I'm finding comfort and joy sometimes in the ambiguity of their opportunities, but sometimes like you don't know and being able to be comfortable in that ambiguity opens up incredible opportunity because you listen differently, you reframe a little bit. This is the Knockin' Doors Down podcast. I'm your host Jason the Chance, and here we unlock stories of resilience, triumph, and transformation. Hey, please hit that subscribe button on whatever platform you're on, and while you're at it, why not leave a rating or review. And my guest is Betsy Frost, the CEO of Hoplark, a non-alcoholic beverage brand brewing hot teas and waters like craft beer to make health conscious people's wellness journeys more flavorful and exciting. I personally got to try it, and it is amazing. Betsy and I have an awesome conversation that includes connecting with nature and how vital that is. Being conscious of positive opportunities that come our way and embracing them, we discuss finding comfort and joy in the ambiguity of situations, the vital importance of the mentor/mentee relationships in our lives, as well as talking about finding strength and letting others in. We also talk about the origins of Hoplark and the work she's doing, plus fun random questions, and Betsy leaves us with some amazing final thoughts. Betsy Frost, the CEO of Hoplark, thank you for joining me on Knockin' Doors Down. Thank you for having me. Oh, it's my pleasure, and as a matter of fact, I'm going to crack open, I got the sparkling hop tea, calm one with chamomile. And so, you know, some mornings I got a little anxiety, we're recording in the afternoon here, but hey, this is delicious, so I'm going to enjoy this while I ask you about gratitude. I start my day with it, so three things you're grateful for today. Well, today I'm actually grateful for being here and getting to talk about our awesome company. I'm super grateful I'm actually away with my family right now at the beach, and my parents are here, which is amazing. I live in Minnesota, so to see water, to see the beach, the ocean is amazing. And I'm just super grateful for where I am right now. I had an amazing, which we probably can talk about, of a coach, and I had an amazing session yesterday, and just a breakthrough of like, oh, I got this. Like, I'm feeling good, and I just feel very grateful for that feeling. That is a wonderful, wonderful feeling, and when you can work with others, or even a mentor-mentee relationship, but I'm with you on the beach. I grew up near it in Monterey, California, and I'll tell you, the beach is much nicer than the waters of Lake Minnetonka. So, you know. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I grew up in the East Coast, and I live in the middle of the country now, our company is based out of Boulder. So, I'm grateful that I get to like, go see mountains, for sure. There's like something that's remarkable about mountains, but there's something about the beach for me that like, cannot be, cannot be compared. Yeah. Well, and it's that importance of connection with nature. You know, Betsy, I know your story did different than mine. Obviously, you know, me in recovery, but that nature component, I think, is so vital that so many people are missing. I mean, I don't know about you. I got, I got teenagers, and I got one like, "Hey, let's go for a walk. Just go barefoot on our grass or something." It's like, "Yeah, geez, Dad." Yeah. Totally. I mean, I didn't really grow up a lot in nature. I mean, I grew up like playing sports and being outside a lot, but in college, I was actually a geology major, and had to go spend three months out in the desert, like mapping rocks, and like, literally just like, lived in the wilderness for three months. And there was just something that like, connected clicked for me about being outside. And oddly, I don't really raise my child that way. We like to call my husband the great endorsman, which is hilarious, but we actually sent our kid to, I have a seven year old, to go to like an outdoor focused elementary school. And just how you learn outside, how you see things, how you just like are able to, you know, connect with yourself, but also feel something different in the world. I mean, I definitely feel that in Colorado. Everyone in our company isn't like, chose Colorado because they live outside. And there's just some energy that comes from it that's amazing. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. One, I think that's awesome that you're doing that with your daughter, because I mean, one of the things I'll go and I'll speak with the generally teenagers junior senior year of high school. And, you know, that electronic device devices is such a hook that so many people are just, I mean, I'm guilty as charged at times. I run a bunch of social media accounts and it's like, oh, you know, I just, yeah. So I think that detachment is vital. Yeah, it absolutely is. And I mean, I say that she's also completely addicted to YouTube. Although like, you know, make ourselves feel better. She was just diagnosed with dyslexia and we're like, oh, she's just using that as a way to learn. Right, that's me making myself like, oh, no, no, no, this is just a learning