Hello and welcome to the top floor, the podcast where Charlotte area CEOs get to tell their leadership journey. My name is Jeff Cass. I'm an executive coach and the leader of a peer advisory group for CEOs and business leaders and I'll be your host today. And happy to have Parker Perion from diamond solutions with us today Parker welcome. Hey Jeff good to be here. Yeah, glad to have you. You and I got a chance to talk a little bit before and you and I both have roots in the Midwest, but we both ended up here in Charlotte. So maybe let's start with that. How did you end up down here in Charlotte. Yeah, well, good question. I think the big basically the big thing was is, as honestly, it's my wife's health, right? We had She's had a long journey of chronic health issues and so snubbed that fear of leaving what's known right can keep you and I had a moment or I'm like, I think are we going to live in Michigan. For the rest of our life. I mean, comfortable. Are we going to seem like, you know, environment was part of her struggles around some old stuff and so We explored the Cayman Islands as the people that with her on this had, you know, just some groups where there was like they were people were moving there and we're doing like life changing. And so we went and actually was incredibly helpful for her. Just the man, I tell you what, living on an island. Yeah, far, but the logistics were pretty wild. So obviously, yeah, we flew me flew back to the States. We ended up stopping in Charlotte and it seemed like she did well in Charlotte and then just thoughts around, you know, a booming city that's growing with mold concerns. You know, you know, new schools going up and it was like, hey, maybe we can kind of plug into that and Yeah, more sunshine than central Michigan and you can still drive to Michigan. You don't have to fly to the Cayman Islands or, you know, you know, go back that way. So those are all good things. That's right. That's right. Yeah. Yeah, the logistics are a little bit easier to get to the Midwest. We were from Ohio. So for us, we can easily drive back right up 77 and for you, it's not that different, just a little bit further to get to Michigan, huh? Exactly. Yeah, it's not bad. Yeah, well, good. Okay. Well, let's talk a little bit about your business. You and I talked. I mean, you've been in and around the asphalt and concrete for quite a while and it's morphed a bit. So I'm anxious to kind of hear that story, but maybe just tell us first and let's just start with what do you do. Yeah, so we are a we are a broker of asphalt and concrete services. So we were a consolidator and we have, yeah, data and systems that allow us to basically simplify the process of, you know, our customers, property managers, facility managers work on on their properties across multiple states. Okay. Okay. So are your clients, are they typically commercial or are they more residential only commercial only commercial. Oh, okay. All right. Yeah. So now you. So you made this switch where you were self performing. You were doing the paving. You were doing the concrete and then you decided, well, this is a better direction. So talk about that because that's a big change. There's a big shift. Yeah. When we moved and I always, you know, told you that God's is kind of part of the story. So when we moved to Charlotte, we thought it was for my wife's health. That was, you know, our logical reason. And honestly, since we've been here three years. She's still really sick. In fact, last year, she was the sickest I've ever seen her in 12 years. So we're kind of okay, God, like what, you know, what are you doing here. Right. But when we first moved down here, we had our crew move us in. To our rental at the time we were building a house. And so we move and they're moving us in and Just, you know, just get close to the people that, you know, and they start hearing some stories and some things and cultural issues is like, man, I, we had to have a consultant that said, you know, Parker, you guys have a really confusing business model. You know, at the time we were five million in sales. And so He, we had four with us moving to Charlotte was kind of in theory, four locations, right? Two in Michigan and now two in the in the Carolinas. And he's like, yeah, like four locations, five million dollars. Like some people have, you know, two locations at 20 million, maybe, but like, not And so we already had this kind of in our mind of like, okay, should we be consolidating our shops? We had our all of our kind of a crew in Michigan with in Greenville, Michigan, and then in Midland across the state three hours away was all of our office. People and so it's like, how do you either lose your office or you lose your, lose your guys that do the work? And we honestly, we didn't pull in the plug and we just said, hey, we're going to move the shop to Midland. And we were really blessed. A lot of our guys moved across the state. We didn't ask them to, but they said, hey, we want to stick with you and really be the community and the culture of that. Not not expected, right, but just, you know, thankful. So moved to Charlotte heard some things and we're like, guys, I think we need to, we need to move the shop to Charlotte. What's best for the company and in doing that, you know, as you can imagine, the guys that were two and a half hours away in Greenville said, hey, man, you know, we're not going to, we're not going to work for us. Yeah, so that kind of forced our hand, right? We had work that was still rolling in. We had a sales guy for that region and Yeah, started started, you know, we had jobs rolling in and it was like, what do we do? So I called some friends that have asked about companies and I said, Hey, I need this silica today. I need this paid and started getting prices back that were that were like, oh, this makes sense, right? Like, we can still make money and they're making money and Honestly, I think I thought that the margins would just be so slim that it just didn't make any sense to do it. Well, we shut that idea down that, hey, if you sub work out, you know, it works for certain models, but it's usually a higher revenue, lower margin, lower over and just we weren't staffed for that. So when the eyes were open to the idea that, hey, you can still make good money and sub. I was like, well, this is interesting. So we started doing that in the Southeast. Okay. And I think it was probably October. This was right, right, you know, post COVID. So One of the I'll never forget. I wish I could forget this because it was not pleasant, but man, I think we had 100 resumes. We're trying to hire in Michigan. And we were going through people. Nobody's showing up after we hire them, right? Yeah. I'm like, guys, you don't know what you're doing. I mean, my arrogance is unfortunate, but I was like, I'm gonna get involved. So I start, you know, they can, I'll hire some people, right? I got 20 people hired five or 10 of them. Nobody showed up. And I mean, you had all the vibes that were right. Like they were they were good dudes that were going to show up and it's like, they're just they're just hunting for their unemployment. I'm not interested at all, right? Yeah. So So that was kind of like, guys, this is this is exhausting. I mean, slowly people were we're falling off for different reasons. We're leaving. It was just a hard, hard time for everybody in the world, right? So I think it was October when he kind of pulled the plug and I forget the exact dates on the kind of North Midwest operations. Hey, guys, it's working so well in the Southeast to sub workout. Let's just we're kind of trying to flirt with it up North and it was both. And so when we kind of pull the drug and pull the plug and committed to we're all in build processes and systems around how do we source and how do we how do we put the right sub with the right job? Not everybody can pay a Walmart, but maybe that guy can pay patches at a Walmart, right? So it's kind of sizing up and profiling your subs and that's a really big part of matchmaking. Mm-hmm. So talk a little bit. That's interesting. I