The Mortuary Show

Dead Body Moves?? 😵

There's no way... Listen to the hilarious story on how Jennifer (The Mulling Mortician) saw a body's "arms" flail in the air. Mortuary affairs in Europe & Africa, full restoration of a skull, and passion for RA. ENJOY! :)

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Show Notes:

(07:45) – Different cultures, different funerals.

(15:32) – Full skull transformation.

(21:06) – Education's place in embalming & development.

(32:08) – Dead body moves arms while dressing.

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Takeaways

Working at the US Army Regional Mortuary involves handling deaths and coordinating the movement of remains in Europe and Africa.
International repatriation can be challenging due to different regulations and cultural practices surrounding death and burial.
Jennifer Lares received extensive training at the European School of Embalming Skills, which included reconstructive and restorative techniques.
Jennifer now works as an educator, providing training and educational content for funeral professionals.
Her goal is to create content that is relevant and accessible, helping funeral professionals improve their skills and knowledge. Skull reconstruction involves using wire and plaster to connect the pieces.
The process requires drilling holes, tightening the wire, and adding plaster.
Excising tissue during the dissection of the face requires careful precision.
Restorative art is about giving families something rather than achieving perfection.
Jennifer enjoys teaching and sharing knowledge within the funeral service community.
She has worked in various funeral homes and has had diverse experiences.
Jennifer shares a funny story from her internship involving moving arms and a plastic sheet.
Her business, Mulling Mortician, can be found on Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, and TikTok.

Duration:: 37m
Broadcast on:: 13 Aug 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

(upbeat music) - Jennifer, you just got back from Germany. What were you doing in Germany and how can we all get on the same page as you would get to go there for some more? - Well, I was a civilian that worked at the U.S. Army Regional Mortuary and we've handled deaths occurring in Europe and Africa. So unlike Dover, that handles primarily theater casualties. That's kind of like the entry point into the U.S. We took care of deaths occurring all over Europe, the logistical piece, as well as the preparation and then return to the U.S. - Wow, that's such a cool, very niche thing. So I guess, what was it like? So what was your day to day? Like were you going out and picking up loved ones, maybe from the airport or something? Or were you more on the preparatory side of things or preparing the remains to be shipped and moved around? I guess, give us the in-depth of how it was on a day to day basis and what you specifically would do with the remains given any circumstance. - So we took care primarily of movement. So if there was a death in Czech Republic, we would be dealing a lot with host nation because we couldn't just swoop in there and pick someone up unless we made sure we were complying with their regulations and needs, documents, things of that nature. So we did a lot of work with international persons to coordinate things. So there's a lot of kind of moving parts to that. And then we were primarily responsible as a metro officers for the preparation of the body and of course, the dressing. And then we made air schedules to get back to the States, which would be complicated with customs, considerations and things like that. The families were being served by casualty personnel most of the time. And so they did more of the conversations with the family, whereas we were collecting loved ones and just kind of getting them back home. - Got it. So were they more being prepared wherever the death did occur? And I don't know, do they actually do any sort of embalming or is it different based on where they passed away? - Well, no preparation was really done. We did have an occasion, for example, where if a death occurred in Bahrain, they did kind of their version of preservation. But the Western way of embalming is significantly different because we have different goals. So in Europe, a lot of times the families are renting a cemetery property. For example, in Germany to the caskets or coffins or all woods, they don't have metal. And the idea is to allow decomposition to occur in such a way that the person can rent that cemetery space, it can be reutilized. So instead of trying to delay very few instances when they're trying to actually preserve for a longer time. So we did all the preparation, most of them were autopsy cases, varying levels of trauma, that sort of thing. And then we had to deal with delays in receiving unquestionable storage conditions. We have our laws of refrigeration, and depending on where the death occurred, we kind of never knew where we were gonna get. - Right, you probably had a wide variety of different cases. Was it mostly deaths from combat, or was it kind of all over the place? Since you were helping families throughout Europe and Africa, you said. So I'd imagine it would probably be a variety of things that you're seeing, and not just death from combat. - So if it were a theater casualty, it would go to Dover. We primarily honestly saw a lot of suicide cases. And so that was the bulk of our cases. We're accidents, you know, motorcycle accidents, occasionally, you know, people travel, so accidents can occur, but unfortunately, I would say the larger number were suicide. Man, that's gotta be so hard. - And they're so young, you know, people are so young. 