tool. Hey, you know what, I'm on your side because I am dyslexic and I always learned so much more from videos. For instance, I've got a car. I've been doing some modifications to pop on YouTube. See what the other guys doing much easier than reading the directions, much easier. Seriously, I mean, she learned how to play dolls by watching videos and like now can do it for two to three hours by yourself at a time, which is unbelievable. But you're like, huh, there's something a little useful. I'll just like make myself feel better about that. Well, I'm always fast. I mean, your story, not only starting Hoplark and I mean, you and the team have won some amazing awards and you're formerly with dry soda co and really grew that brand, but you worked at General Mills prior to that. So I'm kind of interested what little Betsy was like to go from geology into working for General Mills. Yeah, well, it's kind of a long and winding story. I'll try and make as quickly as possible. But like when I was growing up, I never knew what I wanted to be. I kind of, I never saw a past college. It was like getting into college and, you know, now with the path of, or the path around with my daughter and learning all about the way that she learns, you learn a lot about yourself. And I probably had some undiagnosed dyslexia because of the amount of effort I always had to put into something. I was constantly memorizing. And so it was just this huge kind of push to get into college. And then I had no idea what I was going to do after. And my, my dad had pretty amazing wisdom. When I went to school, I went to a liberal, big liberal art school and he's like, you're not going to learn anything practical here. Like, this is not a job school. But your job is to go to every class and to learn how to think differently. And so I took geology and then urban studies. So thinking on million year scope and then like, what are we doing in this environment today. And I had taken my identity, my geology field study and then I took my first semester senior year off and traveled around the country doing dating violence and sexual assault peer education. So like road rules with a purpose. There are like eight of us in a van, go into 36 states. And I came back to school and I was like, my only goal is not to work for corporate America and to live someplace I've never lived before. And my parents were like, get a job. I had just like bailed out of a master's program in geology and go get jobs. So I found this random job in economic development in Sonoma County, California, which was like a 14 month gig. I did that and in the late 90s, I joke, I did my government work and then I moved to DC and joined a startup. So I was like completely opposite everyone. And then ended up at this company called the Motley Fool, which is about investment education and making things accessible and really working for my first purpose driven company. And I was there for a few years, had my quarter life crisis was like, what do I do? I'm like, well, I'm kind of good at school, but I knew I didn't want to be a doctor or a lawyer or a specialist. And so I was like, I'm kind of doing business now. Well, when I go to business school and I'll start my own version of the Motley Fool. So everyone in my life has their life around things that they're passionate about. Like my mom was in her school teacher and my dad like loves soccer, my brother's a ballet dancer, my sister in second grade. So she was going to change at the educational system, which is what she's doing, my cousins and artists. And I was like, what's my thing? Like, I got to find my thing and then like, I'll make my life about that thing. And I went to school and I realized that it wasn't like a thing or a topic, but it was this process of building things, building teams, building people, building opportunities. And so what do I do? I go to a big company, which is like totally the opposite. But someone was like, go get a big name on your resume. This is one time you can do it. And then you can always take that award and go small. And so I went to Mills with the expectation that I would be there for two years. It was like a postdoc. Anyone can do that. And what ended up happening was I kept getting opportunities because you rotate. So, you know, I started in food service and then I was on Cheerios and then Oda Passo. And at the end of every year, I would go and apply for new jobs and see what was out there and what else I wanted to do. And I kept getting opportunities to grow inside Mills and do things that I wasn't, I couldn't find elsewhere. Like I got to start a new product incubator and how does a big company become disruptive. And the answer is like you should acquire those companies. But that like let me create a mentorship program between marketers and our R&D folks and entrepreneurs. And through that, I started mentoring a lot of entrepreneurs and I had kind of a portfolio of advisory companies on the side. My husband was starting his company. So I was like itching my entrepreneurial, you know, or scratching my entrepreneurial itch through all of these other people. And then eventually laugh to do that on my own. And during that time when I was