mean, you know, so you went in a couple phases. You still have the operation where you're self-performing in Michigan and here you were not. When you were before when you were completely self-performing, how many employees did you have at that time? You know, we got up to It was around 50 50 employees, you know, at five million and when we have around 20 million now and we have around 40 now at 40. Okay. Are they all on Charlotte then or are they? No, I mean, we're, you know, it's um It's a blessing and a curse. I think we've I think we're we're spearheading this idea, right? I mean, we're completely remote I mean, we have we have no offices anymore. I have mixed feelings on it. I think there was a season where it felt really freeing and light And uh, there are days now where I wish we could all just, you know, gather in a conference room and have a party, you know, and not be like We have a we have a midwest quarterly get together. We have a mid-southwest. It's kind of air. We have a place in Arizona We've got I don't know how many states we have people in, but it's uh I don't know probably 10 states. Okay. Okay Yeah, it's interesting. I've talked to a lot more people about virtual businesses and running them I I was actually just talking to a marketing company And I did an interview with the CEO who runs a 100 virtual marketing company And how do you engage with the employees? That's part of the challenge, right? I mean, you're not, you know, you're not with them Like you said, you know, you get together quarterly, but how do you do it? How do you stay engaged with everybody? I love that question. Yeah, I think it's you know, I think of all of the things that we I think we're really intentional about it. So I I don't think that we totally fail I think it's actually I think something we do quite well, um, but there's still days where I feel like I wish there was more But we um just to like in no particular order, but we'll do things like I would call it coffee roulette So every week or every other week Everybody will hop on a call. We do breakout rooms We have questions and it's usually five to six people in a room And it's just a time to like is that you know, uh, water cooler conversation, right? Here and it's great. I mean, I honestly it works people You can laugh and you get to know people at a more personal level Um We have a monthly all hands, you know, which is everybody on a call wait for us to kind of bring everybody together give company updates and It's uh, obviously in the post-covid zoom days now of just being able to Uh, you know, all of our meetings are video. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Is that I mean that that honestly is um I don't think you can understand how how helpful that is. I think Mm-hmm. You know, this right here you can get you don't have to I don't have to fly to you to have a podcast with you or uh, honestly, we'll go with in Charlotte, but uh, you know, you know, I mean like you can have podcasts and so how many in California and it's It's great Well, I had a podcast yesterday with somebody that was in India It was eight o'clock in the evening when we did it and uh, he and I were talking just like you and I were talking And we talked for an hour and a half and it was great. I mean, so uh, I I think back to the pre-covid days And I don't know if you did any, uh, video conference calls in our business. We did none So it was a huge change for us to go to video So maybe, you know, was there a adoption for you during that time as you kind of, you know, transition from the in-person, you know, to more virtual I think the absolutely was I remember when he had to make it mandatory that you had your video on I mean it was like Show up and be involved when nobody was there. It's like I think we missed the I didn't realize we had to, you know specify, but please do your hair, you know Get get out of your pajamas and uh, you know, yeah, we want to see your face. Yes Um, I think the other thing was I think being all in on it You know, there was a moment where we were kind of we still had an office in midland michigan and uh You know, you're kind of thinking about doing an office in the southeast and we ended up pulling the plug on on the Yeah, the rent in michigan. Mm-hmm. Let's take that money and put it towards Culture Get togethers towards, you know, quarterly meetups or you know, we have biannual leadership team get together So next week actually and then the leadership teams flying in and we're going to go, you know, do some fun stuff have some You know halftime, but just taking that that money and saying we don't meet, you know, the office is cool But like just committing to what, you know, if we're virtual we're virtual But then you need to bring us and make us not virtual at times, right? It's so interesting. I think our options now are so different and I think a lot of the employees Somewhat expect more options that way whether it's all in vert or it's all virtual or it's some kind of hybrid, right? I mean, do you find that now as you're hiring people? That that um, sorry, what was the question that they want that they want some kind of flexibility whether it be 100 virtual or some kind of hybrid I think it's almost always a positive From what I gather I will say that I don't know that I always feel the same enthusiasm that they do that they get to like You know probably work from their home Yeah That being said, I'm not not excited about it. I think it's just there's there's a level of like, oh, I have freedom and I'm like, okay, I don't get too excited like Yes, but there is still expectations responsibility, you know, so I think it's worked well. We haven't had I mean, there are people all over and I feel pretty connected to We have a product manager for our tech team is in in Washington and we have I weekly meetings and I mean, it is. Yeah, there's there's just there's connectivity and it's not Yeah, I think it's good things. Yeah, the business world is different. I think, you know, one and one thing is employees But how about for your customers? Uh, or you know, your clients or even your partners that you're brokering to I mean, are they adapting to this? You know, just like the employees are It's a great question If I start with customers, I think that we are still working out what it looks like to serve a customer virtually Okay. Okay. I think that is to me. It's a fun challenge. I think it is very much a challenge. How do you, uh, you know, there's there's the local You know, good old boys club, right? And how do you come into that? You know, are we gonna fly all over the us like that's exhausting, right? Like I don't we really don't travel that much so Uh, we found things man. Like my one of my favorites is crumble cookies We we send crumble cookies to the office do the party pack 12 and dude people love it I mean, it's it's cool. Um, another one that we've been doing is is the handwritten cards I don't know if you've seen this but where you can type up a message and and I Mixed feelings, but it's a handwritten card, right? And and I you know, you can automate the AI of what how it writes the card I I don't do that. I actually write the card But probably wouldn't be able to read my handwriting if I did write it. So it's kind of nice to have Do that part of it for me But it will ship the card to them. You can add a gift card Uh to now I start my gift card and they package it for you ship it and honestly the feedback on that is Uh, it's that personal touch which we know the handwritten card days that you know, we're kind of almost going back to I feel like Oh, yeah, it's you know, AI's automated everything. So if you actually take time to to say something and it was you It's amazing. So Yeah, those are a couple examples of just things. I think that we do with our customers to try to make it feel a little closer Okay, okay And how about how about then your partners? I mean, you know them more you probably do repeat business with them is that is an issue with Virtual or do you find that that it works pretty smoothly? Yeah, I think there's more