'Cause most of the active duty we served, and then occasionally we would have like a family member of an active duty person, or a DOD, a civilian employee. And sometimes you would actually have a person that died from a health condition or a retiree. We did have a lot of retired service members that they were eligible for care at our mortuary if they chose to go back to the states. But as far as within the majority of the cases, it felt like it was mostly suicide cases. - Gosh, that's really tough. Where were the majority of deaths occurring that you were dealing with, or was it all over the place? And I guess where was the most unique place that someone had passed away? - Well, most of the deaths occurred. You know, if you look at areas just like in the states with large populations of service members, whether it's a training command, you know, certain areas geographically that are gonna have more. So for example, too, Poland has more personnel there. So we may hypothetically see more deaths in Poland as folks are kind of moved around. Some of the more interesting locations, the Congo in Africa, that was a little, we did have a couple actually come through from there. And so we had to coordinate care and logistics for them. - What were they doing down in the corner? - What was interesting is you have to, like when we were planning movement, it wasn't just a rinse and repeat. We had to really evaluate what resources we had where. So if we knew we had a mortuary affairs collection point somewhere and it was a matter of getting them there to then get onto a plane. So it was kind of interesting in how you had to problem solve on Norway. For example, if we had to go to Norway, then we had to coordinate, you know, is there a military flight that happens to be in or out of that area? What resources are where? And it wasn't branch specific, like. - It was very purple. If we needed an aircraft or we needed access to something, we all very much collaborated because again, we took care of all the branches even though we're an army mortuary. - Right. - So there's a lot of collaboration moving parts, things like that. But yeah, the Congo was different for sure. - Yeah. - And there's a lot of pressure, you know, just like any ship out or any forwarding case, you have the other end is waiting, you know, waiting, waiting to know when will we get them, when will we see them? - Of course. - And you're trying to manage expectations at the same time as make the movements and things happen, work in the back. So there's kind of a lot going on when we have a case. - Yeah, there's got to be a lot of different intricacies and you're probably dealing with a lot of different governments too. So you have to, every single one is different, just like if you're shipping out from the US to anywhere else in the world, you have to abide by their rules. So I'd imagine shipping out, it would be very similar thing and you have to learn a ton of about how each different country works. - Yeah, well, thankfully we shipped most of the US. We know it is needed over here. So that part was easy. It was moving them even on ground transport because they had to be in a coffin. Even just to move from point A to point B to get to us. Coming from Italy, for example. - Really? - You know, we did a lot of ground movement. So, or within Germany, they had to be in a wood coffin to even just come to us. So, and then in some countries, the coffin had to be sealed in front of different people. Yeah, so it was like a whole thing, depending on where it occurred. - All right, so what if there was a normal death? You know, not related to what you were doing. So just a normal death in Germany. Does that same law apply to that? - Yes, so anytime you're moving a body within Germany, they like, they need to have them in a coffin. Now, sometimes they'll bring the coffin to the site. They'll bring it to the hospital. Yeah. - That's what I'm asking. So like, let's say someone passes away at home. What? That's crazy. That doesn't make any sense. - You know, they have like this really interesting container type thing that they can put people in because they don't also have refrigeration facilities in many places like we do. So, you know how we keep our loved ones in our funeral homes, over there, they keep them in a place that's usually attached to a cemetery. And the funeral homes utilize space within these temporary buildings. - Oh. - That meet, you know, the need of temperature requirements and whatnot, and they keep them there instead of housing them within the funeral home until they have a service. And their turnaround time is very quick. - Right, I do know that. So yeah, you know, my brother's lying in and, you know, we need to be-- - Yeah, it's all days. - Not so much, yeah. Not so much over there. - Wow, that is interesting about the renting. It was sort of like a co-op, co-working space that the funeral directors are operating out of that. It's very interesting. - Yeah, we would have to go there to retrieve loved ones sometimes. We would have to coordinate. - Yeah. - And in