Under The Lid - Inside Pro Cricket Podcast

Scar Tissue - Under The Lid With Ravi Bopara

Join Jack Brooks and Katherine Sciver-Brunt for Under The Lid - Inside Pro Cricket Podcast - with special guest, Ravi Bopara.

Ravi Bopara - across many subjects - discusses what keeps him going and coming back season after season, the cricket scar tissue he's built up and of course, what he makes of James Anderson's England retirement.

Tell us what you think using the #UnderTheLid hashtag on socials or email hello@underthelid.co.uk

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Duration:: 1h 9m
Broadcast on:: 11 Jul 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

(upbeat music) - Oh my god. - About Mark Alaferton. - Yes, mmm, just doing the nod. - The bleep to point look. - So he's loving this badgery chat. Oh, freaking hard to put it wrong, by the way. - 21 seconds to get it all and just keep going and keep going again until I die. (upbeat music) - Hello, and welcome to Under the Lid, the pro cricket show with me. Do you have a pro? You always laugh at that, didn't you? (laughs) - Me, Cap, or Simba, but yeah, sorry. That was a little bit low. (laughs) - As always, this podcast is brought to you in partnership with the PCA and the cricketer, we're still going strong episode 15, Bronte. - No, we're smashing it. Well, I was laughing because I thought I could see, I thought I could hear the little one in the background doing a little Trump, but that might have been just you. - No, no, it's been a busy, tough couple of days with a bit of gastro in the household. Not the only one who hasn't got it. So it's a ticking time bomb. - Is it just, is it just him low, or does that spread? How are you feeling? - That spread, my partner has it as well. She's, she's nuffed well. - Through the Ivan Edel. - Yeah, both ends. So that's fun. (laughs) But we had a nice date on Saturday. That was good before we all got ill, so. - Romantic, we saw the feralness kicked in. - Yeah, exactly, exactly. How have you been traveling around with Nat for these one days this week? - I tried to a little bit, but, you know, when fertility calls, it calls. So that stunted it a little bit. I had a trip from Bristol to London and London to Bristol and then an overnight stay and then back home because I bought a puppy approximately three months ago and I'm day two with her and, you know, slight having a child, slightly sleep deprived. - So you've been cleaning up (beep) it as well, then? - Yeah, but there's no nappies with puppies, so it's actual like scenes, like murder scenes. So yeah, not the best. - It's good practice for you. Hopefully when you do finally get pregnant, it's good practice for you, isn't it? - Mm, my niece and nephews used to (beep) put their backs, like, explosive poos, you know, like the... - Yeah, we can talk about leaking nappies all night if you want to. What else have you been getting up to this week? - Also just putting my, you know, adult head on as well. I've been doing some board member stuff, which, you know, could do it a bit later down the line and then doing some light investments and stuff, bought three houses the other week and I've been ripping one out. Literally, I love the rip out. I will never pay anyone to do that. - I doubt you'll do it, don't you? - Yeah, take my sledgehammer and off of the... - You're one of those TV show, shouldn't we? - Well, it's funny, actually, when I bought one of them, I got an email saying, would you like to be on homes under the house? - Yes, please, I'd love to say that. - Absolutely not. Is it Dion Dublin? It is Dion. - Yes, I think it is, yeah. - Yeah, Dion, just looking around the rooms like as if we're looking at something great, just like, yes, just doing the nod. It's ridiculous in it. It's actually one of my favourite shows, but... - You live a wonderful life, Bronte. I was coaching three days last week and we got, sorry, seconds. I got to finals day for the T20, which is good. So, seemed to be doing a lot of the coach so far. - How's your calf? - My calf's getting better, but it's still not that great. Stopping me from playing a bit of club cricket on the weekend, so... We'll see how it goes this week. Much better back. - I hope they provide you with a bit of physio and a few little rubs, no? - Don't get it for free every day anymore, do we, so... - That was a big concern of mine when I was telling you. It's like, "Oh, sh*t, I've got to pay for this now." - I'll wait to talk to our guest about how he's feeling physically. He's been around a long time as well and he's still going strong and making us look broken, even more broken than we actually are, probably. But before we get onto that, remember listeners, you can send in any feedback or questions by using the hashtag under the lid. We'll email us at hellounder the lid.co.uk. So, what do we know about our guest this week, Runti? - Well, with the English county season nearing its peak, obviously we thought it'd be perfect opportunity to bring on an icon in the county circuit, literal icon, and a former England men's play, obviously, a ravingising bopara or as he's more affectionately known, Ravi. - Yeah, very, very stylish cricketer. Been around for well over 20 years now, which makes me feel even older. But he has been there, got the t-shirt, won it all, done it all, and he's still going strong. Can't wait to speak to him. Got a lot to get through, hopefully. - So, let's go under the lid with Ravi Bopara. (upbeat music) - Evening, mate, how are you? - I'm good, I'm good, and I'm sorry, 'cause I was a bit late today, weren't I? Let's be honest. - A little bit, mate, but that's fine. On this pod, mate, that's the least of our worries, usually. (laughing) - You wanna see my set up? I bet you're sitting there with laptops and everything. You wanna see my set up? - Honestly, if I was to show you how I've set up for this camera and everything, you would (beep) yourself. - Only thing that could be worse is if you were on the bog, then that's the backdrop. - But I'll tell you what my set up is, okay? So, I'm doing it off my iPhone. The second thing is, I've got, do you know what a bubble tea is? You must know what bubble tea is, right? - Yeah, yeah. - Bubble tea. Okay, so I've got a couple bubble tea, and you know the big, thick straw that, so I've stuck the straw in, so I can lean the phone up against it, so I was sitting on top of the cup against the straw, just so I can be set by level. - This isn't your first rodeo, is it, mate? - So, if it does fall, I'm sorry. - Well, it'd be good content. - Sorry, yeah, we really appreciate you coming on, Ralph, thanks for that, mate. Where are you tomorrow? Have you got a game? - I have. I've got a game for the England legends. - You know this legends thing that's going on? - I did see it, yeah. It's been, it started recently, didn't it? - Yeah, so that's, we've got a game against Western East tomorrow at Northampton. We've got a win, it's a must win. - Your new home ground? - My new home ground, yeah. Yeah, looking forward to it. (laughing) A finer town, you never see. - Oh, that's the song, isn't it? Yeah, but I've seen, I have seen finer towns. I have seen many, many more finer towns than Northampton. (laughing) - No comment, mate, no comment. Mate, it's, I did say that competition, they're still allowing people that are playing and that's interesting, 'cause I thought some of these combs, you have to be retired to play in them obviously. Full on legend, do what you want. - Were you supposed to be retired, I think? - We're retired from England, aren't we? - It doesn't seem retired, does it? It's his legends. - Well, you are a legend, aren't you? - Well, I must be then, I'm just gonna take it. - Take it for what it is. - I wasn't gonna start with this question, but I might as well, 'cause we're around the subject. So I spoke to Laurie Evans