MuppeTrek
MuppeTrek - Episode 124 - "Wembley and the Gorgs" and "Symbiosis"
Well, hello there, this is Crammate D. Frog. Fascinate, I'm Captain Kirk. Magic is always there. I always be keeping people looking for it. I get it. What does God need with destruction? Thank you, thank you, love you, mwah. I'm from test, I am not a merry man. ticker, never ticker. Places please, and here we go. And a Frego Rock. Welcome, doozers, gorgs, and ormarians and things to episode 124, The Muppet Track podcast, I'm Jarmin. And I'm Steve, we're on a journey across the stars to compare and contrast the creative worlds of Jim Henson and Gene Roddenberry. And what started as a comparison between The Muppet Show and Star Trek, the original series has expanded. And this week, we have Frego Rock episode, Wembley and the Gorgs, and next generation episode, Symbiosis. That's right, but before we get to that, Steve, I want a rock. I want a rock. Oh man, and I'm not gonna give you one. This is that rocks, each week I'm gonna tell you about a gem geode or otherwise thing you can find under the ground, or maybe even in Frego Rock. And this week, I've got Ademite. Ademite is often found around zinc deposits. While Ademite itself is clear, it takes on, it fills in the gaps in its structure with other elements, which allows it to be a huge wide range of colors. When iron fills those gaps, it turns yellow. When copper is involved, it oxidizes and they turn a lovely green color. When cobalt gets in there, it turns everything purple and red. Beautiful. They don't make great gemstones 'cause they don't cut well. However, they're widely sought by collectors and rock collections all over the world. 'Cause they probably look cool. That's right. So that's Ademite and that rocks. I want a rock. (laughing) All right. So what happened this week on Frego Rock, Steve? Oh, man. What's up, Doc? Well, what's that crazy doc up to? Doc and Sprocket receive another postcard from that for that Gobo Fraggle character. Just as Gobo is heading to outer space to collect it, Doc receives his own letter. He's been invited to a Tinkers convention and he's been named Man of the Year. Oh. But don't worry. Sprocket's sad, but Mr. Schimmelfenny and his cat Fluffinella are gonna help take care of Sprocket. Sprocket is not stoked about this. Sprocket begrudgingly takes his caretakers. Doc returns at the end of the episode. He's received his award and he gives Sprocket a reward of his own. Dog of the Year. In a big boom. Gobo grabs the card and escapes back into Frego Rock, breaking Boober's lucky walking stick. Boober complains and complains until Gobo finally agrees to go get him a new one from the Gorg's garden and somehow Wembley gets roped into going. Junior Gorg is there setting a Frego trap and then his father just pushes a ladder out from under him trying to injure and kill his son. And then yells at him to play the damn garden. Wembley and Gobo make a run past Junior Gorg when Wembley is accidentally caught in a pot. Gobo goes back to Frego Rock and rallies the Fregles to go get Wembley as Wembley sort of befriends the Gorgs. He's smoothing things over, schmoozing the king and queen, saying he worships them. And after dinner, one of the, after dinner, the other Fregles come and they try to spring Wembley, but they get caught in Junior's trap from earlier. Junior throws them all in the tool shed because they refuse to worship his mom and dad. We then get treated to a Rocky bluesy song about getting back to Frego Rock, which is super up temple and one of my favorites. - That was good. - To take their mind off of things and how doomed they are, they take time to read Uncle Traveling Matt's cart, which I'll talk a little bit about later. The next morning, the Gorgs plan to crush the Fregles, but they decide to hold a trial instead. And the king and queen and Junior come out donning in wigs and robes like they're in royal court. Wembley pleased for lives of his friends, but in the end, he ends up biting the king on the nose, causing mayhem as the table is tipped and the others escape the chaos. They make it back to Frego Rock. Everyone learned a lesson. And that's what's happening in the rock. - Don't Frego Rock. (laughs) - So, German, what did you think of your second-ever episode of Frego Rock? - They jump into things pretty smoothly, I think, for the second episode. And I think everything's kind of firing on the cylinders. We're gonna be seeing it firing on already pretty well. I had to admit that one of my favorite quotes was when the very beginning Gobo was saying, "I'm gonna go mosey on over there and get the postcard." And he just splits really fast. And then we'll see other