at Mills, I had met this woman, Cheryle Klaus, who ran or started dry soda. We met at a women's forum and became close friends. And she had been trying to get me to come work with her at dry for, you know, eight-ish years. And when I left Mills, she was like, "Okay, let's work together." And I was like, "That sounds like a terrible idea." But we, you know, did a consulting gig and it was super fun and got to jump into a business that actually was in the sober, curious space way before it was a space. She started dry when it was '05, when the space was about, you know, recovery and pregnancy and had ridden a number of waves. And through that time, kind of let consumers define what the product was. And when I joined in '18, like sober curiosity was hitting the U.S. and all these new product categories were coming out. And, you know, the challenge was how do you reinvent the OG brand to now be relevant amidst all of this innovation? And so we did a ton of fun stuff. We wrote the guide for Europroof Packpales. We, you know, launched a bunch of innovation that gave us things to talk about in the marketplace and really put her front and center as one of the OG's and then work to partner with brands around. And when I left there, I was like, cool. Where you are now may not be where you came from. The choices you make today may spiral out of control or spin you in the right direction. Discover a riveting, true story of how Carlos Vira nearly destroyed his life and lived to tell about it. Stand up, stand firm, believe, make it happen and live through the madness. Knock indoors down along the way and don't miss others telling their powerful stories in our podcast. Visit kddmediacompany.com. I'm never doing that much again. It is a bananas industry. Yes. It's so competitive. It is cutthroat. It's ruthless. It's the hardest thing to run. Fighting for shelf space and every other. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's not sad, right? And then Poplar came to me and I knew of Poplar because of dry. And Dean Eberherst started it in 2018. He stopped drinking while he was doing Whole 30. He moved from Chicago out to Boulder being out in nature, like literally walking through the field, which is why it's named half lark because he was constantly hearing the lark thing. But he had done something remarkable is like when he wasn't drinking, he didn't miss beer, but he missed the complexity in the aroma of hot. I was like, why does beer get to hold this ingredient hostage and reinvented how brewing has been done for thousands of years to isolate that delicacy of this amazing plant? And what's remarkable to me about it is in beverage, which is completely filled with like flavors and extracts and sweeteners, having been in food for so long. You know, food's been growing from simple ingredients from the last 30 years, but there's nothing like that in beverage outside of alcohol. And what Poplar has done is create these remarkably bold tasting flavors with just three to four real, cool ingredients. I mean, it's literally just the plants brewed. And, you know, giving you this really fun, interesting experience. Like you're having calm right now. Every time I open one during the day, there's like a little bit of joy. You're like, oh, that's interesting, right? It makes you pause and kind of think about the day. All with zero calories, zero sugars, zero carbs, zero alcohol. And it's like, it's not just taking something away or replacing it. It feels like you're adding something positive to your world. So that's how I ended here. I mean, it is a long story of, you know, my, I mentioned my coach. We were talking about it yesterday of a willingness when a door opens that you don't expect to say, yeah, sure. I'll take a peek in there and see what it can look like. And kind of being open to doors opening or looking in a different direction than I might have thought that was my path has kind of dictated this path that I'm on now. Oh, I understand. Hey, I didn't expect to have this stuff on my resume, you know, like, you know, if you had told 25 me that alcohol was even going to become a problem. And then, but, you know, you'll talk to Charlie Sheen, one of your acting idols at some point on this podcast and be a sober coach. And, you know, it's like, yeah, but I think you said something that's so vital for everyone. And we preach it in recovery meetings, people that I've sponsored or recovery coaching, is it is so vital to be open to opportunities that are presented to you. It's so important in life to like it be conscious of that. Like, you know, I, as someone that lived subconsciously for near a darn decade, you know, when you have these things, these are important to seize opportunities or step into a little bit and look around the, yeah, okay, I don't think that's going to be it. And there's going to be something else over here. Yeah, the other part of that is like finding comfort and joy sometimes in the ambiguity of their opportunities, but sometimes like, you don't know. And being able to be comfortable in that ambiguity opens up incredible opportunity because you listen differently, you reframe a little bit. You think about, you can define where you