The Drive with Jack
* Colton Pouncy, The Athletic Detroit
(upbeat music) - Jack, I believe you're my good friend, Matt Sloatt, grab a Volcomist, lots of excitement at the two dealerships. What's new with Chevy and Nissan? - Well, Jack, great question. At Nissan, everybody seems to be talking about interest rates. We're offering 0% financing on new vehicles, and we have the all new completely redesigned 2025 kicks on the lot and ready for delivery. It is fantastic. At Chevy, same thing. People are talking about interest rates. Guess what? We have 0% financing on new, and as low as 1.99 used. You gotta come check it out. - Great time to get a car and great place to do it. Grab a Volcomist. Great afternoon, Mid-Michigan and beyond, and welcome to the drive with Jack. It is a spotlight, a radio network. Jack, I'll be here with my producer, Boston Rob. 45 degrees here, beautiful day in Mid-Michigan, and Michigan State playing basketball as we speak. First half completed at Brosnan Center and a 13-point lead over Western Michigan, and the Detroit Lions in action tonight in Santa Clara against the 49ers. Rob, let's go right out to our guest line. Very happy to welcome in. Colton Pouncy covers the Lions for the athletic. Colton, what does this game really mean? I'm looking at the standings here, and I'm trying to figure out what the significance of this game is. - Yeah, I mean, if you told me in May that this game probably wouldn't mean much, I'd think you're crazy, 'cause these are two teams I've met for a chance to go to Super Bowl last year, but that's kind of where we're at right now. The 49ers have had some injuries, so they're not the same team that they once were. And the Lions, for a game like this, it all comes down to week 18, not week 17, so they can afford to lose a game like this and still accomplish everything they want to accomplish in the regular season next week. So it's kind of a weird deal. I don't know if I've ever seen this, or a game doesn't matter until the final week of the season. You know, I don't know, it's kind of a weird setup, but they got it, and we'll see how it goes tonight. - So the Lions are a half game behind Minnesota in the NFC North standings, but whether the Lions win or lose, as you say, it's all gonna come down to the week 18 matchup. Dan Campbell doesn't seem to be paying much attention to that. It seems determined to play and win. Do you think that's a good idea? - You know, I go back and forth a little bit, because, you know, in some ways, I get not wanting to stray away from what got you here, and that's going all out every week. And, you know, this team is 13 and two for a reason, and a lot of that has to do with Dan Campbell and how he's kind of led the ship here. But at the same time, I know it's weird, but like this game does not matter, and with the number of injuries they've had, you know, I think it would be smart to kind of rest some guys, not everyone. I know it's not really feasible, especially when you spend all week putting together a game, playing with certain guys in mind. But, you know, if you can rest some guys and pick your spots here and there and still get the win, I think that's kind of what you want to hope for. And, you know, Dan's going to go full out. I'm not sure if he's going to stick to that. Like, maybe they get a lead and they pull some guys, you know, second half, but as of now, he's playing to go and try to win this game. So we'll see what happens. Nicole, and if the Lions are leading, let's say 27 to 17, at the end of the third quarter, would you expect Jared Goff to go out there and just play like this is a championship game? One injury there, and what you mentioned how many they've already had, could derail everything. - Yeah, if that's the case, let's narrow your way down. I think he would still be in the game because one thing Dan told us this season is like, you know, he doesn't, he needs to feel that one, the guys are playing well, and two, the lead isn't really surmountable. You know, they're able to come back. 'Cause he saw, I think the Eagles, there's a game earlier this year where they were up, 22-0, maybe 20-0, something like that. I've got who they were playing, but they allowed the other team to come back and all of a sudden, like they scored two touchdowns in a matter of, you know, two minutes, something like that. So, yeah, I think it's going to depend on the lead. And obviously the 49ers have a pretty solid defense. So I don't know if it's going to be a game where, you know, like the Titans earlier this year, the Cowboys earlier this year. I don't know if it's going to be one of those games. So we could see the guys play it to the fourth quarter. It's just a matter of when he feels like it's the right time to pull those games and pull the guys from the game, I guess. - When Goth goes back to pass in the fourth quarter and Nick Bosa, whoever would be there for the Niners, is zeroing in on him, are you going to be apprehensive? Do you think the coaches will be, "Ooh." - I don't think they will. You know, they don't really, it's hard to account for injuries like that. And, you know, anything can happen, I guess, I'm going to give them play. But they're not going to games, expecting guys to get