"This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network." "Sports Social Now on the Sports Social Podcast Network." Want to beat your mates at Fantasy Football this season? Why not join us at Fantasy Football Scout, the home of Fantasy Football? We're one of the leading Fantasy Football sites in the world. We have tons of expert daily content available for everyone, from new players to seasoned experts. Join us today by subscribing to our podcast for free. Search Fantasy Football Scout. Don't let prior win the mini league again. Hello, good evening and welcome to the Talking Cup. This is a member that only shows that this should be nice and relaxed tonight, unlike the other night, which was absolutely mental, but I did love it in fairness. I did love it. I love that sort of stuff where people just go mad with their opinions and it was great. But this is members only tonight. It's me, Self Cab. It's actually, we're going to talk. We've loads to talk about. We have Bobby Clark. We have, I'm going to try this, Jorgie Mamma-Villy. Mamma-Villy. And when I was just saying it as an issue, we're going to talk about him. We're also going to talk about the P.G.O.L. Henry Winters' Twitter field was unbelievable today. It made me gasp, laugh, and be infuriated all at the same time. And what else we want to talk about, man, see, and there are 115 charges that I hear in this deal to start in the next little while as well. So just talk on that. And then of course, we're going to talk about possible incomeings, alcoholings, whatever it might be with regards to Liverpool. So, actually, how are you? I'm good. How are you? How was your golf day? Oh, it's so much fun yesterday. Meself, Neely, and Bryant went down to Bon Cloudy Golf Club and my god, what a golf course. What a golf course. We loved it from start. We got there, right? It was hammering down the rain and we're like, "It'll stop in a minute. Now, it'll definitely stop. It didn't stop." So we said, "Look, we won't play a few holes. We won't take the cameras out. We'll just wave with the rain, the clear. It took three holes for the rain, the clear, but then when it cleared, it was beautiful. The golf course was exceptional. They looked average really well. We played some good golf. We played some poor golf because that's how it works and we're currently on currently in the middle of editing. So we're hoping to get one of those videos out in the next couple of days. So yeah, it was cracking, I have to say. It was cracking, but it still doesn't stand up to me in an RV, in America, playing golf every two days for six months and that's when I'm comparing every golf day to now. I'm not going to stand up. We'll have to make it happen for you. Yeah. Oh, yeah, no, 100%. All right. She says, "Jesus, stop a golf for folks. Relax." Relax. All right. She has the question. I answered it. We're going to go away from the golf now, all right? Anyway, where are we started? Let's start with Bobby Clark. Okay. Okay. A couple of days ago, it was reported that Bobby Salzberg had made a bid for Bobby Clark of course. Peppermint is there now, but it was something in the region of about 8 million pounds. It fell short of a little bit of valuation. We knew they were going to come back. They have come back. They've agreed a fee of 10 million pounds for Bobby Clark. I think there's a 17.4% sell-on clause within that plus they're going to get full refusal if Bobby Salzberg are looking to sell. Okay. Are you surprised by this? Because I'm not saying we're coming a trend, but the stuff coming out of Liverpool at the moment is obviously Carvalio goes for 21 rows into 27 somewhere around those figures. You have, you know, of course, boy Chet has been linked with a long move away. We're not too sure I'm a colonel, and Dan's is being linked with a long move to Plymouth. And now you have this. And you know, I've heard people say, look, okay, he came into the team last year. He was really good. He has an injury, which is unfortunate. But, you know, we haven't signed the midfielder, although we, well, I'm not, Troy, our best is probably the wrong words to use last week, and we're selling another one. You know, it's like he's clearing out, is it, is it, for me it feels a bit like he's gone with Detroit and trusted, because it's a massive job for him. He's gone with Detroit and trusted, but the club are protecting themselves a little bit in the way they're selling these and add-ons and clauses and stuff like that. But if I'm probably clear, I'm really disappointed because he gets a chance last year, and I really like them. Yeah, I did too. I mean, he has a little bit of a Lana thing going on about him in his way. I mean, that's just my impression. But I think he really stood out as one of the ones that could genuinely take the next step up, but I'm also, I'm not a scout, and I don't know that for a fact. I think we can look at these players with, like, admiration and we love when we see the academy players get that next step. But I can't 100% say that he would be able to play in a slot midfield. That is what slot's job is, and he and his team are supposed to be some of the best around end at finding, nurturing, and introducing youth talent into their teams. And if he felt like Bobby Clark was better suited finding that role elsewhere, then I think we need to, as viewers and supporters, trust that process, even though, I mean, for me, this one feels a little icky. Like, I, from everything I read, it was initially loan 100% until Peplinders came in and really pushed for this sale. So, I, I don't think they were looking to sell him when the window started. I think this was sort of something that developed and that lenders really pushed for. Um, Sam says it's a brilliant meal for Clark, to be honest. As we get four to a few years on the deal, it's almost like a loan. If he does well, we can get him back out of these and say, you can, but you can't activate that sale. You know, RB Salzberg might say, he's brilliant, I'm not telling him. And next thing, you know, you're seven or eight years down the line, he's still at RB Salzberg. It's only if they decide to sell him, you know what I mean? And that we can have, um, you know, force reviews, we get force reviews if they're opening the sale. But in fairness, RB Salzberg, you know, he walks at the usual path is probably RB Leipzig or Bruce Edelman. And then from there, you go on and it could be boring you and it can, you know, this, this pattern is there. And that's being shown for quite a few years, you know, so, um, with regards to, with regards to this, so the sale of this player is young, peplenders really rates them. You know, he, he knows what he's going into with peplenders in fairness and always move into a different country and going to Austria and stuff like that. But to go in and you have peplenders, and I think, um, it's the part you gaze like with peplenders as well. Now, RB Leipzig, the, uh, I'm nearly sure he was, he was going to live up over the last year. And then we, he milled with him. Didn't need to go out to Salzberg. Could be wrong. I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't. Yes, that's him. That's the lad. So put me on the spot there. No, I put me, so I always do like, kind of, I'm brilliant with names. Um, but, you know, he knows what he's going into for, for the player to leave Liverpool, you know, it is a bit unknown, but it's, there's a comfort of unknown certain people there and no one who peplenders wants to play and stuff like that. So we wish probably Clark all the best, but straight away, actually you're getting people and people saying, and rightfully so. They're saying, look, you know, we know what we need, me, me, me and careful talking with this. You know, you know, we're regards to, um, Zubamendi and what we need and players we need and stuff like that. But roughly so people are saying, well, hold on a minute, we've sold, you know, up front is a 21 million pounds worth of players now in those two players. That's totally one. Yeah. You've got Kervalio at 27, Clark at 10, and then you also have the salon clauses from Salenki and Alberto. Yeah. So yeah, you're, you're looking at upwards of 40 million at this point in terms of profit. Yeah. So you're, you're looking at that and people are saying, hold on, we've brought in 40 million here. Okay. All right. Kervalio, you can argue would have been involved. I wouldn't. Clark, you could argue would have been involved. Maybe wouldn't. And we don't think that the youts have stopped here. You know, possibly set by the burger and Liverpool are holding, apparently holding frame on 20 million for him. So that could be another, I, you're getting worried now is what I'm going to ask, you know, before we go on to this goalkeeper, are you getting worried now that, you know, Liverpool are, you know, moving a few players on and getting good deals from wherever it might be. But we're ticking away now for the end of August, you know, 16, 17 days, probably left in the, in the window. I've never too sure if it ends on the 24th of August and the 4th of September, are you getting worried now that we're kind of like new from players out and nothing is happening? Or is part of your thing. Well, hold on. The fiasco that went down for far or for if that is over Zuba Mandy, just in the press. Maybe Liverpool have just got into the shell here and gone, no, we're not saying a fucking word from here on it. I