want to go, but being open to the how you get there has been, I don't know, it's not only worse for me, but it's like, just made me a happier person because you let go of the stress of like, I have to, I have to have an answer. I have to be this way. I have to show up this way and like, no, I'm just going to figure it out. It's okay not to know. And just like being okay and that like ambiguity has helped me a lot. Yeah, no, thank you for sharing that. And I think a lot of people, you tell me, I mean, I'm kind of isolated in the space and the people that I tend to work with and around, but I'm seeing a greater embrace of people going, it's okay to make a mistake, mess up. Matter of fact, messing up is great. I love messing up. I tell my kids, mess something up, like, you know, break the rules, not the law. Like mess some stuff up, you know, and I'm seeing more of an embrace in that and people understanding that not just with workplace, but life. And I mean, you know, like in relationships, we mess up a little bit. And talking something terrible, like you step out on your partner, but we say the wrong thing or something. And, you know, it's like, oh, goodness, I just learned something vital about my partner in that moment or friend, co-worker, whatever it is. You know, it's important to embrace that part of being human. Totally. I mean, it's definitely, we talk a lot about it at work because to be an entrepreneurial company, you have to go try things. And you get to break some eggs and they all don't work. I mean, I think everyone would love to be sitting here telling me how I built this story. And it sounds like, of course it worked out that way. That was an amazing series of amazing decisions that you made that totally work because you're so smart. And the answer is like, no. It is, you know, it's always in the gray of you just think that you've made it. And then something happens and comes at you. And, you know, to build an actual brand that's meaningful to people, you got to go out and you got to, you got to try things. And most of it's not going to work. And you got to, it's about like, it's almost about the volume of things that you try. And then eventually one works, right? That's kind of the old sales adage is it doesn't matter. And it doesn't matter how many yeses you get, how many no's because that means you're out there making all the calls and pushing people to like, it's okay. Try it. Like you're not, as you said, like there are some big mistakes. But I think people overestimate what feels like a big mistake. You should be making mistakes every day, which means that we are trying something new and like pushing the boundaries. And like, as a brand like Hoplark, everything pushes the boundaries. Everything's weird about it. Like I'm drinking hops during the day, not beer. Kind of tastes like beer, but it doesn't really taste like beer. Some of it doesn't taste like beer at all. Like there's a bird on this. What is this thing, right? I will throw this in real quick, Betsy. One of the things that I like about it, like when I was in my drinking periods in life, beers with hops would often upset my stomach. And I'm sure alcohol and I mean, this does not. It's like a really nice, it is very different. Like I didn't know what to expect. I'm like, damn, this is good stuff here. So, but yeah, it is that risking willing to go out there. And I think we always think of innovation as an external thing. And it's not. We constantly redefine ourselves and change and go through metamorphosis and all kinds of different experiences through life. And how fun, right? Like that you don't have to be who you are right now, Merle, for the next day. Like there's so much that you can explore and be and do that. Like the idea that like this is just part of me on the path that I'm on. And like, I've got so much more to, you know, uncover or figure out or be and make more. And that, you hit it on the head. One of the things that I'll often tell newcomers to recovery is you're not under any obligation to be the person you were five minutes ago. Like you don't owe that to anyone. You want to change. If we're positive, just empowering decision, mind you, go for it. It's all up to you. Make it happen. Totally. I mean, it's fun. Yeah. Even the bad stuff, right? Like. Yeah. That's the cool thing about, you know, for me, where I'm at in life is I'll tell people, yeah, I used to experiment with chemicals. Now I experiment with just myself in life. So that I kind of want to, I want to ask you about, um, you're doing some women mentorship, the, the one step closer program slash Jedi network and I'm a Star Wars fan. So I come back, but, uh, can you tell me a little bit about that work? Cause, uh, I don't think any of us have the growth that is necessary without a solid mentor mentee relationship, and you've got to be both. Totally. Yeah. I mean, um, mentor circles has been a large part. I mean, in general, mentor short shift has been a large part of my life. I mean, there's someone in every stage that continues to walk with me in some way or has helped me see things in a different way. Um, and so that has always been kind of a part of, um, who I am. I think part of it comes