Journey to Truth

EP 217 - Andrew Basiago: Tales of a Time Traveler-Project Pegasus - Mars Missions - Massive Cover Up

Originally aired on 11/3/22
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Andrew Basiago:
Andrew Basiago, J.D., is a licensed attorney with the State of Washington who claims to have participated in classified programs involving time travel and space time portals since 1967 when he was 6 years old. He was exposed into these programs by his father who worked for a major engineering corporation that was given contracts to develop these exotic technologies — the Ralph M. Parsons company. From 1969 to 1972, Andrew says he was formally recruited into a time travel project called Pegasus that was funded by the CIA and the forerunner to the Defense Advance Research Projects Agency.

Duration:: 2h 13m
Broadcast on:: 11 Jul 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

(soft music) - Hey guys, welcome back. A few things before we get started tonight. Just a reminder, Star Seated Ventures Conference, Sedona, Arizona, December 11th through the 16th, those tickets are available in the link below, starseedadventures.com. It's gonna be great, you guys have heard us talking about it. A lot of our friends are gonna be there. Go check it out, it's gonna be a great time. That link is below. Don't forget Hopewell Farms CBD. If you're looking to try a new CBD oil, I highly recommend it. They have other great products too. You can get 10% off all their products with promo code Journey to truth 10. And the Omnia Radiation Balancer, a patch you put on any radiating device, cell phone, computer, wifi router. It balances the frequency coming in and actually turns it into something beneficial to your body. It doesn't block it, but it balances, harmonizes it. And it's some really great technology. A lot of people love it. They have patches and now they have pendants you can wear around your neck. That link is below in the description, 10% off all those products with promo code truth, all caps. And don't forget about our Teespring merchandise. You can get 20% off all of our shirts and merchandise indefinitely since Teespring decided to raise all their prices. We have to, I know it's crazy. But you can get 20% off all that merchandise with promo code 20 and back. That being said, today we are joined by Andrew Bishago. And most of you guys may know him as a time traveler from Project Pegasus, but there's so much more to it than that. He's been on hundreds of interviews at this point. His most recent ones, I believe, have been with Dr. Michael Sala. And I highly recommend going back and watching all those. I think it was a four part series where he got in depth. He got into his testimony in depth and they really covered some great ground there. And we're gonna, for the sake of not repeating all the old same interviews, we're gonna get into some new stuff today. So if you really wanna hear his full story, you can go back and check out those interviews. I recommend it. But welcome to the show, Andrew. - Good to be with you. - Yeah, great, we're glad to have you. I've been looking forward to this one. Just for the people who don't know who you are, would you mind just giving a brief synopsis of your testimony and how you ended up here talking about this stuff today? - Well, I basically, you know, my standard biography that I'm using now, 'cause I've lived in a, I'm 61, and I've lived an accomplished life. But basically what I've been saying is that I'm the American lawyer, admitted to the Washington State Bar Association and the US District Court for the Western District of Washington, writer, media personality, public speaker, and presidential candidate, best known for serving as a US chrononaut in Project Pegasus during the advent of time travel and Project Mars during the advent of interdimensional travel. So I've appeared on national television in six countries on radio in 15 countries, primarily discussing the two things that I think were sort of my obligation to impart during my lifetime, 'cause they involved very unusual experiences that I think were actually of historical significance. One was serving in DARPA's Project Pegasus at the inception of time travel. We've had eight modalities of time travel by 1970, and I was involved in all of them. I was one of the children involved. And in that capacity, a lot happened. I became the American time traveler who went back in time to advise General George Washington in August of 1776 to retreat as troops from New York Harbor, which has always been a historical mystery. I can solve that mystery for David McCulloch and other writers about the revolutionary period by describing what happened, which is that the US government in the '70s sent kids back to advise Washington, that's a true story. Also in that capacity, I became the first American child to Tesla teleport. In 1967, '68, when I jumped through a Tesla teleporter at the old Curtis Wright Aeronautical Company facility in Woodridge, New Jersey, and popped out a few seconds later in Santa Fe, New Mexico. And doing such time travel, I was the first time travel from the future found in a photograph from the past, because when I was sent to the day Lincoln gave the Gettysburg Address and the location where he gave it in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, I was photographed. In fact, it was really a miracle that I was, because something like 95% of Civil War photographs were destroyed after the war when the panes of glass were used for greenhouses and they just faded in the sun. So I'm in Ken and Rick Burns, the Civil War, because the US government sent me back to Gettysburg, primarily as a favor or as a treat, kind of a reward for serving well in the project from 1968 to '72, that was in 1972. And I didn't contact Lincoln, but I'm in the so-called Josephine Cobb image of Lincoln at Gettysburg. I'm in the left front foreground of that prominent photograph, and Lincoln is sort of right over my shoulder, right at the back of the photograph, standing on the dais, probably sitting down upon arriving on the dais. - Right, I have that. - And I served. - That's the photo I'm using for the thumbnail for this video, actually, so people can go and check that out. - Yeah, that was identified as me by my father who had connections as a Defense Department Engineer to basically all agencies and departments of the intel community and the military. So that's not disputed, that's been known and identified essentially by CIA since 1972. In fact, when I showed that in a popular American news magazine to my late father, Raymond, at our home in Mars Ponce, New Jersey, I said, "Look dad, when you all sent me to Gettysburg, they got my picture of me." And he looked at it as he was reading his Sunday, New York Times on his easy chair and kind of pursed his lips and said, "Yep, just don't talk about it." So the US government is known for over 50 years that that is me from 1972 in that famous November 19th, 1863 photograph. And as a result, that is the only photograph in the National Archives of our great country that has been classified. And up until like 2007, it was the only known photograph of Lincoln in Gettysburg on the day he gave the Gettysburg Address there. I'm not kind of providing some kind of urban legend. I had arrived before I brought all this stuff forward. I had, for example, as a young man at age 25, written for Captain Jacques Cousteau. In fact, I was offered an opportunity to ghost write for Captain Cousteau. And I said, "No, if I'm gonna be in Clipso Log and Clipso Dispatch, I'd rather have my name on my writing, which I ended up doing. At the same time, I was working with the prominent American editor, Norman Cousins, a former speech writer for President Kennedy. And at the end of that three year period of being a colleague of Normans, he nominated me to be the editor of the Bulletin of the Atomic Scientist at like 25 years of age. Then I went on to go, complete my education at UCLA, go to law school and get my JD at Lewis and Clark Law School in Portland, Oregon. Then I picked up a master of sitting regional planning with distinction at Cal Poly Slow. And then as a result of my planning work in California, which was pretty advanced, I did, for example, specific plans for San Luis Obispo County, California and San Diego County, California. I was sent to Cambridge for a year where I studied land economy under Professor Malcolm John Grant who is now Sir Malcolm John Grant. And in that capacity, I became the 280th American to graduate from Magdalene College University of Cambridge since the year 1428. So I'm just citing those accomplishments just to contextualize the fact that I had arrived professionally long before I came forward. And I was practicing law as George and Ori on coast coast day, I'm used to always like to say, so I had arrived. There was no reason to make up urban legends or personal stories that were not true. They were true. And I was bringing them forward, because for a number of reasons. One is, as somebody from graduating from UCLA with a BA in American history, I thought that what I had done was important. For example, the American physicists that my dad and I were working with on Project Pegasus was Dr. Harold M. Agnew, essentially, the quintessential Project Manhattan physicist as well as other people like Dr. Edward Teller at the Los Alamos National Labs. And I also realized that if we're going to have a world better than what Governor Jerry Brown of California stated, which is, you know, 10 to 12 billion human beings, you know, crawling all over each other like ants in an ant colony. If overpopulation and environmental decline and energy decline really impacts us, I believed that I had a moral obligation to come forward and describe the benefits of Tesla teleportation. - Right. - So for example, every year in this country, we lose as many people to accidental death and have as many grievous injuries, 50,000 deaths, 300,000 grievous injuries, from automobiles, which is the people that we lost and who were severely injured in all 13 years of the Vietnam War. So I thought, wait a minute, if we can get people around the country and world in seconds rather than many hours, like in commercial passenger planes, we're really going to improve the quality of life for our fellow Americans and other citizens of our world. And we're going to confront the carbon crisis in an intelligent way rather than our sort of restrictive energy trading kind of scam. And so I really felt compelled to come forward at least on the Tesla teleportation because I felt we're going to be needing it and that I was one of the only surviving members of the program that applied it and essentially reduced it to practice and achieved it. - Right, right. - My dad had asked me to tell the story because he said we were involved in something great. So in 1989, a year before his death, he asked me to come forward after his death and tell my immediate family and then tell the world. And that's what I've been doing now for 20 years. - Yeah, and we appreciate that and your recall is incredible. So your memory is incredible. I know a lot of people, like I can't remember details of like anything that happened in my, like when I was 10 and you have this incredible recall of all that stuff. But I wanted to get into the modalities of time travel that you talk about, the eight different types. - Right. - Because I heard you talk about it in the past, like I believed a Tesla teleporter or one of them, you could only go back in time, you couldn't go back in time before the machine was invented or you'd never be able to come back or something along those lines. - Right. - But those are things we don't think about and then there's eight or seven different other modalities. And I was just wondering if you could touch on what some of those were. - Okay, well, the first one was remote viewing, which basically is psychic time travel, where you're seeing something at a distance, locationally and/or in terms of time. So I was working, as we're most of the kids brought into Project Pegasus as a remote viewer for the Office of Naval Intelligence. Beginning in fall of 1969, I remember one of the things we were asked to do, we were shown the Ensign, you know, a napolis graduation for Lieutenant Commander John Sidney McCain, who of course would become a prominent US Senator from Arizona. And we were shown his picture when he graduated and we were shown a photograph from ground view of one of the buildings at the POW compounded Vietnam, known as the Hanoi Hilton. And we were asked to go home for a week and dream about where John was being kept by bad people somewhere in the world and then tell them a week later what we had dreamed about. So that I believe was to either blow up the Hanoi Hilton to either kill Lieutenant Commander McCain or rescue him. Because his father, of course, John Sidney McCain, Sr. was the commander of the entire Pacific Fleet of the US Navy. So most of us began as remote viewers for the ONI and we would actually have another Lieutenant Commander, you know, from Washington, DC come to my school, Mount View Road School in Morris Plains, New Jersey and have us do remote viewing. And that was one of the tasks I remember that we did. And when it was a military task like that, we were never told how right we were. I tried to connect with Senator McCain in 2008 when he was ranked for president to talk about that, but he just simply was not successful at doing that, unfortunately. But we were, you know, I like to say that all of us began as remote viewers for ONI. We were small mediums at large. And then we were doing, they were spinning us to induce out-of-body experiences where we had kind of astral time travel. And I remember one time when I got to sort of this physical limit of my ability to go forward out of body, there was kind of like this railroad trestle or bridge. And when I told the lady from DARPA, which of course was working with us, they were handling us when we were in Pegasus as time travelers and doing the experiments on kids. She said to me regarding that weird black sort of railroad bridge that I couldn't get past when I was out of body, yes, Andy, others in the program are reporting that. We think it's the infrastructure generating the hologram in which we find ourselves. We're calling it the matrix. Now that was what, 29 years before the Wachowski Brothers released the first of the trilogy of the Matrix series with Keanu Reeves. So that's an example of how information and ideas from the Intel community and from the military have been dropped in science