mean, I think it's in their best interest to keep everything as quiet as possible in terms of anything coming into the club. I think outgoings were always going to happen. You know, the crescendo or whatever that he was promised at the end of the window, he didn't really specify whether that was crescendo for incoming or crescendo for outgoings. We just kind of all took it the way we wanted to hear it. But I mean, these youth guys going out, it is to a lot of their best interests. Like, I think Bejetic going out on loan is good for him. I think from the perspective of him getting minutes and, you know, getting his body back to a place where he can actually participate in our team, it's a good thing. But on the flip side, I absolutely feel that tug of war being like, well, where are numbers coming from? Like, if endo is not what you're looking for and Bejetic is going out on loan and Clark is gone and Carvalio is gone and you're potentially sending McConnell out on loan or wherever. You know, you're getting down to a smaller number in midfield than I think we need because I think that, I think Kev was the one that was talking about it in Telegram where, yeah, you have three positions, but you have three positions that are going to be rotated very heavily due to the number of games, the five substitutes and the style of play. I don't know if we have the numbers to support that right now in our midfield and we depended on those kids last year, whether we like it or not. They played a role in getting some of those minutes. So that's where my worry comes from. I don't know about you. Yeah, I think you make a great point. You know, those kids we did depend on because of, you know, injuries and possibly lack of form from players that are currently there in those positions where, you know, three days ago, the press are spouting that, oh, you know, Liverpool are saying, look at this. Look at this. Look at this. Look at this. If you look at it and the call of the day, right? So I was like injury issues last season, court is Jones. I think he did an injury issue last season. And though I don't think he can play game after game after game, and he does not sue or any slot is trying to get one, and I think getting a slot in his, in his, um, lineups in preseason has shown you that he doesn't believe he can do it. And, and then you're looking at, you know, Harvey Elliott, who won't play deep in the two, he will go forward or forward, you know, the sort of way, you know, and then you stack it and then you're going, well, the reason these players played is because the guys that we still have here, we still have them a callister, the callister was fairly ever present, you know what I mean? There was some farm here and there, possibly due to toilets because of the travel into South America getting back. I remember he was literally asleep on the page playing against wolves early in the season. And you know, when you look at it and you say this is Bob, like just taking Bobby Clark as an instance, Bobby Clark comes in there and just loads of energy. He's really good. I think he gets, he's got a goal at home and he gets a goal at Anfield and I'm not too sure as again to might be and against loot and may have been, I'm not too sure, and, and you're kind of going, the reason he gets in is not because, you know, all those players there, like if it was the season before you go, he was getting in because Fabino couldn't run, you know, Henderson was all over the place, but Naby Kade was injured all the time, you know, the sort of way Oxley Chamber was injured, but that's not the case, he was getting in because players we still have at the club, okay, where injured or loss of farm or wherever it might be. And that's the reason he's getting in. We haven't changed anything to stone around and say, well we're letting Bobby Clark go for 10 million because we've brought in A and B and we feel now that A and B will cover the players that are already there or get in front of those players for a staring position and that's why we're letting Bobby Clark go, you know, you're not a sort of way and I think that's compounded more by the fact that we went to soil in the player last week and we know you can blame whoever you choose to blame, but it didn't happen and the reaction to that is to sell a Bobby Clark. Now it may be a case that he's young and they want to look, you know, let him go off and progress and we get forced, we get forced calling him and you never know, like live up hook around two years ago, he's being brilliant, we're going to try to sign him back, you know, the sort of way, but it's a bit worrying for me and you know, just people in the summer in the chat they are saying, you know, live up hook and do two deals, bang, bang, quick, you know what I mean, but we have to say it, we have to say it, I don't mind not hearing about it, I really don't, like I'm quite happy to do shows, go and live up hook up saying nothing and for people to go bananas, put down the tones, they've done something, they're just not telling you about it, it's a little bit of a worry for me, it really is, but I'm hoping, I'm hoping that they're dealing business in the background and that's telling nothing to nobody, because I've heard things like live up hook, brief them, Joyce and Joyce put this out and apparently the world coming out of Spain, there was that now Zuber-Mendi felt under too much pressure, all that was going on and I was like, this is real, this is a wind up, it could have been a wind up, I'm not too sure, but you know, maybe live up all I do and you're going to get people now that side here, I'll look, you're making it, no, I'm really not, honestly, the 30th of August when the wind up closed, we're just 16 days from now, if 16 days comes, like I'm fuming, if we're sitting in this position, fucking fuming, but I'm willing, I'm willing to give them that time to do that and I know if they do two or three signs, people are going to go too late, the season started and they haven't even brought, it's not today, you know what I mean, honestly, like if they bring them in on the 30th of August, they probably missed two Premier League games or something, you know what I mean, and after the Tour de France was an international break, so it's not a massive day, but you have to be willing to give them that time, but having said that you have to be able to, you know, turn around on the force of September or the 24th of August as it is this year, tricky focus, you always do the 24th of August and the 4th of September, you have to be able to go, that's not good enough, and I think we touched on it, the Zouba Mendy stuff, whether the player turned down and said I don't want to go, live up all the way the act, it just wasn't really for me, but then the thing is, you know, you look at this, we're in my match, really, right, and you're like, this is a weird one as well, so this link, this link is with the Georgian goalkeeper from Valencia, and the talk is 30 million euros, because Valencia need the money, because they've been running to the ground, basically, I think by Gary Neville's mate, there's a Gary Neville's mate that owns them, but they've been running to the ground anyway Valencia in an awful way, but the talk is, is that, remember actually, 30 million euros, and whatever way they're going to do this, they're going to actually, it's going to be long to bomb it, okay, be signed by Liverpool next summer, and then being long to bomb it again, so it'll actually be up Tauner Barramfield as a proper Liverpool player ready to play at the start of 26, 27, theoretically, theoretically, yeah, this is, this is, this is not a strange one, and I know you were saying to me, they can't, they can't, they can't bring him in, and then loan to another Premier League club, they could bring him in and loan him back to Valencia, they could bring him in and loan him to another club club on the continent, but I don't, you were saying they can't bring him in and, and loan him maybe to the Premier League, but again, like, I'm not saying it's not a gold mill, it looks a really good goalkeeper, but people are going to get upset about this as well, because it's like, great fair play, but you're telling me I'm not going to see a blue goalkeeper a few years, you know, it's, yeah, there's a couple things with this, if it happens after tree soil and you go, oh, I like that mill of, but not now, it doesn't look a good mill of now, yeah, this to me is not a face saving signing, and there's a few, there's a few wrinkles that come along with it that I think optically don't read as positive as they might want it to, I mean the first one is you bring him in and you automatically open the can of worms that is Alice in leaving, and that is not a can of worms that I particularly want to think about, even though I know it's on the horizon eventually, and then the second kind of wrinkle for me is, is the optics of him helping his old club form it, and I know that, you know, there's, there's bound to be some sort of connections there and, and all of that, but, you know, we want him focused on Liverpool, and, you know, when you're not seeing that signing actually walk through the door, I understand how some people might spin it, but at the end of the day, he's a very good goalkeeper, he, I think he would be a great successor to Ali, I just don't think that, I don't think that that, if that's our only signing on the August 