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21st Century Wire's Podcast

INTERVIEW: Basil Valentine & Yousef Alhelou – No Ceasefire Insight For Israel

Duration:
37m
Broadcast on:
31 Jul 2024
Audio Format:
aac

TNT Radio guest host Basil Valentine speaks with Palestinian journalist Yousef Alhelou, to discuss Netanyahu’s attitude towards a long-awaited ceasefire and question his motives for delaying its process. Yousef discusses Israel’s inability to plan for the days after their genocidal war whilst emphasising the ongoing dehumanization of Palestinians and the fact that Israel is still an occupying power that has illegally kept the Gaza Strip under siege. The discussion turns to the EU which has failed to stop the Palestinian genocide or secure a ceasefire and has done very little to stop Israel’s illegal occupation of the Occupied Palestinian Territories. 

More from Yousef: X/Twitter

 ATTENTION: The Patrick Henningsen Show MON-FRI will be on summer hiatus for the next few weeks. Appreciate all of you who have been tuning in. We’ll see you all in due course.

Climate change policies will only widen the gap between the rich and the poor on air 24/7. We are today's news talk TNT. And welcome back to the Patrick Henderson show with me Basil Valentine. Sitting in for Patrick today Tuesday the 30th of July. I'm delighted to say I'm joined from London on the line now by Yusef Allelu. Welcome to the programme Yusef. Thank you very much for having me. It's always a pleasure. Yusef is a Palestinian freelance journalist and filmmaker formerly based in Gaza. Yusef, we've all been hearing about the potential for a ceasefire for months and yet the killing continues. A massive issue to statements saying that Israel keep inserting fresh clauses fresh conditions into any ceasefire deal just when it appears to be close which would give us the impression that Netanyahu and his negotiators are not acting in good faith and simply want the killing to continue as he indicated in that absolutely dreadful spectacle in Congress last week. Yes, well, that now is a fact he doesn't act as a diplomat. He is in favour of prolonging this genocidal war because he wanted to crash the steadfastness and resilience of the Palestinian people as a whole not only the resistance in Gaza. The 7th of October was a pretext to carry out this ethnic cleansing in order to change the demography of Gaza and obviously Israel, the West, we consider Palestinian blood cheap. We are numbers in their eyes. Unfortunately, the West is allowing this community to happen. Israel has never been yet accountable and it seems that Netanyahu doesn't want to leave the political scene without achieving an delusional victory. He claims that his genocidal work Gaza ends to bring back the hostages but he doesn't care about the hostages. He keeps adding more conditions to the deal mediated by Qatar or by other factors in the region and even the United States, basically Netanyahu is interested in reaching his deal. What I would like to say is that Israel is bragging by saying that all Palestinians in Gaza don't deserve to have a normal life because they elect Hamas and because they celebrate what happened in the 7th of October and they keep justifying their accretion of Gaza by saying that Hamas is using people as hostages. I think he is embarrassed. He is in a very bad situation because for the past 10 months the resistance, which is a legitimate right under international law, it seems that he is embarrassed because he did not achieve any of hisistic goals and it seems to me that he will continue these units under the world of Gaza in order to stay in power. Israel is causing death and destruction in Gaza only for fun. Just as we speak right now, Israel is struck by root, the liberty is capital and it shows that Israel doesn't care about the repercussions and the reactions of the resistance, Hezbollah resistance in Lebanon because I think he's been given the green light, he's given the weapons because during his speech in the Congress he said give us the tools and we will finish the job quickly. Unfortunately the world is watching the Palestinians of Gaza being slaughtered for the past 10 months and they do not change anything. Gaza has been under scrutiny for the past 18 years. Israel wanted this opportunity in order to test its new weapons in Gaza. In short, if you ask me how I feel about that, of course I'm outraged as a Palestinian, my family in Gaza. They survived 300 days miraculously this genocide of war while they are being starved to death. There is international conspiracy of silence and the liberalism and policy and the hypocrisy encourages Israel to continue this war and Netanyahu. He will be remembered as the most evil fascist in our modern time. He certainly will be by me. John Mearsheimer said he thinks Israel is actually losing this war for all that tens of thousands of people have been murdered and mutilated to launch it. It's a very eminent publication in Britain, the medical publication. As estimated, it could be more like 186,000. That was the number they came up with a couple of weeks ago that are dead because we don't know how many people are under the rubble. We don't know how many people are injured, the accounting system obviously has broken down. But in spite of those casualty figures, Netanyahu may regard killing that number of people as some kind of success in his own ghoulish mind. Israel has not achieved its objectives. Hamas is still extant. It's still able to fight, of course, problems for the Israelis. We don't know how many