fiction, films, TV shows, books, short stories and so forth, even probably some of today's podcasts, since during and after World War II. So that was the second type was going out of body. Then there was a divide. - One second, I'm gonna ask you a follow-up question on that. You said they were spinning you. What do you mean by that? Were you like strapped to a table and they were spinning you at a high rate of speed or what was that? - Yeah, yeah, we were strapped to a table with our head towards the center of this round table on a stylus and we were looking up at wall strapped in so we couldn't be injured by being dislocated from that table. We were strapped in on our like our shoulders and knees and we were looking up at what looked like sort of a, what was that program by Rod Steiger? Twilight Zone, you know, the Twilight Zone spiral image. - The spiral, yeah. - Yeah, so as we were spinning and our head was in the middle, we were taught to look up at that sort of time, what was it again, the spiral? Yeah, the name of the show again. - Twilight Zone. - Twilight Zone, it's been too long since I've seen it. Anyway, so we were looking up at that spiral image and which clearly showed it had been used for a long time 'cause it was kind of on a poster that was full of old cellophane tape and just very ancient looking like they had used it for 30 years and we were taught to just sort of soften our gaze and when we would, we would sort of space out and then drop down seemingly for a couple feet and then we would pop out of body and actually go through the ceiling of the school and up into these higher astral realms. - Yeah, and I've seen it. - It could have been a Twilight Zone image but I just think it was just a weird spiral that they were using for that purpose. - And I think I've seen something along those lines depicted in a show or movie at one point but my memory is not serving me right now but I definitely think that's been depicted before and it makes sense. So what was the third modality that you experienced? - Well, the third is what's come to be called the Montauk Chair but the Montauk, Project Montauk was launched like 14 or 15 years later like in 1983 on like the 40 year return from the Philadelphia experiment of 1943, August 12th of 1943. So we were in something being called the chair. It was being set up by this young postdoc at our school named David. It may have been a young Dr. David Lewis Anderson, the time travel authority of today on one of the major ones. And we would basically be put on this sort of almost like dental chair and the original one had kind of like was kind of Naugahide Orange and then the second one was kind of this knit brown gold and black fabric. But it was basically the same kind of chair you'd sit in at the dentist and it had kind of a solenoid or a cathode ray tube at our feet that was kind of like on a fish hook that pointed it towards our face. There was kind of a photographer's umbrella above our head and what that would do would be to kind of space us out and we would again feel like we were dropping and then going up, but instead of continuing to up, up, up, up, up, up, like when we were going out of body, we would start going forward feet first, almost like a lose ride in sport. And I think that's what it seemed like and when I've seen things in more conventional reality. And we would ultimately cross this sort of black shiny plane and then we would see something on the horizon and then it would get closer and closer and then we would slam into it and we were entering a subjective moment of our own future, at least possible futures 'cause I've noticed that some of those things have happened and I've gotten these weird days of experiences where what I saw in the Montauk chair has been played out in real time and some of the experiences I saw clearly have not happened. But I remember one time, for example, coming back to our main classroom with this young friend of mine, David, in the program. He said to me like one of those little kids and one of William Hamilton cartoon in the New Yorker, you know, of kids, he said, so who were you this time? And I turned him and confidently said as we're walking along, I was a lawyer in Seattle. And I mean, I was in New Jersey at that time. I had one uncle living in California. I had never been to Washington except one time they had us teleport to Fort Lewis and back again to New Jersey, just to get used to teleporting across the country. I had not vacationed or traveled anywhere to Washington State, which has become my adopted state where I'm admitted to the federal and state bar. But I was talking about that like in 1970 when I was nine, maybe a year later, '71 when I was 10, at least after September of '71. I don't know exactly the dates on these things, but I do have the order of operations. That was the third one. And then they started Tesla teleporting us as a group when I and some of the other kids had already done so with our fathers. So beginning like in '69, '70, Jack Pruitt, who would later become the research director of Project Montauk, he was one of the major team leaders for DARPA and for LANL on Project Pegasus. He took us up to Curtis Wright and explained to us how we're gonna be jumping through this elliptical object with radiant energy flowing down across the surface of the two elliptical booms or armatures as they were called. There would be squiggles of bluish green light at about three inch intervals going back and also the other direction, if the right end to the left across that radiant energy. And when we jumped through that energy, which we had to do at least a meter per second to not lose an arm or a leg or be killed, which we trained a lot to leap through the device, the so-called Tesla teleporter or Tesla energetic array, we would find ourselves in this big tunnel that had like an oblate triangular shape. It was almost circular, but it was sort of circular with like three sides of the circle and an oblate triangle rather than a circle, which may relate somehow to Tesla's comments about three, six and nine, sort of the triangular nature of the physical universe. And we would go through that and it was sort of holographic, it was kind of bluish, white. If we look to the side, we would sometimes see intervening events, but in several seconds we would pop out in the New Mexico State Capitol grounds in Santa Fe. In fact, the side of the baton memorial building where the steps now are in those years, the steps up into the baton memorial building was on the plaza in front of those buildings when you come in from the parking lot. But now it's over on the right side. Well, that right side of the baton memorial building where you can like walk back and find the NEA building, the National Educational Association, there on the State Capitol area of Santa Fe, was where they were trying to put us down. Because I guess they figured that look, they did say, my dad said to me that they didn't want to do it at LANL because they were afraid that somebody there, such as a KGB spy who had been present at the labs, as they were called LANL, would see something. So I think that their intent was to allow kids and adults to pop in the view via Tesla teleportation. And people would just think, oh, that kid just ran around the corner of that building. And also if you visit the New Mexico State Capitol in Santa Fe, it's very sort of picturesque and picarask. It's like every building is from a different era and a different shape and design. So I guess they figured that the Santa Fe State Capitol grounds were such a hodgepodge of unusual buildings that that would also help disguise our arrival by a teleportation where we would just pop into view. And when I did my three major fact-finding trips in New Mexico in 2003, four and eight, I found both children, a former employees of the labs, the Los Alamos National Labs, and people, for example, who went to like kindergarten in Santa Fe who saw the children popping into view. And I was saying things to them, like, my God, I was one of those kids. And my dad took me then. - There were actually witnesses. So it seems like the early modalities of time travel were all consciousness related. So you weren't actually physically jumping anywhere until the Tesla teleporter. - Well, I don't think it was just consciousness. I think that I think there was a separation of our minds from our bodies. I mean, my interpretation of the relationship between quantum physics and us is that the mind controls the spirit that we have that's eternal and going through a series of incarnations to ultimately ascend to a more advanced reality. But the brain controls the body. So I think they were actually calving off the spirit or consciousness from our bodies. So I don't think it was just an induced dreaming or imaginative experience. I think it was literally kind of separating the mind from the body and thereby sending us on spiritual or astral journeys. Certainly the one achieved by the Montauk chair was kind of a pre-cognitive content from our own lives. And when I asked David the postdoc there who was setting up the chair, how are we time traveling in this device? Because our bodies aren't going anywhere. They're just staying back here in the chair. And he said, and this is like 1969/70 again. David said to me, like I said, it could have been David Lewis Anderson. He said, we don't know. We have two theories. Either everything that happens to you in your life is in your mind at birth and then plays out doing your lifetime. And we're helping trigger that somehow. Or the, what happens is out there in time waves in the physical universe around you. And we're helping you connect with those future experiences. But I do know that they knew and they confirmed that the Montauk chair had been a device that does that that provides pre-cognitive flashes of reality for an ET pilot to protect that ET craft from collisions in space when it was traveling at supersonic or even greater speeds. - Right. - The speed of light and greater even. - Well, I'd like to, I mean, so there's so much to cover. I mean, we could spend probably the whole time on all these modalities of time travel. I have so many other questions also. So, but let's, I do, I am curious and I know the audience is curious about these other ways of time traveling because like you said that when we talked on the phone, like you're not claiming that you're a time traveler. You were a time traveler. And these, this is something that we see all over the place in our society. It's literally pumped into our subconscious mind all the time. It's possible. So I think if people understand the ways and the modalities of time travel, it'll help them to identify it. So after the test, after the test of teleporter, what, what came next? - The next was the chron, the chronovizer of Reneti and Chamelli. There was a Vatican invention of that device. It worked by putting an EM signal through an eight-sided bismuth crystal and a cubicle hologram would pop out on a stage. Now, when you're standing back from that hologram, it was a looking glass device, hence the assertion of a project looking glass, which I cannot confirm. I encountered the chronovizer in Project Pegasus and I actually saw Father Reneti at the chronovizer array in Marstown, Performing Arts Center, Marstown, New Jersey. And then, but if you were in the hologram when it was generated or propagated on the stage, you instantaneously went to that time place, as I call it, that time and place in time space. And so, for example, in summer of '71, my father and I were in New Mexico and we were going to the Cerrios Cultural Center in Cerrios, New Mexico down Highway 14 from Santa Fe. And they sent me to Ford's Theater on the Knight Abraham Lincoln was shot there, April 14th of 1865, seven times, or you know, excuse me, eight times. Now, the chronovizer proved something, a couple of very interesting things. One is that there is a multiverse. And the other is that when they were inventing these time travel devices, they weren't sure it was the actual time place as understood by us historically. Because, for example, when they would send me to Ford's Theater on the Knight Lincoln was shot, everything would change a little bit. And in fact, in 1971, I was at the conference at Sandia Auditorium with my dad and about 20 other people in the project. And one of the directors of the program got up and explained they were going to shut down, time traveled by a chronovizer involving kids, not only because of the inherent danger of this device to the children involved, for example, being lost in time space. But that every time they set the same child or another child to the same historical event or place, it changed a little bit. So there is a multiverse, I witnessed the multiverse. And as a well-educated American individual, I felt I couldn't conceal that. The multiverse was like invented as an idea by Henry James, the American psychologist in like 1880. Not a new concept and it is not a science fiction concept. But I can confirm that there are virtually identical, similar and entirely dissimilar events in time space going on all around us. We are focusing on one during this particular lifetime. That is our frame of reference. But there's a lot else out there that other people have encountered. Like people who go driving and then find an hour later, they're back at their point of origin. That's because of dimensional shifts. And so Project Pegasus achieved not only time travel, but proof of the multiverse. So that would be a chronovizer. - One second, before we move on, did you want to say something? - So that's like different timelines as a way to look at that maybe as well? - Yeah, timelines, dimensions. You know, time places in the multiverse. It's basically, you know, now I've had people say, well, the multiverse can't exist because God is not a God of chaos. And I say, Oh, contrary, with God, everything is possible. So I don't think we can put limits on what I tend to call the great Imagineer. Whoever the Supreme being is, and I don't say his, the Supreme being is so brilliant that we can't even fathom the capabilities of the Supreme being. And think about that in terms of the complexity of our bodies or of our solar system or the beauty of plants and animals on this planet and so forth. A blue sky with, you know, puffy clouds. In other words, the Supreme being that created everything, including us is certainly brilliant enough to have created an ultimate universe, maybe even in quote unquote his own mind in which many things are going on at the same time. Like, I don't know, a