The FAN Morning Show

Blue Jays + Canada Basketball Takeaways

The final of the hour of The FAN Morning Show starts with Ben Ennis & Brent Gunning diving more into the deadline for the Blue Jays. They dive into how the team will stack up moving forward and if they will acquire anything by tomorrow's deadline. The morning duo head to Baltimore to check in with The Athletic’s Kaitlyn McGrath as the trio discuss watching guys like Danny Jansen and Nate Pearson get dealt, what it was like watching them come up in the system and what kind of major leaguers they turned in to (9:42). They also re-visit Yusei Kikuchi's tenure in Toronto that contained both ups and downs, as well as if he could be a clear candidate to re-sign with the team in the offseason. They also look at which call-ups could be viewed as contributors in 2025. In the back half of the hour, Ben & Brent welcome on Michael Grange to get into the Olympics and specifically the expectations around both Canada’s men’s & women’s team (26:20). The three guys discuss the tough groups they both face and the accomplishment it would be to get out of them as well as which players are the most important to team success.

The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Sports & Media or any affiliates.

Duration:: 47m
Broadcast on:: 29 Jul 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

[MUSIC] >> Hey, it's the fan morning show Sportsman 5.9 of the fan bed. And it's Brian Gunning. God love me some live sports when we're doing this show. >> Mm-mm. >> Are you interested in Rafael Nadal, Novak Jolkovich playing a singles match? I think this is their 70th match all time. >> 60th year close. >> I knew it was a round number. >> Shout out to Ben Lewis, well I don't even know if he is resident anymore. He just poke around these holes, maybe he still does. Resident tennis hunk, Ben Lewis. >> Mm-hm, 60. And I think, so it's like closely divided. I think it's like- >> I don't have that number. >> Somebody, I think Jolkovich is up 30 to 29. And I think so with a win, Nadal could even the all time match, all time record at 30 apiece. They're playing the red clay, Roland Garros. >> Feels like it would bode well for Nadal, but, you know, like old? >> Yeah, he's also, yeah, he's- >> I feel like how do you who alerted me to that they're like- >> Break it down. >> That they're like five months apart. They're like way closer at age- >> Sure. >> Than you would think based on the tones they're talked about. >> But Nadal plays a more physical game, no question. All right, we'll talk to Caitlin McGrath in a couple of minutes. She's in Baltimore getting set for this four game series between the Blue Jays and Orioles, which starts with the double header this afternoon. Orioles in first place in the American League East 62 and 43 and Blue Jays did last at 49 and 56, 13 games back. Baseball's weird though, because the Rangers are the defending World Series champions, they're trying to win. >> Yeah. >> And maybe that changes now after this, but they were just coming off a sweep of the White Sox, whichever everybody does, but like they were at 500 or close to 500. >> Yeah. >> Blue Jays just swept him out of town. Blue Jays not trying to win. I mean, like everybody's trying, in the moment all the players are trying to win, the organization understands where it is, and they're selling off the pieces. And they couldn't help but sweep the Rangers. >> They tried to weigh pieces from the Major League team, and they still did it. >> The Blue Jays are objectively horrifyingly bad, right? We can all agree, we can all- >> Zero argument for me. >> And there's still two months plus to go the Major League Baseball regular season. They're seven and a half games back of the third wild card in the American League. The Rays are by many metrics, just as bad as the Blue Jays, except for the record, which- >> Seems important to have to be honest. >> There are two games over 500, they're 54 and 52, they're three games back of a playoff spot. That's a series. >> Yep. >> That's a series, a series, yeah. >> You sweep a series, I don't know if they have any games left against the Royals, they were playing today, and they swept that series, they'd be in a playoff spot. >> Wow. >> They are selling everything, like all the things, not just- >> I know, like go wander, I don't even know if they have the tank out there still, like go wander, you have one of the Rays. >> Franchise icons, Randy O'Rosa, Randy, Isaac Paredes, a guy that just signed in for agency and Zach Affleck. You're out the door and more to come. >> Yeah, somebody call Michael- >> Jason Adams, and they have assets. They're sending everything out the door. Now, there are other teams that are in contention that are not doing the same thing. The Tigers are going to do the same thing, the Tigers are worse, they're 52 and 55. And the Mariners aren't doing the same thing, but they also playing a division that's winnable. The central, I guess, is winnable too, but the Twins and Wiles aren't going to sell either. But the idea of the third wildcard team is supposed to prevent exactly what's happening to the Rays. It's like, well, we can't sell. >> Right. >> Because it's, hey, we understand we're not as good as the Orioles and the Yankees or the Phillies in the other league, but the playoffs is the playoffs and everybody says the same thing universally that chip in a chair. Once you get to the postseason, it's more of a role of the dice than the better team winning. Is it doing its job, the Rays are doing their Rays thing and saying thanks, but no thanks. We'd rather lose for the next couple of years, cuz whatever they're doing here, this is not like, here's what I can guarantee you. >> Well, I mentioned to John Morose that the Blue Jays, the possibility of them taking those assets and trading for more winnow pieces before Tuesday or at least in the offseason, Rays aren't doing that. No, Rays are going to, for the first time in recent memory, be bad next season. Like they're almost trying to be bad next season. They're above 500 right now. Is the third wildcard doing its job if the Rays are like, we don't want any part of that thing? >> So you asked me that question, but I think it also bodes to, is baseball's CBT rules doing its job? Because I think the