to be done. I think Um, we have project managers on that are local to our job sites So that part of you know, there is a diamond representative on site on most of our sites Okay, I think that that you know, we're we're largely still overseeing the project. Um hands hands involved Um So so there is still a diamond person talking with our subs, which I think helps Um, there's not as much of the whining and dining. We do some of that, you know, we're we'll throw in, you know, a subs Near a headquarters oftentimes, you know, might you know, somebody will take them out to eat uh, so But by and large, I mean, I think that they're excited to get work You know, I think that at the end of the day that the numbers work and it's we've simplified it and generally we hear great feedback on our jobs are just like We we've eliminated a lot of the complexity, right? So you walk in, you know exactly what to do Uh, we've kind of done all of that not fun stuff so that when they can show up they can actually do what they love to do Which is grind and pave and paint Yeah, that's interesting because I was talking to another business a law firm And they were talking about, you know, some of the things that they did well and what they did well with the marketing I mean, and so they found the customers, you know, they kind of found the issue the cases and things like that And it sounds like maybe if you look back on your, you know, history Is that what you did? Well, because it seems to have fit into what you're doing today. Maybe you can just comment on that That's a great question. Um, you should specifically run marketing Yeah, so marketing finding customers setting up jobs. It seems like, you know, that's something that you guys Must do very well because that's what you do 100% of the time today 100% yeah, no exactly. I would say this. I think that We we call ourselves a Marketing and sales sales marketing and technology company at this point, right? Okay We and we we say our our uniques are like we're clear simple and fast so we've taken the complexity of an industry that is Uh, and we're still doing this, right? But this is this is one of the things I'm super passionate about is taking this these complex Parking loss That some people scratch their head and go how do you solve this and saying it's it's it's not that complex Let's let's not a little bit and say hey, we're gonna go down two inches. We're gonna put back two inches like it's That's a way oversimplification, but I think just taking some of that. Uh, how do you fix this problem? Like well, it's that's fault, you know, uh, so Um, yeah, in terms of marketing, I would say You know marketing, I think you need marketing to get to the the ability to do what I love which is consult consultative selling, right? Like, okay. Well, uh, my actually my college degree or that I didn't finish so I didn't I don't have a degree But my what I was going for was counseling. Okay, so the idea of helping I always say that sales is is actually counseling or you know, you're serving somebody you're trying to help them solve a problem if you're a good sales so The idea of somebody saying hey, I've got a parking lot What do I do? I have this much money to spend and then thinking about the integrity of Them giving you your budget and you're not taking advantage of that but saying how can I actually help you steward that money? Well, that gets me super excited And then to prove them that you do honor that they told you their budget. I also love that I mean if they want me to spend, you know, they're a whole 200 grand and I will do that if that's what you want, but if you say hey, if I don't need to spend it I don't want to spend it for you. I want to treat it like it's my money, you know, so I think again I don't think that's whole I think there are other companies that do that But I don't think that's the the by and large the the integrity in the industry So I love being able to bring to a customer and saying hey We want to we want to partner with you to take care of your asset Okay, so you're really bringing I would say a knowledge of paving and concrete To help them, you know, get the most bang for their buck is really what you're trying to do I mean, you know, that's what it sounds like which may be different Sorry, what no, maybe he's a little different than some of the folks that you know are you know Trying to sell their their paving and concrete work Maybe that's a little different than what they had and that's the marriage I mean, I'm trying to I'm trying to see a little bit parker how this kind of comes together Right because it feels like you have some unique You have a unique a unique approach to sales and marketing Uh and a unique approach with clients that you know, maybe is helping you grow it Because otherwise this wouldn't be growing to the 20 million or whatever else you're going to be next year, you know No, that's right. I think When you think about the process I said something go go call a A plumber or an electrician You don't have a parking lot to manage. It's the same It's the same problems with your parking lot that you have as a homeowner trying to get somebody to come out and Answer their phone show up give you a proposal actually come back once you've signed like I want to pay you money Like please let me pay you to come help me and it's like You have it's like pulling teeth, right? And so yeah I think we're very much the opposite, you know when it comes to getting parking lot work done We're there. I always say like I want to drive the car for them as fast as they want me to drive I'm not trying to rush them. I'm not trying to be pushy but I want to take them and do everything that I wish somebody would do for me when it comes to overseeing parking lot Yeah, okay. Yeah, it makes perfect sense parker Now I want to go back to one thing you said because you still have people you have these project managers that are on site So your geography is not a hundred percent of the United States It's is it just where you have these uh, these project managers. Is that it? It's a great question. Yeah, we We tried the project managers do travel quite a bit. So, okay We're not in all 50 states. I think roughly at this point we keep growing, but I think we're in the 35 Um or so states that we serve well. Okay, that's expanding Uh, I kind of I kind of equated to door dash when I remember in midland, Michigan where I was from, you know I remember opening up the door dash. I happened at saying, you know Uh, basically like give make a request like like say that you want us here We're not here yet, but like how many people want us then when there's enough, you know demand We'll fire it up, right? But you need the drivers you need that they need the orders to make the drivers have work to do and so Our model kind of needs that um Similar model right you you have to have the subs But the subs like part of our value is is that we have subs that work for us Every week we have lots of subs that work for us every week. So Okay, job that needs to go tomorrow. We can get it done tomorrow And you don't have any crews. How do you do that? Well, if you call the sub that I call well, you don't have any buying power with them because you're one on but I need every day right or every other you know to be like probably an exaggeration, but the It's not hard to understand that buying power. There's a real value in that Seeing and I get better scheduling. So, um, again, I think that's one of the operational efficiencies that we bring Uh oftentimes if you were to call our subs Directly, you're going at higher price. It's going to probably depend on the time of the year How they're feeling that day If they're feeling like they can win from you or not We're a lot more structured in terms of like If you're this type of customer if you're a new customer like our our markups aren't Fluctuating based on I hate to say this but like oh, you're an old here at your grandma that you know, like Yeah, yeah, I know we can take advantage of because you're not going to price check us like we don't get into all of that minutia