thousand different versions of the assassination of President Abraham Lincoln for reasons that we can't fathom. But that's what we did prove in Project Pegasus. So I want to actually began shutting down some of the activities in the program because of that discovery. So at one point, you actually, I know we're jumping ahead here, but since we're talking about timelines and dimensions, you actually traveled back to the wrong dimension or the wrong timeline, you went to your house and there was a different family there. You spent a year there and eventually, they were able to communicate back to your original timeline and get you back home, which would lead me to believe that they have a way, a device that can communicate in between dimensions. Is that true? - Exactly, yeah, what happened was I teleported home to New Jersey. It was the same Curtis right. It was some of the same staff members so I didn't feel concerned. I was driven home on a school bus back to Mount Feuroat School, my elementary school. I walked home through the woods to our house on Countryward Drive and I went to the front door and rather than being open as we would keep it, it was a very safe neighborhood to grow up in and live in. This woman came to the door and said, who are you and then like slammed the door in my face? And then I kept on persisting and finally she opened the door again. I said, man, this is my house. I don't know who you are. And she said, son, are you serious? And she said, well, why don't you come in and I'll help you figure out what's going on? And I explained to her who I was and what I was involved in and that woman who was quite beneficent in my young life contacted the US government and about a week later, my dad was contacted at work and they somehow found what dimension I was in. But it was my house with the same number, not the same furniture, but the same paint on the walls. It looked like the same place, but with different furniture. But it was a woman that I have no idea who she was. She said, this has been your house since you were born, 1961. And I said, yes, man, and I'm not making it up. And she said, it couldn't be. We've had it since blah, blah, blah, different. So I was living in the downstairs room that we call the rec room, sleeping and eating there for a week. Pretty much freaked out. Now, I thought I saw a picture of myself on Jeff Francis's website with old pictures from the '50s. But since my parents had bought that house in 1955, maybe that picture on rents.com was me from somebody's life in that house in the '50s. 'Cause Jeff had run a series of pictures from Americana in the '50s and I was in one of them, but I don't even think I saved it. 'Cause I didn't think I could prove it was me. It might just been a kid in pajamas who looked like me from that era in the '60s. - So you mentioned-- - I finally was picked up by this guy and taken somewhere near us. And then I teleported over to Curtis Wright and then back and got home. I got back to our dimension. - So you mentioned in one of your interviews that this device to communicate with other dimensions was in Colorado, or did I misunderstand that? - Well, when we would jump up with the next device, the Stargate device, which was just a huge teleporter that was like this big, squarish anvil-like black thing with all kinds of different electromagnetic connections to it, different devices attached to it. And we would run through this gate in the center of the so-called Stargate. We go up a ramp, run up a ramp, and jump through the center of it, which is about twice the width of a telephone booth and go through the Vortle tunnel that that larger teleporter produced for about 30 seconds, rather than several seconds. That was used to get us from 1972 to the year 2045, which was selected as a result of the fact that it was 100 years after the beginning of the atomic age, 1945. And Hiroshima and Nagasaki and everything. The Manhattan Project, which many of the guys had worked on, like Agnew, like Keller, and like Colgate, I believe. And we would then have to jump back through a conference room that had a teleporter in it at that building in 2045. But yet we couldn't see it, so we had to learn to literally run hard against a solid wall inside a building to get home. And we would go through a Vortle tunnel again for 30 seconds, and we would pop into view at the global overlook site up microwave tower road in Southwest Colorado, immediately west of the continental divide sign, so north of Pagosa Springs. And when we did, we knew we were back in 1972. So that means that that huge micro tower array there, which we call Montauk Southwest, which is now like 100 huge antenna. Back then it was like 20 minor, you know, like fire type antennas, just basic radio antennas. But now it's this huge facility with massive antennae and we knew we were back home. So that means they were using emissions of microwave into the known universe to literally pinpoint this location. So when we put that together with the fact that my dad and his colleagues were able to get me back from that dimension that I had been accidentally teleported to and went home to the right house, but the wrong family was living there, which was pretty terrifying for a 10 year old who loved his family of seven very much and who were very wonderful. It means that, I mean, we can only extrapolate and conclude that Project Pagos has had the ability literally to communicate between dimensions. So the relevance of that to understanding the function today of the deep state, which for which my definition is basically a US intelligence community and military optics are basically violating our human rights, basically one that's engaged in abuses of power, is that the deep state has had communication between dimensions for 50 years and that has to matter. The conception that Weber has arrived at of a chronogarchy on some level has to be true because I met, when I was on Project Pagos as a child, I met in the early 70s, I met both Presidents Bush 41 and 43 and President Bill Clinton when they had just been told of their presences years later. So I don't think they were engaging in making presents, but I do know they were engaged in informing presidents of their destinies as leaders of this country. So we have to ask, what else have they been involved in studying in the future so as to manipulate events? Now, I have to add the caveat that I don't fully embrace the theory of the chronogarchy as proposed by Weber because the problem of retrocausation and proto-causation, and I could go on at length, I could do a whole show on this, but basically you can go backward and forward in time to fulfill the past and future, but not to change it into a different outcome because you are in the past or future. So there's no way to be there in real time and change it from what it's already known to have happened there in those locations when you study them via something like teleportation based time travel by going there or chronovision by looking at it or chronovision by standing in the hologram and going there. So they were able to study past and future events to get more information, more intelligence, which is the function of the CIA, right? 80% of the CIA are analysts, right, not operatives, but it's difficult to change the past or future if not impossible so that and still preserve at least the quality of the information you've collected. So it's a bit of an oxymoron if you try to change it. So I don't believe we've been changing the past or future, but I do believe they've been studying it to engage in contingency planning, but after all, those are their contingencies, not necessarily ours. - Right, so if you go in the future and gather intel then come back and try and change the timeline or change it just by changing it, you've already, your intel is no good anymore. - Well, if you're changing something in the past by going there, I think it's even doubtful that we were. So for example, look what happened when I went to Gettysburg to see Lincoln give the Gettysburg Address. Before I was born, I was already in the photograph going there. Time travel is time travel. It's a journey to that time place when it occurred in real time. It's not a second occurring of that time and place or that event. And that's one of the misconceptions that science fiction has given time travel. When you time travel, you go to that real time location. You don't go to a second playing of that time and place. So I was in the original November 19th, 1863 environment of Gettysburg when Lincoln arrived there and gave his speech. In fact, I didn't hear his address 'cause I faded from view and went back to East Hanover, in Jersey and the next time travel device we can discuss which is the plasma confinement chamber before Lincoln began speaking. But I did hear the incredibly rapturous and a glorious cheer that went up for President Lincoln in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania on the day he gave that speech. He was a very popular president in Gettysburg four months after the battle there in July. - So before you go too much further, I have a couple of questions. So Warren, I think I remember you talking about seeing future events like so they knew that were gonna happen. I believe you mentioned 9/11 and I believe you mentioned the internet. They knew both of those things were gonna happen. And then the second follow up and I'll just let you go is, so you said you phased out of that reality at the Gettysburg address. So that would implicate that that technology that they used, you didn't have to run back through a wall or come back. Did eventually your time eventually expired and you just came back to your point of origin? - In the case of that time travel technology, that was the plasma confinement chamber. It was sort of a big leucide chamber about the actual length and half the width and maybe 14 feet high of like a standard tennis court. And we would go into that leucide chamber on the right side through a door and we would walk down to plasma under confinement, all this beautiful opalescent colored swirling plasma on the far end of the plasma confinement chamber developed by my father and Dr. Sterling Colgate, the president and dean of physics of the New Mexico Institute of Science and Technology. And as a result, it'd be sort of this trap door sensation. And rather than just screaming vertically through a mortal tunnel like we did when we were teleporting, when we were dropped through that field of plasma with the plasma confinement chamber and probably exposed radioactive plasma because it was radioactive plasma and my dad was giving me shots of anadium. He said to protect my teeth and bones from radiation. Just as I was getting exposure to gamma radiation at Allied chemical and persipony measures to lighten my light body to teleport. So I was being used in advanced project. No question about that. But anyway, we'd have this trap door sensation. And just like the image of a sort of a time tunnel in what the bleak do we know where it's kind of like goes hither and yawn and up and down and you're throwing all over the place, it was like that for about 30 seconds. And then we would be spit out at the historical locations, all time travel to the past via plasma confinement even at a time when we had already punched chronovision forward in time. In fact, I was the first forward chronovision probe performed on November 5th of 1971 at I.T.G. defense in Nutlee, New Jersey. But in the plasma confinement chamber, we'd go through that rather deracinating, flying all over time space. I remember losing my hat, both shoes and a sock, which were some of the clothing that John Lawrence burns outfitted me with when I got into the town of Gettysburg when they sent me. But then we would, after the tunnel closed, we would be popped out, very kind of shaken up 'cause of the ride. And it was very, all over the place. It was more than an e-ticket ride. And I would always smell a burst of ozone. I don't know what that means. I'm not a physicist or electrical engineer like my dad was. And we would then, in that case, we'd then walked into Gettysburg, the town from the farmland north of it, where Gettysburg College now is. And it was so tiny, I couldn't even believe that it was Gettysburg. It was just a series of several shops with wooden sidewalks with like three, maybe four stores at most on each wooden sidewalk. And so that was plasma confinement. And then there was kind of an aeronautical repositioning chamber that was being used to send things back and forth across the country that I think they adapted into the arc that we were using to get to Mars 10 years later under the direction of somebody I met when I was on Project Pegasus, which was the legendary US aviator Howard Hughes. He was a VIP at a luncheon there. And Connie Chavez, my dad's longtime friend from Albuquerque, New Mexico, explained to me who Howard Hughes was. And then I would meet Howard about 10 years later, when I saved the life of Bernard Mendez, one of my colleagues on Mars, and Hughes was a friend of Bernie and wanted to meet me. And so Hughes was directing the second program I was in just like Harold M. Agnew, was directing the first classified defense related research and development I was in. And as an American history major graduate of UCLA, I really tried to make people understand that because this was not just some pie in the sky claim that it was Tesla or John von Newman or whoever. These were essentially two of the most advanced physicists in the United States for the post-war era. Agnew definitely a physicist and then Howard Hughes, an aviation expert. So it makes perfect sense that 10 years later Hughes would have become the director for DARPA and CIA and other alphabet agencies of the essentially the quantum access device we were using to get to the red planet. - So before we get into the red planet, 'cause I do have some questions about that. I just wanted to understand the technology. So whenever you phased out of the Gettysburg Address, you just phase out of that reality and you end up back in your body in this time, right? - Now we had like a Kundalini sensation and you just pop back into view in the plasma confinement chamber in East Hanover, New Jersey, just like with the chronovizer. When that image collapsed, we would pop back into view in a field of ventilation which John Peers, a physicist here in Washington, explained to me was just the characteristic of certain electromagnetic particles under certain forms of stimulation. So we would pop back into view in the chronovizer stage, in New Jersey, the hologram