If the Panthers lose game 7 they have to dethrone the Canucks/Sabres as the saddest NHL franchise right?
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outro: ulver - hallways of always
I Hate This Team
115 - Putt Putt Chokes In The Stanely Cup Finals
(upbeat music) - What's bad for the sports fans? It is your regular episode for the week. Maybe recording at a weird time because the Stanley Cup's gonna be handed out tomorrow. - Unfortunately. - But, and then we have the draft on Friday. So, maybe-- - Some stuff to talk about though. Some league news to talk about, which is-- - Totally. - We had a, like we recorded our Patreon, that was when we had like a big rush of Canucks news last, right? And I guess just a quick recap, we like the heroic signing. It's fine. - And not just 'cause we predicted it, basically, exactly. - Yeah, no, it's simply fine. Not too expensive, not too cheap. Seems to make a lot of sense. Hughes obviously likes him. I guess we didn't have time to react to the Chris Tanev going to a concert with Quinn Hughes story. - No, that happened right after. - Yeah. - So, but Luke Hughes is also there, so-- - He's going to either the devils or the Canucks, is what we can get out of that. I don't know everybody talking about it after the fact was saying that the Canucks think is probably gonna be too rich a market for Chris Tanev, which makes sense. - I would imagine, yeah. I mean, he looked so good with Dallas, right? So, that's fine, you know? - Like, was it Dolly Wall said that the Canucks really into Jalen Chatfield? And you see it-- - Who would've been a great deal? - Yeah, well, and Chatfield signed for three times three at bit of a hometown discount. And so, his thing was maybe the Canucks are looking at a right shot defense man that's about that money, like three, three and a half million. I guess in like the Carson Soussey range, which I don't really know who you're gonna get at that price point that's available. - Yeah, I wonder about like DeMello maybe, but I think-- - Nah, he's making more, he's making at least five, I would think. - Yeah, 'cause it's crazy, but-- - Which, I don't know, he showed that you could play with Morrissey well last year, right? And it was complimentary. I've, I've heard people speculate he wouldn't be as good of a complimentary piece to like a Quinn Hughes. - Yeah. - I don't know why, like, I think if you go back when we were looking at offloading garlands and they wanted a defense man, like DeMello was one of the names that came up 'cause it was like a similar price point and like pending UFA. - Yeah. - I know him as like a kind of a valuable fantasy defense man in a deeper formats, but-- - Yeah, I mean, Dylan, I feel like, or he's-- - But he's a left shot, right? - That almost seems like that's guaranteed though. You look at right D. I mean, yeah, it's not. I'm on Cat Friendly right now for, you know, maybe one of the last times. - RIP. - Yeah, you've got Myers, TJ Brody, who's not good now, is my understanding. Tanev, Barry, who, you know, no thank you. Zeitzhev, no thank you. Klingberg, Don. - Oh, the Connects have been tied to Joel Edmondson, which please, if you're doing, just re-signs the door off, please, please, I don't have time for the shit. - Yeah, but like-- - He's like not very good. - No, yeah, so no thank you, I'm good. - He's big, like there's a point when he was good, I suppose, but like, well good is relative, but-- - Yeah. - If you're gonna be spending like, that's the whole, like, Zador of conundrum, and that's why I think they're gonna come to something eventually, right? Is, are you just gonna, are you gonna save two million to bringing fucking Joel Edmondson? - Yeah. - Just, like-- - I mean-- - Like, splurge a little, come on. - Yeah, I think like, I've been seeing a lot of lineups too, where even without getting rid of McKayev, you're getting someone, you're still having, you still have a really good lineup, right? - Yeah, well that's what we talked about on the last Patreon episode, right? It's like, the Canucks right now, they functionally have like 19 and a half million dollars. - Yeah. - So I'm gonna post this in our Discord, let me just go find it, if you'd filibuster for a second. - Sure. - Yeah, I mean, I, I don't know. I don't think they're gonna do anything stupid, which is great, obviously. But I, I still, ha man, I don't know. I still, I still worry a little, if they're connected to someone like Edmondson, like I don't, I don't like that, you know? - Yeah. - Okay, so where are the Canucks? - But I trust them, I trust them. - Yeah, so where the Canucks are at right now, if they signed Genssel in nine and a half, which seems to be like just the pencil in number, Sarah Vellie was talking about that a bit more, too. - It was in Carolina, Carolina's offering like eight something, right? - Yeah, but like eight years. So in order to match like totalish money or beat their total money, it would have to be at nine and a half as I think a Sarah Vellie report. - And I'm doing that like every day of the week. - It sounds like we were like really amped up last week about Genssel and like why wouldn't she be like it? Like in that big list that again, Sarah Vellie made, it really seemed like the Canucks would be the front runners. And then I know some reports came out afterwards saying, maybe pump the brakes a little bit, like Carolina's still trying to make it work. It seems unlikely that the Canucks would trade for his rights because they're pretty confident they can do it regardless. - Yeah, it's not so much that the front runners, it's more that they're like, they're going to go after him really hard, I think, right? - Yeah. - Which is great. - And that also Genssel doesn't care about like how far away he is from his summer home when he's playing in the season, he just wants to play somewhere where he has a good role and the team can be competitive. So I'm sure there's other good situations that he could walk into, but I think being tied to Pedersen's hip on like a team that just was a game away from the conference finals got to be a pretty, pretty attractive place to go. Like definitely- - Especially when you're familiar with the management team too, right? - Yeah, exactly. - It's a big difference. - Like if it's like, you're going to go work for some of that you've worked with before and you know, like their vibes pretty good, you're going to be more likely to go to that job versus with people you're unfamiliar with. But yeah, this was a 21-man roster. So I believe this was fucking, I just kept Mark Friedman on the roster too. And I think this was with Juleson as like the sixth defender or whatever. But if you signed Genssel at nine and a half, there's a door off at five and C loves at League minimum, 775. The Canucks would have $4.2 million and you would have to fill in a right shot D and another winger somewhere in the lineup or another center. So like you could move a suitor to like the Miller line and then where you sign a blue girl and for whatever that cost has been the rest on a defense man, right? So, and that's without moving Mikayev at all. Obviously if you move Mikayev, it gives you a lot of fluidity, which is why I think reports have come out that, you know, the Canucks are looking to move him aggressively or that's what their ideal