30th, our quote unquote judgment day, I don't think we're going to be sitting here singing F.S.G.'s praises. I don't think so, because he's not playing for Liverpool, and the argument to it, I can see that the top behind to a certain point, bring him in, get him a year or two experience in the Premier League, you know, they rate him really highly, a lot, you know, what my first think about is, why don't you just buy him and leave him there for two years, just leave him in Valencia, he knows what he's doing, but I can see, I can see the reason behind bringing him in and trying to get him to a Premier League club, and, you know, so much time of the day, isn't it, net up, doesn't go for, for barments, I think he's totally five, I can't believe he was totally five, by the way, maybe three really old when I heard net up was totally five, but I can see the reason behind what are they on there, you know what I mean? Again, the time and other fields run, I think if we're sitting here in August, the four day that we've gone, we've brought in a centre half, we've brought in a midfielder, what possibly looking out of forward, but we're waiting to see what happens with what we have at the moment, and, by the way, this boy is coming in, and we've blown this up because Alison's out of contract in 2027, and he might want to go before then, so what future proven, you're kind of gone, that's brilliant walk, that's absolutely brilliant walk, but then what does it say, what does that make you think about, Alison, because if that's the case, you're looking at Alison's probably doing two more years ago, what's it say, the queen being killer, stay for two more years, and we're bringing another guy in towards the million, the queen being killer has to be knocking on someone's, it has to be knocking on someone's door and they'll go on, yeah, 100%, I mean, unless the intention is to have a killer her and Marmadame really kind of fight it out for first spot, but I mean, that doesn't seem like that. No, that's Ramsdale Raya territory, and that's not, I mean, I don't know, I don't know what the thought process is here, because it feels very much like they're hanging a killer her out to dry, but I mean, he should be looking for, like Kev said, he should be looking for a club now, you know, especially after this news. I don't want to see him go, I think it would be very bad for us if he left at this point in the window, because there's just way too much to do. But if I was a killer her, I'd be looking actively right now. Yeah, but the club have them on the contract, and the thing is the club club being a little bit, acting a little bit poorly towards queuing killer, but outwardly, you know, from what we can see, because if I'm thinking just from the queuing killer sort of things, I'm looking on, hold on, I've had a really good preseason, I haven't let you down when I come in last season when your number one was injured, your number one is back, okay, I'm willing to stay as number two, but maybe in the year or two's time, I can become number one at 27, 28 years of age, and then, you know, could probably have another 10 years, like, well, let's say five years as Liverpool's goalkeeper, and now the tournament go, now just let you know, in the summer of 2026, this guy will be in here. So queuing killer is expected to, we play two more seasons as Alisson Becker's deputy, for someone to come in and go, boy, the way you're at the deputy to this fellow as well. Like, I'm with Kev, I'm knocking on someone's lawn and I'm going, listen, I want the milk. I want the milk, because I'm not gonna play, I'm not gonna play this season, I'm not gonna play next season, and then when the guy who I can't get past, because he's the best in the world lives, you're bringing someone else in. Yeah, and the thing with Kelleher is his contracts up in 2026, so if I was Liverpool and theoretically we want to actually start to get into the business of making money for some of our big guys when we sell them, they'd probably want to sell them next summer, like, at the very latest. I don't think they're gonna let him run down his contract, are they? No, well, well, you say that, but we've left players on the contract, it's a team Liverpool Yeah, but is that because of core management, or is that an active choice? Because I think some of the decisions that we've made in that department haven't been ideal. No, I think when you look at the likes of Firmino goes on a free, you know, Tiago lives, he's let go, Matab is let go, Matab is let go because of the injury in the soy, right? That's an unfair enough, you know, he was gonna pay a lot of money for John Matab, anyway, this summer, but the likes of the likes of Queenie and Kelleher, you're looking here and you're sitting here in August 2024, and you're basically telling Queenie and Kelleher in August 20, and this day in 2026, you'll be still at the club, right? Sorry, you won't be at the club, right? Because your contract will be up, but we want you to actually play out your contract as number two with no hope of being Liverpool's number one. Even Kelleher goes, you know, it's for me, you just, no, he just has to win. You just had, like, Matab says, there's no links with Queenie and Kelleher for anyone for months now, talking, people talking about when going for the last two seasons, oh, you got that. And people have always said, should he go, should he not go? To me, that's probably the final nail where Queenie and Kelleher goes, there's no future for me at Liverpool. The only future I have is to see on my contract, or, and that's two years away. That's another two years away, which will make him 28, I think. Yeah, he's 26 now, I think. Yeah, he should be, if I'm him, I'm knocking on his arm and saying, oh, I want him. You know, Emmett says, Gino and Adam, Emily, Jan, Tiago, Firmino, all walk for free. Yeah. Not to mention the big guys that are potentially walking for free next year. Yeah, with the trade on there, yeah. The trade on them. Again, not definitive on them, and, you know, we're less than 12 months, like, you think people go, oh, there's 12 months left, there's no, there's four months left. You know what I mean? I mean, in four and a half months time, but that's what I'm saying. In four and a half months time, if nothing's being done on this, these guys can literally start talking to anybody you want. And people go, no, they can only talk to people in Europe, will you give me a break? They can talk to whoever they like, they'll be afraid. They can sign a pre-contractor, anyone in Europe, but they can literally talk to anyone, but that damn tree could literally be talked to Manchester City on the 40th of January. And Manchester City going, we'll pay, you say there, and we'll pay you whatever you want in June. And there you go. But look, it's, it's, it's an interesting one. He's a really good goalkeeper. Just think the time and other people are probably looking into how good he is. It's just the optics of it and everything else. What's next on our list? Oh, yeah. Man City. So, Man City, who apparently wanted all this done and dusted, are we going back? Where was this? Six months ago? Was it? When they were charged? Was it six months? I think it was longer than that. A lot longer than that. I don't like it. Fears it was longer than that. Right now it was in a February time, I think. But look, we're between all the dejigs and the rails. It's come out now that Man City's case will be heard in the, in the upcoming weeks. We will get the, it's expected the last about 10 weeks. And then you get a decision on it in early 2024. And then we'll, we'll see exactly what's going on. Man City's case against the Premier League apparently has been pushed back, which allows for this hearing. I'll be able to 150 instructors to go ahead. And yeah, well, it looks like it's going to finally come to some sort of conclusion. And people will, will know what's going on. Watch our failure on this because, you know, I've, I've seen people say, look, if these guys walk in there for 10 weeks and come out on a Premier League club, you know, and have a phone against them, they feel that Premier League and football is doing absolutely doing. Are you on, are you on that, Paul? I mean, it, it's such an enormous, it's such an enormous task that they, that the Premier League is taking on here, because I, I do feel like this is make a break for the Premier League. Like in terms of being able to police themselves properly and set the proper precedent for this to never happen again, like this needs to be, it, it, the punishment needs to fit the crime. I guess. And, and that can be debated, but I, you know, I think it is more than just a fine that that's my biggest thing for this is it can't just be a fine. Because Manchester City will eat that up and it won't even make a dent in what they're doing. I mean, I think the date that they came out with is September 16th. That's when it starts. Yeah. And then they said, like I said, about 10 weeks expected to last and then they, they want to have the whole thing done and dusted by the end of the season. So they expect there to be an appeals process. Yep. But they want the final verdict done by the end of this season. And I mean, I said in our telegram, I, I want this to be done well. I mean, it's a little bit malicious of me, I guess. But I want this done with Pep Guardiola still there. Because as much as he didn't pull the