it's a lot more like There's some subjective criteria, right that this is the price that you gave. Yeah, okay. Okay. Yeah, it's pretty structured It sounds like Okay, all right Well, good that helps I think everybody kind of understand the business that's unique and the shift has been really cool I mean, that's kind of cool, you know as uh as we kind of unpack it here. So let's let's shift gears a little bit here Okay, so you as as you look at your team today, it's certainly changed You know, so if you had to give advice to a uh a ceo or a new leader on the important things The one to two most important things that they need to do in order to create a high performing team. What would it be? That great question I I think There I have a couple things to run with my mind. I think the one thing I would say that that changed our business was EOS Interoperating system traction You know, I always say that you could go to MD you can go get your MBA or you can go to college You can or you can retraction like it is the most practical business book I've ever read And it doesn't just tell you in theory, you know I always remember Jim Collins, but good to great talked about the idea of getting the right people on the bus And in the right seats and and maybe Jim talked about this but EOS took that and said well What is the bus? So the bus is your four values and Here's how you create your core values They give you a structure for how to think through and how to like almost a model for how to come up with them And kind of derive them from who you are, right? And then they said it's our uh, I think that the seats I remember it's been a minute, but are the um, are you familiar with traction? Oh, yeah, I it's on my so my shelf and Jim Collins is on this shelf over here. I don't know if you can see it, but they're both there I think traction calls at gwc get it gets it wants it and has the capacity So when you're putting somebody in a seat They say that do they have the capacity? Do they get the seat? Do they want the seat and do they have the capacity to fill the seat? Um, but the if you want to walk on my bus, you have to have my core values It's higher fire reward and review around core values, which I I just think is For so long we didn't do that and I remember when I when I got that book thinking oh, this makes so much sense Why some of these people I don't mind being friends with you. I just don't want to work with you Then you don't want to be hurt by that. It's just a thing like I don't want to work with somebody I'm like, hey, I want to grow and you're like, I don't want to grow That's fine then go find a different bus like there's nothing wrong with it But my bus is a growth bus like we are always learning always growing is one of our core values and what that means is We never plateau we reach the top of one mountain and we're looking for the next top. It's higher We're never satisfied and not everybody's built like that and that's okay But you are not going to enjoy being on this bus if you are wanting to kind of Coast and flip down the canoe and just kind of put the paddle in the boat and kind of You know what I mean? Again, there's not that's not right or wrong. It's not a moral issue. It's just So to me the work Right. Cool. What's that? It works, right? I mean we know that It does and it's so much finding on the other side of that. It's so much fun to work with people that have similar values Um That would be one of my pieces of advice and if we go after the question was just what would advice Would you give to a A CEO that's putting together a yeah eceo or leaders that are putting together high performing teams So eos you got to have those values, you know, make sure that everybody has those values. That's a great one. That's a perfect one I don't know. Maybe I'm trying to put a Forces when I'm here, but I just don't know how to not I think I think having priority straight man I think business will mess up. I think I think that you will you will jack up your prior You will put family last you will put god last you will put money first not because you want to but because you feel like you have to Right, there will be seasons where you have lots of money There's seasons where you're you don't have lots of money And if you if you just kind of blowing with the wind and you don't really know your order I mean first right it's god first. I wear the shirt. I would say I don't wear it for you I work for me when I wear this out it reminds me that I need to live with my pro or priority straight, right? Okay, it's god. It's my wife. Then it's my kids. That's god and family It's my wife is she is she is next right and then it's like And then it's diamond and I will tell you I jack that up all the time But I I believe that and I try to live with that structure, right? Okay So I think that that is To me if you don't have that then you're gonna you're gonna do worse You know, they used to call an asphalt season. There's an octopus divorce season. It was like you know husbands are never home. They're always out at work and marriages are you know being sacrificed and it's like Onward that find a different career And that's what that's welcome that you can't if you can't struck you have So yeah So so you're saying for the leader Make sure you have your priorities first because if you don't have your priorities first Then the people that are coming into the business are going to be jacked up as well, right? Is that what you're saying? I think you're gonna you're yeah You can't lead with you with thinking things aren't good at home for you and you're going home in your wife's best It just doesn't work. It will you can you can you can make it through a year You maybe maybe two But when your life starts falling apart because your priorities are jacked up It will trickle down and and it will be hell to work in a company That has that kind of messed up priorities. I don't know if that I'm saying it well, but I think it's Well, I think it's a great point parker and I think I don't know your whole history But you know, I know you lived in Michigan You had a very different business and you know, you were thinking of moving to the Caymans You moved to Charlotte and you've changed the whole business plan and how many years later you're still going, right? So I guess and how many years has it been since you started the business? Well, my dad started when I was 17. I'm 34 So that was 17 years ago and then I bought him 2014 So 14 is kind of what I feel like You know, that was what I would say that I took over and started going So 10 years No, 10 years I mean you've gone through a lot of change in 10 years and you've continued to develop a team and the businesses continue to develop So I think you have a lot of credibility and what you say is kind of my read on that. Okay Yeah, no, I appreciate that. I think this is maybe a good tie-in to one of the personal things That happened. I don't need it. I mean, this isn't a sob story. This is just a fact We found out in October of 23 Yeah, 22. Sorry. October 22. We thought we got that call and nobody wants to get the hey, you know, you have a baby We knew we had a baby, but Hey, some testing came back and your baby is likely to have tried so many 18 Um, I'm with my wife Colin. She's trying. I'm like, we we elected not to run the genetic test Why did they run the genetic test? And I was this whole moment feeling You know violated that the medical assistant and honor, you know, this Anyway, whatever so God got new though, right? So we're thankful at this point to say that we we walked into January when theia was born With the knowledge of her condition and the ready and prepared for her to not live and we were told that she would You know 1% chance she'll make it out alive Day 2. I mean, it was just so like they don't live. It's basically what we're told. So You're ready, right She's still alive. So that's that's parting a little bit She's still laughing um and doing well all things considered but You think about the business before we moved in the business before thea there's no way when thea was