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Download the Experian app. Results will vary, not all subscriptions are eligible, savings are not guaranteed, paid membership with connected payment account required. [Music] Hey everybody, how ya doin'? Well, that's good. Welcome to PHLY Flyers presented by mortgageCS. Check out mortgageCS.com/PHLY to start your home buying process today. Come to the NMLS ID number 1464766. My name is Bill Matts. I'm sitting on the world's least comfortable bar stool right now, joining me as always is Philadelphia's number one hockey beat reporter Charlie O'Connor, and broad street hockey's own Kelly Hinkle. -What's up, Kelly? -What's up, Kelly? -What's up, Kelly? -What's up, Kelly? -Mackafee. You're perched. -I'm perched. -Yeah, I just-- -Like, Mackafee. -The stool is so much higher than the table I have my laptop on. The whole thing, yeah, you spend a couple of months in an actual studio and you forget how we used to have to do things literally every single week with broad street hockey, but here we are now, fam. Matt Vay-Mitchkov signed the draft behind us. They've made their selections. Eric Johnson is back. Garnet Hathaway staying. What else? What's left for Danny Breyer? That is what we were talking about today, as well as the first day of development camp, and that's where I want to begin with Mr. O'Connor over here, who is down at the Flyers Training Center. Very official name for the Skate Zone. I just-- I won't stop laughing about it because I had no idea they changed it years ago until like the last time I was there. Anyway, Charlie, you were down at development camp today. Give us all the notes. Tell us all of the things that you learned about these young Flyers. I'm sure there are copious amounts of things you would like to share. Yeah, not really. Day one. Just all the time. Day one, just to give people some background. Day one at development camp, at least in terms of what they do on the ice, it's always pretty light. It's not the drills where you can actually watch and learn something about where the players stand from a talent standpoint. It's very much like skating drills where they're going maybe 70%. You know, shooting drills where it's like, okay, yeah, they're just like picking corners and hoping they made. They hit it. Like, it's just, it's not a day where there's much you can gain in terms of evaluation. We do interview a lot of people on day one. So, we interviewed a lot of players to just run through the list. We interviewed Oliver Bonk, Spencer Gill, Jet Luchenko, Hunter McDonald, Noah Powell, Massimo Rizzo, and Carter Sotheran. So, we interviewed quite a few players. And yeah, I mean, it seems like they're all happy to be in development camp. Uh, Luchenko is a good skater. Like, he's, he comes as advertised in terms of skating. He can skate real fast. Spencer Gill is very tall and very skinny. He needs to put on a lot of weight. Uh, the one guy, actually, who I would say, if anybody stood out to me, it was Noah Powell, who was the fifth round pick they took out of the USHL. He was a, a redraft. So, he got passed over in the draft last year, uh, then had a breakout season this year with his USHL team. Uh, he looked good. He's, he's not a good skater yet. But the, the feed are always moving. Like, he's, he's high effort. You're hoping that maybe as he gets more power into his strides, maybe that turns into him being at least an okay skater. But he's just one of those guys where you notice him. You know, he's got size, but his shot is heavy. You know, it was getting, you know, a quick release off that shot. It was, it was coming in hard and he just like, once he gets going, you could just see how he can, he can frighten opposing defenses when he gets rolling. And one cool thing about Noah Powell that I don't think a lot of fans knew. I, I knew it because I did some research post draft. Um, he is like mostly death, not completely. Interesting. But he basically was born with very, uh, with significant hearing loss and, you know, he wears things in his ears and he's become an extremely good lip reader. Like when you, when you interview him and you can see it when you're on the, when you're watching him on the ice, like, he is staring intently at the coach so he can read his, read the coach's lips or her because Caramore, the, the Princeton Tech coach is at this camp too. But he's reading the coach's lips to basically match it up with what does register from a hearing standpoint. Um, but he's, you know, he's a completely, you know, he's a completely functional and just, it's, it's not holding him back at all. And it's really cool. And, but, uh, but yeah, he, you know, we interviewed him and he seems like a really nice kid. So it's just one of those, one of those cool little things that, um, that, you know, he's obviously had to overcome in his life and you got to give him a lot of credit. And Charlotte, when you look at the right side, he'll never get pulled off sides on an audible, you know, one of the, one of the... That was the big joke. That was the big joke in the media room was that, you know, if he gets to the NHL quick, that all the other players are going to be jealous of them because he can tune out John Turrell. Yeah. What a guess. Um, so you talk to Massimo Rizzo. That's one of the guys I kind of wanted to talk about because he's kind of this unknown commodity. Uh, the fliers acquired him last year and what is essentially the Tony D'Angelo trade, all that nonsense that went on with the buyout. Um, one of the Kasha brothers rights, but it was the Tony D'Angelo trade. Um, did we learn anything about him today? How do you look, et cetera? Not really. As I said, I'll get a better read tomorrow. Cause I mean, his big thing is size. You know, he's not that big. So it'll be very interesting to see how he holds up in the more battle oriented drills, which usually start on day two. That's like day two, day three. So that'll be tomorrow and then Friday is more really good to see that. And I'll try to get a read on, you know, what his strengths looking like. I asked him though, if he saw himself as a center or wing at the NHL level, and he basically said he could do both. To me, that tells me that he's probably going to be a wing. Um, because if he really thought he could be a center, he would say I'm a center. Uh, if he's saying I could do both, that means to me that he's probably a wing, especially given his size, and especially given the fact that he's not a blue chip prospect. I just know there's some people who wonder, you know, he's, he's played center before coming up, you know, through college. There's some people who wonder, could he help out down the middle. I think he's away. And I think he without saying as much. She kind of knows that. Um, since you mentioned size. Denver Barkey 102 points last year in the OHL had another had a great playoff as well. Um, last we saw him. It looked like he was about 14 years old and like an underdeveloped 14. Has he hit puberty yet? Like has, has he had that growth spurt put on any weight? Is he still looking like a little kid, anything wrong Denver Barkey. Well, we didn't interview him. So I can't speak. I can't speak to what he looks like in terms of space, because I think that's a real driving part of it is that when you when you look at his face and you hear him speak. Like he, he looks like a child. He does. Um, he had, I don't, on the ice, I didn't notice him looking significantly taller. Maybe he's bulked up a little, but he's never going to be a big guy. Like that's just not