Our favorite social worker, besides me of course, is back with us, discussing expectations vs. needs. Enjoy! <3
Emotionally Unavailable
Episode 43: And Now You May Go...
it's okay let's give ourselves some stuff love there so yeah very happy when this airs though he'll be like thank you Jenny thank you for helping my work here's the thing is that when I give you the trust you really have the ability to crush me the vulnerability yes welcome to emotionally unavailable the podcast where we dive deep into the world of emotional availability and intimacy I'm your host Melissa Hepner and I can't tell you how excited I am to have you join me on this journey of self-discovery and connection whether you're navigating the complexities of relationships or exploring your own emotional landscape this podcast is here to inspire empower and entertain so get cozy and let's explore the depths of human emotions together hello everyone today's episode is our favorite LMSW Jenny Kimpton I hope that you enjoy this episode it is very long so I'm not going to talk very long yeah that's it okay enjoy hi I'm good how are you good me hear me okay yep I hear you great so it was hard for me to get across over text kind of what I've been thinking because it's a lot it's it's it's not just one thing about expectations it's coming up a lot so I know that it's something that's gonna help a lot of people if I'm struggling with this so we started our finding peace book club this week and so I've gone through the wounds and whatever no real big surprises except for I was a little surprised at what betrayal encompassed and I've definitely ignored that more than I should have and I was really glad to see that on paper and I was deeply confronted by the lost wound understanding I'm a person who says acknowledge all lost honor degree from transition and yet I have never dealt with any loss outside of death I've always ignored it and I was very confronted and I was like okay I needed on yep and so I was like right every single thing out and hurt to look at it I mean you know it doesn't hurt any more than shoving it down for 44 years so yeah but that was cool but you know when you get a lot of new information and you love it you receive it you don't always know where to put it yeah this is what I'm struggling with in expectations is I don't necessarily know only what are healthy expectations for people and I also don't know what to do when somebody is consistently not meeting an expectation and I mean the big ones like you know it's something that their action directly hits me in my betrayal wound not to mention you know I have trauma brain and I'm never going to get it to a place where I can manage my triggers if I don't get a little more consistency and reliability in my life you know what I mean and so that's the things that I'm really focused on I'm not trying to nitpick anyone in my life but I don't know where to go with them if they can't meet my needs as a human you know what I mean yeah that's why I'm like what do we do like it's overwhelming because I feel like you have to make decisions or something and I'm like okay I'm overthinking this so let's talk to somebody who's not in the middle of figuring stuff out you know what I mean mm-hmm all right so I might need some scenarios here to work with okay I think that's probably the best way to address it if you asked I was talking to Troy about this and he said if you have expectations you're setting yourself up for failure right no I agree with that but what that's what I'm saying what do you do in all your relationships how do you live a life without expectation all right so he also said if you have expectations where are those coming from yeah let's think like I've really addressed most of them in fact most of them I feel like I have addressed especially anything that was blaringly obvious and blaringly unhealthy and unfair to anyone like I realized it was my expectations of the people that I love and that I wanted to love me that they would then make me feel at all times with their actions and words the way my parents never did the things I came from my authority figures especially an intimate partner I really direct there's they there's a direct line between my intimate partner and my wounds that my friends can't really hit but probably because I don't know you know I probably just have never let them that close so yeah I did but yeah yeah I mean it's just a different level of stuff and you have to partner with someone so that's what I'm saying like how can you not expect like things out of your partner I just don't get that but I'm it's a serious question I'm not being sarcastic yeah I'm trying to correct my thinking that's where I'm lost where do you go from here yeah so what would it be an expectation that you might have well the the biggest ones that hurt me the most when they're not met is this is a classic example of dealing with Brian two days ago I called him and I expressly said a need which is hard for me but I said hey meet and Bryson at this car dealership I'm actually not a thousand percent sure that he can rent this car because he got hit by car and their insurance is paying for it but he's not 25 and I really wasn't sure what the rules were and I was like I can't I don't have the capacity for that today so I'm asking you to meet me there and he's like are you blah blah blah which enterprise and I said you know I'm pretty sure it's this one but I can't even I was exhausted and not feeling well so I was like I would I would prefer if right now you call Bryson and ask him that perfect we hang up the phone five minutes later I get a call from Bryson and and I was like okay and did you talk to Brian like y'all good he knows where to go whatever and he's like oh well he made it seem like he didn't need to come then and I was like where did that get some translation I was like really because he just said he was gonna call you to see which enterprise to go to so I called Brian and he says the same thing Bryson just said and I'm like okay did it it seemed really certain because the words came out of your mouth I'm calling Bryson to see which one I'm going to and now you're saying you weren't a hundred percent sure when you called him that you needed to and he gave you information that seemed like you didn't need to so I'm pissed because it was his job to ask a clarifying question if he truly didn't understand the plan which I don't know how I'm supposed to know you didn't understand the plan when you repeated back to me the words and this happens every day he's saying the words in his own words he's doing everything that he's supposed to do to indicate a clarifying you know like we're on the same page and then when it doesn't get done he says to me that's not what I thought you meant and I'm like I have to have a partner I can make plans with like I'm tired of accommodating his brain and and I'm tired of accommodating everyone around me and I think that's why I'm asking about expectations because I believe that I started a self-help journey years ago to try to get better at handling the people in my life there was some merit in that I didn't even realize I was walking around an open wound I mean my entire outside was open to air and receiving all the harsh elements into the wound I get it and I wasn't kind and I wasn't fair ever but I am trying to be fair but it feels like at some point like is Duke does what I need matter and and it feels like if I continue to bend in these areas then I'm saying I don't matter to myself and I don't think that's true and I don't I just don't it's not just him and it's not just this but inconsistency unreliability real big deal to me and it's kind of a deal breaker like if I can't get this little bit squared away I don't know where to go from here because I have to have somebody I can make a plan with and strategize I mean I that's my big struggle is I feel alone and with the mental load you know what it is like the woman household generally carries all of that weight and stress and you know we're the ones that when our head hits the pillow we remember what we didn't get done for our personal lives you know Brian does that with his work life that's the way his brain works and I understand that I do but every time I try to like accommodate his brain I just get back because ends that that accommodation won't work well you got a bin somewhere man where where's the bin you know so that's like am I being unreasonable I'm open to hearing that because I just I just need to know what like direction to go in because I'm not as much hurt by it now because I get it but I am frustrated and like I don't want to live in this like world of frustration all the time you know yeah well I'm what I'm thinking about doing is I'm gonna ask you a couple questions here yeah I'm not gonna filter it through okay so what wound did it hit um or we let neglect is the biggest one but also betrayal because you told you made a promise to me when you made an agreement I know he didn't promise in my heart that is a contract if we fit and we establish a plan together that is a contract and and I yep so that's the trail in neglect that's the two that it really hits okay probably abandoned mix I feel alone okay so I'm gonna ask you just briefly how old are those winds birth okay when's the first time you remember experiencing that any like those winds neglect would be well probably neglect abandonment probably three or less and my understanding of betrayal didn't really start until a little older than that but I would say it must have been by the time I was six because I remember that I was six when or five something like that my grandma we had moved again and she had said she would bring my bike over to the new place that we lived at and it was a really big deal to me because she never didn't do what she said she was gonna do and by five it was really important to me that people do what they say they're gonna do and she forgot it was the first time she forgot to do something and I remember feeling really crushed by it okay and then that was added on to I'm guessing the wound got bigger as you oh yeah every adult time I failed me every day of it so yeah okay so what are the core beliefs that let's start with that betrayal and what are the core belief what's the like when that one gets hit what do you believe about yourself others and the world around you so I am statements being I am not enough