from playing sports and just like working as a team. Um, and was a take to connect to individuals, but it general mills. We had these women mentor circles, which I think were way ahead of their time of connecting. It started with women and marketing and then I ran the organization, um, for the, uh, entire company of women and leadership of finding support through other coworkers of different levels of not only how to manage the organization, but how to think about your career, how to show up differently. Um, and one step closer in Jedi is in, is a nonprofit organization trying to help, uh, increase diversity in the natural food space as well as, um, you know, incorporate sustainability to the way that we operate across the board. And as far as that, my friend, Angie Rossi had gone to them and said, we did this thing at Mills that was amazing. Have you guys thought about mentor circles? Um, and she started it four years ago. I've been co leading with her for the last three years. And the intent of our circles is to give only, uh, so women who are the only in their level, in their company, in their function, the, um, community to connect with others. And what we find is, uh, there's a lot of one on one that happens. And that happens what we do a circle every month and just the, um, openness. When people come as themselves and like give themselves this hour and a half, two hours of space to say, I need help with this thing. Uh, and then the power that in the empowerment that you get by sharing ideas or sharing your troubles and just coming together and during your wisdom gives you empowerment of like, I can do this. Seeing that everyone else is actually working on the same thing says, oh, well, maybe, maybe an imposter syndrome is ridiculous. Everyone in this room feels like they have imposter syndrome. Like, well, then maybe it shouldn't be a thing, right? Uh, we stay together through the year. Um, and it's been, it's been a remarkable experience for me. I feel incredibly lucky and honored too. I've been asked to leave these circles. Um, but we continue to grow them year on year. I mean, I think people are starting to like you walk out and then you're like, no, you should go do that and share with your friend and bring them in. So we take new applications every January and February. Um, but it's a remarkable experience and really how people develop and grow. Like, usually you bring a problem at the beginning of the year of like, here's something I want to develop, whether it's personal or work related. And within the year, I mean, there is every year people change jobs. Like, amazing things happen in their lives. There's like constant change. And so you really walk away being like, oh, I'm constantly changing. And my, the more that I am open to that and the more I let people into that, the stronger I become and the more open I am to that change. And kind of, that's kind of the scene that you see year on year. Um, out of the circle. Have you dug into the archives of past Knocking Doors Down podcast episodes? The Knocking Doors Down podcast archive is available to you for free. Check it out. Here's a snippet from when Charlie Sheen was on the podcast. AA is not the best place for, um, for a famous atheist. I kept looking for that in chapter. What? You know, so yeah, um, but it's not on one size fits all. You know, it's like, it's like saying that we all think the same. Like our brains are built the same. They're just not right now. There's, there's such uniqueness involved. Check out this episode and so many more in the Knocking Doors Down archive. And while you're at it, hit that subscribe button. Give this video a thumb up, leave a comment, and share with somebody else that you know will get value out of the Knocking Doors Down podcast. But see, isn't there, isn't community a beautiful thing because hearing you talk about that, people ask, you know, what I get out of, you know, being a part of 12-step fellowships and groups. Same as what you just shared, that, that beauty of not only seeing other people grow, going through the things like, you know, imposter syndrome or whatever it may be. And, and, you know, sitting in thinking, boy, I haven't done anything. Nothing's changed. And then all of a sudden you have somebody else and a little one-on-one that reflects back to you, how much they've seen you grow. And that's just such the beautiful thing about community and just wanting to be good to other people, be of service is what we call it. And just, yeah, just be there, just be of help, be of service, you know. It's amazing. We do make people write a letter to themselves and then we hold it and then we send it to them a year later. And it's such a fun exercise to be like, well, look where I was. And, or, you know, what I said to myself a year ago versus where I'm sitting right now, which is just a fun thing to do with a friend or in these groups. It's a good way to like shine a light on how much you are growing all the time. And, and leave yourself a little, a little gift. Yeah. Well, do you have any personal takeaways that you might be willing to share or stuff that transformations that you saw personally yourself? Maybe it's not just an