These Football Times
The wonderful world of Basque football
Hi and welcome to the LOB, a podcast from these football times. My name is Eun McTeer, I'm writer for the site and I'll be your host today. Join me to discuss the intricacies of football in the Basque Country are, Nate Alberia, host of World Soccer Top Radio Show, John Arregi, foundation manager at SDI Bar and Salvador Acha, president of the Mr Penland Club, the London-based Athletic Club Deva Bao supporters group. Thank you all for joining me today. So to kick off let's begin by talking a bit about Ibar and the Basque Lester as I've read today although I prefer to think of Lester as the English Ibar and so we're going to ask how does a tiny team like Ibar from a town of 27,000 people manage to reach La Liga and go toe to toe with the likes of Barcelona and Real Madrid. So let's start with John who works at the club and has recently been working on a book archive in the club's story in pictures. John could you sum up how Ibar has been able to reach La Liga, a tiny Basque club to get there? Well first of all we really felt so happy yesterday for Lester winning the Premier League in England and the thing is that we sometimes get compared to them but I think that the difference is really between us. On the one hand you have that Lester is quite a very big city in England versus Abar being a tiny town of 27,000 inhabitants in the heart of the Basque country and at the heart of that we could also expand on the income or TV rides or stadium size but somehow we are also the smallest one in La Liga. The thing with Abar, some people call it a miracle I think it's the triumph of the wind and the hard work and we Basque have been hard workers for centuries now. We have been told to be travelling to brainland and America trying to fish whales in the medieval ages so I think this is a really small accomplishment but we had this multi we have very few mind and we have been put to test in everything we've done but the thing is that coming up from second day to second day and again the preservation in the period of three years it's been amazing but because of all this is hard work and effort and all this classic and typical Basque values that we are so proud of. Yeah and Nate how has the Aibar story been covered in the States? I know there's a fan group for Aibar USA that's based in California how has it been covered over there? Well there's definitely a love for all the things that John touched on there and the pride, passion and hard working culture that is the Basque country at so many levels and the microcosm that Aibar represent and I wish there was a little bit more of it. I wish there were more people because I feel like if the story was covered a little bit more by the American soccer prep. I said look my friends at being sports have done a great job folks at websites like World Soccer Talk have done a great job you have done a fantastic job bringing the story to as many Americans as possible but I wish that it was covered a little bit more and maybe in a little bit of a different way because I feel like there are so many American soccer fans who have flocked to this Lester story throughout the year not just with them winning the Premier League over the last couple of yesterday as a matter of fact but I don't think that the Aibar story is necessarily being covered in the same fashion of tapping into the amount of Americans that would love this story that would embrace everything about the grits and the passion of this story and so hey hopefully we can we can spread this podcast here through but through these football times do as many American listeners as possible but I find the the Aibar story also to be fascinating on this level is relates to it hopefully becoming commonplace here among American soccer fans but that is the the Aibar connection to not only the Basque country and the For Us bias mentality of Basque soccer but the connection to other countries and an international spotlight that has come to Aibar and and you yourself help you and know this very well the incredible connection between Aibar and Scotland and I mean yeah the 75th anniversary match last July and then the kindred connection between you know northerners with histories of resistance of imperial governments I mean it's it's a fascinating connection between the the Basques and the Scots in that regard and I think Aibar really bought into that more than anyone the 75th anniversary match has become was actually gets Celtic and it bulbs backpipes and kilts and cannons and was this great celebration of of true connection between the Scots and the Basques and as John knows very well one of the Aibar fan groups one of the supporters clubs is actually named Scotland in the brave which I find fascinating yeah there's this connection between the Basque country and you know Scotland like you mentioned in Catalonia as well there's also quite a good connection between the individual Basque clubs so Salvador I'd like to ask you about the relationship between athletic and Aibar because it's quite a cordial relationship you know there's a rivalry of course you want to be better than the other but generally they get on quite well and there's I was at the Aibar athletic game in Aibar at the start of the season and the fans were mingling in the street so there was no animosity they got on very well could you talk about the relationship between Aibar and athletic and then maybe about the relationship between athletic and real associate that okay yes well I think we're athletic is much more friendly with Aibar because of it is closer to the sounds of us geographically speaking and there's quite a big affinity between the two up especially I mean between all the Basque clubs there's affinity among us because we like to to feel their own players athletic is probably the most extreme of all those clubs because of all the philosophy we try to defend it but I think there's a mutual respect of all the clubs that you know you've got to play with your best you've got to you've got to nurture your players and bring them up up the ranks and and and just that that feeling of mutual respect of respecting what the other club is trying to do uh bills that bond between the club and its fans so as you you noticed especially in the Basque club is that usually a great camaraderie between between the fans that was myself in the last 30 versus real associate out of Bill Bauer which we lost and but before the match it was it's a great party