guys named the one that's-- - A Boober. - Boober, he's just like, "That's a very spirited mosey." (laughs) I was just like, "I just left out with it that way." I love that they have, they now, I don't know if I saw them in the last episode, they have many copies of the Fraggles for when they're next to a large human figure. And they're like, little tiny-- - I don't think I used them maybe one shot last episode. - Oh, yeah. - Two shots last episode. - They had a lot in this one. It was really cool. It was cool that they can do that. But also they covered huge issues like freedom and slavery and friendship in this episode. Big ideas. - Oh, yeah. - This is our first look at the gorgs at all three of them and their situation and what's going on with them in the-- - In their universe, we're-- - Yeah, they're the queen and queen of the universe, but they don't have any followers if they're sudden. Like, that's just great. - And it also brings the question of like, are they in a different dimension that's next to Earth? Like, and is like Fraggle Rock the door to this different dimension that you go through to go from our Earth to theirs and like, maybe we'll get some answers to those questions later on. Maybe we won't, maybe it doesn't matter, but it's all interesting questions now. - I don't know. - Yeah, like, what if the gorgs are like the giants of ancient tales? - Yeah. - And somehow, Fraggle rock splits the worlds now. And Fraggle's like these little magical sing-songy creatures that are able to venture between-- - And they're like fairies for ancient lore, maybe? Who knows? - And that's why there's only three gorgs 'cause man killed almost all of them. - Oh man, that's a dark story. I wanna see some time. - See? This is what I hope we get to it. - Yeah, I know we won't, but I hope we do. - And I did like there's a lot of upbeat cool songs this time around. There's like one slower, nice song, "Ballad", it was great, but they balanced it out really well with faster songs and bluesy songs. No trash heap this time around, but that was, that's fine. - Yeah. I know that you were a little bit worried about the quality of the songs keeping up. So do you think the quality of the songs is kept up this episode? - It has, it makes you even more worried for them. So I'm like, you can't keep making them this good 'cause then how are we gonna keep this up? - We've got a lot of good songs. The next episode came on after they like auto played through and right at the beginning, there was like yet another song I haven't heard in. - 30 years. - 20 years, 25 years, and I still sang most of the songs. - Oh my gosh. - With red. - So yeah, it's my favorite episode of the season so far. (laughs) Out of the two. - Ah, low hanging fruit. - Yeah. - But yeah, I totally agree. We opened it up a little bit. We got a good idea of what the uncle traveling mat thing's gonna feel like basically from here on out. We got a better idea of Wembley and Boober. I like that we got to see Gobo, like the Freggles ready to go to battle. Like they've got armor. - Yeah, I put on colanders and stuff. - Yeah, they just have those things which means the Freggles have gone to war before. We're just building out this universe. - And I like Wembley a lot. I don't think we saw much of him at all in the last episode if at all and he's just really cute and adorable. He's agreeing with everyone 'cause he's just having a new super cute. - But no dozers. - He's hard to have an argument with. (laughs) - Yeah, no dozers, but well, there's plenty of dozer plot later. You're gonna get more of everything. - Oh, and I need to mention, we watched this show called "I'm Actually." It's on the drop out network thing that we watch and they had a question about the dozers on there. And basically the premise of that show is these, they say a statement and they have to guess what's wrong about that statement. And they talked about how the dozers make all these buildings throughout the series of the show. And they always get so frustrated when the Freggles eat it. And I was like, "Um, actually, 'cause I knew the couch." Like they don't like the eat it. - Yeah, they love it. - They love it. - I was like, "I just fell out." (laughs) - Also, I think episodes like this are why I don't think we're gonna have too much trouble finding similarities between Freggle Rock and Star Trek as we go from this point because there's so many, you said, messages about freedom and slavery and overseer and like those sort of things are just, they're just in this kid's show. - And they're traversing different kind of realms and dimensions and stuff. So it's kind of like, yeah, it's a lot there. - So I'm looking