(00:00) Demarcus Lawrence on leaving Dallas: “I know for sure I'm not going to win a Super Bowl there”
(32:00) Former teammates Micah Parsons, DeMarcus Lawrence have a fresh beef
(36:45) Report: Cowboys making a push for WR Cooper Kupp
PFT Live with Mike Florio
Micah Parsons & DeMarcus Lawrence beef + Cowboys making push for Cooper Kupp (Hour 1)
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We're going to talk about that right out of the gates because the Cowboys always give us something to talk about when they mean to and sometimes when they don't mean to. Good morning to you, Mike. Good to see you. Fashion games at a high level again today. I love it. I should have got I should have thought I should have just thought a little bit more before getting dressed. But sometimes the mind is foggy just around 7am. So that's my bad on that. But I got to tell you, Mike, no, no tongue in cheek. I didn't see the joke. You know what I saw? The Marcus Lawrence saying to the interviewer, hey, you get it, right? You get that I just took a shot at the cowboy. Are you going to respond to that? You see, I just got my shot in. What do you say to that? And I think the interviewer was surprised, but he wanted to get that out. And as we are finding out, there's there's truth in every joke. And so he wanted to make sure his his statements were on the record. I could understand it and we'll get to what that sparked between the Marcus Lawrence and a now former teammate. It's a more potent statement if he signs with the Eagles or the Chiefs or, you know, a team that is in the conversation right now as a Super Bowl team, the Seahawks. And I don't think any Seahawks fan, no matter how much tariff, whiskey, champagne or wine, they would drink. I don't think they would say our team is in the Super Bowl window right now. I think they would say maybe we can make the playoffs this year at best at best. So that kind of took some of the steam out of it because it's not like he has swapped a non Super Bowl team for a Super Bowl team. Yeah, you're right. I mean, one day one, ten games last year and they could look at it and say, wow, we won 10 games. We really should have made the playoffs, but it was 10 games. They weren't really were inconsistent. They were a weird team all year. I think they won their first three games and they dropped off look like they were going to be dismissed and they come roaring back and but really couldn't close the deal. And now they move on from the quarterback in there, depending on how you look at it, number one or number two wide receiver and DK Metcalf. So they got some, they got some rebuilding to do in Seattle. But the statement from Demarcus Lawrence was really what he really wanted to say is the Dallas Cowboys will never win a Super Bowl. See what I want to, that's where I want to, that's where I want to spend my time. Why do you think that? Why do you think they can't win a Super Bowl? It's not just because you're gone. You know something or you think something that you're not sharing right now. So why don't you share it? That's really what he wanted to say. Had nothing to do with Seattle, even if he had gone to Philadelphia, if he had gone to Kansas City, that wasn't the point. The point is he wanted to take that shot at the Cowboys. And I don't want to take a shot here at the guy known as Hawk Blogger who was not to be confused with Hawk. Never mind. But the guy known as Hawk Blogger. Who? Who? I got it. Who asked the question? I'm not that slow on a Friday. Just making sure you said you have a little fog. Just want to make sure the fog is gone at 704. But the natural follow is why do you say that? And it's possible that he was so surprised by the comment. He didn't know what to say. But yeah, that would be a nice, like, why? Why do you say that? Please elaborate. And I'll make the open plea on behalf of everyone. Demarcus, it's probably a little early where you are right now. But if by some miracle of modern technology, these words end up making their way into your ears, take to Twitter and elaborate as to why you said what you said because Twitter was used. Fortunately, Twitter was not down on Thursday night. This didn't play out on blue sky. It happened on Twitter. Not that I have a problem with blue sky. Trust me. I trust me. After what happened on Monday, I would love to abandon Twitter for blue sky. And I already would have loved to abandon Twitter for blue sky, but there's a certain practicality that factors into it. I digress on Twitter. That's where the comments from Demarcus Lawrence did reach the ears of Michael Parsons, who started with this. Why did we block the word? Come on, we say it all the time, but that's okay. That's that's responsible. This is what rejection and envy look like. This some clown shit. That's what he said. Sorry. Yes. Well done. Sorry. That was the first, you know, tennis. That was the first volley back at at Demarcus. And whoa. Wow. Hey, there's some beef. And apparently people who follow the Cowboys have known there was beef between the two. They just never said it before. Now here's Demarcus Lawrence with the last word as of last night, calling me a clown won't change the fact that I told the truth. Maybe if you spent less time tweeting and more time winning, I wouldn't have left with a little smiling devil emoji. And again, that