reason the Rays are operating that way is part and parcel. The biggest reason for it is that they have the second lowest payroll. And again, these things are all calculated differently, but I'm looking at the Spotrack sheet here. The only team that spends less than them, and it's by nearly $20 million, which ain't nothing when you head to this part of it, is the A's. They spend less than everybody else in baseball. I think this is how you have to operate. If that's the way you're gonna operate is that you have to be, you can't have chip in a chair mentality. If you can, if you're showing yourself to 1,000% be in the playoffs, you can't be, well, I shouldn't say can't, you shouldn't be pulling off pieces from those teams to sell them away. But if you're this Rays team, the way it is always gonna have to work for you is for all the cards to align at the exact same time. For all the pieces to be right there and ready to win. And that's not to say that they couldn't have held on to this group, and they would have been ready in a year or two or three because of all the control some of these guys have left. But that's the thing I look to. It's so much less about the wild card for me than it is that a team that has that payroll has to operate in that way where they just, there's no world where they can squint and say it because they know and also, I think this is important too. They have sniffed a world series. They played in them, okay? The idea that they think of like, hey, get into the playoffs. That's not overly exciting for them. It should be for a lot of teams in baseball raised, been there, done that. They feel very clearly that they need to retool and bounce back for whenever they feel the cards are not have four, five, six good players, have a full roster full of them where they can go on not to run and win a series, but have a belief that they can win a world series. So, yeah, they are kind of a unique example because they operate kind of in their own little ecosystem where they spend nothing and they just, they grab all your best prospects. That you didn't know you had. It's wild. They're like, and that guy, the guy sweeping up, he's the janitor. It's like, trust me, you should see the spin. And it's worked for them. How about the San Francisco Giants who just, who were outside of the Dodgers landing Choyo Tani for almost a billion dollars with the biggest mover this past offseason when it comes to free agents. They got all the guys that seem to fall into their lap, right? At a Cody Bellinger, every free agent is now a San Francisco giant to very limited results. Right. Like they're below 500, they're 53 and 55, but only three and a half games back of the third wild card. And he sees lots of rumors, like Blake Snell has figured it out after starting the season hurt and not very good. He's only had one start in his last four in which he's allowed runs. Like he's gone, no runs, no runs, two earned runs, no runs in his last four start. Maybe somebody should have signed them before he just languished forever, maybe. There's reporting that the Giants are selling, which again, like makes sense considering we played the majority of the season so far and they're below 500, but like quite factually, they're three, they're only a half game further out of a playoff spot than the Rays and are only two games under 500. It's just the idea that this third wild card is going to change the mentality of these front offices because we can't possibly tell the fan base that we're sellers considering how close we are to the playoffs. I just don't think is the reality. I think fans are smart enough. Like I don't, I know there's not a ton of Rays fans, but do you think any actual Rays fan disagrees with the position the front office is taking here because they know this team because the big fly factor is very similar to the Blue Jays and they're run differentials minus 50 that they understand it's kind of one fool's goal to be two games under over 500 and only three bag of a playoff spot. And two, even if they make the playoffs, the team just on balance isn't as good as the others in the American League. I think fans are too smart for the idea of we can't, we won't support a front office that sells despite our proximity to the third wild card. I don't disagree. I think so much of it goes to the success your team has had. Like the Giants are a team that they remember like everybody who's a Giants fan unless you're seven years old or whatever remembers winning a World Series and mad bum and all that. They remember it even before that. And that's why I think again, like I'm not trying to just like whack down every example, but I think there's extenuating circumstances for kind of all these teams and teams that have smelled true success, not just getting in, but true success, they are less likely to say, Oh, we can get the third wild card and maybe. But if you're a team, like again, if we go back to meaningful September baseball conversations, people are going to say to be damned with the long term plan, give me some, give me a chance at some playoff games. So the Blue Jays have already done lots of work. Three players sent out the door before tomorrow's trade deadline. I don't know if we're going to get a bigger hug as we head towards the watch than Danny Janssen, the longest tenured Blue Jay Blue Jays doubleheader in Baltimore against the Orioles today. Let's talk to Caitlyn McGrath of the athletic. How's it going Caitlyn? It's good. I'm good. How are you? I'm doing very well. Like that's, we're not going to get a bigger hug than Danny Janssen. Like John Schneider talking about throwing the football around with him when he was 17 years old. I mean, you say Kukuchi is beloved, but is he getting a bigger hug than Danny Janssen? It will be close, but yeah, I mean, I think that Danny Janssen's roots in the organization, which he's obviously been here since he was a teenager. So he's probably had a bigger impact because he's been here a longer time and he felt like one of those guys that, you know, could be a Blue Jays lifer. Obviously not going to happen now, but you say, well, as you say, so he'll get a pretty big hug too. It's going to be a busy next 48 hours, I think. I think they should just let you say sit there and like, you know, if he