I'm not where they love and belonging I'm flawed and defective not worth people's time safety and trust being I can't trust anyone I can't trust women I can't trust men you know there's that can I really feel like this answer would have been much different before I met you but I really feel like now the messaging is I literally cannot trust anyone and I'm never going to be able to depend on anyone other than myself I hadn't been able to identify this but it makes sense that that's my core belief because I've been like I'm pretty sure it's not healthy to think this way but if I'm not supposed to have expectations of anyone then why can't I just be hyper to independent and say screw it and live an isolated life you know what I mean yeah so it's it's really hard I'm just gonna give you a self-compassion moment here really quick it's really hard when you start doing the wounds like when I first opened up that one chapter like it's like I'm taking off those bandages and then I'm like oh it's kind of raw and yeah it's gonna hit things in a different way there so self-compassion as you're going through this because you're seeing things differently you're constantly like you are you literally just wrote down all the things in your life that have ever happened and you're so I do so many emotions at the at the surface right now it's like yeah I mean it reminds me of my sister had some burns when she was in the third grade and they had to scrub them and yeah do the debris yeah yeah and it was just so painful so we're just starting that process out with the wound assessment and it's it opens up a lot of things there so just being aware there and so going back to some of those questions and then powerlessness can be something else like I'm never gonna it's always gonna be this way I'm never gonna overcome and it's it can cover several different areas like depression anxiety addictions all that stuff here me I think to there's a lot of fear there because I'm like I can only change myself I only get control over myself so where's that gonna lead me whenever I get you know like because at the end of the day I can do it all right and I'm still surrounded by people who aren't like thinking the same way I am so you know you go get vulnerable with someone and you say the things you know and then they're not emotionally available so they're pissed that you even said it you know what I mean and I'm like okay well I try to get yes yeah and the interesting thing about this with couples is that we're hitting each other's wounds and we don't even realize it and so yeah and that's why I even feel guilty talking about this but I mean he knows I'm not I don't think he's like an asshole and I I don't you know like this is not like me trying to decide if I should divorce him it's really this he hits this every day because of who he is but this is a very common theme in my life and and I decided years ago I was never gonna have anybody reliable so I know that I also do things to confirm that bias I just I'm not always aware of them obviously because I would like to think I wouldn't go to sleeping decisions like that but but I this you know my kindest friends usually are my most unreliable friends and so I give them so much break and great because they're nice but they're not eating my needs and I get really tired of people just being like like I'm OCD or something I I'm gonna ask my little Virgo friend okay she'll make fun of me for being calamity and chaos where this person over here who can't you know plan a day of their life is making fun of me for being too regimented and I'm like it's so crazy how you can be too much and not enough all the same time every day your life you know yeah so we're all going around hitting each other's wounds and that's yeah just a thing and the more like the closer you are to someone I mean I'm living with a person and so I just went to the beach and I had a I had a sunburn and so my daughter gives me a tap hug and or I turn over in bed and I'm like this hurts or my husband's just trying to touch me and I'm like hey you know so we're just close to each other so those things happen the closer you are to people I mean it's more you're you are able to have connection more and you're able to hit each other's wounds more so just like that this is a thing that people experience and so that's you know that's just good to know and kind of point out there so I'm gonna ask you about neglect what's your what's your core belief around that when that one gets hit is it a I am statement is it a trust powerless it can be several of them but when that gets hit what does it say about you or the world around you again it's so different even now than a month ago but I know prior to working on this particular wound it was very much well I mean that makes sense I'm not worthy so a lot of the neglect happened in the whole you're too much vain and so that's you know like dismissing me because I'm too much all the time friends husband whoever the same is when I was a kid and I was you know you're standing right next to us you don't have to talk that loud or you know accusing me of exaggerating or lying when I wasn't or accusing me of doing something that I didn't do and then causing this whole storm of things all of that kind of leads back to the same place for me because it's it feels like I'm not seen I'm invisible and misunderstood I still feel very invisible and very misunderstood I am not seen and so I'm not worthy and so right there okay and that's something you can continue to explore with when I get set that took me a while there and so then we have a lot of work there was there's abandonment abandonment betrayal and neglect so abandonment that's the one so what's when that's hit what's that what does that say about you or the world around you honestly the last whatever years around that has mostly I've just felt yeah some some worthiness some I'm not worthy but mostly just I'm always gonna be alone oh like a powerlessness like very powerless and very hopeless okay whenever that's hit okay so with this particular incident and we usually just try to sum it up in a sentence for it like what happened you know we are at the like you know you called Brian at the car garage so that that kind of thing he said he was gonna call and he called and then there was some communication like yeah so we try to keep it really simple there and so I'm just bringing it back to that because I want to ask you when I talk about that when you think about it and what yeah so we're just looking at those facts there what core emotions come up anger fear sadness I think mostly a fear that it's never gonna get better okay so yeah we asked what bad thing do you do I sense is going to happen that I feel powerless to stop yeah and to me that's that I'm literally always gonna have this feeling that I'm on an island figuring everything out by myself so I'm afraid that I'm always gonna be alone mm-hmm okay I'm gonna figure everything out by myself any anger or sadness coming up or not right now I mean obviously I was very angry at the time because it's like coolest reinforced every narrative I've created for myself but no I'm not angry now thinking about it I'm just sad because I don't want it to continue to happen and I don't want to be mad yeah so often when we think of anger then I think of like a Tootsie roll pop and so the hard outside is the anger and the sadness is that soft chocolatey part that's in the inside so I don't want to just see ask you these two questions yeah what do I sense is being taken from me without my consent when you think of anger hmm what did that incident what do I feel yeah when you were angry just think of that what did I sense is being taken from me without my permission or you did and that I feel like the only thing that's popping up is control okay my control yeah does that make sense my control over the situation just for some clarity like yeah my control of yeah of the situation and in general in my life because this this hits a spot that makes me feel that everybody else is mercy because either I do everything in a hyper independent fashion and I do it the way I want it done and that's not I'm not interested in that at all or I trust and I'm okay even I'm not okay with it but I'm getting closer to being okay with it not being done you know the way I would typically do it but I yeah the anger starts whenever I think about like so just never I just never get to expect that when you make a plan with me we're again it's going to unfold that way I just have to what come up with contingency plans for when you do this and I do with that a lot it's exhausting I don't want to live my life like this anymore so I think I think you may have a better word for it but it's it feels like a loss of control because I met everybody else's mercy and it feels like I'm back in that victim place where the world is happening to me and I'm not happening to the world mm-hmm yeah so I'm I'm gonna ask you with that control is my control actually actually being taken from me is your control actually being taken from me in those circumstances well it certainly builds as an if it is you know probably that one no because I think a very simple solution if I had not been triggered immediately and stayed present then I would have said then I should probably just call and make sure we're on the same page and when I called and he's like I'm misunderstood and I could have easily said go ahead and divert but see I think that the reason I feel like I'm giving my control away is because it's so hard for me to ask for that in the first place and it brings up more worthiness stuff like especially like with with him because we're married you know I do walk around believing if I'm not intentional about myself talk you know my royal tells me or know my judge I'm I'm too much for myself for everyone I just you know I can't take up space yeah and so it hits that it's like it happened because I'm too much not because it was a simple mistake so it's like a lot happening at once so it feels like my controls being taken but I mean it obviously looking back it was a really simple fix for that one but it happens like multiple times a day yeah well it's just really hard yeah that's yeah so it's just we're just breaking it down here so let's and then this sadness I'm gonna tap on that and we're gonna go right into the shadows of shame some more so what do I sense I have lost that is not