The Cārvāka Podcast

Sheikh Hasina Resigns And Flees Bangladesh

In this podcast, Kushal speaks with Abhijit Iyer-Mitra about the recent turn of events in Bangladesh, where Prime Minister Shaikh Hasina has resigned and fled the country following weeks of violent anti-government protests. They also talk about the attacks on the Hindu population of Bangladesh that have followed the exit of Sheikh Hasina.

Follow Abhijit: Twitter: @Iyervval

#bangladesh #sheikhhasina #hindugenocide

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Duration:: 1h 5m
Broadcast on:: 07 Aug 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

So, everyone, welcome to the Charvip podcast. So, eight months ago, Abhijit and I had done a podcast where we had spoken about all the possible scenarios and discuss how three different nations have three different takes and interests in Bangladesh. We had discussed the Americans, the Chinese and the Indians, well, I guess Abhijit, the Americans won. Not really, in a sense, yes, look, you know, we have to understand that India always ultimately ends up winning in the neighborhood, okay, it's by default. This is one of those things where you have such a huge country in your neighborhood no matter what the other countries try, there's only so much you can do. Subnibola, kiteko, kalibana, gahit, it's such a complete disaster for us. Today, the Taliban is completely quasi-ali, arranged it in such a way so that they will very soon take over the embassy in Delhi. I have always been saying that they're very progressive secular patriots of Afghanistan. You know, the Taliban are secular, they are progressive. They are pro-women in an Afghan cultural context. We'll find the justification. You find Maldives. Maldives is slowly, slowly, slowly changing its tune, okay. This is something that, you know, the Mexican president Benito Cuarez after whom Benito Mussolini was named by his parents. He used to say, you know, Mexico's great tragedy is that we're so far from God and so close to America. So in Bangladesh, they have their own version, our great tragedies are so far from Allah and so close to India. Shilang Kame, we're so far from the Buddha and so close to India. Maldives may gain Allah in India, so it's like that. Bangladesh, see, China has very few levers to pull. America has more levers in the sense that, you know, American sanctions can be crippling for a country like Bangladesh. What they do is first they delegitimize the government, claim rigging all of that, then they basically give Hintzky, Agarthumnekuchkya, Hamsanctions, Nagilaganki. Now remember the Bangladesh and Pakistan elections happened roughly at the same time. The Bangladesh elections, they claimed very, they were not rigged, but they claimed very rigged because all the opposition had been banned. Those opposition parties had also been banned on very good grounds, they were doing terrorism and shit like that. Pakistan, where you had such clear rigging, at night we knew the independence who were PTI were winning in the morning that entire trend had been completely wiped out. After they stopped allowing a press inside the industry, America welcomed the Pakistani election condemned with Bangladesh election. Then Sheikhasena goes to America, she refused to meet a single government official, she sits in the US Bangladesh Chamber of Commerce and conducts all her meetings out of there. So the Americans, you can't say they activated the protests and things on the ground. It was more passive acquiescence. Agarthumnekuchkya, we will not impose sanctions on you. China, in a way, we still don't know what happened between her and Xi Jinping, but she cut short her visit a few days and she came back. So it's very difficult to blame this on America and China per se, except through omission. Her thing was, and look, I know the Bangladesh army believes this, the Bangladesh army was getting worried, if there is no opposition to Harsina, then automatically the army becomes the only other opposition and that is not a position they want to be in, because Harsina has gone out of her way to cultivate the army. She's tolerated a lot of corruption, whatever equipment they want is bought and given to them, no matter what the cost. All her relatives who don't get married by certain age are married off into army families. So she's built family connection, she's built everything, in fact, the current army chief is her nephew-in-law or whatever you want to call him, Heikhasena. So what we used to do, which is why he postponed his speech three times, first it was meant to be 3pm, then it became 4pm, then it became 5-something pm, it got postponed three times. So that Sheikhasena would get away in time. Then the army coordinated with the Indian government, see that they will selectively leak photos of a helicopter to give the impression and then Agartha, Tripura police said she had landed Nagartala, all fake news, it was done in complete coordination with the Bangladeshis, because we were tracking that C-130 that took off from Southwestern Bangladesh near the Bengal border, first it went towards Kolkata, its transponders were off, but the thing about flight radar is even if your transponders are off, you can't see it on the map, but you get the distress ping every two minutes it happens, so the new it was heading towards Kolkata, it course corrected heading north, then it course corrected a third time, coming to Hindu airbase in Delhi. First it was Gora Khoh, Gora Khoh also has an airbase, but then they decided it was going to come to Hindu airbase. So it was all very carefully done with the army, the army wanted her out, the person who ruined the entire thing, because the army fundamentally believes Ki, Tothin Salmi, she has to come back, she has delivered a lot of progress for the country, she has to come back. And they don't like the PNP and the Jammate Islami, because they fundamentally believe that they are going to take the country down. But you know, see, the army to go up against Sheikh Hasina and Labour unions is fine, but when a party is called the Jammate Islami for the army to take on an Islamist party becomes religion or army, that's a very dangerous thing that they don't want, right? So they also understand the army to army connects between the Indian army and the Bangladesh army are extremely good. So this is the army being in charge is not really a problem for us at all. Now we need to understand what the army has done. Everybody wants you to believe it was student protests that led to the ousting of Sheikh Hasina, it is not. The students were just the face in most of the organization and ground surge was done by the BNP and especially the Jammate Islami. A Bismik Kapuahe, when the power sharing happens between three, the