off season would be. - I just wonder what they're going to attach as a sweetener, right? Like it's going to be next year's second, I guess, probably is like the best option? - Yeah, but even that, like you're asking someone to take on like close to $5 million in cap space for two years, like you can believe as much as you want that Mikayev is going to bounce back. And like it looks like he's, he was skating better at least to finish the playoffs. It's just hands of stone, right? So like maybe, you know, obviously Dubas was high in the player, right? Like would that get it done or would you have to add more or would you be a second with like a bit of retention? - Yeah, I also wonder if, I mean, the cap going up does maybe make trades like that a little bit easier, right? But, you know, it is like you said, it's just a really, really bad. It's a bad contract. I'm looking at someone for like a cheaper right hand D, maybe, and I'm just looking at it. Wow, no, he had a really bad year last year actually. - Who's this? - Well, that was just the Winnipeg, the Colin Miller. It's okay with New Jersey, it looks like. - Yeah. - Oh, he only played five games for Winnipeg. So I guess they traded for him at the deadline and was bad in those five games, but it's such a small sample size, right? But like-- - Kerry is the really interesting one to me. - For sure. - That you could probably fit in there. - Yeah. - But-- - Well, yeah, I mean, how much, what, like 4 million maybe? What are we thinking? Like-- - I think, I think, well, this evolving hockey was like somewhere in the threes, as I recall. I'll pull that up now. Oh yeah, the other name that's being like kind of tied to the Canucks was, what's his name? Yani Hakmpa. - Right. - Who's like, fine, but he's not gonna-- He can like just barely skate good enough to be in the NHL, you know? - If he's like your seventh guy, like that's-- - You're your sixth guy, yeah. So, I don't know, really the whole like Zadora thing comes down to like, do you think he can maintain what you saw in the playoffs for an extended stretch of time? Or do you think that he's good enough in the regular season that if he elevates like that in the playoffs, it is something that you don't mind. That's true. - Yeah. - He's 30 now, he still seems like he's like 21 to me. - Okay, you're right, the carry-a predicted contract is four years, 4.3, which is a lot. Which again, at that price, right? Like, you're splurging another 700 on Zadora, fuck it. Bring in the handsome guy. - Yeah, why not? - I think Colin Miller will be interesting because would you then have to change JT Miller's jersey to say, and would it say J Miller or JT Miller? - JT, I don't know, some teams just do... I've seen teams just do like, only the last single different numbers now. 'Cause like, the CD is obviously where D and H, but I forget what recent example I saw of this, but I have seen it where they don't differentiate between the initial. - I guess you could also just differentiate one of them, so it would just be C Miller and Miller. - Oh yeah, probably. Dude, if I have to get another Miller jersey, goddamn it. - I know. - What if he had the initial on there, would it be J Miller or JT Miller, I wonder? - You better go JT, right? - You have to, right? I think you do. - That's my sense of it. - Right? - Right, like JT Miller. Yeah, I think you would have to, right? It's, you know what? I gotta say, it's cool. It's, I don't think we talk about this enough. It's fucking cool that he just goes by JT. - Yeah. - I like that. - Yeah. - It's like his official name. I like that a lot. That is cool. But yeah, Colin Miller, maybe a cheap option as a right-hand D, potentially. - Well, the other thing too, like I guess the biggest news, or biggest rumor since we last recorded, is Elliot Friedman on the last 32 thoughts was floating out, Tyler to Foley, as basically the consolation prize if the Canucks can't get Jake Genssel done. Which, yeah, what are your thoughts on that? - Ah, man. I just worry, like I think we know he probably fits in pretty well. He's slow though. - That's the big thing. - He's older, and he seems like the type of guy that might just fall off a cliff, because he's gonna want a longer deal, right? He's probably gonna want me. - Yeah, like what is, what's the evolving honk you say for to Foley? 'Cause he took a big discount after the pandemic, 'cause just 'cause of the flat cap and like where he was positioned. So, okay, the predicted contracts, 'cause he's 32. - Yeah, he had 33 goals last year. Like he had a good year. - Yeah, and like the year before he led the flames and points, but-- - His coursey four numbers are insane. - Yeah. - I mean, if I'm reading this right, he had like 63.7. Is that right? That can't be. That's insane, right? - Let's see. Let's see here. - I'm on hockey reference looking at his possession metrics. Is that, I mean, that's really good. - I think money pucks easier to look up players. - Okay, I don't know what his PDO. His PDO with New Jersey was, oh, his PDO with Winnipeg was 105.2, but his PDO with New Jersey was 97.9, but kind of evens out. - Yeah. And that would be interesting. - Tyler Tifoli, looking on your name here. Yeah, so in the 2023 season he had and shot 14.4%, which is pretty standard in his career. On the attempts, there's no. On I suspected goals of 60%. You know, I said it's easier to find players, which is true, but like there are so many fucking categories. - I know. - Of shit. - I'm just stupid to look at all these numbers. I think he's a really good player, obviously. I do think with someone like Gensil, Gensil's a step above. And yeah, Tifoli just seems like a guy that could fall off a cliff, but he's also was such a smart player that you can, I don't know. I mean, I wouldn't be against it. It just, I think it has more of a, more potential to completely backfire on them, obviously. That's what's going to happen when you're signing the lesser guys, not that he's like a bad player, but just compared to Gensil. - Okay. Last season, his Corsi at five on five was 56%. Okay, so this is maybe just Corsi like all situations. - Probably, I could do all situations too. - Yeah, I mean, it's still good. - 64% in all situations, obviously, because he's playing like a lot of power play, et cetera. So. - Right, that makes sense. - He would probably fit in pretty well in the power play, but as a right hand shot, he's probably not the greatest in the bumper position. So there's got to be some moving around in there, I would think, evolving hockey has the predicted contract at three years, 6.13 million, which would be fine. Like it would definitely, something like that would give the Canucks more room to improve elsewhere, because then you could certainly try and take a run at like a Matt Roy or a Demello or whatever. I just think that for where the Canucks are at, especially given what we saw in the playoffs with their inability to generate chances when it really mattered, I would much rather see an expensive game breaker like a Genssel than I would, you know, kind of cheaping out on that top six help for PD and spending the rest of that money elsewhere. - For sure. - Like, if the Canucks miss out on Genssel, God forbid, like I think like a Jonathan Marsha show, if he is willing to move north would be the