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Sales Funnel Radio

SFR 154: Why I Chose The Info Product Business...

- What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larson, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

 

Today I'm going to talk to you about why I chose the info business over the others.

 

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9-5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

 

The real question is, how will I do it, without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer.

 

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels.

 

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

 

I wanna deep dive into some of the reasons that I sell info now. I started and walked through several other models and markets over the years, but I've planted in Info for a few specific reasons. Here's why...

 

What's up guys, hey, first off please know that I know there are far more types of business than just the ones I have on the board right here. But generically I find that a lot of them fit kind of in this category as far as the way that we market them.

The four categories that I’m using are: Ecomm/ Agency/ Affiliate/ Info

 

Service is kind of the same way as Agency. We might market Ecomm in similar way to retail.

 

Anyway, so I went through and I started looking through different ways.

 

I did this a while ago and I was very methodical about the way that I entered the business space and which market I actually went into.

 

I'm not saying that one is not better than the other, and I'm not saying that these are all of them...  please know that I’m going to talk in massive stereotypes.

 

There are lots of different businesses out there. The kind of people that are solopreneurs, I typically see them going into one of these categorizes - until they get to a certain level, then they'll scale and blow it up and get to other places as well.

 

I might put supplements under Ecomm. They’re very similar - the funnels are different -  but there are some similar aspects to them.

 

Services and Agency are kind of the same.

 

Affiliate/ Salesman/ MLMers/ are all very similar

 

Then there’s Info products…

 

Anyway, what I want to do is I just want to show you guys real quick why I chose what I do and first of all I want you to know that this is, I actually sell info products now, right? I did not start that way at all though.

 

Info products is kind of interesting the way that it plays out because to sell info products, it helps to have a little bit of authority in the space that you're selling it to. Obviously, it helps, it's true for anything. But especially with info.

 

I didn't start with info. If you want to you can tackle it right away. Awesome, go for it.

 

I actually was just trying to prove that this whole internet game worked. I remember the first time I was sitting in college in a class and for this particular class, it was Quantitative Marketing Research. That was the name of the course. And we went through and we had a live client, and it was actually Paul Mitchell.

 

It was a Paul Mitchell school that was nearby. And what they were having us do was we would go collect a whole bunch of survey data and we were going to try and consult Paul Mitchell on what they should do with this actual real life scenario in business. And it was really really interesting.

 

Well the assignment was for us to go talk to 10 people each as a class, then collectively we have a whole bunch of, we have a lot of data to work from. Well, sitting there with one of my buddies, we were like, "I do not want to go ask people, even ten, "I don't wanna ask ten people how to do the survey."

 

And so what we did, we were like "What if we go, "and let's just actually put the survey on a Google form "and we will drive ads to it." Something very simple, but we did Facebook ads and we drove to it.

 

And what was interesting is we actually went and we had we collected more surveys than the rest of the class combined. And it went really really well.

 

Well that's how I started working for Paul Mitchell. Because Paul Mitchell came back like, "Hey, we don't have to do any of this internet stuff, "professors, like college teachers, do you guys "know how to do this stuff?" And they were like, "No, but these two psychos over here "seem to be doing something crazy, talk to them."

 

And we got a handoff from the professors and we started building funnels, we didn't know they were funnels.We were building sites, in WordPress, we were driving traffic, and it was really really interesting how that happened.

 

Well, right before all of that happened, I was like "Does this internet game even work? "Is it all a scam?" And so what I did was I started studying a lot of, if you guys know, High Traffic Academy from Vick Strizheus, I'm sorry I'm probably butchering your name man, Vick.

 

Anyway, I started studying that and I started learning, "What if I was to just put a squeeze page in front "of a clickbank product and drive traffic to it? "Oh my gosh, let's try that." It seemed so simple.

 

And I looked at my internet marketing teacher, and I said, "I don't want to come back." It was like the first or second day of that class. And I said, "I don't want to come back." And I drew a funnel, I didn't know that's what I was drawing, but I drew a funnel. I drew a funnel, and I drew an email follow up sequence, and I drew, and I said, "I want to go build this." And shockingly he looked at me and he goes, "Okay." And he left, he said, "You don't need to come back "the rest of the semester, but just give me some "kind of cool deliverable at the end of the semester." So I was like, "Cool."

 

So me, and this other guy, we went and we started, we started, trying to make and literally we held class everyday just trying to make as much money online as possible. That's what our task was. Today, let's make as much money as we physically can on the internet.

 

And so one of the very first products we did, was what I was just saying. We went and grabbed the squeeze page, it was a template software, we didn't know what we were doing. And we grabbed the template and we just changed the headlines and we grabbed a video from YouTube of someone else talking about that product, and then we put our affiliate link at the bottom.

 

When they clicked submit, the page collected their email and it redirected over to the Clickbank page, and I remember that night we put, it was a ton of money at that time, we put $50 in in ads, and we woke up the next morning, and I was anxious... this was like the 100th business I had tried. You know what I mean.

 

I opened up my computer and I was like, "Crap, "there's cash in here, what?" And I called my buddy real fast and we put $50 in, we got $50 back out, and we got 17 people on our list.

 

And one person was the buyer and bought the up sale and we liquidated. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is crazy. "That sucks we only made 50 bucks."

 

And at the time, I didn't understand how cool a deal that was. On our very, that's the very very first real funnel that I ever built. And we liquidated because 17 people on the list, and I thought it was a failure because we didn't make any money. How stupid is that. I should have kept it going, would of got a massive list quickly with that. Anyway, lessons learned. And we kept doing stuff like that.

 

I started in the affiliate area, as far as the internet business goes, I started here. This is actually where I started. Like, I'm not joking, a few weeks later that's when we start doing these cool things and we start getting involved with Paul Mitchell. And I start building these, we start building these things, and at that time, my buddy graduated, and I was like, "There's something to, what's this funnel thing. "There's something about this funnel game. "What's with this funnel game thing?"

 

And I went and I decided that I would start studying the funnel game more. I was like, "Who is this Russell Brunson guy, he looks like he's 13." Alright, what? And I was like, "Who is this guy?"

 

And I started deep diving guys, I mean I obsessed, I still do, right hardcore on what he was teaching, I was like, "Yeah, that's totally how it works. "Yeah, he's right, it doesn't work that way. "Whoa, look at that." And I started learning all these lessons.

 

I took “Dot Com Secrets X”, and I filled an entire notebook, page by page, you know those Steno notebooks with the lines, the graph notebooks. I filled it from front to back from notes just from that one course.

 

I mean, it took me three months to go through that one course. because I played it for 15 seconds, and then I stopped and I thought about it and I wrote down what I had just learned. And then I would press play, and guys I did that for a year.

 

And when I say I hid in the box office seats in campus, I did. And that's what I was doing for a year and a half, was studying and learning, and I started applying and doing all those little things

 

And I got to a place here where I was like, "I'm gonna start proving that I know this stuff." And I started going out and I wrote down, I started building all these funnels, and I did it with a lot of startup companies for a while.



And the problem with startups was there business wasn't proven out and if the funnel didn't work they thought it was my fault, and I was like "No, you don't have like a product yet. "You don't have a business. "I have to train you on all this stuff before you even accept me."

 

Anyway, startups were really really hard to work with for many reasons. Then I was like, "Ah man, I should "change who I'm actually pitching." I was like, "Oh sweet, I'm gonna go for successful people "who already have a list, who already have a successful "product, who have testimonials, with a mid-range product."

 

And I shotgun blasted out this invite to tons of people and I said, "Hey, I know you don't know what a funnel is, I will build one for free "just to show you that it works. "If it works, let's talk about me getting paid. "If it doesn't work, no harm no foul, I'll walk."

 

And I had several people bite, like alright, bring it on. And I went and I kind of, I started building funnels for several different people. I kind of went Agency, it was service style. And this is really where I started making actual real money, on my own, in college, ever.

 

First was, I started doing a whole bunch of affiliate stuff. But number two though, I went over, I actually, oh you can barely see that , okay cool. Anyway, number two though I started doing a whole bunch of service stuff and just putting my name out there, being like, "Look, I understand how this works now. "Am I perfect? "No, I'm not. "But let me just learn under your business wing, right, "let me go build this funnel and I'll keep getting better "and if it's working then let's talk about me getting paid "Don't pay me before hand though." And that's what I did and started getting these huge success stories.

 

Well, around that time is when Funnel Hacking Live was coming up, and I was like, "I wanna go. I'm getting "successes for a lot of these guys yet, but still "didn't feel like enough cash to spend money "on a Funnel Hacking Life ticket." And I started trading even, building even more funnels for plane tickets, and hotel nights, and things like that.

 

And I was like, "Oh, what's up Russell. "Then I got hired by Russell, right?" And that's really where I started building a lot of Ecomm funnels. Right, some of the biggest projects we were doing together were like, Fiber Fix, and a lot of products for Marcus Lemonis, for that TV show, The Profit, on CNBC. It was a lot of Ecomm style funnels that was going on there.

 

And it went really really well, it was awesome. I mean, we were blowing these guys up, sometimes too fast and they'd be like, "Turn it off, you're going "to bankrupt us." And I was like, "Oh my gosh," that's the model for Ecomm does really really well.

 

Whenever Russell's like "Dude, we need an Ecomm funnel, kinda like this funnel this funnel, this backend versus that back." I was like, "Sweet, I got it," and I'd go build it real fast. So I got really good at that model.

