State 15s Assistant Coach, Brad Smith, joined Scott Cummings and Tim Gossage in the studio to discuss the shortcomings and positives of the current talent pathway landscape.
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SEN WA Breakfast
WA Football Pathways need support - Brad Smith State 15s Coach (03/07/2024)
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So give it a try at mintmobile.com/switch. 45 dollars up front for three months plus taxes and fees, promote 8 for new customers for limited time, unlimited more than 40 gigabytes per month, so it turns at mintmobile.com. Welcome back, 3.7 degrees, heading for top of 19, after 730 Drew Jones joins us from Fox Footy and Fox Sports, used to talk on all things footy and speculation, of course, of Blake Waterman. Watermelons. We'll try and get to the bottom of that, of course, his name has been linked to contract offer from Geelong and also Melbourne. Yeah. Eight others. Whatever boosts it up and puts a rocket up there you go. We've got a calling for Paul Pios as well. Brad Smith is an aim synonymous to WA football. I think it's a three-time premiership player, 15-time leading goalkeeper. So be like. Yeah, I don't know. Well, yeah, for that, yeah. Hey, we're just going to keep it all in the fam. They still look like those. So there's even more. There's not many of us left. Let me tell you right now. Hey, Smithy. Thanks for coming in. No, thanks for having us. Thanks for-- The three-time premiership? Yes, three-year. I'm only letting go. Because four, I think. Four, yeah. Four, I think you know. [LAUGHS] Four, I think. And actually, to be honest, he played a significant part in that 49-year premiership drought that Subi broke in 1973. Oh, that they broke, although you can say he played a Subi part in this drought. Because West Perth were a dominant team. They beat Subi three-time down in the second semi. The skitters old man played was a superstar for West Perth. Filsome. [DING] But got injured. That's just a warning, sorry. Got injured, had an injury, and didn't play in the grandi. And he would have been the difference. And-- It's funny to say that. So that was in '73. You know, was that '73? No, wasn't '73? Yeah, it was '73. So in 2003, I kicked. It was funny. Just a quick story. I kicked, I think, 81 goals up, 81 or 83. So did Dad, 83. And then I hurt my knee in the grand final and didn't participate. And he got injured the game before and didn't participate. So it was quite a-- It was quite funny. Yeah. Yeah, they're all canace. It's one hell of a career they might have. No, thanks, Scotty. What are you doing now? I am. So I had-- I was a long time at West Coast as you know. And then caught the redundancy during COVID. And then had a bit of time off. And now I'm running a footy program with Darren Rumbel at a school called Darling Rain Sports College. Great school. Great school. Absolutely. Great school. And you're involved in the state school boys. Talk about the 15s, predominantly. Is that right? Yes. Yes. So first of all, thanks very much for giving us the platform to talk about it. We're trying to raise a profile of it. Especially you had Dixie on yesterday to talk about that talent review that they're doing. And they have to do it. That's footy commission. Footy commission. Yep. We're governed by school sport WA. So yeah, just want to get on it and just discover-- So they're the poor relation. And they're trying to get some form of-- I understand their review that they're trying to do. They're trying to get a model similar to that of Gold Coast. And they say, that's not the same model, but that's how the academy works. And we need to try and take out the best info and best data out of what they do at the Gold Coast and also the Sydney Swans and all those academies. If they're the poor relation, so to speak of that, where does that put you guys? Well, that's why they're doing it. So we don't fall behind. Yeah. And we've got to make sure that we don't try to compare ourselves to the state of Victoria either, because our state is unique in the sense that everywhere in Gal Victoria, there's a talent program, a really good talent program, where you go to the Murray book changes, Geelong, Benny, Go, Ballarat. You name it. There's a little town, you can go get a talent program. Over here, if you're a talent player in the Kimberley, there's not a good, competent, contemporary coach up there to coach a kid in the Kimberley. You've got to move. You've got to move. You've got to move. So they're the challenges that we can't really address. That's a barrier. So I've spoken-- oh, I heard, listen to Dixie. I was quite interested, because she had some great points. At one point, she said that with technology these days, we can coach like satellite. I don't know if that's practical, to be honest with you. I don't know. She's white does, one doesn't you? Yeah, you can give us some tips, that sort of thing, but you've got to be face to face. You can't replicate one-on-one coaching. And these kids, we've got in the state school boys. There's 25, and they're all together. We've got kids that travel up from Bunbury and Geraldton, and those places. But they're like Monica, they're competing with each other, they're doing recoveries together, they're doing touch together, they're doing kicking programs together, they're learning, they're sweating together. We can't give a training program to a kid up in Geraldton or Caratha and say, replicate what we're doing. It's