forward to more, but you're right. Best episode this season. (laughs) - Absolutely. - So what are those silly creatures up to? Uncle Traveling Mat observes carefree flying creatures or as we know them kites believed to be invented sometime in the 5th century in China. They, because not only are their reports as early as 549 that paper kites were used to pass messages during a rescue mission, but they had access to silk cloth, bamboo and silk string, which were all sort of the strongest materials at the time that were super lightweight. So regionally and what they had access to, it also makes sense. And we do also know that Marco Polo brought stories of kites back from his travels into Europe in the 1300s. - Damn. - And they started sort of as curiosities and fun, but by the 1700s and 1800s, they were being used in science. They were being used in sailing and navigation to measure distances. So, but then unfortunately then with World War II and sort of the evolution of small fighter plane as military, it's like easier military and the large bombers and stuff, kites kind of went in. - And we have the famous story of Ben Franklin with the key on the kite and getting struck by lightning. And that's why we have like electricity and that kind of thing. - Exactly, it was kites were used in science. - Yeah. - So that is what the silly creatures were up to this week. - That's right. - Jeremy, what did you think was the best puppeteering moment? - I will say, I think with the introduction, we'll lose a little bit more of the mini-sized Fraggles. There were some great scenes right there with the gorgs, the Fraggles trapped in the small cage and then Wembley was in front of the cage and he was on a green screen as a full-sized Fraggle to make him look the same size as the mini-fraggles behind him and then there was still the big, you know, a gorgs behind. So all that at one point is not just a achievement in the miniatures and the puppetry, but also like the camera tricks and the green screen. - Oh yeah, intelligent making. - Yeah, so like that's easier nowadays, but back then that was not very easy. So I was pretty impressed by that. - I'm gonna give it to Fraggle Rock Rock when they're in the cage, all singing together and trying to kind of like break out of their cage. - Oh yeah. - It was such a good number. Seeing all four of them playing together. - And that tight little space. - In the space, well yeah, it was fun. And so I'm gonna give it to Fraggle Rock Rock. - Very well worth it, absolutely. - So, Dravin, what happened on this week's episode of "Star Trek The Next Generation?" - Well, this week we have symbiosis. So the Enterprise is taking a look at some cool star going crazy with a bunch of flames coming out of it and they get a distress signal from a nearby freighter. And the freighter is losing its orbit on a nearby planet and is about to crash and burn into it. So the Enterprise crew tries to help them over the space phone, but the crew seems too dumb to understand their own ship to save themselves. And they're barely able to transport them over to the Enterprise before the freighter blows up. But not before they transport a cargo container over first, which is kind of showing that they were valuing this cargo container more than their own lives. And the four people that beam over consist of Tajon and Romus, who are too disheveled or Narins and Sobie and Langor to snooty Breckens. And the Narins and Breckens are from two different planets in the system and we learned the Narins are suffering from a plague and the Breckens have the only treatment for the plague on their planet. This thing called Flesium, but they won't give it to the Narins for free and the Narins were about to buy this cargo container full of a Flesium from them, but the payment just blew up with the freighter. So now they're kind of screwed. Meanwhile, we find out that the two Narins on board are actually currently infected with this plague. So Dr. Crusher examines them, but can't find any sign of contagion or a virus. Just these terrible symptoms are starting to exhibit. So Picard tries to convince the Breckens to have a heart and just give the Narins a Flesium for free, but they tell him that the two planets are completely dependent on one another. And the Flesium is the only industry on Brecka and their only source of income is selling the Flesium to the Narins to treat their plague, but doesn't actually cure them, it just treats the plague over time. So Picard has to admit that he can't directly interfere or that would be breaking the prime directive, but as the Narins and the Enterprise start to tweak out even more and get more sick, it seems, he's