 

However, I've always known that this is kind of one of the Holy Grails. Info products are, I wanna go through this real fast, and then I want to show you something and this is the only reason why, but info products, it's one of, it's one of the hard categories to get into, but it's also one of the Holy Grails.

 

If you look at what Dan Henry did, well, it's episode, it's one of the earlier episodes of Sales Funnel Radio, but I interviewed when he had only made 200 grand with his current offer, that he'd blow up with.

 

His Facebook ads for entrepreneurs He'd only done like barely $200,000 at that time. And he was talking about it and if you have listened to that episode, what he was saying, was for his info product, he spent a solid like five, six months taking a beta group through and seeing what they were doing and how they were reacting to what he was teaching.

 

Okay, I told you to build the Facebook ad this way, but turns out you all thought I meant this. Okay, let's clarify. Then okay, now do this step. Oh man, you're all screwed up here, let's do it right. And he was spot checking and he was making a system.

 

And he spent a lot of time proving out his info product before he ever sold it. I've done the exact same thing with mine.

 

Alex and Leila Hormozi, at Funnel Hacking Live, this last one, they were talking about for a full year, before they ever, they just got, they just made 10 million dollars since last April. But they didn't just start doing that.

 

For a full year before they ever started really scaling and selling hard, for a full year, they were living in crazy areas, doing crazy things, just so they could prove the process that they were going to bring people though.

 

That is really one of the gateways, it's one of the key gates of getting really good and awesome at Info. Your crap's gotta be amazing. It's gotta get results for people. And the best way to do it is to just spend a lot of time with your prospective customers. With people who represent your prospective customers. And make them successful, make them successful, and get, and when you do, it's in my mind, it's one of the Holy Grails.

 

I love selling info products, okay. I love it. And here's why, let's walk through this now real quick.

 

Here's a good reason why, just so you know, that's been kind of my journey I've gone through it, I kind of did a little more Ecomm stuff then I jumped over here to the Info side where I will reside as long as I can. I absolutely love it, and it's super cool. It takes a little finesse to get into a lot of times.

 

I'm not saying you can't go interview a bunch of people and toss out that interview series as an info product. You could totally do that. Now, I'm not saying you can't, there's a lot of ways to create an info product really quickly. But I'm saying, like you as a brand, you as an educator, you as an idea and a vehicle that has potential for two commas, like info wise, it's gotta be really good. It's gotta be really good, okay. So let's walk through this real quick here.

 

With Ecomm, let's say over here on this side, we're going to go through Ecomm and for each one of these we're going to look at the profit margin potential.

 

Again, massive stereotypes... I understand that there are people out there who have figured out how to game the system, but they are not typical.

 

I'm talking typical, stereotypical, kind of result in each one of these categories. How much profit, how much margin potential is there? How much money for you after all the expenses are done? How much earning potential is there for you, typically, in that category and how much time does it take to actually do the business, actually fulfill on the thing that you're selling? I'm gonna walkthrough really fast.

 

This is why I've chosen what I have and I've been methodical about it. I'm going to say that #1 equals a little, #2 equals kind of medium, and then #3 equals a lot.

 

Let's go with Ecomm. And I know that some of you guys want to reach out to me, and kind of fight me on these things. I understand. I'm talking just straight atypical general person that goes through this think, okay.

 

What is the earning, at the very end of the day, the profit potential of the Ecomm category? What is it? It's not, it's not actually that high.

 

A lot of people get in two comma clubs in Ecomm, but they don't actually keep that much money, they actually don't have that much cash to their name themselves.

 

I understand the coolness of the award, and you certainly can scream to it real fast by doing something like Ecomm really quickly. But there's not typically that much profit margin inside of Ecomm. Especially when people don't do my freaking offer creation strategy in this.

 

If they do, they can make a lot of cash. It's like, I don't know why, a lot of Ecomm people don't believe me. Like even though that's what we do, and it works. Anyway, but the actual earning potential, actual profit margin on the actual business itself, is a little bit tiny. I'm gonna say, we'll say a two here. A one to a two. It's kind of a little, especially if you're doing something like drop shipping, that's obviously a one.

 

If you own the product, you're going to get more of a 2. But let's talk about time to fulfill. Even if you got a shipping fulfillment house doing your work for you, or if it's in house, you're typically sourcing products like crazy. You're spending a lot of time finding the next product, testing the next thing. I'm not saying you gotta sell the Ecomm product for a couple bucks like a lot of Ecomm people do. You can sell really really expensive, but you're usually in a game of trying to figure out the next thing to go sell really really quickly.

 

Info, the way I write info, is a little bit different, ok? I'm gonna say a 2, because you can spend a butt load of time actually on the phone. Right, that's one of the things that Trey Lewellen was having a hard time with, with his, which you can't blame him, with his credit card knife. The dude's the man, absolutely amazing. Spent a lot of time though fulfilling, and it's easy to run into troubles that way.

 

Ecomm, I was like Ecomm's cool but like, ah man, I'm about that ROI. How can I get the highest leverage, ok? Which in Ecomm comes in later.

 

Remember this, ok? I'm going to come back to this and show you how I use this now. But you sell info. Wait, do I?

 

Agency's freaking awesome too, there's a lot of cash that usually comes in the business. The thing that I don't like about Agency is when you get paid, is when the work starts. I don't like that. It's where I proved that I knew what I was doing. It's services, services/Agency. It's where I, it's a really fast way as well. I love the path that I personally took. I learned how to sell other people's products, which is awesome, we'll get there in a second.

 

But then I went over to the service and Agency side and it was really cool because you get paid a lot of cash but you're also, even if you have an amazing team Agency wise, you're still managing the team, you're still closing deals typically. I'm not saying you're, anyway, there are exceptions to the rule, but usually, there's a lot of time to fulfill on Agency model.

 

After the sale is made, is usually, that's when it starts; I'm going to say a three and then a two here.

 

Let's talk here about affiliate. Now typically with affiliates, the profit margin, usually small, right? You got the crazies out there like Russell Brunson giving 40% every single month of his check to you for getting an affiliate person it. That's amazing, that's incredible. Usually not the case though. So I'm going to say a one. But what's interesting, but actually 1.5, let's say 1.5. Depending on the product, depending on the affiliate, there's a lot of variables with every one of these categories and I totally get that. But just generally, usually 1, 1.5.

 

How much time does it take for you to fulfill after the sales made. No time, no time at all. Oh my gosh, great place to go. And this is actually how I built my entire company and business without ever spending a dollar of my own. I've never spent a dollar of my own, I don't think so, in my own business. And it's because I started with affiliates.

 

That generated cash so I could do cool things like hire VAs in service/Agency and that brought in even more cash, and I was like, "Well this is awesome, but I want to free "up my time a little bit." Let's jump over to info, and that's what I went in to next.

 

Let's talk about info. What's the earning/profit margin potential on an info product? Guys, my margins right now on my main product is like 94%. Obviously there's a business margin, but I'm saying the actual product margin is like 94%, it's ridiculous. It's like no cost to fulfill on it at all. I think it's actually like 98.8. It's really, it's ridiculous. Three, definitely a three.

 

Time to fulfill, like virtually nothing. The cost of an email with access to a members area or something like that. Now, there's a caveat to this. If I go through and there's an info product, people know, there's this inherent understanding that the info product is already made. It's like the subconscious know, the little thing that they know that it's not going to take you anything to fulfill on that. Because of that, the perceived value, the perceived value, so it's a lot of value to me, but the perceived value of info, is usually kind of low. It is, right.

 

Let's take Ecomm for example, though. Ecomm something physical, something I'm gonna get in the mail. I got these stupid crows that are flying all over the place around the office and they just, they're messing with me, they'll like, so anyways, I've got a BB gun coming, you can guess what's happening, right, but the perceived value, perceived value of an Ecomm product is really high.

 

Perfect example, go think about Amazon. There's not sales copy on Amazon, there's like bullet point descriptions, this is what it is. Bam, here's the button, put it in your order and just go get it. The perceived value, perceived value, of Ecomm is high, but the value to the entrepreneur is typically a little lower. So what I do is I combine them.

 

In my offers with info, the reason why info does so well for me now, is yes, you get the info thing, but I also ship a lot of amazing, incredible things to the person when they purchase. I combine info with Ecomm and it's one of the reasons why my stuff does so well and one of the reasons why the perceived value of my offers is so high, cause the value is high.

 

They're getting something in the mail, they're getting, it's not just like something, they're crazy cool things, they're getting those and they're getting access to all this crazy stuff: funnel builds, incredible things. Things that people pay a lot of money for me to go do normally. They're getting those things in there and that's the reason why I chose and landed on info, and I will stay there, stay there, stay there.

 

The category that I want to move into eventually though is software. I think I don't know what it's going to be, but it's because it's almost like the benefits of Ecomm, high perceived value, software, right, software is high perceived value. With really high margins on the product itself, the business margin on software is a little bit hard, because you have a lot of support usually, that's a higher.

 

But the time to fulfill is like virtually nothing which means the entrepreneurs can spend, as long as they get great support, usually in software the entrepreneurs can spend little time doing any kind of fulfillment, instead they do a lot of time selling.

 

Russell stays in the act of selling like, 24/7. He can do that because of the software game, because he's in the info game, because he combines a lot of Ecomm inside of it. Does that make sense?

 

So he tosses off a lot of the benefits to his affiliates by giving them the ability, "Hey look, you don't have to fulfill anything, "I ain't going to pay you for it." Sweet. And he teaches a lot of people, look, if you need cash and a lot of it pretty quick, go service/Agency style.