wants to, we shouldn't force anybody to do this, but like, they should let him sit there with the rest of the starters watching the game with a glass of that really nice Japanese whiskey. Like he's not going any pitched on Friday. They're not going to need him. I think that'd be a lovely kind of kind of gesture. You know, he's had such an interesting tenure and his time as a J. I mean, you know, you can dig and find numbers. There's always something worse, but man, that first season, it was as jarringly bad as possible. Then you have the bounce back season. You throw in that he is the other half of the burrios decision from from the playoffs last year. And then this season, there's kind of a, you know, not crashing back to earth, but definitely a, you know, finding the, the, the mean there between the two, the two seasons. What do you make of his kind of tenure as a whole, presuming it very likely comes to an end here in the next day or two? Yeah. I mean, it's interesting as you say, like, um, when the Blue Jays signed him, I think they knew that he was going to be a bit of a project, you know, obviously he's a left hander. He throws really hard, has a great fastball, you know, has other secondary weapons, but really hadn't lived up to that kind of potential in Seattle. And the Blue Jays kind of saw a little bit of Robbie Ray and him, I think, and obviously when they signed him and they were just coming off, so, you know, having Robbie when he saw young and all that. So, uh, I think they saw way to sort of unlock a new level for you, say, and I would say that, you know, ultimately the, the experiment worked. Um, I mean, I, you know, he didn't necessarily become, uh, an ace, uh, he, he didn't want to say young, like Robbie did, but, um, he took some time to get there. And as you say, like, I think I asked Josh Shire this the other day and it's like, is this kind of how you mapped it out? Like, when you sign a guy for three years and you know, there's going to be a little bit of work at the start. And he said, like, well, yeah, you kind of hope that it goes a little bit quicker. Like you hope that that first year didn't go as poorly as it did. Um, it really took like a full year to sort of, I think, uh, break through to him a little bit. But I mean, in the end, you, you got a lot out of him. He's had some spectacular start. He's obviously had some rough starts too. Um, but I think ultimately he kind of at a, at a place in his career where I think he's pretty confident on, on the mound, he knows what he's doing. He doesn't unravel the way that he used to in his first year in Toronto. Um, he just seems a lot more like calm and self-assured up there, which he has gone a long way for him. So I mean, yeah, ultimately, I think that for the money and what you got out of him, his reliability, I don't think you've really ever missed the start other than in his first year. Um, so I think that you got a lot out of him for the money and I think that he became someone that the clubhouse really loved and embraced and, you know, I, I always hesitate to say these things could happen because I feel like when a team trades someone, they often like don't come back. But I, like, you know, they, John Schneider kind of said the same thing about Danny Jameson. Like we'd love down the back and you say, uh, you know, he loves Toronto, loves the organization. You know, if the blue kids do want to compete again next year, they're going to need another starter. He makes sense for them. Um, but I guess we'll just see what unfolds in, in free agency, but I think it's possible to become attacked. Yeah, it's certainly, I don't, I don't think either side would firmly shut the door. I mean, certainly not the J's. They're going to need some live bodies next year in Kakuchi. I think it's going to be certainly a case of, you know, whatever suitors are available. I don't think the J's have done anything here to hurt their chances, especially by, by trading them. I think he completely understands the business and quite frankly would like to play on a winning ball club for, for a couple of months. How could his, you know, back out, I don't want to call back half of the season, but, you know, August, September and playoffs affect the market. He's looking at this off season because, you know, if he would have hit the market after last year, he gets one contract. If he hits the market after this year from the blue J's and doesn't have postseason accolades, it looks differently. How much do you think teams will be swayed by, you know, if he ends up being some teams, you know, fourth starter in the playoffs or if he has a couple kind of high leverage, lefty spots there, how do you think his performance, the rest of the way, given the way this season has gone up to this point will impact his market and how do you think that helps or hurts the J's chances? Yeah, I mean, it definitely could. I mean, sometimes there is a bit of recency bias when it comes to free agent contracts and teams that go with your hearing. You know, I think, ultimately, you could, because he's been in the league, you know, enough years now, people kind of know and teams now just have so much data and have so much information that they don't necessarily rely on a handful of starts down the stretch or, you know, a couple of starts in the postseason to sort of make their decision. But, I mean, if there are, like, question marks about, you say, if a team is wanting to sign him and it kind of knows what they're going to get with him, but there's some question marks about, okay, well, how does he handle the most high pressure situations? How does he handle, you know, those types of starts or those types of outing? And this, you know, this opportunity to be has something when he gets traded could help answer some of those questions because, like you said, I mean, he was kind of part of that weird experiment, the Blue Jays did last year in that second game of the wildcard, which I don't think anyone would really fault him for feeling unnerved in that moment. I think the Blue Jays didn't put him in a very good position, nor did they put burials in a good position. And I love a good spin, but I'd be hard pressed to find anybody blaming Kakuchi for that one. Exactly, right? So that one, he gets them