strings, I do feel like he is benefiting from all of this. And he is the one that's the face of the Oh, no, we're innocent campaign. And I want him to have to kind of face the music on this. So yeah, this is a big deal. You know, I, it could change the face of the Premier League, I think. Yeah. I think it's, I think it's absolutely huge. I think, you know, me and you and everybody else that watches football will have a view on it. But the biggest thing on this will be the clubs around, you know, or the stakeholders as they like to be called with regards to Premier League. I think a lot of clubs have bitten their lip for a very long time on this. I think they've, they've had their, they've had their suspicions over, over certain things for a very long time. And they've, they've, you know, they've kept up out of joy on it. But I think, you know, I was thinking of the different scenarios and I was saying, if see you walk away with this sort of foil, I think the rest of the stakeholders and clubs in the Premier League are going to go absolutely bananas. I think if the, if the, what, like, you see, it all depends on the amount of charges to get charged with, not charged with found guilty of, if they found guilty of any. And I, I expect them to be found guilty of a hefty amount of them. Because there's so many of them that are documented in the forced year against them. And that continues as a pattern right through to the seven or eight years, it's over seven years, 11 to eight days and I think, and if they get, if you look at the forced years charges, they're mirrored a lot through the whole process. So if you have, say, seven or eight in the forced year, okay, and, and they, they're mirrored too. And they're found guilty. They're probably looking at 56 charges, right, 56 charges. Now, as far as I can say, if man's that you get done for 20% of this, which is torty something, would you be able to afford 37 charges somewhere around there, right? They should be in the, they should be in the Premier League. It's as simple as that. They should not be in the Premier League. They brought the game in England in the dispute, that's far as I can say it. They brought in the dispute, they've committed fraud. And then you have the, you know, the HMRC or whatever they call themselves, looking into them then as well. Because that will be called an issue, right? It's going to be interesting. This will last 10 weeks. Of course, you're going to get all the stuff after a man's seat, you're going to get away with this. A man's seat, you're going to get this done to the man, and you're better off just ignore on that, because everyone's going to see an opportunity to create hysteria, create clicks, people reading articles and make a money off it. And that's the job, but it wouldn't be me reading them. But honestly, like, I can see, I can see a situation where there's absolute war in the Premier League by the end of this season, and I mean that. I think there'll be absolute war, and I think, you know, not only that, not only if they, they say, got away with the war, if they get fined on the capital of the Premier League, I think they'd be trouble, real, real big trouble. But you have to remember, the close ones only, I think the other clubs won't only be disgusted at the, at the football club that is Manchester City. I think they'd be disgusted at the, the thing that is the Premier League, but you go and look, we, we as a brand are under your umbrella, and this is the way you're carrying on. This is what you've allowed to happen, you know, and you've gone in here with a hundred and fifteen charges, and they've proved to be all wrong, and even if they were, even if they were proved to be not guilty on any of this, right? But the close would have, I think, very grand, since one of them go, this, this entity can continue. This Premier League can't continue as it is, because you're either running it or you're not. Now, for the going to do that much research and bring a hundred and fifteen charges against somebody. And of course, Man City refused to give some, give some paperwork over and, and different things, and I've missed deadlines, and, you know, they've done them for late kick-offs two million quid, like, they give a fuck, like, a little two million quid, it's, it's honestly one of the biggest moments, I think, in the history of English football, as a fan. Absolutely. I genuinely believe that. Yeah. No, it's, it's absolutely, like, the most pivotal moment that I can recall in, in recent history, um, with regards to where, where we're going, um, because I just, I just can't even fathom what happens if, like, if they get off on technicalities, for example, like the UEFA ruling, where, I mean, I know that this isn't time-barred in the same way, but, you know, my biggest fear is, you know, with all of these lawyers that they're paying that are supposedly the best in the business, like, I worry that they have teeny little technicalities in the legal jargon that they can, they can use, and, and if that happens, I think we're in for absolute disaster, um, but it's one of those things like time will tell, we have to trust the process, we have to trust that they're going to get this right because there's no brushing this under the rug, um, the cat's out of the back. Oh, but I think it's very, I think it needs to be very clear call because you're talking and, and you really could say it, you know, these teams of lawyers, and the Premier League have great teams of lawyers as well. No matter how good your lawyer, your lawyer are, if, if you don't wrong, you don't wrong, you know, you might get a reduced sentence because of those little loopholes and stuff like that. But if they go in and it's like, well, see, you got off on all these points because they actually done what the Premier League said and they're out of order, but there's this little thing over here that says basically you can't throw them over the league because of it. You know the sort of thing? And, and that's where it comes back on the Premier League's and that's where clubs come back and says to the Premier League, you're looking meant to be looking after their interests with regards to the game in England, the game in, in, you know, across Europe, across Asia, across the world as, you know, we mark ourselves as this and I think the, like, Kev's is there, you know, he feels that they've got the ducks in the line or ducks in the row with regards to these charges. I really hope they have, I really hope they have because I think all the jargon and all the bits and all the pieces, if you look at one Manchester City where in 2007, all right, and look where they are in 2011 and then look where they are in 2011, you know. Even, even, like, it just doesn't make any sense. It doesn't not make any sense and you look at clubs now, they were in way more than they did in 2007 or 2011 or in the 2011, and they're being restricted in what they can do because of certain financial rules. Now, when all the financial rules have changed over that point, but, but not to the point where city could do this now, and in 10 years time, nobody can do it, you know, they haven't changed that much, that they've more or less been changed in reaction to certain things that the looks of Man City don't and gone back again, Chelsea and stuff like that, but Chelsea would just have loads of money and you could pour it in. It's, I just think it's so fucking big for English football because not only that yet, the word that's out there and the feeling that's out there between fans of all clubs bareman cities and even man city fans go, ah, you know what, if we get done for, I still had a great time and then as soon as somebody says that to me, I kind of go, well, now you know that you could get done, you know, six months ago, these were all telling us, no way, we're fine, we don't run, you know, let's start the way. And that's where the creeps in, even man city fans are kind of, resilience, I wouldn't change a thing, but would you know, you know, you're okay with just a good time you had, all them trophies won't mean anything, you know, they'll probably have to be strobed out of the record and stuff like that, but I really think it's so, so big and I think, you know, people are there, there's a couple of people travelling to the chat there like City will look for a play bag and some more, but what are you playing? Like, hon, if they have me, or get found guilty of 30, 40% of these charges, you're looking at, like 40% of these charges, right, is about 46 charges, I think, built up, right? Like 46 charges, right, of financial, whatever they're calling it, it's monumental, it's monumental, it's never been seen before, do you know what I'm saying? I mean, some of it's outside of the Premier League altogether, like if you're, if you're basically cooking the books for lack of a better term or you're fraudulently, fraudulently reporting your financial dealings, like that becomes like a police issue, that I mean, I don't even think it's in the Premier League's hands, if they prove that, I think it then gets handed over to higher authorities, so I don't know, it all depends on what happens in the court. I am not a legal expert by any means, but I think what Sam said earlier, where it's you know, either, either city are finished or the Premier League are finished and I think that there's a real danger of not necessarily a super league, but perhaps clubs