outward perspective, but, but the perspective upon yourself. Yeah, I mean, I think for me, there's been a few major like shifts. Some of them is in this like world of my life is integrated with business. Like work, work, life balance is not a thing to me. And I'm okay with that. That's like, I am very much projected of the work that I do. And for me, work, life balance becomes, can I be my true self at work that I am not holding world in two places. And I think, you know, I had said that for years, even when I was at General Mills. And I knew it was time for me to leave when I was putting so much energy into who I needed to show up as at work. And it felt so different from who I was at home. And this idea of being a truly one integrated person, even though, you know, there are different norms at different places. And, you know, you do have to kind of adapt it to be a good person to others and to show up for other people for sure. But this idea of being a single integrated person, and like, you don't have a work life and a home life, it's life. And when you can think about it that way, for me, it has been released because it's not like I have work stress and I have home stress. Like, stress is stress and it can lead over into different things. And being integrated to acknowledge that and come into a meeting and say, hey, I just want you guys to know, like, I've got these nine things going on at home right now. And so, like, if I'm short or feel like I'm not paying attention, it's not you. I am like trying to put all that aside and be as present as I can right now. I may or may not do it well. And like, you know, the first time I did that, I was like, am I being an over sharing? I'm definitely not where we need to be. And then I was like, the meeting went amazing, because no one was reading into what I was doing or, or, you know, reading into how I was acting. And now, like, how to live that integrated life really was a large part that came out of some of my work within the circle. And I have a professional coach. But that's now how I lead. And I try to bring it home to, as I say, I literally work from my home. So it is as integrated as it possibly can be. But it's okay, like, if my kid runs behind me or I got to get a door or, like, life happens all the time and to, and to approach it as a integrated person has just been really freeing. And my energy then goes to creating new things, not trying to show up as someone who I'm not. And taking that acceptance was kind of, it's also hard to be like, oh, no, no, this is just who I am. And when you get over saying, like, it feels hard because, like, is this who I want to be? It's like, no, this is who you are. It can change, as we were talking about, but this is who I am and this is how I'm going to, like, show up and this is how I'm going to be at all times. And to take the energy out of trying to be someone else has freed up that energy to do all kinds of, like, positive creation things, versus that energy was being used, like, destructively, whether that's stress or worrying or, you know, destructive behaviors. It doesn't really matter, but, like, letting that go to use it to create versus destroy has been an amazing gift. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I think that's, that's that importance of being able to have a good level of consciousness about oneself. And I personally, I think that's great that you go in and you can, by going in and letting people in on, hey, these things are going on. I just want to make you guys aware. So maybe if something, you know, goes in one ear out the other, I have to ask again, please don't take it personal. I think immediately you create a great space with that other person that they're not going to feel devalued. And, you know, I always say, don't take it, you know, don't take things personal. It's hard not to at times, especially when we have good interpersonal relationships at work and we like our coworkers. But I think it really it's, it's just a wonderful form of communication because we're going through so many different emotions all the time. And if we can't do a good job of giving someone else like a framework of where we're at, you know, it's, you don't know how to carry the interaction in the movie. What did I do? It's, it's an incredibly valuable thing, but I think that just comes in importance of communication and creating a work environment because I can tell that if you communicate that way and somebody else does, even as a CEO, you're understanding of that. But mind you, you're not saying excuses to not do or be there or whatever else it is. It's just, yeah, I might lack a little bit here in this space or whatever it is. I think that's a necessity. I think there's too much of the old show up, shut your mouth, get your job done and, you know, put on this thing that you're not, you know, I know I can't do it. I mean, I feel like I'm too short not to be passionate about the things that you do. So if you care about it, then you care about showing up and doing the stuff. And if you don't care about it, like, I used to hold on to people at all costs. Like, I can help you love this thing, or I can help you develop out of this, or, you