Israelis have been killed, but there's certainly a war we're in this setting in. He said that Israeli generals themselves want a ceasefire. It's the politicians that don't. First of all, if there is a ceasefire, do you think it'll be permanent and, you know, as in your own vow to continue until Hamas had been completely eliminated. But without any idea of what that looks like, does it mean killing everybody who's ever had anything to do with anybody in Hamas and their sister and their children? That's what it seems like, you know. Well, when the R asked that Israel is killing civilians, you see, well, this is the cost of war. Palestinians are collateral damage. And when we talk about the proportionality, what's the number? I think Israel wants to kill a thousand Palestinians for each Israeli who was killed during the 6th of October. Actually, so many people say, I mean, tend to the fact that it was an inside job, meaning that Israel knew about, but it did it happen in order to justify its attack on Gaza. Why didn't protect itself or defend itself when it knew about that attack? And it delayed its engagement with the Palestinian resistance groups for several hours. I don't think Israel will allow Hamas to stay in power. That's why they are delaying and postponing the deal, because they are looking for an alternative party that is willing to rule Gaza. International forces, I don't think so. Maybe the Palestinian Authority forces, we still don't know. The in-game here, what's next, what will happen when Israel ends its, you know, side of war. I mean, Gaza is still under Israeli control, under Israeli siege. Anything goes into Gaza, or leaves Gaza, has to be approved by the Israeli authorities, because they still brag and say that, well, we went through our forces back in September 2005. But as a matter of fact, Israel is still occupying power, still imposes its naval blockade on Gaza's 45 kilometers, still controls the aerospace of Gaza, still controls the resources of Gaza. Gaza is still practically under colonization. So any deal, I think, it will be fragile. I don't think it will last for long. As long as there is no permanent solution to the problems in Gaza, the siege, the occupation, then we will continue to see the cycle of violence keeps happening again and again, because remember, it wasn't about the 7th of October. Palestinians have been suffering ever since 1948 for the past 76 years, and Israel wants the world to believe that it's the Palestinians who are the gristers and the victimizers, whereas Palestinians are the victims. This is the root cause of the issue. Palestinians are demanding for their freedom. They are not demanding to go back to before the 7th of October. After all these sacrifices, I don't think the Palestinians are, I mean, they're resisting that. They will just accept any conditions. There must be permanent lifting of the siege and opening to all border oppressings, and to allow Gaza to go back into criminality. And also, I mean, any steps has to be taken should contribute towards a lasting settlement to this conflict and into the Israeli occupation, not only in Gaza, the West Bank, and Jerusalem as well. Well, that would, of course, be in accordance with international law, something reaffirmed by the ICJ. Only last week, we're going to take a very short break now for the headlines when we come back. I'm going to be asking Yusep about the hard choice facing the United States. Are we going to live in the in a jungle? Or are we going to live under international law? We'll be right back. Globalist agendas, democratic rights at risk, corruption, propaganda. It never stops. For the news and views silenced by the mainstream media, by government and corporations, vote one, TNT radio. Free speech always has a home here. Stay up to date with the latest live news and current affairs delivered by our lineup of expert commentators and hosts. Listen to TNT radio anywhere you go. Ask Alexa or Google to play TNT radio or download the TNT radio app for free from the App Store or Google Play. Today's news talk, this is TNT radio. And welcome back to the Patrick Hennington Show with me, Basil Valentine, sitting in for Patrick today, Tuesday the 30th of July. I'm delighted to say I'm joined on the line by Yusep Allello. Yusep, before we talk about international law and the double standards applied particularly by the West, first of all, you have family and friends in Gaza. We only see it on social media, corporate media, of course, largely blacking out the scale of the horror. It's been described as absolute hell on earth, children dying of heart attacks because they're terrified of the sound of the drones and the rockets. Can you give us a few examples from family and friends of some of the horrors? It's important because I do believe viewers and listeners around the world need to know just how bad the situation is. The Palestinians of Gaza, they say that they are knee down. They feel that they are frustrated and angry that the whole world is watching them being massacred day at night for the past almost 300 days. It's going to be almost a year. Can you imagine, like, for a whole year, Palestinians? I remember reporting on it in the early weeks where the number of debt was 3,000, 4,000 when people were being driven from the north out of Gaza City. You've got to get out of Gaza City. This was a stronghold. Move south. The south will be safe, so-called safe zones. Then they cut the territory in half. Who can forget that first bomb? Is that a little hospital? They know that they want to build a