and we all have friends or relatives that's for the right hook club and and we know that once we get into the pitch we're we're the physicist of rivals but we understand it's it's a football match and we're there to have fun and and we we we try to push aside any sort of uh rhetoric that uh will lead to any animosity between between the fans yeah I saw this week the 4-4-2 did a list of the 50 uh best armies in the world and the athletic rail derby came in 45 I wonder what you all think of that should it be higher should it be lower? Nate can I start with you do you think 45 is a fair ranking for the Basque Derby in terms of all the dargies in the world? Well clearly I'm quite biased in this regard. Of course. I think it should be much higher on the list and but this goes back to something again connecting this to to other things around the footballing world and I love what was just touched on there by by Salvador in terms of the unique qualities of of the derby and yeah there's some some hatred there's animosity over the here's plenty of it between between associate Adam Dilbao but there's also this fascinating connection and that everybody looks at each other at that match around that match and says we're all Basque we all come from the same culture of resistance we all have the same blood that that flows within our bodies and and I look into honestly as as a Liverpool supporter I look at the mercy side derby with the something with a similar quality where it cuts between family lines where mothers are red and and fathers are blue and brother sister it's a very similar context in the Basque Derby and and I feel like surely the unique qualities of the Basque Derby should have it much higher on that list let alone the atmosphere and the fantastic football on display I find the the unique almost the lack of a better bit of friendliness within the rivalry I feel makes it so so beautiful and surely should be much higher than 45 on that list and and if I if I could also make this important point I think that whoever goes to one of these matches sees it as a a family oriented affair yes it's very common to fall fast to come along you know with their their kids or with their siblings or two or within the you know the parents all all sorts of people from all ages come about get together they have a good time a good crack you know they do the Baudel they have the chocolatey before the match of them they they try to support them once the referee blows the whistle yeah it's quite one of the interesting things you were saying there Nate was the sort of us against them mentality of the Basque Derby it's you know the Basques against the rest of Spain and I read that I was reading Phil Ball's a column on Monday and he was talking about the real Sociedad game against Real Madrid at the weekend and he was saying that there seems to be a sort of a change where there isn't quite as much animosity from Basse teams towards Real Madrid these days because partly because there's more animosity towards Barcelona and partly just the younger generation is no longer quite as anti-spain when it comes to football and I wonder what you all think about that can I start with you drawing since you're the only one on this podcast that actually lives in the Basque country just now would you say there's less of an animosity towards the Madrid teams or the Spanish teams or has it not changed well that doesn't just be a question the good thing I'd say about Basque Basque football is that I don't there are any children wishing to be Cristiano Ronaldo or Messi was it called yeah and I think this is something huge and really important for us because when you think about football on a lower scale there are so many bad examples how to and I'm so few good examples and I think that one when Basque children wants to to grow up and be able to be able to be or I don't know as Real Madrid that means that something is different if they have sent they are referring to all the kind of roles and models of course it the second relation between Basque clubs and Real Madrid also but the thing the good thing is that I think that Basque clubs said such an example about values of how work and not everything being about money that made it really important for us as a culture and that's a country I don't know if that answers your question you know that's very interesting the hard work aspect I wonder how far you think hard work can go in the you know back in the day from 1980 to 1984 La Liga stayed in the Basque country twice with athletic and twice with Real Sociedad but like you touched upon John Modern football has changed so much and do you think that a Basque team can ever win La Liga again through hard work and over money can I start with you Nate on that one? Well I hate to keep beating the dead Leicester City horse but maybe if a team like that could do it the Premier League we can we can take some inspiration in La Liga but the duocracy I mean the the running of La Liga over the last few years of Barcelona and Real Madrid yes I know I'd let you go but that incredible season a couple of years ago but for the most part you look over the last decade plus it and you see where the money is gone you see the extent to which it's gone it's hard for me to to fathom a Leicester-like story happening in La Liga but I'm I'm gonna hope and pray that it happens I'm gonna root every passing day for it to happen and and it could happen it absolutely could teams can can go into slums teams can get hot it could happen but the likely good of it happening well how about this maybe five thousand one yeah maybe Salvador obviously athletic has the disadvantage of our web and from a social point of view the fans would say it's an advantage but from a sporting point of view it's not a disadvantage that they can only field past players how do you see that as a handicap towards a team and would that make it even less unlikely that they could win La Liga well well I'll try to address a couple of your points yeah if you don't mind especially I wanted to comment on this animosity tour it's Barcelona Real Madrid yeah of course and I think and I think each man is has you know their own set of opinions about about the big plots and these these guys that move so much huge amounts of sums and which are very hard to compete against I think the animosity towards Real Madrid has been there because they are the most well the team were the most champions champion the titles in the Spanish league etc but and because there