coming back when you think of sadness I don't think I can answer it honestly like nothing stands out because I think it's so much of everything myself maybe some call myself like I've given away a part of myself and I think so much of my subconscious used to you know battle for fairness and so like I would know that my response to him making me angry because he did this really bad thing my response and the consequence that I'm gonna provide for that not healthy in any way and you know but my rebel says that's fine because he effing deserves that anyway you know and I or a real big one for me is always I don't care like then whatever like it all just is what it is this is how I'm I just I don't care you know what I mean and so I don't know how much I really let myself well obviously I don't let myself feel sadness very much so it's hard to identify anything around that this is a new thing over the last few months that I've allowed and I'm just now even learning how to allow it so you know I told you the last time we talked I'm still finding myself blocking the feelings you know I don't know what's happening until I realize I'm overthinking and my body hurts yeah sadness is one that's just a little tricky for me to like be able to unravel right now yeah and that makes sense so you're working through some other emotions and things that are coming up and the wounds are pretty happy there so you said a couple things with I want you to so you said deserve and that's the word with the right with the royal so where would the royal be in the room if the royal was here I don't know because I mean the royals always right here in my face you know like always what would it look like what would it sound like we can really externalize it I don't know it's a female it's always been a female and almost like a Sally Jesse Raphael like the red hair like you know it's like the dyed red you remember like the oldest version of her on TV okay yeah and but meaner you know pretty hateful yeah so yeah so what is she saying about this situation you deserve I can't believe winning fingers at other people kind of the blame I mean she always says that like he deserves my terrible ass response so he deserves your response that yeah my reaction yeah yeah that's the first thing that always pops up because it worked for me so much that I've done it you know yeah I mean I just screamed at him but it's still really me but so like the the royals like you know like he deserves it and then you got the rebel who's like and so go scream at him like you bet you know like you get to do what you need to do too and blah blah blah and you know what I'm actually it's so funny because my rebel will talk directly to my Roy I mean they are talking to each other that's why they're not talking to me yeah and I'm like that's right you know like on our vacation heightened emotions and lack of sleep really got me in a bad spot and I was bawling about this talking to my friend on on an episode because I felt horrible but I was telling her like man I could identify the shadows as they were popping up and I finally just like silenced them with my rebels like I don't care I am mad and I'm gonna be mad you know what I mean yeah there's nothing to do with any one of these things I am so overwhelmed and flooding that like giving myself permission to just shut them up really hell like like oh we can't do this like yeah yeah but I mean my royal is the loudest always mm-hmm okay so it's saying so that's the one that's associated with the expectations there and so that's what we're doing you force it is mm-hmm wrong it's now that's your judge you right right so they'll come back up these are just the shadows of shame and they're trying to protect us from getting hurt or whatever you know they're what family or and or society says it's a defense mechanism and so we're just noticing them it's like a mindfulness things so they're all saying these other things and they'll fight back at each other and the judge will even have a two-edged sword where it'll be like are you acting this way you're crazy or you should do this this is this you know it's like what the what is happening here so this is just a really normal yeah so it's so next level Jenny I don't think you understand no I I understand and and and that's the thing where it's fun to talk about it it's not fun to experience it no I love it in hindsight but boy going through it but I just wish I just wish that truth could prevail in those moments and that I wasn't transported back to every time it's happened anytime something happens you know what I mean I just yeah and that's why we have to take a 20-minute break and let our brain reset and we do a grounding activity like breathing techniques there's different we teach and do a chart do some journaling which essentially we're doing a chart right now right well that's why I was like no I only want to talk to you about this because I wanted to look at this through this lens you know and you're right I forget every single time to take a break now that one was tricky because I was on the way there but in the car my friend when I cried to her overall this she was like yeah y'all just needed to stop that car and you just need to get away from everyone for a minute yeah maybe I should have texted you so that you could have told me that you know because like never in my mind and I think we should go out to the next rest stop and I should put my air pods in and go ground for a little bit the ring center like never it was in the red out of 10 12 hours yeah yeah I've been there a lot and that's that's not a fun place to be and it's taken me a really long time and I'm still not always there either it's like the retraining the neural pathways like okay this is what we're gonna do and that's why I'm so grateful to know about the shadows of Shane because the way I feel when I do that is is that's the stuff that has caused the most depression in my life is thinking about my reactions like that and the chain I feel from remembering their pain so I that's that's what's helped me cope the very most with that is like understanding these are just protective mechanisms and that's a trigger and I'm gonna learn to manage this eventually you know right now I'm not great at it but eventually I'm gonna get better at it yeah yeah and so when that wound gets hit then that core belief comes up and then it's like hey that hurts and then our shadows of shame are right there to back us up and be like you know what like because that's not happening to me again right brain remembers things that have happened so we go into that flight fighter freeze the Megdala so we're in there and it takes a while to get back to that so that yeah that's that takes some practice for sure and even when I'm noticing it sometimes they don't want to pull out of it and so I have to be like I'm not going to say I rebel tells me I don't have to you know yeah don't care about anybody else you know everybody else and then care about me they didn't they sure you know I'm a care about my day self yeah so I want to see kind of what that royal is really saying there because that's that's what's that's what's there with the the situation and that's where we're gonna and I want to ask you how low was your not how low was your I want to ask it this way if you could say on a scale of one to ten how full was your love tank at that point when you call it was actually pretty full when when we hung up the phone and I I stated a need and he was gonna meet it and he had been you know he's he's really getting really good at filling the tank anyway I mean since he's been able to hear me on this podcast unemotionally he's a different person but so yeah I felt very cared for that day very loved I'm going through some health stuff though so like I wasn't feeling good but in terms of like me and him when we hung up that phone he's like absolutely I'm gonna call Bryce and don't you worry about it my love tank couldn't have been any more full yeah and then it was like someone gashed a hole in it nothing second things went out okay so you said that you were kind of exhausted that day so we're just talking about holistically if you think it wasn't in a place to handle emotions at all okay so thinking holistically we're just imagining a love tank just a tank like zero to ten where are you how full were you that day like right then with everything oh I probably only could maybe a - okay yeah not yeah I was pretty empty overall yeah I know that yeah and then there's a gauge that's on that love tank and it opens and closes and the shadows of shame there's this gauge for the shadows of shame how much of the shadows of shame showing up in your life on a scale of zero to ten ten okay so that gauge how much they're showing up is how tight that love tank is and so if that tank cannot be opened then things can't go into it and if it's not full it gets empty then we're getting triggered with the shadows of shame even more and so it's just like perpetual cycle thing there so usually we'll see it's an interesting thing they almost match up like how much shame we have you know if it's like an eight then we've got like a two you know it may not be exact but just you know yeah you're exactly right yeah yeah yeah and so we have to deal with those shadows of shame there so the yeah that royal some some other things that it's saying and that you asked for something and then that that didn't happen right then what's the what's the royal saying I want to I want to hear that part I knew it doesn't matter what I do you're never going to be the partner that I need I did not say any of this out loud to him right right this is the shadows it this is your while and we're like it's right there next to talking like you said it right there by your face and yeah she's so hateful um yeah like I knew it like I knew I couldn't count on you okay so it's saying you knew it yeah you knew you cannot can't count you knew better you knew better why did you even ask this is why you don't ask ever why if I don't you ask and then he's never I heard some never kind of stuff so yeah yeah yeah you're never he you know you know he's never gonna like change this is yeah his brain doesn't work the way that you need it to and you know I mean this is just who he is I mean you know you're gonna be alone to deal with everything forever yeah so you have that impotent one what does that impotent one look like where's it