him. He's, there's only so much you can put on that kind of frame and continue to do what you want to do on the ice from a skill standpoint. So he's just always going to be a small guy. The question is whether he has the, uh, he has the skill and also the, uh, the tenacity to make up for his, uh, his weaknesses from a physical standpoint, but we'll probably talk to him tomorrow and I'll give you a better read on, you know, what, whether he, uh, he seems older, or if he still looks very, very young. Hey, Charlie, it's me, Jennifer Porky. Yes. He remembers me real deep. Yeah. That would be actually scupendous if he did that. Like you look at him, he's got lifts in his shoes. He's, he's on like three children in a, in a trench coat. He's on top. Um, anyway, so that's, uh, Charlie's going to be down at development camp all week and we will have more news and notes coming out. Uh, just, you know, about all the prospects who are there, obviously, um, Alexi Colosov, there was question whether or not he would be there. He isn't. Um, was there anything further on that or is it just like, yeah, it's, he's not here at the end. No, well, what Breyer told us yesterday? I didn't, like, I didn't transcribe this yesterday because the main focus was my veg golf, but obviously people are still concerned about Colosov, which I get, like, when L.A. And he even puts it in a column, people are going to freak out. Um, from what I understand, the flyers still expect him to come. When we asked Danny Breyer about it yesterday, he said, look, everything we've been told is that he's going to come. The reason why he's not at development camp is because he had a really long season. He's already played in three per years and that tends to be our cutoff for, like, our guys anyway, like once they play three per years, they don't have to do development camp anymore. So we just basically told them you could have the summer, like, don't worry about it. That said, I mean, this is, these are just things that like, you know, you do think about like, they brushed off the cutter go to a thing too when he missed it off the camp and they were like, Oh no, it's no big deal. We're good. When in reality, it was, Oh no, we're real bad. We just can't tell you. So you do have to, you know, take everything here with a little bit of a grain of salt. But what I, my understanding is that they think he's calm, like, they think all of us coming and Breyer straight up said yesterday he's like, he's under contract. So we can't really play anywhere else. Then he kind of laughed and said, well, I guess Benotov stayed, but then he said, look, his team, like, Benotov's team and Benotov himself both got punished. So it's hard for me to imagine that, like, this is what Danny said. He says, hard for me to imagine that they would do that again, given the fact that like those punishments from the IHF were real. Like, Benotov can't like play an international hockey for a while because of everything that went down. So my guess is that he's going to be there, but like, obviously you can't completely dismiss something when Elliot Friedman's tweeting it, but everything I've heard is that they think he's good and they think he'll be here at camp. That's in September, I guess we'll see. Ladies and gentlemen, it's my pleasure to announce that smooth sack summer is officially upon us. And when you're playing in the summer sun, make sure you're groomed from pubes to bum. Thanks to our friends at Manscaped, you can make this season your smoothest yet. The performance package 5.0 Ultra is the ultimate bundle to keep your boys downstairs cool while looking hot. 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Don't do that in the lake. Anyway, now that you have the perfect haircut, use Manscaped's liquid liquid formulations to keep that freshness, even not even at the hottest summer barbecues. Once they touch your sack, you'll never go back. Manscaped even through in two free gifts to their performance package 5.0, the Manscaped boxers and the shed travel bag. Get 20% off and free shipping with code flyers at Manscaped.com right now. It's smooth sack summer boys, get on board or get left behind. Kelly, I did love you mouthing package. I really respect the way that Manscaped leans in. There is a very big deal. You know, why, why, why beat around the bush, you know. Anyways, so that's that's development camp. Is there anything else from first day of development camp or we good to just kind of get on to the rest of the stuff and we'll have more news and notes the rest of the week. Really, I mean, as I said, it'll, it'll be more interesting to see tomorrow and Friday when you actually see them battling and then there's the three on three tournament on Saturday. I will say that then both Hunter McDonald and Oliver bonk like they, they are, they are built. I know that they have been working out quite a lot over these this last year and they look significantly more built than they did last year. So hey, good for them. Hell yeah, that's what I like to see. Put on that muscle boys and then make sure you're well groomed. Go to Manscaped.com use code flyers. They were there watching the kids. That was cool. So it was York, Drysdale, Fariby, and someone else. Or is it just a photo? I think photo talk was there. There was four of them and cannot confirm, but it's possible that Morgan for us was there too. Okay. I like the photo toms part of that crew. I've decided he's right in there with them. I hope so. Well, so Fariby, Fariby his buddies with some more. So I wouldn't, you wouldn't shock me the photo. I was kind of latched on, because he's now friends with some more because they're. I can see. All right, great. You know, I want the locker room to be tight. These are, these are things I love to hear. Now we can move on to, I guess, the business of the day. So, Mitch Cobb's ELC is done and we can get into that and the performance bonuses and everything. But I laid out last week, the class A and B bonuses that ELC eligible players have kind of built in. You can achieve up to four of those bonuses in the class B if you do one of them. But those are like, yeah, you have a fucking star player in your hands if you achieve a class B. It's up to what three and a half million in bonuses, I think. Yeah, I believe it would max out, it could theoretically max out at like four, four, five or something. I think in terms of like cat pit plus bonuses. I think that's the way it adds up. And I asked, I asked Breair about that yesterday. If he's got the bonuses like maxed out, he's basically like almost. So I don't have the specific details of the contract yet, but it certainly seems like they maxed them out as much as they possibly could. Yeah, that makes sense. We expected this and it's just sort of a thing. It's maybe while they're going to want to open up a little more cap space or keep some free. So it doesn't roll over to next year, but we all saw this coming. It's. Yeah, sure. It's a nine, what nine seventy five cap hit now and then nine, nine, fifty, I believe. I think I think he's the max fan. And then, you know, next year, it's like, oh, it was actually three. Okay, we'll see how we figure this out. So it's the team's best player. He's here. That's great. Half the way that extension. Yeah, that extension got done. We have resolution in terms of no qualifying offer for Carter Hart, something we wanted to know about. Cam Atkinson bought out. Another thing we figured was going to happen doesn't look like, I mean, it's not going to Cal Peterson won't be the Ryan Johansson thing. We just