is some some political animosity towards them and and that has been historically but one can argue in the last 20 to 25 years that that the animosity should be uh gets more against Barcelona because Barcelona has been the one who has been relying on bus players um and you know from the from the 15 days and so forth as and to try to poach the bus out into the way from either Real Sociola or Atlantic uh I personally do not I'm not fond of any of those clubs uh but uh that there is there is some level of um of uh I don't know you don't want to call it hip-hop christy or bad or because we get a lot of that with Barcelona historically then it's easy we see it easier uh for our for the last place to go to Barcelona then to go to Real Madrid so yeah um now uh on the on the other question about athletic and and the uh handicap or philosophy well it is is it a handicap well you can argue it is but we don't see it that way because uh because there's too many virtues of from the philosophy that we possess but the way I see it is an athletic Lucas uh just to rotate I made a reference to it a few months ago if if you want to compare us to a um to a uh food product we are as organic as it can get yeah that's a good thing that is that we source look at me yes we source locally and and sometimes you know when when the when the harvest isn't that great well you just got uh suck it up and and do the best that you can the last couple of years we've been we've been lucky enough to to to nurture a good generation of players we've been constantly playing in Europe we've been constantly getting to a couple of finals which we have done for for a while aside from just nurturing that kind of the club has has raised the bar as into uh what it demands of its players the players seem more committed to the to the cause and and and we've been able to get better results coupled to that we've been having these fantastic coaches with with uh would be assigned however lately so it's a combination of factors that uh has allowed us to to be competitive now the big what I find as as the big handicap if you want to call it from our philosophy is that unfortunately we because of our philosophy it is very hard for us to have a a corner at the side of a you know a 24 man roster the big plus that amount all these great clubs have like Madrid or Barcelona or Biomedical Manchester United is that the people on their bench are internationals and athletic even though they could put up put on the pitch 11 very good players the bench is usually quite thick and and and that it's very hard to always have a healthy 11 so there will always be a period in the year or a season or two where you can't feel the bad as possible 11 and that is what I think is the the big challenge for athletic to be able to to produce even high quality substitute second so that whenever you're in other ways or any other public fault all still or we lose them to a transfer you can easily replace them yeah no that's a good point because I think athletic season sort of hit the rails a little bit when adorice williams and la port all suffered some injuries in the last couple of months that's a good job and so there's no I think we were sorry sorry when you go now yes I just wanted to say that role Garcia's injury this is I think was was critical in probably had a had a healthy we could have been admitted it's available in the web file yeah of course and so do you think I know you probably want a grease Salvador but do you think we associate that have a better mix where they can buy some players and put together a slightly better bench but they still try to field bass players where possible is that the the way forward and john could I put that towards you do you think because either has a similar sort of mix where they sign some players some foreign players but they tend to try and keep the core of the team as a bass team do you think that's a good mix to have well actually uh the the only having bass players quality you know to take these it's absolutely amazing for us yeah and I think it's such an incredible example not a navigable in the whole in the whole world but that means that being a country three teams and third division and we hope to be five last teams next season with us as no man all of us back back in halega that may agree that may quite a lot of people trying to fish in the same small pond and that makes things really difficult for us to to make yourself an idea we do actually have six players six bass players all the 23 neighbor and we are starting to to keep that bass core because you at least those situations it means that when you have good player at 30 core real so they are going to take it and just very little we can offer a player when at 30 core real so they are interested in so so that makes for us very difficult keeping that bass core and and actually we we do have right uh way to be uh source of of players when we have nine teams uh but also we have the same problem which is that if we have a good player in in in those sense at 30 core real so they are going to take him and uh it's something difficult to repeat we try to do our best we do believe in in that kind of philosophy by our sports model is changing in a world it's really different from real society or or whatever but we we you have to imagine that uh at the end of the last season we have to hire 15 new players which is absolutely amazing and only one of those 15 players is a bass player and he came in January from real to the end so keeping that core is important yes it is uh and we struggle to to do that because uh when you have him like at 30 core almost 100 years in first division and have never been demoted you have a power of attraction that we cannot compete with so that that's actually uh it's a good policy something unique but it's difficult to put up with when you're smaller yeah that makes sense so nay i'm going to imagine that you're the president of a bass club bass gamec i've just made it up if you're the president of that club what kind of method would you take are you going to hire some players from south america some from asia or are you going to go all-bask or are you going to try and find a mix what do you think would work best from an on-field point of view and from an off-field point of view first off first off we're in the name of this club avaraya fc we are up at the foothills of the here it is about 60 miles north of pumplona in the town where my my family originally came from now i'm i'm going to