Bret welcomes on longtime Atlanta Braves pitching coach Leo Mazzone as he shares many stories about his days coaching the legendary trio of Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine and John Smoltz.
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Plenty of seating options from cozy daybeds to private temperature controlled cabanas stadium swim book your spot today at circa Las Vegas dot com today's episode is sponsored by nerd wallet smart money podcast ready to expand your financial game nerd wallet can coach you on smart strategies like choosing investments finding your next credit card and setting a budget that works for you score major points towards your summer vacation by learning expert tips for choosing a high yield savings account and how to build wealth by investing in index funds slide into summer with smarter decisions in 2024 follow nerd wallet smart money podcast on your favorite podcast app future you will thank you podcast is hashtag boom approved it's time for another edition of the Brett blown podcast ever made you almost with the blows loose and me down three times too so I know what you're talking about your host MLB All-Star Brett bull bottom line is you will become a successful major league hitter by hitting pitchers mistakes as he sits down with his sports entertainment friends from around the world you are not going to be a successful major league hitter if you hit pitchers pitch this isn't just any former jocks podcast to change outcome you gotta change the income you gotta change what goes in and that changes what goes out often duplicated but never replicated just like his back flip okay now the party starts the responsibility starts now now in its fourth year this is the one and only Brett Boone podcast welcome to the Brett Boone podcast I'm Brett Boone and recently I went back to Atlanta we had a lot an alumni gathering my first one with the Braves I got to catch up with today's guests Leo I'm gonna I'm gonna introduce you this way one of the greatest pitching coaches of all time welcome Leo Mazzoni to the program Leo thanks for coming on well thank you booty I'd be glad to to help you out anyway I can just like the pitchers help me out you know and I but that's part of it and and I love this because the fans are gonna get a little bit of view of Leo I know some of the questions I'm gonna ask you today Leo I already know these answers because in the 99 season I played my one only season for the Braves we got to go to World Series got whooped by the Yankees but my my seat everywhere I went in my career I had a seat and my seat in Atlanta was right next to Leo so we had a lot of conversations a lot of venting during the game him yelling to me about the pitchers be yelling at him about I couldn't get me hit so we had a lot of fun time it was pretty cool this Braves alumni we just had it was my first one I know you've been to to some in the past but I thought they did a really great job the big list and a lot of guys I hadn't seen it a while yeah I think that Greg McMichael's done a great job with it without Mac I don't think you'd have all this activity going on with the Braves alumni it's been going on for quite some time now and it's been great we've had we have a blast and of course next year is going to be special because it'd be the 30th anniversary of the 95 World Championship team and so that'll be something special but every year there's a theme that makes it special and we had a great turnout I mean I hadn't seen you in quite some time so it was great to see you and great to see some of the guys again and have a few beverages and shoot the ball yeah 95 I don't like 95 Leo 95 you beat us you beat us to go to the world series and I didn't like that and you beat us quick to fork fork quick I'll tell you real funny though booney that you know the writers in Cincinnati came to me we're getting ready to play you guys and actually we were kind of the underdog because of your team speed so the writers used to come to me and say Leo what are you doing to counter act Cincinnati's team speed eyes are you doing anything as far as timing plays or backdoor pick-offs or this or that they would over about five or six different things and I said no to every one of them they said what are you doing I said we're down in the bullpen working on our pitches they said what about their running game I said if they don't get on and we make sure there is no running game that's true that is true and yeah it was it was that was ugly because we we were good we were really good and Cincinnati 94 95 obviously 94 was the strike season but 95 and we knew it was gonna be tough but we didn't know it was gonna be we didn't know it was gonna be a sweep but it ended up happening I just finished watching doggies documentary for you guys doggy that's Greg Maddox it just came out on MLB network Leo was a prevalent part of it finished it last night I watched the first half and I had to call Greg and I called him and he answered boom what do you do and I said I'm watching Maddox on on this special on MLB network ago what do you think you know how Greg would say but I got to catch up with him a little bit I thought it was well done were you happy with the finished product I thought I think all these documentaries are great but I thought they cast obviously you were a big part of Greg's at least 10 years in in Atlanta all the all the big players were there it was glad it was small see I thought it was really cool having the bonds interaction and I love the Randy Johnson coming in for for his two cents well I thought it was outstanding and and you know what to be in the dugout with him for 10 years was just one of the greatest things I ever got to witness I can't remember Boonie I can't remember him having a bad game you know I'm sure he might have had one or two mixed in but I can't remember him having a bad game and the conversations that you would have with him was pretty much an exchange of ideas for example when we got him over from the Cubs I told he I told him to give me every one of his checkpoints that he uses mechanically and then he says will you tell me how you guys you know stay healthy all year and get to the World Series I say well between the both of us I think we can figure that out so and then you know some of the he's the only pitcher that I was around that would get a guy out in the first or second ending and he'd get the dugouts sitting next to me and say Leo he when he comes up in the seventh and the game's on the line he has no chance and I'm sitting there going really well I get you know he set him up early in the game for later I mean every once in a while he'd you know I opposite the you know back we'll hit a little I think back off of him one time he went in on him he never got he never got inside the back well but he's not gonna see that pitch again so things like this that you sat there and went man oh man you know or but I'll tell you funny story Boney and then in 95 he got off to a 4-0 start and we're getting ready to go down the bullpen he's playing the Mets he says Leo he said you never been out to the mound this year since I've been pitching and I said what do you want me to do make something up I said you're pitching great our practice sessions are great you feel good physically mentally I said no reason for me to visit he goes well you know it gets kind of lonely out there he said I'm gonna look in the sixth inning tonight he says and when I look in going out and you visit no one you know maybe he came maybe something could happen that he might not go six but I certainly hope not and what is extending he got a shutout going and he gets the first down he looks into the got any staring at me and Bobby goes Leo get your foot out there and make sure he's okay he's looking for you so I go out to the mound and I'm out there and I said well here I am that's what you want me to pay you a visit he goes I'm glad you come out he goes what I look like from in there I said well you got a three-hit shutout going you look great and he goes well I'm glad you came out because I don't want to talk to Chipper he said I'm sure as heck don't want to talk to the umpire he said in the catch or don't speak English he said I'm glad you came out I'm telling you to that story no I 100% I lived with him for a year so I know that's just how Greg is and when you're his opponent he kind of has a mystery to him but then when I came over for the one year he was my locker mate that sounds exactly how Greg is in you know I think it was well documented in in this in this hour and a half long special he was as loose and as funny and I mean he's got that dry sense of humor as could be but when when he was pitching he was he was as fierce as anybody out there and he really was and he had that that goofy personality that you know I remember Leo I'd go into the shower I go Maddox you not wearing shower shoes although it he said Boney why do I have to wear them the rest of you are you know that's typical Greg and that's how we would that's that's how we was but yeah we're gonna get to that and and what it's like being on that on that Braves team and and in the 90s playing against