leaving the Premier League and, I mean, if they can't police themselves, what's, what is it really? What is the league worth? Yeah, exactly. Like, and that's where the, that's where I think the, the Super League will come back in the focus, because clubs will say, well, look, you can't police yourself, but you've literally let this run now, okay, you've brought 115 charges because you believed that they've cheated, everyone else believed that they cheated and somehow that hasn't happened. Somehow it hasn't been proven, and listen, we can't go on like this, we can't go, it's like having an insurance company, you know, and everyone's in the insurance company, next of all, there's a guy over here making false claims all the time, and your policy keeps going up because he keeps making false claims, and then you just, oh yeah, he was the owner, but you just keep paying that policy over here, and you're going, no, I go to a different insurance company, thanks, you know, because, because they aren't getting false claims, and we're not, I'm not getting, you know, held back or punished, because what's gone over here, and you have to be fair, those teams in the Premier League, they're possibly feel like they've been held back, I think Liverpool might be one, I think Arsenal genuinely think they might be one, where they feel like we've been held back from bigger successes or earning more money, winning more trophies wherever it might be, because of during this period, this team are allowed to do this, and that's, that's what it is, like Emmett says, they were already found guilty by the way, yes they were, only thing was wrong with the statement of the statute of limitation, correct, and also where the source of the information came from, with their Spiegel and stuff like that, if they were found guilty then they'd be found guilty again, when city starts saying the rules, which they had signed up to went unfair, you know they are on a losing ticket, but that's, that was a crazy situation actually, like to come out and say, yeah look, them rules that we signed up to, and everyone has to a boy, boy, we think they're unfair now, you know, now I don't, don't can be wrong, if city went under investigation over 150 charges, and went to sat around the table with the Premier League, and did an interesting club and said, look, this is a bit unfair, what's going on here, can we have a discussion about it, can we put a vote on it, can we put some sort of structure in to make this a bit more lenient, or open it up a little bit fair enough, but when you're sitting on a hundred and fifteen charges saying, the rules we have, and we signed up to, and we feel they're unfair, you're kind of going, well, were you playing with them, were you playing with these rules, or are you going to be caught on this rule, and then you're arguing, before you're actually caught, you know, the sort of way, it's a bit of a marvel. I think that that ruling is actually set to come out in the next couple of weeks, for the, yeah, the, all of the associated party ruling and stuff, that was already finished, which is part of the reason why they're able to push the 115 charges up, so we'll know pretty soon what the ruling was from that, so I'm curious, because I did read somewhere that there was limited success from City, and I don't know what that means, you know, because, I don't know, I don't know how exactly they are tied together, but I think that there are kind of, like, there are things that tie together in that the sponsorship deals, and the inflating of sponsorships, sponsors, I can't speak today, sponsorship deals, that stuff worries me, if they can set a precedent in this ruling, I don't know how that foreshadows what's going to happen in the 115 with, with the deals, with the charges that are related to the deals. Oshin says that City have had some success in arbitration on that issue, and presumably the time of the issue with regards to the rules being unfair, but that's, it doesn't matter if they have some success in arbitration on that issue, it doesn't matter. That's not going to affect the 115 charges that are against, because the, the rules are there, and when you think they're unfair or not, they're reals, you know, they start the way, if you've done nothing wrong, and, and you feel like, look, that rule is there, and we can only put in this amount of money, or we can only deal this, or whatever, and you feel unfair, they may change it for next season, and go, right, okay, listen, everybody, we've looked at it, these guys feel it's unfair, and we found that most of you are affected by this, so we're going to open this up a little bit for free everybody up, a little bit, that's fine, but when you're arguing against the rules that are there, and you're like, let's remember, they're arguing nearly 10 years later, they weren't arguing in 2018, they're arguing in 2024, the charges are from 2011 to 2018, that's what the charges are, so it'll be interesting to say, it's going to start on, I think you said September 16th, in the room for 10 weeks, which will probably put you to the end of November, you'll probably hear something in January, there will be an appeals process, but again, I think everyone will want this sorted by the very end of 24/24, because it means then that we are now where we stand going into 24/26, and you have to remember, right, you have to remember, they need to know what's going on, because if these charges stick to a big level, a man's seat, you're no longer at all, you're able to primarily live, because of this, right, then the AFL become involved, and then you have to remember, there's playoffs, there's relegation, there's promotion, if they're thrown into the league too, it has to be really the AFL, and then the AFL after the soy rope, what do we do here, do we have playoffs, do we pull, does everybody, does every league get an extra team promoted, it does loads of permutations around us, let me see, everything of course, we get into everything on another day, their face and possibly another band, are not a band, another point introduction, because apparently they've gone over, they've been found to go over again in the 2022/23 set of accounts, which is a bit weird, because that should have been all done and dusted, because those accounts would have been in by late June last year, but something's gone on there as well. Can we talk about the P.G.O.M.O.L. because they're in the favorites, just to finish. Save the best for last. Yeah, so we're approaching the new season, everyone is expecting the L.M. semi-automated off-soid, and Harold Webb's gone, nah, we might get up by the end of the season, like they're having a time to plan for this, they're having a time to pull the facilities in place, they've just gone, ahh, you know what, maybe, maybe in the end of the next season, which is a joke, right? And let me know in the chat what you think about that, I just think that's a parl, like we've been watching this in the Champions League last year, we watched it in the Euros, you know, it's actually really good the way it's done, but the P.G.O.M.O.L. were two days before the season starts, you know, it started against Fulham in two days now, have come out, and True Henry Winter would so absolutely an utter nonsense, but starting with it, starting with the semi-automatic off-soid, they should be in, they should just be in the Premier League. So I did a little bit of background research on this, and someone in the chat can correct me if I'm wrong, but I, sorry, can I just stop you? Nobody in the chat has done any research, they won't be stopping them correctly, you just go ahead, we're not gonna go fair play to actually, we're all lazy fuckers, she's not, let her speak, go. Okay, so what I read was basically, there's a new company called Genius Sports, and they're the ones that are supposed to be coming in to supply the semi-automated off-side technology, and one of the reasons it's so complicated is because it requires basically brand new computer cameras to be installed in every Premier League stadium, and it's going to be a newer, different form of automated VAR from what we've been seeing in like FIFA and the World Cup and the Champions League, and a lot of that is that they wanted to bring in the kind of next generation of the technology, and also because the Premier League doesn't have access to the Adidas ball, and the way that they've been doing the semi-automated off-sides is the, I know, I told you, I went deep, they have the wrong football, okay. They do, so they have Nike right now, and they're gonna have Puma next year, and yeah, so basically they're in a bit of a pickle, but the long story short is I think they are planning to have it in actually in October, so it might not actually be the end of the season, they're aiming for October. Who in the right mind, right, that runs, like, who in the right mind, that runs the Premier League, okay, and has the PGA been well on board, right, and 200 of them goes, when does the season start, that's August 16th, I'll tell you what we do, we just aim for October, but that's ridiculous, that's like Santa Claus saying, do you know what I'm gonna do, I'm gonna aim for February lads, I know it's December 25th, but look, you know, I got the wrong fucking blades on me sleigh, so I'm gonna have to aim for January, and people are on February, and people are going, put Santy Christmases December, and they're