adds to my like, is he just trying to stir things up for our amusement and entertainment if so well done? But, but again, some of the folks who cover the Cowboys have since said this has been there. It would have been nice to know about it while they were teammates, but now that they're not teammates and now that they're openly fighting the people who have followed the team are like, Oh yeah, yeah, this this they've they've kind of had this going on. Usually we know when two teammates have something going on, but now we know primarily because of our teammates anymore. You know, Mike, he's playing a little chess with with Micah Parsons because Parsons, the podcaster, you know what it's like. What can we always say? Hey, we don't we don't necessarily root for teams. We root for stories. It's good content. So podcasters love content. So he goes right where where Micah lives and says, well, you know, if you spend less time doing all these things, like that's what you are, right? You're a content creator and a great pass rusher. So I'm giving you content right now. Are you are you offended? It gives them a little, am I playing? Am I serious? So now Micah is kind of off balance. I don't know what to do with this. And then he changes his profile pick to that old cowboy said, which is a brilliant move. Oh, that was that was great. That is love. But you know, it makes me wonder, because I like a good beef as much as anybody. I don't want to apply reason to it yet or just like be the arbitrator. Well, you make some good points and you make some good points. And let's let's work this out. I don't want to get there yet, but it does make me wonder, is he telling the truth? If if he and Micah Parsons got along, you mean to tell me he would still be a Dallas really? So let's say they get along and Seattle is still offering, I don't know what Dallas offered, but Common Sense tells you Seattle offered more than the Cowboys. Or if the Cowboys offered anything at all, you mean to tell me he would be a Dallas and now Seattle, I find out hard to believe. So if you really break it down, Micah Parsons does have a point. If you're here, we're not having this conversation, because if you're here, you get more money. And ultimately, that's what you want. Yeah, rejection and envy, that speaks to a belief or knowledge by Micah Parsons that Lawrence isn't with the Cowboys, not because he decided after 12 seasons, 11 seasons, 12, I think it is in Dallas, I'm going to go try to win a Super Bowl somewhere else because I'll never win one here that that wasn't the thought process. It was I need a job. And the team that I played for since 2014 doesn't want to give me a job at the level of compensation that I would prefer, the Seahawks do. So that that response from Micah has loaded into it the notion that the Cowboys were the ones who said to Lawrence, we are breaking up with you. Yeah, and the envy, the the envy could also be Parsons or it could be envy and exactly. Let me add something to Micah's rent or his comeback. He said, envy and rejection. It could also be exasperation on a part of Devarkos Lawrence. Rejection, Dallas didn't want me and my home is there, as he said in the interview with Hawk Blogger. So that's rejection. Envy could be Micah Parsons. He's got the podcast. He's going to get a huge contract from somebody. If not the Cowboys, somebody else is going to be a big contract. It's going to be record setting. But exasperation that he's able to do some things in that locker room. He's able to get away with things that rub some people the wrong way. It is Demarkos Lawrence alone. Is he the only guy in the Cowboys locker room who kind of finds Parsons off putting? I don't think so. Now, he's the first one to say it, but maybe that's part of this thing too. Like, yeah, like, how does this guy act like this? And he's one of our leaders. If he's one of our leaders, I know we'll never win the Super Bowl because this type of leadership does not lead to a winning culture. I think you might be hitting the nail on the head because this goes back to last April when Sean Sharif of 1053, the fan Dallas Cowboys flagship station said based upon four people in the organization that he spoke to that Micah's act is wearing thin. And we've seen squabbles and I can't remember the name of the defensive back. He was a former first round pick of the Indianapolis Colts went to Ohio State, play safety ended up. I remember everything but his name went to Dallas and and spoke out last year about Micah's podcasting habit. And that created a back and forth between him and Michael Parsons. And look, when a guy's off duty, I don't expect a football player to eat, breathe, live football 24/7. But there are certain hobbies that can undermine the attitude and the spirit you're trying to create in the locker room. It's the Aaron Rodgers bully pulpit on ESPN with Pat McAfee once a week where he strays down conspiracy rabbit holes and otherwise potentially says things to get undermined the idea that it's team, not me. Ben Rothberger used to do that in Pittsburgh on 93 7 the fan. He would do a Tuesday afternoon call in that would generate one or two stories a week. And he would piss off a teammate or two from time to time by saying things that were better left unsaid in a public forum like that. So and there is a double standard