able to convince the Breckens to at least give the two of them a dose of Flesium, so it can help them for now. And Dr. Crusher watches them take the Flesium and realizes that they react to it just like they would some drugs like opium or some kind of heroin, that kind of thing, they all get all happy. So they confront the Breckens about this and with some help from Data doing some extra research, they find out that 200 years ago, the O'Narens had a real plague that was actually cured by the Flesium, but it was also highly addictive. So since then the Breckens have been fooling the O'Narens into believing they still had the plague, so then they had to continually treat it with the Flesium and keep buying it from them. But Picard can't tell the O'Narens any of this because of the prime directive, but he allows the Breckens to send down the Flesium cargo for free because they want to keep them addicted. But at the same time, he now refuses to help the O'Narens fix the remaining cargo ships they have, which means that after this point, they won't have the means to transport any more of the Flesium from Brecka. So now at this point, all the O'Narens will eventually go through painful withdrawals, some will die, but eventually they will be free from the addiction, much all to the chagrin of Dr. Crusher thinks this is all terrible, but Picard's hands are tied supposedly. So it's a lot going on, a lot of politics and things happening there, but Steve, what do you think of this episode? Okay, some things I like. I loved the distress call, just the whole them being like dumb yokel, Captain and crew, like, oh, well, we don't know how to do that. It felt the later it did feel out of place 'cause they didn't really play that way the rest. Yeah, that was odd. They seemed like idiots at first and then they weren't. It was an early hard sell and I don't know why they sold it that hard at first 'cause they pulled back. I loved the great addition of them saving the cargo and sort of the crew. It added another level of mystery that typically these don't have. They typically just jump to it. And in addition to that, I put it on, they finally slow played the reveal, which was good for you, Star Trek. You finally did it. With the symbiotic relationship was too convenient. We knew it, Crusher knew it, but we didn't know why. And the episode didn't immediately tip its hand to the why, which I was proud of. Normally they immediately tip that shit. Like I arrived the bat basically. Had her biggest role in many episodes and she has definitely done drugs, right? Oh yeah, for sure. And I also liked that John Luke called the guy's bluff on murdering Riker. It was a nice human kind of moment that didn't just result in escalation, which is pretty typical. Some things I struggled with a bit. They, there was that really terrible after school special vibe that took over about the two minutes right in the middle. Oh yeah. Really bummed me out. Drugs are bad, okay. Really bummed me out. It was really too convenient that these two in theory traders, not big wigs in the government, not presidents of this thing, happened to know the planet's biggest secrets. There is no reason that that would be just like a known thing. 'Cause it makes you wonder they were selling this other. They were selling a huge amount of Felicium. So it's possible they could have been high level, but you're right, they never mentioned that these are high level people. Right. We don't know. Yeah. As far as I'm concerned, they're random space traders. Yeah. And so there was that aspect of like, why do they know this biggest secret? Why do they have no skills to lie about it? If they've literally been lying to these other people. For two hundred years. Yeah. For forever. And that means that every single person on their planet's in on it. And that's hard. Like, that's just not the case. Yeah. There's got it would be a government deep secret that only a few people would know and why the fuck would it be these two. That makes sense. And then Gates McFadden, her acting in the beginning was really great. Her objection, we got to see her stretch and push against her cart a little bit, which we really haven't gotten to see, at least not to this extent. Later on, she went so far overboard that I couldn't stay with her. At the end, she just came off sort of as like a petulant teenager. Yeah, a little over the top kind of acting. But the beginning was so good. It made me go, oh, no, Gates pull it back a little. Just a little. Which is good because for another show, Paul Wright, he's from an early time, has always said that Gates McFadden's acting was way too wooden. And I think this episode, she