hurt. Especially the quarterback, like Jared Goff, who's been pretty healthy most of his career. But I imagine the fan base might be a little squirmish if they see him out there with, you know, five minutes left up, 14 or 17, something like that. All right, let's go back to last January and the scene of the crime, Michigan State. The Lions with a 24 to seven advantage at halftime. And everyone was thinking, "Okay, this is it. This is the year. Super Bowl, here we come." And then everything that could go wrong did go wrong in the second half. How much do you think that's played on the Lions' minds? Do you think they've talked about it? Do you think they've watched that game again? How do you deal with that? Yeah, you know, it's time for you to ask. A lot of guys after the previous game against the Bears, you know, St. Louis in the locker room saying like, yeah, I'm still mad at that game. It's one of the worst losses I've ever stopped for in my life. Like, I can't think of anything worse. You know, I want to win this game. You talked to him after that Bears game. He's like, all fired up. And then, you know, you get into the week and it's like, you know, it's just another game. You know, we got to, it's important because it's the next one. So then you have guys kind of backtracking a little bit. But based on the initial comments that we were hearing after that Bears game, those guys want to win that game for sure. Not just because of, you know, seating or whatever, tiebreaker potential or whatever, just because they want to beat the 49ers. And they're still a little upset about what happened here last year. And, you know, I don't want to call it a revenge game because like they blew it. They had a chance to win and go through one. They just weren't making the plays that they needed to make to win it. So I think it's more just trying to right some of those wrongs. And again, it's not the same. Like, it's not, it took to serve on the line. But if it can give you a little bit of closer or you could feel a little bit better about yourselves after a win then I think we'll try to go for it. Colton, one of the dumbest cliches that you hear in sports, it drives me absolutely nuts every time I hear it, is they all count one. And anyone who thinks that the loss to the 49ers last year in Levi Stadium has any relationship to the importance of this game. If you had a choice, you'd rather win that one 100 times before you'd rather win this one, right? Yeah, no doubt about it. I mean, that's the one that we were all booking, you know, looking at flights to Vegas at halftime of that game, then that that's going to be the one. But it wasn't meant to be. And they're trying to get back there this year and see if they can actually make it there this time. Did you get a chance to watch Minnesota and Green Bay yesterday? Part of it, I was on my plane kind of waiting for baggage and everything, but I caught like, I think it was 27, 10 when I stopped watching off the plane, I came back and it was 27, 25. And I was like, oh, OK, so that happened. So I was able to catch like the final couple minutes there. And I mean, honestly, the Vikings are a tough team, man. Like they got a lot of the grit mentality that the lines have just in a different like brand, I would say, in a weird way. But you see the locker room celebrations. They're, you know, lifting Sam Darnell. You see Kevin O'Connell in the background. He's like, this team is fun. Like they remind me of the lines in some ways. But, you know, that's why I think it's going to be so cool to come down to a week 18. Like that's what you play the game for. That's why you coach, as Campbell said, for moments like that. So I think week 18 is going to be a lot of fun. As great a story as the Lions are overcoming all these injuries, is the biggest surprise this season. Minnesota or Washington? Ooh, you know, I thought the Vikings had some talent. And I think like I liked it. Um, Tim Darnell, a lot more than most people did going into season. Because yeah, I think so highly of Kevin O'Connell. I think he was an amazing coach, an amazing offensive mind. Um, you know, again, I watched what Nick bones was able to do for the Vikings last year and throw 400 yards into the Lions and look like an all pro quarterback for a couple of a couple of starts there. Um, and so they got a guy like Sam Darnell that was like, you know what, they got some pieces offensively. Their defense with Brian Flores could become the long. So it's like, I like what's in place. I just got to see it. And then obviously the way this year is played out, it's been pretty fun. So, um, but man, the commanders, I mean, I thought they might pick in top three again. And here they are in the playoffs. So obviously the commanders are definitely more surprising. Uh, did you think that at this point it would be the Lions and the Packers instead of the Lions and the Vikings? Yeah, I think that's fair to say. The Packers, obviously what they did in the playoffs last year, you know, being the Cowboys the way they did, given the 49ers, all they could handle. I think I liked them a little bit more than the Vikings coming into the season, but man, they, I think the Packers have been pretty disappointing this year because