This is I on Foxborough, the premier podcast for all things new England Patriots. Brought to you by MassLive. Welcome back to I on Foxborough. I'm Chris Mason here with Mark Daniel, day one of training campus in the books. Mark, did you have any sort of major takeaway from today's practice? Major takeaway for practice? No, I believe a smart man compared today to dipping his toe in the water and that is kind of what the Patriots did. Jordan Mayo is easing his Patriots team or easing his Patriots players into training camp. There's really no pads, no contact, kind of what we saw in OTAs in mini camp. Major takeaways? No, I think all eyes and the number one storyline is the R number. All eyes are on the quarterback. The number one storyline is quarterback competition. But as Jordan Mayo said on Tuesday, I mean, Jacobi Brissettes in the driver's seat. The Patriots see him as the starter. And that's what we saw today. And I'll just give you a quick rundown on some quarterback stats because people love QB stats and training camp. Jacobi Brissette went 10 of 13 with an interception of Kyle Duggar. And then he was the number one guy in all the drills. And you had Drake May, he went 6 to 10. He was the number two guy in all the drills. And then Bailey's app. He was number three. He went three or five and Joe Milton still number four. He went four or six. And frankly, Joe Millen goal four or six was more than we saw him, but really in all of many camps. So they're easing the, they're easing their way into training camp. And Jacobi Brissette is still the starter as of the first day of training camp for the record. I'm the one that came up with that very, very original analogy. Actually, I don't think anyone's ever said dipping the toe in the water, using their way into the pool before in a video that we shot for Mass Live, probably 15 minutes ago. So Mark's stealing my lines. It's okay. Like I said, not the first time somebody said that. But yeah, I mean, I thought the whole tempo of this practice was very much just like getting guys back and swinging things after five, six weeks off. The practice was only 90 minutes and more than half of it was just indie periods, which is players just working on drills with individual coaches. There wasn't a ton of competition here. But one player who still managed to stand out in the little bit of competition that there was, was Jalen Rager. Rager came through with easily the catch of the day. It was so good that the NFL Twitter account actually reposted it earlier where I don't even know where they got that video from going to have to check with Stacy on the video policy and everything. But Rager got free going down the right sideline with Drake May quarterback, May uncorked a bomb. Rager made a great one-handed catch while kind of tightrope in the sideline and went out of bounds. Like he made the catch and then like drifted out of bounds. There's only one caveat with the play, Mark. Do you want to share what that was? Sure. He had two players around him that he ran by and one was the ZZ Hearn and undrafted cornerback and another was Brendan Schcooler, who was playing safety, who was also known as being the Patriots best special teams player. So not exactly top tier competition for Jalen Rager. But you can only beat who you're out there against ultimately though. So and that's what he did. And I thought of those guys vying for that last wide receiver spot. He definitely got off to a fast start. And that's what you need to see. Juju Smith-Shuster is someone that like had a nice catch early on in the practice. Yeah. But then was absolutely blanketed in coverage by Isaiah Bolden at another point. It was like the most definitive pass breakup I think I saw all day where Bolden was all over him. Smith-Shuster couldn't separate and boom done. So I thought it was a mixed bag for him right off the bat. But again, not a huge sample size today. Yeah. I mean, saying Smith-Shuster couldn't separate is something we've frankly seen a lot of and then said a lot of and we're not trying to pick on him. But Juju Smith-Shuster has to show the ability to get wide open. I mean, he's the highest paid receiver on the Patriots roster in right. He got blanketed by Isaiah Bolden, a seventh round pick from a year ago. It's not exactly what you're looking for. But as Chris said, Jalen Rager did stand out. He led all receivers with three catches today. The only other player on the roster to have three catches was Jim Michael Hasty running back. But another interesting thing about Jalen Rager, I'll say this because he got three passes from three different players. He got the really nice ball from Drake May. He caught one from Jacobi Percet in 11 and 11 and he caught another from Bailey Zappi. So no matter who he was out there with Jalen Rager was getting open and he was catching passes. And as Chris said, you know, he's in this mix for that sort of bottom of the depth chart at receiver. But another element that's going to go into this is the kickoff return ability. I mean, last year, we saw it in Buffalo when he scored our kick return touchdown. In fact, I asked him after practice, I'm like, you know, I'm like, ending the season the way you did with like the return against Buffalo. Did it help you? And he said, yeah, I said, it gave him some like some positive momentum heading into the off season. He noted that last year he was injured for most of the season, which we didn't know about. So he suffered an injury and training camp with the Minnesota Vikings and said that he feels like he's grown up. He's and he's more comfortable. And we're certainly seeing that. Yeah. And he feels like the only one of that group of why that's vying for the last spot that has like legitimate