at in the room I think that's one I don't allow myself to address very much I could not even begin to identify it honestly I know it's there I do know that but um it's very against anything I've ever been taught from adult figures and I you know what I'm saying so like you know well even my emotionally unavailable friends don't ever let me be sad or have hope the thoughts because there are holes who tell me well on a brighter note you know things like that and I'm dismissed all the time so I don't ever really plus I've had for real mental health crisis and you know that was kind of that so I do ignore it on purpose sometimes but you know I'm afraid of even looking at that I don't know why I can feel it blocking I'm blocking able to see and describe it to you I don't necessarily feel safe today to go there if that if that makes sense yeah so one thing that saying is you cannot acknowledge me you can't I can't be acknowledged you can't you know you can't not be happy and so that's really blocking some things there mm-hmm okay so can you put it outside of yourself because we know what it's saying just kind of like where is it gonna be if it's so it's not inside of you where's it at in the room a dark corner okay like a closet a dark it's in your in your closet if you have a closet in the room okay well because I'm in my bedroom and my my closet is in our master bath yeah and I could feel that's a fine place for it to be yeah it's close because it's always gonna be close but it's you know it's a good distance where I can bat at it away you know I'm saying so yeah it's a dark shadow okay long's in the dark closet okay it's back in there saying those things so yeah it's not not human form at all it literally is just you know those diagrams like out like a drawn body you know like chalk or whatever it's like that only like shadowy yeah and that's okay yeah it's sometimes it's an object for people and they're like it's a ball it's like sludge or whatever I'm like oh whatever it's not you yeah as long as you understand that it's not you yeah yeah yeah some people are like it's in my brain and I'm like now you take that out of your brain and put it over here well if you don't understand how to separate it from yourself you're not gonna get past it you're gonna be the things it's telling you yeah you're gonna believe it's you and then that then you just go in that change cycle and and then the changes like why are you thinking that you know and that gets all messy there so yeah so okay and then you have the rebel there that's like and yeah so where's your rebel at oh if if the royals right here the rebels right here so because my royals the biggest and baddest and that's where I used to protect myself the most in my like I said if I can make my actions someone else's fault then it doesn't hurt as well that's the royals protection mechanism if you that's what I do with her a real good okay so you won't get hurt if we stay close here now and then so that's like next to your face almost and then it's you know a couple like a foot on my rebel you know I'd call my rebel sleepy because like she's probably taking an app right now and she's younger than Sally Jesse Raphael royal but probably my age okay I can't really stir her though it's more of an energy of her like I know she wants to protect me I know that she is my advocate you know like so let's see I think she would be again female I that's how I feel probably I don't know I envision her even though I can't really like picture her I envision her being one of those loud like just younger than me like probably like a 30 year old who like you know how to weigh different at bringing than me and so she's just like raw raw we take care of ourselves you know what I mean we do do for us so we're gonna do because she doesn't enter the scene that much because she she really mostly I do try to stay very present suck at it but especially now that I can identify things as they pop up she only comes out when the worst of the worst of the worst of me comes out to protect myself from the pain that I feel when I inflict that pain on others well who fucking cares you know I mean that and it gets there real fast and then I but again it protects me from all the other shadows it's the only way to silence them except from that now quick and she's like hey okay what does she have a higher low-pitched voice I forgot to ask you that I think with the royal - so we're just really trying to externalize it okay so you have those coming up any like martyr we're just gonna do this by herself and then our Royal can like jump on board with this like you know nobody's gonna show up for you I mean you know my rebels like you can go yeah so that martyr what's that martyr look like that's saying take it all on yourself you want to ask for any well I mean there's the the royal that's playing in there with it but the martyrs like yeah you can take care of it and that's how you get your self-worth mat to be the door mat for everybody else and you're just gonna you know just I think of the 1950s wife that's my but I've been telling you that I'm not to give you your but you know that's the you know well I kind of theme the 1950s wives were martyrs so you know what Jenny I'm gonna be really honest with you that's why my rebel screams at the martyrs so much because I I'm not willing to accept that so I don't martyr myself I pissed and make sure that I get what I need but we're all unhappy at the end yeah I mean I know that I do sometimes but honestly this is not a shadow I really battle with because the last five years I've been like you know I've taken a lot of stuff in my life and I'm not doing it so adjust or leave don't know what to tell you so not like harder myself very much because I have pretty good boundaries yeah so you're not doing everything by yourself like I'm just gonna do it and and and and that's how I get my worth or I'm gonna clean this whole house and I'm gonna go do all this stuff on myself and nobody's gonna help you know you ask for your needs and yeah I mean yeah or it just doesn't get done I mean yeah you know I mean the only time the only reason I'm hesitant to say this is because he doesn't know that I've ever done this consciously but the only time I martyr myself and clean like that is to piss off it doesn't piss him off it hurts him when he gets home and he realizes there's nothing he can do to help me after he messed up but that's what I do to hurt him is to to make sure he can't do a single damn thing to make it better so some rebel like I told you I told you these two are so big in my life and the judge obviously but those two protect me so well yeah so the judge is it coming up at all in this like yeah I didn't do that at the best yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah what did it look like what the sunlight not as a response to the external thing that's happened my judge comes up to talk to me about like how I'm reacting and that's why the rebel or the royal will hit it the judges admit older classes that's all I know yeah but they they tell him you know you know but most of my judgment is it truly is about my response to people I I'm I've been working on healing for a very long time so I'm really pretty aware of a lot of stuff but you know this is just that really deep stuff that I hadn't been able to hit yet but I don't I really don't talk negatively to myself or about myself that much because I'm really conscious of it and I change it and reframe a lot so my judge only talks to me about how I treat others you should have treated them better you you should have could have would have why didn't you why didn't you pause why didn't you take a break why didn't you whatever and it's just it's so painful to have to think about you know especially my kids yes my husband but like honestly Brian's a grown-ass man and and he probably should have divorced me a long time ago but he's choosing to put up with me so that's on him but my kids don't get a choice so the pain that I feel when I know I have inflicted pain on them by screaming or even how I've treated him in front of them you know nobody was happy in that 12-hour car ride nobody and and I kept thinking because my oldest is he's a little touchy too emotionally so I kept thinking like you're gonna get Bryson in a bad mood too that's all we need is both of us to be escalated like this and yet I couldn't stop because I needed a break from the car I needed a way from everyone their proximity was driving me insane because everything I was dealing with inside you know but yeah my judge really only talks to me about how I'm ruining my kids okay and so was it there like during that incident or after like right after the other day whenever we got when that well yeah yeah immediately the second I raised my voice at Bryson when he was telling me and then I mean in the middle of when I say screaming I was screaming at Brian on the phone the judge is there the whole time but that's why the royal or the rebel have to get very loud because the judge is the stuff that made me have suicidal ideation because when I go down that spiral like I can't get out very easily you know so they really keep me out of that yeah the like the judge will be like you should have coulda woulda and then the rebel intro those are the suicidal thoughts and things and so it's like you know this is how we're gonna deal with this because you can't it's yeah I mean that I don't know how it goes down in your mind that's kind of how it has worked with me when I've had suicide ideation is like okay I notice it's like exit this is how we're going to exit here because you know you cannot you know that raises the bar continually like this and this and this exactly right it raises the bar every time you know honestly I stop and give thanks even in this very moment to my royal and to my rebel because they are the only reasons that I can silence that judge that gets me in that really horrible place you know I mean talk about expectations I know that I still expect myself to be perfect it's a subconscious thought and I'm working so hard on it but my expectations for myself are far too high you know I'm over here preaching to everyone else about how if you're human you're doing it exactly how you're supposed to but like my human causes so much hurt for others you know yeah I mean our judge will come back up on us and say like okay why why are you like this why you know and it's