all, you know, whatever, so yeah, I think that showing what he can do in the postseason could kind of round out his resume, I guess, so to speak and give teams a better idea of the full picture of what they're getting. Yeah. And his perception in this market is impacted by, as you guys were talking about, like the start to his Blue Jays tenure where, I mean, he was not a majorly caliber pitcher and in fact, you know, was open and honest about saying, I'll go to Buffalo, whatever it takes. I'll do whatever this team wants me to do, ultimately didn't end up that way. And he ended up reviving himself as a starter and despite the ERA over six since the start of June, it's a pretty good starter, I would say. Nate Pearson had the opposite perception thing happen where he was not just one of the top prospects in this Blue Jays organization, but one of the top pitching prospects in all of baseball, he departs as like, man, if not below average middle reliever, it's incredible what's happened to his career, Caitlin. It is and it's one of those things, like I think that sometimes you just be scratching your head a little bit because you're like, you know, he's throwing a hundred, he has four different pitches, he's got the stuff, but it just, you know, doesn't guys can hit it, like he gets hit hard and it sort of boggles your mind that, you know, someone like him that has all the potential in the world is just has not been able to figure out, you know, how to consistently get out and, you know, it's basketball gets hit. So, you know, these are the types of trades where, you know, at some times hurts, I think, but, you know, sometimes a guy goes to another team and they figure it out a little bit. I think the Cubs have a decent history recently of unlocking some things for some guys and, you know, we've seen P walker work is magic on a lot of guys, you know, you say included, we were just talking about that and there's, you know, there's been a long list of pictures that he's been great for and has really helped, you know, including still on this Jay's team. But, yeah, for whatever reason, I don't know if it was just always having that label as, you know, a prospect that didn't work out in Toronto, having the pressure in Toronto, although, you know, in the last couple of years, I don't think Nate was really operating under any sort of pressure and he was just part of the bullpen, right? But, you never know, like, what goes into these things and what happens. And so, you know, maybe a change of scenery is a good thing for him. Maybe having a different voice in his ear would be a good thing. You know, I think that he came a long way. I think that he was more consistent this year than he had been in any other year. And he stayed healthy, which I guess is a thing that is a positive for him as well, because that's been, you know, the biggest struggle in his career, I think, is staying healthy. But, yeah, again, just, like, not quite the consistency that you want, you know, it'd be one step forward, two steps back a lot of times with Nate. So, the rest of the season is already started to be handed to the young players and after Tomorrow's Deadline, it's all going to be about the young players. And, hopefully, for the Blue Jays' sake, they add more young ones that could factor in to next season. They got somebody already that's at the upper minor leagues, was in the major leagues when they acquired him in Jonathan Class A. But you look at the top of the order yesterday, Spencer Horowitz leading off for any Clemente hit in second. You had Leo Jimenez playing shortstop for as long as Boba Shetzout, Addison Bargers starting to see some time. Of course, David Schneider in the mix. Like, how many of these young players have legitimate chances to factor in? Or the Blue Jays are hoping factor in to next season? Yeah, I mean, we'll see. We'll see what else Blue Jays collect to in terms of trades. Like, I was coming into this trade deadline, the Blue Jays were going to target a lot of those AAA, you know, between AAA and the major guys that are squeezed out, maybe from the team. And so far, you know, there's a few that I think have been in AAA, maybe a couple AA, but also some high A and some guys. So we'll see what they do in the last couple of days here in terms of, like, collecting prospects because it would make sense that they would want to get as many guys as possible at the upper minor leagues just because A, their depth there I think great to begin with. I mean, they've sort of exhausted that depth already, and like you mentioned, all those guys that you've mentioned already on the major league team. So I think they kind of need that there to begin with, and just also if you're a team that wants to compete again and immediately in 25, like, you kind of need those guys available for you. So we'll see. But in terms of who's on the team right now, I mean, I think Spencer Horwitz, he's a guy that stood out to me, he's really, really, I don't know, kind of transformed his season, becoming a second baseman, looking pretty natural there. His, you know, his at bats are always consistently good. You know, we'll see. I mean, I think we got to wait and see if there's a Davis Schneider sort of effect here or not, whereas obviously last year when we saw David come up, he was, you know, incredible, looked like the best baseball player we've ever seen. And then, you know, guys around the league sort of get to know him a little bit and are able to, you know, tack him differently, so we'll see. But so far, I think Spencer Horwitz has looked really good. Leo Jimenez was another guy that has interested me. I think defensively, he just brings a lot. And he is a guy that gets on base a ton, which is something the Blue Jays like. But yeah, I mean, I don't know how many guys are necessarily playing for a spot. I think they're all trying to impress a little bit. But we'll see. Spencer and Leo Jimenez are the two names that kind of stand out to me. And perhaps more to be acquired before tomorrow's trade deadline. Caitlin, enjoy the seafood, I guess in Baltimore and a couple of games today. Thanks for this. Yeah, of course. Thank you for having me. Caitlin McGrath of the athletic in Baltimore for a couple of games against the Orioles today, doubleheader. And