here because twice per week during the season, we hear from Jerry Jones on 105 3 the fan saying all sorts of things that create news. But this idea that even though Parsons is a great player, there is a quiet pushback against him in the organization from players and maybe, maybe front office that for as great as he is, he just doesn't fit with what we're trying to do. And to the extent that he's a leader, he had a tweet after Lawrence left that it's my time now with a lion head. And and he was talking about leadership. Well, there's good leadership and there's bad leadership. And I think what this rift between Lawrence and Parsons is showing is the reason why it's different in the building as to whether or not Parsons leads in a good way or a bad way. And I'm not making a conclusion because I don't know what's going on inside the building. Right. I know this. I know this. There's there's a there's a leaker to spraying out of the the wall. And you got to wonder how far this might go. It's going. It's going a lot farther. I'm going to tell you that right now. And you know, it is because of Micah Parsons. He's got the platform. This is just how he's wired. He is not going to take the high road. He is not going to show any type of restraint and give Demarcus Lawrence to the last word. So it's got to we'll have more. We'll have more to it. And it doesn't speak to also who the Cowboys are. Now, I know we'll talk about it later, just like their whole team building philosophy. But it just really speaks to how fragile a good team or building a championship team can be. It's not just talent. And so I think that Jerry Jones, if I give him credit or give him blame, it's in the same same category. I'll give him credit. Him and the people around him know how to find talent in the draft. They do they draft well. But it seems like they focus on talent and not necessarily how it all comes together. So this is the case of Micah Parsons saying it's my time now. We'll think about it. The guy was just drafted, what, five years ago? How to Penn State? Yes. So five years. So five years for Micah Parsons. He's entering year five. He's entering year five. Okay. So this is going he's going into year five. Lawrence has been there for a decade. So it takes the right kind of team, some, you know, championship teams, some, some championship teams, they say, well, you're more talented. You're one of the captains. I will follow your leadership even though I've been here longer than you have. Let's look at Kansas City. Travis Kelsey has been there longer than Patrick Mahomes. But I think they're both leaders. But Kelsey, if he needs to, will follow Mahomes. It's fine. Okay. Got it. This is how this is how we roll. I think that just this is one of the problems. Lawrence, I was here first. Here comes this loud, brash, rookies, talented. But sometimes he doesn't know what he doesn't know. And I'm just not feeling all the things that he does. I mean, that probably factors into it as well. We're going to learn more. I'm going to sit back. I don't know if you know this popcorn is my favorite snack. It really is. So I will have it ready for round three or round four, wherever we are. Popcorn is awesome. I have two popcorn machines in the house. Cattlecorn. There's a certain type of kettle corn that's low calorie. I can't remember the name of it or I give them the free advertisement. We have it in the house all the time. It's in a purple bag, light purple bag. It's awesome. And I tripped over something else the other night because I wanted to have a snack. I went and picked up some dinner. And on the way back, there's a store right down the hill, which is a good thing. And it can be a bad thing. And I found a type of popcorn that is drizzled with just a little chocolate and it has tiny, the tiny little M&Ms with it. And man, that's that's something I just need to like eat that and nothing else for two days. So I never want to eat it again. Because I've got that's a new problem for me. Anyway, anyway, um, the, uh, the situation in Dallas, two points I want to make with Kelsey and my homes. After the first year that it was obvious that my homes is the real deal. Kelsey attached himself to my homes. Yes, he did. Texas Tech made a run in the NCA men's basketball tournament. And there's my homes. And right next to him is Kelsey. Wherever my homes went, Kelsey went, because Kelsey knew I've been waiting all these years for somebody who's going to take me to the top of the mountain. And I finally found the guy who's going to take me there. I love Alex Smith, but this guy's a little better than Alex Smith. You know, right? I know special when special walks through the door and my homes has the right personality. He's all about football. He's never changed through all of the fame and all of the money and everything that could cause him to be big time. He's the same kid he always was. And, and with Parsons, you're right. There's something about the personality and the way he carries himself and the way he handles himself that's rubbing people the wrong way. And maybe he just doesn't have the self awareness. I think that's one of the key things. When you have somebody stumble into a workplace and cause problems, it's Michael Scott, lack of self awareness. And you don't understand how the way you behave is going to be received