don't know how that's going to play out because we don't know if he's ever going to be deemed healthy. Draft is over. As I said, they took care of some business yesterday. EJ is back. Little surprise and connect me not done yet. I realize, I realize it's one day like we're twenty, we're like thirty six hours into this thing with Travis connecting, but him being eligible to sign. But it did seem like back in the winter they were like, yeah, we're going to get this thing pre negotiated, and then on July 1 or shortly after and we are still well within the shortly after range obviously, it will be announced. Not announced yet though is this a little surprising to anybody. So I have to say that it's, I mean, based on the contracts that we've seen signed over the last thirty six hours. There's no fucking ways get nine. Like I think that we can like if Ryan Hart got eight and a half, Connect needs not getting more than Sam Reinhardt like no fucking way. So I think maybe like things have kind of fallen in the fliers favor a little bit because if Connect was looking for eight point eight or whatever. Like Danny brayers has to point at that one single contract to be like no dude, no, not a chance. I don't think it I don't think it's that simple, but I do, but I, Kelly, I do agree with you though that the last couple days the contracts that have been signed definitely do help the fliers position. The three contracts I'm thinking about are the Reinhardt deal. Absolutely. The Jake Genssel deal actually because even though that is at a nine million dollar cap it. That's a nine million dollar cap it over seven years. Now, I don't like it would be hard I think for connect me to argue that he has a better track record than Genssel. And if you're the fliers you could theoretically say like okay well if you want to say you're Genssel, then let's just that you're gonna start with a nine million dollar cap it we can tack on the extra year to bring that cap it down, give you a little bit more money and then boom suddenly you're at a reasonable cap it for what we're looking for. And then today you have the paddle who's never contract which is six years eight million dollars. It just seems like, like if connect me came into this negotiation if his camp came into the negotiation, looking for like well into the nines coming up on the tens. These contracts do not help his case from a comparison. But but Bill to go back and answer to go back to answer your question. It really no it doesn't surprise me that what I had heard was that the fliers want to have this done ideally by the end of the summer like they don't want this to bleed into the season. But no, it seemed like over the last month or so that both sides came to the conclusion that like the gap was larger than I think both of them had hoped it would be. But if that's coming from connect me asking for close to 10 million year, you can understand why the fliers are like yeah we're not going to sign that now. He was hoping that you know Reinhardt was going to hit the market wasn't going to resign with Florida and then he was going to go take 10 mil somewhere. Well, that just got dashed because he stayed in Florida. He signed his deal like the thing with the Reinhardt stuff is that while I'm sure that he gave them a little bit of a hometown discount like number one. I don't like to move we talked about this number two. It's a cup team. They've been to this cup final two straight years they wanted this past year. He probably wants to stay. That's something obvious. And then it's axis. I'm sure they I'm sure plays a bit of a role. But like they're, but in any case, I don't think connect he can like the fliers can't just be like well Reinhardt's way better than you. And he took 8.6 or whatever. So you should take 7.8 like there are going to be factors that play into this work and acting is going to be like well, like, come on, you got to understand that that's not an apples apple situation, but it certainly does help the fliers leverage because if I'm the fliers I'm absolutely point to Reinhardt and I'm saying this guy scored 50 plus goals last year he got 8.6 over eight years so who were you to ask for 8.9 that's insane and that's fair. Absolutely and the counter to that obviously I remember this coming out like during different among a few different Toronto, you know, some of their stars negotiations and it's like, yeah, comparables don't really work. Every one situation is like, I would take less if we were keeping a cup team together. I would take less if it was Tampa, and we're trying to get the band back together reassemble a cup team and we have other stars who need who need accommodating I'm the best player here bitch like you got no one else to pay I'm Travis connecting. This is the only like Eric Johnson Garnett Hathaway. These are your big off season moves thus far. I'm worth more than like maybe Reinhardt is in that situation just because of what he means to keep this thing together that would be the counter. Obviously, I have thought time and time again if this is the money. Travis connect me once like trade him trade him right fucking now, you know, but we'll see how this thing plays out, but I brought up like so many things got done over the last couple of days from between the draft up through yesterday. Do you think there could be any outside factors like something that they something else they're hoping to get done before they're like okay and now we can think about this, you know, eight nine 10 million dollar whatever it's going to be a year contract for Travis Connect is there some other shoe, maybe that's going to drop do you think that's a possibility first. I mean, I think there could be other shoes that drop but I don't think it has a ton of bearing on the connecting negotiation like a GN is capable of doing at the same time, like he can be negotiating a Travis connect me contract with a few calls a day or even just like a text message a day or whatever, wherever they are in the negotiation, while also trying to work out trades, you know, trading whoever on the roster trade trading and trying to dump rasters aligning like, but I don't think those things necessarily preclude him from also working out a deal with connecting because the connecting deal won't kick in until 2025 2026 anyway, so it's not like they need to clear up cap space now to sign connect connect these on his current contract for one more year. So anything they do in terms of trades or whatever or other signings or anything like that. They're going to have that much bearing on what they do with connect me. It just may take some time to work out this deal with connect me because the two sides are still far enough apart, they're not ready to sign a deal and we're still ways away from camp so the urgency hasn't said it yet If you're asking if I think there's another shoe drop on this off season, Breyer more or less said yesterday that he's trying that he's he's trying to work out trades that, you know, he didn't say he's definitely going to do a trade but it's abundantly clear that he doesn't want or at least he doesn't want he's not at pencils down moment yet he's still working. And the one thing that did I'm working on an article about this about the flyers cap situation, the one thing that did catch my attention was if they've accepted that they're going to be tapping into long term edge reserve this year now that, you know, now that accident has been bought out they know Mitch coughs here he signed to the ELC like, have you accepted that LTI are is going to be a thing because