know, like, we're going to, you really need to, like, do this differently to, you know, be rewarded in this job. And you had a point where you're like, it doesn't click, and you don't like it. There's a lot of other stuff to do. So, like, how can we help you find the thing that you love so then someone can come in here and do what they love. And if it doesn't click, it doesn't click. Like, let's just go find you the thing that does, which has been a real, like, interesting metamorphist for me as a leader instead of being like, no, you have to fit in this. You have to fit in this box to be like, oh, well, maybe, maybe you're playing with the wrong box. And like, that is totally fine. And it's helped me find people who really want to be there, who enjoy operating in our, in our company. And if they don't like it, I'm more than happy to go help you find what the next thing is, and how freeing that is for people to then show up at themselves and actually find the thing that clicks. So, when they're in the room, they do want to pay attention, and they do want to, you know, contribute and do the best that they can because they found the thing that fits for them. I think that's an interesting thing is when like, when you feel like everything is hard. How can you step back and be like, it may not be me, it just might be the wrong fit. No, I agree with yourself. You've just got to change the situation, you know. Yeah, and I had many of those things throughout the years until I, I just know now where I'm at in life of a middle aged man, I have to be in a creative space. I just do. I know who I am. I know I'd be miserable if it was put on a suit and tie or khakis in a polo every day and make sure you're at the office by 830, and you're going to take your lunch from noon to one. It would be effing miserable Betsy. I could not do it. And I love to be around other creatives, but I also am appreciative now of the people that can do that, you know, and do. I'd like to or want to, like, you know, there's some amazing stability and there's structure and it can be an enabler for other things that you want. And I appreciate that too. I don't. It's not me, but I appreciate it. My partner, she's amazing organization and everything. It's like, go ahead, babe, you do your thing. Like, like, you're fine with me. I'm like, look, if it was me and like, I was just a, you know, a single guy, I'd probably have like two plates, two spoons, two forks tonight, you know, like, yeah, just put it like, I don't hold the same value. But I respect and support those things in the way that you value them. Totally. Totally. And, yeah, and that's a good thing. Sometimes we don't have not every value matches up. Well, before we jump into fun random questions, I ask you for some final thoughts and words of encouragement. Hoplark, people want to check it out. Learn more about it. What's the easiest way? Easiest way is go to hoplark.com. You can buy it direct from our website. We also have a limited release program every month on our.com platform, which is super fun, like all kinds of random stuff this year. This month we're doing an NA breakfast beer. We just did a Hugh melon. We're about to do a Mexican lager in July. We've done sodas in the past, so unsweetened zero calorie sodas just by brewing the ingredients. So a lot of fun stuff and limited release can also find us nationwide at Whole Foods and most retailers in the ready to drink tea set and sparkling water. And then you can find our hoplark 0.0, which is our beer styles, hot water beer styles in the NA beer set. Yeah, and they're delicious. I personally, like I said to you, I can enjoy the non-alcoholic beers. It's not a trigger for me. But I have actually had friends that, and they weren't even necessarily sober curious per se, but I'm going to save a couple for my best for him because he's, you know, as we get older, hey, alcohol is just bad for you. That's why it's called pick your poison. It's terrible. And as you get older, you know, everybody thinks, oh, my hangover's gone. I'm fine. No, that alcohol, I'm going to tell you, hasn't left your body, just a little hint here. And it's such a wonderful alternative. And, you know, I was out working on my car the other day. And I had one of the beers that you kindly sent me the non-alcoholic hoplar beer flavor, beer flavor. I don't know how you'd want to classify it. But it was like, it was nice. Here I am. I'm working on my car. I'm having what I would consider an adult beverage. But there's good. There's no negative consequence to this for one. And it's just like, it's good. So yeah, I really dig the brand. So you definitely have a client, for sure, for me for now. But I definitely highly recommend people check it out if you're so even so precarious. Or just want a nice alternative, maybe to a sparkling water or whatever else it is. They're wonderful. Yeah, it just creates an elevated, like even instead of sparkling water to have something a little bit more interesting in the day, a little bit more elevated. I had someone tell me, I love having hoplar get lunch because I feel like I'm doing something really naughty. But I'm actually doing something really good. I know I kind