Grumpy SEO Guy
SEO Contradictions, Clarification, and Critical Thinking - Episode 71
This is Grumpy SEO Guy Episode 71, SEO contradictions, clarification, and critical thinking. You're listening to Grumpy SEO Guy, the SEO podcast that doesn't waste your time with nonsense that doesn't work. I'm the Grumpy SEO Guy, and I'm sharing with you the strategies that have helped me successfully run my SEO agency for the last 14 years. In this podcast, I'll be sharing my knowledge and experience, discussing tips and strategies, and trying to help you cut through the confusion that permeates this industry. If you listen to this podcast, you will know more about SEO than 99% of people on the planet. Ready? Let's get started. I'm the Grumpy SEO Guy. Let me tell you why I'm Grumpy today. I'm Grumpy today because if you have been reading about SEO on different forums and different websites and you read something and think, "Right, that makes sense." And then you read something else, and you're like, "Wait a minute. That literally contradicts what I just read, and you can't figure out what's going on because everyone says something different, and it's all opposite of what someone else said." You're not a crazy person. That's actually happening. All right, let's talk about some of that. Here are some things you may have read, but before we do that, my lawyer tells me that I have to say this right now. A quick disclaimer before we get started, everything I say here is based on my experience and opinion from 14 years in the industry. I don't officially know how Google or any other search engines work. Everything I say here is hypothetical and based on my experience. This podcast does not constitute advice or services. What worked for me may or may not work for you. Okay, back to the show. There are a lot of comments, for example, in the SEO subreddit where somebody will ask a question like, "Hey, I want to get backlinks, but I don't want to get bad backlinks. How do I know if I'm getting good backlinks or not?" Or something along those lines. And there's always people who respond with something like, "Oh, well, Google can tell the difference between good backlinks and bad backlinks, so don't worry about it and just get backlinks." Okay, okay. And then there's always another comment, usually in response to this one, that says, "If bad backlinks could hurt you, then people would just make bad backlinks to their competition all day long and hurt their competition." Yeah, well, that's possible and it's called negative SEO. I'm not sure why people don't think that this is the case, but that's not the problem. The problem is that then there will be another question where somebody will ask something like, "Oh, hey, you know my position fell and I can't figure out what the problem is." And people will say, "Maybe you got a spammy link penalty from the algorithm change or something along those lines." And it's like, okay, okay, just stop for a second. First, you say that bad backlinks are no different from good backlinks and they can't hurt you. And then you say, "Well, maybe the reason your website isn't ranking anymore is because you got a bad backlink penalty." But I thought you just said that bad backlinks can't hurt you. Both of those things can't be true, okay? If bad backlinks can hurt you and they can, by the way, then A, it is possible to hurt your own website with getting bad backlinks and you should be very knowledgeable about the kind of backlinks you're buying, okay? Or it's not possible for them to hurt you and therefore there is no such thing as an algorithmic penalty based on spammy backlinks. Those things both can't be true. So when somebody says, "Oh, don't worry about the backlinks that you get because Google can tell the difference and the bad ones don't hurt you because if they could hurt you, then people would just make bad backlinks to the competition all day long and penalize your competition." By the way, they do, again, let me just tell you, they do, it's called negative SEO. Now, this brings me to my next point. Negative SEO does not work definitely, but it can work, okay? Let me give you an example. So look, just, okay, a couple things can happen. You can do negative SEO on somebody, okay? And it doesn't work, or you can do negative SEO on somebody and it does work. Those are the two options, okay? There's not like a half penalty. Like, it either works or it doesn't work. It usually doesn't work. That doesn't mean it doesn't work. It means most people don't do it correctly, okay? I'm not going to get into why it would work or not. I'm not teaching negative SEO. Probably should stay away from that, okay? But I want you to know that it's a thing. We've had it happen to a client. I have an episode where I discuss it and episode two at the very end of the episode when we're done talking about penalties. I talk about a client we had that got negative SEO. It works. It's a thing. But anyways, like, it doesn't always work. So if you get like a couple bad backlinks, okay, and nothing happens to your site, that does not suggest that negative SEO doesn't work. It suggests that it didn't work in this specific circumstance. Do you understand the difference? Like, I'm not sure why people think that everything has to be 100% successful or it doesn't, it's not a real thing. Like, that's not how anything works. Look at building backlinks, okay? You might build one good backlink and nothing happens. Does that mean backlinks don't