Spirit in Action
Communicating with Compassion
I have no hands but yours to tend my sheep No handkerchief but yours to dry the eyes of those who weep I have no arms but yours with which to hold The ones grown weary from the struggle and weak are growing old I have no hands but yours with which to see To let my children know that I am up and love is everything I have no way to feed the hungry souls No clothes to give and give, the ragged and the morn So be my heart, my hand, my tongue Through you I will be done Fingers have I none to help and time The tangled nuts and twisted chains The strangle fearful minds Welcome to Spirit in Action, my name is Mark Helpsmeade Each week I'll be bringing you stories of people living lives of fruitful service, of peace, community, compassion Creative action and progressive efforts I'll be tracing the spiritual roots that support and nourish them in their service Above all, I'll seek out light, love and helping hands Being shared between our many neighbors on this planet, hoping to inspire and encourage you to sink deep roots and produce sacred fruit in your own life I have no way to open people's eyes, except that you will show them how to trust the inner mind Today on Spirit in Action, we'll be visiting with Uzi Weingarten Uzi has been teaching a course called Communicating with Compassion for about ten years A way of listening with deep empathy which transforms workplaces as well as personal relationships Uzi is a rabbi, a teacher and a compassionate presence Along with his business partner Marlene Strum, they are communicating with compassion, an organization and a course of study Good morning, Uzi, thanks for joining me on Spirit in Action Good morning, and thanks for having me here I think you're taking off tomorrow to head back to LA, but you've just spent a few days on this visit What were you doing on this visit here to Eau Claire? I was addressing the Leadership Institute of Sacred Heart Hospital on the subject of Communicating with Compassion So what does that mean communicating with compassion? Does that mean that you're a caregiver? Can you think of anything in public life that we have that's a role model for communicating with compassion? What communicating with compassion is it's a set of skills and also underlying attitudes about how we can listen with empathy and respond with dignity and effectiveness to others And evidently they wanted to know about this at Sacred Heart Hospital where you were doing this Why does Sacred Heart Hospital care one way or another about communicating with compassion? Well, specifically about Sacred Heart, and this is very much to the credit Sacred Heart is part of a chain of hospitals founded by the hospital sisters which is a Franciscan order They have 13 hospitals in Wisconsin and Illinois And integrating the values of the Franciscan sisters into the hospital is very, very much a part of how they see themselves So communicating with compassion is something that they have now made part or are making I should say part of their culture as a hospital This was a gathering of the leadership of the hospital That's the administrators, managers, supervisors, department heads, et cetera So all the people who are in leadership positions approximately 100 in the hospital And they come together every three months for a one or two day retreat And part of what they do is this mission integration, this is integrating of values And communicating with compassion is part of what they want to integrate into the hospital And that is very, very much to their credit that they want to do this What's the outcome that they're expecting from learning to communicate with compassion? Is there some outcome and desired result that they want to produce by learning to do this And by making it a further part of their culture? Well, first of all compassion is its own result Compassion doesn't need anything beyond compassion as a justification In addition, specifically in terms of the hospital There is a growing body of evidence now of studies that are made About just how significant empathy is in terms of people healing The old model of Western medicine is that we just treat the disease But what the awareness that is growing now is that our minds, our spirits, our bodies is all one And if we just treat the disease and don't look at all at the emotional context of what's going on We can have much weaker results than if one takes a look at the whole thing So, for example, studies have shown that patients are much more compliant With doctors' instructions, let's say for taking medications If they perceive the doctors being empathic, for example Now, in this particular case, this is for leadership This is how people are going to interact inside the hospital with their own workers Amongst themselves as colleagues and with their own workers And I've now been teaching at that hospital for a year and a half And what I've been told very clearly is that there are results to show Forget the patients, just inside the hospital itself, how are relationships working? Well, they're working more pleasantly It's wonderful that Sacred Heart has that commitment To have even amongst their own workers a more dignified, more compassionate connection And so, do I understand that you do this every few months with Sacred Heart? So, in 2005, and they've just renewed this for 2006 I was coming out every three months and giving essential introduction to communicating with compassion The hospital has made the course essentially part of the