going, yeah, we don't care, we just aim for January, it doesn't matter, it's madness, right, but Henry Winter, and anyway, let it leave until we, because there's no problems all around, and let me tell you what they are, so a couple of tweets from Henry Winter, which were so many favourites in this preseason to be fair, I'm trying to read these quick as I can, because we found it was about the doughy, but first one up, and players, no, Henry Winter said this today, at 1 a.m. p.m., okay, you know, Greenwich mean to him or whatever, we're on at this stage, they've all different names for this stuff, now, players, managers, and club officials are being encouraged by the Premier League to be more measured in the criticism of referee's decision, like honest to God, like at a PGMOL genuinely, going to preemodating on lads, he's won't give the clubs a ring, alright, and just tell their managers and their players just to be a bit more measured when we make a complete bollocks of things, and they're going, that's a fantastic idea, we will ring the clubs and players now, like, I think, right, players, managers, and club officials are being encouraged to be more measured, I think in fairness, I think players, managers, and club officials have been fairly measured in the criticism so far. Unless you're the forest owner. Well, he ran on the picture when the horse killed somebody, which I wasn't against. I mean, so maybe, maybe if we're talking about that, then yeah, like, let's not do that. I don't know, I mean, there's, there's so much of this, like, respect the referees so that from the grassroots level down the referees get more respect, and I'm all for that, but like, a lot of their respect needs to be earned, and with some of the rules that they're putting out here, like, I don't, I don't know how that's going to happen, I don't know, they, I swear, they, they say they're simplifying it every year, and it sounds more complicated to me every single year. Oh, wait, like, get to the handballs, the handballs are the best, the handballs are the best, and you have to remember now, this is two days before the Premier League starts, two days, like the Premier League, in 48 hours time, we will be literally an hour past the final whistle in the fourth game of the Premier League, and this is what's coming out. Okay, so let me just read about the handballs, right? Players told, players told the Premier League there were too many handballs last season, and again from Henry Winter, okay, this is a 4-0 1pm, he just let the dust settle on the lads go easy on them, and he said, players told the Premier League there were too many handballs last season, players know it was by the Premier League, they're not every touch of a player's hand or arm with the ball is an offence, and they are not expected to move, they're way for this, they're not expected to move with their arms behind their back, or boy their side, like pogoing penguins, that's not an official description in the last of Henry, thanks for that Henry, handball law is simplified, now they back this up, well you hear this, handball laws are simplified, no handball if just the foil position or action, okay, they're just warts, okay, just a massive void of grey area which they fucking love living in, right, yeah, a clear change of trajectory when touched boy are deflected from the same player, which means if a player is above your leg and hit your arm, that's absolutely fine, right, touch boy are deflected from the same player, played by a teammate, okay, so the ball is played but now if you read that Roy, okay, so let's read it again, change of trajectory when touched boy are deflected from the same player, played by a teammate, hit supporting arm when a player falls or proximity, which means if you're really close to the ball and hit you on the arm, proximity we know that, but that bit there, change of trajectory when touched boy are deflected from the same player, right, which means them, played by a teammate, so if your teammate is, if your teammate is kicking in the goal, can you just put your hand and go, I mean teammate, touch that, teammate, touch the last, right, yeah, yeah, deliberate handball is still punishable, yeah, handball still fairly complicated but this should prove an improvement, so they've used, they've used simpler for it, okay, in some of the warning here, okay, and then they've said it's still fairly complicated but should prove an improvement, no it doesn't, it simply does not, what we've done here is, right, they basically said what we're gonna do is we're gonna make the referee guard again, okay, and guard has gone to the soil, right, Paul Tierney will be God every Saturday and he will the soil better, if flicked up by yourself, your arms were out, your proximity did your mate, touch it, and again we're just gonna end up, we're just gonna end up the exact same stuff as last season, if not washed, you know what I mean, like it's mindblowing when you're ready to stuff, I mean it's, I think, like I said, every time they try to simplify it, I feel like they make it more complicated, it lasts for about a month and the first, like the first month, there's so much chaos and then they just go back on it, but I mean there was one thing in this description of all the changes about kind of like the refs call, and I think Kev put it in the chat earlier, where they're gonna have, they're gonna defer to the refs on the field more often and have like a higher bar for not intervening. Oh god, I hate hoibert, it's like everything, everything just, I don't know, it just screams disaster to me, everything with these refs screams disaster, I don't know. I'm just wondering what damn a Gallagher has on the PGMOL, because like he's gonna have to be doing double shifts in school, you know, he's gonna be making an absolute fortune. Because that would be hilarious. Oh, I think, oh yes, they've started them, they've started a Twitter account to explain the VAR, haven't they? Yeah, well, they're not, they're not announcing, yeah, they're the whole like prospect of announcing what was going on live, that's not happening, so instead they want you to download Twitter and then be part of their little account and then they're gonna live stream, I guess, the explanations. And then they're gonna put the replays on the big screen for the stadiums that actually have a big screen, so I don't know, the whole thing, it's gonna be exactly the same like last year, there's not gonna be in person, I don't know why we're setting ourselves up. Correct, like Brian Harren says, and like he's joking, but this could be true, new tweet from Henry Winter, goalkeepers not allowed to use their hands if the ball comes out the foot of an opponent, like they're genuinely only like short of the owner, like honestly, when it comes to penalty kicks, just make it really fucking simple, right, really simple. If the ball hits your arm and that player is more than three yards, four yards, four yards, pick the distance and hit your arm, it's a penalty kick, end the story, right, end the fucking story. Take care of your hands or your face, down by your side, like all this stuff, like oh he was in the silhouette, well let's take like, that's nonsense as well because the ball hits you on the arm, right, and it's in the silhouette, take your arm out there, and the ball goes in the goal, you are stopping the ball, hit your arm, it's unfortunate, it's unfortunate, but they should literally go listen to what we're gonna do, if it comes up off your own, if it comes up off your own body, you're trying to clear something and I hit some, and your arm goes up, I'm absolutely fine with that, that's, that for me is something where you say to yourself, right, look, he's gone to clear it, it's him, it's gone, I'm okay with that, but they literally, if a ball is struck, if a ball is struck and it takes a deflection up off somebody and it hits you and it's a penalty, just do that, and it's really like black and white, you know, that's a penalty, that's not a penalty, how was it not a penalty, well it didn't hit his hand, fine, and then everyone knows what's going on, and yes, you will get some decisions against you, and yes you will get decisions for you, but the decision is already made, it's not a case of what does Paul Tierney think of the weekend, what does any other, any other fucking he just think of the weekend, it's basically the ball has hit you, it hasn't deflected up off your own body because you don't have time to react, right, and don't get me wrong, if the ball comes in and it deflects off, you know, or I think of it deflected, basically it should be a distance thing, that's my take, think of it, it's a distance thing, so they should be able to go with all the lines and technology they have, they go look, he's crossed that and he's four meters away from, right, or three meters away, let's put a figure on this, five, six feet, right, so two meters, so they say look, when he's hit that look, we know with the lines he's two and a half meters away from, it's a penalty, simple as that, if a ball has gone in the goal and it hits your hand, right, and your hands are down where so it, you've stopped the ball, you've stopped the ball, simple as that, like, and this is the way, like, and like, Oshin's mentioned, you're our favorite here, I'm clear and obvious, that's just another gray area, it wasn't really clear and obvious, no it was, it was clear