co-op. - I was on the latest issue of co-op, so you should, our video of co-op, talking about-- - Episode. - I like calling them issues though, it sounds cool. - Issues of co-op, so you should see that. - It's the season premiere. - And then also, you should listen to this week's Geek box as well, because I was also on there to bring their fucking nerd discussions down. No, I'm just kidding, I fucking dove head long into it. - What did you talk about? - Did they talk about loss? No, they didn't, actually. We talked about a lot of comic books, Star Wars stuff. I mean, it was actually stuff that I could participate in pretty heavily, so no loss, no burn notice this time. So, it was good for me. So yeah, thank you for listening, subscribe to us on iTunes, tell your friends about us, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music) (upbeat rock music)