leadership requirement So, over the coming years, everyone in a leadership position will be taking the phone course by phone conference Also, beginning in December, and then going through each of the four times I'm here in 2006 Sacred Heart will be having a community event So, people from the community can come one evening during my stay here And here, typically, it'll be stories about communicating with compassion Or stories that have a communication aspect to it, which we can then talk about a little bit Big, kind of, funny evening, we did it once in March, it was a wonderful evening Kind of storytelling and talking about it, and it's a great evening, people just thrill to pieces Well, what is the subject matter? What is it that you do in the course of a workshop, communicating with compassion? And some of those stories I'd love to hear What we call the learning objectives of communicating with compassion There are four skills of how to listen There are four key listening mistakes to avoid There are six steps to giving effective advice and feedback In a way that's dignified and compassionate We speak about affirming the dignity of the other and avoiding shame-based responses And the underlying attitudes that support these skills This is the level one course So whether it's on-site or by phone conference, the phone conference courses are open to everybody This is what I teach in the basic level one course Now, this week, for example, as a leadership institute, I was teaching things that were much further advanced than that In terms of responding supervisors who need to be speaking to their employees about different situations Perhaps in situations of corrective feedback Or dealing with complaints of employees So that was a more advanced presentation for, you know, clearly a more sophisticated group What kind of training did you go through? Is this something that you originated? Or how did you learn to do this and how did it appear in your life? Well, you know, Mark, I'm kind of flattered that you think I might have dreamt all this up But, uh, no, I did not dream it all up I studied with a number of very wonderful teachers One of whom is Marshall Rosenberg, that name I'd be familiar to you Okay, I see you nodding So Marshall and Marshall's students were my first teachers My very first teacher was Aitanyakobus in Israel And then I studied with Marshall And then Cela was Said out in Monterey in California Wonderful, wonderful woman who's now in her mid-70s It's been giving seminars on relationships for 35 years Just the most loving person I've met And then at the University of Santa Monica Next to Los Angeles The Spiritual Psychology Program Two wonderful teachers Ron and Mary Holnick So doctors Ron and Mary Just extraordinary people Really filled out some very important things And then I really sat down and took what worked best for me From all these different things that I learned And then fashioned this And then a lot of God's grace And things have developed since then As I've had my own experience Teaching and I've been tweaking it So that's how it's come back Well, how did you get into this field? I was a speech communications major in college Was that your area of study? Or maybe you were a carpenter who found that Communicating with compassion was what you needed to do in your work How did you stumble on to both the need and the inspiration To pursue this as your life worked? The environment in which I grew up The schools, the communities Were not people who were very skilled in compassionate communication Many immigrants, people that come from Europe ahead of the Nazis Survival was very much on their agenda Nothing niceties have had to quite say things compassionately Putting food on the table, keeping us clothed And at a rather early age There was quite a strong awareness on my part That I wanted to get good communication skills Some kind of inner knowing that they must be out there And now how do I find them? And then very fortunately Around ten years ago I began finding them What did you do professionally up until that time? Originally I began teaching Judaism Then at some point I put together a workshop on personal effectiveness It was called Thinking for Success But although the title here in America we think of as success as money This was in Israel and the word success has a much broader feel to it So it's really that being successful in our lives In whatever way we define success being in Relationships or personal effectiveness or whatever the case is I did that for some years, then I began doing this So you grew up in Brooklyn, how long did you live there? And did you go directly from there to Israel? Did you do university somewhere? Yes, I did grow up in Brooklyn and I did attend university in New York City And I did go from there to Israel And then came back and did not want to go back to New York I went to Los Angeles I think it would be probably helpful for me in terms of understanding your spiritual roots To have some kind of description of what your childhood was like I think you grew up as an Orthodox Jew And when you said the environment you grew up in was not very compassionate I'm not assuming that that extended to the synagogue So what was your religious environment in your home? What was your upbringing? What were the values that came as part of your growing up as an Orthodox Jew? Well, my parents were very devout Orthodox Jews They sacrificed a lot in order to maintain their faith It was not always easy for them Whether it was not