if you look at their cap situation right now the two guys left that they have to sign our Bobby break and gig or some of those are your two. If you give them, if you don't try to lowball them like crazy. You're going to go over the cap ceiling, like counting the Ryan Johansson and the Ryan Ellis contracts info like you're going to go over unless you just basically, you know, try to basically screw those two guys over so you can stay under the cap, which maybe they'll try to do maybe that's an option but most likely once they sign there's two guys they're going to be over the cap. So you've got two options here your option number one is use lti are that's the easy one because you got two guys in Ellis and Johansson who can't play or Ellis can't play Johansson maybe won't play we don't really know which but any case they both probably can be put on lti are so in terms of functional cast phase you're still fine, you can open up the allowance if you need to. But if you don't want to use lti are and Breyer again reiterate it yesterday, he does not want to do it, then it becomes okay how do you how do you get yourself into a position where you don't have to use it. He basically said, Zmul and Fido to offer going to be Mitch coughs buddies next year, so they ain't dumping Zmul, like he's he's here, I cannot imagine they don't bring because he's a talented young player and that was part of the reason why they bought out cam acts it was to give Bobby bring a regular shot so that means then if you're if you don't want to tap an L T I are that means that you're trying to work on something to move out some space and that's where I wonder about resto. I don't know if they can do it. I am, I am not exactly optimistic that anyone will be willing to trade for this line and after the injury play gear he had that said, and this is this is fair point. It does seem like around the league. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. I think that's the best way to do it. 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All the CAF space you bank at the end of the year, that is essentially what you didn't spend off of the $88 million yearly cap. Now, why is that important? It's important for this reason, because if you have players that have bonuses and who, because when, like, for example, with my vech golf, his cap hit, his cap hold during the season is going to be $950,000. That is his cap hit. That's how you stay under the cap. But with the bonuses, by the end of the year, the flyers are very likely going to have to pay out like at least a million and a half more to him in bonuses and have that fit under the cap too. Now, if every day, they banked $6,000 a day. By the end of the year, they will have enough once we find out what bonuses mitch golf gets to pay off those bonuses and stay cap compliant for that season. If they don't, which they won't, if they are on LTIR, because LTIR, as I said, again, it's an allowance. It's not like it's actual cap space. It just allowed to go over the cap. So you don't bank shit when you're when you're using it. If at the end of the year, the flyers have $0 worth of bank cap space, and it turns out mop the mitch golf has $1.6 million worth of bonus money coming. Well, guess what? That $1.6 million worth of bonus money goes on to your cap for the next year. And the more you kick that can down the road, the more likely the flyers are going to have a lot of these bonus overages when they're actually trying to turn the corner and compete and want to spend money. So it's better off. And there are other reasons there are other benefits. It helps your flexibility of the trade deadline in terms of bank half space. It helps them potentially, you know, retain salary on deals, things like that. But the big one for me is the bonuses, because they don't want to get stuck into a death spiral where, you know, by the time we're two years down the road, and the flyers want to start delving into the free agent pool and start aggressively trying to improve. They have to account for the fact that they have $3.6 million worth of bonus overages on their cap before they can even start that because they didn't manage it well these last two seasons. That's why it's important. I think I saw today or yesterday I can't remember they asked about the potential of maybe one day trading that Ryan Ellis contract, the way they did with Chris Pronger and stuff like that. There are some teams rip Arizona Coyotes. They could happen, but it's a lot harder now the Arizona Coyotes are going to keep anymore. That's what Utah is one of the teams and San Jose we saw like they got a good player and Barkley Goodrow but they're trying to get to the cap floor is one of the main reasons they're like, yeah man put that dude on waivers doesn't matter if he doesn't want to be traded here. We just need to pay him because like we need to get to the cap floor. I wonder if they're going to be interested in doing something like that. If that's the case. Would you Charlie O'Connor be willing to part with some sort of asset a late round second day pick to have them do it or would you just be like screw it just have the bonus overages. It's a good question. It's an interesting question. I don't think I will be willing to part with a pick in the top three rounds. I would probably be willing to do it for like a fourth or a fifth, but I don't know if a team would be willing to do it for just that price like they're going to want more like we just saw it was a ridiculous trade but it happened. If you just saw Detroit pay a second round pick to get rid of Jake Wollman, who is a pretty solid defenseman on a not crazy contract. Yeah, I mean the and and Ottawa just traded a third round pick to get rid of Matthew Joseph who again, not a bad player and not on a terrible contract so if you're trying to get rid of, you know, six, what is it 6.25 for three more years on Ryan Ellis. Yeah, that's probably going to cost you. No, it's a it's a pretty it's not huge but it's a fucking sizable contract like, and it's several more seasons it's not like it's just one or two years. It's like three is it so like yeah, I was just curious what your thoughts on that situation works I saw it come up yesterday as we talk about trades and we had the conversation a bit yesterday about the. I don't know the perception that Danny hasn't been able to close some deals. I. It's rumors sometimes I'm like, all right, did you want him to though, like he can't close the deals except for the ones he has closed like I went to flyers history.com. They've made some traits. They made several just on Friday and Saturday. Yeah, I know we don't think of moving around in the draft is like a trade or whatever, but I want to know. Or do you think I loved Danny Breyer's first year in the job I thought he had to love. He did a lot of things he really had to do obviously that major thing is drafting that they michkov that gives you a lot of. That gives you a lot of leeway and then when you see Oliver bonk have that kind of draft plus one season you're like oh fucking a alright two good first round picks way to go. But just the moves to get essentially the two first plus for Ivan Prover all of after you move Sean Walker all that stuff move on from Kevin Hayes do all the things that he was able to do the D'Angelo buyout etc. Does now in year two. For this to be a successful off season. Do you think Danny has to make at least one kind of big move that improves the team if not in here and now for the future, because that is his job to make the team better. And can't say