 

You'll get a lot of cash quickly but eventually that's why I landed in what I do, and that's why I stay in info, and I will always stay info. I love it. The time to fulfill is tiny, which lets me stay in the zone, where I get to create more things for the same product. Toss in more cool things. Make the value of the offer even bigger. Create amazing things for people, and the profit margins are big enough that it allows me to do that.

 

I'm not having to sell thousands of little knick knacks. And take away a thousand dollars to go put that in something else from the source of knick knacks, that's really really rough in Ecomm.

 

But a thousand dollars, coming from the source of an info product? It's really really easy, it's not that crazy hard, at all. SO this is why I do what I do. This is the reason that I've structured it the way I have. So I hope that helps.

 

If you guys are thinking through how to actually sell the stuff that you are, and what you're trying to get into. I started as an affiliate and it's a great way to go.

 

And frankly, when I started Sales Funnel Radio, I kept this thing going by giving away share funnels. And now I've got a bunch of people on ClickFunnels accounts.

 

At the beginning when I was working at ClickFunnels, at a 9-5 job, I had this extra cash that was coming in, and because of that, while I was doing my 9-5, which was way more than that but while I was working over there, during the same day, there would be doing VAs in different places that were getting projects and cool things done for me. Not from my own pocket, because I was doing affiliate stuff like crazy. Really easy to fulfill, got some cash from it.

 

Still to this day, it's significant. I think we've passed, we're well passed thirty grand in affiliate commissions in the last like year-and-a-half, I mean that's good. It's been the cash that I've needed to do all the stuff on the side and prep the groundwork so I could launch into the info space.

 

So anyway, I just hope that that helps. It helps you guys work through and think through where you're heading.

 

If you're like "I'm trying to do info." Okay, does anyone know who you are? Have you proved out the process yet? Can you, if someone actually follows the process, can you virtually guarantee that people are going to be successful at it. If you can't, it can be to sell that at scale.

 

If someone follows my process, they get results, I know they do. I have the best product in the category I'm selling in in the entire market, and I know I do, and I'm fine with that, and I'm fine saying that because I know it's true.

 

Because that's what happens, when people do it, they get results. It's happening life, like right now. It took me like two years, honestly, to really get to a spot where my info product could do that for people, so if you're knowing that, if you're like, "I want to do info," Awesome. Or if you're like, "I want to stick in Ecomm." That's great, that's great. Just figure out the little tricks to make the margins huge and make that two into a three. That's super super cool.

 

Just be cognizant of what that industry is typically like and the cost associated with that. Like supplements, supplements takes a lot of cash to sell someone into the supplements.

 

Continuity, and software, take a lot of cash to sell. Continuity is expensive to sell. So don't sell continuity outright. Attach it to other things. Funnel Hacks, like Russel does. Isn't it amazing. When you do it that way, oh my gosh, so much easier.

 

Same thing with supplements over here, supplements cost a lot of cash to drop in, but if you have an info product that you're coupling it with, they buy the info product, that's what's self-liquidating, your ad cross and now in the backend go toss them to your supplements.

 

Awesome, or your Ecomm, or whatever. Does that make sense? This is one of the reasons I've structured the way I have - I'm very methodical about it. It's turned out really really well.

 

So I hope that it's helpful to you?

 

If you're stuck or you're like, "Oh gosh, I don't know "how this is going to work? I don't know if this is going "to be successful here or there?" Man, just go figure out how you can get cash now. And some of the easiest places to do it, Affiliate. Probably next, probably the Agency. I know a lot of Ecomm people will probably fight me on that and that's fine, that's totally fine. We all have our own opinions and that's perfect.

 

The model I'm following and I just wanted to walk you guys through why I do what I do. And what my logic has been behind each one of them is... profit margin potential out of the gate, not tricks, not little tips. Profit margin potential out of the gate - what is it?

 

I'll do the little tips and tricks and stuff like that, and I do and it goes even higher, but I don't want to bank on those. That's why I didn't run into Ecomm. I almost ran into Ecomm... I just about did Ecomm, but that's the reason I didn't right out the gate.

 

Again, not telling you not to, but that's the reason I didn't was ‘time to fulfill.’ I was like, "Man I just want to "do revenue generating activities, but what I'm constantly managing a product for someone else. I’d collected the cash already but I can't "actually do anything with it cause my hands "are tied, my time is tied because I can't actually "go do, I have to fulfill.

 

I don't know if I want to marry the Agency/service model. It was a great place for me to go for quite a while honestly, to vet out and prove who I was and what I was doing and that I could do it, which the market obviously needed to see, why would they not?

 

I got my testimonials from there, I got, that's what launched me in to being able to work next to Russell. In fact, that's one of the first things he asked when I sat down face to face with him.

 

Actually before I even got there, he's like, "Have you "been building funnels?" I said, "Yeah." He's like, "What are the URLs?" Boom, blasted over like 20 URLs over to him. Look at all these funnels I've done, look at all the stats here we go, boom, and when I sat down, he was like sick, okay, cool. He didn't say sick. He was like, "Okay, cool, awesome." You've actually done this. I didn't start from ground 0. But it's because I actively was trying to prove that I could do it. So anyway, that's the path I took, hopefully it helps?

 

Sit back, figure out where you're trying to go and those are some of the, when you're just talking about generating cash flow, I'm not talking about change the world products, I'm talking about you making money, for you. Change your own life before you go trying to change the world. It’s way easier, do it that way.

 

I want to change the world and I plan to. I don't know how yet. But first I'm changing my world so that I have the ability and power to change the world afterwards.

 

So this is the path I took with that intent in mind and it's been working really well. And we haven't had a negative month yet and I don't think we will. Anyway, things have been going great. I really appreciate it .

 

Thanks for listening, please rate and review the podcast. Please share it, we'd love to have more people on. For those of you guys who are on iTunes, I do film these now, if you want to see the graph I just drew, go to my YouTube channel if you want to see - it’s just ‘Steven Larson’, that's the name of my YouTube channel.

 

If you're on You Tube and you're like, "Hey, I would rather just listen to these," go to iTunes. A lot of you guys on Instagram, I know these get pushed to you as well.

 

Bloggers, what's up. You guys can come out to any of these platforms as well. We push out now to, it's over, it's like 25 different platforms. Just know that the others exist and excited to have you guys. Thanks so much, talk to you later. Bye!



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Broadcast on:
06 Jul 2018

- What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larson, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

 

Today I'm going to talk to you about why I chose the info business over the others.

 

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9-5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

 

The real question is, how will I do it, without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer.

 

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels.

 

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

 

I wanna deep dive into some of the reasons that I sell info now. I started and walked through several other models and markets over the years, but I've planted in Info for a few specific reasons. Here's why...

 

What's up guys, hey, first off please know that I know there are far more types of business than just the ones I have on the board right here. But generically I find that a lot of them fit kind of in this category as far as the way that we market them.

The four categories that I’m using are: Ecomm/ Agency/ Affiliate/ Info

 

Service is kind of the same way as Agency. We might market Ecomm in similar way to retail.

 

Anyway, so I went through and I started looking through different ways.

 

I did this a while ago and I was very methodical about the way that I entered the business space and which market I actually went into.

 

I'm not saying that one is not better than the other, and I'm not saying that these are all of them...  please know that I’m going to talk in massive stereotypes.

 

There are lots of different businesses out there. The kind of people that are solopreneurs, I typically see them going into one of these categorizes - until they get to a certain level, then they'll scale and blow it up and get to other places as well.

 

I might put supplements under Ecomm. They’re very similar - the funnels are different -  but there are some similar aspects to them.

 

Services and Agency are kind of the same.

 

Affiliate/ Salesman/ MLMers/ are all very similar

 

Then there’s Info products…

 

Anyway, what I want to do is I just want to show you guys real quick why I chose what I do and first of all I want you to know that this is, I actually sell info products now, right? I did not start that way at all though.

 

Info products is kind of interesting the way that it plays out because to sell info products, it helps to have a little bit of authority in the space that you're selling it to. Obviously, it helps, it's true for anything. But especially with info.

 

I didn't start with info. If you want to you can tackle it right away. Awesome, go for it.

 

I actually was just trying to prove that this whole internet game worked. I remember the first time I was sitting in college in a class and for this particular class, it was Quantitative Marketing Research. That was the name of the course. And we went through and we had a live client, and it was actually Paul Mitchell.

 

It was a Paul Mitchell school that was nearby. And what they were having us do was we would go collect a whole bunch of survey data and we were going to try and consult Paul Mitchell on what they should do with this actual real life scenario in business. And it was really really interesting.

 

Well the assignment was for us to go talk to 10 people each as a class, then collectively we have a whole bunch of, we have a lot of data to work from. Well, sitting there with one of my buddies, we were like, "I do not want to go ask people, even ten, "I don't wanna ask ten people how to do the survey."

 

And so what we did, we were like "What if we go, "and let's just actually put the survey on a Google form "and we will drive ads to it." Something very simple, but we did Facebook ads and we drove to it.

 

And what was interesting is we actually went and we had we collected more surveys than the rest of the class combined. And it went really really well.

 

Well that's how I started working for Paul Mitchell. Because Paul Mitchell came back like, "Hey, we don't have to do any of this internet stuff, "professors, like college teachers, do you guys "know how to do this stuff?" And they were like, "No, but these two psychos over here "seem to be doing something crazy, talk to them."