be forced to have a mix because i'm i'm a small football club up in the hills and i can't necessarily compete with with what uh bill bow is able to do but but this is this is such a an interesting conversation on so many levels and and one that is very unique but there are also other stories like it around the world and and i'm currently living in san diego right now i'm so connected to mexican soccer and there's such a similar story of a g boss in in wagelahara who are known as the the true mexican team they've all forever fueled it nothing but mexican players and for the first time in almost a hundred years with what's going on around g boss in wagelahara there's a lot of people who are saying hey maybe it's time to move beyond this maybe it's time to bring in some imports and you look back with with bill bow and you look at where bill bow is at and going back to the last thing that you asked me in terms of a of a vast team potentially winning la liga would bill bow maybe eat broadening the horizons just a tad without going away from from the true core of of what makes athletic so special would the idea of bringing in a few important important that players could that be the difference in being a perennial fifth through ninth place finisher and perhaps competing with rayama trid and barcelona for for a la liga title i mean i mean that's an open-ended question i don't necessarily add i'm not no stardomist i don't have the answer to that but i can't help but wonder if it would i can't help but wonder if that could be a a huge difference for bill bow when and in regards to the the basket only policy it's something that it's so interesting because bill bow would just look that as the basket i mean they are truly looked at as the basks side but that always was was troubling for me because i grew up with many people teaching me about rayama's associate dad as a kid i grew up with with people teaching me about ala vez and and and and a bar and and i was asked well our our avar ala vez and sociedad and oh so soon are they any any less fast than bill bow what does that what does that really mean and that's a question that i'd love to throw back to to john and salvador i mean is there almost at times ever a resentment of that you know you are the basket even when we're also we represent the the same in country we just don't have the ability to to field nothing but basket players i mean is there ever any sort of resentment from from a club like abr to bill bow and in that regard john well i don't i don't really think that is uh actually uh we we're starting with uh having uh i think the bow front day la liga in 1929 i think along with the other action which was uh at the age of and also we are social and we are related to our teams and the thing is that this means that one of the founding fathers of la liga is exactly now and also along with it like a depot from world mind south of spain is the oldest for the club in the spanish peninsula so that that is something you cannot compete against um and that's that's good to me like that forever and also a verdict has has forged an image with a basketball league policy uh that is i think the main uh the main sign of identity for them and and and and it's something really good and something different but the thing is that uh we we do believe at least from over that this doesn't make them any more or any less bus we bus our own team and it's called the bus national selection and that's a place where we're all bused to commit uh the thing is that one adulting has a really clear and identity and have models in in doing things and i think the trick is just about finding your your own model for example in ever we we have the only japanese player in la liga and and that is something that i think it's not going to have never ever if they keep having only bus players and and and i think this is something interesting in in our photo model because uh it means that when you only have when you have the only japanese player in la liga everyone is your band is located you and and that gives you such a power uh for communicating on for selling your product and for having supporters in the other side of the earth that i think is not going to have on that side and that it has a great and amazing model it's property of the players sister bus holders but for example neighbor the thing is different we would have to share whole others 10 000 shareholders all over the world in the uzade the uk i don't know in australia or all of the poor or afghanistan and and that that is different really different but it works out and it's really fast and we speak mainly fast and everything else and we also put players to the bus uh national selection and and well it doesn't make us any more or less fast and then we also here has a novel different model mixing some of these things i think that the key is this about finding something different and not trying to to compete or to replicate is exactly what all those are doing you have to find your own way of different things so yeah i i just want to say i absolutely love the the shareholder culture of avar and actually know a number of uh of minority shareholders in the club uh in in the state of idaho in one of the uh the biggest vast populations uh in america there are avar shareholders in boisy idaho i mean that alone is so so beautiful to me on a level of as someone with a deep vast immigrant history uh myself i find the fact that yeah there's in in elko davada reno davada and boisy idaho there are people who have investments into your club i find that absolutely beautiful based on their that ask heritage one last point that i want to make here and and you and we talked about this actually yesterday it's really it's it's funny to me and it relates so much to this particular conversation and the the basket only policy about people realized that up until 1989 real associate ad had the same exact policy they feel that nothing but vast players for their entire history all the way in to the final year of the 1980s and and the the amazing connection between Liverpool and Real Sociedada i think really kicked off back in 1989 because that first non-fast player was a scout syrup from Liverpool by the name of john altridge and john altridge went to sociedad and he banged in 16 goals in his opening season and i i was laughing thinking about this the other night in preparation for this podcast and i was thinking man could you imagine if john altridge in 1989 that showed up in in sense of