Germany, they, unlike, you know, in the US, where you can pretty much coordinate to pick up someone whatever hour, right? They have very specific hours, even in the hospitals. If we go to retrieve someone, we have to coordinate in advance to make sure we're in that window of time that we can have access. - That's, it's just so cool to see and to hear about how different places operate. What was it, what was the container, I guess, that they would use? So would they ever have, like, a cod or a gurney, or like, how would they, so they would put the remains onto a gurney? - We could get a cod or a treasure. - A gurney. - Yeah, but they had this container that I was seeing. And it had like, it was like a metal container that had like a lid and it had handles. I'll have to get a picture of it. - Zig word. - It was really interesting and they would keep them in there, I guess, to kind of move them about, turn them in the coffin, things sometimes. So it was interesting even just watching the equipment they used to remove a coffin in or out of the vehicle. You know, we used church trucks. I've seen where they had like this little, they looked like a tiny cart thing that they would flip up and it would help them get the coffins in. And it was just really fascinating to see how differently they did things. It was very practical and efficient in their own way. And it was nice to be able to see alternatives to kind of the way you're accustomed to doing things. - Yeah, it's always good to be learning from other people, other cultures and see what you can take away from it. And that's really cool. How did you even get involved in the first place in doing this? That's such a very specific thing that you've been doing recently. - Well, back in 2007, I joined the Navy as an active duty hospital corpsman, Navy Mortician. So at 30 years of age, I was like, hey, here's a fun idea. Let's go to boot camp and become a sailor. So I did that. - Wow, thank you for your service. Thank you. That's awesome. Really cool. - And that was very interesting. 'Cause I've been licensed halfway for nine years. How was it at 30? - Oh my gosh, I was the oldest female in my division and I had a mortgage. So there were times when they're yelling at us and I'm thinking, what am I doing right now? Am I even doing this? Like, I'm a grown, informed adult person. Like, why am I here basically? But yeah, so boot camp was fun. I lost a lot of weight. And then I've got to be a corpsman, which was kind of counterintuitive because I had to go to school to learn life-saving skills. And I mean, when you're in the mortuary field, you're like, do I wait for the code blue? I joke about this a lot of times 'cause they would have a code blue drill and I'm like, do I wait to see if they made it? Do I show up to save them? Where am I supposed to be at this whole scene? - Right. - But I finished all of that training and got to work in headquarters. And we did a lot of counseling of the casualty assistance officers who go out to the homes. We coordinated with escorts. And this was during wartime, so we were a little busy. And then we'd go to Dover for a refresher. I went there for a mass casualty event as well. So it was kind of a busy chunk of time. That was between 2007, 2012. - What was the mass casualty event? - It was an August, it was called extortion 17. It actually just had the anniversary date. And that was when the helicopter carrying the seals was shot down and there was considerable, it was the largest Navy loss with all those special ops folks in one place at one time. - Wow. - So I actually flew, I was stationed in Italy when that happened. So I flew from Italy to Dover to just provide hands on deck. And now all I remember is uniforms, uniforms. Just trying to get everybody uniforms ready, trying to meet escorts as they would fly in, which is very hectic. Because also Dover had other cases coming in that were, you know, from other branches and other situations. So it was a busy time. - Yeah. - Yeah, I'd imagine. Did you get to spend any time elsewhere throughout Europe? And I guess what was your, what was your favorite spot that you were stationed in? - Well, the Navy morticians don't have a lot of options. They don't put you on a boat, you don't deploy. So I guess that could be a good thing. But as far as where they put you, sometimes you're kind of in a landlocked desk job or you have the good fortune that I did to be stationed in Naples, Italy, which was fantastic. I was there for three years. - You're not right about it. - Yeah, I did the hostile thing, the whole backpack, hostile thing. Wake up, make sure your liver is still there. I did all of that stuff. And it's just beautiful. It was a beautiful place. So that was my favorite picture. - Oh, that's wonderful. - So how do you know, when this job opened in Germany? I was like, well, like, you know, because there are different ways to do the evolves and, you know, different things. So I just went ahead and applied a couple of my prior colleagues from the Navy days were there. When was the director? - I don't know. We just went in with a little family meeting. - We mortuary staff with Navy morticians for the most part, so. - That's so cool. Wow, what a unique and fun experience and something that a lot of funeral directors probably don't know you could go out and do. So it's like, hey, you know, if you want to try something