 

And we got a handoff from the professors and we started building funnels, we didn't know they were funnels.We were building sites, in WordPress, we were driving traffic, and it was really really interesting how that happened.

 

Well, right before all of that happened, I was like "Does this internet game even work? "Is it all a scam?" And so what I did was I started studying a lot of, if you guys know, High Traffic Academy from Vick Strizheus, I'm sorry I'm probably butchering your name man, Vick.

 

Anyway, I started studying that and I started learning, "What if I was to just put a squeeze page in front "of a clickbank product and drive traffic to it? "Oh my gosh, let's try that." It seemed so simple.

 

And I looked at my internet marketing teacher, and I said, "I don't want to come back." It was like the first or second day of that class. And I said, "I don't want to come back." And I drew a funnel, I didn't know that's what I was drawing, but I drew a funnel. I drew a funnel, and I drew an email follow up sequence, and I drew, and I said, "I want to go build this." And shockingly he looked at me and he goes, "Okay." And he left, he said, "You don't need to come back "the rest of the semester, but just give me some "kind of cool deliverable at the end of the semester." So I was like, "Cool."

 

So me, and this other guy, we went and we started, we started, trying to make and literally we held class everyday just trying to make as much money online as possible. That's what our task was. Today, let's make as much money as we physically can on the internet.

 

And so one of the very first products we did, was what I was just saying. We went and grabbed the squeeze page, it was a template software, we didn't know what we were doing. And we grabbed the template and we just changed the headlines and we grabbed a video from YouTube of someone else talking about that product, and then we put our affiliate link at the bottom.

 

When they clicked submit, the page collected their email and it redirected over to the Clickbank page, and I remember that night we put, it was a ton of money at that time, we put $50 in in ads, and we woke up the next morning, and I was anxious... this was like the 100th business I had tried. You know what I mean.

 

I opened up my computer and I was like, "Crap, "there's cash in here, what?" And I called my buddy real fast and we put $50 in, we got $50 back out, and we got 17 people on our list.

 

And one person was the buyer and bought the up sale and we liquidated. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is crazy. "That sucks we only made 50 bucks."

 

And at the time, I didn't understand how cool a deal that was. On our very, that's the very very first real funnel that I ever built. And we liquidated because 17 people on the list, and I thought it was a failure because we didn't make any money. How stupid is that. I should have kept it going, would of got a massive list quickly with that. Anyway, lessons learned. And we kept doing stuff like that.

 

I started in the affiliate area, as far as the internet business goes, I started here. This is actually where I started. Like, I'm not joking, a few weeks later that's when we start doing these cool things and we start getting involved with Paul Mitchell. And I start building these, we start building these things, and at that time, my buddy graduated, and I was like, "There's something to, what's this funnel thing. "There's something about this funnel game. "What's with this funnel game thing?"

 

And I went and I decided that I would start studying the funnel game more. I was like, "Who is this Russell Brunson guy, he looks like he's 13." Alright, what? And I was like, "Who is this guy?"

 

And I started deep diving guys, I mean I obsessed, I still do, right hardcore on what he was teaching, I was like, "Yeah, that's totally how it works. "Yeah, he's right, it doesn't work that way. "Whoa, look at that." And I started learning all these lessons.

 

I took “Dot Com Secrets X”, and I filled an entire notebook, page by page, you know those Steno notebooks with the lines, the graph notebooks. I filled it from front to back from notes just from that one course.

 

I mean, it took me three months to go through that one course. because I played it for 15 seconds, and then I stopped and I thought about it and I wrote down what I had just learned. And then I would press play, and guys I did that for a year.

 

And when I say I hid in the box office seats in campus, I did. And that's what I was doing for a year and a half, was studying and learning, and I started applying and doing all those little things

 

And I got to a place here where I was like, "I'm gonna start proving that I know this stuff." And I started going out and I wrote down, I started building all these funnels, and I did it with a lot of startup companies for a while.



And the problem with startups was there business wasn't proven out and if the funnel didn't work they thought it was my fault, and I was like "No, you don't have like a product yet. "You don't have a business. "I have to train you on all this stuff before you even accept me."

 

Anyway, startups were really really hard to work with for many reasons. Then I was like, "Ah man, I should "change who I'm actually pitching." I was like, "Oh sweet, I'm gonna go for successful people "who already have a list, who already have a successful "product, who have testimonials, with a mid-range product."

 

And I shotgun blasted out this invite to tons of people and I said, "Hey, I know you don't know what a funnel is, I will build one for free "just to show you that it works. "If it works, let's talk about me getting paid. "If it doesn't work, no harm no foul, I'll walk."

 

And I had several people bite, like alright, bring it on. And I went and I kind of, I started building funnels for several different people. I kind of went Agency, it was service style. And this is really where I started making actual real money, on my own, in college, ever.

 

First was, I started doing a whole bunch of affiliate stuff. But number two though, I went over, I actually, oh you can barely see that , okay cool. Anyway, number two though I started doing a whole bunch of service stuff and just putting my name out there, being like, "Look, I understand how this works now. "Am I perfect? "No, I'm not. "But let me just learn under your business wing, right, "let me go build this funnel and I'll keep getting better "and if it's working then let's talk about me getting paid "Don't pay me before hand though." And that's what I did and started getting these huge success stories.

 

Well, around that time is when Funnel Hacking Live was coming up, and I was like, "I wanna go. I'm getting "successes for a lot of these guys yet, but still "didn't feel like enough cash to spend money "on a Funnel Hacking Life ticket." And I started trading even, building even more funnels for plane tickets, and hotel nights, and things like that.

 

And I was like, "Oh, what's up Russell. "Then I got hired by Russell, right?" And that's really where I started building a lot of Ecomm funnels. Right, some of the biggest projects we were doing together were like, Fiber Fix, and a lot of products for Marcus Lemonis, for that TV show, The Profit, on CNBC. It was a lot of Ecomm style funnels that was going on there.

 

And it went really really well, it was awesome. I mean, we were blowing these guys up, sometimes too fast and they'd be like, "Turn it off, you're going "to bankrupt us." And I was like, "Oh my gosh," that's the model for Ecomm does really really well.

 

Whenever Russell's like "Dude, we need an Ecomm funnel, kinda like this funnel this funnel, this backend versus that back." I was like, "Sweet, I got it," and I'd go build it real fast. So I got really good at that model.

 

However, I've always known that this is kind of one of the Holy Grails. Info products are, I wanna go through this real fast, and then I want to show you something and this is the only reason why, but info products, it's one of, it's one of the hard categories to get into, but it's also one of the Holy Grails.

 

If you look at what Dan Henry did, well, it's episode, it's one of the earlier episodes of Sales Funnel Radio, but I interviewed when he had only made 200 grand with his current offer, that he'd blow up with.

 

His Facebook ads for entrepreneurs He'd only done like barely $200,000 at that time. And he was talking about it and if you have listened to that episode, what he was saying, was for his info product, he spent a solid like five, six months taking a beta group through and seeing what they were doing and how they were reacting to what he was teaching.

 

Okay, I told you to build the Facebook ad this way, but turns out you all thought I meant this. Okay, let's clarify. Then okay, now do this step. Oh man, you're all screwed up here, let's do it right. And he was spot checking and he was making a system.

 

And he spent a lot of time proving out his info product before he ever sold it. I've done the exact same thing with mine.

 

Alex and Leila Hormozi, at Funnel Hacking Live, this last one, they were talking about for a full year, before they ever, they just got, they just made 10 million dollars since last April. But they didn't just start doing that.

 

For a full year before they ever started really scaling and selling hard, for a full year, they were living in crazy areas, doing crazy things, just so they could prove the process that they were going to bring people though.

 

That is really one of the gateways, it's one of the key gates of getting really good and awesome at Info. Your crap's gotta be amazing. It's gotta get results for people. And the best way to do it is to just spend a lot of time with your prospective customers. With people who represent your prospective customers. And make them successful, make them successful, and get, and when you do, it's in my mind, it's one of the Holy Grails.

 

I love selling info products, okay. I love it. And here's why, let's walk through this now real quick.

 

Here's a good reason why, just so you know, that's been kind of my journey I've gone through it, I kind of did a little more Ecomm stuff then I jumped over here to the Info side where I will reside as long as I can. I absolutely love it, and it's super cool. It takes a little finesse to get into a lot of times.

 

I'm not saying you can't go interview a bunch of people and toss out that interview series as an info product. You could totally do that. Now, I'm not saying you can't, there's a lot of ways to create an info product really quickly. But I'm saying, like you as a brand, you as an educator, you as an idea and a vehicle that has potential for two commas, like info wise, it's gotta be really good. It's gotta be really good, okay. So let's walk through this real quick here.

 

With Ecomm, let's say over here on this side, we're going to go through Ecomm and for each one of these we're going to look at the profit margin potential.

 

Again, massive stereotypes... I understand that there are people out there who have figured out how to game the system, but they are not typical.

 

I'm talking typical, stereotypical, kind of result in each one of these categories. How much profit, how much margin potential is there? How much money for you after all the expenses are done? How much earning potential is there for you, typically, in that category and how much time does it take to actually do the business, actually fulfill on the thing that you're selling? I'm gonna walkthrough really fast.

 

This is why I've chosen what I have and I've been methodical about it. I'm going to say that #1 equals a little, #2 equals kind of medium, and then #3 equals a lot.

 

Let's go with Ecomm. And I know that some of you guys want to reach out to me, and kind of fight me on these things. I understand. I'm talking just straight atypical general person that goes through this think, okay.