special team's ability where Juju doesn't really have any type one. They've put a gunner a little bit, but I don't see him ever turning into a great tackler given his frame and everything. So of that and like Keisha on booty didn't play any special teams last year. So of that, like bottom of the depth chart, rigor is definitely the one that boasts the most additional ability beyond just playing wide out. Yeah, you know, and really he has to do what he did today. He has to go out there and he has to make plays. And that's that's what training camps all about pads still are not on Chris. According to Patriots PR pads will come on on Monday. That's when the real quote unquote real football starts, but you know, we're all good day for jail and radar agreed. And while we're on the offense, another thing that I don't think we were really expecting today was that Calvin Anderson started it right tackle. He was with the first group out there. And that's a spot we've seen a ton of rotation where they still have Mike on went to a guard, but it had been Kate and Wallace towards the end of mini camp. Today was Calvin Anderson. Would you make it that? Yeah, that was probably the biggest surprise for me of the first day of training camp. I mean, in mini camp, how it was really the all three days was Michael when you went from my tackle to the right guard and it was Kate and Wallace playing with the first team offense at right tackle. And that even in mini camp Chris was a giant surprise because I thought the Patriots paid Michael when to be their tackle. But it looks like they're seriously considering keeping him in right guard Michael when you talk to us after practice today and just said, you know, what they're doing right now, it's all about finding the five best guys. He also noted that by playing guard, he thought he had he could get enough push on defensive lineman to help the right tackle out, which made me think maybe that's what the Patriots are thinking. They're thinking, all right, we're going to put our best offensive lineman at right guard. He's going to help out whoever is there at right tackle. But seeing Calvin Anderson there over Kate and Wallace was I'd say, yeah, the biggest surprise for me for day one. On the defensive side of the ball, the one interception of the day in a competitive period was Kyle Dugger. And this was a really familiar play where Jonathan Jones had blanketed Rager, actually, it wasn't one of Rager's best moments. But also, I mean, this happens, Jonathan Jones is a good cornerback, he blanketed in them, tipped the ball right up to Dugger, who always seems to be in the right place in the right time for those deflected plays. And that to me was just kind of a reminder of like, Oh, yeah, you know, the secondary still gonna be really good. This is something we've seen a lot and even like in one of the few competitive periods where this is happening, it's like, okay, yep, their checkbox checkbox. move on. Well, you say that like Jonathan Jones had a really good day. He had two pass breakups, one led to a Kyle Dugger interception. But in fact, Jacobi per set today, he goes 10 to 13 has three incomplete passes. Two of those were because of Jonathan Jones with his his two pass breakups. And the cornerback alignment today was Christian Gonzalez on one side Jonathan Jones on the other side. And as Chris said, it's a really good reminder of seeing Jonathan Jones out there of just how good the Patriots defense and cornerback situation could be this year. And looking over the schedule, looking at the division with who's that quarterback, what receivers they're playing, they're really going to need a strong secondary Chris. You know, if it's it's interesting because like, the over under for Patriots, I believe for wins is like four, four and a half. And I keep thinking that's that's a little bit low. Like I would give them probably six, maybe maybe seven if they get lucky. But I think the Patriots success this year will hinge on guys like Jonathan Jones and Christian Gonzalez on the defense if their defense can play top 10 defense and your offense can be a little bit better than it was last year, you should win more games. I agree with that. And quickly on Brissette going 10 of 13, like, that sounds pretty good. I didn't think he was as good as that. Statline indicates where even there's 111 on 11 period, he started two of two technically. But the first one, he held the ball, held the ball, held the ball, fled the pocket, held the ball some more, not entirely on him guys just weren't getting open. Then finally hit Austin Hooper. And that goes in the books as a completion. In real time, he's getting sacked and we're throwing that ball away. The next play, he found Taquan Thornton for I think it was Thornton's only catch of the day right across the middle. As Gabriel Peppers was screaming down the field, like if this had been a live drill, I think it would have been a lot like when Peppers destroyed Devante Parker, or Devante, Parker, Devante Adams last year in that game against the Raiders. Or that's another one that's like, if that's a catch, it's caught by a guy who's not going to be playing for the rest of the day, like he's going to get smoked. So I think these are things that are really important to consider just in remembering, like if you hear like Drake was six of 10, and Percet was 10 of 13, like those numbers can be valuable, but days like today, there are a couple of them where it's like, I don't know about that. Yeah, it felt to me like the Patriots quarterbacks were really reliant on the running backs and their tight ends when it came to the past game. And the reason was because those guys were shorter, they're like, you know, shorter to