you it's it's fascinating to me I learned a lot and and I think you know I always used to say we're in Seattle and and I sit there and I always used to think how stupid pitchers where I said you're so dumb just because I you hang a break-and-ball and I hit it in the seats that doesn't mean to abandon the break-and-ball but nine out of ten guys would not that staff they were they were thinking at the highest level they were thinking you know where I always used to think I could outsmart you well you couldn't outsmart that staff and we'll get into it as this goes on but it was fascinating to me now I was thinking we used to base our attack not on who we were facing but your own pitchers strength so basically you know you've been in a lot of those meetings where you say you can't throw this guy this can't we never use those types of terms as you remember we just based it on our pitchers of how they want to attack hitters and then I would also add what I'd even make a few things up adding to their what their strength was to give them at least a bunch more confidence than they had to get somebody out. Fourteenth straight division championship that's that's unbelievable you won the 1995 World Series were you the greatest pitching did they make you the greatest pitching coach of all time or you as their pitching coach make them the greatest arguably the greatest staff of all time. I think they made me the greatest pitching coach of all time there's no question about that because here's the one thing that I was so proud of we only had only had one goal for our pitching staff and we always used to say go to the post what it's your turn and the rest will take care of itself and they did that better than anybody in the history of baseball and we based all our pitching philosophies on number one owning the down-and-away strike and number two was learning how to control your effort and throw more often with less exertion so that in other words you know Maddox and Glavin averaged out about 88 but they could have thrown 92 if they wanted to but that they weren't as accurate at 92s they were at 88 so then therefore Boonie when you look at that guys our guys had something left in the tank by the time they got to the seventh inning and they needed a little extra they still had it in the tank and here was the genius of Bobby Cox and not too many baseball people know this Boonie not many at all maybe most of them still don't Bobby Cox had what you called a max out inning then what it what was a max out any well he and I always talked about is the pitch you're going to max out his effort in this particular inning when I'd say yeah Bobby I think he's gonna max out he'd go well we'll have somebody ready because pitch count doesn't matter doesn't matter they were if he would say Leo is he gonna max out this inning and I'd say no he's still on cruise he's still it is 90% he's smooth strong he goes okay then we're not taking him out and pitch count don't matter so we based all our moves like that on on the amount of effort somebody's putting on a pitch from pitch one all the way to the seventh eighth or ninth inning depending on how far they were gonna go and and these are the interesting things I'd like to hear from from guys like you that that this was your life this was your livelihood I've talked it you know I watched the modern game it drives me crazy the layman in me just thinks okay you know I think because they're throwing harder now without a doubt bullpen's have been a pre have been prevalent the power bullpen is is the game in 2024 max effort but I see more injuries than I've ever seen I was going through it I was thinking about it last night go preparing for for our our show today and I remember you know going to Atlanta I'm like you know for for my tenure with the Cincinnati Reds for five years in the 90s it seemed like every time I played Atlanta or Atlanta came to Cincinnati nobody was ever hurt I never missed Maddox Moltz and Glavitt they were never hurt it seems like today everybody's hurt all the time everybody's on the IL at least 10 days at least 15 days every single season of Tommy John's at an all-time high I've talked to doctors Leo I've talked to ex teammates ex pitchers trainers they all have their thoughts on why the injuries I want it from Leo Mizoni what are the data guys that that are in charge a lot today what are they getting it what are they getting wrong about how they're going about preparing for a big league season what they definitely got wrong is starting with the term that I didn't care about called Vilo and this starts it's this starts now for young kids and traveling all-star baseball it starts now with everybody concerned about how hard somebody can throw and everybody these kid these teenagers are being told we're from 12 years on on up well if you don't throw hit a certain number on this radar gun you're not going to make a club and what does the young kid try to do he tries to do that so in other words our healthy staffs listen booty 537 starts their own you miss one start you know we're doing something right well anyway what they do now is less often you throw less often with the most exertion you can possibly have and that starts when you're a teenager and by the time these kids graduate and got into pro ball or college there's a real good chance they're gonna blow because the whole emphasis is on how hard you can throw now in other words it's good that you can throw that but here's the key say for example that I had that guy from the pirates that can throw 101 miles an hour whatever it is you know what I would what I would try to do with him is see if he could trust a 90 to 95 percent effort on the pitch and instead of throwing 101 locate 95 and that's basically was that what was the thinking behind it when you saw a guy like Jarrett Wright turn his career around with us he could throw hard as anybody but he he learned how to command 91 instead of blowing 95 on every pitch but these are just examples but this is what the kids here if I hear a youngster come to me the first thing is coach your parents say is well he's up to so-and-so on the gun I really don't care I really don't care I want to see if he's cut has a nice release on his fastball I want to see him have a quiet delivery nothing going crazy flying out all over the place spinning out on your follow through on a follow through now they teach him to stop themselves and like for example if you see a right-handed pitcher throw a pitch to the to the hitter his his his right leg spins out toward the first baseline because they're saying you could throw harder if you do that yet you raise the risk of arm injury because you're almost throwing into a recoil position or stopping yourself all these things they're trying to create power from the second base bag as opposed to creating power from the top to the finish instead of creating it way behind you why it's all about how hard you can throw not how you could pitch all about how hard you can throw and the spin rates you know now guys are trying to get as much spin on the balls they could we knew that stuff booney Johnny same was a great pitching coach and he had a spinner with him all the time and he had me back there studying all the different spins on fastballs two seamers four seamers sliders curves all these types of things the one the thing that taught me the most about spin was if you stood behind that pitcher and I'm sure you've seen this million times from from second base a picture throw fastball and it cut and I would ask you might say did you cut that on purpose no so how well come it cut I don't know I said well we got to find out because if it's only doing it on purpose or when you don't know it is it could cut into the nitro zone I said so we got to know you got to know the spins on those pitches whether it's a cut spin back spin over the top spin etc you've got to know these things and be consistent with your pitches if you don't know when a ball is gonna cut you're only gonna be 50/50 so those are all the things that we studied and all the things that we put together so that we could pitch and I'll never forget Maddox said it best one time and when he said he said Leo you mind if I talk to the young pitchers in spring training as before we send everybody down and I said sure go ahead so we going out to the bullpen and I said hold on a minute guys before we break for our stations I said Matt Dogg has something he wants to say and Smolsey goes oh this ought to be good and I said no no no he's serious he wasn't serious yeah he's gets him all together he goes you know why I'm a millionaire they went why he goes because I can throw a fastball where I want to he says you know why I got beachfront property in LA he says because I can change speeds thanks Leo and that was it and I got him all together and I said what did he just tell you there's nothing more to pitching than fastball command and changing speeds complimenting the command your fastball and the reason why booney that we we our philosophy was to own the down in a way strike it was because that would allow us to pitch inside when we wanted to not not and do it selectively and and you know