born I took off from work. I spent time with my daughter that we didn't know how many days we were gonna have with her, right? And I was that and the business was able to continue on So I just think about how God goes before us and he in our move to charlotte being around a good medical system and a good um and the business model changing like There's no way there is no way that with the self-opera, you know self-performing crews all over all of the headaches issues I was constantly on the phone constantly dealing with that and I was able to give my little girl Focus attention that I needed to give her and then the fast performance after thea was born hope got super sick And this goes back to those priorities, right? Is it business or is it family and so hope got super sick like to the point where she couldn't she couldn't move And I don't know how to like if you imagine like she was a vegetable You think about a vegetable like she could sell if she couldn't move her hands. She could she couldn't really text on her phone She couldn't talk providing us a week, right? I think it was two months and this is you know We've she'd had crashes ups and downs throughout her medical journey, you know And I thought okay, she'll bounce back and it was about two months and one of her brothers, you know, pulled me aside I was like, hey, man, I think you need to like consider You know Maybe pulling back from work and really focusing on like she's just laying in bed every day and she's not getting better And I'm like it was kind of it was a good. Yeah, so I ended up pulling back from work. I You know in the middle of trying to grow and all of these things that are happening. I was just like I I'm I'm gonna take care of my wife. Yeah, so I Started researching Reading books, listening to podcasts and you know when I woke up in the morning I wasn't thinking about time and I was thinking about I was thinking about how to help my wife, right? You have to fight for her when she can fight for herself. So I I just I say that all to say I think that if you don't have your priorities right, man I didn't ask for that, you know, but if you don't I caught playing the hand And I tell people that you can focus with a bad hand I don't I don't think that the hand that I I have is what anybody else wants But I will tell you that I'm happy hopes happy we're thankful Right, but the biggest part of that is is playing the hand. I had these cards in my hand I have a daughter with special needs. I have a wife that can't walk What am I gonna do? Am I gonna try to wish that I have I had this life over here? Am I gonna wish that I was at the beach this weekend? No, I'm gonna be where I'm at and I'm gonna write live the life that I have that I've been given and I don't know how to If you play the hand that you're dealt There is joy in that like I don't play but it is so it is so much fun To try to be creative with what you have versus wish you had something that you don't Yeah Yeah, that's cool. I mean that's interesting and there's a lot that's happened there I mean, so thea is doing well. All of these considered is hope doing better than she was last year She she is. Yeah, she's had currently in the middle of a little bit of a down, but the rollercoaster continues but She's a lot of updates. I think around February. She started having days where she was walking It would just be a day, but it was like I'll take it one day of hope walking and then she you know be down So thea just spent three weeks in the hospital again You know, is it do I love being in the hospital? No Uh, but she's home. She's smiling We're thankful for more time with her. Yeah, all right. Yeah, it's it's it's can be challenging to get to go with the flow, but uh Yeah, when i'm at the hospital that you can enjoy and that you you know, go ahead. What do you say? No, I park. I think it's great advice. Listen, I heard somebody say the other day I was talking to them and they said be where your feet are, you know, be present basically, right? Which I think is a you know, I never heard that term before but be present is kind of what you're saying, right? You know, be where you're at, you know And more importantly have the priorities that kind of allow you to be present are the things that are the most important for you, right? So that's that's really cool. That's I think that I don't think anybody could have answered that question better. I appreciate that marker, okay? All right, so let's keep going here. So let's talk a little bit more than Unless there's anything else you want to bring up a bunch of family, you know or the priorities I mean, is there anything else you want to talk about there? I think we covered it. Okay. All right, so let's shift a little bit then Let's talk about maybe the challenges you have today with the way the business is because it's you know I'm sure it's not all sunshine and rainbows even though you've made this transition I mean, there's still challenges. So what kind of challenges do you have? Yeah, I think I mean at 20 million we're facing a ceiling and we're we're trying to break through the 20 million ceiling and we're I've always been fascinated with these these so-called ceilings You know, it's funny. We had we kind of had a ceiling at five million We spent three years at five and then all of a sudden it was nine and then it was 18 and in 20 and it's like Okay, boom boom boom and then right now this 18 20 million area is It's been a challenge. So, you know, we staffed up for growth You know that having two years in a row where we were doubling we were we were burning people out and you know Asking so much and so we kind of like I think we can hit 30 million And so we staffed up for that 30 and and and that creates some problems right when you're on year two of The people in place and the structure in place for that growth, but it's not coming. So I'm leading through that and Making the adjustments that are needed to make sure that you know, we we Are able to keep going right. So I think that that's uh, that's definitely a challenge Growing quickly. I think it's just a challenge. I mean, I think You know, people told me this early on but growing from one million to two million is not the same as 10 to 20 or 20 to 40 It's very different. So Yeah, I think that's one of the big the big challenges I think, you know, I I have a phrase that hard isn't that and and easy isn't good That's another one of those like core beliefs for me that if you think that easy is good. Good luck, right? Yeah That is how we are taught that is the world that we live in that's what's preached to us is that you should chase easy like Oh, I had a good day. Well, it was good about it. Well everything kind of went went well, right? I mean, there's nothing wrong with that I don't know that I would recommend chasing the hard days or trying to chase things that are all jacked up but but it's when we grow is when things are hard and so I think that we're in a season of tremendous growth We are we've leaned on other companies for marketing and this year we've really said hey, we're gonna learn marketing. So We are I don't know how many hooks in the pond we have different, you know methods of marketing But we're probably have eight eight or so give or take And avenues that we are pursuing leads. I mean we on an average month We're around two to 400 leads a month of qualified leads that come in that we wow system. That's great. So We're certainly reaching people, which is great I think you know figuring out how to reach them and serve them well and You think about segmenting your customers and we went for a while it was You know, who are your target customers? It's full property managers and and we knew that we didn't want to do residential and we knew that we didn't like working with GCs You know, that was two things be like, okay, every job we do for a GC We show up they say it's ready to go and it's like literally never ready And there's always dumpsters in our way and painters over here and it's like this is awful We want to do and we can't get it done. So GCs kind of we rolled out for