ashen and suited up for sociedad and had scored a goal and brag with injuries all season and just had an absolute crap campaign i'm sure those folks at sociedad would have looked at each other going hey maybe we're gonna go back to that basket only policy this is a terrible terrible idea what were we thinking it just so happened that john altridge mr import from mercy side came in and scored a ton of goals and actually get great service to sociedad for a couple of seasons and so i think the groundwork that that laid was that hey we can still be a club that represents the vast country but what's wrong with bringing in an english man or a south african and american of whoever from wherever the world if they can bang in 16 goals in a season for my club they can shoot up for us and that doesn't make us any less of that anyone else yeah that's a good book so salvador i want to put this to you do do you look at sociedad and do you as an athletic fan think that your club is more basque for the basque only policy or how do you view sociedad switch and from basque only to adding some other players i would like to to i mean i broadly agree with with john's earliest comments that i think what is important each club should have their own their own philosophy or set of priorities in order to make you know a a strategic long-term process of how they want to manage their club and i think that's the best way to go about it uh now also i would just like to make you to make with all your respect uh we we call ourselves athletic club what we're about and and we prefer to be called athletic and that's that's something that uh we we are very proud of because of our english you know heritage yeah so that we're that's why we we like to mention always a very athletic uh athletic club and so forth uh but um now to answer your question uh and going back a little bit to Nate's uh comment about uh foreigners uh well you can mention about uh the positive four ring players that have come to be all sociedad over the years which have been magic and some one of them is Carlos Verla who's Mexican and he has done very well over the last couple of years but uh equally so one could count the number of players who have not been successful foreign players who have not been successful in real sociedad so it's a bit of a hit and miss and and not only i mean that that month that hit and miss comes more from whoever's making the decisions at at you know the uh the the the sports director of the club it's not so much immediate there foreigner or not foreigner that's that's what i would there would be my argument that that uh the the judgment of the people who make the decisions really is is what what uh tells you how successful your philosophy or your approach to to fielding aside is now um now i i also what i would like to mention here is that yes uh well i mean it just does play only with the boss players and we're very proud of it because it has been uh a history for for many many years although i need do need to mention that we started uh initially with a mix of mask and people will be skiing is going to uh from his day uh play from the stage as well as english players because they are the ones who helped us you know taught us how to play football so even though the english players got pushed aside after a few years uh and and they weren't fielded anymore uh we we have been very focused on nurturing our own talent and i wouldn't even call it uh i wouldn't call as boss from the beginning because if in 1910 we thought there was mainly uh people from Bilbao and the great regions of Bilbao were a club just constantly playing with people from his sky and as the philosophy has evolved and the times have evolved uh we have had to expand our our uh our scope of where we capture the players from it and yes we we have gone to hippos where we have gone to Navarre we have gone to Parate and and and that philosophy has changed somewhat over time but i think the important aspect of our philosophy or the clubs identity is that we try to play with our own we try to play with the players that we have uh nudged uh through our farm system uh for instance uh for instance there's many players such as you know Muni Ayin or La Porte uh that even though they were not born in Bilbao or in this guy they have been with us since the age of well Muni Ayin since he was 13, La Porte since he was 16 and to make our players absorb the culture and identity and what it means to represent athletic and and just as long as they do that and they they are uh you know um uh they have pride of wearing our colors the people will support them and and we will be united you know between them there will be a they're strung in between the fans and the players yeah it's very interesting that the the typical bass club has a English name it's sort of strange in that sense but you're right it started with English players and and move to to more of a bass identity whereas Real Sociedad sort of had the the opposite moving towards Merseyside and important players and even managers from Merseyside as well with John Toshak and David Moyes making the move via Merseyside Sociedad and we're going to talk a little bit now about managers and in particular about one one of the occasions last season where a guy so Gary Tannell was holding a press conference um after a defeat I think it was in Al Maria and uh he was asked questions in Basque and he responded in Basque and the Spanish media or some parts of it anyway were very critical of that fact despite the fact that Basque Uscara is one of the official languages of the country and do you feel that with the this attitude towards a Basque language does that represent a sort of overall and we talked earlier about animosity from Basque clubs or fans maybe towards the rest of Spain do you feel that there's a vice versa and that there's animosity from the rest of Spain towards the Basque clubs maybe not from the club specifically but from the Spanish media and can I start with you in that one John because you were obviously involved in AIVAR and I'm sure that was a very um busy week just after that press conference that Gary Tannell held yes so why I remember it clearly and he somehow happened again this year when his press conference after that there wasn't absolutely horrible and inappropriate to me from some money very important Spanish football newspaper that said I don't understand why does he have to speak first in Basque he should bring a translator this is not a we speak only