the series wrapping up on Wednesday, Blue Jays also have a suspended game to resume in August. I love this against the Red Sox later on this season. It's a game that when it was suspended, do you know, is that the plate for the Blue Jays? I don't. It was him. Yes. Danny Janssen was like, I figured he was involved and I didn't know the exact particulars. But I didn't realize it was literally his about. He was in an O1 count. That's amazing. So someone will have to pinch it for Danny Janssen in that game inherit the O1 count. Danny Janssen, of course, now a member of the Red Sox. You know, it was catching in that game for the Red Sox. I'm guessing Reese Maguire. Reese Maguire was catching in that game for the Red Sox. He has subsequently been DFA'd after that debacle in Colorado with some great lip reading and apparently almost like a brawl that took place after the game when some of Reese's Red Sox teammates found out about what exactly was said. They didn't in the moment. They just came out of the bullpen's in the dugout because they saw their teammates. There's a lot of screaming I'd imagine in those. So maybe I could see just like guys are mad not knowing why. Yeah, but you could like so for the first time in history, we could have a player play for both teams in the same game, which is under the rules of baseball allowed in a suspended game. Danny Janssen at the plate for the Blue Jays, no longer a Blue J. Now remember the Red Sox and could be catching for the Red Sox in that baseball game. That would be so according to at scoring changes and scoring changes on Twitter. If Danny Janssen does in fact catch for the Red Sox, it would make him the first player to ever play for both teams in the same game. But if he enters a catcher for the restart, he will have both batted and caught in the same at bat, which is wild wacky stuff. That is incredible. I love that oddity. Like, you know, all sports have them. Sometimes we have he who shall not be named the Zamboni driver, like, you know, putting up a shutout against the Leafs. Sometimes you see that sometimes you see this in baseball. It is incredible. Do you have a question for you that's going to like, I feel like illuminate what I already know about you. What's up? Do you follow that Twitter account or it just worked its way into your life? You know what? I have to check if I follow it. No, I don't. Okay. But now you see the fact that the follow button. Okay, I was going to. Okay. There we go. All has been rectified because that felt like something you would follow. Oh, yeah. I love that stuff. You know what else I love? I love when we're good at sports, like basketball, and we have legitimate medal aspirations. Maybe not gold medal because like, the Americans took care of Nikola Jokic's Serbia team and they didn't even play Jason Tatum in the game and like, I'm so sorry. I actually think that's like the most interesting part of the Olympics so far. They made Derek, like, it makes or I'm sure he was very happy to, but it's like Derek White who's worse than Jason Tatum and on the same team. He played 11. Yeah. It's great. Anyways, yeah. Shay Gill just Alexander played plenty. Yeah. Born to Canada. I think thank goodness he did. We'll talk to Michael Grange of Sportsnet Next as the fan morning show continues, Ben and his friend, Gunny, Sportsnet 590, the fan. In-depth, Blue Jay's coverage with an analytical twist. Jay's Talk Plus with Blake Murphy. Be sure to subscribe and download Jay's Talk on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your broadcast. Fan morning show, Sportsnet 590, the fan, Ben and his friend, Gunny. So we have our third medal of the Paris Games game today. Rack them up, 10 meter platform diving, shout out to Nathan Zombour Murray and Rylan Wiens. They earned bronze. Synchro. Two bronze medals, one silver. Okay. Could be a gold coming tonight for a summer Macintosh whose favorite to win the 400 meter I am. If swimmers get all the medals for all the different swimming, we should get two medals because two dudes were synchronized diving. I agree. Like, and we should get all the medals for every player if Canada, if Canada wins a medal in basketball. Wholeheartedly agree. All right. I'm Michael Grange, Sportsnet's own. How's it going, Michael? It's good. How are you guys doing? Doing all right. What's your favorite Olympic sport outside of watching this men's basketball team? Like in the women as well, who open up their tournament today because like, there's so many, there's so many events that, you know, I watch and I'm like, I should watch more of this, but I don't. But I do love watching, like swimming. Swimming is one where I'm like, I can get geeked up for people jumping in pool and see who's fastest. Is there one that you're like, man, I wish I watched more of that sport. I mean, I love track and field, right? Like, yeah, me too. Pretty much all of it. And you know, it's, and I guess if I would just, you know, yeah, like there's something I don't really like watching in track until I probably had to pick. I think the mile for me is probably like the perfect combination of, you know, it's not like, you know, it doesn't take like 25 minutes or 20 minutes. Like it's not the marathon, yeah, but it's, you know, it's a very digestible, like four minutes. Yeah, I can pay attention to something for four minutes, barely. But honestly, man, in 2024, congratulations to you that don't say that, like it's not an accomplishment. And, you know, and then within it, like there's so much drama and tension as it builds. So, you know, that probably one, I mean, I love obviously the sprints. But, you know, it's kind of blank and it's done, but it's pretty amazing. So actually if anyone's, I've been watching this thing called, I think it's called sprint on Netflix. It's sort of like a. Yeah, I saw that. Yeah, it's kind of like one of these behind the scenes type documentaries on the 2023 sprint season. So that's pretty good. If anyone's looking for some background, but yeah, I'll go with that. Yeah. Fencing. I wish I understood better because that looks so cool, right? Like in the venue that it's at, it's, it's cool if they didn't wear the masks. It would, stakes would be higher. No, sport. I love it. Masks are fencing. Well, they got a little nub on there. How