now and then residential And I think right now we're in the process of saying okay, hey Is everybody else fair game is a church fair game? Is somebody going to one property fair game or is it do we want to try to target people that have 30 plus properties, you know, so we're not we don't have that dialed in yet, but we're kind of in our process We only have so many people and we can only serve so many people and it's great to have leads but Can we get hundreds of people the right type of service? So that's a journey man. Just trying to figure out But I would say that's probably the hardest thing right now. It's just um Seeing closed rates, you know somewhat drop as volume increases and trying to figure out. Okay. Well, what what are we wouldn't we stop doing? What are we lacking? Um, those rates are changing You know, so I spent a couple for a month. I spent some time like digging into calling customers and Getting feedback on are we delivering what we said we deliver or you know The sales process like and I get all this great feedback. I'm like you guys are one of the best times We never work with somebody like you Again, I'm like, well, that's great, but not really helpful Um, I'm hoping for a little more like yeah, you guys really dropped the ball on this project I'm like, well, I can work with that. I don't like it, but I can work with that, you know, right So currently I've felt as honest as we're still looking for kind of that What is it that we need to change to kind of help? Grow beyond this point. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, it sounds like you're doing a lot of the right things I mean, it's not bad to get good news from customers I mean if that's the type of customer you want to deal with and you want to keep finding more of them and a bigger geography or whatever That is, but I can understand kind of the journey here you're going through this So that's kind of cool So as you as you come into these kind of problems or you discover them These challenges maybe is a better way to say it Who helps you with those decisions? You have a good coach or mentor that helps you with these That's a good question Yeah, I'm trying to think so we have I'm in our leadership team is just eight players like we have great Yeah a great team around us So obviously, you know We have that internal team that we lean on. I am a part of a C12 Is that Guys that get together once a month and we I can pick their brains and They pick mine. So that's a that's been a good group of other CEOs Trying to think of uh, you know, sometimes I honestly I will yeah The last year and a half for me with with theia and then with hopes how challenge challenges are our days where I The hand that I wish that I had right that I don't is the hand of just being a part of more groups and more like Networking and yeah and right now I'm you know, it's probably an excuse to be honest because I think about I can pick up the phone and call people But I don't have anybody in my life right now That's just like that one person that I go to and get mentored by Okay I've had seasons of that and that was really really great. So definitely kind of missed that Probably a good reminder to maybe keep my eyes open and pray about that Okay. All right. How long have you been part of C12? Yeah, good question. Um c12. I think I've been a part of for I think it's been two and a half years Uh, okay started In michigan the closest group was in atroit. So two and a half hours away So I visited a couple of times. I was like That's and I was still self-performing. So it's just not There's no guarantee once a month that I could give a day um Obviously the now the group meets like literally three minutes from my house So it's like okay amazing. I can wake up and pop over there and very convenient. So Okay, okay But uh, just you know if you can't talk a little bit about that because I'm involved in that with vistage in the peer group So it's a similar peer group, right? So you have other CEOs that basically you get together once a month and maybe talk about the value you get out of that Man, it's it's it's huge. It's funny Everybody in the group talks about how there's always that like uh, do I have a day today? Like is this like, you know, I'm really gonna prioritize this is that you know, that moment where you're like, should I skip this week or this month or Yes, once a month. So it's um Every time I go man, I'm always shocked by how God shows up in the in the topics that are discussed Uh, there was you know when this all the stuff with growing and scaling was happening. I was like Very much on my mind and I walked in that day. I thought You know, what is it today gonna be about some HR? I don't know something that is like Okay, good stuff to know, but it was on scaling. I'm like, I'm like, I'm so glad I was I got so much out of it And it was it was like, you know, needed Uh, forgive me here Yeah, it was needed, uh, industry problems. Yeah, I think that that's been good. You know, giving we give a call giving a core Presentation so kind of business to the other CEOs and bring up key issues and that is also really helpful to have Businesses of different sizes that can speak to Uh, things that they see they do they um, they do a tour and interview so they'll like meet with my leadership team Uh, like a two-hour Uh, where they where they call and they they'll have you know, ask them questions They'll talk with my wife and ask, you know, I mean questions like is Parker being a good husband? Is there anything that the whole park are accountable to? Is he uh, yeah, and how is he doing leading your family? Is he prioritizing, you know, you were the business and those real like personal side, you know, but um, and then you know talking to the leadership team about You feel comfortable talking, you know, can you challenge parker? Is he uh, you know, is he uh, is there any blind spots that, you know, he's not saying that, you know Uh, might be hard for you to talk to him about. So it's just it's cool, right? I think it's um You get that once a year where you're kind of on the on the hot seat. Okay. Okay But uh, yeah, I really enjoyed that that part of it. Um, and they're just good guys. So I think Uh, they're kind of all over Charlotte. So there's times where I feel like, uh, you know, it's it can be challenging to stay in touch Outside of the once a month meetings, but I think as a You know, it can be lonely, right? There's a phrase. It's lonely at the top I remember when I first bought my dad out just kind of feeling like there was nobody else That I knew that really had the challenges of the pressure of business ownership um Payroll and and you know, whatever that you know different things that just people don't normally have to worry about so Having those other people that you could call they're in your corner that care about you. I think it's huge Okay. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, I appreciate that. Okay. So as we're talking about this I mean talk a little bit about maybe um, what you enjoy most in your current role Yeah Yeah, I think um I love I love just building teams I love and I love solving problems. So I think right now trying to figure out how to crack the code on 20 is is just super fun I think when things are easy, it's it's easy to get complacent. So I I rustled with that balancing that when things were going super smooth. Um, so I like the challenge. I like the um I like having clarity right and what what are the issues? Sometimes when I wake up and there's no issues or it feels everything just flowing really Hard times like minute like now what and it's not that there are no issues. It's just that I'm not aware of them, right, right? So I probably enjoyed the most when I wake up in the morning and I know I don't care if it's a problem or what I do, but I know what I have to do right and that is the purpose is that like um I almost say I probably rustled as a CEO Especially having key like key leadership probably one of the hardest things at this size for me is knowing how to work Through them and with them When you're