and do it when you want to not just because some chart says you got to get this guy out in you know and then so we made it like you know if we had a base of a right hander honest in out down in a way and a lefty to lefty the same thing when it when it turned into opposite armed a bat then we went inside a little more you know you had to you know you had to do that we understand that but I never forget that one guy said another pitching coach is how do you teach pitching inside Leo we can't get these guys to do it and I said we if we teach him to own it down in a way strike he said what about inside I said if you own that you can go in no sweat I don't know how many times guys would jump out of the way of laughing and that fastball be down the middle it was brilliant because in that time the Braves were the only one and and and I used to go you know we used to talk about it as hitters and go they don't pitch in it was a surprise once in a great while glad would be that change up away fastball way change up change up maybe once in a while break you off a curve ball and then when you least expect it he'd freeze you in with that backdoor to seemer but it was very rare it might have been a big situation in the game or runner on third less than two outs and he wanted to show you something he hadn't shown you maybe in your last 10 at bats against him but yeah it was that was what was fascinating about you you talk about less what the guy that comes to mind in in our generation that went from a big-time power pitcher and started taking out less sometimes is more less gets it off the barrel if you're 94 95 and in a 2-0 counter a 3-run count you give him an 89 or 90 that'll get it off the barrel when I'm looking for 95 less is more Bartolo Cologne comes to mind for me he was a 98 guy he had 99 in there but when he started being a real pitcher and winning a Cy Young he was a 92 he started to pitch like Maddox he started to own that two-seamer started off the plate away bring it back for a strike and and it was off to the races for him he became a different pitcher because as that guy that threw 96 97 I loved him I used to say that's a softest 97 I've ever the lightest 97 I've ever faced because you squared up I mean it would it would just explode but when he started pitching he became really tough I love the philosophy the honest in out down in a way and I heard that over and over as an opponent I used to come to Atlanta and this is what made you guys different I knew exactly what Greg was gonna do to me I knew exactly what Smoltz he was gonna do to me I knew exactly exactly what Tommy was gonna do and it didn't matter I face any other great pitcher and who knows you know I might face Pedro one time and he might go heater heater slider slider next time I might face him he might throw me five change-ups in a row I didn't know what I was gonna get the fact that I knew what I was gonna get from your big three and still really didn't have a big counterpunch is what to use to drive me crazy I know situation do what's dog you gonna do he's gonna throw me two seamers off the plate away I was gonna give up on it because you give your eyesight says that's a ball and now it's a strike and I saw it in front of my eye just come back over there and I said I'm so sick of this and I'm going man I'm committing to that fastball way and you give up on it and it would and then you know big situation he might mix in a change-up he might throw you two seamers on your on your hands clap I know what he's gonna do he's gonna throw me two seamers away he's gonna float that change-up a special change-up by the way that seemed to never get they're kind of the left-handed Trevor Hoffman and then you had Smolte who is the prototypical power pitcher over the top he's gonna throw four seamers on the outside corner then he's gonna throw you what looks to be a four-seamer on the outside corner but it just happens to be a slider and break it off the plate and you can't pick up either one and man it used to all three of them used to give me nightmares glad second greatest left-handed pitcher ever faced I got to give Randy the number one Maddox or or Smolte many gave me fits didn't ever do much took him deep one time and I let him know every time I talk to him but that was the rest of it it was him getting me out and I think I saw this in the documentary I think you alluded to it Greg is simply you know I walk around and people ask me about the greatest players of all time my answer is Maddox Moltz glavin when it comes to pitching Barry Bonds is the greatest hitter I've ever seen no one's even close but when it pushcoats the shove overall body of work night in night out start after start after start I have to say Greg Maddox is the greatest pitcher I've I've ever played with and played against take your business further with a smart and flexible American Express business gold card it offers flexible spending capacity that adapts to your business you can also earn up to three hundred and ninety five dollars in annual statement credits on eligible purchases at select business merchants that's the powerful backing of American Express terms apply learn more at American Express comm slash business gold card hey fantasy football owners the road to winning your fantasy football championships starts now I'm Matt Harmon from reception perception join me and James co as we take a deep dive into the position that's gonna make or break your fantasy roster wide receivers we analyze we're out running target share and all the metrics that matter giving you the insights you need to draft the best wide receivers as you prep for your draft let us give you the coverage you need follow and listen to reception perception on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts hey it's Rob Bradford with zombie technologies the world's hottest cloud storage provider recently asked themselves what good is storing data if you can't access what you need when you need it their answer was Sabi air is the first intelligent cloud storage with built-in AI auto tagging capabilities now everything you store with wasabi every game ever played every movie ever produced can be searched through quickly and easily go to wasabi dot com to see how wasabi air can breathe new life into your content well that that means a lot coming from coming from you and players like you that most of them said the same thing and but you know they always try to get better no much how much success they've had they try to get better for example you know small to the early in his career was where he couldn't be afraid of throwing a change up because his breaking stuff was so good and he had no confidence in a change up so I thought you know his delivery is just perfect for a split so I thought I'm gonna go okay I'm gonna I'm gonna get him down to bullpen and we're gonna give him another weapon against left-handed hitters but before I did that bony we had a guy named Bruce Souter living in Atlanta and I called Bruce and I said can you meet me for lunch before I go to the ballpark he said sure I said I need to I need your help he goes okay Leo so I bring him over to the to the area we were gonna have a lunch with it's called Stooges and I'll never forget it and so Bruce give me all your information on the split because I'm going to go show Smoltey I'm gonna try to add that pitch to him and he's more than willing to do it I said so give me all your information he gave me all my information for the split that I needed I showed it to Smoltey here he comes now he's got fastball break in ball split well the split made him just eat up left-handed hitters the other thing was though then he started incorporating it to right-handed hitters this was Lee's we're all later on in in their career now the split for Smoltey was early in his career using it against righties was a little bit later in his career Tom Glavin we found out one time bony we were playing against the Astros the killer bees great great ball club great players and he made a location mistake to Bagwell he threw him an inside change up and Bagwell about fell on his face trying to hit it and and he come in he goes Leo do you see that I said yeah I saw that I said he made it you made him look sick he said it was a mistake location mistake he said I threw him an inside change up I said yeah I said I'll like it and he goes I think I should throw some more of those I said why not well Maddox here's our conversation right Maddox goes hey Tommy he goes yeah he goes if they hit that pitch it's only gonna go foul which reinforced what I what I said yeah go ahead when in the next inning he's throwing inside change-ups to the the killer bees and Bobby comes over next to me and goes hey Leo he said that last pitch Tommy threw a change up and I said yeah he said was hobby sitting up inside I said yeah he goes what do we do when he said that kind of dangerous I said glavin said he can't hit that pitch Bobby goes okay let him roll me you can't be scared booty you got it you got a roll with it you know you can't be afraid if you're coaching in the big leagues you can't be afraid to coach all your good players your great players every day players