best consolation prize. - I remember when we were making our cat-friendly rosters, I had him on there originally as a guy who would be, I mean, he's such a smart player, obviously, and I think he's the other player that would fit really well with PD. - Definitely. - But he also seems like a type of guy to like take that hometown discount. That's where I came up with the Shay Theodore, right? - Right, which like, what is going on with Vegas? They didn't really move to do anything. - They haven't done anything, yeah. - I mean, I feel like we're gonna see a lot of, I mean, this, I'm not some fucking pundit, but like it, it's gonna be fun because I think we're gonna see a lot of movement this week because you've got- - Well, you got the goddamn cup final finally finishing tomorrow for fuck sakes. - Can't even, I just, I can't watch, like I'm just, I just cannot watch it. It's just- - We're so late in the year, I've broken and bought Claridin 'cause my allergies are too bad working outside. - My allergies are crazy right now. - It's been so bad last week, I'm in hell. - But, no, but yeah, I think like we're gonna see, like you said, Vegas hasn't done anything yet. They're going to do something, obviously. You've got Winnipeg, they're moving McGroady before the draft is what all their reporters are saying. - Okay, so here, this came up at Discord today. Would you move Likarimaki for one for one? - Oh, man. I think the thing is McGroady's further ahead in his development. I think Likarimaki has a higher ceiling, but I think McGroady's the type of guy that could fit pretty well with someone like Petey. - I'm not like a prospect guy, like I know that name, but that's like the only thing that I know about him. Like, what's his deal? - He, I have him in my main keeper league. - Okay. - So I'm very excited about this news because with Winnipeg, it's like, there's nothing, right? If you have prospects on Winnipeg, it's like, it's just not gonna happen. Look at Profetti, right? That's like, apparently that's part of the reason he wants to move is what happened to Profetti last year. - Right. - So I think like he's not a great skater. I think he's improved in the past couple of years, certainly, and he's the type of guy who, I don't know, I think he would, he's closer to the NHL than Likarimaki for sure. Likarimaki definitely has a higher ceiling, but I would say, oh, man, it's tough. I would say like, I could see, I could see Magordi fitting well in like a target system. He's a smart player. He works really hard, really hard-nosed kind of guy, drives to the net, tougher guy. I could see him, and if you're looking at signing a guy to an ELC as well, right? Like, it makes a lot of sense. I don't know that Winnipeg would do that because I feel like they want someone who's closer to the NHL in a trade for him. So, but then they also want to move Eler. Like, I don't know what they, they're such a weird team. I really don't know. - Yeah. - And it makes no sense to me because obviously they're not an attractive place for free agents to sign because it's Winnipeg. - Exactly, yeah. - So like, why wouldn't you work hard or at drafting and develop? And I know they've got a, you know, they do overcook prospects in the minors. That's like their whole thing, right? - Yeah. - But like, if you're a McGrory, okay, you can either go play for Winnipeg's AHL affiliate and ride the bus for like 85K or whatever. I mean, probably more than that, but, or you can stay in Michigan playing for one of the best college programs in the entire nation, right? - Yeah. - And you're getting like, NIL money as well. Like, you're getting sponsorship money and all that stuff. - Yeah, and like, how far away is he from like just finishing out college and? - He's got two years left. - Two years left. - So that's gonna be tempting to try and get into the NHL and get paid, like, just shy of a million bucks, right? - The thing is he's going to, like, I think if he gets traded, he wants, he wants to play in the NHL next year. - Yeah. - I don't know that Vancouver can necessarily guarantee you. - Oh, for that, right? Like you'd have to kind of get traded to a shittier team. Like you, you wonder about like the attitude around that. But then I also understand not wanting to go to Winnipeg. - My understanding is it has nothing to do with like Winnipeg as the city. Like he's from Nebraska, his dad is Canadian. It has nothing to do with that. - It's just opportunity. - It's just opportunity. And like, I totally get like, I mean, Winnipeg has not done a bang up job with-- - Yeah, they've done an awful job. Like just like not playing prophetic in the playoffs, right? Like, there's your example right there. Like we need to have a top six or a bottom six and we're gonna have shitty players in our bottom six 'cause that's the way it is, goddammit. Like I, that's not a situation I would want to step into either. - Yeah. - So yeah, I'll be interested to see what shakes out there if something happens at the draft. I'm very excited to be only what five days away from the draft. This is Friday, right? - It's on Friday. Like it's gonna be a lot of fun, I think. Like it's gonna be a really, it's gonna be such a wide open draft. I don't like, I don't really know what to expect after the first pick, but I'm very excited to watch all of it. It's gonna be a great time. And then like, you've got like Mitch Cobb coming over now. That was just a nice one too, which is awesome. - Glad they could have swung those few games at the end of the year, so they got to drop down. - Well, the thing with Mitch Cobb is like, I do think the reports of him like only wanting to go to like a specific team were probably true, right? - Yeah, but why would it be Philadelphia? - I mean, that doesn't necessarily make sense to me. - That doesn't make any sense at all. Like what's the big draw about Philadelphia? Unless it was like good interviews or whatever, or him trying to dodge Arizona at the time, right? - I mean, that's definitely part of it. And like, I understand with like, with Montreal, it's like the pressure of playing there too, right? - Yeah. - So it could have something to do with that as well, but like, yeah, I don't know, like they, they're gonna be a really, really fun team next year, I think. - Yeah, it'll be interesting to see, but then he's gonna go play for Tortorilla too, which maybe that's good, maybe that's bad. - Yeah. - Seemed good for the first bit of the year. - I don't know, it's a way more interesting situation there than it was a year ago when we're like, God, look at their situation. It's like Vancouver, if they didn't have Hughes or Pedersen. And I was like, well, they're getting their, their hot ship prospect, the true talent probably could have gone one or two in the draft last year. - Yeah. - So when it comes to the Keramaki for McGordi, I probably wouldn't just because like, I think McGordi is gonna be really good. I think look Keramaki has a higher ceiling and I think Canucks need like pure goal scoring, right? And so I think he'll bring more to the team eventually. I could see McGordi, like he could go to like San Jose or Chicago or something, but again, the issue is like, I don't think Winnipeg, I'm speaking on my ass here, right? But from reading what their fans say and what their reporters say like, and just like the way they treated McGordi like, I don't necessarily think they want like another young player in return or like prospect or draft pick. Like, I think they want players that can play now. - Right. - Especially because like, they're so desperate to get, and it's sort of counterintuitive 'cause like, they're so desperate to get more season ticket holders, right? 