was gone, the stage would still be there. And for about 90 to a hundred seconds, we were trained just to sit on the ground and count back from a hundred as we would then start seeing the other children in the program start popping into view from that probe as like black body emanations. So that those were two technologies where we didn't need a return device, the original quantum access method or effect would just wear off. And now it's certainly true of chronovision and plasma confinement, but not in the case of teleportation. If we had jumped to New Mexico in 1971 and reached, you know, Santa Fe in 1791, we would have been stuck there because there would have been no Tesla teleporter to get us home. - Right, so, you know. - So let's talk about some of the future events that you saw like, or I don't know if you saw, but you had heard about the internet and 9/11 were those two things that let's just say intelligence agencies were privy to before they happened? - Without question, including Donald Rumsfeld, who was the defense secretaries for President Gerald Ford, Gerald R. Ford, and George W. Bush, the Americans spend the longest number of days as Secretary of Defense. My dad and I had a friendship with Donald Rumsfeld on the program. I've said he was a pretty nice guy, I trusted him. But anyway, Rumsfeld, when he was Defense Secretary during 9/11, we know at a minimum that he had been in a classified defense program where 9/11 was detected and being discussed about frequently. That may be that reason that that FBI agent was put in the Twin Towers. I think was John O'Neill, something like that? William O'Neill. And then I was present at a restaurant in New Mexico. I don't know which town per se, it was probably Albuquerque, where John Alexander McCone, who was Director of Central Intelligence from 1960 to '64, the very time frame, or time span, when sadly President John F. Kennedy was assassinated, that was discussing with my dad what the internet was going to be. So we know the CIA knew about the advent of the internet and that bespeaks the possibility that many of these mavens of the digital age, the Steve Jobs and Elon Musk and so forth, could actually be government intelligence operatives that are creating these behemoth companies to sort of keep the digital age under CIA and actually like use our emails and so forth to achieve what DARPA began announcing under President George W. Bush, their goal of total information awareness. Remember that special logo they had about 10 years ago? Back during the Bush years, second Bush years. - I'm not familiar with DARPA logo, but we definitely know that that's their ultimate goal, yeah, to have everyone. - Well, they actually made this a cultic symbol for, at least I looked at cultic for total information awareness as a goal of DARPA. And then one of my Mars astronauts who reached the position of the Director of DARPA, Regina Elvira Dugan came out on behalf of body chipping of human beings as like an important advance. So when I ran for president in 2016, one of my hundred proposals was to not allow things that would engage in transhumanist alterations or embellishments or additions to the basic human form divine as William Blake called it. I was really disturbed by that proposal by Dugan to introduce chipping of human beings. I thought that bespoke numbering people during the Nazi Holocaust against the Jews during World War II and other inhumane historical practices. But anyway, that was what we know the Intel community developed with Project Pegasus. And I want everybody to realize that by bringing this forward, I was going against the expression instructions of the George W. Bush administration. When I went to New Mexico on my first major fact-finding trip in 2003, June of 2003, I met with a representative of the executive office of President George W. Bush. And he either warned me or threatened me. I think it was the latter, that if I didn't stop investigating, writing about or talking about the time travel technologies, I was, I had contact within Project Pegasus in the early late 60s and early 70s. And then again in the early 80s, 1981 to '84, that they couldn't guarantee my survival. So I went forward with all this to save my life and to also bring the truth forward and the event they were gonna kill me. So I am not in danger to the deep state. - Right, and that's good for you for... - Right, and we thank you for that. - Thank you, yes. - To be honest, your testimony is one of the most credible that I've heard, if not the most credible. - Thank you. - Just because, yeah, I mean, you can't make this stuff up and the amount of details is incredible also. Oh yeah, that's good. - We'll just jump in and go up a tick back here. Actually, what he said is that I couldn't talk about right about or investigate these time travel devices because they remained sensitive, compartmentalized national security secret. So that implies they're still using time travel devices, but also keeping them official state secrets. That's what I just wanted to add to that. - Yeah, so I didn't know where it was. - I've been meeting in 2003. - Right, and it makes perfect sense and we see the evidence of that being covered up. But, so what I was gonna ask is, okay, so some of these jump rooms are these machines that you were using. I know you've described them being in like an old school gymnasium or in an abandoned building, just basically in plain sight, people would be driving past every day. Maybe it's underground, maybe it's not, but like where would we find these locations? Are they the end? - Well, they were obvious. - They were placing them in non-discrete locations in New Jersey, Ohio and New Mexico. So let me explain that. In New Jersey, they were always, they were always classified defense contract locations for the most part, like ITT defense and nutly, like Curtis Wright in Woodridge. Like originally the general manufacturing company Convent Station for ChronoVision, which they then moved not to the Mars Town performing arts center in Mars Town, New Jersey after it was built, but when it was under construction. So they were kind of expert in hiding things in plain sight, either in defense contractor locations, where I did get some witnesses among in the defense industry to the Tesla Teleporter at Curtis Wright, a man by the name of Captain Lewis B. Wary, who unfortunately has now passed. But I did get his testimony to confirm my memories. And then in Ohio, when the teleportation from New Jersey to New Mexico or back again, New Mexico to New Jersey was weakening too much and essentially failing, we would be decanted to just a grassy lawn, a couple blocks up the street from the Solon, Ohio based swage lock headquarters. That was a company founded by Fred Lennon to make like precision pipe fitting for engineering companies. In fact, we had a tour by Mr. Lennon and that had a Tesla Teleporter over on the right side of that one story building at that time at least. So we would walk down the street from this field and then across an intersection diagonally and then into the swage lock headquarters. And nobody would say, "Hey, you're walking here into the swage lock headquarters. "You must be time traveling." Because it was just a pipe fitting company working for the DoD, you say? So they were good at that using nondescript defense contractor locations to disguise very advanced quantum access activities going on. And then the same thing in New Mexico. I mean, the Cerios Cultural Center was kind of a cultural center for the people of that town built by the WPA during the Depression. It was owned by this couple Joseph and Josepha something. It would later be purchased by the Sarkeesian family and then by Jesus Maroli's an artist. So it was sort of in private hands, even though it was a cultural center with different facilities. Somebody privately owned it. And I don't know exactly how the DoD dealt with them to use the Cerios Cultural Center for both chronovision and the Stargate. They were putting the chronovizer on their symphony orchestra stage in the main building. And then they were putting the Stargate on the Olympic sized basketball court. And the meet and greet kind of speech we got from Rumsfeld was down in an auditorium that seated about 30, like a story underground. After that floor burned off when the Sarkeesians owned the Cerios Cultural Center, that's now kind of an amphitheater that's visible from the surface, from the ground. It looks almost like an artifact type of amphitheater from 2000 years ago or something. But we went down there and had a little kind of intro to keeping the project secret by Donald Rumsfeld. Again, the defense attache, the darkest project Pegasus, long before he was even President Ford's Secretary of Defense. And this was all during the Nixon years before Ford. And at least my experiences in Pegasus and then Mars, of course, was during the Reagan years. - So before we move on real quick, I wanna have a question about the chronovizer. I think I've heard you mention, and I've actually seen an image floating around on the internet, which we've actually showed that image on our Project Looking Glass episode with Brad Goetz. But he is apparently a photo of Christ. So they were able to go back and take an actual photograph of Jesus Christ and that picture is floating around on the internet. I was wondering if you could confirm that and did they go back to that era with the chronovizer technology? - I wasn't trying to photo Christ. I was shown about a 20 to 30 minutes film loop, like a 16 millimeter black and white video production of the scenes from the ministry and the crucifixion of Jesus. And that was shown at San D and national labs in summer of '72. And when my dad and his friend, Connie Chavez, and I were walking out of that, you know, the holding of that film viewing. His friend, Connie Chavez, was a devout Catholic, who was very disturbed. She couldn't even look at the screen. And let me tell you, Jesus suffered amazing. I mean, just in a horrendous, horrifying way on the cross. I found difficulty watching it as well. And as a, what a 10 year old in summer of '72, I felt the evil of those images was so evil that it was like a swarm of hornets buzzing in the center of the small room that about 20 of us were watching that film in. It was kind of like a privilege to see these scenes of Jesus' execution. But then when we were coming out, I have to be consistent with the truth. I don't share this as a proselytizer of faith in Jesus' divinity or anything like that, even though that is my religious belief. It happened to me, but I'm not a proselytizer. We're coming out of that viewing. And my dad said, Connie, I don't know why you're so disturbed by this. And she said, Ray, how do you think I should be disturbed by this? They were crucifying my Lord. And he goes, I know, I know. But we also got footage that three days later, two angels show up in Jesus' crypt. There's a flash of light, he stands up, and the angels help him push the rock away from his crypt. And then all three of them walk out. So I've also shared that because that is the truth. My father was a man of truth. He was a devout Roman Catholic, like Connie Chavez. I was being raised as a Roman Catholic as a child who had been baptized as such and was going to confession and church and taking the Eucharist throughout my childhood. I would later be confirmed as a 13-year-old. So even though I'm no longer a practicing Roman Catholic, I am a non-denominational Christian. And I thought, in a religious spiritual term, what is my obligation with that? And then when I realized that Satanists, skeptics, and secularists were doing things like even denying that Jesus was a person, which is an absolutely ridiculous assertion because even during Jesus' time, the Hebrew historian, Josephus, wrote of him. And that's been known by Christologists for centuries and by religionists for centuries, including Christian adherence. I'm just plain historian. And so an assertion, let's say, by a David I, who some of his work I like and appreciate, but when he was trying to say that the Jesus story and the gospels were fictional novels scripted by the peace of family of Italy, I said that's absurd. I mean, I saw images of this individual ministry, death, and heard my dad speak of his resurrection. I thought, well, I have to share this because for some reason, the US government blocked images of Jesus' resurrection. And to the extent that my mentor at UCLA, Norman Cousins, proved that I'm trying to think of my point there, but... - Well, I do want to answer your question. - He proved in his book, In God We Trust, that all of our founders and framers, except Benjamin Franklin, were believers in Jesus Christ, not just Christian. They had accepted Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior, as people often say. In other words, they were born again Christians. They were Christian evangelicals. And I thought about Norman's book, In God We Trust, I had worked with Norman in 1986, 7, and 8. And I'm talking about decisions I made like in 2000 or so, 2003, 2004, when I came forward. I thought, wait a minute, if I have this reliable statement by my dad that his team at Sandia that summer also recovered images of Jesus of Nazareth resurrection, I have to share that with everybody. So it will either confirm their faith, not on the basis of faith, but video evidence or it will bring other people to Jesus. Just because I think that's the right thing to do. I believe in being Christic. And like the Dalai Lama, that basically is my religion. My religion is kindness. And so I realized that I was in kind of a moral, not a moral crisis, but a kind of an important event in my life, why I thought, well, people will just say Andy's time travel memory are just this clever way to promote an evangelical Christian perspective. No, in every way, everything I've shared has been history. It's been what I experienced. And I've been accused of being conceited for only sharing my experiences. But no, I'm an experientialist. That's my means when I'm a speaker, a media personality, you know, a lecture, a writer. So it's a true story. I now did I see the resurrection as captured? No, but my father did. - Well, I do like to add to that. So there's a book you might be interested in called The Thea Uba Prophecy, which talks about Jesus or Christ actually being a being from that planet who incarnated here to do exactly what we know. And they describe exactly that resurrection story, exactly the way you just described it. They describe that is how it was just those beings coming down in their