 

What is the earning, at the very end of the day, the profit potential of the Ecomm category? What is it? It's not, it's not actually that high.

 

A lot of people get in two comma clubs in Ecomm, but they don't actually keep that much money, they actually don't have that much cash to their name themselves.

 

I understand the coolness of the award, and you certainly can scream to it real fast by doing something like Ecomm really quickly. But there's not typically that much profit margin inside of Ecomm. Especially when people don't do my freaking offer creation strategy in this.

 

If they do, they can make a lot of cash. It's like, I don't know why, a lot of Ecomm people don't believe me. Like even though that's what we do, and it works. Anyway, but the actual earning potential, actual profit margin on the actual business itself, is a little bit tiny. I'm gonna say, we'll say a two here. A one to a two. It's kind of a little, especially if you're doing something like drop shipping, that's obviously a one.

 

If you own the product, you're going to get more of a 2. But let's talk about time to fulfill. Even if you got a shipping fulfillment house doing your work for you, or if it's in house, you're typically sourcing products like crazy. You're spending a lot of time finding the next product, testing the next thing. I'm not saying you gotta sell the Ecomm product for a couple bucks like a lot of Ecomm people do. You can sell really really expensive, but you're usually in a game of trying to figure out the next thing to go sell really really quickly.

 

Info, the way I write info, is a little bit different, ok? I'm gonna say a 2, because you can spend a butt load of time actually on the phone. Right, that's one of the things that Trey Lewellen was having a hard time with, with his, which you can't blame him, with his credit card knife. The dude's the man, absolutely amazing. Spent a lot of time though fulfilling, and it's easy to run into troubles that way.

 

Ecomm, I was like Ecomm's cool but like, ah man, I'm about that ROI. How can I get the highest leverage, ok? Which in Ecomm comes in later.

 

Remember this, ok? I'm going to come back to this and show you how I use this now. But you sell info. Wait, do I?

 

Agency's freaking awesome too, there's a lot of cash that usually comes in the business. The thing that I don't like about Agency is when you get paid, is when the work starts. I don't like that. It's where I proved that I knew what I was doing. It's services, services/Agency. It's where I, it's a really fast way as well. I love the path that I personally took. I learned how to sell other people's products, which is awesome, we'll get there in a second.

 

But then I went over to the service and Agency side and it was really cool because you get paid a lot of cash but you're also, even if you have an amazing team Agency wise, you're still managing the team, you're still closing deals typically. I'm not saying you're, anyway, there are exceptions to the rule, but usually, there's a lot of time to fulfill on Agency model.

 

After the sale is made, is usually, that's when it starts; I'm going to say a three and then a two here.

 

Let's talk here about affiliate. Now typically with affiliates, the profit margin, usually small, right? You got the crazies out there like Russell Brunson giving 40% every single month of his check to you for getting an affiliate person it. That's amazing, that's incredible. Usually not the case though. So I'm going to say a one. But what's interesting, but actually 1.5, let's say 1.5. Depending on the product, depending on the affiliate, there's a lot of variables with every one of these categories and I totally get that. But just generally, usually 1, 1.5.

 

How much time does it take for you to fulfill after the sales made. No time, no time at all. Oh my gosh, great place to go. And this is actually how I built my entire company and business without ever spending a dollar of my own. I've never spent a dollar of my own, I don't think so, in my own business. And it's because I started with affiliates.

 

That generated cash so I could do cool things like hire VAs in service/Agency and that brought in even more cash, and I was like, "Well this is awesome, but I want to free "up my time a little bit." Let's jump over to info, and that's what I went in to next.

 

Let's talk about info. What's the earning/profit margin potential on an info product? Guys, my margins right now on my main product is like 94%. Obviously there's a business margin, but I'm saying the actual product margin is like 94%, it's ridiculous. It's like no cost to fulfill on it at all. I think it's actually like 98.8. It's really, it's ridiculous. Three, definitely a three.

 

Time to fulfill, like virtually nothing. The cost of an email with access to a members area or something like that. Now, there's a caveat to this. If I go through and there's an info product, people know, there's this inherent understanding that the info product is already made. It's like the subconscious know, the little thing that they know that it's not going to take you anything to fulfill on that. Because of that, the perceived value, the perceived value, so it's a lot of value to me, but the perceived value of info, is usually kind of low. It is, right.

 

Let's take Ecomm for example, though. Ecomm something physical, something I'm gonna get in the mail. I got these stupid crows that are flying all over the place around the office and they just, they're messing with me, they'll like, so anyways, I've got a BB gun coming, you can guess what's happening, right, but the perceived value, perceived value of an Ecomm product is really high.

 

Perfect example, go think about Amazon. There's not sales copy on Amazon, there's like bullet point descriptions, this is what it is. Bam, here's the button, put it in your order and just go get it. The perceived value, perceived value, of Ecomm is high, but the value to the entrepreneur is typically a little lower. So what I do is I combine them.

 

In my offers with info, the reason why info does so well for me now, is yes, you get the info thing, but I also ship a lot of amazing, incredible things to the person when they purchase. I combine info with Ecomm and it's one of the reasons why my stuff does so well and one of the reasons why the perceived value of my offers is so high, cause the value is high.

 

They're getting something in the mail, they're getting, it's not just like something, they're crazy cool things, they're getting those and they're getting access to all this crazy stuff: funnel builds, incredible things. Things that people pay a lot of money for me to go do normally. They're getting those things in there and that's the reason why I chose and landed on info, and I will stay there, stay there, stay there.

 

The category that I want to move into eventually though is software. I think I don't know what it's going to be, but it's because it's almost like the benefits of Ecomm, high perceived value, software, right, software is high perceived value. With really high margins on the product itself, the business margin on software is a little bit hard, because you have a lot of support usually, that's a higher.

 

But the time to fulfill is like virtually nothing which means the entrepreneurs can spend, as long as they get great support, usually in software the entrepreneurs can spend little time doing any kind of fulfillment, instead they do a lot of time selling.

 

Russell stays in the act of selling like, 24/7. He can do that because of the software game, because he's in the info game, because he combines a lot of Ecomm inside of it. Does that make sense?

 

So he tosses off a lot of the benefits to his affiliates by giving them the ability, "Hey look, you don't have to fulfill anything, "I ain't going to pay you for it." Sweet. And he teaches a lot of people, look, if you need cash and a lot of it pretty quick, go service/Agency style.

 

You'll get a lot of cash quickly but eventually that's why I landed in what I do, and that's why I stay in info, and I will always stay info. I love it. The time to fulfill is tiny, which lets me stay in the zone, where I get to create more things for the same product. Toss in more cool things. Make the value of the offer even bigger. Create amazing things for people, and the profit margins are big enough that it allows me to do that.

 

I'm not having to sell thousands of little knick knacks. And take away a thousand dollars to go put that in something else from the source of knick knacks, that's really really rough in Ecomm.

 

But a thousand dollars, coming from the source of an info product? It's really really easy, it's not that crazy hard, at all. SO this is why I do what I do. This is the reason that I've structured it the way I have. So I hope that helps.

 

If you guys are thinking through how to actually sell the stuff that you are, and what you're trying to get into. I started as an affiliate and it's a great way to go.

 

And frankly, when I started Sales Funnel Radio, I kept this thing going by giving away share funnels. And now I've got a bunch of people on ClickFunnels accounts.

 

At the beginning when I was working at ClickFunnels, at a 9-5 job, I had this extra cash that was coming in, and because of that, while I was doing my 9-5, which was way more than that but while I was working over there, during the same day, there would be doing VAs in different places that were getting projects and cool things done for me. Not from my own pocket, because I was doing affiliate stuff like crazy. Really easy to fulfill, got some cash from it.

 

Still to this day, it's significant. I think we've passed, we're well passed thirty grand in affiliate commissions in the last like year-and-a-half, I mean that's good. It's been the cash that I've needed to do all the stuff on the side and prep the groundwork so I could launch into the info space.

 

So anyway, I just hope that that helps. It helps you guys work through and think through where you're heading.

 

If you're like "I'm trying to do info." Okay, does anyone know who you are? Have you proved out the process yet? Can you, if someone actually follows the process, can you virtually guarantee that people are going to be successful at it. If you can't, it can be to sell that at scale.

 

If someone follows my process, they get results, I know they do. I have the best product in the category I'm selling in in the entire market, and I know I do, and I'm fine with that, and I'm fine saying that because I know it's true.

 

Because that's what happens, when people do it, they get results. It's happening life, like right now. It took me like two years, honestly, to really get to a spot where my info product could do that for people, so if you're knowing that, if you're like, "I want to do info," Awesome. Or if you're like, "I want to stick in Ecomm." That's great, that's great. Just figure out the little tricks to make the margins huge and make that two into a three. That's super super cool.

 

Just be cognizant of what that industry is typically like and the cost associated with that. Like supplements, supplements takes a lot of cash to sell someone into the supplements.

 

Continuity, and software, take a lot of cash to sell. Continuity is expensive to sell. So don't sell continuity outright. Attach it to other things. Funnel Hacks, like Russel does. Isn't it amazing. When you do it that way, oh my gosh, so much easier.

 

Same thing with supplements over here, supplements cost a lot of cash to drop in, but if you have an info product that you're coupling it with, they buy the info product, that's what's self-liquidating, your ad cross and now in the backend go toss them to your supplements.