of had that feeling when I cracked this one because it's not yet noon where I'm at as of this recording was like, oh yeah, no. All right, these are fun random questions just to have some laughs and giggles. Don't overthink it too much. If you could have dinner with any one person living or not, who would it be? Oh, goodness. Yeah, it's good. It's because you want to hear him say, Betsy, it's a pleasure to meet you. I do. I mean, I'm just curious on his take on life. He seems like a very introspective, but funny human being that has obviously a deep understanding of our world today. And now, now, you know, outside of his political world, like, how does he see the world around him as an ex president? Just super curious on his take. What do you think your greatest achievement is? It is my greatest achievement. Good question. I think it's this is stupid. I think it's just kind of being like, I feel like I am in a place where I'm not trying to be more than I am and I'm not judging myself for not being a man. Or not being something else or for being who I am. I just feel, I feel really comfortable on the journey. And I, I don't think there's anything, I mean, you can do big stuff and you can create stuff, you can win stuff, but like, I just feel comfortable. I don't think I've ever heard a better answer. That is, that is like, I like myself. I love myself. I love the life that I have, the ups and downs, just like, that is the being. That is like the most just zen in the moment. Here it is, you know, stoic, like, that is, I don't know. That's a mic drop. I know you don't have a mic, but drop that. All right, we'll do two more random questions. Do you have an interest or hobby that people might be surprised to learn about? For instance, I love to build Legos. Well, I'm not really a hobby person. I'll say that. I tell everyone that my hobby is collecting interesting people. That is what I spend most of my time doing. I do have one, I mean, I play Candy Crush like nobody's business. I'm on level 4,596. I've been playing the same game for, you know, seven years. And then I, the other new one that I just picked up is I actually draw, I put a drawing in my kids lunch every day. And so I take two hours every week and I hand draw notes for her for the week, which I'm not a very good artist or drawer, but it's become, you know, for the last two years, she just finished first grade. It's become a, I don't know, fun hobby that like I never thought I'd get into. Oh, that's beautiful. And you know what? She's never going to forget that. I don't know. I don't even think she reads them anymore. I was like, I'm going to stop doing this. I'll tell you a true story. So my grandfather, my dad's dad, he used to always every time he would visit, bring my brother and I, like a new Star Wars figure, or I was in the GI Joe as a kid. And unfortunately him and my dad had falling out for a few years, and that hurt. And it wasn't the not getting the thing. It was the understanding that my grandfather took the time to go to the store, paid attention to make sure he didn't buy the same thing and would come, I mean, once a week or at least, and it was just like, wow. Yeah, and I didn't, that's like, yeah, the longer I've been sober, I'm getting more memories back like a child like, oh my God, that really crushed me and, you know, and I remember asking where's grandpa and nobody would answer me. It's like, oh, come on. I'm going to write a book someday. Well, this has been an absolute pleasure. I'm glad that we were able to connect and really appreciate all the insight. We'll have to do it again in some capacity, even if it's not on here at some point. Amazing. I really appreciate it. It's been a super fun time and I appreciate the time to share a little bit about Applar chat with you. It's just been a blast. Yeah, this is where I give you, I, I jokingly say the Jerry Springer moment of closing out the show of anything that you would want to lend, you know, positive or encouraging, maybe even a recent lesson that you've had in life or whatever. Yeah, I just end it with, you got this, you know, have a little bit of fun. Find a way to smile a little bit every day. And even if you feel like you've got to fake it till you make it, smiling and like telling a joke and saying like, all right, I'm going to find something positive to do, baking your way to positivity is like the best trick in the book. Because if you pretend and just even practice it, it starts to show up, even when you're not looking for it. And so, just, you know, smile at somebody else, like it's shocking how much you'll like freak them out. And then you're like, it's kind of fun to see what happens when you smile at someone else. And all of a sudden you start doing it. I love it. Again, the brand Hoplark, the link is in the podcast description, go and check it out. I can't give it enough, but like if I was a reviewer, it'd be like 20 gold stars seriously it's a wonderful product and, and I'll definitely be getting some more. Betsy Frost, thank you again appreciate you so very much. Thank you, have a great day. You too. And on that note, remember no outside solutions to inside problems and keep knocking doors down.