different, serve your country and maybe get to travel a little, enjoy yourself. That didn't sound too too bad. From having the phones at night and making house calls, that sounds a little bit better to me. - Yeah, well, we did have a phone and we did get called upon it real times, but thankfully not as frequently as like your average funeral home experience. - Right, right. So what's going on now with you? You're back, you're in Texas now, what's the deal? - So I just got back. I started a company in May, a little veteran lady biz, where I offer training and educational content. I've done some work with continuing vision, with some CE webinars. I've done some articles and different publications with Ravenplume and also continuing vision. I actually just had one come out today from funeral vision that I wrote. So I also have my own little blog site, where I write blogs. I make little YouTube videos on what will seem basic when you've been in the business for a minute, but like how to operate the church truck. I do an evolving machine comparison and I don't have any suppliers for anyone that's like telling me, you know what to say or anything like that. - To sway you. - So what's your machine? What's your machine? You got to tell us, come on. - Come on! - The new fridge and machine. - Ah, everyone stayed with all the color. - Well, I loved it because it was so precise, because you know, like when I'm doing a case and there's a lot of head trauma, I may need to utilize the instant fixation technique or something like that. And because it tells you the exact pressure and exact rate and you can really play with it, it's almost like it gives you more information to hone in on what you're doing more effectively. So I didn't do that machine for that reason. The technology was great. We had a Dodge machine, we had a Port-a-Boy. And like I said, my video, any machine will do the job for you. It's just, I liked knowing more and I feel like the new fridge and machine let me know more of what was actually going on in there. And it makes this continuously, you're not getting funky clumps of stuff. It has a little filter thing. - Right. - If I was very excited about it, ours was not pink or lavender, it was a traditional black. We did not upgrade because it is the government bought it. But I did get to work with it and I enjoyed it. I liked it quite a bit. - Nice, yeah, I've never used one personally, but they are pretty sleek and I have heard very good things. So that's nice that-- - They're very quiet, too. 'Cause it's like a little car muffler thing or something going on, it's very quiet. - Or you get the pulse, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. I just remember every pulse. I'd always go pulse on the way up. That was my whole thing for trying to control that the flow going and all that. Anyway, so keep going. So you got your videos, you got your blog. What's, what are you thinking? Well, what is your next thing? And how are you trying to move on with your career? So is this what your goal is to build this and educate and speak to people? - I like to imagine a mortuary Mary Poppins, right? She floats in with a little bag and insides maybe a trauma hit. So that's kind of what I'm trying to do right now, right? - Hilarious. - I float in. I bring the training to you. Leadership says, "Here's what I want." And I create something and as an educator, I know how to create content that is understandable, appeals to people and I can work with their schedules and I can go on site and deliver training, which I enjoy doing. I have a lot of good technical experience. I attended the European School of Involving Skills while I was in Germany, which was a very intense, reconstructive and restorative training. It was two weeks, phenomenal. I learned so many things. I put a head back together and all I had was a tongue. That was all I had. - Come on, elaborate. What do you mean? How? - No, basically, so basically level one of the class, it was, we were partnered up and we had donated cases and we were able to work on things like swollen eyes, discoloration, wax work, suturing. It was really fun to be a student. When you are an instructor, you know, it was nice to be the student for a change. And the instructor of the course that was, his name was Alan and we had Philip, but Alan, he came around with like this little measuring tool and like we were doing sutures with dental floss and we had to do them so small that he could run his finger across them and not feel them. So he would come by and feel them and run a little little tools and whatnot. They had flashlights to come look at your wax work, you know? So that was really cool. - That's cool. - We did do some reconstruction on a skull and it had more pieces than you would experience out in the field, so it was really chapped. - That was really cool about a dozen of us. And in those houses, the only offer them like once a year. You get on a list early, it's a small group thing. Week two, there were seven of us. We each had our own cadavers and we ended up doing some facial dissection and actual recreating everything from a stump basically with a tongue sticking out. So you had to, I remember feeling like cervical vertebra, I could feel them, they were there. So I'm like, okay, this is a good guide. But we had to basically kind of start, we knew what the person looked like, but we