'Cause that's like their whole problem right now. And so their whole thing is like, we need to compete now. We need to have like NHL players now, but it's like, I think like driving away McGordi is not going to compete. - Yeah, like wouldn't that be a good way to let like sell the future? Like we have all these young guys, but we also have Shiflee and Hellebuk and they're going to help make our team better. Not like, yeah, we're not going to let these young guys in the lineup because we need to win. And oh yeah, we're also not going to play eelers and we're going to trade them away like. - Yeah, it doesn't make a ton of sense. But again, like, yeah, we'll see what happens, but he's apparently going to get traded before the draft. There's like so many places he could go to. I would assume it's going to be an American team, even though he's shown no indication he doesn't want to play. Like maybe he could go to like Ottawa or something, right? Like he could definitely get playing time there, I think. Obviously he could get playing time for, you know, Anaheim or San Jose or Chicago as well. So, but then what like older guys do they have to give up? Right? And like, you have to assume the value is going to be similar to what Philly got for Gochay, where it's a good young player who has some problems. In this case, Drysdale had all the injury problems, plus like a high second. - Yeah. - It's very funny, like searching for his name on Twitter and seeing like other teams propose trades for him. And I saw like a Rangers fan where he's like, if I'm Drury, I'd be willing to give up the 30th overall pick for me. - Ooh. - Yeah. - And Capo Cacko or? - Yeah, you'd be willing to give up basically a second round pick for like a really good prospect. - Yeah, that's right. - Sign me up. - Yeah. - Certainly back to the Vegas thing though. - Yeah. - Get back on a Canucks track here. Wow, Vegas has their first round pick this year, and then nothing until the sixth round, which is wild. - Yeah, it's like talking, they still have their first this year. I assume they're going to trade it. - Give it everything. - It's like not late either. It's like 18th or 19th I think, right? - I don't know. - 'Cause they finished, they didn't finish. - Yeah, they're, I guess they were like lost in the first round. - Yeah, they were like the eight seat in the West unless the first set makes a lot of sense. - I think it's like 18th overall around there. So they're going to, they'll get someone decent if they want to. - So, also it's Vegas, right? Like I think they're going to trade. - They functionally have 6.2 million in cap space right now because they still have a letter on LTIR. But that is with Michael Amadio, Will Carrier, Anthony Mantha who they said isn't coming back. Jonathan Marsha show and Chandler Stevenson, all Penny and Alec Martinez as well. - So, maybe they trade for McGordy, right? I know Winnipeg maybe doesn't want picks and stuff but like Vegas needs like cheap players on like ELCs, right? With their cap issues. - Yeah, like they have-- - He seems like a Vegas style player too potentially. - Their lineup as well, like it says that's with 20 players. So it's not like there's a bunch of like, it's not like Edmonton that has 9 million and like half a team to sign. But this does have Brendan Brisson up with the team and I don't really know if he's played any NHL games for them. He played 15 games last year, 8 points and 15 games. That is of course Pat Brisson's son and he's the only first round pick they've ever kept which is kind of funny. Like, is that just like-- - That's so funny. - You're increasing the palms of like the super agent. Like that's the only way over to keep around. It's good to have them on our side. So yeah, they're losing a lot of their depth pieces. And I guess, yeah, if Marshall show is willing to take $6 million, you could run it back with that. But it also seems kind of against their ethos. Also the thing, like Vegas isn't usually a big player at this time of year. This is, they clear up space now. They shore things up and give themselves-- - Well, when was the Michael trade? Was that, Michael trade was in the regular season? - That was in the regular season. Yeah, 'cause remember they missed the playoff set here? 'Cause even after he came back, yeah, they seem to do all their work like at the trade deadline. Like that's when they acquired Thomas Hurdle who's there forever. - Did they miss the playoffs the year before or did they miss the playoffs with Eichl? - It was with Eichl. And then the full season of Eichl's when they won the cup. - Okay. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. So remember that was like a big point of, like something to point and laugh at is like, they went out and acquired Eichl and they still missed the playoffs because he got his surgery or whatever. And then there was like a long recovery time and then he came back near the end of the year but there's still like beat up and stuff and kind of stunk. - Yeah. - And then same thing, Noah Hanifen, right? Like they acquired him at the deadline, signed him forever. - Yeah. - That was like their big off season piece of business which he's making $100,000 more than Hironic. And I think when you take tax and stuff into consideration, it's like functionally a little bit more than that. And like for that cost, I'd rather have Noah Hanifen on my team but I don't think it's the worst comparable in the world. - Yeah. - You know? - Yeah. - Both definitely not like number one defenseman but like really good. - Oh yeah. No, for sure. - But yeah, with the connects like situation if they can't get Genssel. - Yeah. - I wanted to bring this up 'cause it's been percolating in my head for like a month and now it actually seems like it could be something that's real is. - Everyone's like assumed that Sam Reinhardt is staying in Florida, right? - Whenever? - I mean, whenever the name comes up, it's always qualified with, but they have an agreement. They're gonna get it done and you know, low state in the no state tax in Florida, he wants to be there. They're gonna get him signed. Which you're in a Stanley Cup, like you're in a Stanley Cup run, like they're still a game away from it. They were a game away from it last week when we recorded the podcast but nevertheless. It was so easy to get done. Why hasn't it been done yet? - Yeah. - I like, I know they're like distracted now, but now we're looking at, okay, the cups handed out tomorrow and then there's a week till free agency. That's a big contract to get done. Are they just waiting until after the cups awarded? Or if you lose in the finals two years in a row, - Man, like. - Do you really want to go back there? Like, especially for what sounds like less money. And then of course Reinhardt is from Vancouver. Like, do you not see a scenario where he's like, you know what, I do want to test the market? And then at that point, do you pay more for Reinhardt than you would for Genssel? Would you splurge? 