students, the BNP and the Jammate Islami, first there's a fight between the BNP and the Jammate Islami on who is a stupid thing or who is going to get power. Then there is a thing between the students because they think all the propaganda is telling them that it was because of them that Sheikh Hasina ran. Now what the army is trying to do is they're trying to create a coalition that maintains this tension so that this government will fail and falter in about one and a half, two years and Sheikh Hasina can come back, he almost certainly will. But even that won't really happen because what has happened is her son, Sanjeeb, sitting in America has gone and made some extremely stupid remarks which he possibly should not have, ungrateful people, this, that, whatever nonsense, which now means that he is effectively closed the path for his own mother to come back. So there's somebody else which will have to come, I'm sorry, I'm just getting an urgent call. Can I just mute you for a second? Yeah, I do it, in the meantime I will look at a question by someone, think the post of rationalization of protest handling by India looking at Bangladesh's fair, also there is a direct way to help Hindus there. But as far as helping the Hindus is concerned, so here's what we know as of now, a lot of minority Hindu temples and Hindu houses are attacked, even a very famous Bangladeshi artist's house was attacked, yeah, so yeah, Abitubul, we'll take this question later on. So Sanjeeb, sorry, has thrown this spanner into the works now, not a very helpful spanner I might add. But let's see, there are lots of options even within the family to come back. Now we need to understand what the power base of these three parties is, the student power base you forget about. Students never really have a power base. Students love to think that they are the ones fronting change and all of that. No student movement has ever realistically either changed the government without some other support behind it, and they've never been able to hold on to pass. So you forget this entire student narrative. The second thing is the Abami League itself, the Abami League's entire thing has been rural workers and especially industrial workers, trade unions, labor unions and these things. And this is why Sheikh Mujibur Rahman, one of the first things he did when he came to power was nationalization of land and redistribution of land and things like that because it took away the power of the old land holding class. Now people don't remember, I want everybody to Google the 1974 Bengal famine after we liberated Bengal in '71. There was a huge famine in Bangladesh which killed off about one and a half to three million people, which is really what led to Mujibur Rahman's unpopularity, which is by Khaled Azia's husband, General Zia, was behind the coup that ultimately killed it. General Zia played a very clear role. He pretended that he wasn't involved in it, but he was. Those land holding classes, they attached on to the General Zia faction. That is the old land holding class and all the mullahs and things used to join that class because they were part of that, I mean you know how feudalized Indian Muslim society has always been, you see it, you don't see it so visibly in India but it exists because you look at all the BJP government schemes disproportionately up to 35% of the benefits have gone to Muslims. Why? Because that feudal network is still very, it hasn't been dismantled completely, they've tried to dismantle it but it hasn't been dismantled. Now what ends up happening is in Pakistan and Bangladesh it was much greater so and in Bangladesh they attached to Zia. Now the mullahs what happened was that they felt that they went getting a lot of the thing and they were the old razakas. Now remember Zia for all his faults could not see eye to eye with those who had supported Pakistan in this thing. So they went and formed the Jamaat Islami. Now remember the Jamaat Islami has a very same philosophy every in Bangladesh, in India and in Kashmir which they consider a separate state and in Pakistan, Jamaat Islami in Kashmir come militant wind here is Bulmajati and their political face is PDB, Mebu Babamu. In Bangladesh the Jamaat Islami is the Jamaat Islami, they are both the political wing and the sort of shock forces, everything is them and that is their roughly power bases. Now you tell me when landlords come back into power or when mullahs come back into power what do you think industrial labor is going to do? As it is Bangladesh is in very deep recession, I never realized this till Kushan Mitra called me up, you know Kushan tracks the automotive industry. Last year saw a drop of 21% in motorcycle sales in Bangladesh, none of us picked up on it. This last year and you Kushan sends me all these useless videos, all the important information you never sends me, so I called them and had a yelled at quite early yesterday. But what happens is clearly they have been cooking the books, this has been a very much economic drawn because barely her soul, there are huge mass protests in Bangladesh where life comes to a land of stands. Why was it more intense this time because of the economic stance? But was there a case that their economy was doing well? No, the books were cooked, that is the point because you cannot have or see scooters and mopeds and bikes. The first thing when you come into money is not a car, you cannot afford a car, you buy mopeds, scooters and things like that, so it is the clearest indicator that the lower sections aren't doing very well. And student cappella student can't guide you, you only buy motorcycles and things like that, you know, not even motorcycles, scooters or mopeds really, so it is a very clear, this thing you have, a whole, you have had an economic slowdown which was kind of the books were cooked to hide it and that intensified the nature of the protests. The first thing that happened was the army fundamentally believed he did not want to fill the vacuum. They believed that they needed to be a pressure release, just a pressure cook army, you have the whistle so that the pressure releases and the backup mechanism is the gasket which is incidentally an Indian invention by TTK, which makes prestige, which like Volvo and the three point seat belt, they did not paint until they didn't make it open to everybody else, but they wanted a pressure release, but not like this. The problem happened because the protests got so intensified that shooting had to result. And once the shooting happens, they realize if you exacerbate the situation, then you won't be able to control the outcomes, the outcomes were still controllable till they were not. So this is the background of what has happened so far, but I understand, army has