yeah, they, you know, they got all the wins, but their five losses have come against the the Vikings, the Lions and the Eagles, the three top teams in the NFC and like they haven't been able to get it done against that competition. So, you know, playoffs are different beats, but you got to get it done on the regular student too. And they haven't been able to do it this year. So we have a disappointment for the Packers. So take me behind the scenes here and how the decision is made. I don't know who has first choice on this when a game is assigned to a certain window. This is going to be the marquee game for week 18, right? Yeah, for sure. They flexed it to a Sunday night football. Um, that's going to be a lot of community right with season. Um, it was really going to be, you know, if the Vikings end up losing to the Packers, um, and the Lions won, they obviously would have clinched in week 17 and weeks 18 will be meeting with some that scenario. Um, so I imagine it would have been a different game for that time slot, but it's the biggest game of the regular season. And, um, it was kind of no brainer, kind of moving up to Sunday night football and what's that be the last game of the year and, uh, decide the one seed. Like I've never seen a game with this like level of stake, um, and the regular season two, two, what could be 14 when teams depending on what the Lions do tonight. Um, I believe the loser would be the first ever 14 win wild car team. Um, it's been done with the 13 win team. I think the 99 Titans were 13 in three and for the second place. Um, but we've never seen a 14 win wild car team before. So yeah, that's going to be the marquee game for sure. So the Lions could have a franchise record 14 wins and be a five seed. Yeah. How about that? So they're like, wow, uh, as you look at the standings now, uh, as they would shape up, a five seed would play the four seed, right? In the first round on the road. Yeah, and that would be the weakest of the division champs in the NFC, right? Yeah, which I think right now would be the Buccaneers, I believe. Um, okay. It depends if the bucks and, you know, bucks and Falcons will play next week. Um, not each other, but, uh, I think if the bucks win, they're, they're in. Yeah. And the Falcons with that loss last night, um, you know, they were struggling, uh, to handle the clock in the last couple of minutes, commanders and Falcons in the battle of rookie quarterbacks. But I think the Falcons are, you know, they're, they're basically done now. So, uh, I think it's going to be Tampa and we know the lions have already lost the Tampa this year, right? Yeah, they have. And honestly, like, I think the bucks have gotten even better since they put the lions. Like, Bucky Irving has really stepped up. He's really become one of the best young running back from the league, taking over that running back room. Um, you know, like some of the, I know he lost Goblin, but, uh, the rookie from Washington and McMillan, I think he's been playing really well. Yeah. So yeah, I mean, they've got some people still bakers, still operating at high level. You got Mike Evans, a good defense. That defense really gives the lions some, some issues there. So that would be a tough one on the road. Uh, let's deal with the negative aspects first. If this is lions at the box, how does the lions stop Mike Evans? Yeah, that's the question. I mean, Terrion Arnold's going to be, got to be ready because he's there to factor a number one cornerback right now. Um, so really it's going to come down to, you know, maybe give him a little extra attention with the safety. Um, just keep an eye on him to up the game, but, um, yeah, stopping Mike Evans going to be probably number one. I would imagine offensively. And how important is it to get the one seed, not for home field advantage as much, the lions, uh, only losses this year have come at home unbeaten on the road, but to have the week off. And for a team like Detroit, I imagine guys who are out aren't getting any worse. They're only getting healthier. Would you expect some guys to be back for the playoffs? Yeah, you know, I think they have a chance to get some guys back. Um, you know, Alexander Loney, he could come back as soon as maybe week 18 against the Vikings. I imagine he's going to try to suit up and play this week. But if not, it was always week 18 slash first playoff game. I think it was the timeline given by Dan Campbell. So, um, he'd be the big piece there. Some of the others, I think are more weight and fee like Dan Campbell didn't really seem too optimistic about, um, Carlton Davis and sounds like he's going to need more time. Um, you know, David Montgomery has not been placed on IR. He's, he saw a third opinion to kind of see if he can still play this year and it seems like it's kind of up in the air. But, um, I've had just some of these guys and even Aidan Hutchinson, if you want to hold that hope for him, might be like NST champions from game or Super Bowl. So you got to win some of these games to get there and get those guys back first. But, um, yeah, it's a lot easier if you're at home and you get a bi-week in between versus starting the, the playoffs on the road. Colton, how many opinions can a player seek? Is David Montgomery