just crazy if you think you do it. Or I'd like to know what technology can replicate that experience. The state school sport and school footy is not just Perth. That's what that's the issue, and we're such a big state. Well, that's right. Well, that's traditionally speaking. So when I first got involved, I spoke to people at the footy commission, "Why aren't you governing this?" Or, "Why aren't you with these guys?" It was so umbrella. Yes, well, they're not. But I think they should be working together. And probably the knocks they've had with the state school boys is one that they don't agree with the five games in the seven days, which is a legitimate concern you. That's fair enough. We can't do nothing about it other than try to manage all their games throughout the year. We also, we've got wellness apps where the kids can log in and say, "Listen, I'm not feeling well." So we'll manage their training and those sort of things. They've also been critical of state school boys of picking, selecting kids that they want to win now. So kids who are 15, they've got body-like, 18-year-old. They're not necessarily talented. Might have put. Yes, yes. So we'd like to think now, Tom's a great up-and-coming coach, we'd like to think now that we select players who we think are talented enough to go on and play Waffle AFL. Not right now. We want to develop players that we think can go on play AFL, not be 150 Hall of Fame gamers for the Northern Federals or whoever we want to try to get AFL players. So to do that, we've brought in when we have our selection games, we'll bring in recruiters. So we've had four or five recruiters come in and we've got a squad, we picked a squad last year. We got pipped in the grand finals. So we went over there, bowled over Queensland, which are pretty good these days. And that's not just a tick the box at New South Wales, it's the same South Australia, then we bowled over Vic 2, and then we played Vic 1, which is a combined Vic Country Vic Metro team in Ballarat in the mud, the cold, and we just got back. Oh, that's interesting, stacked. Yeah, yeah, yeah. These are all state schools, aren't they? Yeah, well, it's called state school boys, but it's still the best player. You can come from a private school, you can come from a private school. So our squad, out of the 25 we've got, we've got nine kids from state school, nine from PSA, and then we got the rest from a Catholic school. All right, well, Cathy from Maruna has texted, and if you've got a question for Brad Smith, 0487736736, Cathy says, "Thanks to all the coaching and extended staff for their time "and support and expertise with our 15s, "my grandson is in the team and travels from Geraldton, "each week for training to spot his own injury set back, "he wouldn't miss a session." Can I tell you about that kid? His name's Reid, and he is an absolute gripper. So first of all, he just missed out. He was a train on player, and we told the train on kid, "You didn't make the squad, but if you want to come and train, "there's an injury, you're there." - So we had a few-- - We'll see something in you. - And he, well, he was really good. Like, he probably should've been initially. Anyway, he came down every session from Geraldton, his parents drove him down, right? These are barriers they have, so they need parents to support it. He's come down, played well in the trial game, someone gets injured, and we thought, "Reed's doing really well." So we got Reid in the squad. Then we played Freeo next-gen academy last week, and he's broken his collarbone, snapped in half, they put a plate in on it as well. So he's got a plate in. In the sling, and his dad rings up. "Listen, can you do something now? "Son can't help himself. "He's taking the sling off. "He's done the five-key run. "He's down on the local booty club. "He's kicking the balls, and we're going, 'What's he doing?'" - You love a team of raids? - Anyway, we're signed. Go rest up. What's the Netflix, do your homework, all that. He's driven down. They've driven down to training. He's kicking the balls back. I reckon it's just going to be one of those stories you talk about in '15. He's playing, I fell, and we look back and go, "Remember when Reid was doing this stuff?" So there's a barrier. - Above and beyond. But there's a barrier, Gerald and Kidd. The commitment from the parents and himself is very, very inspiring. The boys have got around him. I reckon he's going to... It'll be touch and go whether he gets to fly over with the Gold Coast, but he's a great story. So one of your biggest challenges is obviously funding. So the 16s and 18s get flown in a state, they get put up, and all that sort of jazz, and they pay a registration fee of, what, five, 600 bucks or something like that? - Yeah, 600. - Are they in the program? Yes, so it's $600, and it's totally different. So they've got Adam Jones, who oversees the 16s and 18s program. The guy, the Adam Jones for us at School Sport, I've come in and seen him around a bit. Peter Smith, he's been a store ward of School Sport. W.A.'s terrific guy and been terrific for School Sport. He'd pop down, I thought, "He'd be good if someone like Jones is always down here." But what he does, not only does he do it for W for our school AFL, he does it for netball, cricket, volleyball. So he's got to do all that. We don't have an Adam Jones to oversee our whole program. We're all sort of volunteers. It's all the states, the 16s and 18s, they all get paid. And