Bobby Cox our staff they they loved all of us because we weren't afraid to coach we also weren't afraid to tell them the truth great players like you and Larkin and the pitchers at all they don't want to hear some eye wash or all this phony side you know they want you to be honest yet supportive and that's what we did better than anybody besides having great the guys having great talent it's not what you want to hear cuz sometimes you got to hear what you don't want to hear but then a respect a mutual respect in a bond is created that man if I go to Leo he ain't gonna he ain't gonna bullshit me he'll tell me whether it is hey maybe I don't want to hear it maybe I'm thinking I know what he's gonna say and he's just gonna come on top and just confirm my thoughts but that that creates a great working environment and that the thing about being an opponent of the Braves it's man I knew I had to think with them because they were thinking and I alluded to the fact that hey if I hit a slider in the bleachers I can eliminate nine times out of ten that pitcher throwing me another slider makes my job easier that that's all I try to do especially the second half of my career is if I wanted to eliminate a pitch from my from the pitcher if I could take a just a basic four seam well located fastball away and shoot it through the hole on the right side and I got that look from the pitcher like wow that was a good pitch now I've just I pretty much said he's not going away again he's either coming in or he's gonna try to trick me with something it becomes it becomes predictable not with the Braves not with the brave not with the Pedro Martinez he wouldn't not with the David Wells David Wells I got a quick story for you yeah I used to hit David pretty good and one day I took him deep I think it was in Seattle dead center on a fastball I came up my next at bat and I'm going he ain't gonna throw that again he threw me four in a row and I struck out and he's looking at me laughing because he knew that's what I was looking for the key to pitching is know who's looking for certain pitches identify them and you got to start thinking with him now there's certain guys out there that just see ball hit ball and and you don't have to think with him but I used to look at the pitch my pitchers in Seattle used to turn to me I'd say listen you talk about the killer bees they would sit on pitches and I'd say I'm telling you we had Jeff Nelson and and Arthur Rhodes in the bullpen and they used to ask me booty what's Beazio look for back said well I'm telling you they look for pitches like I do so if you're ever confused late just turn to me and I'll tell you you know because I knew a certain time Beazio sitting on your neck and if you hang him that slider he's gonna hit a double down the left field line right now with the bases loaded so throw him anything but that but it's the game inside the game it these guys are you know if you play with them you play against them you know how they were always interacting always talking and they were probably the three smartest guys from a pitching perspective I've ever been around and and they all did it differently they were all legitimate number ones you never wanted to face it and I've told you this story in the in the 90s you know we didn't have the cell phones by the way for these are you watching the Brett Boom podcast today I found out Leo Mazone still doesn't have a legitimate cell phone he's got a flip phone his wife Rebecca was nice enough to help us out today with with getting on the fees but we didn't have cell phones back then and we hit you know you go on the road you had the USA today and I was always under your door and you'd pick it up and I'm telling you two weeks in advance when I was coming to Atlanta or you were coming to us you know I'm a Cincinnati Red I go all right let's see where these Maddox Smolts and clavant clowns are pitching and I start counting the days down I'm like all right glad pitched on Tuesday Thursday Thursday Friday okay he's back on Saturday okay he's off Sunday and I'm telling it every time you know I have like one eye shut looking like okay and we get to Atlanta Friday now Maddox Smolts clavant every time now mentally I'm starting to think about it two weeks in advance and I always tease T's Kent Merker who is a great pitcher in his own right I played with Merck I said Merck no disrespect you've had a lot of success but if it comes down to Maddox Smolts clavant or Merker I want Merker all day long and he completely understood that but I think it wasn't just me that that did that with the USA today I think during that 90s run it was pretty pretty prevalent amongst hitters in the league right well you know Boonie on the opposite side with our guys you know they would all come to me and say one of my opinion we never changed in other words we didn't adjust no rotation in other words if that well we go to you go to you're gonna save this guy for Cincinnati instead of you know Colorado whatever the team was it wasn't I said Bobby go save him for what we got to win each game that we play you know but here's the thing spring training we're getting ready to break camp and Maddox about too many says hey Leo he said if I don't pitch opening days it's okay I've been there done that so don't worry about it I said okay glavant comes by and he goes hey Leo if I don't pitch opening day he goes don't worry about it he goes been there done that Smolts he goes hey Leo I don't pitch opening day no big deal so you guys choose who you want I'm going okay there's something going on with all this stuff you know here I find out that they checked their schedule in advance all the way two months down the road and said and they knew that if they didn't pitch opening day they missed pitching in Colorado and now they're telling it wouldn't pitch open day because they knew that if they didn't pitch opening day they missed Colorado but if they fish up they didn't pitch in Colorado yeah that was before and that was before the humidor and you didn't want to pitch there people how people think the Colorado thing is oh well the air so light so the ball flies and a lot of home runs which is true but that's not the true advantage for us as hitters in Colorado it was the the vastness of the outfield and how big it was in all our little cheap hits they'd all fall in in Colorado the the the outfielders played deep yeah if you get the ball up in Colorado it never comes down try hitting a wedge there you know you hit your wedge 135 in Colorado you hit a 160 so imagine how a baseball goes so I can completely understand that as far as that okay honest and out down in a way I've heard it a million times I've referred to it on this show a couple times already why didn't why were you guys the only team that really stuck to that like I said I don't remember anybody else we knew your philosophy we knew what you guys were gonna do and it's like it was really tough to have a counter punch to that why we're we're other organizations other team why didn't they use that philosophy because they weren't very smart be perfectly honest with you I mean even the throwing programs that we used where everybody made their starts and they had asked you ask us how how we did it you know just wasn't three guys you had a whole starting rotation and I think this the 98 rotation was called the greatest of all time because your number four starter was Kevin Millwood and your number five starter was Denny Nagle behind the big three and so you know they all went to the post they all start because we we were on the mound practicing our craft a lot you know this flat footed throwing and all this BS look you make your living at 60 feet six inches going downhill to a catcher and so when we were when I was coming up you know baseball some of was in a four-man rotation and when I pitched into minor leagues I love pitching in a four-man rotation but then the baseball world went to a five and they want to give that starting pitcher next today and I felt that was too much rest so I went ahead and did it on my own I didn't ask nobody didn't tell nobody about the guys throwing twice in between well in the minor leagues they all loved it and guess what nobody got hurt the minors either and so when you get to the big leagues as a pitching coach then you had to have a staffs that didn't break down if your staffs in the minors broke down you had no chance to get to the big leagues it wasn't any of this other stuff and so we did it it worked I used it the big leagues for my entire career and it worked based on throwing more often with less exertion so I had a pitching coach tell me goes you know what he said if you throw I said why would you have him throwing flat footed in the outfield there their extra day of throwing as opposed to if they're going to throw why not throw them off the mound he said they'll have a tendency to throw too hard I said well that's what they held they pay you for is to regulate the effort so that's what we did we read that's what we did and then if you had you we had a program for our relievers bony because I was I was looking around and I was thinking how many times does a pitching coach