was the opposite of wooden. She was just going all for it, you know? Going over it, over it, yeah, she just went over it a little bit. Yeah, I could see it. But overall, it was okay, episode. Yeah, I think besides the heavy handedness of the anti-drug message, I kind of liked the episode. Like you said, the reveals and what's going on with these people. It's a mystery and we get to see Picard as a diplomat and a negotiator a little bit. And it highlights the values of Starfleet, the Prime Directive, but we know that they break those all the time. So it's kind of like, why didn't they just break it this time? Yeah, why was this the bigger thing? Yeah, and they also some good ensemble moments, which you said like Dr. Crusher was there. But I think the guest stars were very good actors. I think they all did a very good job playing their parts. I think they had some confusing direction. Like you said, they're played really dumb at first, but then that just gets thrown away literally dumb. Overly dumb at first. Yeah, it was like, that was funny too. It was interesting 'cause I love seeing Picard's reaction. He was like, why don't they not work their own ship? Like what the hell they doing? Do you want us to beat me over? Yeah, that'd be great. (laughs) Yeah, that was great. That was really funny and I was like, oh, I don't think he'd keep doing that. They didn't. But yeah, I think because of all that, I think it was a pretty solid middle episode, but nothing more than that. It wasn't crappy. It was just kind of like some missteps here and there. But yeah, especially the anti-drug stuff. But-- The whole thing was an anti-drug thing. I don't know why they felt the need to, and like, Tasha, why would someone do drugs? Like I was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, stop. This whole thing is an anti-drug thing. Why did we need to do this? Yeah, you only hit us over the head with it. So I'm actually interested in Trek Facts about this episode. Merrick Buttrick, unfortunate name, who played Tijon and Judson Scott, who played Sobi, they both appeared in Star Trek 2, The Wrath of Khan. That's pretty big roles. Respectively, Merrick Buttrick was Kirk's son, David, which I knew I recognized him. I couldn't figure it out where, but he plays Kirk's son in that movie. And then Khan's right-hand man, Joachim, was the rich, snooty guy in this episode. He was Khan's right-hand guy. He has a few lines in Rat the Khan. So it's weird that two people from Rat the Khan were in this episode. The visual effect of the fluctuating force field around the Enterprise D, while it's near the star, when it's getting affected by the star's rays, was created by using a bowling ball, which was trickled with salt as the phrase they used. And the salt bumping off the bowling ball in some kind of lighting was used, and then they squeezed that image to make it fit around the Enterprise and turn it upside down. And that's how they made the effect. I'm like, how do they go up with this shit? I have no idea. The makeup of the Onarans, where they had that thing on their nose, was the basis for the makeup of Bajorans later on, when Bajorans come around, when Ensign Rowe eventually is on the show. And that's where they got it from. So we never see these races again, ever. The Felicium grains that we see them picking out of the big car container are actually just red lentils from the store. And the dispenser for them for the Felicium is part of an automobile alternator from like a car. The episode was, of course, an indictment of a legal drug addiction, especially given the country's mood at the time with President Ronald Reagan's anti-drug efforts in full swing and other programs like the DARE program that Steve and I, of course, took part of them in school, and they were becoming very prominent at the time. And the episode was almost prophetic in that some drug cartels evolved a corporate structure and acted more like businessmen than criminals at the expense of drug users pretty much around this time. The episode was influenced by co-executive producer, Maurice Hurley's recent work on Miami Vice. So he took his work on Miami Vice and took it to this episode. And it was intended to have the enterprise come across a drug deal in progress. And Hurley was also responsible for the insertion of a just-say-no-style drug speech by Tasha Yar to Wesley Crusher, which came over the objections of the cast. The cast did not want to do that scene at all. And they're just like, no, you're putting it in. We want the anti-drug message in there. And what's really funny, this last one, that discussion between Tasha and Wesley was the only time in the entire series that the two characters have a conversation, which I was like, I did not realize that. I had to think back. I'm like, I don't see that at all. - Oh, she's gone not too long after this, right? - Yeah. - We only have a couple episodes left with her, right? - It's the next one. - So that's her only conversation she has with Wesley is about drugs. - Oh, good, well, good. It sounds like she had a real fun time with those drugs. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. But any connections here between these tricks people and the Muppet people. - Oh, boy. Judson Scott, who played Sobey, had a small role in Blade, which featuring Chris Kristofferson, who was a Muppet show guest. - Uh-huh. - Merrick Buttrick played to Jean, was in a TV movie called When the Bow Breaks, featuring Ted Danson, who starred in Jim Henson, Creature Shop's production, Gulliver's Travels. The two guys who were in a con were also the connections. I like that. - That's right. And then Richard Linebeck played Romus, that character. He was in the movie Ready to Rumble. He's also working after this, been in a ton of stuff. In Ready to Rumble was David Arquette, who played both Dr. Tucker in Muppets from Space and the Angel Daniel, and it's a very merry Muppet Christmas movie. - Wow, he was in two things. I didn't realize that. David Arquette, Arquette, pull it down. There's some impressive connections. - Makes the sense they're so connected, 'cause they're so similar. - These episodes are very similar. Tell us, Steve. - Both feature an unequal exchange between two races where one thinks it's better than the other. The gorgs and the Fraggles, and the two nose aliens, I've already forgot. - Absolutely. - Both episodes do address the matter of freedom in a way. The gorgs and Fraggles more directly when the Fraggles would be kept as slaves by the gorgs. And then the Unarins rather, they'd rather keep up their trade with the Breca to get their drugs and learn how to innovate or do anything else on their own, in their own free kind of way. - Both feature people seemingly changing to be better people, but really have ulterior motives. Sobi and Langor giving the drugs to keep up the addiction and Ma and Pogg gorg telling Junior to spare Wembley because they loved how he worshipped them. - Ah, that's true, that's true. - Both have a character desperate to get something and they finally get it. Junior gorg finally capturing a Fraggle and the Unarins finally getting their Felicium drugs. - Both feature people using their natural defenses, the aliens and their electric grips and the Fraggles biting with their sharp teeth against the gorgs. - Fraggles are ferocious creatures. - They Fraggles bit two people. - That's true, they're dangerous. - Don't pick up any Fraggles. - No wonder. - Oh gosh, what's that doing? - Transporter, no function. - Transporter, no function. - All right, so part of the show, we transport one character from one episode to the other and then vice versa, so what you got for a Steve? - Rock to track, I'm gonna bring over Junior gorg and replace the hillbilly yokele, one of the two, it doesn't matter. Just being too dumb to fix his own stuff and needing his narcotics. (laughs) - Oh, mommy daddy, I cut a spaceship. - I'm similar, I have from Fraggle Rock to track, I have the gorgs, just all three of them. Just to take the place of a drug-addicted ornarans because it would just be fun to see the havoc the gorgs would cause when they're going through withdrawals and taking drugs and shit. - Track to the rock, I'm bringing over Beverly Crusher to replace Boober as she was sort of the worry work this episode. - That's true, that's true. - But she ended up being totally right. So that's sometimes Boober's probably right too. - Oh yeah. - Track to Fraggle Rock, I'm having a Wesley Crusher take the place of Wembley 'cause he has that same child-like innocence as Wembley has and we try to make the gorgs happy but in the end you have the same sense of justice that Wembley had in the end there. (laughs) - That's fair. - That's fair. - All right, well I guess that brings the end of the episode of 124 of the Muppet Check podcast, guys. - Join us next time for Fraggle Rock episode, Let the Water Run. - And next generation episode, Skin of Evil. - So from the lovers, the dreamers and us. - Live long and prosper everyone. (dramatic music) - Thanks for listening to the Muppet Track podcast. Be sure to follow us on social media on Facebook and Twitter. Subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts YouTube Spotify or your favorite podcast platform. This podcast is brought to you by A Play On Nerds. (dramatic music) (dramatic music) [MUSIC PLAYING]