he's done that yet this off season. He's made some trades to, you know, get to get to next year's draft where they think it's a better draft but that's essentially like I traded my lottery ticket for what I think is a better, better lottery ticket. So, so my answer to see you on that bill is basically like look if we are talking purely about the moves that he has definitely made. I do not think this has been anything special off season he hasn't done anything really you know what has he done he had a draft that I'm not super pumped about even if I like we shanko as a prospect I'm not saying I'm not giving it an A like I did last year I was like that's a hell of a draft. It's like a chair whatever I hope you're I hope you're right kind of draft. You know he resigned Garn and Hathaway resigned Eric Johnson he hasn't made any huge moves, you know, no none of this is huge, the one big caveat though and this just comes down to how much credit you want to give him for this. And you know if you want to argue that that was not him that that was his camp, and that was you know the Scott St Petersburg will want to let him go and the flyers were just the beneficiaries of the situation. But, if you suspect that Danny had you know and I'm making a little joker had a little bit of his fingerprints on that, then potentially you might want to give him a stronger grade because there's no player that's more important to the future, then my finished off, and Danny got him over two years old. So that that's my answer to you. I agree with that line of thinking I want to get your answer to this question as well Kelly. It's just this. I just read it him for this year for that because he made a ball Z draft pick, whether you feel like he fell to seven that's luck, but he had to pull the trigger, and he had to be confident that like we were eventually going to get this guy, and then things. I guess we can say he had his hands in it whether he did or did it will never know probably. Maybe all goes back to this is just more of last year's move paying off. Like this is him having him having the guts to do what he did last year, and be like no he's the best player in this fucking drought outside of you know obviously the dark. Maybe this is the best player in this draft. He's at seven. This is the easiest draft pick I'm ever going to make, and then it all kind of works out, or even if you think he negotiated this thing if he, you know, through back channels or whatever made it happen. You do just chalk it up the next year because he was coming at some point like you were getting michkov, hopefully eventually. It's early and that's really no that for sure. And if you don't, it's a terrible failure of leadership then like I guess if we're going to say that then we do have to get him credit give him credit for bringing him over, but you would hope when you take a guy. With the understanding that he's going to play for the team at some point it's the seventh overall goddamn draft pick, and that's the other part of it is that at that time when they made that pick they knew that cutter go to a one it out. Maybe they weren't concrete on it they thought oh he's going to change his mind he's a dumb kid, but he had already asked out by that point when they made that pick last year. So you had to hit this like he was coming but either way I'm kind of chalking it up to last year's success, just kind of carrying over to now something happening this season, and maybe it's two seasons early whatever. I just, and again it's July 2, the league year started yesterday. So I'm not like killing him or I'm just saying Kelly is to for this to be a success does something more have to happen than what has happened already. Not necessarily because, again, like we are all operating under the assumption that Danny Breyer and Keith Jones have a long term goal for the flyers. If they don't do anything this season, and they win a cup three seasons from now, then was this off season to success I, yes, obviously whatever they did this off season it got him to a cup for years from now like there's nothing. None of this can really be judged I don't think on a micro level but also I think what's happening here is that fans are seeing people tweet out rumors parts of rumors speculation, all kinds of stuff and then they assume like oh this is a thing that's not going to happen. Like oh Shane Shane Pinto is on the block and he's going to get traded to the flyers and if he doesn't, it's because Danny Breyer fucked it up. And like that's not how it works. And so people are getting this idea in their head that like all of these potential apples are hanging out here, and all Danny has to do is grab them. And if he's not grabbing them it's because he's too short and he can't do it like that's not how it works. People need to just like, first of all, consider the source for everything that you read on the Internet. Eliot Friedman says something yeah it's probably true. Charlie O'Connor says something yeah it's probably true. Bob Johnson 69 420 who went to flyers practice one time and he's saying something maybe you don't listen to him. I'm like just like I just think that everyone has to stop anticipating things that they don't know are even going to happen and just let things play out like if he does something that's bad, then we can judge him on it. And so we find out at some point from a guy like Eliot Friedman, like, oh yeah Shane Pinto was going to go to Philly but they wanted Scott Lawton and Dan Dan Breyer said no like oh well that's a problem and we could talk about that. But right now, all of this is just speculation and it seems silly to me to damn him for things that we don't even know are true doesn't make any sense to me. And Kelly, I do agree that, and this is just the perils of being extremely online. Yes, you know the positive of being extremely online as a sports fan is that you get all of the information you have more info you know more things than the people who are you just do you get it right of your fingertips. You're you're all your fingers on the polls of everything that's going on with your favorite team. The positive of it is that you know everything in that you're you're literally getting information overload to the point where it becomes very difficult to distinguish between one is true and one is false because you're just getting all the things pumped into you constantly. And it does have the potential to convince someone who is extremely online and is paying attention to every rumor and every report and every everything that because you know everything that was rumored. If nothing happens, you're more disappointed than someone who isn't up to date on every single rumor they just like for someone who is not that online. If the fires do nothing the rest of the offices and okay they're just like okay we don't make any more big trades whatever. And the end of August rolls around. What is the casual flyers fan going to think I think most of those casual flyers are going to be like, you know what, flyers are almost a playoff team last year and they just added mafia Mitch. Whereas if you are whereas if you are very online following every single rumor and every single report and every single rumbling, you're going to be much more frustrated because you feel like something should have happened because you build it up in your head so many times that something was going to happen. So I think it's a completely reasonable point but that's not even me shitting on people that are very online. I think it just naturally happens when you do it. It's