by others. You're so focused on your own life, your own stuff, your own thing. There's no sensitivity to how you being caught up in your own vortex of self interest is going to cause other people to react. It may be that simple. And one other point, Michael, and I don't know how much effort is put into this by teams, but it should be. When, when picking a jury, something that once upon a time in a galaxy far, far away, I did. You scrutinize the individuals for certain characteristics or traits that will or won't be conducive or not conducive to your client's interests in whatever the case may be. That's just what you do. One thing that I don't think lawyers think about enough, how is this group that I have selected? There's only so much you can do. You can't craft a jury. You just kind of prune a jury. But how is this group going to work together? How are it when it's time to close the door and deliberate the case? How are these? And it's usually six in civil cases. How are these six people going to work together? And I think if you're putting together a football team, Michael, you need to ask yourself, Hey, how are these 53? And more importantly, how are the core, the guys that we know are going to be here, the guys are going to be on the field, the guys who are going to be the focal point of the media, how are they all going to work together? And I don't know that that's a factor that you have the luxury to really focus on if you're a team, but man, they should. And for all the consultants and all the money they spend on this, that and the other thing, there's got to be an expert out there in human dynamics can help you balance the right mix of personalities in a locker room. Yeah, you said it human dynamics. And I don't mean this as a shot at analytics because I do, I do value analytics and I value shot. It's okay. It's okay. I like it. I like it. I like to make the shot. I don't I don't like it as as a be all indoor. I don't like people who just focus on analytics and it didn't happen as much as in football as it does in baseball, baseball is out of control with it ridiculous. But people who think it's everything, you know, analytically, this is what we should do. We should always go forward in this situation. We should always bring in this type of player. We should use this pick in the in the first round, this pick in the fourth round, because analytically, this has been proven. Okay, fine. That that's just crazy. But there's an analytical side of things that has value. But those human dynamics, you really can't even it's an art. So there's a science and there's the art. And somehow the art and science have to work together. And when they do, that's when you get championship culture. And I know Jerry Jones has talked about this a lot and some players are excited about Brian Schottenheimer being there and Schottenheimer has talked about culture. And that's a little confusing to me because I just made sure I went back last night just because I like I do like the gossip part of this thing. So I went back last night and looked at the NFL PA survey again to see where Mike McCarthy ranked, you know, McCarthy got an A and players love playing for Mike McCarthy. So one of the things he was able to do is kind of manage the situation, not just Lawrence and and Parsons, but Lawrence about manage some situations in a locker room that I'm sure other things that we don't know about. Okay. So now that he's gone and Lawrence is gone, Schottenheimer, are you trying to say it's going to get better? It was Lawrence the problem. Are you going to do a better job than Mike McCarthy who got an A from the many of the players that you going to be coaching in 2025? I just I can't wait to see it all how it all plays out. We all know to consider our pits when it comes to odor, but what about our other odor zones missing that coverage keeps you from smelling and feeling your best. Keep every zone covered with the ultimate odor defensive player doveman plus care whole body dio, which keeps you smelling fresh and feeling confident. No matter what your day brings, tackle whole body odor with doveman plus care whole body dio spray doveman whole body dio defense against all your odor zones from pits to privates to feet. We're long lasting 72 hour odor protection. You'll be covered from morning kickoff through triple overtime. Doveman whole body dio goes on instantly dry with an aluminum free vitamin E infused formula tighten up defense against those odor zones this season. Find doveman whole body dio at Walmart today. There is one point I've been waiting to make here and it might be stale, but I just have to say it. I quit following baseball 30 years ago when the pirates lost to the Braves in the NLCS 1992 because I knew it was going to be a long time before the pirates when he good, I had no idea it was going to be 33 years in counting. I feel like brain that said bream. Yeah, that was said bream legan out of the well, he he managed to score from second on a routine. Slowest guy Barry bonds. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. That's my most painful baseball memory, but and my last baseball memory. I feel like baseball is so wrapped up in analytics that it has basically become a real life game of stratomatic. Do you remember stratomatic when we were kids and have anything else to do? I feel like baseball is just stratomatic baseball and the human element is completely dumped out of it. You can't do that with football. You cannot do that with football. Those personalities work together because the players aren't just out there in isolation doing their thing. I'm pitching. I'm hitting. I'm fielding. They are together and they are working in unison. It is a beautiful chaotic ballet when it's being done the right way. It's a complete and total cluster F when it's being done the wrong way, but how the personalities work together is critical. And I don't know that the Cowboys have the expertise to craft. I think they got lucky and Jimmy Johnson between luck and Jimmy Johnson and probably a little more Jimmy Johnson than luck. They put together a team because also what happens is when you have a very strong personality who runs the show, his way gets basically forced upon them and they submit and comply and they change. You know, if Michael Parsons comes kind of stumbling into the locker room as a rookie who's brash and oblivious with zero self awareness, the coach is going to grab him and tell him that's not the way you want to act or or he's going to grab to Marcus Lawrence and say, get a few of your teammates and show this guy, you know, give him a code red. Not not the kind that will kill him. Just the kind that will get him to submit to the will of the veteran leadership in the locker room and teach him a little lesson and not to be like hazing or anything like that, but just just to get him on board like braid head coach knows how to clunk heads together when he needs to to get the personalities to operate in a way that you don't have this crap in the locker room where this group of guys hates this guy and this group of guys hates that guy and has nothing to do with football. We got to solve all that shit. Sorry, Liverpool, or we're not going to be able to win football games. It's a very mercenary Machiavelli and simple task. We don't need any of this crap if we're going to try to win. So you you got a problem with him. We're going to work it out and you got a problem with him. We're going to work it out because it gets in the way I went in football games. Two quick things before you're done with baseball, I just say when you when you were talking about how you how you gave up on the sport, you know, you just kind of lost your way 30 years ago, I want to just bring you back in briefly. I want you to look up a story. This is hilarious. You're going to either be amused by it or enraged by it. You just let me know what it's going to be it's going to be one or the other. I don't know what it is. A story in the Boston Globe where Hall of Famer Jim Rice. You heard the story? No. Hall of Famer Jim Rice is at Red Sox Spring Training and they've got, you know, a top rated farm system and one of the kids comes up to Rice who's like 70 or 72 right now, something like this and says, hey, you know, I just have a question. Mr. Rice about my swing or about my approach in the box and Rice gives him advice and one of the analytics people who was not part of the conversation over. Here's the conversation goes in and says, no, we don't teach it that system. Jim Rice, we don't teach it that way now. We teach launch angle and Jim Rice had a lot of sorry London, sorry Manchester. Sorry Dublin. I mean, he went off on this guy and had to be calmed down. So you read the story, you tell me how you feel about that one. And the other thing is you mentioned Jimmy Johnson and some of the other great coaches. And they are, you know, Hall of Famer coaches, I wonder how they would deal with today's reality. I mean, everybody, it's not just Michael Parsons. Everybody, every player on every team, I'd be surprised if there's a team without a player who doesn't have a podcast. Every team has a player with a podcast. It's just a matter, the podcast, the platform's not the problem. It's how you handle it. So Michael Parsons handles it in a way where it's off putting to somebody. Whereas I'm on Ross St. Brown does his podcast and it's funny. I mean, he had a funny rant about the bears the other day. I mean, it's the podcast is not putting his teammates in uncomfortable positions. It's more conversational, it's more observational on football as opposed to, hey, we're going to go out, we're going to, you know, next year, we're going to kick the Eagles ass or the commander suck. I can't believe, you know, they came in and beat us. And so there's a difference. There's a way to handle it. And I wonder how some of the old time coaches would deal with with 21st century football. By the way, your Jim Rice story is an example of life imitating art because it kind of sounds like the things George Costanza used to say in the Yankees clubhouse and teaching guys how to work on the swing and suggesting cotton for uniforms and taking Danny Tartable and getting lost on the way to a PBS pledge drive. Anyway, there's some Costanza in that analytics guy that came over to Jim Rice and said that's not how we teach it. Jim Rice to me. I remember because there was a time that I was a bigger baseball fan than football fan. There was a time. And the summer was all about in the morning when you weren't reading the back of the cereal box. When you've had the box of cereal long enough that you've memorized the back of this