working on Saturdays, whether it was giving us a Jewish education There's a lot of sacrifice involved in that Well, that sense of real devotion and being willing to sacrifice for the faith And how important those practices were I would say was the spiritual content I'm growing up with You tell me if I'm wrong, but I kind of assume That growing up with a strong identity and in general having a strong identity Can make one feel very much more secure It gives you a good jumping off platform to other things Did you experience that growing up? Well, there was a strong sense of identity It was also an identity for minorities So I think that can cut both ways But there was a strong sense of identity And that does give a certain strength, yes This is me, this is mine in my life, in my time Every heart, every soul, we're each part of the whole Every birth, every breath, every life, every death I am here, I am home, I am not alone Every step of this journey will be mine Take a stand, take my hand Take your time from the moment of my birth Every day around this earth I will live this life for all that I am worth But this is me, this is mine in my life, in my time Every heart, every soul, we're each part of the whole Every birth, every breath, every life, every death I am here, I am home, I am not alone We're in the end, there's precious little that we own Great or small, time is all Just on loan, so let us live life to the brim And if we sink, if we swim, let us leave a bit of grace Where we have been But this is me, this is mine in my life, in my time Every heart, every soul, we're each part of the whole Every birth, every breath, every life, every death You are here, you are home, you are not alone Every joy we close leads to an open door Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Love is what this living all is for Every birth, every life, every death This is me, this is mine in my life, in my time Every heart, every soul, we're each part of the whole Every birth, every breath, every life, every death We are here, we are home, we are not alone We are here, we are home, we are home [Music] One of the things that I sense that I reflect back on my childhood Is that the community was a community where survival as Jews was very strong These are all people who are not only a minority as Jews But as Orthodox Jews, they were a minority within a minority A sense of we are holding on to this very precious tradition That so many generations of sacrifice in order to bring it to us We don't want to be the one stopping the ball And we're now in a new environment, we're no longer in Europe Where our ancestors live for hundreds of years And it's modern and there are no ghettos here and it's open And we need to really, really work so that our children will receive And continue to transmit this tradition And there was a lot of focus over there So that sense of being devout, that sense of Especially being devout in those things that will be Distinguishing as Jews, observance of Sabbath and holidays And eating kosher and so on Very strong priority went to that Those are the distinguishing things There were certain values carried in the culture, for example charity Very strongly carried In fact, the IRS has programmed its computers That in concentrations of large Orthodox Jews Not the flag unusually large charitable deductions Because they just know it's in the culture People will give usually large amounts of charity Acts of kindness were very common Very much woven into the community Along with that, the skillfulness of how to speak in a compassionate way How to speak in a way that avoids shame and affirms dignity Was not quite as strong It just wasn't where these people were coming from And as I said earlier to you This is a community that at many levels is trying to survive Is trying to survive economically These were not people largely who were born in the United States They ran away from the Nazis And these were people who were trying to survive culturally and religiously You know, well the surprise one pays in that kind of situation So there was a lot of devotion At the same time I would not say that communicating with compassion Was a strong side of the community I've had some exposure to at least some Jewish culture The family I grew up in was I think Irish culture And my wife's family is German culture We were talking before the interview began about speaking with your hands Which I think is both Israeli and is Italian typically Mediterranean is a good description of it Are there any other significant parts which you just carry with you As part of your personality which are part of your roots there One thing I noticed is that when I teach I know right away if the audience is Jewish enough If it's a Jewish audience They're going to start arguing with me Probably by the fifth sentence If it's not a Jewish audience They just sit for three hours and don't say anything So usually I say to them When I prompt for questions the first time of the ten minutes I'll say, if anyone have a question or a comment Does anyone have an agreement or a disagreement? And then I'll say I'm Jewish We argue I'm not afraid of arguments If you don't believe me that we're Jewish and we argue Read the Bible Well they all laugh And that's when usually they'll start raising their hands And at least asking questions I haven't found a very good at arguing There's a passion for truth that prompts arguments And the arguments in Jewish culture Are not seen as disrespectful They're actually seen as respectful