much? Yeah. No, they got the nub on there. No, no, no. No protection. That's great. I watch a lot closer. I will say like, just saying if they brought sword fighting and not, not fencing, just like you pick any sword you want, get in there and have it. I'd watch it. Yeah. Big old broad axis. Yeah. Sure. Why not? Come on, man. Yeah. That's, that's a lot like that. Now I'm just pictured some old gladiator move with like a net and you have a lot of contraptions. God, just bring gladiator ring to the Olympics. It sounds like we're just describing running man. Like that's what we just want running man. Okay. And I'm not saying we don't, but like, yeah. Okay. Okay. So the basketball and yeah, the women's team gets underway and we just saw the men's team with an impressive victory over Greece. There's obviously so much depth of talent with this, the men's team, Grange. But where would they be without Shay Gilchis Alexander? Like one guy, like how, how much does one guy change the outlook for this team? Oh, immensely. And, and you know, I think it was great. They got the win. Obviously I think it was great. They got the win against Greece. I'm not sure they do get the win, you know, without Shay, like I think if, you know, once the win was said and done, they got it was great and they surely controlled big chunks for that game, you know, retrospectively, like that great team, that great team is not very good. You know, like I, you know, this is, you know, this and then after that, I think Nicholas is a 40 year old point guard. Like, you know, they had some players, but you know, I think that team with like 10 NBA players, 11 players with recent NBA experience should be able to more than manage the rest of those match ups and the fact that you kind of needed Shay to sort of guide them home in the fourth quarters. I'm not going to say concerning at this point, but it's, it's sort of, it, it probably shouldn't have come down to that, but you know, the point being is, you know, when you have a guy that good, that capable, who is a point guard, you know, he's, it's, it's, you can't even measure how valuable, how valuable that is. Like it means you are never really out of a game. And I think in close games, you probably have an advantage over any single matchup in this tournament, except you may be team USA. Yeah. I mean, it's remarkable to have that guy is the, the tip of the spear offensively. How much do, and you know, sometimes this stuff gets overstated, but I actually think for the moment Canada basketball is in, it's really important regarding Shay is how much do you think his demeanor matters just as much? I mean, we saw the kind of woofing at the end of the game between the two teams and he got asked about it. He's like, yeah, we yelled at each other. It's cool. Now I think back to the feeble world copy, make some huge shots at the end of games and teams coming over to him, celebrate his or walking back to the bench and he's given the like calm down, calm down. It just seems like no moment is too big for him. And I don't say this as though he doesn't care, but he just seems so unexcitable. And I honestly think for a team that is in a very odd part in terms of their expectations where there's plenty of them, but they really haven't proven a ton, that demeanor is kind of so important coming from the leader as well. Yeah. Well, I think it's why, you know, it's not a, it's a feature, not a bug, you know what I mean? Like it's, it's, it's, it's pardon parcel with why he's, you know, top five, top three player in the world. It is because he is unflappable. And why is he unflappable? Well, because his skills are to the point where he can't really be dictated to. And you know, I'd be, you know, you kind of going around in circles, like, is his unflappability, the reason that he's able to manipulate games with his skill or his skill so superb that it means he's unflappable, because he's never really under pressure that he can't handle. So the answer is, you know, one doesn't happen without the other. It works both ways. And you know, that's, that's the literally, and then you mix in six, six, and way more athletic than he plays because he kind of chooses to play kind of on the ground. He doesn't try and rise up in embarrassed guys. You know, he's fully capable of doing that. He's really like, I think he's a way more athletic overall package than gets highlighted because he chooses not to chase highlights. And you know, that's the definite literally is the definition of a superstar, right? Like he's intellectually and emotionally at a level that very, very few people can kind of manage and then his package of ability and skill is, you know, one of one, like easy season, you know, on the short list of the most competent physical players out there. And then it's in a six foot six, super live, super flexible, super slithery package that all has been trained, you know, so it's, that's, that's what it is. I mean, you want to see what one of the best in the world to do it looks like it's him. That's what it, that's what it all had to do. Yeah, it's pretty good. You want those guys. And you also want a guy with an NBA title on his resume like Jamal Murray, although didn't really play like it. Like, is he, if he continues to play that way, is he a net positive for this team right now? Jamal Murray? I mean, I think so just because he's, you know, like his shooting always needs to be respected, you know, even though I didn't think he was very good against Greece, like he showed a couple of flashes, you know, shook himself free for a couple of mid-race shampers. He had a really nice runner at a key point, but it was, to me, it was more the rest of this game. That just wasn't very good. Like defensively, he was average to, he wasn't good, like there was a couple of really bad breakdowns. I saw it. I mean, you know, he makes had some nice moments on the ball. I thought it's, but again, you're like, he needs to be better. And I think for Canada to say a challenge team USA for a gold medal, to win a semi-final medal, you know, he has to gradually, over the next couple of weeks, 10 days here, become you know, his best. And that's, you know, that's great. I think if he doesn't quite get there, the fact he's a superb shooter and can create offense