the one negative. And I like I said a lot of that yesterday like we'll just never know like all right. Shane Pinto let's use him as the example. If it comes out like all right. For Lawton and the Columbus pick they could have got it done. All right, that's a starting point that's new. Okay, we can talk about that and if Danny wasn't able to figure something out there. All right, but what if they're like, it's far beyond 12 and we're not moving. All right, well, then no, yeah, I don't like that much Shane, then he didn't do like that he didn't get something done that would have been objectively bad. There's also that I will say though like at a certain point and this may be counter to what I said yesterday because I think they kind of may have telegraphed for us by kicking the can to next year's draft. This is going to take a little longer and we think and guys like Garnett half the way and Scott Lawton that are still here. Yeah, we want them here because this rebuild, it's going to be about the length of their contracts, you know, they might be telegraphing that for us, but at a certain point. And this is just us being impatient. We want to see the players who are going to be here. We got one. Yeah, we got one. It's a mission. That's awesome. We think some of these get they gave Owen tip at the long term contract last year we assume he's won. Cam York, we all really I think started to enjoy by the end of the season last season. I know I was on York and by the end I was like, I like them a lot. Yeah, like we're starting to see it. At least we have a big roster of goalies. One of these guys hopefully works out. We'll see. It's all Voodoo. But like, I guess I just want the tangible like all right fucking Trevor Zegris it's him, you know, like what and that's just the example, but I just want to know who we're backing on being the dudes who are going to lead us into this next year's era. And many of them aren't here yet. And it might just be a little longer than we were hoping, I guess. And I can't call this off season a success because what did define it. We won't know, like Kelly said, we won't know for years down the line but as of like this moment. It's hard not to say, especially with the impending arrival of Mount V a mitchkov that the future is bright and this future is bright segment is brought to you by our friends at shady rays let's put on our rose color glasses and explain to the people why the future is bright for the Philadelphia flyers this is brought to you by shady rays head to shady rays dot com and use code PHL Y a checkout for 35% off polarized sunglasses. I told you I just came off the beach. I was wearing my shady rays right down here in Seattle today everybody's a big fan of them. I didn't lose them in the ocean very happy about that forgot to take them off one of the times I went in. But you know you can always use that lost your stolen protection. If you do take him in the ocean may be a lose him in a wave or something but the future does seem bright and I do think you guys just did a pretty decent job of explaining even if things don't happen at the pace we want them to. I'm a common patient. I want this team to be good yesterday. But the future I do believe remains bright and that segment was brought to you by our friends at shady rays use that PHL Y get 35% off. What else do we have to talk about today. Oh, just thinking about some things we've kind of talked about in the. In terms of the conference and the division that the flyers are in. There's a really good chance a lot of teams are better. I truly believe like, obviously like the devil's they we just expect to be better because injuries and goaltending they can't get that kind of luck again. And I think they had a good they've had a good off season. Yeah, they've had a legitimate good off season. They've added a few defenseman they lost some like true defensive help before last season and I think they kind of maybe fixed that this off season. Obviously they add marks from that's good. You got to be like Dougie Hamilton Jack Hughes these guys are going to be not missing half the season you should at least assume. But you look at Ottawa. It's like, yeah, they they have a good young roster that should be coming into its own. Plus, they just added a former resident winner, like a dude who's real good and lean is Omar. Like eventually Buffalo just needs to take another step you gotta believe it's going to happen eventually, even the capitals who did beat out the flyers in the last day of the season. Yeah, maybe they don't get the crazy goal tending run at the end of the year like they got, but they also shouldn't suck for the first half of the season they the way they did last year. They should be at least a little better. This conference and division after being not so great last year we were like okay who's a contender Florida. I guess we'll go through the Rangers in there and they turned out to be better than we expected. And then Carolina's always kind of in that perennial contender even though they never do it in the in the postseason. They seem to be like a hundred point team. I think they got better. They added a tremendous, you know, offensive defenseman. Two of them in Shane, in Shane God's despair, without having to like, you know, trade for, I guess, give them up for nothing they actually just went and signed them. Give up for them. Yeah, tremendous. But anyway, like this conference. I think it got a lot better in the last couple of days. Agree. Yes. The flyers are telling us they're not making playoffs like they, Danny's already said it like three times. Yeah. So like, I don't know. That's the, that's the other thing where I'm like, why is everyone so convinced like they're not rebuilding properly like they've said over and over again like yeah we're not trying to make them. And, and like no one believes them for some reason. I don't understand really, but yeah, the flyers haven't, I mean, they're better because they have Mitch cuff but they're worse in a few ways as well. And the goal tending is a giant question mark who the F knows what's going to happen there. And just about every team around us got demonstrably better yesterday. Yeah, it's, it's not going to be surprising to anybody I think if the flyers are making a lottery pick again next year. I think they will absolutely remain competitive. I am not expecting like I'm not going into the season thinking. Oh man, I'm going to be the Blackhawks. Yeah, they're not going to be terrible. No, like, like they got, they got worse defensively because you won't have Sean Walker for the first few thirds of the year. That's real. So they got worse defensively. They got a little bit better offensively. And the goal tending is an unknown. You know, they obviously had one half of the season of card or heart that's going to be replaced presumably by Ivan Fidoetov and hopefully Sam Harrison is a bit better in terms of full season numbers when he's not getting run into the game over the final two and a half months of the season. But we don't know. Maybe those two guys just stick there. It's an unknown. If I had to guess I think there's the flyers are probably around the same true town if, if a little bit worse than they were last year. I do agree though that they will have more competition. I think the other teams will probably be better. But by the same token, there's always teams under a cheat. Like we might look at it and say, you know, yeah, devils are going to get better and honestly I think they will. I would have been shocked if the devil's going to make the