'Cause I think I would. - Yeah, he's like so good on the power play. - Yeah, and on the penalty, like penalty kill, right? Like, I think. - Man, with PD, like, I just, yeah, I don't. - Selfie finalist. - It's gonna be so interesting. - 'Cause if they win the cup, Florida, which I don't think they're going to at this point, unfortunately, I've made, like, like you, I think I've made peace with, it's happening. - I've made peace with it. Like, I'm upset about it. Like, I did an emotional head, right? - It just feels like 2011. I know we kept saying like, oh, hopefully this is evidence 2011, and it is, we were wrong. It's the other way around, we're so wrong about it. Like, I think they're just going, like Florida has given up. Like, it just doesn't seem like, but like their body language, - Florida's thing has always been like, they do well when they're the plucky underdog. - Yeah. - And they're finally now the underdog for game seven, right? - That's true. - Like, that's a good point. - You gotta think about, I just think about where the teams are at mentally, and Edmonton, obviously, they feel like they can't be beat now, right? After the stretchy games, they've, like, prattled off, right? And I just think Florida's gonna be like, they're gonna have that dog in 'em tomorrow. They have to. And like, who knows, maybe there'll be like an early goal, just like they've been in the other games, and maybe there'll be an absolutely fucking confounding offside goal call taken away. I could definitely see the path to Edmonton, like, winning, and if you talk to me on Tuesday morning, and Edmonton wins, I'm not gonna be blown away by it. But I just think it's being set up really well for a Florida win tomorrow. And like, okay, the motivation for both of 'em is win the Stanley Cup, what they've dreamed to do for their entire lives, but Florida also has the motivation of let's not be historic fucking losers. Like, 'cause this hasn't happened since 1942 when like, the goalie would be nicknamed something like Chip Monk, and all the regular players were fucking fighting in World War II. Like, this doesn't happen in modern sports. And so, I think they're gonna have that extra motivation of we can't be the biggest losers that sport has ever seen. - I mean, you're right, and you know, it's one game. Doesn't, like, it does matter what happened before, but it doesn't, 'cause it literally is just one game, but like, god damn dude, like, I just don't, damn, there's. - The drama of it all is very fun. - It is, it is, absolutely it is. But like, god damn, like they have just fucked up, so it's crazy how bad they've fucked up. - Yeah, it's kind of mind-blowing, really. - Yeah. - Just as like, a sports fan, like the narrative of it all is really interesting and fun. Like, I wish it was happening with a different team, like literally any other team. - Any other team, any other team, literally. - And I'd be able to actually enjoy it. - Yeah, but this is just, it's a total nightmare. I guess like, part of it is like, well, all those fans are such assholes already, and they brag about their cup wins already as it is, and we didn't really have a comeback to them, other than them living in Edmonton. - Yeah. - And like, obviously this is like, worse, because it's like, like, you talk about spoiled. - Yeah, it's like, well, we also have the best Stanley Cup win in history if they win tomorrow. - Like, there's no question, this is the most legendary Stanley Cup win ever if they win it. So you have that, you have McDavid, you have the first Canadian Cup win in 30, like all that stuff, right? So, I mean, yeah, that's so brutal, but at the same time, it's like, we're Canucks fans. Like, you have to expect the worst, like what, yeah. So all those fans are gonna talk shit to Canucks fans. That's gonna happen no matter what, right? And I know this is, this is coke. But like, well, the other thing is like, I mean-- - We were born in the darkness. - Exactly, I mentioned this already, but like, I think now my riot prediction, win or lose. I mean, they're gonna go nuts, right? - Yeah, you think so. - I, like, if they don't riot for this, if you don't riot, like win or lose, if they don't riot, it's like, I don't think they really care. - Yeah, well-- - Sorry, like, yeah. Like, they have, it's gonna be like, great, they're gonna be, if they win, they're gonna go fucking crazy, right? - So I kind of feel like-- - I think it's, it's likelier that they riot if they win, I think. - Yeah, yeah, I mean, we'll see. I'm sure there's gonna be some hooligans no matter what. - Oh, yeah. - So here's my question. Does them winning make it more likely that like the band's gonna stay together? Or does it make it less likely? - Well, yeah, it's interesting because like, you almost look at it like, a LeBron thing, right? - Yeah. - When he came back to Cleveland, won and then went to LA, or like the Kawai thing, I know that's a one year thing, so it's a little different, but like, ends a different sport, but yeah, it's interesting. I mean, I feel like it makes it more likely 'cause they're gonna wanna keep running it back. - Yeah, like, hey, we can do a dynasty here, we're this good. - Take a discount, they absolutely could, right? And that does terrify me. I think they're still in a really rough shape, capwise, but if they win, I think it makes it even likelier that everyone takes discounts to stay, which fucking sucks. - Yeah, actually like how much of a discount? - Yeah, the other thing that worries me is that they become the type of team where, and they kind of already are 'cause they have McDavid, but they become the type of team where like older free agents are just like, yeah, I'll go there for like league minimum. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I wanna go in a cup, I'll just be there. - They'll always be able to have like good depth and everything, but man, I just cannot, I can't believe, here's the other thing, we should talk about this. I know they're talking about, 'cause it was a rough, I always forget who can't put the sad clause. - It's rough, yeah. - Yeah, and he's like, 'cause it's 40 years by his standards, which is fine, I understand that, but he's like, I think we should let Florida in if they lose, I, and I said this in the discord, I kind of think they become the charter members. I know it's crazy. Like here's the thing, like the Canucks and Sabers obviously have the longer, they're longer suffering. - Yeah, no, we've been suffering for way longer, you can't take that away from us. - Like almost twice as long, which is awful and crazy, obviously, but at the same time, and it's crazy to say this, the Sabers and Canucks who have experienced some brutal, brutal losses have never experienced anything this bad. - That's true, that's true. - Like this would be by far the worst loss in the history of not just the NHL, but like sports. - Pro, yeah, like North American sports for sure. Like I can't speak to what's happened in like, you know, cricket or soccer or whatever, but those things are different, right? Like they don't have like the same playoff format, et cetera. So yeah, I think it probably would be the worst loss in a seven game series. - Which is like unbelievable. And