and obvious that everybody watching except the four or four people that are meant to make the decision, honestly they should just simplify it really down to, it's hit off your army, it's a penalty kick, they've changed the red card rule for hand balls too, just pick a distance, what's the change of the red card now, well, the red card is only for deliberate hand balls now, which, I don't know, I need to go back and look at it, because it's, I thought that that's what it was, I thought the red card was for deliberate hand ball for stopping the goal, the ball going into the goal, right, yeah, I need to go back and check this, go and check it, but the thing is like, my algorithm with all this and I was always being, if you, there's too many permutations to, to, to hand ball, there's just too much, there's too much of all, it was closed from his body was in the silhouette, you know, and you see fellas like, you know, like you look at the, you look at the one, um, against, what's, what's the name, um, it was in the euros Germany against Denmark, and the ball gets crossed and it hits the guy in the hand, right, that guy has his hand up in the air, as it's crossed, it hits his hand, it's unfortunate, you have to stretch our arms out, but if it hits you, it hits you, but if they go back to that and they go, listen, that was actually only four and a half feet from him, you know what I mean, it's not a penalty, but if he's seven and a half, eight feet away from him, two and a half meters away from him, and it hits him, it's a hand ball, simple as that, the ball's going in the goal, if the ball's going to another player and it hits your hand, it's a penalty, just do that, and I know, look, don't get me wrong, all you could be sitting here, you know, at three o'clock on Saturday after Liverpool get two penalties given against them, against Ipswich, and I go, I can't believe we lost a game, those two penalties, but at least I know going into the game where it is, that's the biggest problem, that's the biggest, biggest problem, nobody knows when they're going into these games, what to expect, and even when it happens and you don't know what to expect, two weeks later, the same situation happens, and then you think you know what to expect, what to expect, and you don't, because you've changed it, internally they've gone, listen, that was a bit mad, wasn't it, two weeks ago, tell you what, when this happens again, just do this, but you don't tell anybody, you just, just keep going, do the wrong thing, and if, look, just get to the end of the season, and reading that from Henry Winter today, I was gone, Jesus Christ, there's so many things in this, that, and by adding more and more stuff into this, the clearing obvious thing becomes more and more greater, you cannot get a clearing obvious decision if you have that many permutations around something, you simply can't, how can, the more you muddy the waters, how can you make it clear, how can it be obvious, you know what I mean? Okay, so that, I mean that's one of the reasons why I'm having a hard time with this red card thing, because it, it does feel like it's a judgment thing, it's, it becomes the referee's call, and basically the change was, up until this summer, any handball which stopped a goal or prevented a goal scoring chance was a red card, now it needs to be deemed deliberate for it to be a red card, otherwise it's a yellow card, so you're, again, adding another thing for the ref to judge, is it deliberate or is it not, which is just, it's a, I mean, I like when things are black and white, I don't like when they live in this gray area because I don't trust the refs in the gray area, I just think they operate like maniacs when they're in the gray area, but this, but this, this is what allows them, I've often, I've always said it, they, they live in a, in a gray area, right, that he can retreat back into whenever they feel like it, and we can all argue over the decision, and they can just sit in there saying things like "hoy bar and clear and obvious", right, but here's one for you, if you were standing on the goal line, right, and if your hands down by your side, okay, and that ball has struck at you, and you have your hands in the silhouette as they call it, and it hits you on the arm, and your team cleared the ball, and it goes to VAR, and they say, "lookus, that arm is in the silhouette, you know, where are they meant to go", okay, and they don't give a penalty for it, or they don't give a red card for it, which is nonsense, the ball is going and the goal doesn't matter, right, the only way you can stop that goal legally for me is not to deal with your hands, okay, what happens if a guy is standing in the silhouette, okay, and the ball loops towards goal, and he doesn't think he makes it, but he shifts across in the silhouette, and let's do the arm, he's in the silhouette, do you know what I'm saying, okay, so I think that would still be a penalty, but it would be a yellow card, I guess, in this scenario, but why would it be a penalty, his arms are in the silhouette, the whole thing was the silhouette of the person, the natural silhouette, is if it hits them there, no they're in the silhouette, they've done their absolute best, but you could genuinely take a step across goal, remain in the silhouette and let it hit your arm, that's what you could do, I don't know, I, I mean I think of like that Reese James incident at Anfield, where he stopped the ball, and it was a red card, like that, that's what that sounds like to me, so if that wasn't a penalty, and if that wasn't a red card, I don't know what I would have done, um, I don't know, it's, it's crazy, I don't know how people are meant to keep up, like, changing the rules every single season, but the thing is, they're getting more confusing, yeah, but the thing is right, what's the stop, Howard Webb, right, bringing two referees and a couple of footballers, right, into Skoy, into one of the many Skoy studios they have, right, or an outdoor area, setting up all the cameras and saying, right, listen, we've gone through, we're going to go through 20 issues here, we're going to go through 20 issues with regards to tackles, you know, for over the ball penalties, and literally releasing 20, 40 minutes of footage gone, if this happens, if this happens, this is what would the decision would be, and this is why the decision is going to be that way, right, so even if we're watching a game on Saturday or Sunday or next week or, um, in February when Santi comes along, um, because he's late for Christmas, we're watching that and we can say to ourselves, well, hold on, that happened, but do you remember where I'm telling us at the start of the season, it was pretty well on Skoy, it was pretty well on TNT, it was pretty well on wherever, all around the world, do you remember this happened, this was, this is actually really close to the situation that happened, right, and referees could actually come out and, and learn them and turn around and go, listen, on the VA organ, listen, that's very similar to example 24 from the start of the season, and the example did show that that should be a penalty, or the example showed that that shouldn't be a penalty, or should, or shouldn't be a red card, or whatever it might be, and then people are able to relate back to stuff, but at the moment, you look at the looks of the course Jones tackle, on was a bersume, um, last year, right, um, or maybe the other guy in the field, I can't remember, and that happened, and people are like, over the ball, red or not, and then something happens a couple of weeks later, and it's not a red card, and you're going, but the course Jones was the same, like, we have an example here, and now the example is actually being ignored, but if they officially came out and showed you loads of different scenarios, and then I had to find, just go back over the last couple of years of Premier League action, look at all the big decisions that have caused controversy, and go, right, bring these players in, bring some referees in, let's show the situation, let's show what the decision will be, and at least we have a solid example to go back to, but at the moment, the examples that we think in our head are similar to something happening now are actually the exact opposite when you get a couple of weeks down the line, because internally, they change what they're going to do, and they don't tell anybody, well, they don't, I think, I mean, that sounds really logical, I would move a lot of it that existed, but I think that from their perspective, that would be introducing them to a whole set of standards that they would then have to be held to, and at the moment, they live in that gray area where they don't have to be held to those standards, and, you know, if all of this, like, don't criticize the refs, whatever, is also to be believed, like, why would they open themselves to criticism? Because I feel like the minute that they put that out, they then have to hold themselves responsible, and they're never going to be up to that standard, not these refs, not the ones that I've seen. You see, you can argue with refs, like, well, it's actually the organization for me, and the amount of leeway that I've given, and the amount of opportunity that I've given to retreat into an area where I know I can really touch them, and that's where my issue is. Like, honestly, if you could just be way, like, instead of