And those actually care enough But what you're saying to respond to you If I don't care it doesn't matter what you say That's something that I carry with me That inquisitiveness That checking it out for myself And if it's really so And if it's not so Come back to the present and say I don't get this Explain this to me, here's what I'm not understanding I certainly recognize that there's a possibility of aggression in communication And there's also passive aggression Which happens in communication And somewhere in between there With assertiveness One can be getting the truth out Be communicating with others without doing that Is communicating with compassion Is something on the assertive line? Does it incorporate that? And what else does it include? You know, it's so important When you say that there can be aggression in communication And certainly there can be Passive aggressive Is really what it says It's a way of lashing out at somebody Or verbally attacking somebody But wrapping it or masking it As a gentle statement So it's those snide, barbed remarks They sound like nothing's being said And yet the listener feels slapped And yes, that happens, that happens quite often It happens especially When people don't feel sufficient inner power To compensate "I'm not happy about something" So if whatever reason a person does not feel Able to say "I'm not happy about something" It'll come out instead as an indirect barbed communication The problem is that that doesn't do anything for the relationship It's much better to work out a way that a person does feel power And can say Somewhere along the way you decided to head over to Israel Why did you go there and how long did you spend there? I went to Israel 28 I had been there a number of times Between 17 and 28 for periods of study of various lengths But at 28 having completed my formal education I had a master's degree and I was ordained as a rabbi I went here because I was having a serious crisis of faith And I was looking for a way to somehow reconnect And restore the joy and the connection that I had felt earlier You very obviously have lots of joy right now How did you get to it? Was it your soldier in there in Israel? Or what were the steps that led you to this joy That's so obvious in the way you carry yourself now? I don't know that it was my stay in Israel per se that led to that There was quite a bit of struggle, inner struggle, while I was in Israel I was looking for something very spiritually And just because of the way that the religious community in Israel set up I wasn't quite able to find it Essentially the religious community in Israel tends to be Orthodox And Orthodox Judaism has official standing in Israel They don't have the separation that we have here in the United States So Orthodox Judaism has official standing Non-Orthodox Judaism is hardly existent and does not have official standing And the answers that I needed were not going to come from within Orthodox Judaism So I actually met some wonderful, wonderful teachers there Many of whom are extremely dear to my heart Till today and one of whom I'm in touch with till this day on a regular basis But in terms of ultimately finding the path I wasn't able to find what I wanted there and I did return to the United States Can you give me some examples of communicating with compassion? One of the things I often see is people, let's say two people are talking One is a speaker, one is a listener And the speaker is speaking And telling a story that has some kind of emotional energy to it The speaker is upset about something Worried about something, confused about something So there's some kind of emotional energy going on there This reminds the listener of something The listener says yes, and that reminds me the time that I, and he goes on And that's a classic listening mistake Because the person telling the story hasn't told the story for the purpose of hearing what our mind is the listener of He's told it because something's on his mind or troubling his heart And he wants to get some kind of empathic response back And then with the listener instead of responding with empathy Which is the attempt to understand another person's experience If instead of responding with that the listener goes on into Oh here's what this reminds me of That's the mistake of autobiographical responses So the speaker is, oh my goodness, I'm not going to get in and it's standing over here So that's one classic mistake people make This clearly happens on a personal level Is that mainly what you deal with when you're talking with folks? An administrator standing in front of a room is perhaps a very different situation Than a nurse talking with a patient One mistake that administrators often make Is thinking that after they've heard two or three lines They've got it And they know if they tell the worker, sometimes that's true And sometimes the real story will emerge at the end The real story will emerge often after the worker has spoken once and been heard And then a second time, so you're saying something to me And I'm going to listen to you and reflect back to what I'm hearing so far I think I'll say some more And it's often that some more that the fullness of the story will emerge And the administrator who won't take out the time to let somebody speak to the end Will end up giving advice from that opening comment and not hearing the whole story I like to call that the illusion of solution Then what happens is that nothing's happened, nothing's been solved And the administrator