ever get to work with the relief pitcher pretty much not hardly at all they're usually you know they might they might pitch that night okay I gotcha well I thought you know what if you have 11 guys on the staff number 11 guys should get the same amount of attention as number one and how do you do that well you do that by making sure you communicate with him and have conversations with him and if he hasn't warmed up or been in the game for two days in a row I would ask a reliever to come down I said you want to come down a bullpen and give me a little bit of five minute and do a little spin session little feel in touch you know go down the mound get a feel for the mound it's that they go well Leo we love to I said now remember you're preparing for tonight's game it's okay well I had in the front office executive come down and say hey Steve Bedrosian was a one of one of one of our relievers in the 90s and he said he hadn't pitched in six or seven days then you know bedrock I mean I think he's the greatest one of the greatest pitchers I ever saw in my lifetime and he was you know hey I haven't pitched in a while you know and I'd say come on let's go touch it up a little bit I'm gonna go throw down there and throw it out you know but he was joking he understood and so anyway I sold it all down to front office again he said you have Bedrosian down there throwing a bullpen I said yeah I said you do that to some of your relievers a lot don't you I said well yeah I said because you know those you know if they if it's two days in a row that they don't they don't get warm up or get in a game I said then I I try to follow up on that and he goes what if you have to use him tonight what are you doing and I said that's what we're doing is preparing for tonight's game and the relievers loved it that way you gave everybody the same amount of attention and when guys are on the mound more often practicing their craft and their location and we wanted 80% fastball command of down and away then we could all our other pitches come in behind that and all our other locations came in behind that because they'd say this guy's a first ball fastball hitter Boney you know that you've heard of your entire life I'll say okay he's a first ball fastball hitter we're going to give him a first ball fastball it's going to be a down-and-away strike not a middle-away strike a down-and-away strike and we're either going to go strike one or get a one pitch out because we were pitching towards two contact we wanted the end we wanted the handle and we would we would refer to everything as let's be sneaky quick instead of overpowering let's be quiet out there quietly stick it to him and leave and to elude what you said to earlier managers would come up to me and say it's a damn distinctly oh and I'd go what they'd say we know where you're going to be and we still can't do anything about it and that's and I heard you say that earlier and I went well I've heard that before here's another thing in your strategy two things that you probably might not have heard or you tell me if you have clavin's pitch against Cleveland in the World Series that great game where you pick one one to nothing that's probably the deepest lineup I ever saw in my life as far as you know one through nine and so Tommy said Lee after after the second ending they said Tommy said Leo they're moving up on the plate on me and I said yeah he goes I guess I'll have to start going inside more I said we got two options it goes what's the other one I said well if they move up on you you can go out a little further and see if they follow you out now if they follow you out you're still in the same boat now if they follow if they don't follow you out that's getting it or you're gonna have to go in you're gonna open that up or jam somebody but if they follow you out you're the same boat you know they follow him out and he you know I think he made me through seven pitches inside that gave me its Cleveland and then the one in Cincinnati Kevin Mitchell owned he owned Glaev I mean owned him Glaev could not get him out and I don't know if you were there with Kevin that year a couple years but you know I went out to the mountain with the bases loaded and we were already down one to nothing and Kevin was open to plate and I said Tom I went out to the mountain Tommy I said I want you to pitch to this guy like there's nobody on he goes I said because besides you got a base open and he told me look to me goes well I don't know what you're looking at he said the bases are loaded and I said no home plate's open he goes oh don't give in I said no don't give into this guy you know he walked him on a 3-2 change up but I thought I thought he would chase and he didn't he taught me did too retired the next 18 in a row and we that's the only few runs they scored in the whole game so if he would have gave in to Mitchell there that would have been extra bases with the bases loaded and he's already he's gonna be down for it enough and this way oh he walked in a run we didn't care Tommy was famous for that and we know that we knew that second half of my career I knew that I wish I do it my whole career but Tommy will not give into you ever and then when I got a chance to play with him I said what's your what your thumb press is booney with the bases loaded I'd rather walk one then give up a gapper and that's three and for you know the rest of my life I thought yeah 3-2 doesn't mean you know everybody thinks 3-2 oh he's got to come to he's got to throw a strike not Tom Glavin he's got to throw you something that appears to be a strike and and right in that that zone where should I swing should I not swing but I'm gonna make you think about it and and that was kind of the the genius of of that whole philosophy that team and that run that you guys had I want to talk about their relationship you know there were golf partners on the road whoever wasn't pitching if the all three of them weren't pitching for a couple days they'd all three be there they killed me Leo because they dragged me along once in a while I was like being on tour you know I tell people I said you think Tiger Woods got some pull in the golf world I said try hanging out with Smoltz for a while he's got more connections and tighter on the golf course they were all competitive as hell but they were buddies how was your relationship with the three of them was it the same or was an individual with each one of them well I think I think it it was the same yet it was an individual for example with Smoltz see if you were going to maybe get a point across the and you had you wanted to get a point across you had to use a little more of a lighter approach because Smoltz was more of the emotional guy you know so you use a lighter a lighter a lighter approach and you know taste most and get your head out of your butt oh you know the catcher just told me I said we don't need to hear it twice I'll go back in stuff like that with Smoltz but anyway then with Glavin he was your never-given guy stubborn in a great way all good pitchers are stubborn I think and so anyway I could push him harder I could say the same thing to Glavin and be a little more firm and get the same point across the Smoltz and be light in my presentation with Maddox have your numbers together have you if he asked you a question give him an answer for example let's see Willie Green and Reggie Sanders we're gonna pitch against Cincinnati right and you know we're in the dugout and he goes Leo games on the line who do I pitch to Willie Green or Reggie Sanders and I said well well let me see I said let me tell you and they asked one other coach that other coach said oh it doesn't matter we can pick anyone you want he said I want to hear that don't want to hear that he says what do you think Leo I said I would pick Willie Green to pitch to he's gonna get left handed against you he said yeah I said listen Reggie Sanders strikes out a lot I mean a lot I said he strikes out on pitchers that pitch north and south I said you don't pitch north and south you pitch east and west occasionally up occasionally lower than low I said but you're an East West guy I said Willie Green he can't hit your sinker he can't hit your cutter he can't hit your change up I said so I'd take Willie Green okay we're walking down the bullpen you know and he go and I go who'd you pick he'd go Willie Green now I'm nervous I'm going oh god did I pick the right guy or is he like that or did he like it only in a good way only in a good way you know and then or the time when you know you saw it on TV but he couldn't get Luis Gonzalez out and so he told he told Bobby he said you know you you know we can walk him if you want because Bobby refused to have mad dog walk anybody and of course the game came up and here it was in the seventh and and we're gonna put him on and he goes no wait a minute now wait a minute he goes give me two pitches he said he said I'll probably go sinker away cutter in he said and I think you'll pop it up to third base I got caught whoa but anyway that's that's that's the approach for all three having with Clavin and Smolte Clavin was just you know you could you could jab him a little bit