done something very smart, mamad units is the nominee of the students who think they are the heroes of the thing. The BNP and Jamaat Islam, you are not happy at all because they are like by rioting sub-harmonica, the protests succeeded because of us, we are the parties of power, Tomko Cassier, Prime Minister Milrahe, I am going to be right now, mamad units is not going to be pathologically anti-India like the BNP or Jamaat Islam, but there is going to be a lot of tension, mamad units does not know politics, so he is not going to be able to make those compromises and shady deals that are required to whatever, and the army's wish, which is that this government would collapse in a year, year and a half, two years, maximum is what happened. But isn't mamad units again, the American guy, he is the guy Americans want, right? He is the guy who thinks that they all think similarly, he says all the right things for a Western audience, that doesn't mean he is not a patriot or anything like that, I do believe the prosecution of him was a bit malicious, for sure, but we should admit that he has done fraud, but it is also malicious to an extent, because if you want to prosecute him, I can show you a hundred people in the army league also have done far, far worse than he has now, what is going to happen is he is going to be the figurehead. So if you have a figurehead and a weak Prime Minister who just got written in a hejaltah what you are going to have is a whole bunch of people working at cross-purpose with each other and constantly in fact, and that's what you are going to see. Yeah, but okay, what do the Chinese gain or lose? Another thing that I have been hearing, in fact we had discussed last time also that the Chinese actually in a very weird way are actually on the Indian side on this occasion in Bangladesh, because they also did not want the Americans to get because I think Sheikh Hasina, one of the reasons that the Americans were irked was because Sheikh Hasina was kind of getting close to China and they hated that fact, right? Not clearly, so China is, see she manages balancing very well, we need to remember that. And the way she cut off, she was so pissed off, she got, I mean the amount of aid they offered Bangladesh was an insult, she also got pissed off and cut her visit shot, remember? So if you give me the fact that she was getting too close to China, we were perfectly, India at least was perfectly comfortable with her outreach to China. America is actually much more tolerant of these things, so I don't think China was the immediate catalyst. I think the decision had been taken long back for different reasons, a lot of it had to do with all the offshore gas that Bangladesh has discovered and the rights to extracting drilling and extracting all that offshore gas, sea bed drilling. Did that play a role, I'm almost certain it played a huge role, we don't know, we are not privy to private discussions and things like that, but you know when you have such huge reserves of gas, it's enough to make Bangladesh totally energy independent, it can actually become a fair energy exporter to India also. This Bangladesh to Karidini set the gas exporter in anywhere else, if you look at a map of Bangladesh, let me bring up a map of Bangladesh maps. Yeah, I also wonder what's going to happen to the Sili Bangladesh textile industry which India actually strategically let the Bangladesh industry to come up, I don't know what happens to our investments there, like India literally let their industry come up. No, no, no, see we also need to see it's not just that, we also screwed up in terms of not allowing our agricultural textile sector to you know expand and shit like that, but let me just show you this. So if you look here, TK, look at this, every single site is India except this part down south which is Burma, now I want to show you the topography, it's my topography name, now see this, in order for a gas pipeline, where is the market here? Bhutan can it import gas, Nepal, too expensive for China, yes, but you look at this part, this is the Arrakhan mountain range, it is a serious, serious mountain range boss, in order to take this you have to cut through mountains and then go all the way up through hilly territory into this, you have to cut through mountain ranges, see you're not flowing with mountain ranges, you're not flowing with a mountain range with the valleys, you have to cut against it, which means it has to go up, down, up, down, up, down, through very difficult terrain, this is not exportable gas unless you're looking at exporting down south to Thailand, which is a very, very long route and this part, it is much cheaper to transport it by a ship than it is to build this thing, which you never know, especially because this is a warthorn area, the pipeline is prone to sabotage, correct, so there's not much that you can do with that gas except export it to India, so this is leverage for us, number one, number two, you have all the illegal immigrants out here, if this government gets particularly hostile, what makes you think we're not going to push them back, that's our biggest bargaining chip, that's our biggest bargaining chip, now will the Supreme Court create troubles and things like that, of course it will be a legal process and things, but once the process is defined, once you come up with the legal definition of what a Bangladeshi illegal immigrant is, once you and it's actually a process where you can prove, if you've got an Adhar and Pankahad or whatever, like those two, that couple that was caught in the border just yesterday or day before yesterday, if they don't have the, see, Adhar or Pankahad is the basis Pemiltahal, You need to have prior documents, basis that the official record doesn't have the record of those documents, just basis with ukwadha, milath, hai, tsekra, etc. You would be deemed a bangladeshis. You will be kicked back. Now you might say Modi might not want to rule, but Humanta Bismal, Sarma will do it. It is widely popular in Assam. The Assamese wanted data. The Assamese Muslims wanted done because they don't like Bengali Muslims. You understand? Yeah, because the Assamese Muslim is fundamentally an Assamese. You look at like Parvina sultana and people like that. They are first and foremost Assamese. Parvina sultana kafoto google caroshi wears a big bindi. She looks like a typical, you know, East Indian lady. She's completely steeped in Assamese culture. They don't want these Bengalis around there. They want them out. Where do you go? Those nine districts that have become Muslim majority, they haven't become Muslim majority based on Assamese Muslims because the Assamese Muslim birth is the same as the Indian, more or less the same as the Hindu birth right now. These