work? Of course not. It means you didn't do enough. Come on, guys. Seriously. Anyway, so negative SEO doesn't always work. It does work. I would say it doesn't usually work, okay? It's a lot of effort. Like, you guys, whatever amount of time you're planning on using to negative SEO your competition, just use that time to boost your own website instead, okay? Just whatever. Anyways, but yes, it's a real thing and it's got a pretty clear pattern if you know what to look for. So it's a thing, but just because it doesn't always work doesn't mean that it doesn't ever work. Think, seriously? Think, okay. Anyways, so you got people that say backlinks don't matter and the Google can tell the difference and you know the good backlinks and the bad backlinks won't hurt you. Wrong. They do hurt you. It's called negative SEO. But anyways, okay, then people will respond to you by telling you maybe you got penalized because you got your spamming backlinks. Bro, make up your mind. It can't be both of those. Anyway, let's talk about another topic that's very similar to this. There's a lot of posts on Reddit where people will say, guys, I can't figure out why I'm not ranking and blah, blah, blah, they'll list all the things that they did, okay? And I don't mean to like disparage anybody by saying blah, blah, blah. I'm not saying it's not important. I'm just saying for the purpose of this episode, it's not important. And then they'll get to the end of their post and they'll say, and I'm not using AI content. Okay. So, first things first, there are people who think that AI content will somehow negatively affect your results in the SERPs. By the way, SERPs, if you're just joining us, S-E-R-P search engine result pages, it means what position are you in? It means what place are you in in the results? Are you number three? Are you number two? Where are you? That's all it means. Anyway, there are people that think that AI content will have a hurtful effect on your SERPs. There's literally no basis for that, but we might come back to that later. Anyways, so I can't figure out why I'm not ranking. I'm not using AI content. Okay. Then in the responses to that question, you will see people say things like, "Oh yes, it's good that you don't use AI content. You should only use handwritten content that is helpful for the user and then wait for it because they will always say because the search engine is like good content and it will make you rank better." Well, hopefully those of you guys who have, you know, been fans of grumpy SEO guy for a long time understand that that's not how search engine optimization works, but that is a different topic for a different episode. Anyway, then you will see comments like, "Well, content is king." Okay, that's cool. So hold on for a second though, just give me a moment here. First of all, you're saying don't use AI because there's some problem with it. I'm not really sure what the problem is, but whatever. Then you're saying content is king. Okay, that's cool. So the conclusion from those two comments is that AI content is somehow not good quality. Now, I'm the first person to admit that if chat GPT wrote something, for example, you can usually tell that chat GPT wrote it, okay? Like, I'm not sure how I can tell, but I can tell because, and by the way, I'm not the only one. There are a lot of people, although I haven't seen this happen as frequently anymore, which is good. People will post questions in the SEO subreddit and then there will be these long chat GPT replies. Like, somebody literally asked the question to chat GPT and then pasted the response in as a reply. But the thing is, people immediately identify it and say, like, "Thank you, chat GPT," or something along those lines, and then downvote it as they should because the answers are usually not helpful, okay? So I'm not the only one who can tell when chat GPT wrote something, but that doesn't mean it's not good, like, content or bad content. So let's take a step back here, because by saying, "Don't use AI," and then by saying, "Content is king," you are implying that, first of all, you're wrongly implying that content ranks because of how good or bad it is, which is wrong, okay? But then you're also implying that AI content cannot possibly be good quality content, good enough quality content to rank, which mistakenly assumes, again, that the quality of your content is what is determining whether or not you rank. So here's a question, if content was king, which it's not, but if content was king, why couldn't AI content be king? Why not? What if, okay, let's remember, the content is king crew, thinks that content ranks because of how correct or right or useful or helpful or whatever, whatever they think, whatever it is, right? Are you saying AI content cannot be correct? Not sure, let's be honest, it's wrong a lot of the time, but are you saying it can't be correct? I thought content was king. Are you telling me that if AI content was good enough, I'm airquoting when I say that, good enough, okay? That it was good, let's just say it was good enough, whatever that means, okay, that it wouldn't rank, and you say no, because you're written by AI. But it's good, and you just said content was king, so which is it? Those things can't both be true. Anyway, the whole point is that when somebody is talking SEO, you really need to listen to what they're saying and ask yourself, does this even make sense? Does this make sense? Look, a lot of people disagree with