you know and in a good way with Smolte a different presentation and but they all three I told any pitcher that came up in our in our to the big leagues I said look you got four pitching coaches here guys take advantage of it I said you got three starting pitchers take advantage of it pick their brain understand what they've done for their entire career your career is just starting and so therefore or here's what I would do to Boonie say for example I had a young left hander down in a bullpen and so I say glad it wasn't his day to throw I said come on down a bullpen come down to bullpen and let the young kids throw a little bit you know and you he'd watch him or if the guy was left handed in glavin was having his bullpen sessions bring the left hander down and half him watch those sessions so we always had those guys it you know Bobby want Bobby used to say where the hell's all the pitchers at they said they're all down the bullpen with Leo we would have in class every day because everybody threw all the time all you do now is see guys shagging balls in the outfield Bobby had no shagging in spring training Maddox saw that he went oh man I came to the right place pitchers don't shag and stuff like that things little things like that that you know made it all fun to come to the park and and when they believed in all those things and they saw the results they felt the results then it all works but you can't do that without your head manager allowing you to you know even Maddox when he managed to come over Bobby saw him in Pittsburgh having coffee early in the year and Bobby goes what are you doing he goes well I'm having coffee and reading a paper he goes why ain't you out there playing golf he goes what it is why ain't you out there playing golf get your ass out there and go play golf he said get away from the game for a little bit bony how many organizations have you been in there's no golf allowed you got to treat and the mental side of the game it's so important how you treat people you're talking about that's why I asked you the question because I wanted here everybody isn't the same you don't treat everybody the same way you know you've got it you've got to have that fortitude to look at one guy go you know I need to light a fire under this guy's ass and in this guy over here I got to be real careful because because he's sensitive so I got to treat people different to get that that the best result of him out of all of them and you mentioned Millwood Millwood I love Millwood in 99 he kind of became our horse that there were some injuries and Millwood had that great year but he was you know the fourth and fifth guy as Steve Avery early a Kent Merker who I mentioned a Denny Nagle these are all great pitchers but not a part of the big three did you have to manage those guys because they kind of knew they weren't Maddox Moltz and Glavin right was there a mental approach to them that was different eBay Motors is here for the ride remember when you first saw the potential and then through some elbow grease freshen stalls and a whole lot of love you transformed 100,000 miles and a body full of rust into a drive that's all your own look to your left look to your right it's official no one's got a ride like this there's nothing else that sounds like feels like or looks like the set 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own right you know Avery was the Dodger killer he would eat Avery in 1991 booty 118 games as a 21 year old kid didn't want the MVP the NLCS and we went over them here's a great story for you we went over all the pirate hitters that's when it was bonds and but he and a great great ball club and so we're going down to bullpen three rivers after we would had our meeting and all that kind of stuff and but I know ave I'm you probably let it go in one ear and out the other which is fine you know so we're walking down the bullpen and we're down three games to two and he I say hey you got it figured out he says yeah Leo I do I said good tell me just making conversation he goes I'm gonna go warm up find out what I got and pitch accordingly I said that's smarter than any scatter report I ever heard and he beat him more than nothing nothing just with what he did best you know or Kevin Millwood Kevin how you feel good tired new as it that's your conversation one of the worst bullpen guys you ever wanted to see I mean he would have his practice sessions or warm up and you'd sit there and go you know but then you knew after being with him all those years you knew like somebody said we didn't warm up because I don't care how somebody warms up okay just drop it I don't care I've seen guys shoot lights out the bullpen can't get nobody out of between the white lines Kevin Millwood is the opposite he would walk out there this big old strong dude all of a sudden the same pitches that were out there were not what you saw in the bullpen so all we wanted to do is you know make him feel good physically mentally nothing bothered him you know and he just went out there and battled and and was a hell he was a 16 game winner in the four hole and Danny he was a 20 game winner in the five hole but then again Boonie after all these years we went to the postseason a couple times with none of them there Mike Hampton Jarrett Wright John Thompson Russ Ortiz Russ Ortiz won 22 games for us one year Russ come over from the Giants and I'm thinking why the hell the Giants trade him he comes over he goes he goes Leo he goes I said Russ why did the Giants trade you he goes they told me I walk too many guys I said well I don't give a damn how many you walk you don't I said no long they don't score I don't care and guess what we never talked about walks the rest of the year those are just examples I know getting away from the big three it's awesome get murk or the same way I said Murk he was starting for at the vet and you know he's worried about I said Murk you know what you can give up four home runs in a game and go nine innings he said yeah I said yeah I said four solos four solo home runs you can go nine or you know it's at three or four run inning that's it gonna so our we were talking about damage control and I said you know and I said Murk what's your most important pitch you go well my fast boss your most important pitch is your next one that's your most important pitch because if you have that mentality of your most important pitch is your next one then you'll have damage control in the inning instead of having some snowball well you know what he he's we're winning but he's giving up three runs right three solo home runs and he committed to sit down next to me because I think I'm testing your theory a little too far and I said no no Murk you got one more left you got one more bullet anyway this is this is this is all great stuff and you don't hear about it every day you know I got traded to you guys after the 98 season I'll never forget I get traded two things went through my mind Leo man I'm gonna have I got a chance here to go to the my first world series and two and it might this might be in reverse order I ain't got to face those guys anymore we came to you were with us too I came to spring training I remember it was myself Brian Jordan we were new to the ball club and Bobby kind of addressed us and he said booney Brian you know welcome here here's what we here's what I do and here's what we do in Atlanta we win I put a line up out every day and we go steamroll our opponents or something to that effect and I remember looking around and it was different than every where I've ever been I remember sitting in the postseason you know you have that player shares meeting where we talk about who's gonna get a share well all the players that are there on the roster for an entire season they automatically get a share the coaches and the manager they get a share but the rest is up to the players on how much we give the traveling secretary the people you know and I've been in a few shares meetings in Cincinnati and so I know how it went down well I'm sitting in the shares meeting you know this is after a long season we're getting ready to go to the postseason and GlaV was kind of the he was kind of the boss he ran and he'd been there the longest and they're going through these shares and I'm like you're given the grounds crew three shares and so I speak up I raised my eyes and glad wait a minute not all of us he goes booney booney here's the deal he goes we here in Atlanta we go to the postseason every season and we take care of the guys and I just started laughing and I said well I've been to the post you know I've won the division twice but I don't go every single season and he just started laughing and everybody kind of looked and it was kind of a funny moment my point is it was different place than I'd ever been it was a culture it was we're here to win it was very blue collar it was at lunch pail to work clock in do your job and go home I really enjoyed the guys I mean good guys all through it was a different environment it was expected it wasn't whole hopefully we're going to win this year it was no we are going to win it's a matter of whether we win the World Series and it was different than any