specific box, I would like get into the box scores every day. I remember sitting there flipping the paper and and studying the box scores and trying to understand what the hell the RA is. And and Jim Rice was one of those guys. He was one of those. I wish he was a pirate guy because I mean, I like I remember he either hit for the cycle or came close to at one time. And he was just one of those guys. I was like, damn, I wish he was on our team. So I really don't miss that because I don't have the bandwidth to pay attention to baseball anymore. But I do kind of miss those days. I do kind of miss those days those summer days of following the pennant race, listening to games on a transistor radio with that plug that was way too big for your ear canal. I I yeah, I miss I miss those days for a lot of reasons. Anyway, um, I'm gonna be curious to see where this goes from here. If you have other former cowboys out there who might chime in on Team Demarcus, how many of the current cowboys are going to chime in on Team Micah will will it create some sort of a beef between teammates who don't jump in and support Micah? Will he have a problem with them? And the thing that is hovering over all of this, we had the conversation a week ago about whether or not they might trade Micah Parsons. Miles Garrett, since we last convened the weekly meeting of run PFT has gotten to $40 million a year in new money average on his contract. At what point did the cowboys say? Nope, not gonna do it. We're gonna do a Herschel Walker trade and we're gonna we're gonna hijack somebody for a bunch of draft picks and we're just gonna move on and you wonder if something like this will cause them or will be a factor in the pros and cons that might eventually lead to them doing it. Yeah, I think at this point, I think they're stuck. I think they're stuck. I think they have to I think they have to pay them. I think they're gonna pay them. Heck, can you imagine like how do how would the cowboys teams selectively aggressive? How does this team come out and say, oh, we're gonna we're gonna trade our our best defensive player. We're gonna we're gonna trade one of the best stars, just one of the best draft picks we've made here in the last 10 or 15 years. We'll trade them for a haul of picks because what are you rebuilding? Are you what are you what are you trying to what are you trying to say that you'd rather have a bunch of sixes and sevens than one 10. So I think they have to they have to come up with at least 40 you say 40 at least 40 if not 45 because Mike Parsons, although he has he doesn't have the resume. The Miles Garrett has he's still significantly younger. So he's an ascending player and the market is what it is right now. You're gonna have to pay for that. Yeah, I just wonder if there are some deeper issues at play here, will they will they eventually say and first you have to find somebody else who pay him and give up the value when you look at what the Steelers are paying DK Metcalf 33 million a year. They gave up a second round pick to get him. There's a balance to it. It's not like Herschel Walker anymore where it's one way. You don't have to worry about what you're paying the player. You're getting a contract. He comes and plays for you. The rules hold him with you for as long as you want to keep him. You don't have to worry about what the market is and how much you're going to pay. The more that Parsons is going to want, the harder it's going to be to get value. I think I'm with you. They got no choice at this point. They just have to come up with something, but you can't help but wonder whether or not this democracy towards Michael Parsons beef has unlocked something that could maybe maybe spiral a little bit and create issues in the locker room. Want to move on to one of the Cowboys point, but I want to share this with you because I was curious about whether or not Jim Rice, well, I was curious about when he hit for the cycle or if he was just close and maybe he was like a triple close or a double close or something like that, but that was always like that was like for some reason when I was a kid, I thought hitting for the cycle was like the ultimate thing because it was just so weird. You got a single double triple and home run in the same game. So I went to Google and earlier this week, Michael, the week began when Chris and I were trying to figure out where DK Metcalf fits in the list of the best receivers in the NFL. So I wondered what Google AI would tell me. I was curious and there were like 20 receivers listed and DK Metcalf wasn't one of them. Here's Google AI when I typed in Jim Rice hit for the cycle. Here it is. Here's the lead from Google AI. Well, Jim Rice is known for his heroic actions on August 7, 1982 when he rushed into the stands to help a young boy struck by a foul ball. He did not hit for the cycle in his career. So that's it. That's the first line of the Jim Rice. Now we know maybe that's how they're going to write obituaries in the future. They're just going to let AI do it. That's the first line of the Jim Rice by up and not not that it's a bad first line of an obituary. It's heroic action. I'd like to think he's known for more than rushing into the stands to save a kid that was hit by a foul ball on August 7, 1982. And AI needs an editor. I'm pretty sure that was a girl. I'm