capital. That's why, and also it's because of the hypocrisy and complicity of some of the Arab governments in the region. Unfortunately, Gaza borders shut down from the Egyptian side. It's like normal life. Of course, the Arab world. I mean, the best they can do is just point cut. I mean, it looks like that I say, "Look, the Arabs didn't care about Palestinians. What are the Muslims?" As I said, non-Jewish, non-Muslim, blood is cheap. I mean, what my family tells me, what people tells me, is that they say that they will never forget the world, the Muslims, the Arabs in the region. That they are being butchered, massacred, starved to death, turned to pieces as well as aiding Palestinian babies and children as a result of the loud explosions and blasts. I mean, the destruction of schools, universities, mosques, churches, civil life, is this really an excuse for self-defense? What this has to do with soul-defense? I mean, when the starvation started, it was good news that it started during aid. But this aid, Arab aid, has become a humiliation because many people drowned in the sea trying to grab the food parcels or many of those barre shoots fell on tents. And the scenes of neck barre, the displacement and the refugees and the panic and the shootings and the snipers, I can't imagine. I mean, it's really for fun. I mean, soldiers in their 20s, they just, you know, kill at well, just for fun snipers, you can see. Indeed, that came out of the number of two children. That came out in 972 magazine, you know, eyewitness reports and confessions, indeed, from Israeli soldiers saying they just go out shooting people when they get bored that any man is a potential target. And then, of course, there were the American doctors that came back the other day and said that they're shooting children in their head twice at the very least. And arguably the worst of all, the drones playing the sound of babies and children crying so that people venture out onto the streets to see if they can find the distraught infants, only to find that it's simply a recording being played by the Israelis and they are then shot. I mean, this is, you know what, the film is, you know, it's horrendous, it's horrific, it's scary, it's worrying that people that have, you know, some people that have a shower for months did not have a proper sleep for so long, the psychological impact, the stress, can people, you know, people, these people, intense, they live mixed to sewage. There's so much disease around them. I mean, the garbage goes the street. It's like people are dying slowly in Gaza. And, you know, you are doing good journalism. I'd like to salute you for this, for bringing the real issues here, because once I was interviewed by one of the UK shows, talk, British show by Dunbar, and we kept asking you, you could do Hamas, what do you think of the rest of the book, as if my answer is going to bring back life, the 40,000 Palestinian scale, as if my answer, if I yes or no, is going to bring back, to bring Gaza back to the melody. The real issues here is that Israel enjoys this community. It keeps humiliating Palestinians. It doesn't see Palestinians as humans. I mean, when they describe us as human animals, I describe it as, you know, children as children of darkness, then what do you expect? I mean, the mental, the evil mentality, the sectors in the span of the torch Palestinian oral groves, the groves, when the attack shippers, when they just keep my Palestinian houses, they are giving these arms by fear, being fear, who is arming the settlers. So, the suffering of Palestinians does not only happen in Gaza, but also, of course, the West American, its Jerusalem, and Israel's intention is to drive Palestinians out of the land, because it was a few Jewish states. It unders Israel to see Palestinians are groving by numbers, because before this January started war, they used to say Gaza is a ticking bomb. Gaza is the most, the most destabilated area on the planet. So, it caused some threat to Israel. So, they are making life visible by destroying the civil infrastructure. In case there is a chance for people to Gaza to flee by the sea, by Egypt, then, yes, it's going to happen. Thousands of people will flee Gaza, but some people will not, you know, heed the call and leave Gaza, because they say, you know, we would rather die Gaza. So, Israel is going to fail, means it's not going to achieve any political game, again, any military game, again, because at the end of the day, when you have the orders of the land, the indigenous Palestinians, they say, this is our land. We are not doing it in a way. We are not going to finish. No, absolutely. One thing I would say is that I don't think the Israelis expected the backlash in public opinion, not just in the global South, but in the West. Hence, the mendacious attempts to label people calling for an end to genocide as terrorist supporters. I mean, this is a really sinister stuff when you simply want to see the even-handed application of universal human rights and the implementation of international law, is something that's completely alien to the Israelis, who, as you say, have acted with total impunity. Now, there's a piece in Al Jazeera just published this week, which talks about the, you know, the crunch that's coming really, so it's as simple as that, because sooner or later, there will be a ceasefire. The mantra from the United States is still two-state solution, two-state solution. That's still the official view of the European Union, the United Kingdom. All the major players, really. And yet, on the other