are all migrants that have come. Now Modi can just tell him, "Mantak, Tum desu kaakat nahi, manta will also do it." And you see, the thing is you can't do what Putin did to Ukraine justified based on historical wrong. You have to create a legal framework in the here and now in order to start pushing people back. Himanta knows this. He is a consummate player. He is not one of your morons who has come from the BJP who is all, you know, oh, bye chara, love, brotherhood, turn the other chief nonsense. He is a old congressman who fundamentally knows how to play power politics. And that is why, in my opinion, he is the best chief minister we have had in a very, very long time. He is the best chief minister in India. Let's be clear about it. He is total prime minister in material. What do you think about that? But then what happens to the Bangladeshi economy now? Now, the thing is, first they have to go through where the books were cooked with this kind of governmental dysfunction and all the labor unions being with the Abami League. What kind of difficult decisions can you take? You tell me? Actually, they can't do shit. Street veto is a game two people can play bus. This is not like India where one community comes out on the other street and the other community just sits at home saying, yeah, I just can't know. Now all religions are the same name. This is two people of the same community who both know exactly how to go street veto. So now you have students and Islamists. Tomorrow you will have labor unions come out on the street. So you can have an economist. But you know, the last great economist to become a this thing, of course, there's Javier Millet in Argentina who's turning the Argentine economy around. But Javier Millet has a very clear mandate. Now economics professors don't necessarily make good prime ministers. You know, Pakistan once had an economics professor, I think it was a World Bank, something who became the prime interim prime minister, he was good for Pakistan. He was only there for about six, seven months in between, I forget, it was in the 90s. And he said, unless you pay all your bad loans and banks, you won't be allowed to contest all the bad loans where he capitalized within months. But if for every Javier Millet and this Pakistan prime minister whose name I've forgotten. There was a Antonio Salazar in Olivera, the Salazar in Portugal. Despite the Portuguese empire and destroyed the Portuguese economy, he was professor of economics at the University of Coimira. He destroyed the economy. Just because you're a professor, some like the World Bank to college, some professors are very good professors, some professors are very bad professors who don't really engage interest. You're a professor in what? You are a professor of some weird gender studies and you could not be allowed to run this country now. But this guy is a professor of economics, fine. Social economics. That doesn't mean politics. That doesn't mean you know politics. So this guy will have to adjust to politics. He's going to learn a very, very nasty game, because politics, if you think Indian politics is bad, you have no idea how bad Bangladeshi politics is. All the effective cost-cutting expenditure reduction measures you have to do and sometimes in recession, depending on the nature of a recession, you have to spend a lot more to stimulate growth. This was a mistake America made during the Great Depression. They cut expenditure instead of expanding it, which exacerbated the effects of this thing of the Great Depression. This guy will not be able to do it. I'm happy to be proven wrong, but on the balance of par basis, he's not going to be able to do it. So I don't think we need to fret that much. I'm very angry about what's happened, but I'm not despondent about what's happened. Because I see a silver lining, I see lots of silver lining, not in one year, but two, three, four years, I see nothing but silver lining in the horizon. Yeah, I mean, as far as they say, the rule in the Indian subcontinent is the house always wins, and the house in this case is India. We always win. Exactly. We always win. I mean, and there is historical precedent for that, right? It's not like the first time the Americans have done some hanky-banky in this part of the neighborhood. And then I tell you the thing about America. I use deep state every now and then, because lo and behold, there is no such thing as deep state. They're too dumb to even have a deep state. You know, I'm going to use Balaji Srinivasan's example. When people think of government, they think of, you know, independence day, you know, the alien invasion movie. The government is totally on the ball. The president knows everything, and the rest of the world differs to the American president, and he leads the counter attack because he's an old Air Force pilot. But the real American government is the movie Balaji Srinivasan tells you to watch, which is Don't Look Up, which shows you exactly how dysfunctional government is. I didn't know, I only watched that movie after Balaji recommended it. I'm like, "BC, this is exactly what government is." Yeah. All governments are like that. And this is why I keep telling people, "Please watch Yes, Minister and Yes, Prime Minister. Don't wait until I can download it, don't wait until I can download it. Please." Nothing portrays government. You people think of government, you know, from the Socratic, the great ship of state. Is it Aristotle or Plato or Socrates? I think it's Aristotle or Plato, but anyway, the great ship of state. It is the great bloody chaos sinking ship of state anywhere in the world. How efficient is government of Patajalthagi, handles your block, may you not say, "Hajate?" The thing is you incentivize enough people to act in a collective way. So the Americans, they do mischief everywhere. You look at the Indian, the American embassy in India, they keep promoting news laundering, then they promote the Teishpak, how to tell disinformation and misinformation with Deishpak and how to influence policy by Deishpak, policy chatter, gap policy, but then you have a low-grade bloody, he's not even a page three celebrity. He's like an F-grade celebrity from Hollywoodia, from Los Angeles, who's been made your ambassador here. America's technocratic ambassadors have always been outstanding here. Every time you've had a political appointee here, it has never been good. Okay, you have them doing all their mischief. They do mischief everywhere. It's not deliberate mischief, it's not some great soot, so much kick away. They're just the reacts, it involves playing and much more so in this government because your vice president is a bimbo. Your president is a walking cadaver. You don't know what he listens to, you don't