last week, who is in Surrey, too, is just having a couple of T20 games whilst I was coaching, and well, he's 37 now, and you think he's younger, but he also keeps himself in great nick. - Yeah. - But he, we're talking about, we're gonna do it in the future and everything, and he just said, what was the point of retiring? Like, you can play forever, especially on the franchises, and then you've got all these retired leagues as well, legend leagues, whatever you wanna call them. - Literally now, there's so much, and you're getting paid very well for them. - Yeah. - Especially if you're a name or an ex-international light, you can almost never stop playing, as long as you physically are able to, and you actually want to play cricket until you're 68. Like, what? - No, yeah, actually, that's remarkable, isn't it? - Yeah, absolutely, right. I mean, if you used to ask me this 15 years ago, I just could not see cricket where it is today, and still play. I said to myself when I was a young, I must've been about 17. And Gucci was sort of my Essex hero, so Gucci played to me was 40, 40 plus. Then that's my minimum. I've got to get to 40 as a minimum, and now I just think, well, hold on. You're right, there's so many retired comps going on, that you don't have to stop playing, or can just keep going as long as, I'm thinking about, I'm actually thinking, how can I improve now more, to be a very, very good retired player, so that I'm wanted on the circuit as a retired player, rather than being, 'cause I'm gonna say 90% of the retired cricketers are just gonna let go, and probably gonna get fat. They're probably gonna get, you know, unfit, fat, probably not gonna train much and cricket, because they've got a life. But me, I haven't got a life, so what I'm thinking of doing is just training cricket, practicing, see what I can get better at, stay fit, and see if I can play another 10 years. - Wow. - Whoa. You ready for this? - Wow. Do you reckon you're bowling in those 10 years, or are you just gonna-- - So that's-- - Strike your bats around. - Yeah, that's the thing, bowling, I don't know. Look, there's not much effort in my bowling. - I was gonna say, it doesn't take much effort out. - No, it doesn't, it doesn't. It takes a lot of mental effort, if anything, because I must say, like, there's days that turn up now, and I don't bowl it. You know, they say, bowl the ball. And I'll find out hard to do every day, day, day out. Some days just turn up, and they just think, my coordination's off today. Everything's just off today. And you sort of just float it out, you sort of bite it out. And then there's days where everything clicks, and you'll probably go in, and then you say, okay, yeah, best gun, but it was much easier when I was 30. I felt way more consistent with my days, how I turned up than I did today. - It takes a while, my experience was, and we've spoken to Brenty about this a lot in the pod as well, just as you get older, your motivations, and just the longer it takes to get ready, it's what's really sapping, like the recovery, and when you turn up to the ground, you've got to spend even longer to do warmups, or get your body moving, or do your extras. - But then it eats away, you've got to be seriously motivated. One of my questions to you was, what drives you to play cricket after all these years, since you've watched your debut in 2002, you're not even 40 yet, but you're not a million miles away from it, are you? - Yeah, yeah, was it 2001, 2002, somewhere along those lines? It was that Northampton, actually, my first-class debut, anyway. What drives me, what motivates me is-- - You want to get better by the sound of things? - I do want to get better, because you can't master this game, right? You can't complete it. So you just go, "Well, what else can I achieve?" Like, there must be something more, because there's no such thing as completing the game, so let me see if I can win a T20 blast again with another county. See if I can better what I did last year. Can I get a better, can I back better than I did last year? Can I hold better than I did last year? Is it possible to learn a new delivery? All those weird things that come to your mind, and you just think, "But if I retire, "I've sort of given up. "I've sort of just gone, "well, I didn't really try hard enough "to see if I could get better." - It's amazing you've got that mindset. Something like a broadly finish at the top of his game last year, or sort of Alistair Kirk, who still could grind runs out at the top of his game. The county cricket was probably quite easy for him. You've still got that drive to actually mentally get yourself out of bed, drive to a new game, go to the gym, train the fears. Remarkle, you've still got that energy now. It's great. - Yeah, no, I can't say it's easy now, because there's a lot of other things I like doing. There are other things I like doing, whereas in my 20s and early 30s, there's nothing else I really like doing. I used to just love playing cricket, come into the season, and I'm sitting in the dressing room depressed, whereas everyone else is celebrating and it's the end of the season. I'm thinking, "Well, what am I going to do in my life?" It's the end of the season. What am I going to do? I'd be like, "I just have a net or something." But literally my whole life was about cricket and achieving what I needed to achieve as a creator. And I suppose in my life, I've probably been very selfish with the other aspects of my life, because it's more like in relationships and stuff like that. I've just been, "No, no, no, no, no. "If you're going to be with me, "then you follow what I do." Kind of thing, it's my career, and you either hop on board or you're not involved, and that's what I mean by being selfish. But the motivation is still there, but there's a lot of scar tissue as well, man. There's a lot of scar tissue that comes with playing this long. It's not about the age, the body can keep going. The body can just keep going and keep going and keep going. I don't have any trouble, really, with my body. But when you play for 24 years, you build up so much scar tissue in your brain as in you go through so many experiences, ups and downs, but more downs than ups, as a sportsman. You generally have more bad days than good. So you build up all that scar tissue in your mind, and that's what makes it hard. That's what makes you walk away from the game in the end, I think. Unless you physically struggle with it. But I don't think I'm going to physically struggle for another five years. Now, I had a, mine was more a mixture of things. Definitely the scar tissue, like, there is so many downs. And you sacrificed a lot. I know you said you'd prioritize cricket above everything, but I never really did that. I did maybe for the first 10 years, but after that, I was like, I think it's different, because being a female, there wasn't any cash in it. So it was like, so I went and did, half my time would be spent working or trying to earn more money outside of cricket. So my mind was always starting to stray away in terms of like family earning and living outside of sport, what it looks like after and then being in hospital multiple times. Yeah. So you, I think you're blessed with the staying away from the hospital situation. Yeah. Yeah, the strong body is always helpful, for sure. It's funny that, because I was, I remember being a little bit younger under 19s and sort of in my early days, I was tagged as unfit. And everyone just took piss at me. Like, you're the same photos of you. Yeah, I was fat doing that. And I was, you know, I was always told you're unfit, you're unfit. You know, you can't run, you don't run this on the bleep test. You don't run that on the bleep test. And I'll just remember saying, listen, the bleep test is pointless. All right. I kept saying it, the bleep test is pointless. No, it's