sure I'm pretty sure you rushed in to save a girl. So AI, I don't know. Now you make me wonder. If you get that part wrong, did he hit for the cycle? I know he... Jonathan Keene, Jonathan Keene, Google IIS says the boy's name is Jonathan Keene, who went on the graduate from North Carolina State University and become the CEO of C.E.A.H.D. in Raleigh, North Carolina. Or it could just all be wrong. It could just all be wrong. So I stand correct. How dare I question the all-knowing AI. I don't know. But anyway, that's your Jim Rice fact. He did not hit for the cycle. He did save a young child on August 7, 1982. Not to make light of that. But my point is, AI sucks. And everybody's infatuated with AI now, just that they were infatuated with analytics. To a certain extent, they both suck. AI sucks more. Okay. The Cowboys, possibly using analytics, possibly using AI. They are hot on the trail reportedly of one Cooper Cup. Super Bowl 56 MVP. Hey, if you can't win a Super Bowl, go sign somebody who has won one. Maybe that's the new approach. But Cooper Cup, and when you look at the depth chart, that would make sense. They've got CD-LAM and after CD-LAM, they don't have anybody. And that was the critique that we had in the Cowboys. Past catching core of the past couple of years. After CD-LAM, who is there? Brandon Cook's free agent. He likely won't be back, especially if they would get Cooper Cup. And that's been the real question with pegging Cooper Cup's value, Michael. Where does he fit on the depth chart? One of the big reasons he got cut by the Rams, they saw him as a number three. They'll pay their number two 20 million plus per year. They're doing it for Devontae Adams. We're not paying their number three 20 million a year. So the team's out there. If you see him as number three, you're not paying him. If you see him as number two, you'll pay him. The Seahawks reportedly also interested. They need a number two behind Jackson Smith and Jigba. The Cowboys need a number two. You look around the league. You can see where the teams are that could use a number two. Those become the teams that would potentially pay Cooper Cup the money that he was supposed to make with the Rams. And I think he's going to come out of this with a good contract. If that kind of interest is there as a number two, as a number three, maybe DeAndre Hopkins at five million on a one year deal because he's clearly number three in Baltimore. If you're number two, you're in a position to make a lot more. You know, it's the big question. And it just turns out, Mike, I don't know if you ever get caught up in these, you know, going down these rabbit holes or you just kind of get stuck watching something. So it just so happened yesterday, I don't know, seven o'clock, six o'clock eastern time. NFL network is showing classic Super Bowls. And so they have the Bengals, Rams, Super Bowl, where Cooper Cup just takes it over. And I'm saying, I was there, I was watching, you were there, who watched the game, but I just watched it again. I knew what was going to happen, but I had forgotten some stuff like I forgot right before the end of the half, Rams up 13 10. Hey, Matthew Stafford telling Van Jefferson go deep. I'm like, oh, they're about to go up 20 to 10. It was an interception. And so it was still 13 to 10. And so I'd forgotten some things. And one of the things I forgot was just how dominant Cooper Cup was when they knew the Bengals knew he was getting the ball and they couldn't do anything about it. I mean, every, they need to pick up a fourth down. They did a jet sweep the Cooper Cup. I need to pick up a, there's a tough reception. He gets it, takes the punishment. Just amazing. So the question, the Rams have already answered the question for themselves. The question for everybody else is, what's the difference between Cooper Cup 2021, just physical, just talent wise? 2021 Cooper Cup, Super Bowl winning catch right there, versus what we expect in 2025. And I, you know, I think it's, I think it's significant. He doesn't look, he's not the same player. And what's the irony is that if the Cowboys get them, that will mean the Cowboys who are generally cheap have paid top dollar at the wrong time for a guy who's 32 years old and declining. So if they get Cooper Cup, who makes sense for their roster, maybe not necessarily for their cap, he makes sense for their roster, probably as a number two or number three. But if you're going to get them, that means you're going to, you're going to out muscle, you're going to put some financial muscle on other teams and get this guy away, which is not really Cowboys like. Unless the pitch is, do you want to come to a place where you'll never win a Super Bowl? You never know. Yeah, I've already, I've already won one. So I've already won one. So do I want to come to a place where I can never win another one? Okay. Cooper Cup had a spectacular and historic season in 2021 145 catches 1947 receiving yards. He was threatening the all time catch record and the all time receiving yardage record single season. And yes, there would have been an asterisk because it was the first year of 17 games. He also led the league with 16 touchdown receptions since then the problem has been injury. The pro Cooper Cup point is if he had played in every game of every season for the last three years, he still would