Spanish and that was amazing and was like you know that the heads were hot day like oh my look carefully this is happening again fortunately he didn't go as far as the last time yeah he was an amazing guy also an amazing manager for the team and he he was from a little down near somehow near about 10 kilometers from here he had almost only speaking Basque for the Basque majority of his life and he had a political compromise also with Basque values and culture and also as supportive for independence and for him to be in AIVAR and that was the end the other corner of the Spanish state and not hearing like comments the day after but someone yelling at him in the middle of a press conference this is a Spain you have to speak Spanish I don't understand you first of all this is really rude but for someone as guys this is challenging everything you believe in and I think that what he did that was a stepping up and living through what's the most elegant way of saying I don't give up but what do you say I don't want to believe this represents Spanish people all these kind of behaviors represent obviously represents a small sector of people and we've seen that with with Catalan language also and it's something that I think we have to deal with and it's called intolerance and it happens in every country all over the world and when you are on minorities say the far of a state with your own language and and culture and traditions it gets even hollow but I don't want to believe this represents almost anybody I've been living for the past four years after coming back to it where in New Madrid and I've lived in Barcelona or you know cities and there's quite a lot of intelligent people and people with an open mind that enjoy the difference and really want to learn about different things and languages so I don't I don't think it's representing no way and I don't think there's an animosity against mask teams in general however we cannot all recall like a special episode and all the times of we learn violence and I recall the death of fact of the letter who was a result of a family in Madrid who was attacked by his king heads after a game I want to believe those are things from the past and well actually everything in the space seems to be changing today and we talk about new politics and new ideas new media I think that the football is also changing somehow and La Liga is putting quite a big effort into tolerance and respect and making people understand that some things from the past cannot happen again so so I just want to affect this this was a golden opportunity for some videos to to get something to guys got and I took them to be a star for one day yeah that's a good point I'd like to put that to you Nate as well living in America which is obviously such a diverse country and there's many minorities in America do you do you see similarities between what you you see happening in Spain the treatment towards vast managers or vast players in Madrid and some of the issues that you see in America you mean with the political climate that we're dealing with in this country in 2016 yeah that political climate yeah that's yeah I think it's safe to say a certain character has definitely drummed up quite a bit don't know me that in our political and cultural climate here and yeah it's it's terrible and but again some of the things that John touched on where we're so spot on and so beautiful in a lot of ways and represent a microcosm for pride resistance and passion and keeping a language alive that has at least 7 000 years of of history without any direct connection to any other major language in the world I mean it's one of those beautiful things about vast culture is is the language itself and seeing anybody whether it's a a kid on the street or a football manager try to keep that language alive is is one of the most powerful things of all and and languages is our pathway to learning about each other and and I'm all for I'm one of those people once the everybody learned as many languages as possible whether it's bass, French, Spanish, English whatever it may be and so the unique qualities of the bass language definitely have me on on the side of wanting to see it kept alive in in every way possible and whether that press conference is in Madrid or or the hills of the bass country it needs to happen and and idiots like like the man that they need to be need to be hushed and then the the culture of resistance needs to continue you in in this regard I just want to make sure also that my my microphone is properly set up and we're not hearing any mysterious oh was added to the end of athletic club here I just want to just want to clarify that here now I'm just coming through as athletic it's coming through fine and what one other thing Salvador I'd like to ask you well maybe maybe move on a little bit to the possibility of a bass national team and so today the news has come through from UEFA that Kosovo has been admitted to UEFA Salvador could you ever see that happening for a FIFA or UEFA recognised banks national team and if so what would have to happen for that to for that to take place okay I am not an expert in this field but the way I see it is that it will not happen any time soon because there there is a political deadlock in in Spain they are not interested in in recognising officially in this case the bass country as a as a as you know to have to have its own international side going back to doing an analogy with with the journalists that have this issue with guys going anytime at the press conference well there is some people who who you know do not tolerate other views who who let you get on you they lack they lack they lack tolerance but I think they also just lack respect they lack education and they don't seem to they seem to only think that they are on the right side of things and unfortunately it's been since they kind of the the dealership in Spain despite the efforts for you know not only the basket of copper lines and other other entities and in the Spanish region have tried to come up with their own national sides there has been no no will no interest in and pushing things forward because because they simply are not willing to to make it happen and and well I'm very happy to hear that Kosovo can now now play I hope that the Basque team can play in some time in the future but I do not see it happening anytime soon yeah and Nate and John do you have any views on that do you think it could happen anytime soon or at all why I don't see it