not pointless. It's a test of your mental character and you need your fitness. And why do you need this type of fitness? Like I run in 16 yards and those 16 yard account account them. Like I step them out and count my run out. I don't even measure it. That's probably the, yeah, that's probably the most explosive I need to be. A 16 yards bowl, and that's it, really. I might chase the ball to the boundary once every sort of 20, 25 balls. I don't need to be that fit. And they said, what about running between the wickets? And I said, look, I think you're over-exaggerated now. I might run a two, I might run a three occasionally, but I don't need to be super fit. If anything, I need to be cricket fit, which is not getting injured bowling or not getting injured, trying to play a sweep shot or dive and do my shoulder or something like that. So I said, that sort of fitness, do you not take that into account? And then I would just get flopped off like I said, he's just being a smart ass now. But I do, I honestly, I don't believe in all these long runs. You don't have to be like super fit. You don't have to have a six-pack. You don't have to run 25 mile, two K runs in like 30 seconds and all that stuff that they'd, they do now, you just don't need it. To be fair, it's kind of gone out in a window with us. I think, I feel like the skin folds is like optional now. Because obviously it's, you know, new area, you don't want choice over stuff. So that used to be, you get fine. You'd like lose a percentage of your salad. Oh yeah, yeah, you're right. Which is actually pretty f***ed up if you think about it. You were just a little bit tubby, but you could do your job better than anyone. You can lose some salary, I thought that was a bit messed up anyway. But the fitness thing, you're right, you don't have, I don't, I don't need to be like mofair or whatever. I just need to be able to do my job well, that's all. I mean, it's different for me when I, the only time I ever struggled was maybe like fourth spell of a test match and I was like, oh f***, I'm getting real now. But it's a skill-based game, it's a skill-based game. You just need to be skill-based. You have to be skillful. Yeah. There's some it for, I'd say for myself and Jack maybe, if we were to add to ball, life 40, 50 overs, there's a rare occasions where you need it. I think I was running twos and threes in the windies or Sri Lanka once. It honestly like maybe out of, if I play a thousand games, there was maybe ten of them I needed to be pretty fitting. That's all I feel you, I never. Yeah. It's probably done. That's pretty grunty. That's how we managed to get as long as we did, starting late. You have a lot on the view now just being a 2020 cricketer, can't believe it? Since 2019. When I left Essex. Right, okay. Good show. Do you miss the Red Bull at all? I do. Make pace with it. No, I do miss the Red Bull. I play the twos game this year in the Red Bull. Did you? Yeah, just because I was being a badger, really. I was like, I'll use it as an excuse to say I need a bit of time in the middle, but really I want to just see if I've still got, can I still bat in Red Bull cricket? Have I still got the hunger to hang around in four-day cricket? You know, when you're just hanging around for just doing a bit and leave a few and all that stuff, if I've still got the appetite to do that, and it felt really good, actually felt really good. I enjoyed batting the Red Bull. Everything's at a slower pace, but I was so sore, I was so sore after the first day because we spent the whole first day in the dirt. Good start. Yeah, I was sore. It really broke me in nicely, and I was like, oh, I don't miss this. That feeling of coming back the next day, and you know, you're in the dirt again. I mean, I didn't miss that, but there is something about four-day cricket, you know. I did enjoy the grind, especially when you're batting, and you're not out overnight, those butterflies you have in your stomach, when you get home, you're having dinner, you're not, especially when you're like, I don't know, you're past 50. You know, you're sort of in the 60s, or you're in the 70s, and you go home that night, sort of reward yourself with a nice dinner, and you think, I'll get a big one tomorrow, big one tomorrow. You can't sleep all night, so you sleep deprived, turned up next day, and then you get cleaned up first of all. That's a great game, and that is a great game in a 10-second nutshell, I think. Yeah. It must be way easier to deal with now that you're just a T20 player, but you're one of the pioneers, if you like, of the format, because you've played since it started. How was the game, I mean, you must have seen so many different ways the game's been played and how players approach it now? What are the main differences now from when you started, and how is it quite brutal running up now to bold something, thinking this could go anyway, even if I'm, you know, Top End and Ravi Bapara, this could still disappear? I thought, yes, it was a lot easier, I felt, as a bowler, back when it started, and probably for the first, I would say, for the first 14, 12 to 13, 14 years, I felt, bowling in this format wasn't really that difficult. As long as you put the ball in the right area with a good slow ball, you were always going to get respected, whereas now you're probably not going to get respected wherever you put the ball, you know, the batters can put you at the park, but what I have found is if you put the ball in the right area often enough, they may hit the odd six, but if you keep putting it there, you'll get a wicket, that's what I find, especially if you can change the pace up, but as long as your length is good, they can't keep hitting you for six, I mean, they can, but you've got to take the chance, right? I think you've got to be brave in this format where you've just got to take the chance and say, I'm not going to, I'm not, I'm going to be brave and I'm not going to go defensive, I'm going to put it in that area where there's an opportunity for him to hit me at the park, but there's also opportunity for him to get out. And that, that game of cat and mouse, that's what I find the best, the best bit, rather than going, well, let me just shove this wide and get hit for one. There's no fun in that, there's no fun in that, it's more fun going, you know what, I'm just going to, I'm going to dangle the carrot, I'm going to dangle the carrot and then you might have a swing and look really, really silly when you get yourself out, but danged in the carrot. Can they play? Yeah. And they play 10 minutes too early on the shot because you've done this one, this one and this one. Right. I mean, just dangling the carrot. It's like spinners, right? Spinners have to dangle the carrot, you know, otherwise, you know, you can't get overly defensive as spinner, you've got to attack. But the carrot, sorry, let's get back to it, how has the game changed? It's just got, it's got faster, you know, there's bigger scores, there's a, there's abilities to score higher now and get 200, you've seen it now, 230, 200, you've seen way more 220, 30, 40s now in England than you ever did. It's just the ability of that as being able to hit the ball. And it's not just the top four now and your top five, where it was back in the day, it's now down to number eight or even number nine can still strike a ball and put it out of the park. That's, that's the difference. So that, that's just keep coming. They keep being aggressive. It's not, okay, you're a tallies man, you get us through, you back through, you get you, you get the 60, the 70 and we'll back around you. It sort of doesn't exist anymore, it's gone out of the window. Do you still, do you still like back yourself, um, more like, what, as much now as you did back then, like obviously you're still getting downward Milan Joe route out