will end up finding that employee back in his office again Or he'll find that things haven't gotten done Whether they didn't get done properly Is the communication technique that you teach always supplied one-on-one Or is it for group-to-group or country-to-country? Is it really just a personal communication technique? Well, the skills are true across the board You know, when countries talk to one another There's a bit of a different dynamic it works because countries don't really have friends And countries only have interests Either the interests are shared or they're not shared But on the whole, person-to-person, organization-to-organization These skills work wonderfully well They're great tools in negotiating You know, it's interesting that there was a best-selling book that was written at the end of the 80s Seven Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey What's interesting is that Covey was a professor of business at Brigham Young University The title of the book, Seven Habits of Highly Effective People Will clue you that he's writing for business people Primarily, although it became a best-selling book, everybody read it So he has seven Habits of Effectiveness over there, right? We're not talking, this is not a Sunday morning sermon This is about effectiveness The fifth habit of effectiveness is seek first to understand And then to be understood, that's the fifth of the seven Habits The examples he brings over there, he brings one example of personal, a father and a son speaking And then in that chapter he brings a second example of a negotiation, a business negotiation So these skills are true across the board And I would suggest that people negotiate from that place It's a very powerful way to negotiate, because rather than trying to manipulate, rather than trying to fool or bluff One is trying to understand fully what's going on at the other side That's a position of enormous power So it is true in business It is true in personal life What is very important, both in personal life and in business Is that these skills are not techniques And what I mean by that is that If someone has the idea, well I'm just going to learn how to reflect back when I'm hearing And you said it's a technique to get what I want That's not going to work, because that will come across as inauthentic and as manipulation, which it is If someone has the idea of I want to communicate in a dignified way Honoring myself, honoring the other Trusting that from that place the best solution will emerge That is the truth, and that is when the skills will be truly effective And really transformative at some level I think you must get objections from your audience when you say that kind of thing That some of them say I need to protect myself If I made myself vulnerable by speaking truth, by speaking honestly and lovingly I'm going to get trampled Do you hear that kind of complaint from your audience that no, it just wouldn't be safe to do what you're advocating? I think that often people who are passive aggressive do that because they figure they don't have any power And their only way to protect themselves is through hidden aggression A person who is told well, I'm going to speak and I'm going to share what's truly on my mind That second round of listening you're talking about That's going to make them feel very vulnerable because as soon as you say Well, I really don't feel comfortable working with this person Right away that person is going to take it as a grudge match I think I see that frequently myself I'm wondering if that's the kind of reaction you get from your audience sometimes Mark, that's a really important question And two thoughts are coming to my mind as you're asking that Number one, there are people with whom it is not safe They're just are And I don't see any virtue in coming with compassion to a situation that is in fact not safe There are exceptions that I teach And if I don't feel safe with someone, if I don't feel trust I don't see a need to open up So if I have said a little bit and have not gotten back A response that leaves me feeling secure, I would not go further than that What's then worth noticing is that For the listener who gives a kind of response that leaves a speak of feeling insecure The listener has shut down the conversation So one of the great benefits of communicating with compassion is that that doesn't happen Because when the conversation shuts down, that's not your optimal reality Now, regarding the other point you raised, when someone comes and says I'm having difficulty getting along with another worker, let's say If the supervisor is in a place of communicating with compassion Which means that the supervisor is listening to this with empathy And with dignity Dignity meaning the speaker is a dignified person Speaker has divinity, as we all do So, as the great Christian theologian Thielhard de Chardin said We are not human beings having spiritual experiences We are spiritual beings having human experiences So right now this spiritual being is having a human moment People don't get along sometimes, or there are some things that need sorting out That does not make either of them bad So if the person can hear the workers saying I'm having a problem with another worker And now make either of them bad But say okay, let's see what's going on, let's see how to resolve this That could be a very wonderful interaction If the supervisor is going to resort to shame Oh my God, you're always having a problem with something Why is your problem