even know if he's alive. It's literally like attack of the zombies kind of movie happening. So there's nobody to control the government out there either. They're all working at trans purposes with each other, which is why they can't support you also, but they can't bring you down also. You bought a jeep that he'll kiss you all. You know what I have understood with these government, they have these conversations amongst each other in silos. They are all in silos and they are very much affected by their own echo chamber and it happens in our government also. I mean, like I said, every government, it happens in our government. No government on earth, which is efficient does not have copious quantities of waste. You know, there was a report that came out the American Department of Defense accounting errors. Do you know how much money the US taxpayer has lost on? Let me just find that report department. This was a couple of years ago or what that report? No, this was just a few months back. Department of Defense report lost to. I don't remember this specific one. Wait, let me show you this. They've lost almost a trillion dollars to accounting errors. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember this one. Yeah, how nice. Remember this? No, I can't find the reports right now. Yeah, you know, the keywords to search for, but a trillion dollars lost to accounting errors. Oops. Even small, efficient countries like Monaco, Lichtenstein, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Austria, Switzerland have chronic government malfunction. It can't be avoided. Now, okay, what has happened is happened. Now, okay, I understand we have a treaty with Bangladesh, extradition treaty with Bangladesh, but why this keep us in a year? Nair, what's the point? I mean, she's going to be happy here. Grant political asylum. Then extradition can't be. Extradition can only be invoked when asylum is not granted. Yeah, so give her asylum. No, who cares? I mean, what? Oh, she is india's friend. Yeah, duh, she is india's friend. See, see, if she, she's not stupid like Sajid. Now, it's easier for her to go to the UAE because then she won't be accused of being an Indian stooch. But if not, I can tell you honestly, nobody in government is going to deny her the right to stay in India. You know, she probably spent more of her life in India in exile than she has in Bangladesh. Yeah, most young kids don't know that. You don't know that. She's probably more Indian than you or me are. Okay, she's certainly spent more time in India possibly than you or I am. So, I can guarantee you this. She will not be extradited from India. And she certainly will not be. Yeah. This is your article. Audit reveals army's trillion dollar accounting gaps. Yeah, she's holding her up only and dollars. Does it even sink in? How much one trillion dollars is? Yeah, they, yeah, people don't understand. People think government is Machiavellian. All governments are stupid by nature. They're stupid. How do I know? I mean, just three, four days ago, Abhijit and I saw a param example of government stupidity when I was vining. Yes. That's all I can say. We have to have everything working at such complete cross purposes to each other. Okay. A little Delhi palace would know this. Now the road outside my house has been dug up five times in the last three years. First, MCD won't put an electricity line, then NDMC came and put a water line. Then somebody else pamed it over. Then they decided that some other line needed some course correction. Then the water line started leaking and that needed course correction. I have seen my road and it's a main artillery road dug up at least three times, dug up and kind of repaved. Right now there is no paving on that road. Now you think this is unique here. It may be more sophisticated in America, but it's pretty much the same thing there also at a different level. It's not all corruption. India, the same CDNDMC thing is entirely corruption. It's to suck as much as you can out there. It's not corruption. It's actual incompetence and lack of communication. Yeah. Okay. Now one more aspect which has angered me the most in this entire issue is what can we do with the Bangladeshi Hindus now? It's quite clear they're going to be attacked first. What do we do? What do we do there? What does the Indian government do for the Bangladeshi Hindus? You need to issue a cassette notification extending CA indefinitely. That's exactly. If the one thing we can do as citizens of India is pressurise the Modi government to change the CA and create a special case for Bangladeshi Hindus. And what you do is send planes quietly to pick them up whoever wants to come to reach the airport to be taken out. That's what we did for the Sikhs in Afghanistan. So why can't we do it for the Hindus here? Do people realise that recently a very famous Bangladeshi Hindu artist? I forgot his name. He's a singer even. Even the French President Macron, he had also gone to his house and they thought he was calling Gandhi. Like what the hell? And how do we ensure that and I'm not just saying Bangladeshi Hindus all minorities of Bangladesh. I think India has to help them out. What the hell is where the hell are they going to go? Otherwise what is the natural homeland? And I understand not all of them can be settled in Bengal in India in one day but what is India supposed to do in a situation like that? And we know it's coming. But and we don't want their Islamists to come in India. They can stay in Bangladesh. They got the revolution they wanted but can we take care of the Hindus now? Yes and get rid of the Bangladeshis. Yeah I mean okay we you want Bangladeshis to stay in India. Now let's do a swap. Let's send yours here back to your country and we take ours back. Mind you all these people celebrating this democracy is cold for killing Hindus. That's exactly what it is. Because everybody is saying democracy doesn't want to talk about the Hindus being killed. And these were the same people that we're saying, go India should be given refugees status in India. Yeah yeah I want to ask you what is this commentary by a certain lot in India? Like I just like are these people are these people revolutionaries. I apologize for two people for showing these images. I normally avoid showing all of this stuff. But like these are your revolutionaries. These are the revolutionaries these people are talking about. This guy holding bras up. This is a revolution. You can't see revolution by? Yeah revolution. For the audio listeners this is a man who has stormed into the prime minister's house and picked out bras. That that is the revolution. They are they're talking about then then obviously in the quintessential Bengali, Thagri. One man was like meander