the line of scrimmage, or basically they're easier passes, they're easier quick pass plays. And one reason is you're playing against a good defense and you're learning a new offense. But another reason is as Chris noted, not a lot of receivers were always getting open. Nope. So Tycho and Thorne did have two catches today. Jalen Rager had three Jalen poke had two, but I thought it was sort of noteworthy. Like Pop Douglas didn't have any. And then, you know, KJ Osborne, a veteran, they brought in to sort of help them. He didn't have any catches either. So as training camp goes on here, you know, a massive storyline is how this receiver sort of competition and depth chart on folds. We've talked about that a lot on this podcast, like DiMario Douglas, I'd say you know, Kendrick Bourne, if he gets healthy, he gets back out there, KJ Osborne based off the money and then your two draft picks, Jayvon Baker and Jalen Polk, those are five guys who should be on your team. Well, you know, Tycho and Thorne Chris has been stepping up. He had two catches today. He had a strong mini camp, but he's always a butt with these guys. He has to stay healthy. Judas misused or makes a ton of money, but he has to get open and like, you know, Jalen Reggar made some plays, but has to continue to show more consistency. So that receiver group, I think you look at today, a training camp across the league, some of the guys who didn't practice, right? Like CD lamb isn't showing up for Dallas, Brendan Iyuk didn't show up for San Francisco. Those are names that are going to be attached to Patriots just because they don't have a bona fide number one. If the receivers don't like that in Foxborough, the only thing they can do Chris is step up and prove you know, people other wise, right? Just play better. So I think we've talked about this practice itself enough for what it was. I thought the real story today came after practice and that was Matthew Judon met with the media and was incredibly honest about his contract situation, the trade stuff from his Twitter account. There's a lot we can dive into here. We'll start with the trade thing where if you guys haven't followed it, Judon over the weekend, his account reposted a hypothetical trade that would send Judon to San Francisco for Brendan Iyuk with rap pics and everything. So seeing that pop up reposted by him, obviously raises the bread flag, right? Where you're like, huh, today he said, hell no, I don't want to be traded. I don't think players ever want to be traded and said that he doesn't run his own Twitter account, which is the one thing that I think in the course of his whatever was eight or nine minutes he talks to us today, that I was like, okay, I don't know about that. I don't know about that. But then he got into his contract stuff. And he was really open about the fact that, you know, he doesn't want to play on his current deal that's going to pay him about seven million seven and a half this year for the last year of his deal. Yeah, he doesn't want to play on that. But he kind of has to you right now. And it's not in his hands anymore. And he went on, do you have the quote right in front of you? Yeah, he was really good. I'll start the beginning of the quote. He said, honestly, it's tough going into the last year of the deal. You kind of look at everyone around the league in the building and you see them getting deals done and worked out. It's tough not to be jealous or envious. I mean, I think right there starting off that he's admitting like, Listen, the Patriots paid Michael Wen who Kyle Duggar. They extended Christian bar more. Ramondre Stevenson. All these guys are getting paid. Really think back, Chris, this off season with the Patriots did was they extended their internal free agents and then they gave new deals to a couple of young players who they really like. And Matthew Judon say, man, you know, for two years in a row, I led the team in sacks. I had two pro balls in a row. Now, last year didn't go with playing because he only played in four games. But he's only making somewhere around, I think, six and a half million as a base salary. I looked it up. He's like 47th in the NFL among defensive players. Matthew Judon has a point that he deserves more money, but he also doesn't have leverage because he'll turn 32, you know, before the season starts and he only played in four games. But he goes on to say, or someone asked him, basically, are you willing to pay or play on this current contract? And he said, I mean, I've got to, honestly, I signed the deal. My signature is on it. So I've got to play on it. What I like to know. Do I think that's my value? No. But again, it's not up to me. Later in this interview, he actually told the media to go talk to macro and now Elliot Wolf about his contract, basically said like, Hey, guys, listen, I would love to finish my career in New England. I'd love to be in, you know, with the Patriots forever. But I know that's not up to me basically saying, you know, he wants to stay here. Not entirely sure if the team wants them for the long term. So ultimately, I think there is a fair solution in the middle here where so Judon turns 32 next month. He's coming off a season ending injury. He only played four games last year and then was done. Before that, he had been a very, very good player, four straight pro balls, you know, the tape speaks for itself there. But this is guy who's turning 32 next month. So what if you just give him five more million this year, he bumped up to 12 million, say, we'll see how it goes. And then like, he plays really well, you sign him to an extension of the offseason, you try and work that way. If he's not himself, then you're not like locked down forever. But he gets more