like, like, look, the Canucks have 94, they have 2011, they've never picked first overall. They have, you know, the courtesy incident they have. - Yeah, Florida got to pick Aaron Eckled for us overall. - Yeah, yeah, and and Jovanovski was always his second overall. - Was Jovanovski first overall pick? Let's see. - Let's find this out. Was he like fourth overall picks? - Let's see, Florida has picked Eckled in 2014. No, he was maybe second. Yeah, 'cause I think maybe he was, they did, oh no, he was first overall in '94. - Oh yeah, yeah. - Yeah. - My bad. - Yeah, so they've picked first overall twice. The thing that's interesting to me is, Tim brought this up in the discord. Technically, they have had more chances to win the Stanley Cup. No, I'm not talking about like, like, times in the Stanley Cup finals. It's that they've had games, like they have this series, 'cause they're previous two times in the Cup final, they never actually had a chance to wrap it up with one win. - Right. - This series, they've had four chances to win this down. - Canucks have only had three. - Canucks have only had three. They've had Game 7 and 94, Game 6 and 7 and 2011. So there's that, I mean, that's like a heartbreaking, obviously. I just, yeah, I mean, I think it comes down to like being long-suffering versus versus like just the worst loss ever, basically, right? - Yeah. - And I, like, 'cause it's two finals in a row that you're potentially going to have lost. And the second loss is the most heartbreaking loss. Again, not just in hockey history, but probably in sports history. - Yeah. - I think this is worse than the Falcons choking away the Super Bowl. - Yeah, I think like you might be onto something 'cause it is two finals in a row that you've lost. - Like if, think about us as Canucks fans where we're just like, they're never gonna win, right? We've had to show me those moments, right? Like, I think if this happened to me as a Canucks fan, I would have to just stop watching hockey for like a long time. I don't know how, how could you, as a Flora Panthers fan, if they lose this, you've been to the finals two years in a row, you're like, what do we have to do to win the cup, right? - Yeah, 'cause you would think going into the finals, like, hey, we have the experience here. And this is like so obvious that it feels stupid to say it. And they're up three nothing. Like, that's it. - It's raps, game over. Like, this is what happened, like when you go up three nothing, you fucking win the series. - Yeah, yeah. - So-- - Think how checked out, you were as a fan in 2012. Like, speaking personally, I definitely was, right? It was like, I don't care about the regular season, get to the playoffs, and then they fucking get destroyed in the playoffs, right? - Yeah. - Like as a Panthers fan, two years in a row, one, you get destroyed by Vegas, which sucks in its own way. - Mm-hmm. - And then this year, again, you know, this episode comes out on a Sunday. Potentially, you have the most heartbreaking loss in the history of all professional sports. - Yeah. - Like, how do you watch them again, right? Like, what is the regular season? Who gives a fuck? And then they get in the playoffs and it's like, oh, here we go. - Yeah, yeah. - I think it would have the best case scenario happens if we're up three nothing at the cup finals. We can still blow it again. Like, fuck it. - Exactly. Like, legitimately, it would just, this feels like the type of loss that, like, destroys a franchise and a fan base, right? Like, how, mentally, how do you come back from this? How do you come back from this as a coach? I think they have to fire Maurice after this. How do you come back from this as a GM? - Yeah, that's weird too. Like, you can't really fire a coach that brought you to the cup finals two years in a row, but he's also someone that's lost you the cup finals two years in a row, like-- - Exactly, yeah. I just don't, I don't know what you do. - Yeah. - It's so crazy. - It would be an existential crisis. - For real, yeah, it's brutal. Like, I just truly-- - And here's what you do. You got to get that rotten core out of there. We're letting Sam Reinhardt walk to free agency and sign on his hometown Vancouver. - I mean, legitimately, that's probably like, they're gonna-- - That's why I don't think it's so far-fetched. - Yeah, no, I completely agree. Like, why would you not? Why would you, yeah, you can't run things-- - Granted, Reinhardt hasn't been too great in these finals, like maybe he's battling some play, we don't know. - Yeah, that's true as well. - Man. - We all know getting injured isn't an excuse. - No. - Well, I guess it's allowed to be an excuse if you don't play for the Canucks. - Yes, that's right, yeah. - I just don't, yeah, I mean, it just, what it comes down to you for me is like, the argument is, and look, I know several savers, fans as well. I know lots of Canucks fans, obviously. I'm not saying, and you know, you guys know me, you know, the podcast is called I Hate This Team. Like, clearly, we understand how much we've suffered, and our whole thing is that we've suffered more than any other fan base. It's us and the savers. I think, like, this is the type of loss that just destroys a psyche. It just destroys a fan base. Like, it just ruins, like, it ruins this, like, 2011, ruined hockey for me for a while. - Totally, yeah. - But this is just like, how do you ever watch them again? Like, when, like you said, they're up three games to none, and the Stanley Cup final, and they still can't win. Like, what, why bother watching? - Yeah, it's like it's over, I'm gonna get into it. - Why would you watch at that point? - So, I just think, like, man, like, I, I, I, so, it's close, I think. I mean, definitely they're in the Sad Club if they lose. - Yeah, I think that's where the goes without saying. - For me, it's 30 years, so they're in the Sad Club anyway, 'cause I think for me it is 30 years, but I just think, like, it's just, you're just, you're done as a, as a team, as a franchise, as a fan base, you're just done after this. Like, how could you, how could you not-- - How could you not be, yeah. - Yeah. It's crazy. Like, it's just, it's funny saying. - Well, you know, with that said, though. - Yeah. - We've just dedicated, like, 10 to 15 minutes talking about it. And when we did it last time, dancing on the grave to the Oilers, the Oilers came back and won a bunch. - Exactly, so, I am sort of-- - Doing our part here. So hopefully this podcast is completely invalid. Hopefully whoever's getting around to listening to this on Tuesday, 'cause, you know, life gets in the ways. There's a lot of podcasts out there. - Yeah. - You're like, oh, these fucking morons, they thought Florida wasn't going to win in overtime. - Yeah. - Imagine that game goes to fucking overtime. That, that'd be some television, baby. - I can't even, I just hope it's a blowout for Florida. Like, that's the only thing. - Oh, yeah, like, what matters most is that Florida wins. - Yes. - Or loses in Sam Reinhardt comes to Vancouver. - Yeah. - God damn, dude, this is so stressful. - I'm excited for like, 'cause we're just under a week away now from July 1st as well, right? Like, I'm very excited to just sit on my couch all day, refresh Twitter, hopefully it doesn't go down this year. - Hopefully not, yeah. And I just, yeah, I don't know. I've almost thought about like calling in to Halford and Bruff to like make this argument. - Or at least call this question. - Texting it, yeah, they don't take it to calls. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. 'Cause yeah, I, the more I think about it, the more I think it is, it would be Florida. Like, I'm not down playing. Obviously we've been through so much shit as Canucks fans. Basically, to the point of like, yeah, why wouldn't you give up as a fan, you know? And like, I think a lot of us have on some level. - Yeah. - But it's just like, holy shit, like this would just fucking ruin that. - Hey, if nothing else, the tale of the Edmonton Oilers shows that you should never give up, 'cause on a long enough timeline, you will win a draft lottery for a second time. Well, the legal have to change rules 'cause you've sucked too much and got too many good players from it. And you'll eventually reap the benefits and rewards and be able to come back and fight adversity. - Yeah. - Oh man. - Speaking of disheartening things, I just clicked over to Twitter. And Scoop, sex Jay, yeah, he just retweeted something. A guy lost a fight and then proposed to his girlfriend only to get rejected at Clash of the Stars yesterday. And now which one is Clash of the Stars? - I don't know, it's good. - Is that one of those like social media MMA things? - Looks like it. - Oh man. - It looks like there's like a different language on the screen, like some Eastern European thing. - Okay. - That's rough. - Yeah. - That's not great. - Yeah, it looks like it's Polish here. So it was like a Polish creator clash type thing. - Okay. - That's pretty rough. - Yeah, would you rather, would you rather that happen to you or would you rather the Canucks be up three nothing in a Stanley Cup final and then... - Probably that, to be honest. - And then lose. - That's probably that. - Wait, which is that? Which one do you pick? - The proposal one. - Yeah, I think I'd rather like lose a fight and then get rejected getting proposed to and have the clip post from Twitter then get so excited for the Canucks to win a cup only for it to turn to fucking ash in my mouth. - Yeah, I think so. As crazy as that sounds. - Yeah. - Oh man. - Maybe we got a problem. - I think we do. Yeah, we definitely do. - Yeah, 'cause like I'm securing myself that I could eventually recover from that, but I'm not able to exert any force on what happens on the cup finals. Despite my best efforts, I did an emotional hedge to the Oilers win tomorrow. I get $90. - Hey. - Which is not an insignificant amount of money to win gambling. - Yeah. - But... - I don't even want the $90. I just want the Oilers to lose, man. - You'd rather spend $90 for the Oilers to lose. - Absolutely. - Oh boy. - Yeah. I don't know if there's any other way that I could like gamble it so that can happen. Probably not completely independent of everything. But, you know. I am, I just can't. I can't have this. Like I just can't have it happen. - You're gonna have to be streaming throughout it too. Just for a bit of it, eh? - Oh, which is brutal. Yeah, I'll be done at eight o'clock, which is right around when it'll be in like-- - Well, so that's eight o'clock is like, well, I should know this eight year time. 'Cause I was streaming for the game on Friday, right? And I was able to start watching just as the call was overturned, like just when. It's like, oh, it's out of reach, they're fucked now. - I'm not sure if I should watch it and like unjinx them 'cause I haven't really watched much of it. - Yeah, you got to. I don't know. Fuck man, I just, oh. - Let me tell you about my lived experience. 'Cause we had the Ribsanity episode when I went to St. Louis Bar and Grill. Where they didn't have the Ribsanity. - I was wondering, okay, yeah, 'cause I was talking to Colin on a bonus episode the other day 'cause someone asked about Montana's. And I wasn't sure if you went to Montana's or if it was another one, but it was St. Louis. - No, it was St. Louis Bar and Grill. So they now have their wing sanity promotion. And it's been getting advertised to me on Instagram and I've been back since the Ribsanity incident 'cause I mean, the Ribs are good. And they have good wings too. And so every time we've gone, it's been deader than shit. Like one of those businesses that it's not gonna be open very long because there's one other table here. Even like having gone on like a Saturday night or whatever. So I'm like, fuck yeah, all I can eat wings for 23.99. And you get a side of fries with your first order, which I'm not really here for. It just gave me the more wings, but that's neither here nor there. I understand they're trying to fill me up. We go, there's a fucking line outside. - Jesus. - Yeah, there's a line outside waiting to sit down for all you can eat wings. And there's like people smoking, the patio is full. There are people overflowing from St. Louis Bar and Grill. And I mean, they're all there to watch the hockey game, just like I was, but like, I mean, you got their midway through the second period. So if you were really committed to the bit, like eating all you can eat wings and watching hockey sounds like a good as fuck time. So I understand it, but I thought nobody went to this place. So I didn't get to enjoy it. - It's honestly probably just that like, I mean, obviously it's the final, but like every other bar is going to be filled up. - Yeah, and it's a Friday night. - I guess I'll just go here. Yeah. - So I also didn't get to enjoy wing sanity. I don't know like what this says about my hubris or whatever, but they don't want me eating either. All you can eat ribs or all you can eat wings apparently. - No, fuck them. Go to Montana's. - Yeah, Montana's buying me clothes too. - Okay. - Returning into a... - Montana sucks is my understanding, but... - You've never been? - No. - These fucking... - I think we have one here. - These coastal elites. - I know. I know. I think we have one here and like, one here and Langley, one into Lawson and there's a couple on the island, but... - It's fine. - It's fine. - It's fine. - Yeah. Okay. - Like... - Do you have white spot out there? I forget. Did you guys get one out there? - I know they closed during the pandemic. We used to have two. - That's brutal. - Yeah. - I mean, white spot is... - White spot rocks. We have a triple O's, but it's a bit of a hike. I used to work at a job site and your one would go like very frequently, but now it's like quite far out of my way. Which I mean every now and then is worth it, but... - I'll be honest, I prefer a triple O's to white spot because if I'm at white spot, I'm probably getting the burgers anyway. - Yeah. I mean, you're sitting down, but like you can get your niece a pirate pack type of thing, so... The pirate pack is a classic of course, yeah. - No, but how do you rate Montana's? - Well, I've just heard from people that it's like... But 'cause it's interesting to me like, all you can eat ribs, like how good are the ribs obviously, right? But at that point, it's just like you're more there for like the barbecue sauce. - Yeah, exactly. No, they're fine. Like, I don't know. They're not the best ribs you've ever had, but... - Yeah. - Nothing to shake a steak at. Like you got like Tony Roma's, right? Been