what I teach and what I say on this podcast. They strongly disagree with me that content is not king, okay, by the way, they're wrong. They strongly disagree, the backlinks matter, again, by the way, they're wrong. They strongly disagree, oh, here's another one, they strongly disagree. I can tell it's by how many downvotes I get when I post on Reddit. They strongly disagree with me that SEO is only about ranking a website and has nothing to do with conversion optimization. By the way, there's an episode on that that will be released in the future. And by the way, they're wrong on that too, because search engine optimization is about ranking a website, it's not about increasing conversions once they get to the website. You want to know why? Those have different names, it's because they're different things. Anyway, there are people who think SEO involves content creation, which it doesn't, web design, which it doesn't, user experience, which it doesn't, and conversion optimization, which it doesn't. All of those things have different names because they're different things, okay? And I'm not saying, by the way, that things with different names can't be the same, but I'm saying for these, they're not, they're all different, okay? Anyways, but there's a lot of people that disagree with me, and it's usually people that are trying to sell something like the people that passionately disagree with me that content is not king or content writers. And when I tell people content is not king, those people can no longer lie to prospects and say, well, the search engines love good content. And let me tell you, if you have good content, you will rank better, and guess what? We are the only ones who can write you that kind of content. Sometimes they don't overtly say this, but if you hire us, you will rank better, since the content will be so good, right? It's all a lie, okay? So when people learn that, those people make fewer sales, and when they make fewer sales, they get unhappy with you. But when you expose the lie that content is king, they're not going to make as many sales. And then they're going to downvote you, because they don't want people to know that content is not king. And by the way, I know I kind of sound like a conspiracy theorist right now, but this isn't a conspiracy theory. This is just, this is how SEO works, and this is how like, I don't want to say business, because this isn't really like business. Like some, like, some charlatan on a forum trying to make money by lying to people and telling them that they can write content, and that content is the reason they will rank, that's not business, that's just being a snake oil salesman, okay? But it's the same thing, but I do, I fully admit that this sounds a little bit tin foil-haddy, like, and they don't want you to know, like, whatever. But like honestly, content writers who tell you that content is the reason you rank do not want anyone to know that content is not the reason you rank, because it makes them lose business. So of course they're going to downvote me anyways. It's the same, it's the same with people who think that conversion optimization is SEO, because it's not. That's from SEO salesmen, okay, who are trying to also sell to their clients conversion optimization services, or, or who are trying to lie to their customers and tell them that their special SEO techniques will somehow increase conversions. Wrong, that's not how it works, there's a whole like calculation to determine how this works, and it's not what you just said. So nice try, but anyway, that's why they downvote you, because you're making, you're making us look bad. No bro, you're making yourself look bad by misleading your clients, okay? Anyway, but the coolest thing about all of this is that Grumpy SEO guy is a free podcast, so it's not like I'm charging people to learn correct SEO. And on that note, I have so many, by the way, I just want to say thank you to everybody who emails me, and thank you to everybody who messages me on Reddit, and thank you to everybody who is a subscriber to my Patreon, because I literally have messages in my inbox telling me that my free podcast has taught them more than courses they have spent thousands of dollars on, which is unsurprising to me, because many SEO educators have never actually done SEO, and I have an episode about that. So you can go back and listen if you want to learn more about that, but I'm so grateful to be getting these kinds of letters from people, because it's awesome, and I'm very happy to know that people appreciate the podcast, and I'm very happy to know that people appreciate learning how SEO works, and I'm very happy to be contributing to a community that I actually have experience with, and I didn't just take some course or read some book and rewrite everything and try to package it up as some $1000 content is King Garbage. So anyways, truthfully, I want to say I'm very, very thankful to everybody that has written me and told me that they enjoy the podcast, because I actually feel very content knowing that I'm making a difference in your SEO journey. So it's appreciated. Let me tell you. Anyways, I forgot what I was talking about. I forgot what I was talking about. This is a point where normally I would pause the recording and think for a second, what was the last thing I said? I got to get back on topic, but I'm not going to. I'm just going to keep thinking about it out loud. So I was going to say, I have a lot of people that