Gea, Mirkumachimila, Mehmachilake Chalega, Muamachichur. That was the quintessential Bengali chur. And that this is the true Bengali. This guy know is actually a Bengali. Now the most curious tweet was from Mehmuba Musti's daughter. She tweeted an image of the Shilankar president's house being sacked. I think he was Bangladesh saying, "Yaar, either be democracy, Karavado and shit like basically on that think." Mehm. We should actually organize something like that in Kashmir. Yeah. There is not one Kashmiri politician who isn't corrupt, corrupt, insanely corrupt. Yeah. Okay. Chale, I'll take the questions because I know you have to go. Hasina was a blessing for India. No border dispute. No northeast. Assam, Vespengal, militant. Yeah, these based in India. Hasina could have easily weaponized public anger towards religious nationalism against India. So, obviously, Hasina was our best bet, which is why I've just said that we should keep our India. Is she perfect? No. Nobody is perfect. Yeah, yeah. He has to look after Bangladesh and for her, Bangladesh interests are always over India. But she believed in cooperative group. Was that something? Yeah. I know as a textile entrepreneur how much India has done for the Bangladesh textile industry. We have literally gone out of the way to let there. In fact, it was a strategic investment in India. Literally, Indian government have already gone out of the way. Textiles and ceramics. We control the growth of Tata ceramics to allow Bangladesh ceramics to this thing. But see, don't expect gratitude. Gratitude is a very heavy burden to carry. Never expect gratitude and don't do it in the face of Bangladesh. We help you do this. The point is she was our best friend. Was she perfect? No. Can you find faults with her 100? But she was the best amongst the whole bunch of options and she wasn't a bad option at all. She was a very good option. Yeah, yeah. So, India, should India try to carve out a separate province for Hindus within Bangladesh? No, right? I mean, that would be the worst thing we can do with Hindus. That's why I never tried any of this shit. I don't know who's told you this, but it's never seriously been considered. So, India doesn't do this carving up of provinces and humanitarian intervention. We have never done it. We never will. Because we know if we do it to somebody else, it will be done to us at some point. Somebody has asked, when can I as someone from West Bengal, for example, do to help Bangladeshis Hindus? Is there any platform where I can donate? Actually, you can. I can tell you, if you are allowed from India, you can donate to the Hindu American Foundation. I know Hindus in Scotland are trying to get some Hindus. You can actually donate to ISKCON. ISKCON has a giant presence in Bangladesh. And obviously, the Sadabahar Seva International is always there. Seva International and Seva Bharati India both are there and these organizations can be donated to if you want to help. Okay, won't hosting the ex Bangladesh PM. This is a good question. Hit India in the long run. Already, the narrative is said that she's an Indian puppet and now we are helping her and sort of solidifying that image. It doesn't hit India so much as it hits her, because she can't be seen to be an Indian puppet going back. For India, see if Bangladesh is decided to, if it wants to normalize relationship with us it way. If it is decided, it wants to do in its relationship with India it way. And so her presence here or not is completely irrelevant to that. So, someone has kind of asked about refugees, border safety, etcetera, like how do we ensure while we take the Bangladeshi minorities in Hindus especially because that's the majority of the number of the minorities in Bangladesh. How do we make sure Islamists don't come in? Someone has asked that. It's the NRC process. Okay. You show IDC, a Bangladeshi Hindu who's guaranteed this thing. We'll have no hesitation showing his background paperwork, showing his a Bangladeshi. A Bangladeshi Muslim will not be able to show that paperwork because he knows he's not going to, so he will forge documents. And when you go to the forged documents and verify their authenticity, you'll see there's no backup paper trail for it. So, it's not that tough to figure this out. Okay. The next question is, the lower sections of society, the most vulnerable sections of society are the ones who will actually have the documentation because they'll have ration cards and things like that because they've all been recipients of government schemes. You would work for Emendreka. You would need rations. You would all have ration cards. The Nepali Gurkha's working here have it so tough. They work so hard and they have it so tough getting ration cards because they're not Indian citizens and things like that. You know the system, if you learn how to use it, it actually works in your favor. Yeah. Yeah. So, so should India carve out an area for Bangladeshi Hindus like Turkey? So, we cannot do that. So, we don't have any practical way, like beyond certain things to get Bangladeshi Hindus in, like, can we not make calls? Somebody has asked like, tell the Bangladeshi. I know for a fact those calls are being made and the army is actually, see the army can't be everywhere at one place. Now, everywhere all the time they can't. They are doing what they can. Some of it is going to be unavoidable. So, do you think the post-doc rationalization of protest handling by India looking at Bangladesh is fair? Also, is there a direct way to help Hindus there? Okay. Stop asking the same question again, guys. I mean, we've already answered the second part of your question, so, stop asking it again. Post-doc rationalization by sub-localing. Okay. Shekhasina has dealt with these protests the exact same way for the last 15 years. Every year there has been one mass protest like this. 15 times it succeeded. This one time it did not. On the other hand, if you allow protests to keep metastasizing, you can also see, had she crushed those protests much more firmly, herself protests Nehuahota, they have never been allowed to grow so big and suddenly couple you one finally. What can India Alliance do in this entire process to help the current government? I mean, Mamta has been mature in this entire process. She's, you know, done that hand. I think Jodhke thing. I think what we should do is, if Shekhasina has no intention of returning to Bangladesh like her son says, she should made the BJP chief ministerial candidate for Bengal, and she. You want to get rid of Mamta Barrett? She'll do that. They like her that much in Bengal. Shekhasina. Post-doc Shekhasina comes there. Please understand. She's going to be the most popular Bengali leader ever. I don't think people understand the emotional