 

Awesome, or your Ecomm, or whatever. Does that make sense? This is one of the reasons I've structured the way I have - I'm very methodical about it. It's turned out really really well.

 

So I hope that it's helpful to you?

 

If you're stuck or you're like, "Oh gosh, I don't know "how this is going to work? I don't know if this is going "to be successful here or there?" Man, just go figure out how you can get cash now. And some of the easiest places to do it, Affiliate. Probably next, probably the Agency. I know a lot of Ecomm people will probably fight me on that and that's fine, that's totally fine. We all have our own opinions and that's perfect.

 

The model I'm following and I just wanted to walk you guys through why I do what I do. And what my logic has been behind each one of them is... profit margin potential out of the gate, not tricks, not little tips. Profit margin potential out of the gate - what is it?

 

I'll do the little tips and tricks and stuff like that, and I do and it goes even higher, but I don't want to bank on those. That's why I didn't run into Ecomm. I almost ran into Ecomm... I just about did Ecomm, but that's the reason I didn't right out the gate.

 

Again, not telling you not to, but that's the reason I didn't was ‘time to fulfill.’ I was like, "Man I just want to "do revenue generating activities, but what I'm constantly managing a product for someone else. I’d collected the cash already but I can't "actually do anything with it cause my hands "are tied, my time is tied because I can't actually "go do, I have to fulfill.

 

I don't know if I want to marry the Agency/service model. It was a great place for me to go for quite a while honestly, to vet out and prove who I was and what I was doing and that I could do it, which the market obviously needed to see, why would they not?

 

I got my testimonials from there, I got, that's what launched me in to being able to work next to Russell. In fact, that's one of the first things he asked when I sat down face to face with him.

 

Actually before I even got there, he's like, "Have you "been building funnels?" I said, "Yeah." He's like, "What are the URLs?" Boom, blasted over like 20 URLs over to him. Look at all these funnels I've done, look at all the stats here we go, boom, and when I sat down, he was like sick, okay, cool. He didn't say sick. He was like, "Okay, cool, awesome." You've actually done this. I didn't start from ground 0. But it's because I actively was trying to prove that I could do it. So anyway, that's the path I took, hopefully it helps?

 

Sit back, figure out where you're trying to go and those are some of the, when you're just talking about generating cash flow, I'm not talking about change the world products, I'm talking about you making money, for you. Change your own life before you go trying to change the world. It’s way easier, do it that way.

 

I want to change the world and I plan to. I don't know how yet. But first I'm changing my world so that I have the ability and power to change the world afterwards.

 

So this is the path I took with that intent in mind and it's been working really well. And we haven't had a negative month yet and I don't think we will. Anyway, things have been going great. I really appreciate it .

 

Thanks for listening, please rate and review the podcast. Please share it, we'd love to have more people on. For those of you guys who are on iTunes, I do film these now, if you want to see the graph I just drew, go to my YouTube channel if you want to see - it’s just ‘Steven Larson’, that's the name of my YouTube channel.

 

If you're on You Tube and you're like, "Hey, I would rather just listen to these," go to iTunes. A lot of you guys on Instagram, I know these get pushed to you as well.

 

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- What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larson, and this is Sales Funnel Radio.

 

Today I'm going to talk to you about why I chose the info business over the others.

 

I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9-5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business.

 

The real question is, how will I do it, without VC funding or debt, completely from scratch. This podcast is here to give you the answer.

 

Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business. Using only today's best internet sales funnels.

 

My name is Steve Larsen, and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio.

 

I wanna deep dive into some of the reasons that I sell info now. I started and walked through several other models and markets over the years, but I've planted in Info for a few specific reasons. Here's why...

 

What's up guys, hey, first off please know that I know there are far more types of business than just the ones I have on the board right here. But generically I find that a lot of them fit kind of in this category as far as the way that we market them.

The four categories that I’m using are: Ecomm/ Agency/ Affiliate/ Info

 

Service is kind of the same way as Agency. We might market Ecomm in similar way to retail.

 

Anyway, so I went through and I started looking through different ways.

 

I did this a while ago and I was very methodical about the way that I entered the business space and which market I actually went into.

 

I'm not saying that one is not better than the other, and I'm not saying that these are all of them...  please know that I’m going to talk in massive stereotypes.

 

There are lots of different businesses out there. The kind of people that are solopreneurs, I typically see them going into one of these categorizes - until they get to a certain level, then they'll scale and blow it up and get to other places as well.

 

I might put supplements under Ecomm. They’re very similar - the funnels are different -  but there are some similar aspects to them.

 

Services and Agency are kind of the same.

 

Affiliate/ Salesman/ MLMers/ are all very similar

 

Then there’s Info products…

 

Anyway, what I want to do is I just want to show you guys real quick why I chose what I do and first of all I want you to know that this is, I actually sell info products now, right? I did not start that way at all though.

 

Info products is kind of interesting the way that it plays out because to sell info products, it helps to have a little bit of authority in the space that you're selling it to. Obviously, it helps, it's true for anything. But especially with info.

 

I didn't start with info. If you want to you can tackle it right away. Awesome, go for it.

 

I actually was just trying to prove that this whole internet game worked. I remember the first time I was sitting in college in a class and for this particular class, it was Quantitative Marketing Research. That was the name of the course. And we went through and we had a live client, and it was actually Paul Mitchell.

 

It was a Paul Mitchell school that was nearby. And what they were having us do was we would go collect a whole bunch of survey data and we were going to try and consult Paul Mitchell on what they should do with this actual real life scenario in business. And it was really really interesting.

 

Well the assignment was for us to go talk to 10 people each as a class, then collectively we have a whole bunch of, we have a lot of data to work from. Well, sitting there with one of my buddies, we were like, "I do not want to go ask people, even ten, "I don't wanna ask ten people how to do the survey."

 

And so what we did, we were like "What if we go, "and let's just actually put the survey on a Google form "and we will drive ads to it." Something very simple, but we did Facebook ads and we drove to it.

 

And what was interesting is we actually went and we had we collected more surveys than the rest of the class combined. And it went really really well.

 

Well that's how I started working for Paul Mitchell. Because Paul Mitchell came back like, "Hey, we don't have to do any of this internet stuff, "professors, like college teachers, do you guys "know how to do this stuff?" And they were like, "No, but these two psychos over here "seem to be doing something crazy, talk to them."

 

And we got a handoff from the professors and we started building funnels, we didn't know they were funnels.We were building sites, in WordPress, we were driving traffic, and it was really really interesting how that happened.

 

Well, right before all of that happened, I was like "Does this internet game even work? "Is it all a scam?" And so what I did was I started studying a lot of, if you guys know, High Traffic Academy from Vick Strizheus, I'm sorry I'm probably butchering your name man, Vick.

 

Anyway, I started studying that and I started learning, "What if I was to just put a squeeze page in front "of a clickbank product and drive traffic to it? "Oh my gosh, let's try that." It seemed so simple.

 

And I looked at my internet marketing teacher, and I said, "I don't want to come back." It was like the first or second day of that class. And I said, "I don't want to come back." And I drew a funnel, I didn't know that's what I was drawing, but I drew a funnel. I drew a funnel, and I drew an email follow up sequence, and I drew, and I said, "I want to go build this." And shockingly he looked at me and he goes, "Okay." And he left, he said, "You don't need to come back "the rest of the semester, but just give me some "kind of cool deliverable at the end of the semester." So I was like, "Cool."

 

So me, and this other guy, we went and we started, we started, trying to make and literally we held class everyday just trying to make as much money online as possible. That's what our task was. Today, let's make as much money as we physically can on the internet.

 

And so one of the very first products we did, was what I was just saying. We went and grabbed the squeeze page, it was a template software, we didn't know what we were doing. And we grabbed the template and we just changed the headlines and we grabbed a video from YouTube of someone else talking about that product, and then we put our affiliate link at the bottom.

 

When they clicked submit, the page collected their email and it redirected over to the Clickbank page, and I remember that night we put, it was a ton of money at that time, we put $50 in in ads, and we woke up the next morning, and I was anxious... this was like the 100th business I had tried. You know what I mean.

 

I opened up my computer and I was like, "Crap, "there's cash in here, what?" And I called my buddy real fast and we put $50 in, we got $50 back out, and we got 17 people on our list.

 

And one person was the buyer and bought the up sale and we liquidated. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is crazy. "That sucks we only made 50 bucks."

 

And at the time, I didn't understand how cool a deal that was. On our very, that's the very very first real funnel that I ever built. And we liquidated because 17 people on the list, and I thought it was a failure because we didn't make any money. How stupid is that. I should have kept it going, would of got a massive list quickly with that. Anyway, lessons learned. And we kept doing stuff like that.

 

I started in the affiliate area, as far as the internet business goes, I started here. This is actually where I started. Like, I'm not joking, a few weeks later that's when we start doing these cool things and we start getting involved with Paul Mitchell. And I start building these, we start building these things, and at that time, my buddy graduated, and I was like, "There's something to, what's this funnel thing. "There's something about this funnel game. "What's with this funnel game thing?"

 

And I went and I decided that I would start studying the funnel game more. I was like, "Who is this Russell Brunson guy, he looks like he's 13." Alright, what? And I was like, "Who is this guy?"

 

And I started deep diving guys, I mean I obsessed, I still do, right hardcore on what he was teaching, I was like, "Yeah, that's totally how it works. "Yeah, he's right, it doesn't work that way. "Whoa, look at that." And I started learning all these lessons.