hand, we know that the Israeli position now is that there will never be a Palestinian state. We've got irresistible force of meeting a movable object. And on top of it, of course, the fact just, you know, as if we didn't know that the occupation is illegal and therefore must come to an end. And that, you know, is the West actually going to wake up to the fact that it has to apply law evenly, or are we going to live permanently with a two-tier system of international justice? That would be hell on earth. Yeah, as long as there's no pressure in Israel, it will never relinquish its occupation, it will never end its occupation. And it can now sit many times that he will not allow the establishment of a Palestinian sovereign state, not even a viable state. I mean, the first distribution was born in the long time ago. The Israeli ambassador to the UK, she said that, but I have a problem here. If the EU, they are not able to pressure Israel to end this during the war, that kills innocent civilians, are they really going to be able to pressure Israel to end its foreign occupation? Oh, that's a very good point. Arms embargo. They have to put serious pressure. Operatized South Africa, I mean, did not, you know, he accept the pressure. I mean, without the pressure, Israel will continue its communist policies. And as long as the US sponsors Israel supports Israel financially, literally, economically, automatically, Israel will keep going. So the U.S. Security Council has used this. The United Nations, Palestinians say it's not helping Israel. I mean, the Israeli ambassador the other day, when he tore the charter of the United Nations, I mean, that wasn't an insult. When they insult the parish, because he dared and said the 7th of October did not happen in a vacuum, the Israelis didn't plan to see anybody show solidarity and sympathy with the Palestinians. They described it as anti-Semitic. I mean, they played this card straight away. Even some politicians in the West, like in the UK, for example, that lady, when she described the hotel, but they seen marches and landed as hit marches. I mean, they just want to discourage people from showing solidarity, because they know that they are losing their awakening in the West. So wake up cold. Young people, when they organize these encampments, the pressure is worldwide. It's worrying. I mean, these sacrifices that the Palestinians are doing, I mean, we didn't choose this. You know, sorry, where it was imposed on the Palestinians. I mean, Israel is collectively, I have a serious approval as well. Israel is collectively punishing an entire population, because of the acts of Hamas with the resistance. Why on earth would Israel, you know, destroy several lives, destruction of houses, first it is mosque as a safe hospitals, water wells, electricity, grades, everything is being destroyed in Gaza. Is this personal defense? I mean, when you collectively punish an entire population and orphan over 20,000 kids, you think these kids when we grow up, they will just forget what Israel did to them. I mean, Israel is shooting itself in the head, not in the foot. It's not going to end this war. It's already lost the online war. It is losing this practical war. And I think so many Jews, also these are not in our name. And so many Jewish people are worried. They say that Israel is actually damaging, they're only surprising, which is, I mean, peace has to be made. And in order to fit the next peace, decisions have to be made. Israel is arrogant, terrible state. And it has to be pressured from the occupation. Indeed, it does. We're going to take a short break now. When we come back, I'm going to ask you a step about the Israeli inquest into the alleged abuse of Palestinian detainees, which has bizarrely sparked fury on the far right, who of course, think that the abuse of Palestinian detainees is all well and good. We'll be right back after the short break. Patrick Henningsen, N-T-N-T. And this is Basil Valentine singing in for Patrick. I'm joined by Yusuf Al-Elhu. This is the last segment of the program. Fully two months ago, prisoners held at an Israeli detention camp in the Negev Desert were revealed to be subjected to widespread physical and mental abuses, with at least one reported case of a man having his limb amputated as a result of injuries sustained from constant handcuffing. Whistleblowers went on to describe how inmates have regularly shackled to hospital beds, blindfolded and forced to wear nappies. Since then, of course, Yusuf, we've heard about people being killed by having electrical rods rammed up their back sides, children being raped, just a complete list of horrors. And yet, it seems when the Israeli authorities, I mean, this is the Israeli authorities, committing these crimes, but when there is any sort of investigation, the far right of jacked, I mean, it's off the charts, isn't it? I mean, I want to know when we're going to see Western politicians condemning this sort of thing, because they all just look the other way, don't they, Yusuf? I think the Israelis allow to do whatever it wants. That's why Israel is laughing at the wall. I mean, it does genius crimes. You know, when they humiliated these prisoners of war in Gaza or the captives, I mean, thousands of Palestinian innocent civilians were taking captives from inside Gaza. You've seen these videos when they were stripped naked and, you know, marched in front of tanks and at the backup of trucks. You've seen also some of those who were released, how they were tortured as fury. According to an international human rights