place I've ever been talk about that a little bit number six had a lot to do with it I mean Bobby was you know in other words he you had everybody went in there knew that was Bobby Cox's clubhouse and he also knew that they also knew that Bobby would go through a brick wall for him and he would and he would do anything he could to help guys with success and he all and he knew you know and he also they also knew that he could be really firm when he wanted to but a lot of times when he had he had to be firm with some guys the coaching staff didn't even know it he would do it behind closed doors or in his office and at the time you know the coaching staff wouldn't even do it but he led his coaches coach you know he didn't control he controlled everything but he led his coaches coach and that made a world a difference too it was easy to work for and you know he would ask your opinion on in during the game especially with the pitching staff and things like this he made you feel important now you're talking to a guy that spent 24 years in minor leagues for a long time I didn't feel very important he made you feel important he made players feel important he made you know he played pitchers had never had any success anywhere else and had success with us I remember John Burkett came over what a great great pitcher he wasn't I think the thing one thing I told him booty with Burke I said any time you have a slider situation I want a fastball down and away he goes really I said yeah you watch what happens I said they're gonna you're either gonna freeze somebody or lock them up and he started doing that and you know everybody said where's all the junk he's supposed to throw he was still an 86 mile in our fastballs and so the bottom line though was I went over to him when he first got there and I said Burkett how you feel this is after the sixth inning and he just kept staring at me and you know Burkett always funny he is a funny dude and that dry sense of humor he kept staring at me I said what the hell's wrong with you I said are you tired or not he goes nobody's ever asked me they've only told me if I'm staying in or going I said no if you're not tired we're not taking you out you're gonna have to hit he goes I'm not tired I said well good go grab a bat you know he said but that's what he said you're the first this organization is the first one that ever asked me instead of just telling me and he loved that too every minute of it so just the example of your clubhouse or early now early I saw Bobby mellow out some but one time he chewed my butt out you'll love this would be where we're in LA in 91 it's my first full years his pitching coach I was there for half a year with him in June of 90 when we were building this thing and we finally catch the Dodgers we're tied for first place in Smolcey's starting out in LA and Smolcey's got a five-nothing lead in the fifth now it's five-one now it's five-two but the way they're scoring is not they're just dinking they dink a few then there's a wild pitch then there's a walk and then you say okay he's he's losing those you know I so I run out there I said look you're not in any trouble I said you know I said you don't nothing's gonna snowball I said you know you're one you're one pitch away from from from out of the inning I said so just slow the game down and remember what are saying he goes what I said your most important pitch is what he goes my next one I said okay you've got to implement that right now well I go back in you know and now it's five to three runners on second and third two outs Bobby go you think we should take him out I said no I'd give you one more hitter I don't care I'm gonna take him anyway I said well you're you I don't care you don't want me to take him out do you I said you asked me I told you I don't want you to go so this went back and forth the more big I don't give a damn I'm taking him out I said well you're the manager do what you want so when he walked out I took my hat off and scratched my head and I went damn what was that all about you hmm anyway Smolcey comes in sits down next to me because what's going on I said I'll tell you what's going on you're fixing to blow it that's what's going on just be quiet because I was Bobby comes in Bobby comes in from the dugout from the bound and he don't say a word to me for the rest of the game if there has to be somebody up in the pen he doesn't he doesn't say Leo get so and so ready and I'm going I wonder who pissed him off I said oh I bet Smolcey made a face at him when he went to the mound or flipped him the ball when he took him out something happened out there wind up winning the game Bobby's then going right away guys had away Leo come on him office and shut the door I go in my office and shut the door you ever take your hat I'm gonna clean it up you ever take your head off again and scratch your head when I make a decision don't you ever do that I said what I didn't do that on purpose I just he's just a reaction I decided it yeah yeah I think he goes you know what he said you didn't want me to take him out this was the whole thing you don't we take him out did you I said well you asked I didn't want to do it so it happened back and forth right didn't finally goes looks because I didn't want to take him out either I said what because I didn't want to take him out either he said I'm would tell you why I took him out Leo he said I'm sending a message to that young pitching staff that you have out there that I don't want to hear the word potential no more we're in a pennant race we catch the Dodgers we're in first place no more potential I want results and I want somebody to put that game away in that situation yeah you know what he's right you know I mean as I you learn so much over the as you know over the years he said that's why I took him out he goes what do you think about that and I said well I think that's the smartest thing I've heard he says good get the hell out of here but see that got into my brain going I wanted to send a message to the rotation no more potential you know it's cool too because the the current Atlanta Braves team under Brian Snicker and he talks about Bobby and and how much influence because Snits been in that organization forever and all the sudden they're having to they're having a run you know where they've kind of been the dominant team in that division for seven or eight years in a couple World Series and man it's it's like kind of Bobby and and that culture all over again you got Walter Weiss in the in the Doug Eddie Perez it's pretty cool to see after your Atlanta tenure you went to Baltimore 0 6 and 0 7 did you feel I mean with all the accolades that you'd you'd received and all the praise and and I did it opening the thing you know Liam is only if not the in the conversation is the greatest pitching coach up did you feel any pressure going to Baltimore with your resume saying oh Leo's here now automatically we've got a pitch at the top of the league did you feel that or did you know had enough experience you got to have the horses to do it first and foremost secondly there's only so much you can do as coach well I think the one thing I've I didn't feel any pressure once I saw you know when you go to a different organization and you you see why they lose all the time and you understand what's going on and they brought me in thinking I could change the culture of the pitching there in Baltimore and I thought I could too and nobody talks about the success of Eric Badard and Jeremy Guthrie they were great they turned or they if you look those numbers up when I was there Eric Badard and Jeremy Guthrie turned into all-star pitchers but it was very thin the depth of the staff was very thin the team wasn't all that good and I was not accepted by the the the coach and staff at all and I've learned over the years all my years in baseball that as a coach I had I never had problems with a lot of players at all I did with some coaches and because I thought that everybody worked together to produce a product and what I learned when I first got into the coaching part of it was that everybody kind of instead of producing a product they want the the credit for the product so therefore they're not exactly truthful all the time to what would they report on a particular individual and I saw that in the Orioles organization where they said they would tell me they had all these prospects so I go into spring training and they said they had you know like 18 pitchers that are prospects I'm went 18 I said you know we had the greatest pitching staffs in the world we didn't have 18 so after the end of spring train they asked me how many they had and I said six and they went what I said you have six six legit guys I said which ain't bad it's not bad but I said it's not 18 and of course then the and then I thought the the contract that I received from mr. Angelos in the Orioles was a very lucrative one and the other coaches resented what they paid me and I even said look all this does is bring up the you know bring up salaries for everybody you know and I said but it didn't there was never a communication with any of the coaching staff the manager was fine Sammy