 

I took “Dot Com Secrets X”, and I filled an entire notebook, page by page, you know those Steno notebooks with the lines, the graph notebooks. I filled it from front to back from notes just from that one course.

 

I mean, it took me three months to go through that one course. because I played it for 15 seconds, and then I stopped and I thought about it and I wrote down what I had just learned. And then I would press play, and guys I did that for a year.

 

And when I say I hid in the box office seats in campus, I did. And that's what I was doing for a year and a half, was studying and learning, and I started applying and doing all those little things

 

And I got to a place here where I was like, "I'm gonna start proving that I know this stuff." And I started going out and I wrote down, I started building all these funnels, and I did it with a lot of startup companies for a while.



And the problem with startups was there business wasn't proven out and if the funnel didn't work they thought it was my fault, and I was like "No, you don't have like a product yet. "You don't have a business. "I have to train you on all this stuff before you even accept me."

 

Anyway, startups were really really hard to work with for many reasons. Then I was like, "Ah man, I should "change who I'm actually pitching." I was like, "Oh sweet, I'm gonna go for successful people "who already have a list, who already have a successful "product, who have testimonials, with a mid-range product."

 

And I shotgun blasted out this invite to tons of people and I said, "Hey, I know you don't know what a funnel is, I will build one for free "just to show you that it works. "If it works, let's talk about me getting paid. "If it doesn't work, no harm no foul, I'll walk."

 

And I had several people bite, like alright, bring it on. And I went and I kind of, I started building funnels for several different people. I kind of went Agency, it was service style. And this is really where I started making actual real money, on my own, in college, ever.

 

First was, I started doing a whole bunch of affiliate stuff. But number two though, I went over, I actually, oh you can barely see that , okay cool. Anyway, number two though I started doing a whole bunch of service stuff and just putting my name out there, being like, "Look, I understand how this works now. "Am I perfect? "No, I'm not. "But let me just learn under your business wing, right, "let me go build this funnel and I'll keep getting better "and if it's working then let's talk about me getting paid "Don't pay me before hand though." And that's what I did and started getting these huge success stories.

 

Well, around that time is when Funnel Hacking Live was coming up, and I was like, "I wanna go. I'm getting "successes for a lot of these guys yet, but still "didn't feel like enough cash to spend money "on a Funnel Hacking Life ticket." And I started trading even, building even more funnels for plane tickets, and hotel nights, and things like that.

 

And I was like, "Oh, what's up Russell. "Then I got hired by Russell, right?" And that's really where I started building a lot of Ecomm funnels. Right, some of the biggest projects we were doing together were like, Fiber Fix, and a lot of products for Marcus Lemonis, for that TV show, The Profit, on CNBC. It was a lot of Ecomm style funnels that was going on there.

 

And it went really really well, it was awesome. I mean, we were blowing these guys up, sometimes too fast and they'd be like, "Turn it off, you're going "to bankrupt us." And I was like, "Oh my gosh," that's the model for Ecomm does really really well.

 

Whenever Russell's like "Dude, we need an Ecomm funnel, kinda like this funnel this funnel, this backend versus that back." I was like, "Sweet, I got it," and I'd go build it real fast. So I got really good at that model.

 

However, I've always known that this is kind of one of the Holy Grails. Info products are, I wanna go through this real fast, and then I want to show you something and this is the only reason why, but info products, it's one of, it's one of the hard categories to get into, but it's also one of the Holy Grails.

 

If you look at what Dan Henry did, well, it's episode, it's one of the earlier episodes of Sales Funnel Radio, but I interviewed when he had only made 200 grand with his current offer, that he'd blow up with.

 

His Facebook ads for entrepreneurs He'd only done like barely $200,000 at that time. And he was talking about it and if you have listened to that episode, what he was saying, was for his info product, he spent a solid like five, six months taking a beta group through and seeing what they were doing and how they were reacting to what he was teaching.

 

Okay, I told you to build the Facebook ad this way, but turns out you all thought I meant this. Okay, let's clarify. Then okay, now do this step. Oh man, you're all screwed up here, let's do it right. And he was spot checking and he was making a system.

 

And he spent a lot of time proving out his info product before he ever sold it. I've done the exact same thing with mine.

 

Alex and Leila Hormozi, at Funnel Hacking Live, this last one, they were talking about for a full year, before they ever, they just got, they just made 10 million dollars since last April. But they didn't just start doing that.

 

For a full year before they ever started really scaling and selling hard, for a full year, they were living in crazy areas, doing crazy things, just so they could prove the process that they were going to bring people though.

 

That is really one of the gateways, it's one of the key gates of getting really good and awesome at Info. Your crap's gotta be amazing. It's gotta get results for people. And the best way to do it is to just spend a lot of time with your prospective customers. With people who represent your prospective customers. And make them successful, make them successful, and get, and when you do, it's in my mind, it's one of the Holy Grails.

 

I love selling info products, okay. I love it. And here's why, let's walk through this now real quick.

 

Here's a good reason why, just so you know, that's been kind of my journey I've gone through it, I kind of did a little more Ecomm stuff then I jumped over here to the Info side where I will reside as long as I can. I absolutely love it, and it's super cool. It takes a little finesse to get into a lot of times.

 

I'm not saying you can't go interview a bunch of people and toss out that interview series as an info product. You could totally do that. Now, I'm not saying you can't, there's a lot of ways to create an info product really quickly. But I'm saying, like you as a brand, you as an educator, you as an idea and a vehicle that has potential for two commas, like info wise, it's gotta be really good. It's gotta be really good, okay. So let's walk through this real quick here.

 

With Ecomm, let's say over here on this side, we're going to go through Ecomm and for each one of these we're going to look at the profit margin potential.

 

Again, massive stereotypes... I understand that there are people out there who have figured out how to game the system, but they are not typical.

 

I'm talking typical, stereotypical, kind of result in each one of these categories. How much profit, how much margin potential is there? How much money for you after all the expenses are done? How much earning potential is there for you, typically, in that category and how much time does it take to actually do the business, actually fulfill on the thing that you're selling? I'm gonna walkthrough really fast.

 

This is why I've chosen what I have and I've been methodical about it. I'm going to say that #1 equals a little, #2 equals kind of medium, and then #3 equals a lot.

 

Let's go with Ecomm. And I know that some of you guys want to reach out to me, and kind of fight me on these things. I understand. I'm talking just straight atypical general person that goes through this think, okay.

 

What is the earning, at the very end of the day, the profit potential of the Ecomm category? What is it? It's not, it's not actually that high.

 

A lot of people get in two comma clubs in Ecomm, but they don't actually keep that much money, they actually don't have that much cash to their name themselves.

 

I understand the coolness of the award, and you certainly can scream to it real fast by doing something like Ecomm really quickly. But there's not typically that much profit margin inside of Ecomm. Especially when people don't do my freaking offer creation strategy in this.

 

If they do, they can make a lot of cash. It's like, I don't know why, a lot of Ecomm people don't believe me. Like even though that's what we do, and it works. Anyway, but the actual earning potential, actual profit margin on the actual business itself, is a little bit tiny. I'm gonna say, we'll say a two here. A one to a two. It's kind of a little, especially if you're doing something like drop shipping, that's obviously a one.

 

If you own the product, you're going to get more of a 2. But let's talk about time to fulfill. Even if you got a shipping fulfillment house doing your work for you, or if it's in house, you're typically sourcing products like crazy. You're spending a lot of time finding the next product, testing the next thing. I'm not saying you gotta sell the Ecomm product for a couple bucks like a lot of Ecomm people do. You can sell really really expensive, but you're usually in a game of trying to figure out the next thing to go sell really really quickly.

 

Info, the way I write info, is a little bit different, ok? I'm gonna say a 2, because you can spend a butt load of time actually on the phone. Right, that's one of the things that Trey Lewellen was having a hard time with, with his, which you can't blame him, with his credit card knife. The dude's the man, absolutely amazing. Spent a lot of time though fulfilling, and it's easy to run into troubles that way.

 

Ecomm, I was like Ecomm's cool but like, ah man, I'm about that ROI. How can I get the highest leverage, ok? Which in Ecomm comes in later.

 

Remember this, ok? I'm going to come back to this and show you how I use this now. But you sell info. Wait, do I?

 

Agency's freaking awesome too, there's a lot of cash that usually comes in the business. The thing that I don't like about Agency is when you get paid, is when the work starts. I don't like that. It's where I proved that I knew what I was doing. It's services, services/Agency. It's where I, it's a really fast way as well. I love the path that I personally took. I learned how to sell other people's products, which is awesome, we'll get there in a second.

 

But then I went over to the service and Agency side and it was really cool because you get paid a lot of cash but you're also, even if you have an amazing team Agency wise, you're still managing the team, you're still closing deals typically. I'm not saying you're, anyway, there are exceptions to the rule, but usually, there's a lot of time to fulfill on Agency model.

 

After the sale is made, is usually, that's when it starts; I'm going to say a three and then a two here.

 

Let's talk here about affiliate. Now typically with affiliates, the profit margin, usually small, right? You got the crazies out there like Russell Brunson giving 40% every single month of his check to you for getting an affiliate person it. That's amazing, that's incredible. Usually not the case though. So I'm going to say a one. But what's interesting, but actually 1.5, let's say 1.5. Depending on the product, depending on the affiliate, there's a lot of variables with every one of these categories and I totally get that. But just generally, usually 1, 1.5.