now? Why can't you just get the work done? If the supervisor is going to go to shame Then the supervisor has created a shame-based, unsafe environment And if the worker has any options, the worker should probably leave You're listening to an interview with Uzi Weingarten He teaches a course called Communicating with Compassion Has been doing this about 10 years His work has included courses to help the staff and administrators At Sacred Heart Hospital in Eau Claire, Wisconsin To treat one another and clients with respect and dignity You've been teaching this workshop here for Sacred Heart in Eau Claire Are there other places where you're teaching at Uzi? What other settings have you taught this in? Well, there is a community just north of Milwaukee It's called Cedar Community And it is a nursing home and assisted living and independent living It's a whole organization there Their mission is to provide nursing care in a Christian environment of compassion When I went out there, I really was impressed by just what a remarkable job they're doing Talk about dignity and the way they treat their people, goodness Very dignified, very compassionate And around that they have assisted living and independent living So seniors can find where they fit in And I have taught there once And I've just settled in teaching a three-day retreat for their entire administration In March, in the second part of March Through Sacred Heart Hospital, we've also gotten grants to do retreats for clergy So Jewish and Christian clergy have come in from all parts of the country To do retreats here in Eau Claire With a grant secured through Sacred Heart Hospital And there are also two rabbinical programs that recognize this course for credit So one of the processes I'm negotiating now at the Mays University To have this course offered its distance learning so people can take it by phone conference Which is how most people in fact take the course, they take it by phone conference Uzi, when you say we, who are you referring to? My business partner is Marlene Strum, who actually lives locally here, she lives in Lake Hallie And she does marketing for communicating with compassion I do the teaching and the preparation of materials Marlene also knows developing her own presentation called Adventures in Living She'll be presenting that pretty soon How did you end up in Eau Claire, Wisconsin? Was it just too hot for you down in LA and that you felt like you needed to come up here in the winter? What led you up to this area? You are so right, you are so right I just cannot deal with winters that are 70 degrees I need, my mind is 20 Marlene lives here, so she began marketing for me just in the nature of things She began arranging some engagements for me over here locally And then that developed and then Sacred Heart Hospital came into it and so on I would think there'd be a significant need for the skills that you can teach down in LA That's where I hear about road rage happening I don't think that's a very good example of compassionate communication Is there a demand for it everywhere in the US? Is it just because Marlene's here that Wisconsin happens to be getting it? Or do we just need it more than others? Well, as I said Marlene was here and I came out here around two years ago And she arranged for a number of speaking engagements here First one was at the Christ Unity Center Was Sandy McKinney is a spiritual leader and I spoke there I spoke once at the synagogue here, which is where some Sacred Heart people came And that's how that connection got moving, spoke once in the Menominee So these were just different places I was speaking in locally here And the full conference courses that I teach people do call in from all over the country And in fact they call in from all over the world We've had people call in from as far as Australia The settings that I've heard that you do this in Newsy include hospitals or nursing home situations And with some clergy, are there other places where you're looking at applying it Places that you think particularly obviously would benefit from this? Well, I think that everybody would benefit from it You know, it's so interesting now that one of the things that we're being told Marlene and I have been told this by people is that businesses now Are seeking to incorporate greater spirituality in the business place I cannot imagine a situation that communicating with compassion is not effective Look, if a worker is going to leave because he or she is unhappy Replacing that person is going to involve a search and that costs money To find a good replacement for somebody can cost today easily $50, $60, $70,000 Just in the search Now, why do you think the single biggest cause for conflict in the workplaces? Well, I'm going to tell you, in apt criticism This is a study that was made and Daniel Goldman quotes it in emotional intelligence The single biggest cause of problems at work Are the way people are being criticized And when they're being criticized ineptly Morale goes down, ability to cooperate is severely affected Willingness of the worker to cooperate with our particular supervisor Collapses often, people leave, you have to replace them It is much cheaper to send the whole department to communicating with compassion It is much more cost effective than spending $65,000 on a search to replace somebody You mentioned earlier that the word successful had a different sense when you were speaking about it in Israel But it's clear to me that communicating with compassion is about