so used to being able to just go right to the person deal with the problem And now when I do that I usually light a fire The older's and I get a call like hey man, you know, I just like So that's been an area of growth for me, but um Yeah, I I love having clarity and the struggles and that doesn't have any sense. I feel like it's kind of an odd answer, but Well, no, I mean, look it's it's your answer. Okay. I mean, I think a lot of us are motivated by a certain thing Right, uh, so for you, I mean you love challenges. Uh, so, you know, uh, a day when you have no, no Hard things you're looking around saying what's going on? How come I don't have something? It's a little more difficult probably right? I'm guessing that's kind of what you do, right? That's why easy isn't always good for you, I guess, right? Yeah, so look, I mean it is what it is and I think you know a lot of us, you know, we're motivated by you know growing So I think a lot of people are in that same boat, you know with you that's where you are So I can understand that, you know, that's why you would say that's what you enjoy Uh, you know, I retired from the corporate life and for me I still needed to have something like this where I was engaged with people like you and other folks that wanted to continue to grow because I enjoy growing business. I enjoy building teams. I enjoy, you know, solving problems Those are all things that kind of get me going, you know, every single day So so I can completely understand where you're at. So again, it's your answer. Okay, but I think a lot of other folks probably would relate to that. Well So that's cool. Yeah Okay, so let's uh, let's see, so let's talk about Sorry No, go ahead. Where is this thing? I really enjoy, like, finding good people. I think when we're in it, like right now We're not in a season where I need a lot of a lot of new people, but I think when we are, I think it's super fun to see See those talents and abilities and then place them. I think that's also super fun is yeah, helping people see what they're good at and They want to manage somebody or they want to do this and be like, no, no, you need to try this And then when they do it and the lights turn on, I'm like, I love this That is such a win. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, that's probably part of team building for you, right? I mean, you find a good person that can fit into a different spot that, you know, maybe wasn't, you know, being filled as much So that's pretty cool So you mentioned a couple things there. You're kind of at a ceiling, you know that 20 million ceiling If you had to give everybody kind of the aspirations for your company over the next five years, let's say, what would they be? Great question. Um, I think I think revenue is where your mind goes to with this because that's you know, that's kind of the hard measure of growth I think is that what you're asking or is that You you tell me, I mean, I mean, we could I don't necessarily want to get in the nitty gritty I mean you always if you're gonna grow you want to be a profitable growth So I'm assuming whenever you give me a revenue number, that's what you're saying, you know, you want to grow profit way to 40 50 60 or whatever it is Yeah, I think I think we would articulate our five revisions to be the uber of asphalt. That is that is our goal Uh, I think there are times and seasons where you You can see that clear than other times Right when the when the moment is there and right now at that ceiling. I'm kind of like probably there's there's moments of like man You know, we got a breakthroughs before we get to that's a pretty grand vision um It's an idea man. I'm just being able for property manners to hop on an app and and get parking lot work done Simple like very simplistically and it to be I can do it tomorrow. I can do it today I mean, that'd be pretty freaking wild to have that kind of I don't know that today There's so many challenges with what you've got the setup that's needed for most projects, but Um, I think that we're solving some of those problems that most people would say how do you how do you get stuff done this fast? um As you lean into a model, you start to see Oh wow like like I talked about with with the with the buying power thing Like how do you get something done? So like well, we we have their schedule, right? We but you have to have consistent work for that. So We're learning things about like market share, you know, it's something that I um again, you know You won't talk about that, but that what does it mean to go into a new market and become known there? And Came to where people are just they love the experience of diamond um, I think we're very much growing in that but yeah, I was in the fire vision is said to be that kind of that uh if you if you have a commercial property in a major city in the US diamond is one of the uh top three people you're gonna you're gonna be asking for a proposal So would you say you're disrupting kind of that uh paving and concrete type business? You know for those type of customers were that that industry disrupting that industry? I think disrupting is a fun word. I think it's a it's a big word. Uh, I love the word. I would say sure Yes, um, I probably all feel like we're disruptive in some ways. Uh, but yeah, I I think that we're I think that we are but I I'm making something to say that because I think that we're all we all live in our own bubble And so and the and the bubble of what I know. I feel like we are very much disrupting Okay, okay. All right I think I'm saying that with humility to know that there are other things happening and there's other things I'm not aware of And I'm sure there are other people out there with very great ideas that are uh, yeah Well, let me ask you this because maybe this kind of goes to that I mean when you're competing for a project, are you typically competing with somebody that's local that is self-performing? Or are you competing with somebody like yourself? You know, there would be more similar to yourself That's a great question. I would say that typically we're communicating with people that are more local More local. Okay. Yeah Yeah, so I would say, you know, at least from what you're talking about everything that you would say to me You are you are making changes if you're not disrupting you are changing that marketplace. Maybe okay Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. Yeah smaller word. How's that? So you've talked a little bit about things that you've learned about yourself and you know advice you give to others But I'm going to narrow in on that. I want you to summarize So if you look back over the last 10 years that you've you pretty much run the business, what have you learned about yourself? That's a big question. I know What have I learned about myself um Yeah, at some point I'm planning to write a book and maybe this will be the uh, it looks to be the question It'll help trigger those thoughts, but I Let me let me just say as you're thinking I find with people that I talked to they don't always look back on that Right, you know because they learn something every day and you probably do too But you know, it's good to sometimes take a look back and I think it's helpful to take a look back every once in a while Yeah, no, I I love looking back. I think it's so the question is How have I grown? Yeah, or what have you learned about yourself? So those would be similar. Yeah, absolutely. Yep Yeah, I think that I would say one of the things I've learned about myself Or that I'm learning right now, I will say is that uh I thought it isn't and then uh I can I could fire stuff off here. I I think that you know recently I was at it. So I say recently humility Um is something I I had this moment. It was probably like eight months ago and I was like I don't understand what it means to be a humble person Um, it has a lot to say about humility Right, uh, bless the spirit where they will inherit the kingdom of god But you also you also says that he will reject the proud and so I had this moment. I'm like, man How do you know if you're