for himself in doses is good. Like, yeah, you definitely want that guy, but, you know, he needs to be, he looked to me like a guy had barely played basketball because he hasn't since Denver was eliminated back in May. So he's got a ways to go, but you know, I think he got his feet wet and there was some good, some bad and hopefully it'll be better tomorrow against Australia, which is absolutely a crucial game. Yeah. It's massive. And thank goodness Murray made those free throws at the end there, maybe we're having a very different conversation about that game and about how he performed as opposed to being able to skate by it a bit. Obviously, John is, is John is, there's only one of him, but how informative was it for the problems Canada is going to have with talented size in this tournament? And again, like I, I'm not, I'm not meant, I'm not trying to hint that they're going to see something like that. But I don't know, Anthony Davis would be no fun. Size is going to be an issue for this team. How informative was that Greek, that game against Greece in terms of what they're going to have to do or how big of a challenge it'll be for them? I don't think there's too much to take away from it. I mean, you know, I think overall they defended, John is pretty well, I think he had to work pretty hard. I mean, he went to the free throw line 13 times, he saw those three guys, you know. There's only one guy like him in the tournament. I think the fact that Canada was able to beat France, for example, in the exhibition play with their two bigs, Colbert and, I mean, they're pretty big team overall. Colbert, William and Yemen, and then they have a couple of year old, the guys who were pretty, pretty imposing as well, you know, but they were able to manage that because they were so overwhelming, you know, at the wing and guard positions. Nicola Yoakich, should they end up meeting Serbia and across over a game? Yeah, I guess what, they're not going to be able to cover him. I guess he's going to, just because no one, you know, he's never been able to be covered, maybe Minnesota a little bit in the playoffs. So, you know, so that's going to be a big, big problem, but Canada should be at a significant advantage literally with almost every other single match up or close to it. So, you know, you're just going to have to play your strengths and minimize your weaknesses. So, and then that's, and I guess team USA, it is what it is, you know, basically that's going to come down to Canada hit a lot of threes and pushed the pace and forced USA into turnovers and hopefully they have a bad shooting night. If that's what happens, it could be a really close game. If it doesn't, team USA wins. So, you know, not to spoil it for everybody, but yeah, so, you know, we saw the trailer, we kind of got the 10. I don't know where that was going. I don't think there's anything to, about that game to really take away from going into say a game against Australia, you know, it's going to be a really good game. Like they've got good guard play, they've got some quality, you know, they don't have overwhelming size of guys who, you know, are racking up all star knobs and all NBA's, but they're quality professional NBA players, Chuck Mondale is one. And you know, also in the lineup, they have a lot of good quality NBA guides and plus a lot of continuity experience. So that to me, you know, I think the game tomorrow is probably going to be the most competitive game Canada plays until they get into the metal round. And, you know, so it's, you know, if they win it, they win the group and they should advance. Or if I should say they win the group, they've got a very good chance to win the group that you know, and you know, they should advance with a good seed going into the metal round. But yeah. And then we got the women today, right? Love them with them. And, you know, very interesting match up against France, who Canada always seems to play at the end of the Olympics to the World Cup. They've beaten them the last couple of times and beat them at the World Cup, which was huge because, you know, France had kind of been elected, ended their Olympic tournament 2016 and then kind of was their obstacles in the quarters in previous Olympics too. So really important game for Canada against the home team. It's going to be very charged there. And, you know, an interesting in their group today, Australia, who's also in the group and would probably be the favorite, I think, Luz just in Nigeria, who's, you know, which is just a massive upset Nigeria and Nigeria women ranked 12th in the world. So like not a non factor, but you look at that group and you were said, okay, I mean, that's a game Canada should and can't win. And a lot of discussion on the men's side about Canada being in the group of deaths. This is the group of deaths on the women's side because, you know, Canada ranked seventh France is, I think, eighth or ninth, Australia is third and Nigeria is 12th. So that's a really sturdy group and as Nigeria shows against Australia, is there a factor. So, you know, just absolutely crucial where can I get off the right foot today at 1115? Yeah, what is the realistic expectation for our Canadian women? You know, I think they getting out of the group is realistic. I think playing for a medal is realistic. You know, the women are an interesting story, right? This is their fourth state Olympics, Natalie O'Chonwa, setting a record when she steps on the floor today is the first Canadian basketball player to play in fourth state Olympics. It's kind of crazy when you think about it. When you look at this team, so you've got Natalie O'Chonwa, you've got two NBA players are doubling up the experience, so that's kind of their core. Still pretty young when you look at Edwards and M.E.A.R. for example, and, you know, and then behind them, you've got four first-time Olympians who were either teenagers' style of swords, right? Like, say 18 years old, just finished high school. This is their summer job, going to the Olympics, and a daughter of Shawn Swords, who was in the Olympics in 2000. And then Yvonne Ejim, Cassandra Prosper, and I think I'm missing one other who are still in university, first-time Olympians, so it's kind of a hybrid team where you've got a group that's pretty much