there? - I think so, yeah. No, I haven't really ever been to like a ribs restaurant, I guess, is the thing. - Strange. - Yeah, maybe just not as big out here. - Yeah, anyways, the Montana's is fine. My reading of it, I do like their wings. They're like, they're like real dusted kind, and they have like a nice sauce, and I'm just like dipping them in for angst and calling it a day, which I always appreciate. - Yeah. I mean, I will say all the talk about ribs does make me wanna get ribs. - Yeah, me too. - Yeah. - Now I'm pissed off the Montana's closed. I used to have like a whole bunch of scene points, and you could like use scene points at Montana's. - Oh, okay, yeah. - And I like kind of stopped going to the movies, but I had like a scene points reward card. So there's a stretch of time there where I was just like getting free Montana's on Sundays just because I could with scene points, which was nice. - I'm searching ribs on Outlaws channel. - Oh God. - He's done an Outlaws Cookout. He made ribs with a Dr. Pepper glaze. - He's been, he went to a place called Branks Barbecue. - I don't watch it yet, but apparently he did a 90 minute interview with the guy that voiced Bowser in the, I don't know if it was in the movie or just like in something else. - Yeah, so I see that there, it is, no, my God, it is an hour and a half. That's fucking crazy. I always wonder when it's the interview ones. A lot of the times he's just filming it from like the audience. They're at like a comic-con style thing, but this is actually him. - He's in the studio for this one, Scott Burns. - That's so crazy, man, like-- - Okay, not doing interviews without law. - Yeah, this might be someone that takes his money to teach him how to voice act. - Oh God, okay. - Yeah, he's a voice acting coach. He's my mentor on voice acting since 2009. Mentor on voice acting. - Yeah, he's interviewing this guy. That's, oh man, I can't watch Outlaw interact with like an allegedly normal guy. - Well, yeah, I'm looking at this guy's credits and yeah, he voices Bowser in the games. - I mean, that's-- - I guess there's nothing to shake a stick at, right? - Yeah. - What was the Outlaw series of shorts where he's like going up to people in a mall and like asking them if they want, was it a water bottle or something? What was it? - Oh, I forget. - Those are brutal where he's like, I just can't, I can't watch him talking to just like regular people, you know what I mean? It's just not, oh man. And at an hour and a half, I don't know. I'll skip around this, I think, and see. - Ment, this is gonna be really exciting if you're his voice actor guy. So his earlier credits, he did a lot of voices for a video game called Putt Putt. So he's been Mr. Baldini, Mr. Hippo, Fatty Bear, Mr. Firebird in these games called like-- - Putt Putt was a classic. - Putt Putt and Fatty Bear's activity pack, Fatty Bear's birthday surprise, Putt Putt saves a zoo, Putt Putt travels through time, Putt Putt enters the race, Freddy Fish 4, the case of the hog fish rushllers of briny Gulch, Pajamasam 3, you are what you eat from your head to your feet, Putt Putt joins the circus. Then he voices a Sim in the Sim's vacation. And then just from there on out, starting in 2002, he's like Bowser and like Super Mario Sunshine and Paper Mario, Mario Tennis. - It's pretty good. It's not bad. I mean, Bowser's always gonna need a voice actor. He doesn't really talk about that. - Yeah, what does Bowser even sound like? 'Cause he's like-- - He just goes like, oh, oh, yeah. - Yeah. - Yeah. - I feel like you could kind of record all of those in advance and use them for every single time. - He's kind of reuse them. - Yeah, it's not like he's got a ton of speaking lines, I don't think. - No, I don't think so, yeah. Yeah. - Well, bringing back to sports, he played one of his more recent roles, 23. He was the referee in Big Bruh. And I gave out a Big Bruh when I saw that off-side call get called back. I don't see how that was conclusive. How's that in the spirit of the off-side rule? And we're just gonna get more fucking reviews next year. Fuck video review. - I really didn't argue. - Just get really entirely. I don't give a shit anymore. - Get rid of it or do the thing of like, you have like one minute to look at this and you have to look at it full speed. You can't slow it down frame by frame, sorry. Like just do it like that. Would you have made this call on the ice if you saw it basically is what it should be, right? - Yeah. - Let's see at full speed, would you overturn this call? If not, sorry, like that's what it should be, right? It's so brutal, it's so bad in soccer as well with VAR, it's just awful, it really just ruins the sport. It blows, like, so it was a game two or a game three or whatever where there was the puck over the glass from Florida already on a five on four where it was like, was the puck in their zone or was it over the blue line when it got flipped over the glass 'cause if it's in your zone, it's a penalty. If you're not, it's not a penalty and it can't be reviewed this year, but it can be reviewed next year and that's a good thing for video review 'cause we can get the stupid puck over the glass infraction, right? Which is like the only rule in hockey that has to be called, there's no gray area. It's the most egregious thing you can do. You can't review a high stick to the face that draws blood, but we better get it right. And so if this puck goes over the glass, fucking three inches behind this other spawn, it doesn't make any fucking sense. Stupid rule in the first goddamn place. But like, great, now we can review and pick over that. That's a bad thing. Like if I was an oiler's fan, I would be upset that that wasn't a five on three either, especially given where they were in the series. Like I get the reaction to it, but I don't wanna fucking review puck over the glass, man. - No, man. - I don't wanna review off side. - Yeah. - Yeah, unless it's like a Matt DuShane thing where you can use like common sense on it. Yeah, give him a minute, full speed. Fuck those nerds up in the sky looking at that shit. I'm over it. - Are they gonna start reviewing whether or not someone's actually over the red line for icing or not? 'Cause that's subjective, right? Well, it's been called that subjectively all the time. So why is offside more egregious than icing? - Yeah. - It's not, it's stupid. Fuck. - Oh, man. Well, I really, really-- - Oh, worked up now. - Yeah, I really, really hope that I really hope Florida wins, but. - We'll see. Either we're gonna have a really fun episode upcoming this week, or we're gonna be miserable. - We'll have a lot of support. - No matter what. - We'll probably record after the draft or something. - Yeah. - I think that'll probably be like, we'll do one more this week, like after the draft, and then probably another one after July 1. - I think so. - Yeah. - So we'll do one on-- - Unless something crazy happens midweek, like if there's a trade pulled off or something, right, and they'll be more of an emergency one, but I think we should hold our nut until after the draft, 'cause this one is most likely to have stuff happen. - Agreed. - Yeah, nice. - All right, well, go Panthers, go. - I've always believed in you. - Bye, everyone. 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