attachment we have. Even me sometimes, you know, when I hear some Bengali songs and things like that, I get super emotional about it. You people don't understand our attachment to that culture. We fundamentally believe we are superior to all of you. And in that Mujib has a very, very important place because it was the, it was fought on a linguistic basis. It was fought on an ethno-linguistic basis, not a religious basis on an ethno-linguistic basis. Okay, her aura in I can guarantee you, she'll win about 80% of the vote if you make her a chief ministerial candidate in Bengal, try it. Forever solidify that she was an Indian agent now. She's political you fighting in India. That's why I said, that's why I said it depends on her. If she wants to go back, then no. If she doesn't want to go back, make her BJP Bengal president said her there. Okay, one last question and we wrap up. What do you think about the argument that Hasina was autocratic? So it was necessary for a protest like this as they cared for freedom of speech. Freedom of speech? Now see, these people don't care about freedom of speech. Let's be clear about that. Why did Hasina start becoming autocratic? She was very happy to compromise in the beginning and things like that. Then the Bangladesh rifles guys came out and tried to unseat her in 2009. That is when the autocratic street began because it brought back all the bad memories of the army killing of her entire family. And that is why she took that revolt very, very seriously and she started cracking down and any incitement to violence would be cracking down. Now anybody in India knows, and India is a slightly more developed society than Bangladesh in that sense, that it requires very little to trigger the fuse in rural India like it does in rural Bangladesh. So it became, see, the Bangladeshi opposition was so uncompromising like Rahul Gandhi, very divisive, very acerbic. So it became progressively more autocratic, autocratic, autocratic. It was a response to the situation around. It was that simple. Now you remember we spoke about this, about the statue of Justice outside the Supreme Court that the Jamadhi Islami first targeted it. And then they wanted to target Fujibur Rahman. So she doubled down and said statues everywhere of Fujibur Rahman. Was it a mistake? Yes, I don't think you should be that reactive but then it was what it was. I know you have to go Tujja. I will wrap up things. I wanted to share a few links with everyone to make people understand what's happening in Bangladesh. Tujja, I will wrap up. I know you have to go to a meeting. Tujja, Tata, bye bye. Tujja, Tujja. All right, I just wanted to show you guys a few things before we wrap up. Like this is a revolution, right? Yeah, revolutions are not like this, ladies and gentlemen. Always remember, is this a revolution? This is a revolution. This is a woman stealing an elliptical and losing an elliptical outside the Bangladeshi PM's house. I mean, I don't know if this is a revolution. I did not even know Dhruvrati had made a video pointing on Bangladesh also showing his hands. Apparently, this is like some four-year-old clip that I had come across. I had a hearty laugh on this also. Dhruvrati and his genius analysis. So, apparently, Mr. Rati had said this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. Bharat K premier YouTuber. I guess what the... Anyway, so, so, so, there was this journalist who had made this comment. I mean, it's the Indian liberal class is actually a very weird class of people. They really have developed a pathological hatred for, I don't know for some odd reason, for Hindus. And, yeah, listen to this. So, basically, so, basically, so, so, basically, so, so, so, so, so, so, look at the Kuchni or a Hindu or a Voni or a Hindu or a Kothofir. Yeah, Kyaathai, Smita had shared this image. And, any other things have been there too. Shek muchib kutakni bhakshan on it. Yeah, they wish Smith had shared this 32-dhanmondi, the iconic place from where Shek muchib gave the call of independence of Bangladesh has now been reduced to Sindhir's. Shek muchib's legacy is being wiped off now and being, you know, under the name of a revolution. Like, what kind of a revolution is this that is happening in Bangladesh? Like, what is this revolution? And these questions need to be asked, but hey, sometimes these questions are out of syllabus, right? I mean, people stealing sarees, people stealing bras. And the worst video to me was this one. Like, Shek muchibur rehman, whatever, he gave Bangladesh independence, right? And I never thought I'm going to see this site. This was, this was the worst of it all. This one. This is what we bring here. This is the revolution they wanted. The man who gave them independence, not one site. This is the equivalent of Gandhi Nehru's statues being broken in India. Yeah, I don't know. I'm sorry if I don't buy the revolution being that good and that's sensible for anybody in this country or in the neighboring country. It makes no sense, but he can't sell anything. Anyways, there were a few other super chats that Abhijit had to go, but I'll look at them. Bhai Vopurana podcast, link share, although after you posted that short, everyone has been looking it out on your channel, but cannot find it. I think you're talking about my first podcast with Abhijit's Bangladesh issue. So I can pull it up and I can share it with you guys if you guys want. Just give me a second. I'll have to look it up. I had tweeted it out. I have to look it up. Yeah, so here's the link. I'll share the link with all of you and I'll put it up on the screen too. So this is the link and I'll also pull up the screen and share the screen grab with you guys. So you guys can watch that also. Basically, everything Abhijit and I had feared in that particular video has come to this was American interference in Bangladesh and you guys can go and check that out. That was one. I think the postdoc rationalization of protest handling by India looking at Bangladesh is fair. Yeah, well, I think it was always the right thing to do. Some of us were always supporting it. U.S. endgame Abhijit Choudha says Indian prevent Indian rise. Any other aspects in this game plan? It's very hard to say what the Americans want. I think Americans, nobody should give so much credit to Americans that their governments are as stupid as Indian governments are as far as I'm concerned and we should never overestimate anyone. Good to hear from Abhijit. This money is from Abhijit, not for crucial well. It's going in my pocket. So too bad. What options does India have to protect Hindus? Well, options are obviously messages will be sent to the current dispensation in Bangladesh and the army that if anything happens to the Hindus, then etc, etc, etc. That