 

How much time does it take for you to fulfill after the sales made. No time, no time at all. Oh my gosh, great place to go. And this is actually how I built my entire company and business without ever spending a dollar of my own. I've never spent a dollar of my own, I don't think so, in my own business. And it's because I started with affiliates.

 

That generated cash so I could do cool things like hire VAs in service/Agency and that brought in even more cash, and I was like, "Well this is awesome, but I want to free "up my time a little bit." Let's jump over to info, and that's what I went in to next.

 

Let's talk about info. What's the earning/profit margin potential on an info product? Guys, my margins right now on my main product is like 94%. Obviously there's a business margin, but I'm saying the actual product margin is like 94%, it's ridiculous. It's like no cost to fulfill on it at all. I think it's actually like 98.8. It's really, it's ridiculous. Three, definitely a three.

 

Time to fulfill, like virtually nothing. The cost of an email with access to a members area or something like that. Now, there's a caveat to this. If I go through and there's an info product, people know, there's this inherent understanding that the info product is already made. It's like the subconscious know, the little thing that they know that it's not going to take you anything to fulfill on that. Because of that, the perceived value, the perceived value, so it's a lot of value to me, but the perceived value of info, is usually kind of low. It is, right.

 

Let's take Ecomm for example, though. Ecomm something physical, something I'm gonna get in the mail. I got these stupid crows that are flying all over the place around the office and they just, they're messing with me, they'll like, so anyways, I've got a BB gun coming, you can guess what's happening, right, but the perceived value, perceived value of an Ecomm product is really high.

 

Perfect example, go think about Amazon. There's not sales copy on Amazon, there's like bullet point descriptions, this is what it is. Bam, here's the button, put it in your order and just go get it. The perceived value, perceived value, of Ecomm is high, but the value to the entrepreneur is typically a little lower. So what I do is I combine them.

 

In my offers with info, the reason why info does so well for me now, is yes, you get the info thing, but I also ship a lot of amazing, incredible things to the person when they purchase. I combine info with Ecomm and it's one of the reasons why my stuff does so well and one of the reasons why the perceived value of my offers is so high, cause the value is high.

 

They're getting something in the mail, they're getting, it's not just like something, they're crazy cool things, they're getting those and they're getting access to all this crazy stuff: funnel builds, incredible things. Things that people pay a lot of money for me to go do normally. They're getting those things in there and that's the reason why I chose and landed on info, and I will stay there, stay there, stay there.

 

The category that I want to move into eventually though is software. I think I don't know what it's going to be, but it's because it's almost like the benefits of Ecomm, high perceived value, software, right, software is high perceived value. With really high margins on the product itself, the business margin on software is a little bit hard, because you have a lot of support usually, that's a higher.

 

But the time to fulfill is like virtually nothing which means the entrepreneurs can spend, as long as they get great support, usually in software the entrepreneurs can spend little time doing any kind of fulfillment, instead they do a lot of time selling.

 

Russell stays in the act of selling like, 24/7. He can do that because of the software game, because he's in the info game, because he combines a lot of Ecomm inside of it. Does that make sense?

 

So he tosses off a lot of the benefits to his affiliates by giving them the ability, "Hey look, you don't have to fulfill anything, "I ain't going to pay you for it." Sweet. And he teaches a lot of people, look, if you need cash and a lot of it pretty quick, go service/Agency style.

 

You'll get a lot of cash quickly but eventually that's why I landed in what I do, and that's why I stay in info, and I will always stay info. I love it. The time to fulfill is tiny, which lets me stay in the zone, where I get to create more things for the same product. Toss in more cool things. Make the value of the offer even bigger. Create amazing things for people, and the profit margins are big enough that it allows me to do that.

 

I'm not having to sell thousands of little knick knacks. And take away a thousand dollars to go put that in something else from the source of knick knacks, that's really really rough in Ecomm.

 

But a thousand dollars, coming from the source of an info product? It's really really easy, it's not that crazy hard, at all. SO this is why I do what I do. This is the reason that I've structured it the way I have. So I hope that helps.

 

If you guys are thinking through how to actually sell the stuff that you are, and what you're trying to get into. I started as an affiliate and it's a great way to go.

 

And frankly, when I started Sales Funnel Radio, I kept this thing going by giving away share funnels. And now I've got a bunch of people on ClickFunnels accounts.

 

At the beginning when I was working at ClickFunnels, at a 9-5 job, I had this extra cash that was coming in, and because of that, while I was doing my 9-5, which was way more than that but while I was working over there, during the same day, there would be doing VAs in different places that were getting projects and cool things done for me. Not from my own pocket, because I was doing affiliate stuff like crazy. Really easy to fulfill, got some cash from it.

 

Still to this day, it's significant. I think we've passed, we're well passed thirty grand in affiliate commissions in the last like year-and-a-half, I mean that's good. It's been the cash that I've needed to do all the stuff on the side and prep the groundwork so I could launch into the info space.

 

So anyway, I just hope that that helps. It helps you guys work through and think through where you're heading.

 

If you're like "I'm trying to do info." Okay, does anyone know who you are? Have you proved out the process yet? Can you, if someone actually follows the process, can you virtually guarantee that people are going to be successful at it. If you can't, it can be to sell that at scale.

 

If someone follows my process, they get results, I know they do. I have the best product in the category I'm selling in in the entire market, and I know I do, and I'm fine with that, and I'm fine saying that because I know it's true.

 

Because that's what happens, when people do it, they get results. It's happening life, like right now. It took me like two years, honestly, to really get to a spot where my info product could do that for people, so if you're knowing that, if you're like, "I want to do info," Awesome. Or if you're like, "I want to stick in Ecomm." That's great, that's great. Just figure out the little tricks to make the margins huge and make that two into a three. That's super super cool.

 

Just be cognizant of what that industry is typically like and the cost associated with that. Like supplements, supplements takes a lot of cash to sell someone into the supplements.

 

Continuity, and software, take a lot of cash to sell. Continuity is expensive to sell. So don't sell continuity outright. Attach it to other things. Funnel Hacks, like Russel does. Isn't it amazing. When you do it that way, oh my gosh, so much easier.

 

Same thing with supplements over here, supplements cost a lot of cash to drop in, but if you have an info product that you're coupling it with, they buy the info product, that's what's self-liquidating, your ad cross and now in the backend go toss them to your supplements.

 

Awesome, or your Ecomm, or whatever. Does that make sense? This is one of the reasons I've structured the way I have - I'm very methodical about it. It's turned out really really well.

 

So I hope that it's helpful to you?

 

If you're stuck or you're like, "Oh gosh, I don't know "how this is going to work? I don't know if this is going "to be successful here or there?" Man, just go figure out how you can get cash now. And some of the easiest places to do it, Affiliate. Probably next, probably the Agency. I know a lot of Ecomm people will probably fight me on that and that's fine, that's totally fine. We all have our own opinions and that's perfect.

 

The model I'm following and I just wanted to walk you guys through why I do what I do. And what my logic has been behind each one of them is... profit margin potential out of the gate, not tricks, not little tips. Profit margin potential out of the gate - what is it?

 

I'll do the little tips and tricks and stuff like that, and I do and it goes even higher, but I don't want to bank on those. That's why I didn't run into Ecomm. I almost ran into Ecomm... I just about did Ecomm, but that's the reason I didn't right out the gate.

 

Again, not telling you not to, but that's the reason I didn't was ‘time to fulfill.’ I was like, "Man I just want to "do revenue generating activities, but what I'm constantly managing a product for someone else. I’d collected the cash already but I can't "actually do anything with it cause my hands "are tied, my time is tied because I can't actually "go do, I have to fulfill.

 

I don't know if I want to marry the Agency/service model. It was a great place for me to go for quite a while honestly, to vet out and prove who I was and what I was doing and that I could do it, which the market obviously needed to see, why would they not?

 

I got my testimonials from there, I got, that's what launched me in to being able to work next to Russell. In fact, that's one of the first things he asked when I sat down face to face with him.

 

Actually before I even got there, he's like, "Have you "been building funnels?" I said, "Yeah." He's like, "What are the URLs?" Boom, blasted over like 20 URLs over to him. Look at all these funnels I've done, look at all the stats here we go, boom, and when I sat down, he was like sick, okay, cool. He didn't say sick. He was like, "Okay, cool, awesome." You've actually done this. I didn't start from ground 0. But it's because I actively was trying to prove that I could do it. So anyway, that's the path I took, hopefully it helps?

 

Sit back, figure out where you're trying to go and those are some of the, when you're just talking about generating cash flow, I'm not talking about change the world products, I'm talking about you making money, for you. Change your own life before you go trying to change the world. It’s way easier, do it that way.

 

I want to change the world and I plan to. I don't know how yet. But first I'm changing my world so that I have the ability and power to change the world afterwards.

 

So this is the path I took with that intent in mind and it's been working really well. And we haven't had a negative month yet and I don't think we will. Anyway, things have been going great. I really appreciate it .

 

Thanks for listening, please rate and review the podcast. Please share it, we'd love to have more people on. For those of you guys who are on iTunes, I do film these now, if you want to see the graph I just drew, go to my YouTube channel if you want to see - it’s just ‘Steven Larson’, that's the name of my YouTube channel.

 

If you're on You Tube and you're like, "Hey, I would rather just listen to these," go to iTunes. A lot of you guys on Instagram, I know these get pushed to you as well.

 

Bloggers, what's up. You guys can come out to any of these platforms as well. We push out now to, it's over, it's like 25 different platforms. Just know that the others exist and excited to have you guys. Thanks so much, talk to you later. Bye!



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