now, 24 years later. Do you still feel confident as confident as you did back then, you know, probably, you got what, if I'm being brutally honest, probably not, um, because I feel now, I don't have the same control over everything that I did when I was a probably, you know, my body was right and my mind was hundred percent. This is meant to be an advert to get you some more coin in another T 20 French. No, but you're like, yeah, my mind is, no, but you know, having, having spoke to most cricketers now around the world, I now feel what they used to say to me, sort of 10 years ago. Um, and you know, I used to say, well, what's the matter with you? Why are you so, um, why are you so negative or why you, why do you not back yourself and stuff like that? I understand now, uh, whereas I wouldn't understood, um, sort of six years previous. Um, I understand this way, I just, I don't know, I just understand way more. I think it's, like I mentioned before, all the scar tissue, all the hardships, the failures and stuff that have gone before me, um, in my career, they do play, they come back, they're playing you, don't they? It's like when people have traw my early in their life, um, you know, effects them a bit later on, um, and I find that's a little bit like this is a case, right? Um, all that scar tissue that builds up, um, you know, so many ways that can go wrong. Yeah. And, and I don't... The best of, the best and freest I ever played was like, at the beginning, I've never felt so free. Yeah. Because you don't have all that baggage. Yeah. Missed that so much. Yeah. And, and it's so good. And this is so hard to avoid, right? Yeah. But you know, you got to put that in your mind, but it's not that easy. You can't just put it in your mind, it's in there, right? Because you've, because you've experienced it. So it's in there. You can't forget about it. You've got to find a way of dealing with it, um, and that becomes the battle every day because you will deal with it one day and you will deal with it day two, day three, day four. But are you still going to deal with it, you know, um, back end of the season when you've, you know, you, you've got to do, or you're going to, because you play all year round, right? So are you going to keep dealing with it day in, day in, day out for the rest of the year? You might need to take a break and go look, I need time away from the game. And then come back fresh. I can't take time away from the game now, you know, it won't be accepted. People will go, well, you can't give you time away from the game, you'll be finished. You know? If you step away from the game now, take a break and people will go, no, you're done. You know, people go, he's 39, he's 40 and he's taking a break from the game. That means he's done. So there's no time for break for me now. I've just got to keep going. I've got to stay on the treadmill now and just keep going and keep going and keep going until I die, until I die. I'm sorry, but Jesus, can we clip that up after Scott keep going until I die? I'm so good. I'm getting a really good insight as to why you've gone for so long and why you're going to keep going. I'm just getting a little inside your head and a lot of this stuff is quite similar to me. You do see it stopping, you see it as a failure. I've given up, and also the amount of resilience you've built over the years from those scar tissues is why you're still like, it all makes sense to me. You might have shocking days sometimes. You might turn up and you're just, you feel like you're playing the cricket for the first time in your life and you're that nervous, you're that nervous, but then you'll come back another day and you'll be absolutely on fire. And then that's sort of, you've got okay, that's why, that's why. And they always, that always happens. Yeah. I just found when I got older, those days in between took a little bit longer. Yeah. Tell me about it. Well, I only need a day. I'll be right. Three of us practice that I've been fighting with cobwebs off. Expectation. We haven't spoke about expectation as we, I mean, there's expectation as well, I guess, as you get older, those people who select you to play for them, they're signing you on the basis and they're expecting you to do a job, right? And you can't just go, I promise that you can't go, yeah, I'll definitely play well for you just because I have done in the past and just because I'm experienced that I'm definitely going to play well, there's, sometimes you don't have control, right? You can do, you try all the right things and it doesn't go your way. You know, you, you might come in against the best bottle of your position and he, and he gets you out or you might go in at, go in at tough situations, you might bowl at very tough situations, you know, that day you may not be mentally right and have bad days. So, I mean, expectation is another thing. I think that comes along with playing for that long. People just expect you to do the job over and over again, like a robot. But we know, we know that that's not the case. It's just like anyone else. That's not the great game, is it? No. Yeah. Moving on to your international career mate, which might seem like a long time ago to you now. But 2015, I think when you were finished playing with England, but you played for about eight year period in all formats. Yep. Now, England are obviously playing West Indies this week, but laws take you back to probably a fantastic time of your life and do you allow your mind to look back at your test debut and your three consecutive hundreds against the West Indies, was it? You're up on the Honours Board at Lords for getting a hundred. What are your fondest memories represented in England mate in that sort of eight year period? Ah, fondest memories. Actually, it's not actually just test cricket actually, funny enough. I certainly don't want to look back at my debut. It was in Sri Lanka. It was in absolute nightmare, murley. Men ran the bass. Oh, in absolute bunches, Malinga as well, when he was just coming around. Cheating. Yeah, no, I just... I'm done. I can't look back at the first early part of my test career, but the comeback was good. Yeah, that was good times coming back against the West Indies in Barbados. Actually, it's funny, I think the A team were touring in the West Indies as well at the same time, and I just got a hundred in the A team, but we had a fitness test just before we went out to West Indies, and I failed it. I failed the fitness test, and then I'll get a call from the selectors to say, "Right, so-and-so's going on or something, I don't know, I can't remember who I replaced, and if we want you in, you're in and you're playing the next test." So I was like, "Oh, great." So I'll go back, play at Barbados, get a hundred, and then I hear from someone in the A team that there was a meeting after I'd been selected, I'd left the A team and joined the main squad, but there was a meeting amongst the A team, saying, and the coach called them in and said, "Do you think Ravi deserves to be called up to the main squad having failed his fitness test?" And everyone was like, "I don't know, I don't know, maybe not." I think the Yorks, I think the guys from Yorks just said no, he doesn't do it for you. But all the southerners were like, "Yeah, of course he does." And then, and then you, what was it, a day later, a couple of days later, I don't get a hundred at Barbados, and then it was all sort of forgotten about, you know, the fitness thing wasn't what you talked about after that. Do you have pretty fond memories of your test 100 at laws, mate, and you met that iconic generation of the signature in the air and stuff, like, what does it mean to you think back in now? Does it give you still give you hairs on the back, or is it just kind of, "Yeah, that was cool, but it seems a long time ago now." I remember saying