they're funded by the AFL club, so the royalties that they get from West Coast Eagles and Fremantle, they own the license. They get a lot of money from West Coast, obviously they're flush with the cash. - What do you get? - We're at a lot of cost to you guys. OK, yeah, so they get 600, and they get the return flights, and the coaching, and the hotels, and all that sort of stuff. Our boys have to cough up $3,000. - Right. - You have to play, so they'll cover their flights, their levees, their gear, their gear like this. And also, they're not staying, we don't have their duty care, the coaches don't have the duty of care. They actually got to go over there and pay for their return flights, pay for an Airbnb, car to get around, and then we'll just see them at training. So it's, we've got some working class families last year to max out their credit cards. They're not going to deny their son to represent their stay. So they get it done, they somehow get it done. So a couple of, we've got to somehow lean on our relationships. I'll rank a couple of people this, and we respond to this, keep an help kick in two and a half or three grand. But I'd love if some WA company or corporate can come in and say this, and we want to support this. There's not a lot we can give them in exposure, anything like that. It'll pretty much be a good thing, socially responsible sort of thing to do, so I've helped young WA football be in the talent pathway, represent their state. So I'd love it if there was a WA company out there that can kick in some money to help subsidise their representation in the programme. It would be fantastic. There's going to be boys in Miss Anne. There has to be boys in Miss Anne. The cost of living at the moment is through the roof. There are people genuinely, genuinely struggling at the moment to pay their bills that. And then you say he's three grand, need that plus, plus, plus, two. Yes. So all up, what does it cost? If you've got a boy going across to play in the state school boys, where are they going next? We're on the Gold Coast, so there's a couple of things there. So we went to the Ballarat last year. I asked a parent that last night and they said it cost us $10,000. So that was all those costs that I just spoke about. Others will be six or seven because they might only take one parent, but both parents and general speaker want to go. They'll have a great time. They'll have a great time to do a survey at the end of the programme. What did you like about it? They say overwhelming, it was a terrific programme. But the cost is enormous. So when we talk about programmes and funding, and let's get this review going like Dixie, we need some coin. We need some coin. We're running off the smell of an oily raglock. We need 40 years. I'll get them from my school or Tommy, our coach. He'll get them from his school or bump. Tom, who are you talking about? Thomas Carter, he's our coach, he's a terrific young coach and does a great job. So, yeah, we're talking about talent review. We need some funds. Is there a responsibility? I know the Eagles and the Dockers pay their royalties that they have to pay. It doesn't seem a lot. I mean, the Eagles got $80 million at the bank, which is not bad for a not-for-profit. Is there a responsibility on the Eagles? I know they have a business to run, but how do you bricks in the bank is a fair war chest? If they get a responsibility to listen to the commission, they get a responsibility? They do. And the commission, I will say, ever since we've sort of tried to get a line, I went and spoke down and Jones a bit about how we can make the programme. He's been terrific. He flew over, watched our grand finals, saw a few things that he liked. He said, "Listen, you'll need help here. "You'll need help there." And he's actually doing some things that's going to help us get some profile in and around the programme. But I will say about the AFL club last year, got David Walz, a friend of mine, and Dave McMullen, they're listed in recruiting manager for her. They came and watched. There was a few other recruiting clubs there. They came and spoke to our boys. And Walz, he was terrific. He said, "Listen, I really, really, easily, "we really like what we see here. "We're going to be helping our NGA boys as well. "And West Coast NGA boys, we want to be on board somehow. "How can we help with it? We need some coin." And he goes, "Listen, I'll speak to Simon Garlic." And then he called back a couple of weeks ago and said, "Garlic's on board. He's a whack of money." So we were very, very appreciative of that. So from that, I rang a couple of old mates at West Coast. "Listen, I know he's doing..." "No, no, no, no." Well, I just know what Nizz was like. If Nizz was CEO, you just go up and he's going, "Listen, very hard work." - Mate, this happened. - And he'd go, "Yeah." And he'd go, "Yeah, email this, see if yadda, yadda, yadda." So I spoke to Mattie Clark, who I think will be terrific for West Coast, he's a new list manager. And they're getting some things together, too. And they're going to be helpful as well. So I want to say, shout out to both. - Yeah, well done. - That's good to hear. - Well done. And look, the texts are coming in. "My twin boys have just made the state school boys "under 12 team and travelled along in August "for the national champ. "They also made the team last year as a bottom age. "The training's been sensational for my boys. "And Brad said it's so good for my son to