happening anytime soon I I don't see it happening anytime soon I had a lengthy conversation with with Guillaume Balague actually a few months back about the Catalonia national team potentially coming to fruition I don't see the Catalonia national team I don't see the Basque national team becoming a thing for at least 10 to to 15 years I mean I I almost hope that I'm wrong and the fact that you bring up the situation with Kosovo being recognized I mean who knows it could happen I sincerely hope that I'm wrong in this regard but I sincerely don't see it happening for the Basque national team or even a Catalonia team for at least a decade plus maybe even more yeah and if there was to be a Basque national team how how good do you think it could be would it qualify for World Cup John I'll put that to you and there's obviously a lot of very talented Basque players in Ibar, Real Sociedad, Athletic and even in the Premier League and the rest of Spain if there was to be an official Basque team could it qualify for the World Cup do you think well I my opinion is slightly different from mates and fellows yeah and in no way represents my club it's my uncle's on opinion because I do think we will see Basque national oh you do? for children maybe no I think two or three years well I think that from here to you that I sent years we're going to see it we we are seeing really important political changes in Spain and the recent majority Catalonia directly fighting for independence and politically saying that they don't want to do anything in the future with Spain and talking about what they say disconnection so so we are not an insulated thing here in the Basque country so I think that the way of Spain is Government to prevent Catalonia or the Basque country or Bolivia from escaping literally it's just to sit down try to understand things and one thing that happens in the UK is that each country has its nationality it can also walk out perfectly in Spain I think they are going to have to talk about these and about all things and say there is something reasonable today it's something really really difficult but but we see that we are going to to larger our election in June for the second time after we could not like the prime minister for the first time in the history of Spain and that means huge political changes ahead so I think that that that this is a this is something that is going to change in the future call me an optimist if you want and I think that that the perfect thing is going to be made from my particular a bar of zunan and Malabar it's it's something really strange to have so many first division things in such a small country don't forget that the Basque country including what we call it's calculated with Navarro and this the south 10 10 parts of France that we call it rather that is two million five hundred inhabitants more or less and for that population to actually have three teams and first division and the possibility of having two more for for racism it's it's something huge so if if you mix that up I think that made a pretty good team we with sim and that's something they're competing for champion today also to think that they qualify for European and I think that this could be quite a quite a big team so why do you think that is what why is football so popular in the Basque country why are players so good because there are so many other popular sports in Uscadi such as you know Pilata cycling is popular mountain climbing even chopping wood is a popular sport in Uscadi and going back to Guy Spagari Tano as well who was the manager who won promotion with iber he didn't grow up wanting to be a footballer he wanted to be a Bert Solari which is sort of like a Basque street poet there's so many other sports and past teams competing for children's attentions in the Basque country yet they still have this enthusiasm for football and they still produce so many footballers why do you think that is for such a small country that also has many other sports competing for children's time so salver there i'll start i'll start with you if you if you wouldn't mind answering sure sure aside aside from all the sports that you mentioned i think we we love cycling as well yeah as one of the favourite sports in Uscadi well i think to answer well historically i think it's because it's been there's there's well you have the seaside you have the mountainous part there's there's quite a lot of green space and in nice areas where you can practice sport and i think that has led for for the youngsters for the people who want to do sports to to develop their abilities and they they put their time and effort to it now aside from having the time to do so i think they they have had they have the ability to compete they especially you see it now well especially with some of these boss players who are playing and elite and and and and first division they they like to compete they they are fair they are fierce they are some people call them knuckleheads but they they like to win and they even though they might might not be the most talented football players in this case since we're talking about football they they do they pour their heart and soul to it and they also like working in teams so there is a collective spirit that that also gives them a number of hands against against their rivals so i would say that that is one of their the main factors why busks have been good at football now also i could argue that one s s time has a progress and with the with the living standards of people improving in the last few decades especially in Spain one could argue that that has been a big uh factor for for clubs such as athletic to not have so such a great form system because if the quality of life with the people improves then those players will spend well those players or those people those youngsters will spend their time getting a college degree trying to do other types of activities aside from just sports and that has that we can do it i guess probably you could interview a sociologist and and and and historians to get a better answer but i i believe i believe that that could also play a factor as to why there it could be a lack of of of uh of bus talent and maybe why what such is as we also see that kind of breaking point a few years ago when they said okay we're going to start relying on on foreign is because the the mask only policy seems that it is uh doesn't have a long term bit future no i think that's a great answer um nate is there anything you'd like to