at the start of that inning, so I said, "If I get 100, I'm going to signal to you, like, to put me up on the board." I was obviously, like, really confident at that time. I just got back from the IPL, and I saw a different world, where I got back from the IPL. It was early days of the IPL, and there wasn't many English cricketers that had gone over at the time. And when I came back, I was like, "Wow, I mean, I felt the top of the world, I was playing amongst the best creators in the world, superstars, and I was amongst it." So when I got back, I felt like a million dollars, I felt so confident. So that's why I had chat, like, "If I get 100 today, I'm going to give it that one," and all that sort of stuff. A little bit cringed. A little backhand. A little cringed, really. No. It's the confidence. Yeah, you get the name. Confidence of youth, right? Yeah, confidence of youth. You didn't have that scar tissue, did you? No, you're right. You just don't know all the stuff that can go wrong, right? There's not enough that's gone wrong for you to worry about at that time. Yeah. Confidence is key for me. It is absolutely the key. It is. And healthy arrogance, confidence, you've got to fake it to make it most of the time. Even when you feel like, "You've got to swag out onto the pitch," and act like, "I'm going to be up first ball," like, "Most of the times, the bravado is just like underneath your sh*t pants," but honestly, you've got to, because they've got to believe it. Yeah. I've never really, most of my career, I've never really been sh*t myself, and then pretended to be confident. I was genuinely confident. I was very, very confident in my ability, and never, never, ever doubted it. I have doubted it over the last few years, and that's, I think that's more so me telling myself that you're older than everybody else. So, you know, I think you play tricks on yourself, right? You say, "I'm so much older than everyone else," and... I feel like you're watching out for it, you're like... Yeah. Yeah. You're sort of... You're looking out for it, right? Waiting for something bad to happen, "Oh, I'm going to get injured more," or "Oh, I'm going to get slower," or "I'm not going to be able to hit it as far," or "I'm going to get fat quick, easy. It's going to be harder to lose weight, or whatever." It's a great... Honestly, it all comes in your mind. No, you're right. It's a great way of putting it. You're looking out for something, just because you're in your late 30s or, you know, approaching your 40s. You think there must be something that's going to happen that just gives it away that I'm old and rubbish, and I don't know, it's a weird one, it's a weird one, but I'm going to work it out. I'm going to work it out in my mind. It's going to say, mate, you sound like you're going to go forever, so you've given yourself a good time to work it out. It doesn't sound like you're in a mindset to finish, which I was, and it made me enjoy and care less about the result a little bit, without disrespecting my teammates or teams were playful. I cared about winning, obviously, but there was literally, I don't give a f*ck what goes wrong. I want to try and do as well as a camera and have a laugh, try and soak in this last few games, months, weeks, whenever it wasn't, and I'm so at peace with finishing, where obviously you're in a different mindset, you're like, right, next thing, when's the next thing, when's the next thing, I can't take my foot off the gas, because I might get left behind and then, yeah, then more, yeah, but it's interesting, mate, this is, I'm loving this chat, I'm absolutely loving this badgery chat. You were an ashes winner as well, aren't you? 2000 and 2009. Yeah, if I don't count, though, does it, it does count, I tell you why it does count. I tell you why it does count. Yeah. Because I didn't play the last test. But did you play in the series? I played four tests. You played four tests, mate, that's enough to win an ashes, isn't it? Yeah, no. Probably, no. Yeah, but I didn't get any runs, so like... You were there for the f*ck up, will you? I wasn't, actually, because I was back with, I was back with an Essex. I was back with Essex, trying to prove your point, trying to prove your point, saying, you know, I'd dare you drop me, kind of think. Okay. So, rather than talk about what's it like winning the ashes, what's it like playing an ashes cricket for four tests against that aggressive, gnarly, and fuzzy team as well. We've obviously Mitchell Johnson, Peterson, although sort of. Yeah. Yeah. I tell you what, when I went into the ashes, I knew nothing about the ashes, right? I didn't grow up watching England versus Australia. I grew up watching India, right, because my parents are Indian, and they watched, they watched India. So most of the time, when the cricket was on at home, it was Sachin Tindalka, Sachin Tindalka, Sachin Tindalka, Sachin Tindalka. No one cared about Mark Alapatin, or, you know, all these lot. And I was just saying that my brother loved Mark Alapatin. And I did, and I did secretly as well, because, you know, the great nickels and everything, and he, you know, he looks sweet, he looks sweet, he looks sweet, but it wasn't about, it wasn't about the English cricket, it was all about Sachin Tindalka. So I had no idea going into the ashes about how important the ashes was and how big it was. So, you know, everyone was sort of building up, and then you had this massive media frenzy about the ashes, and I was like, what is everyone getting excited about me? It's just another series, isn't it? And they were like, no, this is the ashes, this is the ashes. I was like, what does that mean? But then it got so much, it sort of got to my head a little bit, I was like, this must be massive, mate, this must be huge. And then, yeah, playing the ashes was, I can't say that I enjoyed it, to be honest. It was not a good time for me, because at that time, I went into it in really good form, really good form, and the first test, that Cardiff, I felt really good as well, I think I got 30-yarding, got out, but I felt really good. And then, I got a rocket at my arse for getting out, in the 30s, right, a proper rocket. The flower? It was from flower, yeah. It was probably the biggest rocket I'd received, ever, ever, up until that day, and I was like, oh, how do I play this one now, because, what do I do, do I play in shots, or, you know, and I was, I was gone, so I didn't know really how to approach it anymore. So it wasn't the play like you did against West Indies. It was just like, how do I not get out? And then I was just gone, mate, and then- Surely, just having to think about that right now, would you play better under this team now, with the way they approach stuff? Yeah, like, that would never, those words would never have gone falling on your ears, never. No, it would not. No, no way. And yes, I do sort of envy the way it is now far. If I had the mind that I've got now, with everything I've learned, I would have understood where Andy Flour was coming from. He only wanted the best for me, and he wanted me to do better. Now I understand it. I didn't understand it back then. Yeah, but he should know that that wouldn't have fallen. If he knew you as a person how you were then, he should have known how that would have fallen, too. So he can't just be about you. Maybe, maybe, or maybe he was just trying to say, toughen up, you know, he wanted the best for me. I know now, I didn't see it at the time, having played with him, I had been a teammate with him, and I had so much respect for me. It was like, like a batting guru to me. And then, you know, that happened, and I was like, "Ah, he must think I'm so ***** it." But I didn't get it back then. But I understand now, and I understand. And he could do that to me now, and I would get it, and I would go, "You only want the best for