were attempting to restore. And yeah, it was really intense. It was really intense. And there were moments where you would stare at these little bones and be like, you know what, I may just walk away. Because you'd just do that. I'm waiting for them to kind of look like they go together. And that it was really-- - It was a puzzle. - Technology. Yeah, so it was a puzzle with too many pieces. And some were missing, some pieces were missing even. So yeah, so I did that. I learned a ton of things. I got really excited. I tend to be excited anyway. I do airbrush things. And so I was like, oh yeah, that'd be cool is to be able to go to a funeral home and just do some training with them so they can gain more knowledge about this without having to come to me or to work with what I work with. You know what I mean? So that's basically what the thinking was. And I like to create content that's relevant for people who are, like things again that we take for granted having been around for a minute, like the church truck, or like something really simple. How to roll a person over, like correctly where you're not compromising tissue, right? Little things like that. And so that's kind of where what I'm doing. I'm creating little tidbits of content, like I said, little Instagram things and YouTube things. And I like to make my stuff available. So if people can use it in another kind of catalyst for it is there was in our little, one of the little Facebook groups, there was a student who needed help filling out a 2063 which is a DD involving form. And they weren't from my school. They were from a different school, but their instructors were having a hard time articulating how to fill it out. So I'm like, you know what, I'm gonna make you a video. 'Cause I know what this is. So I made them a little video. I saved it YouTube. I'm like, you know what? I'm just gonna keep doing this. So that's kind of what I do is create content and educational things and bring training to the people with a Mary Poppins bag of heads. So. - That's so cool. I expand on for me, reconstructing from the tongue up. What specifically was that like? How did you go about that process? And what did you physically do? Like, how were you able to do it? Like you can get into the wing for us. Give us a lesson, Jennifer. - Yeah, okay. I'm gonna give you a free lesson, okay. - Thank you. And I pray that I never have to deal with this situation. - I know. - That's cool, sure. - So we got in there and the first thing you have to do, like with any, you know, reconstruction situation, now the case had already been involved. So tissues dry, right? That part's done. So then you're really just trying to figure out the piece, put the pieces together and we had a fake skull and I would often walk over and study it. I would study the underside, I would say the top, how I'd look at the lines and the thickness, right? And so, you know, kind of understanding how the pieces go together, the frame and magnum piece. Like find the pieces you can identify, you know, the temporal skull piece, the thinner and all these things. And so you kind of just start from there, you start putting things together. We used wires and different things. You re, once you get the skull and the face was also in pieces. So I had to rebuild jaw, reconnect the maxilla to the other rest of the face. - Yeah. - And it's tricky because you're trying to reconnect everything and you don't have a lot to kind of go by. Like when you're putting a piece back, you know what I mean? Of the inside. - Right. - So you do your best. You can do that. - To make the beautiful. You know, you just kind of fill it in. And then once we did that, got the skull back. - Was it, was a lot of glue and, glue and wire? How did you put everything back together? - So we basically utilized wire and plaster. And we utilized the wire. - Tell me about the wire. How so? - So you would take two pieces and we had a drill. So we would drill holes together to connect the two pieces. We would utilize wire and you would tighten it as much as you could. - Which was interesting because sometimes when you're working on, you know, doing a reconstruction, it looks like you're missing pieces just by virtue of not having them tied enough. So you have to tighten without them overlapping, right? So that was really interesting. So you get it all nice and tight and it's, you've got to make sure too, do you need a dowel, right? So I had to put a dowel inside to give reinforcement. - Yep. - Because you want to make sure you have stability when you're doing something like that. And then once you get all that kind of piece together, you're wired up, good to go. You add your plaster and what was interesting is they added salt to their plaster. It was kind of cool and it got, it, I guess, extradited how it firmed up. It was typical we used. Because I know like the plaster we had, the mortuary would get, would dry pretty quick. So we did that and then you remove the wire. - No paper to say. - Nope, well, no, not today. No, no, not today. We would cut wires and remove them. So you could lay to, you know, the two. And then you would think that, you know, putting the face and everything back would be easier because we actually had removed it. It was on a complete dissection, which was something that I had been really intimidated by, the idea of it. - It's tense. - It's the glen talent technique and what it does, it allows you to get access to what you need. 