light body and bringing or removing him from the site, bringing them back up to their craft and reviving him with their technology and then placing him back down here. - You might be interested in reading that book. It's, you know, a lot of people have a lot of issue with that controversial. It's very controversial, but the way you describe that scene is exactly how they described it in that book, which was, which came out in like '89 or '90. - But you know, I've never heard of it. I mean, I've heard of Operation Trojan Horse by Benita, J.J. Benita, but haven't read it, but... - But that's we can go on and on about that forever. - And Law of One talks about, Christ was a basically higher dimensional being than incarnate, you know, other things talked about. Basically, the concept of Christ did exist. He was an incarnated, higher dimensional being that came to help the planet essentially help humanity. - Right. - So, you know, there's, yeah, and I agree, it's absurd to claim he never existed. I think that's just wishful thinking on a lot of people's, they just don't, for whatever reason, want to believe he existed, but there's too much evidence that he did. And I mean, you're all right. - Well, people are just sharing David Icke's claim without any exploration with Christologists or, you know, even, you know, Cardinals or whoever, college professors, you know, that about the fact that Jesus's reality of having lived was confirmed by the Hebrew historian Josephus during his lifetime, and that's evident. - Right, right, exactly. - So, we can't ignore facts and evidence. - Exactly. - So, I want to move forward a little bit here to Mars. And one thing in particular that struck me as interesting was you would talk about these skulls on the surface of Mars that were your access points to the jump room, but you never clarified, at least I didn't hear you clarify, what type of skulls were these? Were these giant human skulls, animal skulls, or were they mandatory? - They were, they were huge animal skulls that I didn't recognize as a fairly knowledgeable individual from this planet. In fact, some of those were captured and when I published the Discovery of Life on Mars in 2008, that was the first written work on Earth to show evidence of life forms on the Red Planet. And then 25 very talented anomalous have contributed to our findings at our Facebook site, the Mars Nonly Research Society, which I created when I wrote that paper and published in December of 2008. And yet that paper was going to be such a landmark publishing that I was briefed on it as a result of the quantum access capability of the US government going back to 1968. So, when I first started teleporting between New Jersey and New Mexico and back, my father came home one day with certain expirgated passages from my 41 page paper that I wouldn't publish for 40 years in 2008. And then he, a year later in summer of '69, he showed me my image of the humanoid being on Salkowski Ridge, which is to the rover data, sort of what the face on Mars on Psydonia is to the satellite data from the Red Planet. So, this all kind of overlaps Project Mars, because for example, one day at the law, I'd say in their restaurant, my dad asked Connie Chavez to walk across the floor of the restaurant and with her and they talked quietly in the corner. And I kind of zigzag my way over there, you know, as kids do, they finally, hopefully get to where they're being encouraged not to hear something. And I heard Connie say to my father, is this before or after he discovers all those creatures up there? So, he must have been telling her about the fact that I was destined to be sent to Mars via one of these emergent technologies. And I think it's kind of interesting that Howard Hughes was a guest of honor of Project Pegasus during those years, for a dinner. And then he told his third wife, Eva McClellan, from Alabama, that he was, she thought he had said that he was spending time with stargazers, somewhere out in the country, as described by major general Mark Music and Douglas Wellman in their book, Box is the Secret Life of Howard Hughes, but I think he was saying I was spending some time with stargators somewhere else in the country. So, I literally heard my dad telling this longtime friend of his in New Mexico, somebody he met back in 1953, '54, when he was flight testing the ramjet engine at the White Sands Missile Proving Ground, before Curtis Wright, I guess, she asked, very concerned, is this before or after? He publishes those images of all those creatures up there. And my dad said before, in fact, long before that. So, they knew I was headed for Mars. So, the two projects did sort of overlap in my experience, but I think that Project Mars was so different, so focused that it's really debatable whether it was a programmatic element within Project Pegasus. So, what do you think, why do you think they used the access, the skulls as access points, was that just because there's easy cover, or did they place those skulls there? Were they naturally found there? That's very interesting to me. And I'm sure that would lead to an underground facility, I would imagine. - Well, bear in mind that I can only speculate. I went to Mars about 20 times via jump room or space elevator or aeronautical reposition chamber or arc as we short hand. We're still speculating because Mars is a new terrain. The images are showing us another planet at great depth for the first time. Mars is inhabited and my guess would be, and I think it's probably gonna prove out to be true, but it's just a guess that the skulls that we were using for the access points to our jump rooms were placed there by the two human, earthling sized humanoids on the surface, the Homo Martis terrace and the Homo Martis Martis, which means Earth men and women on Mars and Martian men and women on Mars. They're the ones that are very much like us, and then the sort of the smaller spindlier ones that are sort of a little bit more freakish than us. And I could go into that if you'd like, but they're living predominantly underground. In fact, Courtney Hunter, the CIA and I were invited by one of that second type, the Homo Martis Martis, to go down underground into his lair, his residence underground, which was really just sort of a large series of caves with paisley designs on the ceilings with a lot of pneumatic tubes running like elevators and devices to live underground. And Virginia, old's of the CIA said after I published my paper, you know, you're really onto the truth here. In fact, those two species, which you might not have encountered on Mars in the same place, they actually live cooperatively. The weird thing is I saw three of the first type at an air base in New Jersey, but all the ones I saw on Mars were the second type. But anyway, we had a sort of a dog and pony show by one of them of where they were living underground. Now, since there are two very lethal and vicious predators on the surface and many other carnivores, Mars has essentially a climax population where all of the land animals basically survive, not by grazing on vegetation, but by devouring each other. There are two that are extremely vicious and deadly. One is a reptoid, about 16 feet tall, with a T-Rex head that looks sort of chicken-like and a Velociraptor body with small upper appendages and huge hind legs, but that can run at about 70 miles per hour. I saw one of those kill one of my colleagues on Mars, a 45-year-old gentleman named Bob, I don't have his last name, and another devoured a 16-year-old kid from California named David, but not devoured him, he just bit him on the stomach and killed him. So those are sort of the reptoids that Mars claimants, for instance, Penny Bradley, have claimed, and that we witnessed them. I witnessed them killing two of my colleagues on the surface of Mars. The other type are essentially these insect avoid-like creatures that are about the size of a small garbage truck, have 10 to 12 appendages, and large saber-tooth teeth in the front of their head, and they can just basically slice somebody up and were. That was the creature that William Brett stillings and I spent like a mile running away from. We just exhausted ourselves running away from that creature, the one time we encountered it. Because Mars has oxygen, it has blue skies. Oxygen is a clear gas that refracts blue, so there's many times when you're on Mars where there is a pale blue sky and like a baby blue sky, but it's a very deficient of oxygen. I would sometimes get the hypoxia with the pain in the legs and feet. I still have some pain in the legs and feet from that experience or set of experiences. And yet the oxygen in some places is as deficient at, let's say, or I don't know, 10 to 12,000 feet above sea level on Earth. So it was really miraculous that I was able to save Bernard Mendez's life by carrying him a mile of safety. - You mentioned in an interview, you asked how you were breathing on Mars and they told you the lithosphere. Did you get any more information on what that was? - Well, we were breathing unassisted as humans from Earth, but when I said, I said, according to the CIA, again, I said, "Courtney, how could we be breathing up there? I mean, there's such little vegetation." And he said, "The lithosphere, we believe that oxygen is seeping from the rocks." Both on and above ground. So again, I'm not a planetary scientist, so I don't know whether that was valid, but that's what they said. But it was definitely deficient in oxygen. A couple of times I got the tunnel vision from hypoxia. And that was quite disturbing, because I said to a couple of my colleagues, "I'm flaking out, watch me, I've got tunnel vision." And they said, "Just use your ventilator." We had a ventilator that we could kind of move the rocker arm back and forth and produce oxygen. But most of us seldom used it. I mean, I dispensed with it after my first trip in July of '81. And there were even American astronauts smoking on the surface. So go figure, I'm never been a smoker, so I didn't have that issue. - I think one of the most crucial points about this whole thing that you mentioned, it was that you were calling an interdimensional transit to him from Mars, and there was actually a question that it actually wasn't Mars, but a planet like Mars, or Mars in another dimension. And I don't remember his name, but Kerry Cassidy had a whistleblower come on years ago who came forward and said, "The Mars that the gentlemen are speaking of "in a secret space program exist in another dimension." And that was the first time I had heard him say that, or heard anyone say that. And then you are claiming something similar, might have been the case, and I was wondering if you could elaborate on that. - Yes, but my point has been basically, and I certainly shared by my colleague Bernard Mendez, although Bernie's kind of dropped out of the truth moon because he's dealing with health issues. But my point was, look, if you drive into Pasadena, California, it says something like Pasadena next six F. Now, when we were jumping to Mars in this, clearly this interdimensional device, the arc, which was basically an elevator at 999 North Sepulveda in El Segundo, California, that would morph from a box-like structure into a cylinder and then back again. And then the far wall would open up like an elevator door. And we were in the sub-basement of one of the seven or eight jump room facilities on the red planet that we were accessing as Americans. I can't speak for the alleged German presence there, but that's basically the experience. We had one jump room facility out of about seven or eight that said that had, it was like a, that one was like an underground parking garage that said, welcome to Mars. But did we know enough about planetary physics, to say at the end of the day, that we were sure it was Mars? Well, when Bernie and I began comparing notes with some help from William Stilling's, we realized, for example, that, wait a minute, if Mars is 40% the volume and hence the mass of Earth, the differential between gravity there should have been 2.5, right? Because 2.5, that 4 to 10 is 2.5. If 4 goes into 10, 2.5 times, right? - Right. - So, okay, so I was able to leap or to stride the normal male human stride of a healthy young male, five foot, 10 inches tall, on Earth, about three, three and a half feet. Like if you know you're forwarding a creek or something and you kind of stride leap over the creek or river or rocks or whatever. But on Mars, I could do at most four feet, but if there was a differential of 2.5, my normal three foot stride should have been easily 7.5 feet on Mars, but it wasn't. There was also times when we would dig on the surface, when we would hit this thick metal sphere that was under the red planet. And other times, like the time that Hunt and I were invited in town to that residence of that second type of Martian, when they were digging underground without any a metal spherical layer blocking their egress into an underground location, just like the jump rooms. So, we weren't really sure what was sort of on or above the red planet, but some of the data we started collecting from our experiences was, wait a minute, we don't know if this was the Mars up there in the sky sometimes during the year, in our solar system. So it might have been, because it was a quantum access device, it might have been what Bernie Mendez and I named or promoted the idea of a synthetic quantum environment or artificial planetary holographic domain. In other words, rather than using an advanced interdimensional device to go to the Mars in our solar system, it may have been another form of interdimensional travel. And to that degree, since we had jump rooms in both directions and we wouldn't be trapped like we might with Tesla teleporters on earth, now trapped in the past, we were possibly going to, I don't know, a million BC on a Mars-like planetoid in another dimension, we don't know. One thing I added very recently to my analysis of those years is a couple of years before I was asked to go to Mars at age 19, about five years earlier when I was like 14. Several of the books in the Blade fictional series by the author Richard Lord were placed in my closet in my bedroom in California, in my family's home in Chatsworth, California, where I literally drove down to be driven by Courtney after the CIA down to El Segundo when I first went to Mars on July 7th of 1981. So I asked myself to the extent that in that novel series, which has kind of smattered with a little bit soft porn to kind of interest young males, you know, teenagers or 20-somethings, just a couple