Palazzo was great and but you had this good old boys situation there where you know owner the players were allowed to voice complaints to ownership and when you have that you have no chance and I just told him I said you know I told him the truth I said you know I said you're way over rating who all this talent that you have I said you're bringing up guys from AAA that can't pitch because I you know I saw who we would bring up from AAA and could pitch a little bit and then who they brought up hell they would be in double A and then then he said one time they said we talk about you always bring up the Braves and I said what do you want me to do I bring up the Braves to give you guys an example of how it was done you know not I said I want to be able to help out doing the same thing here but they really didn't want to listen that much and I knew from the first couple of weeks of spring training that I was in a wrong place I knew it I just got to felt I just felt it you know and then so you know it didn't work I had Mike Flanagan had a tough time there and and the other they brought in McPhail toward at the end of the second season and he said Leo he said I understand you're outstanding with veteran pitchers but you're kind of hard on younger ones I said where do you hear that at because no I said well he said I said wait a minute Mr. McPhail so I went to my locker and I got a baseball it was from a rookie named Jeremy Guthrie who Cleveland didn't want why did Cleveland not want you and he said they told me I thought too much because I went to Stanford and I thought too much I said a mind has a great asset I said and I know one thing for a fact if you can't think you can't pitch I said so don't you ever worry about that again I give the baseball and I show it to Mr. McPhail and I said Mr. McPhail this is a guy's first year in the big leagues and he says yeah I said look what he put on the ball now I said this is a young guy you put on the ball he said without you I could never had the confidence to pitch in the big leagues signed Jeremy Guthrie that ball there meant as much to me as a World Series ball or a you know great 300 win ball or whatever the guys would offer to give me I never asked and so I said there you go and showed him that and I said by the way Mr. McPhail I said you know in the early 90s we had the youngest starting rotation in the history of baseball I said we went to the seventh game of the World Series so that was it but he they didn't listen so I ended up being there for two years and then the third year they for the third year they called me and said we'll take care of your contract for you but we will not retain your services as pitching coach and I do that and I thought well be a son of a gun you know and then after that the game started changing and it looked like maybe I wasn't gonna get back in it because of certain things that I believed in so they said my opinions were too strong for current staffs you know what the current staffs were the front offices and wasn't a pitching staff that's right that's right and that's what happened and it's interesting too for you to talk because I've as a player I've seen the dynamic on certain teams I've been on in the coaching ranks and it is and it's like oh who's he what's he doing here did it at all that stuff and the end it gets polyticky and to me it's gross to watch and it's more of everybody out to save their own ass oh I just have to do everything right so I can get my job next year yeah so when you say that that that surprised me at all alright I was thinking about this and we're about to wrap up but 2022 pretty special year for you get inducted into the into the Braves Hall of Fame I thought about it I've never heard of that before heard of skippers you know obviously players skippers I don't know too many pitching coaches that have ever been inducted into a franchise's Hall of Fame and then I started thinking about it one one deeper and I said and I don't ever remember a hitting coach ever being inducted but I don't remember any coach ever right I don't know how many you know but you're in pretty rare air when a pitching coach get inducted into a friend that shows the impact you had and it kind of when you talk about the greatest pitching coach ever kind of hey it has some value it has some validity when you get inducted that's a pretty it's a pretty awesome honor your thoughts on on being inducted in 22 oh I thought it was just tremendous I mean I was a very emotional time for me after spending you know 24 years to minors in 18 and a big so that's a long career and I loved every minute of it I love the minor leagues too and so it was it was a tremendous feeling and you know you there's so many people responsible before it you know I did close my speech by saying that the one person that had the most influence on my life besides my father was Bobby Cox and without him I wouldn't be sitting here talking to you without him all these things that happened in the big leagues for me personally without him I'm not sitting here and the other thing is is that you Boney there's no such thing as a great good good or great coach without great talent you know the great John Wooden right what was it why was he so successful he says talent talent more talent well if you were able to not mess up your talent and upgrade at some but the bottom line was this and you said it earlier it when it's your turn to pitch we did not miss starts and when Bobby Cox and I were together for 15 years our starting rotation average making a hundred and forty of the hundred sixty game scheduled starts whatever rotation I was that year and that was for a long time so you look at those types of things and yeah and then I got I discussed some good news that I'm going to be put into the state of Georgia Hall of Fame and I'll be the only non-head coach into that one and I want to tell you one thing too about how after it went down in Baltimore real quick I asked John Sirholz how come people who wouldn't knock down my door want me to come into their organization and he says I said did I'd say anything wrong or do anything wrong he goes no Leo he says you didn't I said well you know he says yeah he said the organizations know that if they knock on your door and they say we we want you to come in here's how we want you to do it you said what would your answer be I'd say well if you're bringing me in we're gonna do it what I want to do that's why you're bringing me and he says they know that and that's why they won't so anyway that's how that all you know they don't they want to control it anyway you've dumped some TV you're helping out at Furman University last question all your years what makes a successful pitching coach great pitchers and all my years great pitchers make for a good pitching coach and a good pitching coach doesn't mess up great pitchers yeah I think I think the one thing I've learned from you Leo and and I know we mean you had a lot of fun times sitting on the bench rocking back and forth you used to drive me crazy say Leo you're stressing me out stop it but that was that that was the relationship we had and I always enjoyed that but you always used to tell me when when you got serious we joke around about you know the big three and all that but you said Boonie I just don't mess them up and there's something to that there's a skill there and hey you know what you got but know how to handle what you got and you were always very humble about it but very honest and in the simple answer if don't mess it up you know you think it's a joke when you think about it's like yeah you're right you're right I can't mess this up and there's a skill to that I appreciate it Leo mezoni a lot of fun and I and I appreciate coming on a lot of really cool insight that you don't get to hear every day for those of you watching the boom podcast now on its own YouTube channel appreciate you checking it out for those of you listening to the boom podcast on the Odyssey app or wherever you download your podcast until next time keep it here thanks Leo a message paid for by veterans for all voters listen to this message from Ted Delicath former army infantrymen and Ranger qualified platoon leader active in the army reserves when I enlisted in the army I sworn oath to this country not any political party that's why I'm interested in citizens ballot measures around the country to reduce the power of political parties Colorado votes on one to right now election rules allow political insiders to handpick party nominees it's the reason we're usually stuck voting for the lesser of two evils Colorado's plan creates an open primary where all candidates appear on one primary ballot every voter has the freedom to vote for any candidate no matter which party the Colorado plan advances for candidates to the general election not to that means more choices for voters in the primary and general election get the facts elections belong to the voters not political parties paid for by veterans for all voters Anthony Haas registered agent the use of military rank and job titles does not imply endorsement by the Department of the Army or the Department of Defense of this ballot measure