think that what I say is wrong, or more importantly, they are worried that I'm going to eat away at their market share by exposing the truth. But here's the thing. The stuff that I say is, this is just my thinking. I might be wrong, but it's consistent. I don't say in one hand, "Oh, do this and this and this other thing," and then turn around and tell you to do something completely contradictory. I would never say, "Oh, backlinks don't matter," and then say, "Well, maybe you got a backlink penalty." Those are opposites. They can't both be true. I would never say, "Oh, never use AI content." And then tell somebody that the quality of content matters. It literally doesn't make any sense to say that. So, whatever, I'm not even sure, but think. And I really hope that what I tell you makes sense, and it is consistent alongside all the other stuff that I tell you. And I think it is because some of the episodes, we've gone pretty specifically into how the algorithms and stuff work. I would like to think that it's all consistent because it has to be consistent to make sense. Look, I feel like fans of Grumpy SEO Guy are smart, and I feel like if I were to contradict myself, somebody, I know somebody would call me out on it. They'd be like, "Grumpy SEO guy, you said this thing, and then you said this other thing, and one of those things has to be wrong." And by the way, if I do ever contradict myself, please do that, and please let me know, because maybe I misspoke, or maybe I didn't explain something correctly. But, I don't know, the closest that anybody has come to that was some person on Reddit said that I said once the number of backlinks matter. And I literally have never said that. In fact, I have said the opposite, the number does not matter. In fact, I have an episode called Stop Focusing on Number of Backlinks, and as far as I know, the only thing I've ever said is that quality matters, not number, or quantity, depending on how you want to look at it. But anyway, I'm not sure. I feel like that person maybe misunderstood the concepts, which makes perfect sense. Look, if you are one of the people who reads normal SEO stuff, and you hear that content is king, and backlinks don't matter, and AI is bad, and EAT, and things that don't matter, but everybody thinks actually do matter, right? Like, all of that kind of stuff. And then you hear me start talking about backlinks. You might just naturally figure, oh, well, it must be about number, because more is better, right? More of stuff is cooler than less of stuff, so more backlinks is probably better. Okay, I get it, ChromePSCO guys said backlinks are important, I need more backlinks. You need more backlinks to rank better. No, I never said that, but it's understandable. So anyway, again, people that like ChromePSCO guy are smart, and I can tell that, I actually think that I mentioned this in another episode, but I can tell from the emails and stuff that I get. Like, I can literally tell that, like, the people are smart, because of how they phrase the emails and the questions, and I can tell that they're thinking, and they're not just like, oh, he says this, he says that, blah, blah, blah. I don't know what that voice was, but honestly, like, anyway, I got smart listeners, so if I ever contradict myself, I feel like somebody would have pointed it out. Anyways, here's my point. When you're studying anything, or SEO, or whatever, always be aware of things that somebody says that don't make sense, okay? If somebody says, you know, let's use the first example again, if somebody says, oh, bad backlinks don't matter, they're not going to hurt you, and then they turn around and tell you that, oh, you might have a penalty because of your backlinks. No, nothing could possibly work that way. Either they do matter and don't get bad backlinks, or they don't matter, and then you don't have a penalty because you just said the backlinks don't matter. Like, literally, literally, like, choose a side and just whatever. Anyway, I feel like my listeners already comprehend this concept, but I just wanted to put that out there to let you know that if you have been finding this kind of stuff in the SEO forum, you're right. You're right. You're not crazy, but it is actually happening, and that is part of why the SEO industry is so perplexing. Thanks for listening. Don't forget to subscribe. And if you enjoyed this podcast, please leave a review. It would really help the show out. I hope this episode was helpful. If you have any questions or want to suggest a subject for a future episode, you can contact me on Reddit. My username is grumpyscoguy. You can visit the grumpyscoguy subreddit, or you can email me at hello@grumpyscoguy.com. If you email me, please either whitelist my email address or check your junk folders because I've been told that my replies are going into the junk folder, and it's probably because we're talking about things like SEO and backlinks, and I think those words will classify an email as spam. And if you want to support the podcast because it's the best source of SEO information on the planet and it's free, you can do so at patreon.com/grumpyscoguy. And I will talk to you later. You're listening to Grumpy SEO Guy, the SEO podcast that doesn't waste your time with nonsense that doesn't work. Join us next Wednesday when we talk about how to build a private blog network, Part 4, answers to the questions from the Reddit thread. 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