have had a thousand receiving yards, but he didn't. That's the other side of it. You've got to be available. You got to be healthy. He has missed in three years, Michael, 18 games. He's missed more than a season in the last three due to injury. And I know that sometimes it's just bad luck and stuff happens. But when you're going to commit money to a guy moving forward and you've had three years of stuff happens, shame on you. If you don't assume stuff is going to happen again, that's the challenge. And it could just be that Jerry thinks he can go get Cooper Cup cheap. Wouldn't you like to come play for the Dallas Cowboys Cooper Cup? Well, you get that star on your helmet and you get to go out there and catch football passes from Dak Prescott and get to play in our big old stadium. And who cares about winning the Super Bowl and yeah, money and all that we don't have state income tax. And if you become a football player with Dallas Cowboys, maybe you can get yourself into broadcasting one of these. I mean, I, you know, I could see him throwing an arm around Cooper Cup and trying to get him to take less than another team might pay because that's what they tried to do with their own guys. They try to use playing for the Cowboys as some sort of tangible value unrelated to how much is in your weekly game check. Yeah, I don't know if that's going to work. That never does. It never does with their guys, but it doesn't stop them from trying. Yeah, it's a nice try. It won't work if he's got a limited market. And we'll find out just how, you know, what the market is. When the Rams gave them permission to seek a trade or they're trying to find a trade and they couldn't, they couldn't find anybody. That could be because of the contract or it could be, hey, there's just not, there's not an interest in this player who is, who's gone from a number one receiver, even if you call him a number one slot receiver, he was still number one. He was a number one option. You lead the league in all those categories. You're a number one receiver. He was to a number three. All right, what, what do you pay for that? And so I think he's going to have a lot of teams interested. He's going to have a handful, I guess a half dozen teams to be interested in Cooper Cup. But only a couple of them will say, yeah, we're going to give you a pretty good deal. We'll have some incentives and we'll make that contract look respectable when one of the insiders announces it and says, hey, Cooper Cup signs for, you know, two years and, you know, 38 million, but then we'll find out as like, you know, 16 million guaranteed. You forgot something. Cooper Cup signs with insert name of team for insert value deal negotiated by insert name of agents. You forgot that part. They never say negotiated by general manager of the team that signs him. They never say that deal negotiated by insert names of agents and we're required contractually to do that because they're also our sources. And look, I understand, I understand how the game is played. But I'm sitting there thinking, and we're in the business, Mike, so we know what's up. But if if I'm not involved, if I'm not in sports media, I'm thinking, who gives a shit? I don't care. Yes. There it is. That's a first one. Yes. Sorry, Manchester. But you don't care. Why do I care what agent negotiated a deal? And so that's what's required to get the scoop for, you know, to get it 39 seconds before you go down the street and give it to somebody else. I think that's crazy. You know what's going to happen? I mean, Sims and I have been dropping S bombs and F bombs on this show forever. But Michael Holly, respected, distinguished member of the media, appearing on PFT Live, he comes in and he says who gives his shit and it's going to go viral. Because Michael Holly did it. The rest of us do it. It's no big deal because we do it all the time. But that's good. Welcome. Check the boxes. The bosses, the bosses will write you now. Listen, this has gone too far. We got a language restriction. We got a language restriction on PFT going forward. And let me tell you, to the point we were just discussing, the bosses do pay attention because I got an email from a very high level executive this week asking me, why do these people greeze the agents in every tweet they post? And we went back and forth and it's like, oh, well, okay. So, but you're right, to somebody who doesn't live it like we do it, it doesn't make sense. And they don't care. No football fan cares who represents any of these players. They just don't care. But it's free advertising for the agents. That's the thinking. The mindset is, I got this contract for this player. And if you hire me, I'll get it for you as well. All right. The show is completely off the rails today in more ways than one. We were supposed to talk about the market floors and micro parcels for a little while before we pivoted all sorts of stuff about the Seahawks. 46 minutes later, we're going to take a break and when we're returned, we'll pivot to all sorts of stuff about the Seahawks. 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Hour 1: Mike Florio (@ProFootballTalk) and Michael Holley (@MichaelSHolley) discuss latest news in NFL including former Cowboys teammates Micah Parsons and DeMarcus Lawrence having a fresh beef and the Cowboys making a push for Cooper Kupp.