Howard Webb dealing stuff, every fucking, whatever, no, with Mike Alone, right, born, the fucking tits off everybody, why don't you just do it the start of the season? Just do it the start of the season, and go, we've picked, I don't care how many it takes for the incidents. We're going to go through every one of these, because they're all, like, being, they're all an issue, they're all different to each other. Let's go through them, let's talk about them, let's show what our referees are going to do. We're in these situations, right? You may get ones that aren't exactly the same, but at least you have a starting point, you know, at least you have a starting point on this handball decision. Look, that's like example 15, example 15 would have done this, put us a slight difference there for that reason, and as well, if they explain themselves, and they give you an example, and then they give you the reason behind it. Everyone's good, then you know what you're going into the season for, but you're right, they won't be hurt at a certain standard, because what they do is you're retreating, Howard Webb comes out and says, "Yeah, we made a mistake, what are you going to do over here?" I'll apologize here for five minutes, Mike Alone just keeps nodding at me, like this, and then we'll all just go home. And that just happened, ridiculous. Yeah, I mean, I also just have no idea what their perspective is on, like, do they think that fans deserve that kind of information? I mean, I think that kind of thing should be out in the public domain, but I don't know. I mean, do they do those things behind closed doors, and could they quite easily broadcast that to fans? I don't know. I mean, there's got to be a rule book where they have those examples where that stuff exists. I just don't know if it's made public. You'd like to think so. I mean, at least I'd like to think so. I don't know. You'd like to think too, but there's no evidence that they are. The only evidence I think there is, like, inadvertently the evidence that is, that they change the rules as they go along. That's it. They have changed it. We've seen stuff where it's happened, and a couple of weeks there are very, very, very similar situations, have a different outcome. You know, and then you put it down to the ref going off to have a look at this. And one ref may say one thing, and one ref may say the other. It's the same game. It's the same game. It's the same rules. How are we getting these different outcomes? But as I said, my idea might sound a bit mad, but I don't, like, if why don't the PGMOL, the Premier League produce some sort of video package to show people how they work, and they become more, become more human on his den, don't they, really, to show what's gone on and how he talks, how he thinks and stuff like that. But they keep putting themselves behind this barrier, and that feels like that's their protection. You know what I mean? I'm just, I'm just thinking in my head that stupid little graphic of the man with the arms by its side and the t-shirt line where they were trying to show, like, what a handball was. Yeah. And it was like they dumped it down so much for the audience, and I feel like, in general, like, sure, there are some people that have no idea, like, what they're looking at, but I do think that fans are smarter than they give them credit for, and if they put that information out, it would actually be great for anyone that was interested in the game. Yeah. And I don't think it needs to be as dumb down as a little silhouette with arms. I think they can, they can be more clear, but I just don't know if that's what they want to do. But the thing is, like, when you look back a couple of years ago, and I know we've gone over time, I know it was meant to be the timekeeper, and I'm terrible at it because we started talking about the fucking PJMOL. But, but if you look at the government a couple of years ago, any handball with a boy, an attacking player, in an attacking milf, right, was a handball, and the goal could be disallowed. If you remember, back to the open day, the season going back to, I think it was, I want to say, in 1920, um, C.E. beat spores early, first day of the season. And I think Gabriel Hayes used to score as a goal, but it turns out it comes off, they go for a header and it brushes off a little hard time, falls, and Gabriel Hayes used bangs in the net. I think I could have that wrong, but it was definitely city against sports. And you had this real, if I hit off your hand as an attacking player, and you scored me, you know, in, within the milf, it was, it didn't matter, it was intentional, I know, the goal was real. But why don't you just turn around to defend them? Generally, you just turn around to defend them. So the only way is this like, Are these just Premier League rules changes, or are these international competition rules? I don't know. I don't know. But like, like at some point, I just want us to get on board with the rest of the world and stop thinking that the Premier League is somehow unique and gets to have its own little set of quirky rules. Yeah, but we just, but the Premier League just aims for October, for the camera stuff. Like the season ended, like, like a season, like they should have been planning this. They should have been able to say, look, we've planned this, and as soon as that Premier League ends, we're going into every Premier League ground in the country. I'm important this stuff in, and we've run a couple of test events in the stadiums in pre-season, make sure everything's working for the fourth day of Premier League, and they go, no, no. We'll wait 10 or 12 games in. Doesn't matter. And they go, yeah, but then you're going to have like contentious issues. I would aim for October. What do you want? Like, you know what I mean? The momentum going on in the game. I mean, it does kind of open up the discussion to whether or not, you know, half of the season, you have this rule in place, half of the other season, you don't. So you're going to have to be in the first half. But that's the thing, like, there are meant to be a set of rules in the start of the season, and they don't change, and no changes can be made in the following season. The automated off-soid is a change that shouldn't really come in on October, because now you get people going, well, hold on, there was a contentious one in the middle of September, which we've looked at, okay, and if we run the automated off-soid technology on it, we were actually on-soid, or we conceded the goal, and it was actually off-soid. So now we're being punished because you didn't bring this in. So people may benefit where we've, you know, had stuff go against us. It's an absolute mess. And but there you go. I mean, as long as we don't have legitimate goals chalked off this year, I would consider it a win. Like, at least, at least can they just do that? Well, Kev says apparently they're going to clamp down and holding in the box from corners. I believe when I say Kev, they don't do this a couple of years ago, at last at about three games, and then everyone just hung out with their, like, during a march day, you know, for the rest of the season. So I wouldn't be, you know, I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be, I feel like Kerry Maguire is going to be out of the business. Yeah, it's just, they say this stuff and then they change it, but they don't really change them. I just get really upset with the PJMLL. So I'd like to officially apologize to anyone that's watched this, or is going to listen on the audio download, I apologize profusely. But they just fucking annoyed me so, so much. And the PJMLL and the Premier League, and the way they carry on with this. And again, how many winter tweets from, you know, Wednesday to 14th of August, when the league kicks off on Friday, the 16th of August, and it's just, it's just bananas for me. Right, I think we've covered loads there, have we? Yeah, we've done everything. We've done really well. Ashley's time keeping us being horrendous. She's kept me here now for an hour and a 12 minutes. I don't know when he mentions 25th. Tomorrow is a prediction show. We sell them Kev, and there might be one or two more on. But we're going to have a look at the Premier League. We're going to have a look at the teams involved. We're going to try to pick a top four, a bottom tray, a surprise package, boom, boom, boom. And we try to do that in an hour, but that'll fail as well. We'll be here right now and a half. That's how it rolls. Thanks to me, actually. Thanks to me, Devon and Diccha. All our members, actually. And anyone listening afterwards, if you fancy getting this live and you want to comment on it as it goes on, knock on our YouTube, hit the join button, 3.99 a month, and you get all this sort of stuff. Nonsense, to be honest with you. Look, 3.99, what do you want? That has been the talk and comfort tonight. Thanks to me, actually. Thanks to me, Devon and Diccha. Whatever. Good luck. Good night. All right now. This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network.
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Clarke Out - Mamardashvili In
Gav and Ashley are with you to talk Liverpool as Bobby Clarke looks on the verge of a move to RB Salzburg and the reds are linked with a very strange move for goalkeeper Mamardashvili.
Oh and the PGMOL are at it again!!
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