be around "kids with the same talent. "My issue is after this year, there is nothing for them "for two years until the 15s. "We've even contemplated moving east "because my boys are exceptional players "and want to be pushed in the next two years. "And there's nothing quite like that here in the WA. "We really like an academy." Also says, and it costs them $9,000 to take their twins over for the carnival. - 12. - Yep. - So a couple of things there. - It's a sacrifice. - So yeah, it is. So the 12s, so there's the 12s and the next things fit. So they're talking about with review on all these pathways I think of them. It may be potentially do a 12s, a 14s, and then a 16s. So there's not that big gap as she was saying there. - It is not number the 15s, isn't it? Because we do go national 16s and A-dains, but 15s is up to year 10. - Oh, depending, yeah, depending. So there's some year 9s and some year 10s, depending on where they are on the calendar year. - Okay, so bottom line is, Smithy, and this is a part of the reason. So in a simple terms is you've got a whole range of boys who are playing football, but are not in a position for the best part, from all around the state, to fork out the money, to go away on these states. Well, they do, they fork it out, but you would like to some sort of support. Now, so if you're a major company and you do sponsor, what can you get? Is it just naming rights on your track suits and stuff like that? And hopefully there's some return on investment for those businesses. I mean, we know businesses, I know businesses. And I've just been on the phone texting someone right now. I hope they're listening. And I know this person is well connected to the footy community. So they're just not aware of the plight. - Yes. - Is it a plight? Are you serious, is it serious, Nate? - No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Well, as I said, there's only been, I'll rang that parent. There was one person in the last four or five years that didn't come. Very good play, actually a good football person in Western Australia too. He got selected and he made the final 25. They said not to go. And I rang him. I said, listen, was it something about the program? Or what was it? And he said, it was just a cost really. And it wasn't really that I couldn't afford. I was like, we just couldn't justify it. I said, no, totally understand. - Do you think some kids slip through the cracks because of the cost it takes to go, isn't it? - No, so what it is, no. So they'll come and try out. We have trial games and they don't have to put out 20 bucks. So they'll come down from everywhere and try. And if they make it, they make all these carts and get down to the 25, then they'll somehow find the money. But it just really, really stretches them. - 131255, took your depot open line or 10 0 4 8 7 7 3 6 7 3 6. Some people are saying it could be actually a sport for the rich at various levels you need to fork it out. - It's expensive. - And you, your boy plays Colts footy and plays. - You pay Colts fees and then you pay your club fees as well 'cause he's a borderline player and you have to be aligned to a club team. So you might play a handful of both and you're coughing up a couple of fees and there's boots and then there's travel and all that sort of jazz. - There's all that. It'd just be great if it was similar to the '16s and '18s program where it has come up with five or six hundred. That's doable. - Yep. - Seven to 10,000 is a real, real stretch, especially in today's class. - What's the group like now? What's the squad like? - You're really good. So last year we picked 28 in the squad, 25 in the final squad and out of those 28, 19 have gone to the '16s. So the '15s play a really, really important part in the pathway. - Given. - Given. The reason they do is because you go out and watch these kids as 13 or 14s in the community and I do it all the time. And we talk about in the review a contemporary coaching, the full forward still at full forward at both ends. Like it's very, very '80s and '90s because their community coaches, - I like it. - Yeah, exactly. - I like it. - So then when they get into the '15s the first time they're exposed to a football experience. Now because it's the first time for a lot of the kids we've got to drip feed a lot of the stuff like from a total holistic game education like we will drip feed them game previews before games, game reviews, you know, recoveries, prehab. You know, defenders, we want defenders to play assertive or defenders to play lockdown or a rolling forward line. So these guys are like, what's all this sort of stuff? So we want to make sure that they've got that good football experience, a football experience that also travels and then hand them over the '16s and they've already had that one year of all that exposure of a footy program. - Yeah, yeah. - And in the past, I think the state school boys they've been critical of who they choose. The retention from going in the '15s and '16s isn't as high as what it is now. So hopefully we're ticking that football experience off in the talent pathway. So a lot of the things that Dixie's put in that document, that working document, it's great. And we'd like to think that we're getting there. We're ticking a few of those boxes, but the big box that needs to be ticked is just some resourcing of what the footy commission get with the '16s and '18s. - It's a good point you make, especially if they, if they're, it's a part