me." Yeah, "You only want the best for me." He wanted the best for me. He wanted me to be the best I could possibly be, possibly be, but I just took it the wrong way. So, it's a little bit my own fault. Well, yeah, I mean, the best bit about it is learning, isn't it? Learning, yeah. I guess that's why you're still going, because you probably still feel there's so much more to learn, like playing cricket now with the mind you have. It's just another level, isn't it? It's great. It is great. But there is a lot of... And it's not the same. There's a lot of temptation, though, with all these retired links that are kicking about. I'm snapped enough, I could barely walk in the morning. Oh, God. Hey, I'm talking about somebody who's probably broken enough, James Anderson. Obviously, he's got a shed ton of longevity, like yourself, fine wines. You are a couple of fine wines. And there's no reason, like, I mean, he rocked it for Langston for a week, didn't he? And just took a casual seven or eight, then that's just, that's it in there. It really is a shame that there has to be like an age and a limit on it before you move to the next. Like, why? Yeah. But why is the age of, I don't get it, like, I don't get it. If the blokes bowl in that well, why do you have to make room, make way for a younger person? Well, I don't get it. I think I just don't get it. I think the only thing I can think of is, is he still going to be doing it in three years and costs they have decided no, then that sort of made the decision for him. If it was more like, can he play next year in this series, this, whatever series, later gone. Yeah, probably. Okay. So, are you saying then, okay, we want to be for the next three years until these new guys get better? But why don't you just use the, yeah, why don't you just use the guys that you've already got that proven for the next three years and tell the other blokes to get better while they're still playing? Like, I don't know. Yeah. No reason. You can't. Why go, well, we want to blood this young, this other bowler for three years, but so, so basically you want, you want to be for the next three years. Is that what you want to say? Yeah. It's what I'm taking him out with Jimmy there. It's a good icon. The only thing I'd say is, I remember when Broad Nansen came in, they shoved out Hogard and Harmerson, who weren't quite finished and they chucked Broad Nansen and his two youngsters didn't they? And they kind of learned on the job, like, that's probably what they're probably maybe hoping for. But I don't know who that next two will be because there's no stand out. There's a lot of people in the same bracket, isn't there? I don't know. Yeah. Interesting one. I don't know who it'd be. Well, about the whiteboard team, mate, how do you view the whiteboard team because you obviously played so much whiteboard cricket for England, you were a big part of that team for a long time. You must have loved playing them for that team, but also, would you have swapped your time then to be part of the team now, or do you think, like, how would you get in the team now? There's a rubberboard. Yeah. Yeah, and I mean, it's a good question, but I mean, would I even get into this team that's kicking about right now? I don't want to face you. Oh, mate, you do all these ones, when I watch the blast sometimes, when you were in it and I was like, I'm like, Ravi's coming on, I'm like, I'd be one of the lads that'd be like, no, get one of the festivals that's not doing all these ones, I can't deal with it. I faced Wayne Bravo in a legends game last year, and I had to go up to him and say, just take it easy, yeah, I don't do 18 mile an hour. And he goes, don't worry, Yorka, and then slow ball, and he nearly blasted me toes off and then he followed it up with a ridiculous slow ball. Obviously, I absolutely loved his changeups, but I've never faced a men's ball since I was 17 and so it was just like, it was an unbelievable skill and that's what I see when I watch you, it's the same type of skill and I would just not want to, I wouldn't be there for it. Jack, what do you feel about how the lads viewed facing Ravi as a bowler? It feels me with dread, it feels like there is one of them that no one wants to face. Yeah, he definitely would have talked about in me, I remember, because he's someone, there was a few players each time you'd play, because Ravi probably never really, even if he wasn't getting wickets, he never really went for runs, is that fair, Ravi? Yeah, you'd probably pick up two, three, four, semi-regular anyway, but if you were never getting the, he was like, right, don't give your wicket away, he's a canny bowler, he's got a lot of slowies, rather than risk getting out to him, sort of knocking around and take risks against other bowlers, is that what, is that would have been a part thing for you, Joe? Yeah, I did notice after some time that people stopped playing big shots and it actually made it a lot more difficult, because I was at my best when someone was coming at me, so it was, right, I'm going to try to take this guy down, that was when I was at my best, and then when guys sort of knocked me around and played proper shots, then I was tentative with the ball, so I was like, I'm a bit tentative here, like, what do I do, do I have a ball ball, do I have a whole pace on, do I have a cutter, what do I do, whereas when someone was coming, I knew exactly what I was doing, and which ball I went to bowl, and I still feel that way a little bit now, you know, I feel like I'm always at my best when someone's coming, and I don't know why, I just feel like, I just do things best, you're more in it, a bolder ball better, I just feel in the game, but I haven't quite found my rhythm this year, I must say, this year, I haven't found it, I don't know if it's just bowling at a new ground, bowling at a lot of new grounds this year, because obviously in the North, everything feels a little bit more alien. It's a different game, mate, I've played in the North and South, and obviously played for a few different teams more than you, but the North and the South, T20, how they play the game on the pitches, it is different models, and you can see why the North, getting to final state, you know, would struggle sometimes on a used pitch, on the bigger pitch, it's only really Durham, really, I've found that would have been the hardest to battle in terms of a team dynamic, whereas down South, they're all tiny grounds, aren't they, run fest, apart from the Rose Bowl, probably, but they were two different brands of cricket, if you like, aren't they, the North and the South groups? Definitely, definitely, it is a big difference. I have found it a little bit easier to, I can't say I find it easier to bowl in South, because smaller grounds, but then there's that element of they're coming for you, right, because they're one of the small boundaries and they're coming all the time, so you'll sort of switch on, and you're boiling your best ball of time, whereas here you sort of think, well, I can get away with this, I can get away with that, you end up getting hurt anyway, because you know, you're not really in it, I just haven't found my rhythm this year properly, I think bowling at these new grounds, just little bits here and there, it's been really windy this year, for some reason, why has it been to windy? I hate wind. What's that all about? I mean, it's been ridiculous, it's been so windy this year, I haven't played the match yet, where I've felt I'm getting blown around, as I'm, you know, sort of running in or just like in your load in the big gust of wind, especially at my hours or pace, when I say hours, you know, I don't know what I'm talking about, me, my sort of pace and the pace I run in at, I can easily get blown by the wind, because I can't run through that wind, I sort of jog in. It's very