like soft porn scenes per novel, but it's basically a science fiction adventure series. Blade was getting to the past and other dimensions in a box-like device. So I think that may have been an intentional introduction in my imagination, my mind to this device that they already had, because right around that time when those Blade series of books were placed in my closet as a 14, 15-year-old, my dad gave me a picture as taken by Viking too. But after I ripped it up and I was going to Mars, I was so disgusted about that. So I suspect that those things were sort of intelligence community military ploys to introduce a young California guy to where he was going. Basically a Mars-like environment, or at least know what Mars looked like so that when I was sent, they could figure out if it was another location arrived at interdimensionally rather than through rocketry or direct transit. And that's supported by the extensive questioning that Ed Dames would give us for a half hour to an hour every time we came back. It was like one of those famous Ed Dames sessions at what happened next. Okay, then what happened? And he's done that with multiple people including remote viewers. But that's what he would do for like 30 to 60 minutes every time we would come back. And then he would space us out with the American reverse engineered version of the Soviet Leda machine, which is basically a memory suppression device. - So, okay. - So yeah, I strongly suspect it was interdimensional travel to a Mars-like planet in another dimension. - Well, there's two things. So using gravity as a guideline, I don't know how efficient that is because we don't mainstream physics doesn't actually quite have, I don't think people fully understand what gravity is and how it works. And just because it works that way on Earth doesn't mean that those same laws apply in another planet. We don't know, I don't know. That's my opinion, obviously. But when you got to Mars, let's just pretend it was in this reality, how long would you say humans have already been there by the time you got there? When do you think this stuff was established and by who? - Well, both, when we were going in the 80s and then when I began to use NASA's data to write the discovery of life on Mars and found the modern, you know, the leading contemporary Marsology organization, the Mars Nonly Research Society or Project Mars at Facebook, for example, projectmars.net, we put out a lot of material. It's not really arguable as Dr. Sala recently tried to claim. It's just not arguable that it's Andy's Paradolia. You know, that's like claiming that President Kennedy hasn't been assassinated yet. You know, it's just not happening. I believe that I think it's possible that it could have been Mars in the extent to the extent that when we were answering your question, when we were going initially, it took about 20 minutes from the time we stepped into the space elevator and it more from a box into a cylinder in the back again before the far door opened up and were in the sub-basement of the US facility on the red planet. But then as the planet Mars was drawing closer to Earth and it's a regular two-year or roughly two-year orbit around the Sun, our Sun, in this dimension, it shrunk down to eight minutes so that rather than one or two astronauts, three or four, could go in the jump from at the same time. I did that, for example, with Stilling's Mendez and Satoro, who later changed his name to Obama, a number of times, with all four of these things, a number of times, with all four of us in the jump room, either going or coming back. That was only possible because Mars, the Mars in our dimension was closer to the Earth and the time in the jump room as a result shrank from roughly 20 to eight minutes. So that, unlike the bizarre differential in terms of gravity or weight, mass, that scientific outcome seemed to prove it. Was the Mars in this dimension? And so as we were developing that, and Ed Dames was even denying that he was our instructor, which he was, and he was interviewing us after every trip there, I was concerned that the American sort of scientific community and government and culture had not grasped this mind around these questions. Was it in another dimension because the stride that we should have been 7.5 was only four? 'Cause that was healthy, but I was never really an athlete. I mean, I could leap across a creek of three or four feet, but not leap 7.5 feet, like I was participating in the Olympics or something as a jumper. So that supported the premise that it was the Mars in our dimension. So in this solar system, in this dimension. - But you didn't answer the question on how long do you think humans have already been there by the time you got there? - Oh, okay, yeah, let me go back to that. I started that, but I got off that. First of all, when we were going there and then when I wrote that paper, okay? And the later work that all my colleagues have done and I still contributed to, it was clear that there was a high Egyptian presence on the Martian surface. We saw pyramids on the surface that look very Egyptian, but then Ross Curly of Mars, the Mars Nonly Research Society found like an intaglio carved into either metal or rock which was photographed on day 2012 of all days. The 2012 soul of Mars of the Rover's Spirit. And they took this photograph and right near the corner of the slab of rock or metal, there's clearly an Egyptian pharaoh that looks just like King Akhenat. In fact, it looks a lot like President Obama. And it's not new and it was found by NASA and they've been denying life on Mars, both ancient and modern. They're still fighting with people where there was microbond Mars and we've been showing humanoids in higher life forms and incredible ancient artifacts for 14 years now. So that's why I was worried about America being behind, but no, there was clearly a high Egyptian presence. Now, regarding the more modern, potentially American or Western presence, when I went to the, through the, up to the jump room called the corkscrew and then walked to the right diagonally and then ultimately through what we call the dilapidated brick city. The bricks of that collapsed city was partially intact, but there were many things on the ground and just walls and ceilings that the fallen apart and stuff. Nonetheless, they looked like small brown bricks that you'll see like in the colonial district of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, from the period of our founding. When I reviewed both the, well, not just both, but the terrain, the animals, the humanoids and such structures to the Barsoom novels of the writer Edgar Rice Burroughs, that writer of Tarzan whose book plate was Tarzan holding up Mars because his Tarzan series was financially supporting his Mars series, his Barsoom novels. I and others, including my vice president of Mars, Louis Michael Reinhardt, have concluded that Edgar Rice Burroughs was either on Mars or new people who had been or had been given access by some group, maybe Freemasons or something or government officials about earlier visits to the Red Planet than the 1980s. Penny Bradley, who recently interviewed me on her podcast, affirmed that there was much earlier habitation, you know, visits to Mars by Earthlings. We certainly know there were by Egyptians under the reign of Akhenaten, the sun god. It's interesting that they would call him the sun god. Sounds rather solar system oriented. But no, we clearly proved when we went there and then when he studied NASA's images years later, decades later, in fact, that two and a half decades later, that there was a high Egyptian presence there. And there also seemed to be strong circumstantial evidence of early American or Western building there on the surface. So I think the whole process of traveling via arc may have been, for example, an ancient science that was periodically rediscovered, revived, just re-implemented. So I don't think we were the first to be on Mars. We were told, you know, Obama, Dugan and I were asked to read about four inches of documents in French, the French language, which I knew some of, as did they, from studying it for four years in junior high school and high school, from the French External Intelligence Organization, which stated that the first humans from this epoch to go to Mars were two Americans who went via, two American astronauts who went via rocket in 1964. But then we have all the claims of an earlier German presence even during World War II. So I cannot state that we were in the first cadre of modern earthlings even to go to the Red Planet. I've never claimed any, you know, first-in-time kind of accomplishment related to Mars. And in fact, my other colleague, William Whitekra, one of my other colleagues that was going there and helped, he and I save our lives in that of William's stillings against, with AR-15's against the battery of pterodactyls that was trying to eat us for about 30 minutes. So William Whitekra saved my life and Williams on the surface, William's stillings, and his own. He told me that when we were going there, it was usually about 1500 other Americans there. So the bill that sort of David Wilcox spoke of in 2006, where he said there were like 600,000 earthlings on Mars, I don't necessarily believe, but certainly the affirmation by Israeli General Heim I shed on December 9th of 2020, or yeah, of 2020, that there were Americans working with ETs underground on Mars, seems sort of more consistent with our experiences there. But what Whitekra did confirm that there was many as 1500 when we were going. So I've been told the one. I mean, Bernie Mendez said, "No, there were only about 40 of us in the whole program." So I just don't know. And that was one of my beefs with the CIA. I had said to Courtney Hunt to the CIA, "Courtney, you're kind of like an ET." He said, "Why would you say that?" And I said, "Because you only give answers to desired questions." I mean, your agency is asking me and other agencies are asking me to go and military departments, are asking me to go to another planet, you know, millions of miles away, and I might die there or be left there. And you're not even telling me these questions. You told me how there's oxygen on Mars, but you're not telling me how many of us are up there, what she would, we should do if the jump rooms fail, you know, how we can find food up there. They were really endangering our lives. And they also didn't pay us after saving a fellow astronauts life that of Bernie Mendez by carrying him a mile to my right shoulder with terribly depleted oxygen, which was almost impossible. The CIA promised me the space medal of honor, and they never even told me what my DD-214 was when it arrived from the Navy in 1985. I ripped it up because I didn't even know what a DD-214 was. So what I found in my study over the last 20 years are actually now 22 years, which I began around 2,000 consulting with experts on U.S. intel training military, like Dr. Jean-Marie Arego of UC Irvine, a UC San Diego-educated social psychology who specializes in that area, is that operatives are never paid and are shoved off deck. Operators are the 20% of operatives for CIA, for example, who are doing operations, the other 80% paying analysts, and they just regularly do this. They use people and throw them away. They don't pay them. They don't fulfill the promises they made in terms of decorations. I mean, imagine winning the space medal of honor for service between age 19 and 22. And I'm sitting here at 61, linking back and thinking, "Well, that's something I was cheated at, as well as my salary, the cradle to the grave government service we were promised, the zero interest home loan we were promised to buy single family detached residences in the Redding, California area, $100,000 purchases that would now be worth $500 to $600,000." I mean, our government has been cheating people like I, American heroes, and we're even known to the intel community and the military as a ghost. That is not the country that our founders started. So I am speaking out, not only is the broken arrow of the military and the intelligence community, but as a conscientious objector for how they're performing. They're underperforming our nation and our heritage and our legacy. - And that's not to mention the physical effects that has on your body and everybody else involved. I mean, obviously time travel has to be somehow detrimental to your lifespan. And I mean, I know you have vision problems because of it and your rapathy and who knows what else, but like, they don't take that. - Any failure? Yeah, yeah. No, I was definitely damaged. I mean, my dad was giving him a pill that he called the horse go. And when Connie Chavez says what's that for, he said to deal with the effects of radiation. When he was giving the shots of an 80-millimet 23 in my left calf muscle back at our house virtually every week between 1968 and 72. And I asked him, "Dad, what is this for?" Said to protect your teeth and bones from radiation. When the nurse at the Marstown, New Jersey Army Arsenal, U.S. Army Arsenal would give me shots of gamma globulin every week. I said, "What are these for?" And she said, "To make you super smart." So maybe that goes to why I have a very good memory. But yes, our country calls these ghosts. Now imagine that people who are risking their lives serving the military and the intel community and the military and especially the intel community are calling them ghosts. They're fellow Americans that we're treating as ghosts. We don't want to destroy operational security, government secrecy. We want to cheat people of things they earned at the risk of their lives for years. I mean, I have eight years in. They told me I had reached the lieutenant commander level in the U.S. Navy. If they gave me a promotion after my law, my you know, my JD and my two masters were earned, I may be a commander or an admiral by now. I don't know in the Navy Secret Service. I know I'm not working for them. But I know that there's tens of thousands of such Americans, particularly of my generation. Because as the World War II crowd began doing more and more sophisticated things, they began making excuses for themselves like, well, we could have been killed in France or Germany during the war or, you know, during the Korean War. We'll let these young men and women know what it is to serve and not be paid. In other words, there were excuses they made. They were lying to us. If I could talk to my dad or Courtney Hunt of the CIA or Ed Dames in person and other apparatics of the deep state who were handling us during these secret programs, I