would be one of the things. Other is extend the CA and slowly but surely get as many Bangladeshi Hindus as you can inside India. Just to give you guys a perspective on how bad the democracy change in Bangladesh has been. This is the population of Hindus in Bangladesh. This is a chart and let me pull the message out. So, the Bangladeshi Hindu population has significantly declined from 1951 onwards and it's come down to 7.5 percent. Now it was 22 percent at one point of time, Bangladeshi Hindus. And this is the religious diversity. There are 15 crore Muslims, 1.31 crore Hindus, 10 lakh Buddhists and 4.95 lakhs Christians and 1.98 lakhs others. These must be atheists and other religions. Now these are honestly these 1.4 or 1.50 lakhs minorities of Bangladesh honestly have to be taken care of by the Indian government. We have no other option. We have to take care of them. Is this recency bias on my part or has the world been this chaotic? The world is getting better. It's just your recency bias and bad analysis that you think things are getting bad. Honestly, I don't think things are getting that bad. Okay, the rest of the questions I had actually covered pretty much. Somebody's asked about Abhijit's cooking channel. I don't know when he'll bring it up and I don't care about that. It has nothing to do with this podcast. Assina was responsible for 250 students death and many say it was totally organic movement. What do you say? Well, even if the students movement was organic, I have always believed kids are stupid and they will realize that there is no such thing as a revolution in the real world. USA wants a new Christian country using Bangladesh territory. Nothing of that sort is going to happen. What is my opinion on the broadcasting bill? I have not read the bill so I cannot give an opinion. Who will stand up for Bangladeshi Hindus accept us? How should Hindus be? Well, Bangladeshi Hindus will have to be brought in India and some parts of the western world and India and the Indian government will have to take the lead in that and already it has been taken. Even I have helped a few. So it's not like it's not happening. So don't worry. I mean, things are happening. Okay, by Apco, Calistani, Canada, Sinikana, Chatea for alleged anarchy you are creating by tweeting against them. They can do what they want to do. What are the Canadians going to do? Send me back to India. Really? They think that is a problem sending me back to India. That's literally my home. Stupid people. Apologies if this was already answered. The goal of a Christian state is true as claimed by Hasina. What's the risk for India given the general perception that eastern states don't receive much support from the central government? I don't know what is the whole context of this question. So I don't know. I'm not going to answer. Will Bengali Hindu liberals come to their senses? Most Bengali Hindu liberals are coming to their senses. Exceptions apply. Demographic change, worse in Bangladesh and Pakistan. I remember Pakistan did not even have Hindus. This so-called partitioned Capele it in a Hindu hotel in Pakistan. They were all in Bangladesh and a few of them were in Karachi or in Sindh. Pakistan, what it stands as today, had pretty much wiped out its Hindu population even before we were partitioned. They were barely Hindus there. Other than pockets like Lahore, Karachi and some parts of Sindh, they were barely any Hindus. The so-called Hindus of Pakistan were all in Bangladesh or Wahape, Assali, Hindu cleansing. I don't know why people keep thinking that West Pakistan make which Bahatsare, Hindu Pradesh or Thaini. Already you are trickled down Karkhe Northern India and I am not a chukithya. Pailasey, you are not going to go to Chukithya. Patanikyo, you are not going to go to Bhagat Saare, Bhagat Saare, Bhagat Saare. Thaini. Pakistan celebrated the Kabul fire. Now they are doing it for Bangladesh but Taliban relationship with Pakistan is bad. Do you see something like this? Listen Pakistanis are known to be a stupid society. Pakistan is a stupid country. Pakistan is a stupid country. So why even bother about those things? Honestly, why even bother? Anyways, I think it's time to wrap things up. Once again, I would like to remind you that if you want to really, if you care for the Bangladeshi Hindus and Hindus in general that are outside India, there are very few organizations that can help. I told you, you can help his con, you can help Seva International or Seva Bharati India. There are a few others that are doing good work across the globe that can be helped. So be careful in the organization you donate to. Be very, very of people on Twitter raising funds, asking for money to help some Bangladeshis, double check, triple check, quadruple check them. A lot of people kind of jump on the bandwagon when these things happen. So be very, very, very, very, very of these people. I'll leave it at that. Any future books that I'm working on? Yeah, and my next book is going to be on blasphemy and how blasphemy is important and needed. If India wants to maintain a semblance of stability in its society, it actually needs blasphemy because the only way you are defeating monopolistic monotheism is through blasphemy. And best of luck, if you think you can defeat them without that, why US doesn't care about destroying other countries for its own benefit. How was Bangladesh? Anyway, it's going to harm them. The US doesn't think so much, boss. Again, you guys keep making the mistake. You think foreign policy is done by Machiavellian people. It is not done by Machiavellian people. It is done by extremely reactive human beings who react on this part. Anyways, we'll wrap things up. Once again, I want to remind each and every one of you that the Charvuk podcast is not done, run on ad reads. It's run on the support of a regular membership base. So if you can't do consider joining the membership program of the Charvuk podcast, whether here on YouTube or on Patreon, if you do that, that creates the bulwark on the basis of which this podcast runs. So do consider joining it. If you want to send your one-time donations, you can send them to Kushalmara at ICICI. If you want to buy Charvuk podcast merchandise, you can go on Kushalmara.com or on Kodak merchandise and buy Katcharvuk podcast merchandise. If you want to buy my book, Gnastic why I'm not an atheist, you can go on Amazon right now. It's available in your country wherever you live. If you can't do anything else, just like this video, subscribe to the Charvuk podcast YouTube channel and leave a comment in the comment section. If you are an audio listener, do consider leaving a rating on your preferred audio platform. I'll see you guys next time. Until then, Namaste. Take care. Bye-bye. [Music]