and so then it's it's coming back up on you know better like you and you have all people yeah and then the rebel is the one that has the suicide thoughts and you know so far and different things there but the judge can get people to that you know like and this and this and this and now intro rebel there so there's yeah some interesting dynamics there so the judge in this circumstance you know and that gets I want to like just hold a second for there that is excruciatingly painful and I just want to hold that for a moment for people who experienced that because people who don't don't know what it's like cuz I didn't used to feel that and I had some more oil like why are they like that you know and and now I'm like oh like you know that was what I needed to learn and so now I've seen both sides of that where I'm like let's hold space for people who experienced that change something that's a really sacred ground for me to be able to hold space for people who are experiencing it because it's painful and a lot of people don't want to be there and so I just you know so I want to go back to that judge so it showed up immediately after the fact so where is it at in the room if it was like you're in that circumstance just happened you yelled now you got the judge is it like where is it in the room like in front but like diagonal okay and then and then he has a higher low voice that's the guy there like like average voice I would like either hide or low and just saying what what's he saying there oh why are you hurting him yeah why are you making such a big deal about this why are you losing your shit over something so small okay how can you teach Charlie about proportionate reactions to the size of a problem if you are non-stop modeling disproportionate reactions you know and what do you think your daughters back they're thinking as you scream at her dad on that phone all of it just rapid higher shit talk yeah so I don't know if there's any politician like what are people gonna think of you or you can't show this any of that coming up or like I'm not any more I used to but until you help me identify that that one really ruled a lot of my life I don't know I shut the politician up a lot now I mean yeah pops up but one of the other ones just silence yeah it doesn't serve me anymore and I don't it never did honestly and so it added another level of stress that I'm like hey I already got a stress that I've you know messed up my whole family I don't need to stress what other people think about me messing up my whole family so I know I wouldn't say that it was present yeah and did it show up at all with your daughters like what are they gonna think of you or you can't show this or you know like you know nothing there okay okay so yeah so we're just acknowledging all that you know that the royal is that expectation he's like he should have you know he needs to show up in that way like I can't believe he didn't show up in that way and that's really fueling that fire with that expectation no you know I'm not gonna do a full-blown chart on here we could go into numbing behaviors protective behaviors that we go here but for the sake of time you know just acknowledging that like if any of those came up you know you can say that and then you know blaming you know blaming rescuing protesting escaping that's called the burpees and try as a podcast on that so we notice where where that showing up there and then how we get out of the burpees is empathy and ownership and with our partners and then we have those mutated emotions if any of those were showing up it can you know name any that might have been coming up anxiety and like rage and you know just different things that kind of those core emotions they mutate into something else and flow out into every other part of our life like when I was in school I'd be like super anxious or stressed about my schooling and then I'm like guys and it was really about my schooling you know I guess everything else into everything else anything like that coming up or yeah but I think I live in that place a lot of if I'm not intentional and it's but I'm just got so much going on right now and you know it can be overwhelmed easily so if I'm not like working very diligently I stay in a real source of agitation anxiety yeah frustration yeah and so we're working through different things there and so yeah just acknowledging if there's any mutated emotions that come up so we can work through that and then yeah I don't want to leave hang leave this hanging but I want to address if you believe you know in universe what a good friend would say what you would say to your younger self or your child the truth there so what is the truth about you we're yeah so we're just we're just if you had like and I don't know some people have challenged me on an altruistic but the altruistic person or this you know being a fighter this you know person or what I would say to my child if they were experiencing this or I would say to my you know younger self as I've learned and then I kind of get them outsider yeah and so yeah it's like a like the truth about you so for me if I'm thinking about the truth and I'm going through this chart thing then I'm kind of looking at what I what helps me is looking at what my negative core beliefs are and then looking at what the flip side of that is because we know the shadows of shame are supporting this and whatever they say our lies here and so like I'm worthy of love and belonging I am enough I am worth people's time like so we look at what you had said at the beginning and we're looking at right well I'm so glad that you circled back to this because honestly those statements are you things I use as affirmations all day every day anyway and I think that is why I'm stuck in the middle of expectation land and worthy of having my needs met so it's like I don't know how to get my needs met though is but I about myself I am healing I'm learning of course I'm worthy and I am becoming vulnerable and I am caring I care deeply for Brian and his feelings or else I would not feel so ashamed when I am you know yeah and and I don't know I used to be able to say I'm a good mom I don't I haven't felt that for a while so because I just keep doing the same dumb shit you know so that's your judge so I want to challenge that a little bit and say I'm I think of I told my clients I have my door there and I'll point to the door and I say okay imagine putting your hand in there there's a little bit of light coming in and you know the doors just open a crack and you can see that light and you're saying I'm willing to lean into the possibility that maybe I can get that or I'm a good enough mom I'm willing to lean into the possibility that maybe possibly I think I'm a good enough mom I don't think I'm actually I think I'm good at repair so like I believe that to be a very important component of parenting is repair and acknowledgement and accountability and I'm really good at those things so and you say I'm a good enough mom period not with the things you do just I'm a good enough mom I'm good enough period like as a human being so we're looking at that and also I'm enough the other person's enough sometimes people's actions and behaviors aren't enough right I'm enough there enough truth yeah and so maybe I have to put boundaries up for certain people and that I'm not saying this applies to this situation right when I point this out here where you know but there is like that yeah it's you know you would have to determine what what's there but and we're gonna address the needs so I'm getting there and so I just want to like tap into that truth of the part there and there are people in my life that have earned that trust so it's like the marble jar have you heard of the Brene Brown marble jar example where you or it's like you know you're they you gain up though everybody has like their marble jar that you kind of give them and they're earning up that marble jar you know those those or beans or whatever you want to write and then you know they might do something that they might lose some of that trust and those marbles come out but they're they're earning that up and so that's what we're kind of looking at there and then based on how much they're able to show up or not you know Brian saying I didn't understand and so you know that's you know communication stuff and yeah like that's something there where I'm you know I'm not quite sure yeah I want to say that like for different circumstances yeah we're just looking at where that there are people in my life that I can who have earned that trust do you feel like that's a truth because I'm challenging or betrayal wound well negative correctly the problem is I don't give very many people very many opportunities to earn my trust not even Brian yeah he's grabbing something out of the back closet there he forgot we're in so I'm just chatting away yeah so I'm jumping back on track like when you started the visual of you I was like I don't do that ever yeah I don't give that people I have been giving it to Brian but see I'm gonna get mad at you because you're right and I don't like that but see here's the problem is that if I give him two little beans or marbles that actually equates to an entire jar full of expectation the royals right there and you're like you better show up now you better show up now that's exactly right and then what do you think happens when he doesn't told you yeah yeah the royal yeah what we give it up yeah poor Brian so it's okay let's give ourselves some stuff love there so yeah very happy when this airs though he'll be like thank you Jenny thank you for helping my work so yeah that's why we're doing this and I you know I had Troy's help when I was going through this stuff myself and and Colton's like thank you yes I mean like I said I feel like this was I don't want to act like healing isn't a lifetime thing but like when you have the type of childhood I have but I felt like this was kind of the piece this was the missing puzzle piece was learning this type of stuff because I you know not knowing that it wasn't my multiple personalities because it made me crazy yeah we had multiple personalities in my brain so I mean in some ways I do but they're not mine that's okay I mean those are just the thoughts we get out from people like man oh man there's so many things that are there and that's the part that we're trying to separate from us that's on me well yeah