organization in Gaza, they documented 85 Palestinian civilians who were killed against really detention centers and prisons just recently during this violent war. You're talking about severe measures taken by the Israeli authorities, jail authorities, and being feared himself, he entered a cell, according to one of the released Palestinians, and he tortured that inmate. You're talking about at least now the number has increased from 7,000 Palestinian political prisoners. Children in Israeli jails are up to 15,000, including a 300-plus Palestinian children, minors, and women. These are hostages inside Israeli jails, and Israel keeps talking about its hostages in Gaza. What about those who are being held without charge or trial? They're being held, you know, without any accusation. And the treatment that they receive is horrendous. You know, some people go to prison in good shape, muscles, and stuff, and they just leave the prison or the detention center after a few months. You cannot recognize him. One of the mothers that she couldn't recognize her son. So this systematic treatment and torture aims to crush the spiritual and moral active forces of Palestinians. Israel is training on Palestinians, and when I say Israel transformed Gaza into a distant ground, we mean it. He tests the weapons, he tests the techniques, he tests their mistreatment, and many of those who are released recently. One of the witnesses, actually, he's an old man, and he talked about how young man he was sexually harassed by a soldier and by a piece of wood in his bottom. I mean, it's so shocking. I mean, I can't understand in the 21st century that human beings are subjecting other full of human beings to this severe cruel mistreatment. It's psychological, it's physical. And Israel wants to send a message to the Palestinian resistance that, no, this is going to be your fate. This particular incident was sparked when the office of the advocate general of the Israeli military ordered an inquiry following the suspected substantial abuse of a detainee at the SD-Taiman facility, which holds Palestinian detainees, including alleged members of Hamas's elite Nukbar forces. Israeli army radio said military police arrived at Siday Taiman as part of their investigation into 10 IDF reserves. Soldiers have been suspected of abusing the prisoner. The alleged abuse took place three weeks ago, and the detainee was found in a very serious condition requiring his evacuation to a nearby hospital where he underwent surgery. But nine soldiers were detained, accused of serious abuse of a detainee, according to army radio. But the operation triggered an angry confrontation between the military police and IDF soldiers, which was captured on video by a reporter. And these detentions themselves prompted an outcry from members of Israel's far right, including a coalition of extreme right members of parliament and their supporters, who attempted to storm the military police in protest. I mean, this is off the chart stuff that you only get, sort of either, you know, fascists or people to, you know, homicidal psychopaths these days in Israel. It seems what on earth happened to the so-called liberal Zionism? Why on earth now do they behave in this small way? Yeah, I think the Israeli society is collapsing, is being torn apart. I mean, my name is really is the one, the fabric of the Israeli society is collapsing, because when you have these, you know, soldiers, or even parliamentarians or politicians, it's a storm accord, because it wants to try some of those reservists for relating the law subjecting some Palestinian inmates to torture. This shows that this required Palestinian lives. I mean, they didn't want to be held accountable for Palestinians. I mean, so many cases were documented. I mean, five, six divacity wars in Gaza, in the West Bank, and, you know, endless and endless cycle of violence, and those who commit their crimes, they are released without trial of charge. And some, I think, one of Israel's officials, he actually said that he wants to, he wants Netanyahu to put pressure on being feared in order not to intervene in politics, because he is spitting poison, you know, being feared. And what is those two fanatics, the most extreme politicians in Israel's history, in addition to Netanyahu? When you have this extreme government, what do you expect? They are indoctrinating the Israeli society. They are brainwashing the Israeli society. When this is really the emulsion, the switch of Jerusalem, and they say they have to Arab, these two Muslims, and they insult Islam, and they burn the Islamic flag. What do you expect? When you have violence, you have extremism in the Israeli society. Do you think peace is inevitable with these people? I mean, Palestinians are willing to accept any sort of normalization. I mean, it's such a peaceful sentiment. One state solution is the only option, I believe. There are so many Palestinians doing this option. Plus, a solution is not going to work. One, democratic secular state, for everyone, regardless of phrase, religion, ethnicity, color, to live side by side in coexistence. Israel is not going to accept this solution, because it wants to maintain its Jewishness, and it doesn't trust Palestinians. Yeah, indeed. I mean, as we do in this country, the idea that one group should be privileged over another in the United Kingdom is abhorrent, yet it's taken as red in Israel and nowhere else in the world these days. But Nathan Sachs is the head of the Center for Middle East Policy at the Brookings Institute in Washington, and he