'Cause you, if all of that were broken and closed, you wouldn't be able to access it. And keep in mind, some of these countries, they have four to seven days to do all of this. So, you know, as a problem. - So how did you do that part? - So how did you do that part? How did you do that part? Was it a scalpel or forceps or aneurysm hook in there? Like, how did you do that? - The guy's face was, I know, it was. And like I said, I was very intimidated by it, but it's just a very meticulous. And there was already a suture or an incision from an autopsy, right? There was already that autopsy incision. So you utilize that incision and you're basically just extending it. You know, so you're taking it down, you're taking it out. You're holding over. - Right, and then as you're folding, you're just very carefully excising away. And you have to be really careful because like the, for example, the tissue of this air of your face is very thin. So as you're excising, if you're not careful, you have to figure out where to sever the tissue here because that nose is kind of your beacon, it turns out. So that was very intense. - Wow, I hope it's involvement is only listening today 'cause this is some crazy cool wild stuff. My husband is not, I tried to tell him about it and he was not having it. I was like, do you want to hear what I did? This thing is like, really, I don't, I don't want to hear anything about it. I was like-- - Keep it to yourself, sweetheart. (laughs) - I said, it was really fascinating. He's like, I believe you and we'll leave it at that. So, yes. But yeah, so you put that back, but then what's interesting is you've still got to make sure like the person I had had very full face. So I had to make sure that I restored that shape. I had to make sure my nose was in the right place. I had, you know, you're looking at symmetry. I'm long a stool looking down to see what it acts 'cause the tables didn't adjust. So I'm looking down to see what it looks like from all these different angles. - Right, 'cause isn't that supposed to be the best angle is from, you know, the top looking down? - Right, and what's interesting too in Europe, they don't have, you know how we have like the viewing side? There's, the whole thing is the viewing side because they're in college, right? The family can walk all around. So either side is of equal value and it's not ideal. - Not ideal. - Yes. So it was just the kiniest process. Yes. So it was tedious, but it was really, it was a good learning experience. And there were times I wanted to just keep working through lunch 'cause I like, I got so focused and there was one day where the instructor's like, "Okay, well I'll see you tomorrow." And he had his little bag and I'm like, "Okay." And I'm still working and he kind of paused. He was like, "I'll see you tomorrow." Like, you need to pack up, you know? I was like, "Okay, okay." Because I got so laser focused in. And then there were other times where it's like, "You know what, this isn't looking right to me. "I need to just walk away from it." And I would go visit one of my German friends that was also there and see how her case was going. 'Cause she spoke English, a lot of them spoke English and French. - Nice. - So I was actually the only native English speaker in the room on week one. Week two, we had a gentleman come from the UK, so there were two of us. But yeah, it was-- - Got it. - It was wild though, it was great. And I logged how much time it took me from start to finish, including full make, I did full airbrush and everything. And it took me 24 hours, which it was a lot of her time then. Once I think once I became more, had more practice time with the skull, become more familiar with those components. I'll be able to do a little faster, but there were a lot of pieces too. And that was a complete start to finish situation. - But yeah, it took me 24 hours. - Incredible. What would you give yourself out of 10? Did your decimal point rate yourself? - Well, I will say-- - The final-- - Oh, out of the result, you know, I could recognize the person as what they look like. So I would say probably, I would say it even actually. And I made the person a little sassy. I, you know, had fun with some lashes and things, so-- - Nice. - They were ready. They were ready for wherever they were going next. But it was, it was-- - Wow. - I could see, I was really happy with my proportions, 'cause I would look sideways, and everything is where it needed to be. And you know, they told us in the class, you're not striving, you're not gonna get perfection. - No, that can happen. - And it's important, you're just giving them something. So anything I would give in that person would be better than just a headless person with a tongue. So you're already willing to give them a person, you know? - To give it to you. - It's not really one of the key takeaways, yeah. It was a great class, so. - Wow, unbelievable class. - Yeah, and I think it's one of those things the more you stare at it, you just get that tunnel vision. It's like you need to step away. When you're doing intensive RA work, you gotta give yourself a minute sometimes when you're going at it for an hour, two hours, three hour, my goodness. Step away, you need to. - Yes, definitely. 