I gave them so much power because their power gave me the ability to not feel I got to let them talk and which I was thinking but because they were talking I wouldn't having to feel nothing point right yeah it's it hurts and so we think that it's like a gods or something and then we come to find out I've been putting salt in these ones all these times you know yeah this is that salve that I thought I was doing there and then that's why I've been hurting all this time so yeah there's there's that part there so yeah I was gonna say the little analogy that Troy uses that I like is when if you go fishing then if you throw out though if you throw out the line how often are you gonna catch something like maybe a 50-50% chance I mean like it depends because I've been right I'm a terrible just I'd say one out of five okay well so you have a chance of catching something yeah but if you don't throw out your line at all what are you gonna catch nothing trust so that's that's the trust analogy there where we if we don't throw out the line we're not gonna get our needs met at all and then the shut up the thing is not like when I give you the trust you really have the ability to crush me the vulnerability yeah and that and see us Lewis he has a quote I can't remember it exactly but he talks about how if we wrap our hearts up in a nice little box so we can protect it so nobody can touch us then it's safe but then it doesn't have the ability to fill or like drive or anything there so thing like to I actually started watching this cute little next flicks movie last night and everything's like that but I was like self-care I'm eating jack food in my bed it's really cute you might like it it's Reese Witherspoon and Ashton Kletcher have you seen it you know I haven't but I love it it's like a little romantic comedy and that I'm just down in the middle I haven't watched all of it but this is the theme of like protecting your heart and like you protected it all right you know yeah funny that you said that but you I get you like them you'll love yeah yeah I'll have to check that one out so yeah that's the idea there and yeah it's like oh yeah we don't want to do that the shot is a shame we'll come to back us up because you know how much this is hurt in the past here like and I can see you almost like yeah like that like it can move back as you're thinking of it because it can be really painful from our past experiences this really our body says move back you know like this is a fight-or-flight kind of situation to even open ourselves up especially if we're you know in any situation but we're opening up like those attachment wounds and addressing them then they're like we're all there so that's kind of about that forefront there we we addressed that truth there and I'm willing to lean into the possibility that there are people that can earn that trust is that feel like truth yes okay and then I'm worthy of love and belonging that was kind of the the I'm I'm worthy or I'm because you said I'm worth this was kind of the abandonment one so like I'm I'm I'm worthy and then like the one with the neglect can you remind me what that was with the like I'm not worth people's I'm too much okay so so I'm enough just the way I am okay my mantra with that has been I'm worthy of taking up as much space as I need to take yeah okay so you have those there so we have that and now we're going to go into the needs here because needs are important and that's what essentially that is what we are really looking for there if those needs aren't met just like a flag in the soccer game you know like a foul kind of yellow flag will transition will come back to meet them because we have needs that are unmet though I'm gonna ask you what do you need as I connect with my truth what I need is and I'm gonna say these seconds attention and presence assurance autonomy growth and contribution safety and security novelty and pleasure and I don't know if you can see this because I have a little chart here that might be a little more are we just talking this specific scenario we're talking about insurance insurance I needed okay so you need some assurance so who could meet that in a healthy way who do you feel like you could reach out to that could meet that need because if we don't get that need met what's your choice there who what are my options in getting my needs met what choice is best aligned with my value system and honors my core truth what choice can I make that will be in my best interest and the best interest of the people I love which choice will bring me the greatest sense of peace and connection so just thinking about those questions yeah what who can you go to to meet that need today nobody serious don't have anyone I could name right because the people that the one friend I have that I would call emotionally intelligent enough to attend a conversation that her life is crazy right now so like that's it and everybody else is so they pissed me off I can't stand to talk to them about feelings because they're dumb like they just say stupid shit that makes me mad so I don't want to talk to them it's the dumb dismissive stuff you know okay so if you is there someone including Brian yeah I know I would say Brian but he was the center of the problem so yes Brian sweetest dude ever so yes I mean I he does assure me a lot and once that was a need that I recognized I had like hey you know what I just need reassurance actually you know he is very good at that you know I was stuck in the middle of believing that I was gonna be you know make a decisions alone for the rest of my life so I could not get the reassurance from him I needed yeah and maybe at that moment we're not able to try has a podcast with Matt he's the one at the beginning of the book who talks about how great the book is and he's so glad that it came out that's Troy's best friend so he does a podcast it's a couple of years ago and he talks about connection and he ran a men's group and he said to somebody in his men's group was saying well I don't get down to a level of peace and he's like is that what you think he says is getting down to this like Zen place and we're in you know and I didn't say quite like that that's me and I get it I get in a disagreement with my husband and I'm really distressed and I really want to go to him for comfort but then my wounds are hit so badly that I can't it like it's in that moment I'm like yeah but I need to like work on my school work or work or something and I can't even concentrate yeah and so I reach out to my friend Shelley so you said you had a friend that you're like I wish I would have pulled over and talked to you and so there's that friend there so in the moment that might have helped you get to a place where you could actually ground and then come back and talk to Brian because I mean that that brought me you know like that would bring me down with my friends when I'm out of 10 and then my friends bring me down to a six or a five so I have my friends I work on the fielding this group of friends which I've done for years and I have stuff 12 and and in different levels that the people are like whoa that's a lot you know and I'm like yeah people are like yeah yeah there's different levels like I have friends that I go to lunch every once in a blue moon and then I have like these friends or like people I text or see every once in a while and then there's like my deep friends that I'm like they know my my stuff and so I'm gonna reach out to one of those friends I have a couple of them and if they're not available call the next one and so we go down that list and so my friend you know brings me down like I just need a minute or you know a couple minutes you have that okay can you bring you know it brings me down to a like you know I talk about it and I'm not calling somebody who's like you know hates men or something because then they're gonna be like yeah they suck yeah I have I have friends who are so willing to listen but that I don't want people to just listen like I need an interactive like no advice really but just like a what okay well you know what maybe you should blah blah blah but yeah my one friend who's able to say the right things I can't I'm in the red every day at least once you know so I can't call every yeah my other friends literally like are either unavailable or just have taught me that they are not there for that yeah oh yeah so you're working on that part of that there and when you're able to get to a grounded place so you know working on you know getting our brains to a place where we can get grounded and trying to find those friends like even somebody that I can just say hey like I just had a whole bunch of shame that came up and I'm just feeling like I need some reassurance like things are gonna be okay because I just had a you know like hard time with my husband and just want to feel like it's gonna be okay like yeah it's gonna be okay it's like somebody that can meet that need like I am I'm just really struggling right now and so and then later so I'm at like a five six after I've talked to a friend there and then I talked to my husband and I'm getting down to like three two you know whatever there is that's that you know the there's different levels of peace there but I'm able to bring myself down and Matt talks about that's what the piece is you know it's bringing yourself down you're like at a ten you're able to come down getting on that reptile brain yeah where you just did find a bear off of you yeah yeah so we're just and we want to make sure we get those needs Matt because the shadows of shame will perpetually come back up and be like oh let me meet that need so that's why I continually get stuck in it and then the rebels like told you so because you're gonna stay back with this if you don't have somebody who's able to show up for you and meet these these needs and this is the healing salve there like that acceptance attention and presence assurance autonomy growth and contribution safety and security and novelty and pleasure depending on what the situation is you pick out there what is that need how am I gonna get that met and Troy talks about that and that we talked about that before but the the podcast you know the acceptance what that looks like you know right you know like you're enough you know you got you know you got this you know you got this girl kind of thing so do you have any other questions about expectations I know we've