in, mate. Yeah, I trot in, so that's been the nightmare, the wind has been a nightmare this year, but not making any excuses, and it's all out, I need to find my rhythm, I've just haven't found my rhythm yet. That's awesome, mate, I'll, we're running out of time, I really wanted to pest you more about your new club and what's it like playing for different teams, and I haven't even touched on the franchise. I wanted to ask you one question, do you know how many teams you've played for in T20 cricket? I'm going to say, there's a lot of teams I've played for that is not on there, so I would say, yeah, yeah, I'll tell you this in the mid 40s, I reckon. Really, they've missed a lot then, because there's what, we've been informed that there's 66 on whatever profile they've got, I reckon, I reckon they've missed out 15 or 20. How many shirts you got? That's the thing though, do you know where I've had a shocker is I haven't kept shirts from... I've burnt it. None of them. Do you know which shirt I've kept? The best thing of my career, the shirt I kept was the 1960s winning the blast, no winning the blast. On the blast, sorry, Hama, Hama's day out. Yeah, that was the best demo career. Really? Interesting. I love that. Great mate. Easily. Well, that's fantastic. That's fantastic to hear. I really wanted to get under the lid with you more on them, more of those. I wanted to ask you one quick question about your life away from cricket before we get on to the other stuff we go into every week. Away from cricket, I didn't realise you have got your own chicken shop and potentially a coffee shop in Dubai as well. Chicken shops somewhere in London, haven't you? Yes, I have in South London. It's not too far from the old way, so you can two-ting. Two-ting? Excellent. Yeah, two-ting. And how's that there? In the non-trippinger. How's fried chicken doing? It's good. It's good. It's very good. I mean, people are always going to want to eat, right? It's up mate. Big time. Perfect. I hope it's open till all hours. It's open till, I'm going to be careful, I say it because the council might be watching. Two-ting council. So, I mean, we've done before, right, so I think we were staying open at our world later than we should have. It's got a tissue mate. It's got a tissue mate. And then we got the old visit from the council to say, you know, let her or something, you're staying open to this house. Someone grasped us up, I don't know. There's always someone that grasped us as you are, right, got nothing better to do. And then they go and they go and tell the council. So, yeah. So we got that and then you're right, coffee, a little coffee joint in Dubai. Really nice, actually. Really nice. Awesome. It wasn't supposed to be that nice, but it turned out to be really nice. That's awesome. Pass yourself a note, no scar tissue on the coffee and tea front, yeah, that's good to hear. Right, one of our features is our cricket archive guest statler. There's usually a siren around the, there it is. Take good money for that. So, out of all the English players still currently playing, so not in the legends league and everything, but professionally playing cricket, because you're old as ****. You've got the most runs currently of those who are still playing, and you've scored 31,990. Wow. 10 more. Yes, 10 more thousand. Then 10,000 more after that. Who's second, I'm proper keen now, see us up your arse. Well, it'll be someone who's playing for their cricket, right? I haven't played for their cricket for five years now, wish I did that, because that'll probably be. We off the chart. It'll be like real tea or something like that, wouldn't it? Yeah. Okay, we'll have a quick PCA MVP update as we are, the podcast for the PCA, and in the MVP standings powered by Gentex, Shock Hampshire's Leid Dawson has finally got up to the first place ahead of David bedding him, he had a great week. My Keaton Jennings got 187 against knots, he's now up into third, and he's doing bloody well for somebody who just plays as a batter. In the character championship stand in Ryan Higgins, who was my bet at the beginning, has been replaced by Dawson as well with bedding and third Jennings fourth. Ravi, quickly, one name for us, who are you back into shining the men's MVP this season? Is that the overall? One. Yeah, overall. Quick name. I'm going to say DOS, yeah, DOS is, yeah, it bats bowls, bats bowls, it's the easy game for a rounder mate. You know that. Yeah, it plays all the format, bats and bowls and all the formats, cause they're wrong. Where's he field? Cause not, do it. Fielding. Get fed. Oh, there you go. BLE. Yeah. My money's on him. Yeah. He's getting better with age. He's getting better with age. He's had a really strong, since he knackered his Achilles, he tore it really badly a few years ago. If you're doing his 30s, to come back from that with the way he has is unbelievable. He's getting better. He's going to get better and better, I think. You need to call him rather than just say mate, 45. Me and you. Yeah. 45. I've seen, you know, what's funny, I've seen youngsters come, and then youngsters go. And then see, and then see new youngsters come. Yeah, that's scary. What am I doing? Anyway, on the old women's, overalls, not changed much, she's had one game since. So, you know, then he's pulled the finger out and played a bit more cricket, but we've still got Bricey, Catherine Brice, leading the way, Holly Armitage, Yorkshire Lass in 2nd and Kirsty Gordon's right up there from the blaze. And then we've got George Adams in the top three, which is a new name, but she is, she has a batter in these filthy off spinners that actually somehow work. You've got to be an all-rounder think to win the MVP. If you're just a gun batter, you've got to have an unbelievable year with the ball. Yeah, well, which is so tough because you miss games as well. Yeah. Holly's pretty much only a batter, so she's doing well in the little leggies. Moving on to our next feature, under the lid's big question. I feel like we've already added, you know, how could you top 40 odd franchises? I didn't know that. I did, you're not cricket-related, Rob, is there anything quirky that not many people will know about you? Not many people would know about me. We've got a tattoo somewhere, shouldn't we, do you play an instrument, are you a DJ? I used to be a DJ, you know that. Have you got a Ferrari? You used to be a DJ. I used to. That's when I was like full. What was your DJ name? I can't remember, do you remember Gary? Bob. Do you remember Gary? Yeah, of course we do, man. Yeah. Music. Yeah. So I also started welding, I was welding the Gary's music back then, you know, a bit of a chab and everything. Twenty-one seconds to be low. Twenty-one seconds to go and all that. So I remember decks, proper decks, like what you put vinyls on. So I set them up in my house with speakers, everything, my parents were good, right? What they put up with, the **** they put up with and the noise pollution they must have put up with. I was just banging out tunes on these massive speakers with my decks and, you know, scratching and all that sort of stuff. I was doing it. But you thought you were men. Honestly, I remember saying to my mum saying, you know what, I'm going to be the biggest DJ in the world and all this sort of stuff. I had that vision of me just DJing on these pirate radio stations back in the day and everything. And then quickly realized by the time I got to 16, I had to start taking cricket a little bit more serious. You need to talk to your main cookie for message and just get a few lessons in there, just bring the rate, get the spark going, go up and open up a new DJ setting to buy next. That's a tough question. Can I be men? What people don't know, I don't think that people don't know. I'm a bit of a ghost badger, you know. Oh, well, that's handy because that takes us on