'Cause there was a time I looked at the bones and I just stared at them, and I'd been hitting like so much time pass where I felt like I wasn't making any progress. And then finally, I didn't, and I don't smoke. So the instructor's like, "Do you smoke?" I said, "No." He says, "Well, why don't you go take a smoke break "and not smoke, right?" I said, "I'm gonna come back in." I went with the smokers for a second and came back in, and then all of a sudden it's like, the bones were like, "Can we go over here?" I was like, "Yes." So it worked out really good. - Yeah, it's funny how that happens. That's really amazing. What a good experience for you, and now you have that in your back pocket for whatever you need in the future. So what is your favorite class then that you teach, and what are the some of the subjects that you like to focus on when you're going, I guess, at school, and then more of the in-person, one-on-ones with live licensed funeral directors? Tell us for both of those. - So I primarily teach law at the mortuary school. I don't know why some of the people don't like teaching a lot. - The present. - I give them scenarios, it's so fun. But the things I consider fun, like reading about the history of a retort or something, other people are like, "Okay, yeah, super fun, right?" - Yeah, yeah. - I am a nerd. I know, but I love when I'm working with, 'cause I worked, I did a lot of training with soldiers while I was in the mortuary, and we would do stretcher training. I would teach them how to load and load the stretcher and all these other little things. And I get excited when I'm teaching because I feel really passionate. I love technical training because I love science and anatomy and all that's very interesting. Restorative art, reconstruction, I love that. Involving, because I've done a lot of autopsy cases, difficult cases. So I do like to discuss those things as well with students, I get excited about that. But I can pretty much hop into any area of the funeral home and again, being the nerd, I get excited. So I can talk about things like time management or merchandise or something like that and get just as excited as out. - Did you ever get any, did you have any experiences outside of funeral home? It seems like you have such a wide variety. Have you ever actually get to spend some time working in a funeral home at this point in your career? - Yes. Gosh, yes. I was in the civilian sector, I was licensed since 1998. I know what you're thinking, I look so young, I know. It's super mild to hide, super mild to hide. - I'm not, I'm serious. Oh my gosh, no way. - Yes. - What? - Walking right out of the womb to mortuary school. Like from now to go up to Jones. No, I didn't raise the book, I was ready to go. No, but so I started in a funeral home when I was 16. I got my first job. I don't have family in the field. And we had one little funeral home in the town. I like to home the store. And one little funeral home in the town that I worked in. And I interviewed the owner and he was really kind and patient and told me all about what funeral services gave me a tour. And I was like, well, I need to start working in a funeral home before I go to mortuary college. And I asked him for a job. He's like, I don't have a job for a 16 year old kid. So I was like, okay. So I waited and then I called him a week later. And I was like, can you just see a new thing's changed? But he's like, yeah. - Sure, you don't have that job. - Finally, after seven weeks, he was like, you know, I'm going to hire you. Just leave me alone. And then he did. He hired me. I washed cars. I vacuumed the chapel. And then over time, I proved myself and they showed me a little bits over time. But right from there, I've worked for Stewart back when Stewart was around. I was working for them during the acquisition with SCI. So that was interesting. I've worked for private firms. I've worked in sales. I've actually done some pre-arranged funeral sales management in SCI. So I've worn the different hats within the funeral home. I corporate. - I sure have. - You know, a huge regular individual ownership. So I have a very, and I was licensed in six states over the course of my career. So I've gone from Washington state to Tennessee, 'cause I'm a tumbleweed. And if I see something interesting, but I've not done before or that, you know, I'm just going to go. I'm just going to pack up and go. So six states, and I have Florida and Texas still, 'cause Florida is home to me, Texas is home to my husband. And I do contract work here. I could do contract work in either state. Actually, I do contract work anywhere, but I do contract work on regular types of here. But if somebody had a case and needed help, they could call me and I could grab the Mary Poppins tag and we would put that person together again. But yeah, so I've seen quite a few different funeral home environments. - You've seen plenty. Is that your favorite thing to do now? Is it more the teaching or do you like getting, you know, your hands dirty still and getting in on those difficult cases when someone contracts you? - I like, I tend to do teaching while working, even if I'm not necessarily like there to teach. If you're in the room with me, I'm going to be working. And I will say I'm at least good at like working while I talk. I don't do the thing where you pause to explain something. I actually keep going. - Right. - And I think part of that is working with soldiers. You