been going for a while which I'm totally finding out time but no it's long no I mean you know with my friends I don't see as much gray area probably because I'm so willing to cut people out of my life so that they don't you know ever affect me obviously not really because you know I had an anxious attachment forever so I always kept them with some closer further you know yeah I get that I've been there yeah really yeah I would I'm anxious attachment still yeah with with friends so I hear you it's just that like people saying what they mean and meaning what they say and doing what they say they're going to do means a lot to me and it feels like the only time I've ever really like allowed someone to attempt to show up in that way for me well I probably didn't prep this with this is very important to me and state a need but you know they just don't they don't show up and it's always I only even asked for it whenever I need need need it you know but it's not like they've had any practice for showing up for me in this capacity because I've never told them up until that thing where they very clearly failed because whatever you know but it's just hard because I don't really know when I initially asked you about expectations I was thinking like are you kind of just supposed to be like we're gonna orbit each other and we have to know that that's gonna come with a certain amount of hurt if we're asking for a certain amount of intimacy and vulnerability and that we just have to be really open whenever a wound is hit but I can do that for everything except for this piece like if I can't depend on you and you've proven that more than a thousand times in 15 years where do you go from there I cannot depend on him on some things a lot of things I can but he he's forgotten to pick Charlie up from school before because it would be a day I was busy and didn't remind him quite literally 40 times and I don't I don't want to live with the amount of mental load that I'm carrying for this family I don't want to do it anymore but I have to if he's not gonna help carry it and he has said explicitly and implicitly he can't so it's yeah and that's a circumstance so we're asking for our needs very clearly needs are different than expectations in my mind anyway yeah that's that's you know like we I don't we just went over the core needs here and so I'm asking for safety and security maybe in that sense of like you know I need you to pick up the kids and that scares me if you know somebody's not there for me kind of thing and being very vulnerable and like why that so important like I need you to be able to show up now if they're not able to because of whatever reason that they you know I can't I can't remember like I have ADHD and I can't remember some things and so yeah yeah and yeah and that's you know just we're just kind of assessing there okay so if he's not able to meet that need who is able to meet that need for me who can't go pick up the kids when I can't and just you know so we've looked at that so maybe it isn't even like I genuinely wanted to show up and pick up the kids gosh dang it I forgot I know I have to be reminded like 40 yeah you know I don't have enough to know you know and his shadows are shame gets so loud if he even messes up this tiniest bit you know yeah so he has yes yeah those those wounds get hit for him and I'm debating because there's like a little chart thing but that would be a different thing that we'll have to do or we yeah but where you hit their wound so when my partner hits this wound then it then my yeah or belief gets hit it's kind of it's kind of like the chart though and so and then what I believe as a result is and why I react to this way with the shadows of shame why I react to this way is because I want my partner to see it my way or something you know like that's the protest well yeah because when you said who else could I get to pick up my kid I'm like I don't see a single effing point and getting married then I got I don't want to be married if I need to go find someone else that can be reliable but I think that's about the messaging that's like you know so maybe if I am dealing with the poor beliefs that are popping up whenever these things happen it's not gonna hurt me as much and then it's just a thing that happened it's just a flip in the day where you just have to clarify or fix it or whatever and it's not that serious yeah I think the reason I've been so hesitant to get you that place is because it feels like I'm once again accommodating him and everyone else I'm feeling so that you can be such a fuck-up that you can forget you kid at school without hearing a word for me about it know what I'm saying like that's what I'm saying that I just I start to feel injustice in that nothing that's right we're healthy I'm just telling you how I feel I notice when people start saying I feel and it's not an actual emotion then often the shadows shame that's coming up right that's way I feel it's that and I'm like okay let's say what shadow of shame that is if that's not an emotion that you attach to that I feel and so are like okay royals come back up to protect me and my family you know and my kids right and then it's I am reminded of like the Intro to Troy's podcast it said it's not about what happens to us but the story we tell ourselves and so it's what so Brian he's like oh you know he comes back oh man I forgot and he's very genuinely honest and then no no no no no no Jenny he doesn't say I forgot no he doesn't take accountability he doesn't say I forgot he says I mean you know this popped up this popped up this happened blah blah blah blah blah blah how was I supposed to la la la la so that part of the issue is he doesn't take accountability he did not on the phone that time either whenever I was like five minutes we've we got lost in translation in five minutes he does not take accountability and I can see it all over his face and I can feel him but sometimes the words I messed up would be really helpful because he's just acting like my grandma and my parents then you hurt me and you're not even take responsibility for it yeah so it's looking at to be able to get out of that death spiral thing is what we call it the burpees where it's the blame you know burning protest rescue escape so he's like I you know I didn't you know kind of thing I'm asking for a need I'm asking for somebody like assurance even that the you know like this you know or acceptance of my reality of the situation right so that you see that you did hit the wound whether you intentionally did it or not it still happened and like I believe some reparations do in that moment even if it's just to acknowledge that it wasn't at all the circumstances around me that caused that I forgot I didn't set 30 timers or whatever the case needs to be for him to not forget because I don't feel nor am I going to do this any longer where I spend an entire day setting my alarms to remind him every hour of something that is my life if I need something done and I don't I'm not doing it anymore so he's going to make these types of mistakes and I can accept that if he can deal with his own shame and just communicate and you know talk to me about it you know how he's feeling because it happened how you know any of that instead of just you know his royal yelling at me yeah okay so if he doesn't admit his shame because this is something that's gonna be common with a lot of people in their relationship he doesn't admit his shame if he doesn't admit he's wrong like yes I would like if somebody would say I'm sorry and then I you know it's on that expectations part you know the royal comes out I didn't say sorry and I and you want to be seen and so that's like where I'm wondering if the neglect wound is showing up right there where it's I need to be seen and so asking for those needs in that way like can you give me some time and presence right talking to him about how the situation looked when this happened this wound was hit I this is my core belief when that gets hit like just generally and my shot of the shame we're seeing this is where I'm struggling because this is where my impotent enters because what my impotent says is yes he walks right out and says beautiful love it you're teaching me how to deescalate in a moment of escalation but what I'm also hearing from my impotent is it's never gonna get better I'm gonna have to do this every day of my life and I don't want to do it every day of my life something that we didn't do is dismissing the shot is a shame so saying to the impotent one why are you here just say it why are you here impotent why are you here impotent but I don't know why why why would that we don't say I don't know why so just let yourself think it's it's a back in that closet or wherever it is right now why are you sure um would it would it protect me from a different shadow it could why is it I don't know what it serves me I don't I can't think of a single way this shadow serves me that's why I don't let it come out very often so it's saying you can't trust anybody nobody's gonna show up ding it like this is always gonna happen and you do accommodate everyone in your life yeah so why would it want to tell you don't let don't trust people like you they're not gonna show up what did we talk about earlier like that stops me from being vulnerable and then I don't have to feel that led down again yeah so is that what it's saying like so if you know like if you don't have any expectation or not let's use the word expectations but don't ask it you're not worried about your own needs and you're constantly working through an escalation problem that's what this feels like is that I'm no longer gonna have a need I'm just gonna have a bunch of wounds that gay hit and then I got to work through it but nobody around me ever has to change that's what I mean like that's what the impotent is telling me is that no one around me is ever gonna have to grow or learn or do better I'm just gonna be stuck in the middle of a bunch of people who aren't growing who aren't learning who aren't getting better but I'm gonna be really good at deescalating when I get triggered by them that's what the impotence tell you okay so is it helpful having the impotent one there in your life how does that work out for you it does not work for me very well at all I feel okay yeah so it's it's part of the team let's not get hurt and so let's not anybody there and that kind of thing