would literally grab them by the lapel and scream in their faces, how could you do this? Why weren't we paid? Why weren't we given our military decorations, our other benefits? I mean, I had to worry about my academic debt for years, even as a practicing attorney here in the state of Washington. I'm inactive now because of my vision loss and my kidney problems. But I was active for almost 25 years. And I had to worry that whole time about my academic debt and have very little money left after practicing. And yet I never should have had any academic debt. So we're literally persecuting people who have served the country. And I considered that even worse than people spitting on Vietnam veterans when they came back because those are people inside the government growing their colleagues. I mean, I was 19 when I went to Mars. William Brett Stilings was 14. Okay, we're going to do again with 17. Obama and McCool were my age. Barack Obama being like 45 days older than me and William McCool being five days younger than me. - Yeah, everything you just said confirms everything we know about the steep state. They care about power control. They do not value human life. They do not have morals or integrity. They, but they have infiltrated into these positions of power and these intel agencies and kind of like taken over from there and they use people as pawns and they're disposable. Like you said, they don't treat you with dignity. They don't, they don't care. They're just a disposable pawn to them. And it's sick and it needs to stop and needs to end. And we need our country back. - Right. - And we also have to remember, a lot of the people who work as operators handling operatives are not in control. - Yeah. - I mean, there's a Roman Catholic and a Mormon faction, for example, within CIA. - No, it's the top of that. - Top of the period. Yeah, that's a big long time. - Yeah, my dad was a devout Roman Catholic as was his friend, Connie Chavez and a number of other people on the program, probably John Alexander McCone, which is of course an Irish name. So he may or very well have been in that Roman Catholic faction within CIA. Now, we know, at least according to the author, Tim Cohen, that what is it? The Knights Templar, the Rose accretions and the Priory Decion, basically are ultimately protecting the British crown. That may be the residual control of America under the British monarchy. My dad and Connie Chavez told me they were Knights Templar. And when I asked them, what's that? They said something like soldiers for Christ. And I said something like, this was at lunch at Angelo's, Peter, the Angelo's Italian deli in White Rock, New Mexico. They said, you know, soldiers of Christ because Jesus has enemies. And Connie Chavez said that in a very kind of angry, sort of Latin American dictator kind of to anality. So I think we have to explore secret societies. We have to examine the overlap, let's say, between the Vatican and the time travel programs I was in because of course, the Vatican definitely was the provenance of the chronovizer. And I saw Father Erneti at the chronovizer facility at the Maristown Performing Arts Center when it was under historical redevelopment into a public facility was just closed at that point. And then of course, there was the way in which many of the people in both programs, or at least some were CIA. And we know about that substantial Catholic faction. And, you know, it's clear that sovereign Vatican military orders or those are under the British monarchy could actually be running the CIA. And Courtney Hunt told me that the CIA or the US intelligence committee actually began with the Catholic confessional because in that way, the priesthood gathered secret at sort of a village level about individuals misdeeds. - Right. - And so there's certainly a Catholic connection. I'm not anti-Catholic. I'm not anti-anything. I let people practice their religions and faiths. And I don't interfere. But there was a substantial Catholic CIA contingent in both programs. - Absolutely. - That's a whole rabbit hole with the Catholic Vatican. - Yeah. - We don't have time yet. - I do want to talk about, I want to get your thoughts on some of these glitches, quote glitches in the Matrix we see, time anomalies, Mandela effects. What are your thoughts on that? And how is that occurring? - Especially like the Mandela effect. Is that a result of time travel? - No, I believe that the notion that the Mandela effect and these glitches in general are the result of time travel like chronovision is kind of a public legend that unfortunately sort of got initiated when Carrie Cassidy scripted the notion of project, Montauk and project-looking glass, even though the looking glass device or chronovisors were part of project Pegasus under DARPA. I'm not saying they knew all of the results, so it's certainly possible that some incidents of quantum pollution could explain some of the time slips people have had and who I've interviewed, who have been driving in Nevada or someplace to go to Las Vegas, let's say. And an hour later ended up in the same location. I had to redrive it without circling around. So there is this kind of time slip phenomenon. My personal, my conviction is that certainly the Mandela effect is occurring. So one that I'll share that I've certainly identified on a people, I have noted this, but in the original Gettysburg Address, Lincoln said that they have thus far so nobly advanced. And in the version at least of the Gettysburg Address that Kenny Rick Burns reproduced with Sam Waterston, the actor being the voice of Lincoln on their phenomenal 1989 documentary, "The Civil War," Waterston quotes Lincoln as having written and said that they have thus far so nobly carried on, which is not even grammatical. And there's all the other ones. People I've known have told me they've found ancient Bibles that say the wolf shall lay down with the lamb after the second coming, not that say the lion shall lay down with the lamb, which is what I remember. And now in some Bibles, it says the wolf shall lay down with the lamb and so forth. So I think we can take the Mandela effect as a given. Now my conviction is it's not time travel, which has always been rather de minimis in location and extent. It is the 2000 or more nuclear weapons that we've exploded that I was happy to see Richard Dolan state on a mainstream UFO program recently that the primary motive for the post-war UFO activity we've gotten has been our practice of blowing up nuclear weapons. That would be my guess that they've destabilized the quantum hologram, at least to have episodically changed content or event of that nature. 'Cause it hasn't been a mass of dislocation where people have woken up and the state of New Jersey is no longer there. But there have been incidents like that case in Japan where the guy showed up and showed a passport to the Japanese authorities that was which was for a European nation that didn't exist. - I heard about that. Yeah. - And those types of events. So those seem to be local episodic, time slips through other dimensions or lost or changed content. And I don't believe time travel is causing that. Although I don't discount the possibility that it could have caused some of the time slips. But I think the greatest danger that we should worry about and have worried about for many, many years is the fact that nuclear weapons destroy the physical substrate of the known universe. And that was serious enough for inhabitants of other star citizens to visit us and not just begin studying us, but studying our children and not just studying our children, but studying the children of our aerospace community. Because look, we had nuclear weapons and rockets. So what could they readily conclude? We were gonna take our destructive weaponry or devices into the wider universe. And in fact, I learned from people at CIA that the reason individuals like I, whose fathers or mothers had worked in the defense industry is the ETs are so advanced, they were capable to track those adults home with different defense related industrial materials on their clothing. Because I was being contacted by the small grace throughout early childhood and being sort of tested by them. And sort of given a planetary consciousness like John Mack described in his book, The Abduction or Abductions. And that explains why I went on to become environmental writer in LA, right for the Cousteau Society and then pursue three advanced degrees in environmental studies. I was basically given a planetary consciousness, I believe, by the small grace. Now, I don't know what the small grays are and I do know that the government did not know what they were, where they were from or what they wanted. In fact, I was instructed to find that out during my lifetime. So when the Alex Collier's of the blogosphere say, "I know these are from Lyra and these are from Ganymede and all these different inclusive statements about where different ET factions are from." I do not believe that. That has not been the U.S. government's understanding. And there are other people very close to me who had parents working for the Defense Department or the military who would confirm the same thing. Usually their fathers confirmed that we didn't know where they were from, what they wanted or what they were. - Unless things are compartmentalized and there's some people that do, 'cause that's always, in my mind, that's always a possibility. - But that's possible, yeah, it's possible. - You know, there's people that do know, but it's all need to know kind of. - Sure, and you're not gonna have advanced ET races that respect humans, they're not gonna go, they're not gonna give the government who are treating humans poorly, they're not gonna go give them the information that they're looking for, they're gonna leave them on a wild goose chase and they're gonna start contacting some of these star seeds that aren't individually. - Individually. - Yeah, individually. So we can't discount like experience or claim just because the government doesn't know about it for that reason and many other reasons. I think at this point, it's all possible. - But you can't. - There are videos. - Yeah, I'm just saying that it's my suspicion as somebody with an original background in journalism professionally, that those who claim a specific sort of or a testimonial knowledge of specific ETs being from specific star systems are not offering supporting evidence. That's becoming very common where those things-- - That's true, that is true. - Then get sort of mimefied in the blog experience. - I agree with that. - I'm just not convinced that that's true. - Yes. - Unsubstantiated claims that no one can prove one way or the other that people cling on to as true as when we really don't know. - And people form, yeah, and then there's so many people that they have almost put themselves on this pestle. Like, I have all the information, only believe what I'm saying. And then somebody else is saying stuff that's a little bit different and people form these groups and it's just like-- - Guys, got to like-- - Right. - Don't do that. - Right, and also that historiographic violation of specificity being offered to promote belief but not to support the claims. - Right. - For specificity without evidential linkage. - Right, exactly. - So I wanna go back to, you said you were visited by the grades during childhood and this is off to time travel topic but when we talk on the phone, you were telling me about your Bigfoot experiences at age four and I was wondering if you were mind sharing that and then we could start to wrap this up. - Well in August of 1966, I was a month shy of my fifth birthday and the first time I went to an outhouse when we were camping, we camped a lot as a family really for 15 years. About like 1965 to 80. And then of course I camped with my dad in 80. But we were at Great Lakes Agandaga. There was kind of a campground, a little bit in from the shore of the Lake Sagandaga but pretty close actually. And then you had to make like a dog leg. You had to go down the campsite and then make a left. And there were two outhouses, far enough from the campground to not cause any problems. But when I made the turn, there were two, what looked like dark brown haired, ape like creatures. That clearly were not human. But they look very safe. They were just standing there. They didn't come running after me. They didn't smell really bad, as has been reported about Bigfoot. And they were clearly an adult and a child. The child was not my age, which was, you know, as I said, four years and five months. And then by the way, this was a year before the Patterson Gimlin footage from Scott Bluff, California was filmed. And so I didn't even know what a Bigfoot was or hadn't heard about it. And I walked up to them and being trained as a play kid, I said, "Would you like to use the bathroom?" And they just ignored me. They weren't speaking English. So I went in to do my business. And then when I stepped out of the outhouse, the adults asked what was standing in front of me on the right side, and his son or grandson or nephew or kid from his tribe, who looked about, I would say, about a year older than me, maybe six. He's definitely taller than me, but he's still very much a young kid. We're both looking at me. And when I did so, when I stepped down from the outhouse and looked up to see that they were looking at me fully, directly at them, the older Sasquatch jabbed his right hand towards the younger Sasquatch. As if to say, representationally, and I wouldn't say psychically, but it could have been psychically, he said, "Look, he's your age. "Why don't you play with him "while you're camping here at Lake Sagandaga?" And I didn't really say anything. I didn't fear them, but I was cautious because they didn't look normal. Now, how do they look? Well, the adults asked what she was about seven feet tall and rather thin, had a light cocoa brown fur, and his fur and his face looked not unlike Dr. Zayus in Plan of the Apes, but his face was longer than that. It was Simeon and not as Simeon, but certainly his mouth was just a slit very far down on his chin. Now, the boy on his left didn't really look like a Sasquatch, even though he was physically all covered with darker fur, the very sort of tone that the light of both of their furs took when I originally saw them as I was walking towards the outhouse. The boy looked more like Eddie Munster. He had like a widow's peak. He had very jagged, what are they called, inside their teeth, the sharp teeth on the front of the mouth, on both sides of the front of the mouth, and they