in their prime, who is a core and should be able to make some noise. But then, really, this program is in transition to being, I think, a real world power as good as it would have been the last, you know, 12 years. I think they're building to 2028 to being, you know, the one, two, or three best program in the world when you look at the quality of the young talent. So, but I think a good enough team, you know, to, you know, they were fourth at the World Cup in 2022, and a good enough team to challenge or win a medal, and it would be honestly an incredible story when you look at kind of how this team has sort of trended the last 12 years, the last four Olympic cycles. So, but, you know, that women's term is very tough. As I said, you know, you've got Medjira, the 12-Frank team in the world, pulling it off set this morning just kind of lets you know what the field is like. So, you know, we'll have a pretty good field for where Kent stands in a couple hours when they play France. Yeah. Can't wait for that match up, Canada against Australia this morning in France. Michael, always a pleasure. Thank you. Thanks, guys. It's Michael Grant. Sports net zone. Mm-hmm. As the women with a good shot, as he mentioned, the ranking is top 10 in the world, a little ahead of France, a little behind Australia, but you never know when you get into a tournament setting. Yeah. When we talk about, hey, Canada, when they get into a match up against the United States, you never know if this, like, that's a different deal, okay? Very different. Like, that's, let's not talk about Canada, the United States, hopefully that happens in a gold medal match. That'd be fun. And then you go into it with probably the mentality that that Greek team had and seemed like they did at times. It was just like, let's just overwhelm them with the amount of three point shots that we take. Let's just out math them. Let's hope we have, like, a 70% day from three, and we take a trillion of them. The only problem on the men's side of things is, like, Steph Curry, Kevin Durant, there's a lot of chakras over there, and they're like, they're prodigious chakras, and they're good at it. And the close three-point line, Curry, just must be laughing every time he looks from here. Okay. Sure. Yeah, I think that's obviously the recipe for this. I think this is a fun time for both of these programs, right, where you can have success that is an ultimate success, and I don't think that's going in with the loser's mentality, right? You should go there. Shouldn't go there expecting anything less than silver, and that's not to say that there isn't a tournament where it's seen as successful, if it's something less than that. But I think that this is where it's a fun time. We talk about this in different winning windows with the team sports that we follow year in and year out of, there is that sweet spot where you're still building, and you're still on the upswing to where, okay, you can, not where you're trying to twist yourself into it, where you can actually tell yourself, I was happy with this. This was a good season. This was a good tournament. I think both the men's and women's teams are definitely in that spot right now. I will say that anything short of getting out of the group for the men, though, is a disappointment despite the fact that they're talking medals, man. Yeah, despite the fact that this is a return to the Olympics for the first time in a couple of decades, yeah, that's been like epic failure to knock it back to the Olympics. But you just, I mean, watch the depth of talent. Look at what Shigil just Alexander is, and despite how tough it can be playing, like they just played a team with Yonis and granted outside of Yonis, that Greek team, nothing to write home above. Didn't even have the NASA's with them. It's hurt. Right. Yeah, you're right that it's kind of the innocent climb, but it's not the same as like a Leafs team that made the playoffs on the final or second last day of the regular season in Austin Matthews rookie season against the president's trophy champions and taking them to six games. What is like, it's different now that they got into the last Olympics. Yes. But this Olympics, it's, no, okay, like it's nice to be back and out of the group is the floor. Mm hmm. But like, let's just, let's gameplay this out. They lose to the States in a semi final and they have Yokech and Serbia and a bronze metal game. And then Yokech is transcending because they don't have anybody other than Kelli Olinikwa size. And then they lose like, I don't think we're going to be sitting, we're not going to be happy about it, but I don't think we look at it as some disaster tournament. No, that's true. But yeah, I got to get out of the group. Also, I mean, speaking of that American victory, which started with them trailing early in the game. And then they, yeah, they're America did like, they're America on a little here. They're America. Yeah. Kevin Durant, what did he get? He started seven to seven in that game. I think he finished. I think he finished seven of eight. It reminded me of, so we only saw Kevin Durant for 12 minutes in the 2019 NBA finals. The most terrifying 12 minutes of my life. But yeah, like, yeah, put yourself back in those 12 minutes where it was, okay, they're biding their time and okay, maybe when they're forced into it, they'll, they'll play Kevin Durant. He's not at a hundred percent, but whatever percentage of Kevin Durant they get is still going to overwhelm you. It did. Uh huh. Until the Achilles just said no more, Hey, banners fly forever. But obviously that war scene with Kevin Durant is winning the 2019 NBA finals. Yeah. Kevin Durant quite good. Yeah. I mean, the resume he easily could say is the best American Olympian ever, not Hooper, but yeah, as he is remarkable and getting to see him shine on that stage, it's awesome to see until he does it against Camden and then I'm going to hate every second of it. Yeah. So chase another title with your loaded team. Have fun. Talk with Tyree's Halliburton and Jason Tatum. Not getting into that game. Yeah. Then some breaks, buddy. All right. Uh, we'll be back tomorrow with another edition of the fan morning show, Ben and his Frank Gunning Sports at five nine fans. Good morning. - Good morning. (upbeat music)