so and then how's that been working out for you oh super great yeah okay so do you think then that it's okay so the impotent would pop up in this situation I would guess then if if it wasn't about because part of me wonders if it's stopping me from hurting in this present moment to like stopping a source of pain from an action that I have done or if I'm just kind of stuck in the middle of a trigger that I'm not recognizing because I didn't stay present while you were talking in that like I definitely found myself wondering to a feeling you know what I mean at that when we were saying that but I guess too it could be just reminding me like that's cute that's cute you can do what you want to do but like people are ultimately gonna fail you so how much work you really want to put into trust in them mm-hmm I mean yeah I guess it just protects me from being vulnerable but not really that's what you know it thought it was doing for me yeah yeah so thanks it's helping out so do you feel like you can say thanks for trying to show up for me impotent one you can go for today I can thank you for trying to share it for me impotent you can go back to my closet thank you so much can it go like away away away yeah I mean again it's not something I like even let myself acknowledge very much at all so yeah that the impotent can be banished to wherever it came from today okay and then the royal can you dress it and say why are you here today I probably could not okay she's she's serving me very well today okay oh that's the part that yeah we might need to address it there yeah yeah the does I get it I do but it would be so inauthentic - if I did that it would be so enough I wouldn't mean it at all and I want to live my truth so yeah no not today okay so that's something that you know you can work on there we went through the whole chart yes I do not yeah that's that's an area I'm gonna work on for sure yeah so that's part where you can go do some journaling and thinking and asking that royal why are you showing up and asking why are you showing up what wound are you trying to protect me from experiencing those are other questions you can ask the shadows of shame can do you feel like you can say yes even getting better at that too at knowing which wounds that they're trying to protect me from it's just the the royal tries to protect me from everything yeah um the rebel yeah I mean but I don't know necessarily well the rebel I feel like tries to protect me from loss yeah because when I start to act that way and I experience a fear that like I'm pushing everyone away so when the rebel gives me permission to behave badly then she's just serving me to not have to worry about whether or not anyone leaves because I'm gonna make sure they do you know we wrap it up we gotta wrap that up them away so yeah how well does that work out for us abandonment to yeah so I would say you know that the rebels don't really protect me all that way off yeah it goes back to the when we are aligned with the shadows of shame and we're trying to prevent the abandonment wound with the what the rebels saying or whatever it is then we end up abandoning ourselves and wind up yeah not having our needs met and then like you know the exact thing I was trying not to experience there so do you feel like you can say thank you rebel you can go and not as heavy okay so yeah you can go rebel you can go appreciate your service you know and then judge you hear judge yeah why are you here judge I mean the simple answers to that is just to balance out the royal honestly like you can only think everybody else is wrong for so long I think the judge protects me from being too much and protects me from hurting others okay so does it actually help you because it heightens it so much that you end up having the intro rebel royal oh yeah no it's not actually helping me at all yeah but I feel like that's that's why I've utilized it right and it's good to recognize why they're showing up and asking them or you know we're not getting an answer there what wound is it trying to prevent me from experiencing that's a good question there too so yeah just letting it say you can go judge so do you feel like you can say you can go judge yeah okay i'm gonna release you judge yeah and then yeah and so the royal you just we're gonna have a private conversation me and Roy okay yeah okay there's just so much there to impact like royal protects me from literally everything so it would be so like for right this second sure but in the next five minutes one of my family members are gonna piss me off and the royal's gonna tell me about how that's not my fault so okay you know what I mean yeah for this moment though can you say yeah for this moment I can release the royal and say you can go I mean you know you've served me today let's you know go go do your thing yeah so I mean they can they'll come back up and so it's just a constant process of yeah I do but I guess I think I probably need to further explore why I'm so desperate for reciprocity and fair balance justice you know what I mean that's what I feel like being taken from me in every one of the moments is reciprocity fairness balance so figure that out at some point my goodness and is that actually being taken from you in those moments it sure seems like it is I mean even in retrospect looking at it because I am a responsible partner so if you need something for me and I agree to it I'm gonna I'm gonna meet the need if I don't have the time energy or resources and I say no that's different we can talk about how you feel about that but you know no is no but like I feel like I show up for now Brian doesn't ask me for anything probably so that he you know cuz he's not gonna have expectations for me so that I can't have any for him and it's not just me that's the way he's operated in the world so like but it doesn't feel like fair we are gonna set some healthy boundaries and we have those jars where we are you know like we give people opportunities and then if they're not able to show up okay I'm not able to trust them in that way and so that I'm gonna ask for my needs from someone else and I'm gonna set healthy boundaries they're enough I'm enough their actions are not enough and so I determine how far you know like those boundaries naturally come up when I believe that I'm enough and so is that person able to be in my space is that person able to you know show up in this way in my life or so we're not there and it's not about like you know it's it's just I'm enough and so how does my life look as a result how what am I gonna does a result there so it's not having expectations but asking for needs and then is that person actually able to meet that need that's the end of the choices that's after it does needs like acceptance insurance and things who is able to meet those needs in a healthy way and so it's actually asking are they able to meet it physically like they're not able to they got ADHD I'm seeing that that's not happening there or whatever they have going on are they able to meet that need just because of where they are right now like they might be whole hard into it and they're still not able to show up even because of their own wounds and shame that's coming up and so I'm like I see that they can't meet that right now because of where they are and they're healing right even if that's not even they're not working on it so like that or they're not they're they're not even in a place to work on it and so it's like okay what am I I have choices now I am am I taking this path or am I taking this path that really good resolution to that yeah well that's what the whole podcast is pretty much yeah oh that's beautiful I'm glad you're doing it so I'm so glad that you are feeling better and I do appreciate you as a human and your time you are always more than welcome to sign up so you have an open invitation to sign up whenever you want I love to talk to you I already told you you and my cousin Diane are everybody's favorite so we love us some Jani time you know you some people aren't as passionate about sharing and they're like you know they're in a scarcity mindset basically I'm afraid that if they give out this information someone's gonna be a better therapist than them or whatever you know what I mean my whole brand has always been I'm gonna tell you my experience yeah and when you tell me yours I can look at yours objectively you know what I mean but like you're gonna know that I know what you mean because I do it too whereas that used to be a source of shame and then posture syndrome now I'm like you know I I feel so much comfort when you say that you yell at your family sometimes like you can't know that you sweet little soft-spoken Jani healed me by saying that just a little bit because you're so sweet people don't yell at their families right oh yeah that's what our shadows of shame would say what right and so like shame dies and safe spaces you know I want people to hear me say I mess up all the time you know I and I'm never gonna pretend like I don't but I do I want to heal the pain that I have from doing yeah well I love chatting with you too and thank you for these opportunities yes I'm so serious sign up whenever I love it okay I'll see what they can do I'm in the balance there whatever you want whatever you want I want okay all right it sounds good thank you so much okay later I'll talk to you later on hey hey what do you say listen first and foremost please make sure that you have provided this podcast with a five-star rating on whichever platform that you are listening if you want to support the show please rate like and share also like comment and share on any social media posts that you see for me on Instagram or Facebook or TikTok please follow the podcast Facebook emotionally unavailable podcast you can shop my foot online store or schedule a one-on-one with me emotionally on the available podcast org I'm offering what I'm calling non-traditional counseling astrology reading and tarot readings and self-policing services and thank you so much for listening to the emotionally unavailable podcast all right guys I hope that you enjoyed that episode with Ginny and I hope that you've been kind of following along with the finding piece stuff that Bingo and I have been doing on Fridays expectations have been addressed so anyway okay that's it thank you so much for listening and till next time that's all just keep swimming I am D E P E and cut