were very long. - Seals are bad. - Sabretooth, the one. Well, they were sort of vampire-esque, yeah, but they were inside his mouth when he closed his mouth, but they were still very long, like three or four times the length of hours. And so I just didn't know what to say, and I realized they weren't speaking English. They were using, or the older Sasquatch was using a hand gestures. So I just walked around the boy and smiled and nodded, and then as I walked back to our campsite, I looked to my right, and they were both walking slowly through the tall grass, even though that tall grass would possibly, for a creature at least that high, the seven foot tall Sasquatch, would have been visible by campers, including my own family, looking to the back of the campground from their tents, or their fireplace, or whatever, in their campground. So they must have disappeared literally into the tall grass. Now Dr. Melba Ketchum, who found that Sasquatch have the matrilineal or maternal motherly DNA of modern humans and the fatherly or paternal DNA of an unknown primate, she did confirm for me off the record that they disappear. Now Bernie Mendez, my fellow Mars astronaut, stated that he was asked by the government to track some two Sasquatch who were running near the Holloman Air Force Base in New Mexico, and he was sort of chasing them with a helicopter, or in a helicopter. And those Sasquatch were clocked at running at 120 miles per hour. Now I've linked that back to the fact that two days later, when I was just throwing this little football around the field near our campsite, the younger Sasquatch ran out of the woods, smiled at me, and began playing keep away with me, or go get the ball, or whatever kids call that. Been many years. And this kid was like a Heisman Trophy winner, even though he was like just a year older than me. I mean, he could run like Anthony Davis at USC before he won the Heisman. He was a phenomenal athlete. But my theory is that the Sasquatch don't disappear, but just go from standing there to running away at 120 or more miles per hour, so people think they have disappeared. But he was an incredible athlete. Now the strange thing is about his behavior when we were playing together. Well, I didn't ask him to play with me. I didn't see him. He ran out of the woods when I started throwing the ball around the field. And I didn't see him up in the woods when I was doing so. In fact, I hadn't seen him since I confront he and the older Sasquatch up near the outhouse. And every time he would go retrieve the football that we were playing with, he would come up to me and not give me the ball right away, but kind of headbutt me by slamming his forehead into my forehead and kind of affectionately rubbing his face back and forth across mine, especially my forehead. And he wasn't trying to kiss me. There was no attempted sexual abuse by either of them. It was just like a Sasquatch way of saying to somebody, "Hey, I really like you, thank you for playing with me." Now the bad side of that is he hit my head so hard with his headbutt that I got a splitting headache and had to spend like the rest of the afternoon taking a nap in my tent that I shared with my brothers. And his breath was horrible. Both of them didn't smell physically, no beo, but his breath smelled like a six-year-old human child that had eaten meat from around age one or two and never brushed his teeth. It was god awful halitosis or bad breath. But he was very friendly to me. I finally said to them, "I gotta go, I've got a really bad headache." And so I took the ball and kind of showed him it with mine, I was leaving, I pointed to the campground. And he just kind of smiled and ran back into the wood. But I think this is proof positive that there are different Sasquatches. You know, there's supposed to be like four major ones. - Right. - The radio personality Gary Anderson recently told me that he was chased by a dark, apparently male Sasquatch, a dark, black or brown furred male Sasquatch. That was alternatively chasing him by running on two feet and then getting down on four legs. And I witnessed no such behavior by these primates that I met. And so I think we have to be open-minded about what exactly we are when we're talking about Sasquatch. - Right. I think there are many forms of humanoids on our planet. - I agree with that. - Yes, that's why there's so many different accounts and different descriptions of their behavior and personalities and the way they interact and the way they verbalize or don't verbalize. There's so many things to explore there. But that's very interesting. What happened to you as a child and very specific that we don't typically hear that type of detail coming from a sighting or an experience like that. But thank you so much for joining us today. This was great. We covered a lot of ground. I know we've been going for a little over two hours now. So we're going to go ahead and wrap this up. Is there any last words you'd like to share or want to let people know how they can find you for interviews or something like that? - I think on today's show, since I've mentioned a number of TV broadcasts so much, I want to just repeat my experience. That television is the fourth branch of government. And if you agree or have been condescend to appear on it, you're setting yourself open to be light about by paid liars. I was lied about by Matt Markovich of K-O-M-O in Seattle, the very major city in the state where I've practiced law since 1996. I was an admirer of Governor Jesse Ventura and he gratuitous he lied about me when he did an excellent show about me and even proved my claims. And then did this sort of bizarre statement at the end of the broadcast that I had in time travel, but he was certain I had been a victim of mind control. Now that apparently was some nonsense scripted for Governor Ventura by his producer Michael Braverman. Then I was lied to by Stephen Colbert, whose producer Jeff Cooper stated that they wanted to do a legitimate interview of me to explore how teleportation can alleviate American reliance on Middle East oil supplies. And then they just cut up the interview and made me look like a cosmic a-hole. - Of course, that's what they always do. - But then in the case of William Shatner on "Weird or What", I knew that Bill Shatner was a great actor and science fiction avatar with Star Trek and everything and that his mediate on that show was going to be humor. And I think he did a pretty funny job with it. So I didn't resent Bill Shatner's program with me. He's a nice guy, but something strange happened on that show. Instead of calling my dad Raymond, they used the name I won't repeat it, but the name of a first cousin of mine, one of my dad's nephews. So that's the intel connection to US television. They're constantly subverting true facts, calling truth tellers liars, and talking about, for example, an ET presence, just use this as an example, talk about an ET presence that my dad was designing in the metal alloy by which the ramjet would be built 70 years ago to drive the ET craft away from our planet. And they're still trying to influence Americans with shows like a paranormal caught on camera. Oh, look at these lights in the sky. They know we're being visited. I was briefed on that in 1970-71 that they knew we had been visited by as many as 70 different species of extraterrestrials, from different locations in the universe. And that for we're visiting us frequently, the small graves, the tall graves, the amphibians, and the Nordics. Then of course, we have Bill Tomkin's testimony about the Nordics versus the reptilians during World War II, with the Nordics supporting the Allies and the reptilian supporting the Axis power, the Nazis. So I'm very disturbed that true history is not being taught in America, and it's being constantly subverted by American mass media, especially television. It is wrong. And they're literally, imagine if Armstrong, Aldrin, and Collins were not allowed to talk about their landing on the moon with Apollo 11, but instead had to position themselves as participants in a secret space program and asked to be believed when people they knew were known liars were asserting the same accomplishment. I mean, that's fundamentally unfair and fundamentally anti-American. So I just want everybody to appreciate that and know that I was really subverted in sharing the truth when I agreed to do television programs, not a single one was fair, except maybe the travel channel, Mystery of the National Park broadcast I did on going back to Gettysburg. That was fairly fair. But some of the people there filming it were giving me hell as a liar right when I was filming it. I think working to believe me that my dad and I worked with the quintessential Manhattan Project business was Harold Agnew, and we did. Why don't you just go back to Canada and not make this production? - Right. - Well, if all people were admitting we have them because we were put on you, you know? So-- - They're the ones who are mind controlled. They're the ones who are literally programmed to keep chasing, chasing the story. And as soon as they find an answer, you're a liar. You know, they don't want the answer. They don't want the answer. They want to enter, it's for entertainment value, you know? - Also that. - And that's a disaster for a potential disaster for this great country. And it's wonderful 330 million people in the Maine. Wonderful. Because the Chinese have wanted to take the American mainland for 40 years. - Oh yeah. - And I am not anti-Chinese. I've had many Chinese Chinese friends over the years. How can I live in California, Oregon, and now Washington, and not? Just as I have many, I've had many friends over the years from other Asian countries. But the bottom line is I've already been briefed by the Intel community that while the Chinese military is somewhat of a paper tiger, that the CCP has still wanted to take this country and our food supply. But they don't have to buy Washington apples. They can have Washington orchards. In such an event that happened, we would either be dead or slave to the CCP in our own land. - Right. - I do not want to see that happen. And I think this pattern of constantly lying to the American people is potentially disastrous to us. Because how do we know that at some point, opportunists in the deep state might make some Faustian bargain to sell us out to make a couple hundred million or a billion from the CCP? - Right. - So this is a very important issue we need to rediscover what the truth movement meant. It wasn't about science fiction. It wasn't about believing every claim. But we have to become more sophisticated as citizens of this country. - Yes. - To understand the point I just made about television. It's been totally dishonorable and unfair the way that I've been treated on television. - What does that tell you about the media? I mean, it tells you everything you need to know. There's agendas behind what they're telling you. Truth is not a part of their modus operandi. They have agendas that are not ultimately my opinion for anyone's good. It's for power and control. It goes back to that. It's about how we will lie through our teeth to get you to believe what we want you to believe. Not tell you things that we should-- - And then on the blogosphere, I can thank radio and podcasts, broadcasters, and written journalists. Print journalists for being very fair in the telling of my story. I mean, W. Lewis Perdue of "The Washington Post" first wrote about my time travel experiences in 1982. And he just said some snarky thing at the end of the piece like Governor Ventura did and Matt Markovich of ABC, Seattle did, and so forth, ABC, TV, Seattle. But at least he was covering me. But I've gotten very fair treatment from radio and podcasts, broadcasters, and that's kind of renewed my faith in my fellow Americans and in the First Amendment, right to freedom of speech and press and assembly. And yet television has been so unfair that I think it would have even been fair to respond with violence to the television personalities that you handle. Because that may be for Bill Schatner. I still like the guys. It's a good, funny coverage, but he was still letting my, like my teleportation information stuff to come out. Well, I mean, my story is my time travel information is 50 years old when I left Project Pegasus and I left Project Mars, what, 38 years ago, 1984. So we are so far behind reality that we have to contextualize the fact that this kind of deception is regularly being used on, especially on television. And then when individuals like myself trained in journalism and history and law and semiotics became too effective at proving our true experiences, what they did is the blogosphere began to be crowded with what I call the odd opportunities, the delusional and disinformant. So that, okay, we can't prove these people wrong. Let's just flood their area of work with false claimants. I'm sorry to say that has also happened. So it's a mess now. And we're not, certainly not being told the truth about things that have been traditionally cabined under what they call the paranormal, which have just been the advanced, but not yet explained or even written about, reveal whether it's ET or time travel technology or what have you. So we have to be much more sophisticated as denizens of information and we're not being. And I think that's led to problems on the left and the right. I am not, just as I'm not a Dr. Nair Christian, I am not a Dr. Nair leftist or rightist. When I ran in 2016, it wasn't as an independent with no party, very little financial support, but I still got about 25,000 to 50,000 votes in about half the states. So I believe that all of us have to pull back and realize we're being manipulated and therefore not make religious collusions that either Republicans or Democrats are advancing because there are operatives who are manipulating reality. - Those sides, right. - Exactly. - Be careful. - Well, that's why we're doing what we're doing. I mean, to provide a stage for people like you and to come forward and whether or not, this is reaching the right people or not, it's still affecting the collective consciousness and I think it's a step forward. And so thank you again for joining us. We're gonna go ahead and wrap this up before we go on for too long here. So we appreciate your time. Thank you for sharing your story. It's an incredible testimony, it really is. Keep doing what you're doing. Thank you guys all for tuning in. We love you and we will see you next time. Have a great evening. 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