playoffs next year. But I would have been shocked if you told me this time last year that the devils weren't going to make the playoffs. Like, would it blow anybody away if like the Rangers just stink inexplicably for a year. Or like Toronto or Toronto falls off the cliff and it ends up being are they going to trade Marner the deadline. Like, like these weird things happen every year. So maybe the flyers. Yeah, they're giving they're giving it back to the devils because the devils got better and probably underachieving last year anyway. And the caps improves and maybe they stay ahead of the fires. But maybe one of those teams that we think are locks to make the playoffs steps back. And then the fires are right back in that bubble. That's more or less where I'm expecting them to be. I'm expecting them to be in that playoff bubble and end up, you know, with a pick somewhere in like the 10 to 14 range that that's my explanation. And that's probably the most realistic. I'm just looking at this more like, I expect them to be competitive on a game to game basis. But it wouldn't shock me if they lose, like every one goal game, you know, like that You know, because those are a lot of coin flips there and shit like that, you know, and if they're picking eighth because they just drop a little bit and a couple of teams are just a little bit better. Like that wouldn't I don't think that's out of the realm of possibility either like the flyers could be the team that underachieves. You take away that November to January goal tending they got. This wasn't, it's a totally different season. And we're taking away 65% of those starts at least without Carter Hart. Now Sam Harrison might be the goalie we saw in that time. And we're getting normal rest in between starts and it's not 18 to 21 or whatever it was. Fedotov might be good. We at least serviceable. We have no idea he also might be terrible. No way to know that. I just think it's really possible they're an entertaining team. And ultimately we look at the end of the year and go yeah they're in the bottom 10. Like I think that's well within the range of outcomes. The only reason that they were so close to the playoffs last year is because so many teams kept shitting the bed like all other teams had to do was play to their average and the flyers would have been out of the playoffs long before the end of the season. They just got lucky a bunch last year, and then they ended up shitting the bed, you know, right at the very end but the flyers were helped quite a lot by other teams in the Metro just for getting how to play hockey and that happening two seasons in a row seems unlikely to me. Yeah, I think one of the one of the underlying like it's a big story we've talked about it a lot. We will continue to talk about it a lot over the next two months, three months for really leading into the year because it is one of the biggest stories around the flyers. And if anything, I think we're under rating, just how important it was for the flyers from October through January, that for those four months. I think one of the reasons why they felt like they were not shulketuria that they got top six center, two way dominant shulketuria, because were there other reasons why they fell off in February March and April, yes they're absolutely were the reasons they traded away Sean Walker, the defense got injury but I do think a not insignificant part of it was in the first three and a half months of the year, they had good shulketuria in the final two and a half months of the year, they did it, and then they started playing like crap because having that stud top line center and he's not a superstar but when he's driving play the way he was and playing both ends of the ice the way he is and making his line mates better, that's huge, and they lost that from the end of January through the end of the year, and there's no guarantee that the guy from the first half of the year is coming back and I think that the way he was, I certainly am not ruling out the possibility, but if the new normal for katuri is what he was from February on, like yeah this team could drop off significant if he comes back and he's mostly what he was in the first half, this team I think is going to very well, no that's listen you named all those things the goal tending fell off after January, the defense the injuries trading Sean Walker Sean Walker all that stuff it all kind of happened at the same time, but when katuri is fall off the cliff, and it very much aligns with the team itself, like we talk about this team, and how they have no centers, and it's like, well, he's the one, and if they have none he's locked, like, and that's kind of what we saw happen, and I do not mean to disparage the good God name, good God damn name a Morgan Frost, he's a fine player, I like Morgan Frost, hope he takes another step if he gets to play with say Forster and those guys lead this team to the playoffs because it's the perfect combination of skill and size and shooting and play making etc awesome. I think it a lot hinges on Sean couturier and that is just, there's just no way to know, there's just absolutely no way to know until we see it happen, and even when we see it happen it's like, I, what's he going to be in February again, because we were rejoicing in the streets Okay Sean can play awesome, ah shit, the coach just scratched the captain, you know, these things happened all within one season, so there's really no way to know. Before we get to the super chats, I want to tell you about our friends at Coors Light, and between work social media and the choices life throws our way it's no wonder we're more worked up than ever, and Coors Light celebrates rising above and choosing a chill mindset. 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And yesterday we came up with this idea we love the Super Chats we love the participation from our live audience it's awesome, but a lot of times. When we jump into the Super Chats they can slow us up and then suddenly I'm lost, I don't know where we are in the outline, the show gets derailed through no fault of yours. So we have made the decision, we're going to knock out all the Super Chats at the end of the show that's how we're going to try to do it from here on out. So Brenna, if you would be so kind let's start seeing some of these Super Chats. All right, from the first one big juicy germ that's a good one afternoon everyone Anaheim having cutter along with the New Jersey's looking oddly close to hours equals new rival, because I got that fire in me for it. I gotta say I think it's January 11th they come here. We go to Anaheim during the Disney on ice trip. I'm very much looking forward to these games. Yeah we have a we have the Anaheim game in Anaheim it's December 28. It's a Saturday, Saturday afternoon game, but it's in Anaheim and then they come to Philly on the 11th of January. Yeah that game is good that game is going to be a well attended one I would guess. I'm from California and boo a teenager. I'm all for it. So one thing I will say though like like okay like all's fair here like you know if you if you want to boo the kid and you want to bring size and express your dissatisfaction that's all good. Like can we can we please just not have like a JD true thing again like I'd rather that not like the next decade. Nobody has batteries, nobody has batteries who has money for batteries in this. I'm just I'm just saying the the the booing the size the chance that's that's all fair all's fair is fine. Right. But let's keep it full. Yeah. Let's not let's not have