called the protests at the detention of the soldiers accused of this terrible abuse as a sign of a very, very troubled time. I am very worried about the tensions that this reflects in society, in Israeli society, he should have said. So on the one hand, we have that. And on the other hand, the European Union High Representative for Foreign Affairs, Joseph Burrell noted, "In a world of constant and increasing violations of international law, it is our moral duty to reaffirm our one wavering commitment to all ICJ decisions in a consistent manner, irrespective of the subject in question." Now, if you put those two things together, comment about the troubled state of Israeli society, and then the requirement of the European Union. Just fine words, of course, to implement international law irrespective of the subject in question. You've got a recipe for a collision, which is probably a year or two down the road. Joseph, or do you think the West will continue kowtowing to the Israelis? Have the tectonic plates shifted enough for us to see the imposition of a peace settlement? Or are we going to go back to the oppression of the apartheid? [INTERPOSING VOICES] Slow motion genocide, rather than a fast term, which is going on now. I think many politicians in the Western world, many Western governments, they are covered, to say it's talked to you. Yes, that's it, they're cowards. You're absolutely-- They're cowards, and they are afraid from being blackmailed, threatened, being distract as anti-semitic. They want to enjoy their power and money and so on. They say it's, Palestine, Gaza is not my issue. Why should they care? Unfortunately, we have this double-centered policy. When comparing Gaza, Palestine, to Ukraine, you can tell the difference. Palestinians are not worried, not questions. Most of them is compared to Ukrainians, with your respect. The U.K. host received almost 300,000 Palestinian Ukrainians, and we Palestinians, Gaza, and British citizens, we have been pressuring the U.K. government to bring our families to safety on a timber basis, and our demand was rejected, despite the fact that we gathered almost over 120,000 votes signatures. So I think the Zionist project is declining, and I think Israel has shot itself many times in the head and in the foot. And I think so many Jews are frustrated. They see not in our names, and there is a reverse migration from Israel into Europe. But I think Europe is worried, and the U.S. is worried, from Israel's collapse, because when Jews leave Palestine, if you fight Palestine, this will cause instability in Europe. So this is going to be an issue. That's why the West is in favor of the existence of Israel, in the heart of the Middle East. It's a hub, it's a American hub. It's a hub for espionage campaigns to divide the Arab region and stuff. The Arab nations, they said that they are willing to normalize ties with Israel. The Saudis, their armies are really dead, the Marocans and so on. But Israel is arrogant. They are not interested to relinquish their occupation, because they say that they will promise this land by God. What kind of God that orders you to kill God's creation in order to have a land back that you claim you existed 3,000, 10,000 years ago? I mean, there is contradiction. When they say Nazareth is a secular movement, and then when they say they will promise this land by God. I mean, there's contradiction here, right? Oh, yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, Ilan Pape said both Zionists are atheists. They don't believe in God, but they do believe he promised them Palestine, you know, such as the level of sort of idiocy and arrogance that we're dealing with quite frankly. I mean, what if the Romans turned up in Britain and said we were here 2,000 years ago, we're entitled to this land. Yeah, it's about directing temples to Jupiter again, you know. It's just life is too short. One of the injuries I said, you know, life is too short. Like really people are thinking, researching how to reach Jupiter and Mars and Moon. And some people, they are selfish and they are arrogant, and they just want to start wars and sell weapons and medicine. And why? I mean, you should just end the occupation, live in peace with your neighbors. That's it. You'll be accepted, end of the story. But now we need to do that. Well, one would hope so. If we can finish on what Nicholas Somme said, he's not in the government anymore, but it's to be hoped that this is what the establishment in the West or the more enlightened branches of it least are thinking about. We can either cast aside selective blindness. He was referring, of course, to the blindness towards the occupation after this latest ICG day ruling last week. We can either cast aside selected blindness, recognize and act upon rule of law without fear or favor, however difficult it may be. Or we can continue in determined blindness. But if we do the latter, we must know that we are jettisoning an order that was hard won. We cannot be surprised when other world actors replace it. And we cannot be surprised at the consequences that follow. I would like to add something here. Please do. You know, Israel is a great state, it's called a state, and the UK must create its historical responsibilities. The end is going to start even though. Indeed, the UK has it does have a historic responsibility. Well said, you, Sir. You, Sir Valle, hello. Thank you so much for joining us today. We're out of time. I'll be back the same time tomorrow. Don't go away. More great content as always on TNT after the news. See you tomorrow.