humble or proud like if I walking here, like I'm a pretty humble person you would kind of you would laugh Uh as I would right. It's not something you can go around like I don't I don't believe it the idea of calling yourself humble is uh, what's the word here? It's it's It doesn't work. It's actually moron It's an oxymoron, right? So so I'm like, well, then how do you how do you grow in this thing? You know if there's anything else I'm like, hey, jack and I've been really working on, um Whatever attribute and I'm like, yeah, I've been really growing you would be like, oh, that's really cool But humility is one of those elusive ones the more that you chase it the more it kind of slips away and you become proud in your humility I the reason this comes to my mind with that question. I think is I think business ownership man is Is a roller coaster of pride and humility right will be humbled and Carbound on top where you feel like you have done it And and I I think you've done it in your bubble when we were one million I'm worth thinking. Oh my gosh. We did a million dollars and then when we did, you know, two million It was like wow And you know, you don't know the 20 million dollar business owners You only know one of those guys and that's just like so far off And then there's the 50 million dollar guy that you're like, oh my he's a unicorn You know and you see 500 million These are just companies that are on the you know the exchange, you know, like That's not cool. And so So yeah, as you hit these different milestones, I think there's there's you can get excited But I think that the pride is the dangerous part because I think that is You know pride comes before the fall. I mean it literally is And what I've seen happen in those moments of pride is I go I kind of can I become um As I look back, I've seen There'll almost be this sense of like I have the answers in the room that has the no And I hate that I hate that and I'm saying that out loud, but I think that it's absolutely You know, it's been humbling to see that there were moments maybe where I had some good ideas But if you don't stay humble in those moments, then you will soon be the one that needs all of the good ideas And a couple of those roller coasters where I don't think I manage those emotions well um And I'm I'm excited and heard I'm sure I'll fail again But I'm also excited to hopefully maybe make that down a little less down and the up a little less up Right. I think I think in terms of managing that reality of Have good ideas. Absolutely The park are always still need other people and always need right to stay in that that that um posture of Uh God has what I need and I need And there are things outside of my control there are things inside of my control the containing so is that is that a I mean probably my That's my answer Okay, there you go. Yeah, it's your answer. So that's good I I like the the roller coaster of pride in humility because I sense that from a lot of people I sense it from you today I mean you brought it up when you know, you're running into problems hiring people in 2020 You know, okay, then I'm gonna go try and hire people. Well, all of a sudden you're humbled I you know, I had the same problem, right? Or you know as your leadership team gets bigger and your your crew gets bigger You know, if you if you bypass somebody that works for you and go talk to them and kind of deal with them Guess what happens you create a boulder in your opinion, right? I mean now you got a problem, right? So you have to continue to learn to get humbled by those kind of things look I mean as long as you're continually learning frankly, you know, that's probably the bigger thing, you know, uh, You know, but uh interesting answer. I enjoyed it Parker. I think that's great I don't think I've ever heard anybody explain it that way, but I would say that I think a lot of us have felt that same roller coaster So that's good. Yeah All right, so I got one more question for you So if you had to give advice to a new executive or a new CEO could be a new founder of a company You know kind of like the way you found yourself probably the way you felt. What would it be? Good question I kind of want to say that some of the answers I've already given are kind of uh, yeah, I don't want to be redundant though, but I think that if I were to summarize, I would say that read eos Mm-hmm. It's not just just do it You probably won't get through half the book before quarter the book before you're like, oh my gosh I want to go do what it talks like it gives you homework like there's there's there's worksheets to do so there's lots of crafting the score values and crafting the The different things so Uh, I think that that is that is one. I would also say Um, I I do think that having uh, I don't know that you can always just go up and choose a mentor I think this may be I start with any of you have a mentor. I think that's great. The mentors in my life have have come a little more uh providentially if you will like It wasn't like I was going out and interviewing people to be my mentor You know Meet that person at church or you can beat that person here there or whatever and it's like your past cross and You know, it happens. Um, I'm not saying that's how it has that's how it's happened for me So I think if you have a mentor have that person that you can go to Um Andy Elliott if you're familiar with him. I do like I like his phrase. He calls it cutting the check for speed I think being willing to get the knowledge of somebody who's been where you're going um Finding that person that's ahead of you and and then being willing to pay to get to get that knowledge Right, I think you don't always have to pay, but I think that's often there's going to be an exchange there Okay Yeah I had a guy recently that that uh, I have uh, it was like a 30-minute coaching call like a random kind of a kind of random He's awesome. He's it used to be a big youtube influencer Hit our butts for 15 minutes of this guy's time which whatever the one nugget i take away was He he asked me he said parker who are you who are you getting advice from on marketing? And at the time, you know, some of the guys that we're using Were smaller and he said are they are they the size that you want to be? And I was like, oh no And he's like you need to go find the guy that is the size that you want to be and then do what he did There's a two million dollar Body to 40 million if he did you'd already be there and I thought that's That's fair You know, it doesn't mean you can't live through the two million dollar guy that people that are small I don't have good input. I think that was my my other thing is like kind of balance that with humility here like everybody You know, you can learn from anybody but probably seek out somebody getting somebody who's kind of ahead of where you're at and We all are at different places. So the $1 million guy might want, you know, you could probably learn a lot from the two to three million dollar guy You don't need the $20 million paycheck cost of that. You know that guy Is that yeah? Yeah, yeah, no, I think that's good I mean, that's good advice and I appreciate you summarizing because a lot of times what I'll do is all kind of you know I like packaging, you know, together kind of some of the topics that we have, you know So that they're more compartmentalized because I feel like most folks don't listen to 60 minutes on a podcast They listen to little pieces of it, you know, so that's the way a lot of folks are So that's helpful when you can can summarize it like that. So So look, I enjoyed today. I really enjoyed hearing about your business and kind of the journey there your personal journey is very interesting I think I can see why you come from you know where you were self-performing to you know The kind of the transition of this business that you have and it is somewhat disruptive That's what I would say, you know, so it'll be interesting to see what you do with over the next five years So, listen, thanks for being on the show. I appreciate it. Thank you, Jeff. Great to be here.