add to that coming from a a Basque American family um football obviously seems to have filtered through to you why do you think that is even when there's so many other sports that take the interest of a Basque families well there's actually a certain direction that i've gone with this in my mind and that is that many of the Basque footballers who have studied very very deeply and and really tried to examine their psychology and examine them on a on a sociological level even though i have absolutely no credentials uh to do so um as much as i've i've done this i've found almost every Basque player to be such a fascinating well-rounded individual and it comes from all the things that that you talked about right there i mean whether it's it's mr kind of not on himself you know having an infatuation with with street poetry another amazing Liverpool connection now with mr kind of not only talks about uh loving J.D. Carriker uh who was actually on this very show uh last week ago i mean he's such a amazing well-rounded individual getting to know Shabby Alonso so well as a Liverpool supporter in his amazing time at Anfield had just finding this fascinating personality within Shabby Alonso and that and that was that was his Basque that was his his culture and and it's such an amazing well-rounded upbringing that many of these players have so i see well-rounded smart footballers coming out of the Basque country and and i don't necessarily have the the the magical solution to to garner bring more talent or having a better scouting or a youth system but i do find it brilliant in in so many ways that that so many of these Basque footballers that have had the great privilege of of covering and and examining for for lack of a better way to put it to to be such fascinating well-rounded smart individuals with such an amazing work ethic to move would you agree with that John you obviously spend a lot of time with the footballers at ABAR would you agree that they're just well-rounded individuals and then that helps them to become better footballers as well as just better people i don't know if it necessarily helps them to become better footballers i just want to clarify that okay just enjoy the back you're too well-rounded individual yeah well i do think that being a good human being being a good professional whatever you do how do you think that go along and for me well it's it's something they have something really good because we can teach the world and teach especially the children that you can have a university title also play football in the top division and and that go on pretty well i'm thinking of actually i'll play a young study who came from Beyonces here and his uh an engineer and his name is studying for five or six years university and he plays top football yeah that's fascinating i think that yeah i think that helps and i think that what's more important it's it sets an example which is you have to study first and you have to try to go to university or college or wherever you want to go and done you play football and it's absolutely compatible one thing with the other um and i think it helps because it's it's all that the life of football in the top division is really short and if you have been through university and you have a title it helps to to have a job after the 30 or 35 years here one new sports career usually usually ends so to when when we go to school with with football players and we tell them that that player x is an engineer or he's a teacher or a journalist geyska for example was a journalist and and i think it's this sets an amazing example that things can can uh lift you around and that uh and of course i i think that if you have a study or gone to university or college it helps because it somehow helps you you have uh you have a better situation in life for the future so you can just like relax and on paper to football and we have examples like uh like you said with uh Sherri Alonso or all the players yeah i think that's on on one of the most important things you and sorry okay yeah of course it's amazing how many players that that we cover on a worldwide level and especially in the in the english media actually i feel like more than anywhere but players who who fall into bankruptcy i mean players who whose lives collapse once football is over and this goes back to the foundations of fast culture and and these upbringings that many of these players have and the the the the the the the the emphasis that is put on on education and and cultural awareness and and professionalism and it is oh so important again when we see so many footballers lives some of them just you know teeter off some spiral out of control once their playing careers are done and i feel like based on all the things that john just touched on right there that for the most part there's there's no uniform policy in this regard but i feel like for the most part that bass players are are better equipped for for life after football based on on the things that that he touched on there that's a really really important point i'm really glad that that john brought those things up yeah it seems like a bass player's plan ahead for for life after football and that sort of translates to the way bass clubs seem to plan ahead for a rainy day and they're they don't seem to think very short term and they they seem to have a good plan and they stick to trying to stay out of day plan ahead and invest in you fits it seems to be the culture and well that's that's i'm afraid that's all time we've got today in this podcast obviously i think we could talk about bass football for another three or four hours but we might have to cut it short here and i want to thank all of you guys all our guests um for joining today you can find everyone on twitter there'll be links in the description below you can find nay at nay wst which is for world soccer top you can also check in on his radio show john is at john underscore reggie and salvadar can be found at mr petland club which is as we mentioned at the start it's the uh athletic club supporters group for for fans in london so if you're in london uh london check it out there's also a website and and your material uh you can find me at e mctier and and you can find my book on ivar um and the bass blog that um we talked about at the start if you want to discuss bass football even more we're always happy to do so there so thank you all very much for listening this has been the log podcast until next time take care thank you very much