having success with a wider range of meaning than what is normally attached to the word successful in the United States What are the spiritual underpinnings for you of the word success? One thing that comes to mind is the sense of inner wholeness You know, so many people today are wounded And part of the dynamics of our society here in the United States, and I don't think this is a very good dynamics Is that financial success, power and money basically Power and money define success So how big is the house and how posh is the neighborhood and how luxurious is the car and how nice is the clothing Is how people, those are the symbols of success And yet underneath that, there's a tremendous amount of woundedness It seems to be okay for us as a society that children don't have time with their parents Because today from middle class family to have a reasonable standard of living Both parents have to work and often both parents have to work hard And that seems to be okay for us I'm not sure that this is the best way to do things There's a lot of woundedness then that happens So one idea of success is the sense of wholeness Of the healing of wounds and of the restoring of the spirit to a more whole place And I meet the human spirit, I'm not discussing the soul now Just the human spirit, the psyche So that's one thing, I think the ability to feel joy in life One of the things that I think Freud got right and not a whole lot Subsequent psychologists have more or less disproved Most of what he said, but one of the things Freud got right Is that the need for good work and a good loving relationship As things that are part of healthy living So that's a part of success You know, it's very interesting in the second chapter of Genesis If you notice what God does for Adam Is God first provides Adam with work As a gardener in the garden of Eden And then provides him with a woman Or as I would read this story Divides Adam into two of us that there's now a man and a woman As opposed to one being But this relationship involved So those are the things we need And I would say that's very much a part of success And family and friends You know, what are the things that find interesting And if the United States family and friends Is the name of a calling card plan with MCI But family and friends Is really much more the essence of what it is And work Here at the United States for some reason Work has become the important thing People define themselves by their work Family seems to be something of a second And I think it's all the way around I think ultimately It's our family and our friends And then we do what we need to do to have Rewarding work and financial security So those are things that are finally successful And also some kind of spiritually uplifting something Something to uplift the spirit in some way In whatever way that one does it It could be through organized religion But by any means have to be through organized religion So this is not about religion But rather about something to lift the spirit In whatever way So those would be factors of success as I would see them [music] [music] Look all around you, say look all around you See all there is just to be your life above Look all around you, please look all around you See all there is just to be an alive or a life Here's more than our work and our work Here's more than our job and know our life Here's more than our work and our work Here's more than our job Think how your life could be, feel how your life could go If just for once you could get it and let it go Think how your life could be, feel how your life could go If just for once you could let yourself go For what life is more than our work Here's more than our job and know our life Here's more than our work and our work Here's more than our job Think how your life could be, feel how your life could go If just for once you could get it and let it go If just for once you could get it and let it go Here's more than our work and our work is more than our job Here's more than our job and know our life Here's more than our work and know our work Here's more than our job and know our life Here's more than our work and know our life Have you had any of the people that you've dealt with that you've instructed and worked with on this who've come back to you afterwards and said "I've been doing this and now this has changed and this is amazing and thank you so much." Have you had that kind of reaction? Yes, we have. We've had that really quite a bit where people come back and say here's what we've done and the results were different and better and it has enhanced our lives, yes. Are there situations in which communicating with compassion simply doesn't work? Well, communicating with compassion usually says when someone is speaking respond with empathy. Are there situations where empathy does not work? Yes, there are. That would be typically in situations where people are not holding boundaries. If someone is speaking to you trying to be, let's say, controlling of me, then wanting to dictate how I will operate in my own personal space. I would not respond to that with empathy. I would not respond to that with a clear boundary setting. And boundary setting is part of communicating with compassion. Empathy alone is not a balanced energy. Empathy needs to be balanced by a boundary setting and by the ability to say to someone, "This is my private space and what I do here is my affair." In situations of abuse, for example, also empathy is not a good response. Very strong boundary