to the next section of our show, which is the big quiz, the last round. And on this, we're feeling like we're going to get a bit of a tailor made sponsorship. So the price could be well up your street. I brush around for you, got to get quite a few right here. Oh, really? God, okay. Right, runs are on the board. You get one run for each correct answer. You get about 60 seconds, my knowledge is rindest, by the way. Oh, don't worry, it's not general knowledge, it's all going to be like nice. Yeah, we don't believe in the second one. We've got a few people who are joint bottom with four right. So you've got a minute. So if you don't know, it just goes past because we got loads. Okay, cool. So if you get more than four, you won't be bottom. They are Oli Pope, Kate Levitt, Sarah Glenn, Tom Colacab, or Ben Duckett. And at the top on eight, we've got three people leading, Oli Han and Dolby, Harry Brooke and Catherine Rice. You've got this. You've got six teammates, Sam Cook got six, Jamie Porter got six. So there's one for you if you want a bit of bragging rights. Well, Ravi's told us he's about you. So I've got no doubt in you. Are you ready? Yeah, let's have a bit of a countdown then. Three, two, one, go. Ravi, you've got one. Tess Wickett, your name. Can you name the Batty? You're Smith. Joe Woodner. When did you win the PCAMN's Young What Player of the Year? 2007. No. Where did you make your England debut? ODI. 2007. Where did you say? Yeah. Yeah. How many runs did you score? Not only appearance at the 2020 World Cup. How many runs? 15. Against New Zealand. 15. Next question. When did North Hands last win the Vitality Blast? Oh, God. 2000 and 17. Oh, never. What year were Sam's Chickens founders? 2012. 2012. How many half-centuries? How many half-centuries did you score? In one-day internationals. What? 15? 10? How many sixes? Have you hit in your professional tea to any career? 100? How many Instagram followers do you have? Get within 5,000. How many? 12,000. Yeah, we can. He knows that Instagram. He doesn't know he's tough under. He's been no younger than me. He doesn't know he's tough under. He's been no younger than me. What a meal. What a meal. I've got three. I'm the worst. That was very entertaining though. I enjoyed that. That's more important than the league table mate. Mate, we'll let you go. It's getting on and you've been unbelievable mate. We could have strung this out for hours and talked so much more. So many, much more. I wanted to get out of the libaduma. It's great to see you again. It's been a while since. Yeah. As you've seen. It has been a great chat. It has been. After all those years, dueling events to you. It's nice. It's not having to face your mate. Mate, you've dealt with me enough time. Yeah, I know. You dealt with me. No, no, no, I haven't. I haven't. I was always worried about getting hit in the shin mate. Always. Always. It would be swinging out. Then pitch. I think I'll bang straight back at your shin. I was always worried about it. It was very kind mate. It was very, very kind. I've got a lot of wickets with half-bollies mate if that's what you mean. But yeah, very kind. Mate, awesome. Stay in touch. You have a fantastic rest of the blast and legends tournament. Good luck tomorrow for the... Ooh, good luck. Thank you. I'm looking forward to seeing a lot more of you on our screens or on scorecards for years to come mate. Thank you very much. Appreciate that. Let me know if you ever want me back. I'll be happy to come back. Mate, I reckon we should have an under the lid trip to a chicken shop. Yeah. Yeah. Do you feel me in the chicken shop? Get down there at 5am when the council's round. Yeah, let's do it. Cheers. Rob, top man, take care mate. Cheers. What a beauty. What a beauty. What a great man. That's one of my favourite parts. We do the train. I know I say it every week, but... We could have talked for about another hour, I reckon. I reckon we touched half what we wanted to. Oh, really? A hundred percent. There was so much more we could have got deep with, but he's so good. He's engaging in his thought process, but someone that is quite flair and relaxed player to watch and to play against. He's actually quite a deep thinker, and yeah, it's amazing to get that sign of him. Well, it's just like, for a start, he's experienced beyond a many a cricketer, and then just so open and honest. And we're willing to share past mistakes and stuff. Just really good insight I've thought. Great to get to know him. A hundred percent. There's a few lessons in there for us all, I think, and for some listeners of their young. Yeah, definitely. Moving on to our feedback from a few people this week. I don't know if you want to read the first one, there aren't you? I'll have a good crack at John from Lanks. I'm sorry, you're from Lancashire. Pope spoke about Jimmy, Ollie Pope, last week. Given his performance for Lanks, shouldn't he be continuing with England if he wants to? Life in the old dog yet. I think we touched on that, didn't we? And Ravi came for him to play number five years if he wants. So, what do you reckon, Jack? Listen, it's an icon, and you want to remember him for being a God that he is a bit like broadly going out on a high. I'd love for Jimmy to go out with a five foot Lord's in the test with. And be remembered for someone that's the danger when you're a bit older, is not being one person that's hanging on and people are like, why is he going? Try and leave when you're that good. Try and leave when people want him more. But it's easy to say that when you're not that person when you're, you mean you look at him, he's peaked fit. He's fit in these other things. He's bold as well as he's ever done. It's just, I guess, for the good of the team for the future, they see a different vision, which I can't argue with. But we just got to enjoy him one last time, haven't we? I want that for him so bad, like you said, because I didn't have a good mindset going into the T20 World Cup semi-final. Like just that whole tournament was one of the hardest tournaments I've ever played, ever, because my form was not, I'd never had a time where I was out of form, like completely. My, my action was shot to **** and it just gone, like, just like that. And it was, it was, I was like trying to get it back in this tournament and then thinking about, oh, this could, this is my last. I want it to be perfect and it just completely ruined you and I don't want that for him. And it, I mean, it's hats off to Brody to be able to do that knowing this is your last overmate, like, that couldn't have gone any better for him. How good was it to like? Not everyone gets a ferry. And even you as an icon of the English women's game. Yeah. Even you saying that then you didn't get your fairytale finish site. It's not, everyone doesn't get it. No one's owed it. That's the beauty of professional sport, isn't it? As long as everyone needs it on it. So they're happy with themselves and the game, I guess. Yeah. They won't change the world. We won't change the world feel about him. No chance. Just got to get through without crying. That's an achievement. Yeah. Be emotional. I reckon I'll probably be emotional, especially imagine he'll be in tears at some point. Absolutely. Right. That is a wrap for this week. We always love reading your feedbacks. So feel free to email or get in touch with a hashtag under the lid on socials or you can email in at hello@underthelid.co.uk. Thanks very much for getting under the lid with us this week with Ravi Papara. What a guest. Great fun. If you enjoyed it, please subscribe. Leave a review. Tell all your friends. Bronte, have a fantastic week. Good luck with your puppy. And we'll reconvene next week with another fab guest. Yeah. The eye bags are going to be down to the floor. As will yours with the bombing and the pooing. Thank you. Bye. Take care. [Music]