of the pathway, it's sort of, it's got to start at another level down. - Let's start there. - Yeah, it might even have to start lower, but this is the closest part to that '16s and '18. - And there's a lot of talk early in the year that we're going to produce no talent this year. Now obviously, it's on the '18s, draftable talent, but I think they've shown that there's, I think there's probably five or six and more than likely get drafted. It's five or six enough. - Well, I don't think that generally speaking, no is the short answer, but sometimes you're just going to have those years that there's anomalies that there's not going to be as many as the other. Now, we've got to compare ourselves for like the like state, like the like state for us, given our football set ups, probably the sandfall, the South Australia. And I think last 10, 15 years, we've always performed a smidge better than South Australia in terms of draftables, always average. We can't beat 'em in state games. - Can't wait, I don't know. - It's for thee. Okay, I'm going to dumb this down just before you let you go. We appreciate it. Brad Smith is in the studio from school sport, of course, and talking about the 15s and they need help. They need some sort of financial support to help. The next generation of kids, because the parents are forking out and we've had parents text us in today, as they seven to nine grand to get across and the like. And they love the program, but they just need some help. In simple terms, what sort of money do you need? - Overall, if you said to me, and I guess I only said don't set a ceiling, well, what would be a nice little pot that would assist the group right now? Let's talk about right now. - All right, so listen, I'm not an accountant or I'm worked as a CFO at the 40 clubs in marketing and business development to get anything is good, anything is good, anything like free on West Coast to keep chipping in, that's great. 50 to 100. - Yeah, okay. So we're talking about 50 to 100 grand. How much did you get out of the referee commission? - Roughly. - Nothing. Nothing. - And how much before you put your hand out and mentioned the free mound on West Coast, how much did you get? - Nothing. - Nothing. - So who, how do you... - Well, well, well. - Exactly. - So we've got where? - Where? - We're volunteers. - School, school, school, sport, W.A., school sport, and Pete Smith would probably like you to answer a couple of those questions. - Yeah, sure. - School sport, W.A. and the education department. They will, while on the way, selecting the team, while I'm away coaching the team. They'll pay for someone to replace me at my school. - Yeah. - So that's, that's, that's a cost that... - Yeah, but that's four or five hours. - I get all that. - Yep. - But that's not helping. - No. - That's not helping directly. It's helping the families 'cause you get the best coaching and you know, you've got a great record and stuff. But we are genuinely talking about how do we take the financial burden of families who could be the families of the next star who could play at this stadium, who could be drafted, play through our state 16s and 18s program. And that's where they all come from. That's where the Harley Reid comes from through the country and all that sort of stuff. Bottom line is you're not getting any assistance. - No. - And that's what I'm here. - To get any government assistance? - Ah. - But outside of school sport, I understand it's always intertwined, but... - No. - Okay. - No. - All right. - You talk about retention of players. - That's what I'm saying. - Yeah, it doesn't make any. So it's strange. But you talk about retention of players and people playing our sport. That'll have an influence on even, maybe not the ones that make the state team, but the ones that might add 12 or 13 and think, "I'm a chance to make it. "I want to make it. "I want to make it." And then all of a sudden, they go, "Well, if I do make it, "that goal's unattainable "because Mum don't can't afford it." - Yep. - Speedy, we could go on. We could go on and on and on and all about this. So you've come in and you've, and you've certainly pushed the Barrett nicely. It is a wonderful talent pathway. In simple terms, can we win on the Gold Coast? - Um, yeah. - We had some... - When I'd read in, mate, get a final spot for Reid Reid. - Yeah, he's tough. He'll play with the collarbone. - Yeah. - He'll play with no bones at all. - I hope he goes over because he plays for Keeps That Kid. - Yeah, nice for you. Thanks for coming in, mate. - Thanks for having us. And thanks to SCN. I do listen to the program. Thanks very much for giving us a platform to talk about this too, so I'm pretty sure. - Do you miss me on Twitter? - Do you miss me on Twitter? - Ah, go on, miss you. - It's been out eight days, mate. It's been out eight days. - Hey, guys. - I always like giving him a bit of a kickup when it tips up a couple of winners there. - Thank you. - When I actually messaged him, I messaged him to see if I can come on and pump up the 15th. - Oh, I actually know. I said, "Listen, I've got to win this that day too for you." One, nothing. Didn't get nothing back from the great man. - Did you back it? - All his choice. - Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Non-pantomate, I'm a giver. I'm a giver. It's 26 past seven, four degrees, four degrees. - Ah, it's jumping. - Good luck to the walk to the cast. Get up, 19 is the top. Drew Jones talking 40 after 7.30.