just going to continue this until he gets someone to tell him what he wants to hear? Yeah, you know, once you get to the third opinion, and I think, uh, you've got to make a decision at that point. Um, but I think the second and the third were both kind of on his side, I guess, if you want to say that in terms of, yeah, we don't see enough to where you would hurt it more. Maybe if you just rest it, you can get back to playing. So I think he, he, the first opinion wasn't great. The second one was good and the third one was good. So I think that's, that kind of won out there. So I think that's why they're kind of holding out hope that he can make that comeback and if he's able to play it, whether it's the NST champions from game, maybe the Super Bowl, like that would be such a huge boost and such a huge lift for them. He either got back like that back, who's kind of the heart and soul of their, their run game there. All right, let's get back to tonight's game, Colton. What happened to the 49ers? They don't look anything like the team. We saw last year and of course, Christian McCaffrey's been injured, the vast majority of the season out again, but they've had other guys banged up and they don't seem like they've responded the same way. Yeah, you know, I guess the easy thing to be start would be injuries, but then again, like a team of clients have been injured and they've been able to win 13 games. So I don't know if that's like the only excuse. I heard Shanahan talk about this the other day that there's some players that really aren't used to losing on that team because they haven't done it very often under Shanahan. So I think maybe things will go your way. They kind of snowball a little bit. You don't really know how to fight back. There's probably some of that to an extent. You know, so I don't know if that's the full picture, but it seems like a team that was kind of aging anyway and was kind of on this last couple chances there, like obviously the injuries didn't help and they kind of accelerated that. But if you look at how old the roster is, just the timeline of NFL teams and windows, it seems like they're kind of on the tail end of that anyway, and then the injuries just didn't help. So, you know, we'll see, obviously Chris McCaffee is like the engine that makes it all go and he hasn't been able to play it much this year. So losing a guy like that definitely hurts. Think back to my memory of the 49ers this year being a player who wouldn't go in the game. Yeah. And to the point that John Lynch, general manager, had to come down and get into this. Can you imagine how Dan Campbell might have handled that? Oh, he'd be off the team like the next day. Like, no question about it. Like you can't have guys like that on a Dan Campbell roster that wouldn't fly. And I think the locker room would understand too. So yeah, I was still pretty shocked that that happened. I can't believe that I haven't seen that much in the NFL. Yeah, how often does something like that happen where a player says, well, if you don't want to play me, you don't want to start me, you don't respect me. Well, you know, you just do it your own way. We remember the famous story when Joe Schmidt was a Detroit Lions assistant coach after being one of the greatest linebackers in NFL history. And they had a very mercurial talent named Joe Don Looney. And Joe Don saw the game one way and head coach Harry Gilmer saw it another. And so Joe Don was pulled out of the game and they were going to send him in with the play. And he said, hey, you want a messenger called Western Union? So, I mean, do you see this frequently in the NFL or was this something that, you know, everyone said, whoa, what happened here? Yeah, I mean, you did have been Tony Brown a couple of years ago, just like up and leave at halftime of a game or something like that. Like that was a weird one. I don't think it happens a ton. And if it does, maybe it's more private and you just have conversations. But even then it's like hard to hide, you know, a guy just not going into a game. So, yeah, it doesn't happen often. And like the thing with this situation is like, Drake Greenlaw was in front of you. And that's like a really good player in this league. So I don't know how upset you can be. It's not like some scrub. So that was kind of a weird situation. And he calls himself some money. Like teams are going to remember this for the rest of his career. So like, you're hurting your own pockets by doing this, dude. Like, I don't know why he did it that way. But, you know, he made a decision. Yeah, I think if you thought about it for even a split second, you would realize that your future with the Niners is over. And then as far as your desirability for another team, I don't think that's something you'd want on your resume. Absolutely not. I mean, it's going to follow him the rest of his playing career. And, you know, I'm sure he'll get up to somewhere else. But like he's going to have to be on his best behavior until he kind of proves himself again. Because, I mean, yeah, that's going to stick with you for a while. So what is the goal for Detroit tonight? Staying healthy, probably more important than winning. But what else is on the agenda? What is Dan Campbell