death threats we talked about this during the Kevin Hayes got cutter all that whole situation. Let's not threaten death. Let's just like yell mean things at him. Yeah just tell him that he sucks when he misses the net or something like that's not as far as it needs to go. Yeah. Yeah. While we're on the schedule before the next super chat. Starting the season with four straight 10 o'clock games last year. Why the fuck do they do this to us. I hate it. Anyway. I can't watch those games. The next super chat, please, Brenna. All right, from a Catholic nano wild eyed bill is the best bill. I thought I was a lot more. I was a lot. When is bill not. When is bill not. I think it's level. When I look at myself like with this camera angle when we do the remotes a lot, I think I look stone so I like try to make my eyes normal. And then I look at like I was looking at myself. I was looking at myself in the mirror the other day. I was like, this is what an insane person looks like. Yeah, then you just look like you're jacked up on like three red balls before the show usually. I was I'm like we're in the we're staying at the sure house this week and I'm like taking the dog out at like midnight and there's kids like riding their bikes and I'm going to parties and stuff whatever it is they're doing. And I just like turned a corner and some people didn't see me coming to like drunk 19 year olds almost fell off their bikes. Like me, Harold wild mustache just like yelling at the dog to hurry up. I'm like, holy shit. So yeah, I get it. I'm I look like an insane person. All right, Brenna number three from Gary B always love hearing from Gary. Ah, love the Manscaped live read. I am an adult child. We all are none of us working. I mean works to grow up. I'll tell you that. Exactly. I'm still waiting to feel like a grown up. I hear a couple other shows that really go all out with these manscaped ones. I think I got to sit down and work on the copy for myself because it's not as funny as it could be. I'll tell you. All right. Everybody fine. All right, from linden 49. Never thought Mave Mitch Cobb would be in the NHL. Before. I'm assuming that means Ryan Leonard who was taken with the pick after Mitch. Oh, Ryan. I think people were tweeting about him today because he's at capitals development camp. I'm a big Ryan Leonard fan. And if Mave Mitch got was not there at seven, I would have advocated for the flyers to take Ryan Leonard. I think he's going to be a stud. I do not think he has the superstar level potential though that Mave Mitch. So linden 49. I didn't think that was going to be the case. Either I assume letter would make the jump maybe after one year, definitely after two and you're waiting on Mitch. Cough for three instead. Flyers have Mitch cough after just one single year prequel sound. Not too shabby. And let's get to this next one. From Gary B again, Charlie, in your opinion, doesn't matter what month to make the road trip to Toronto. I'm planning on making a trip this season, March or January. I'm leaning towards March since my day is two days later. I'm guessing. Okay. Actually, this may be a better question for the hinkle because interestingly enough, and this is one of the things that does still very much annoy me. Hopefully I can rectify this problem this season. I have never been to Toronto. It's one of the few cities that I've never been to because generally speaking, a lot of times when the flyers play in Toronto, it's usually a one off and I don't usually go on the one off trips. I usually go on the longer trips and the couple times that I plan to go to Toronto, it's gotten post vote. Like I've had to like bail on the trip for whatever reason I think one was COVID related. Another one was because I was planning to go to, I was planning to go on a prospect trip last year where I was going to go up to Boston interview cutter and then I was going to go to London and interview bonk, barky and bonk. And instead I had to cancel the trip because a week or a week before that they traded cutter. So it seems like every time I'm trying to get to Toronto, it doesn't happen. So I really don't know, my guess would be March because it'll probably be less cold. What's the suggestion on your part because you've been there multiple times. Yeah, so I like going to Canada in the winter because there are no tourists and that rules. I mean, but you have to be cool with it being quite cold. So, you know, there's that. But I mean, if your birthday is in March, go in March, the weather will be nicer. It's your birthday. You can stay outside a little bit more. It'll probably still be colder than here. Not too bad. I got to believe March is still winter in Toronto, having no idea about weather or geography. All right, and we have one. We say it was definitely still winter in Montreal when I was up there in March this year or this year, I guess. Yes, we have one more super chat just snuck in under the wild under the wire from a big juicy germ. Forgot my message, flier sign Anthony Richard. Yeah, I saw Tony Dick. He's just an he's an a shell guy. He's an a shell guy. I mean, maybe he gets a call up and at some point, if everybody gets hurt, but he's he's an HL guys on a two way contract. Good HL score, but I really do not see him as being in the mix for an HL job. Big, juicy jerk. All right. Yep, signings fam. Got it. That's right. Before we wrap it up for today, I got a couple of things to tell you about. First of all, the Mitch Cobb mania shirt, you got to go to phlylocker.com or right now. And I want to sell a bunch of these for a lot of reasons now. Not just because I went out sell Charlie's mad Russian design. But if you're on the old Twitter.com, I just want to piss some people off. So make sure you go to phlylocker.com get your Mitch Cobb mania shirt. And on Saturday, July 13th, it's the inaugural phly liberty open. That's right. Valley broke country club in blackwood. We are having a huge golf tournament starts at 2 p.m. It's brought to you by our friends at shady raise and true mark financial credit, credit union. It's going to be a great time in part with the big drive energy show that we have here at all city. I just can't say enough about the time we're going to have Charlie is going to be there for two hours. After you're around, you get the free beer. You're going to play right Chuck? I am going to try. Have you ever got before? Oh, I mean, I'm going to play. I'm just going to attempt to golf. Okay. Yeah, I've got before, but I have not got all that off to so I'll be pretty bad. So if you want to heckle Charlie on the golf course, just come on out July 13th. Make sure you go to all phly.com and sign up just to click the events calendar. It'll be right there for you July 13th in blackwood at the valley broke country club. Come on out. It's going to be a really good time. All right. And that is all the time we have for you on phly flyers today. Thank you all for listening. Thank you for hanging out. If you haven't already, you've got to hit that subscribe button. Follow us right here on YouTube never miss a live show. Set those reminders will be back tomorrow at 4 p.m. once again, with more news and notes from development camp and free agency talk, all the off season stuff you've come to know and love. Followed on Twitter at PHLY underscore flyers and follow the podcast. Wherever you get those, just search PHLY flyers. All right. That's it. My name is Bill Matts. That's Charlie O'Connor. That's Kelly Hinkle until tomorrow, fam. Stay loose and sexy, Philly. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)