know, I have soldiers that were interested. So I would explain what I was doing as I did it. I would miss a beat. I love the idea of teaching and sharing knowledge. Just within our community, I think that's important. You know, instead of boarding and it is huge. And I feel like it's difficult to kind of see that in a lot of instances. I love working with students too though, because they have such a fresh view of everything. And so when you work with them, you're back there where they were. And I think it keeps you locked into that experience of, I don't have, I've never worked in if you were home before, but here I am in class, right? So now I have to make them understand things and make things relatable for them. And then also in a slightly vampires way, I take some of that enthusiasm they have, this new entrance into the field. And I find that to be really enjoyable too. - Yeah. Oh, that's cool. That you still get the thrill out of both aspects of things. And you've had so many amazing experiences. Give us one, you know, that story that you tell at a party. If someone wants to hear that one story, then you like to tell more than any of the others. Give us that one. - Okay, who's my audience at this party? Let's say, 'cause if it's my husband's and his friends, let's say it's someone that's not too squeamish, but they want to hear some good juice. - Okay, well, sometimes I'll talk about the case where I thought I saw the arms move on the person. And this is years ago when I was interned. - No, of course it was. - It's funny though, it's funny, it's not gross though. - All right, I like it. - I mean, I've got, I've got magic stories, I've got all of that, you know, that fun stuff too. But depending on the audience and where we are in the dinner process, I might go to this one. So I was an intern back in the day. You know, I was, and my internship started out where I was just thrown in the back, call us if you need anything, which really was not great. So that was my initial experience. So I was back there, toiling away, learning things and by myself, talking to the gentleman that I was preparing in his little suit and everything. And 'cause I would do that periodically by myself. And you know you all do it. 'Cause I don't, I'm not weird, you know. - Of course. - So we used dry cleaning plastic at the time. And I'd put the, you know, plastic under the collar and have it down under the hands because I like to dress and do cosmetics. And I had kind of all ready for cosmetizing. It was the end of the day. So I pushed my little dressing table into his little spot, did him a do, they was over. I came back the next day. And when I flipped the light on him, which like flew up like that, right? And if I was like. - For real? - I thought real, here's what happened. I would put the dressing table under the bed, right? Under the exhaust fan thing. And when I flipped the light, I hit the little exhaust fan. I grabbed the plastic. So he's almost never moved, the plastic did. Oh my God, I scared the crap out. - Oh. (laughing) - 'Cause it looked like his arms moved. And yeah, for a minute, I had a brief, it's like flicker of a career question mark. But yeah, that was- - I was gonna say that would make anyone question their career choice. - Yes, yes, that was, yeah, that was something. And then I had co-workers that we would get into shenanigans and play jokes on each other. And I learned that if you mix coffee with ceiling powder, it does look like waste material. So, that was a fun- - Coffee with what? - Like incision sealers, a great powder. - Sealing powder? - Yeah. - It's so gross, so you can put it in like a cookie tin and give it to someone and they have no- - You know what I've done that before with that? - Like, I think it was like food dye or something. I was messing around with incision sealer before and it looked like a snow cone. And I was like, oh man, this could be dangerous. - So many things with that, so many things. But yeah, so Christmas is gonna be around the corner. I'm not sure what to get someone at the, you know, joking white elephant. You get one of those little cookie tins, they get all excited and then you put the food duty in there and it's great for parties, so. - Oh gosh, there's gonna be a lot of that going around now. - You know, apologies to anyone that gets duped on that. That is too funny. Hilarious stuff and very informative too. I think we learned a lot. Jennifer, where can we find you? If someone wants to learn more from your experiences or just wants to get to know you better, give us the- - I'm actually doing a mentor program with Continuing Vision too. So I'm in there, but if you're looking for my material, I have a link tree. The name of my business is Mulling Mortician. You'll see the little thinking Anubis, that's my logo. You can find me on Instagram, Facebook, YouTube channel. I did finally relent and get TikTok because everyone was telling me I need to do it. So I just literally did that today. - You got to pay that. - I had to give in, yeah. But so you can find me, like I said, all over the place and there's common areas. And again, it's just Mulling Mortician. - Awesome. Well, Jennifer, thanks so much for taking the time, sharing your knowledge and your stories. That was a lot of fun. - I appreciate it. Thank you for the opportunity. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music)