going to lay out to the team before they take the field? Yeah, I mean, just first of all, win, be as healthy as possible in the process. Keep, you know, stay sharp and ready for next week. But also, I think there's a minor element in this game where you have to win. Because if you do win this game and there's an unlikely scenario where you tie the Vikings next week, the Lions would own the tiebreaker and they would be the one seed. If you lose to the 49ers and then you tie the Vikings next week, the Vikings would be the one seed. So it's important to get the win for that reason as minute as it is. So get the win. You know, I think Campbell wants these guys playing sharp. He wants to see that edge. They don't want, he doesn't want to see them kind of, you know, low for round out there, even though it's a meaningless game in terms of, you know, a lot of other things. So if they're playing hard playing with the ads and they can stay healthy and get the win, I think that's a perfect scenario. We'll see. The injury bugs hit them pretty hard. So I think worst case scenario, you don't want to see anyone go down. But, you know, that's kind of the risky run when you're trying to go all out and win a game like that. As you look at the NFC this year, there's a lot of talk about the MVP award, whether it's Lamar Jackson or it is Josh Allen. If you just had an NFC MVP, who would it be? I think the first thing that comes to mind is take one just because of how he's accelerated that offense and Philly. I think, you know, running, elite running back like that. I know he, you know, easy to forget playing behind a bad offensive line in New York, but you put him behind a good offensive line. This is what can happen. Magic can happen, you know, 2,000 yards could set the record next week. So, I mean, he's probably first and I would take Jared off as number two, just based on he's having a career year for the lines. I feel like it's kind of gone under the radar. So, I mean, what he's been able to do with this offense, he looks so much sharper than he was even a year ago when he was very sharp. So, obviously, take one to go off in the NFC. Jared Goff has exceeded all expectations. What did you expect from him after last season coming in? Did you think he would be an excellent quarterback? Did you think he would be the best quarterback in this conference? I think the continuity, both on the roster and on the staff of Ben Johnson, all these guys coming back, I thought that would allow him to have a season like this, where like, if you throw away the Texans game, which is kind of a fluke, you know, five interceptions, you don't want to see that often from him. He's been easily the best quarterback in the NFC. Even with that game, he's probably been the best quarterback in the NFC. And I think he's just the little details, like he's taking this game to a higher level. He's hitting, you know, Jameson on these 82 year passes now, which is like a different element that they didn't really have last year. He just took so much more in command of the offense than just a year ago. So, I really think that's just like the time on task with the staff and with the guys around them, that a lot of them have kind of had the best season of his career. Okay, take Jared Goff out of the equation. Colton, can you pick an offensive and defensive MVP on this team? Ooh, on the team. Yeah, I would go to Nate Sewell on offense. He's been incredible. What they've been able to do with him in space is a blocker, his athleticism. He might be one of the most important players on this team, not named Jared Goff right now, in terms of offense players. Defensively, I would go Brian Branch just because he could play anywhere in the secondary. He's been the most consistent player. He can give you big plays with some interceptions. He can force out fumbles. He can, you know, blitz off the edge, drop in the coverage. He can do everything you need him to do. And honestly, he's one of the few elite players left standing on defense. So, it would have been hard. That's a easy answer. He was having a DPOY type of season. But I think Brian Branch has been just as good in his own right. All right, Colton. Thanks so much for joining us. Really appreciate it. Have fun in Santa Clara. We had a blast there last January, except for the second half. Absolutely. Thanks for having me on deck. Hey, Spartan fans. When you want the largest and best selection of Spartan gear, Alumni Hall is your ultimate shopping destination. Come get your officially licensed gear. Nike, champion, Columbia, Yeti, new era hats, tailgating gear, and more. MSU students, faculty, and military receive 10% off in store every day. And you can earn cash back with their Hall Pass rewards. Alumni Hall, located in Eastwood Town Center near the Apple Store. Or shop anytime at alumnihall.com. For the ultimate Spartan shopping experience, it's Alumni Hall. To everyone who wants a meal made just for you, let our team member, Arish, share what makes Culver special. We know the best meals are the ones shared with the people you love. Like our cook to order butter burgers and our real Wisconsin cheese curds, and our creamy, fresh, frozen custard. 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