setting is a response. And disengagement if necessary. But what happens in those two situations of control or of abuse is that empathy will play into what's happening. It will enable more of it because now a boundary violation or abuse has been rewarded with compassionate attention and then it will bring more of it. Not what you want to do. And that's something that good people often have difficulty learning because when you really get into compassion and tases sweetness of empathy, one wants to do more of that. And it's really important to be aware of the need for boundaries and to hold the boundaries. And there's nothing uncompassionate with saying to somebody, "I'm sorry, that's not what I want to do." Or, "I'm sorry that's not your concern, that's not your affair." Or, "This is harassing to me, and I will not accept it." This is not acceptable behavior to me. This is a part of communicating with compassion. What makes it communicating with compassion is that while I'm saying this, I'm not losing sight of the fact that the person I'm talking to is a dignified human being. But right now, he's having a very human moment and he's out of bounds. And I need to then set clear boundaries. That does not make the person bad. It does make his behavior unacceptable. And the response is not going to be empathy, but clear boundary setting. So, Lucy, when's the next time that you'll be coming back? I think you're leaving tomorrow morning. When will you be coming back to the Chippewa Valley? I'll be coming back to Eau Claire in December. I'll be speaking again at Sacred Heart Hospital for giving one talk for their staff. There will also be one community event, and I believe it's on the first Tuesday in December in the evening. Your listeners can call Sacred Heart and find out, but I'm pretty sure that that's where it is. And I'll be coming back again then in March. We have a phone conference course that begins on Tuesday, November 15th, and it's a day course, which means it's from 12 to 1 p.m. here at Central Time, and people can then do it over lunch. It's deliberately designed that way. Anybody could sit in on the first of the 10 sessions with no obligation whatsoever. So, you could contact me, you could contact Marlene, my business partner. Just let us know if you want to come. You want to get a taste of communicating with compassion. We'll reserve a phone line for you, and you can join us. If you cannot make it in November, there'll be another course beginning in January. Let us know if you want to come. We'll get back to a dial-up information. We'll hold the line for you. And if people want to find you, Uzi, or if they want to get a hold of Marlene, how would they do that? Well, first of all, we have the website. So, the website is UziTeaches.com. That's U-Z-I-T-E-A-C-H-E-S. UziTeaches.com is the website. And people can contact me by email at UziTeaches@aol.com. Marlene Hulus, locally here on Lake Hallie, 715-726-0149. She can be contacted by email mcsbiz@aol.com. So, those are ways to contact us. Thank you, Uzi, for spending the morning with me. I do look forward to seeing you again in November. So, will I see you at the Minister's Conference in December? Well, I don't think I'll be staying as late as your Minister's lunch in December. But I will be here as I mentioned. There will be a community event, the first Tuesday night in December, sponsored at Sacred Heart Hospital. And everybody's invited to come and get a good taste of communicating with compassion. And they also have light refreshments. I look forward to seeing you again, Mark, next time I'm here. Again, thanks for joining us. ♪ Uzi's got a song to sing. It feels the way we're done. ♪ I'm gonna make the mountains ring. Oh, may the angels cry. ♪ Those of her tears on the way. And you may not know why. ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ Some may come and some may go. He will surely be his. ♪ When the one that left us here returns for us at least. ♪ We are but in moments of light fading in the grass. ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ If you hear the song I sing, you will understand. Listen. You hold the key to love and fear all in your trim of the hand. ♪ Just one key up locks them both. It's there at your command. ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ Come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ I said, come on, people now. It's my only brother and everybody gets together. I'm trying to love one another right now. I'm trying to love one another right now. ♪ Our guest today on Spirit in Action has been Uzi Winegarden. You can learn more about Uzi at his website, www.homestead.com/UziTeaches. That's U-Z-I-T-E-A-C-H-E-S. Music included in today's program included We Are Not Alone by John McCutchen Get Together by The Young Bloods and Our Life is More Than Our Work by Charlie King. You can view these facts and other links on our webpage as well as listen to this and other programs. The webpage is www.NorthernSpiritRadio.org The theme music for Spirit in Action is "I Have No Hands but Yours" by Carol Johnson. Thank you for listening. I welcome your comments and stories of those leading lives of spiritual fruit. You can email me at helpsmeet@usa.net. May you find deep roots to support you and grow steadily toward the light. This is Spirit in Action. I have no higher cause for you than this. To love and serve your neighbor. Enjoying selflessness. To love and serve your neighbor. Enjoying selflessness. We Are Not Alone by The Young Bloods. Music. You