money for this season. Do you think he would agree to that? Or do you think he's looking for more years at this point? You know, I think you would. I mean, I think it'd be hard for any player to be like, Hey, you know what, you know, we can't come to an extension, but just take more money. I mean, what there's no like negative in that situation. Sure, he doesn't have long term security, but he would get, you know, a bigger paycheck. And that's great. And I'll say this about Matthew Judon. I know he's about to be 32. And he lost, you know, he only lost a ton of the season last year, only played in four games, doesn't have, you know, you'd say, he doesn't have that momentum for a new deal. It's because of what happened. But last year, even though he played in four games, Chris, he finished fourth on the team in sacks in third and quarterback hits. So and that's not a good defense to do. That's not like it was a bum defense. And he's like, one of the only guys to can play. Like he opens things up. I mean, you know, for example, like last year, I think the greatest example is Josh Uche. Josh Uche had three sacks last year. And when Matthew Judon the year before had his 15 and a half sacks season, you know, Josh Uche went off and had 11 and a half. I think Matthew Jude, I'm just having them on the field. It opens up things for other pass rushers, such as, you know, Josh Uche, maybe Anthony Jennings or Ken White or D, you know, Dietrich Wise, like the Patriots defense will be better with Matthew Judon on the field. So I agree with Chris. I think they should give him more money. But also him being 32 this year, coming off a season ending injury, you're not going to extend him until you see the product. At least that's my opinion. So if he's disgruntled, and like gets more disgruntled, is there any world in which you would trade him this summer? If you can't come to an agreement? Well, that's a really good question. It depends on the return. I believe you did a story on this with the return would be, you know, probably be somewhere around a third or fourth round pick. I think in this era of this new drawd Mayo era of Patriots football where they are rebuilding and focusing on younger players, I would entertain a trade offer if it was worthwhile. Now, of course, if you're telling me hey, the 49ers want a second round pick and Matthew Judon for Brandon Niyuk, I'm probably jumping all over that because Brandon Niyuk is in his prime and he's a pro bowl receiver. If it's for like a fourth round pick, I don't know, you know what I mean? Like, I think Matthew Judon will help the younger players on the defense. But if you're telling me someone really wants to pay for him, I would certainly entertain it. Yeah, I don't think you're getting higher than a floor for him, regardless, just based on his age, the contract situation in the final year of the deal. And like the fact that you're probably gonna have to pay him more if you trade for him just based on his current unhappiness with it. So I don't think I would trade him under any circumstance, really. I think that I'd either be like, all right, you're going to play this out, like, and you can pout about it. But I don't think Judon, someone's ever going to be wired, he's going to give you less than 100% in like when real games come where obviously last summer was last summer where he's angling for the new contract, he's going down to the lower fields all the time. And he's since said I hated doing that, that's not who I am, you know? Yeah, so I don't think you're going to get good market value for him at this point, unless it's something like you said, like that I you feel I would also jump all over, right? Yeah. But I don't think you're going to get fair market value for him right now. So I think you're going to see him playing this here. Yeah, the other news of the day was that Devon gotcha all that did not speak to us was a full participant in training camp. He was not a full participant in mini camp gotcha out for those who don't know also wants a new deal of some sorts, we're not entirely sure what we haven't heard from them. But he was a full participant in day one of training camp, unlike mini camp when he didn't do much. His mini camp pulled in was so funny, just because of the way that he was doing it, like kind of going out of the way to make sure that people would notice where like, there's one day that he just warmed up without his helmet on randomly and was kind of jogging through warmups and then doing half of them and not doing half of them. And rather than just not doing drills, he would like stand very like far off to the side, basically just like, why don't I make sure you guys know this is a hole in. Yeah, like it's a hole in his like, okay, we're obviously we're off in the media hill, like, see, hold man, like what's he doing right now? But yeah, I think that he has less of a case than Judon for a new year where he's over 8 million this year for what he's doing. And there's a new solution there where the Patriots think that he's going to make the team, which I think everyone anticipates, just guarantee his money. Like, that's I think that's his issue is he has nothing to guarantee left. And you know, he could like tear like sprained ankle moral tearness, whatever happens, he doesn't have that security. You're the Patriots. I think you can just give him that security. And then this thing is done. But I don't know, we will have to see how that shakes out. See how it plays up. All right, first of many training camp podcasts, we'll have more coming your way soon. Catch you later, and we'll catch you further on down the trail. This has been I on Foxborough brought to you by Mass Live. (upbeat music) [MUSIC PLAYING]
