[ Music ] >> Hey guys, welcome back to the Bros. We're in the back of the sanctuary, where the conversation happens, where your host Jose, Bill, and John, and we are in the room today. And a special guest that you see to my left, is Brother Caleb, Robert, Robert, Robert's in. I got it right, right? Robert's in, yes, sir. And he's here, a longtime listener, a friend of the podcast. Brother Caleb, what would you introduce yourself a little bit? >> My name is Caleb Robertson, and a friend of John Hume here, and listen to a few episodes of the podcast, and it's really interesting, John asked if I could come on, and be a guest, so here we are, but we're, I'm 31 years old, you need to know that information. >> Yeah, it's important. >> John has older friends, but we're going to be in my family. >> Me and my family, that would have been good. >> You don't have very many friends, we already have. >> Yeah, that's why I was saying you could have just said that I have friends. >> Yeah, 75% of the room right now. >> Yeah, you have three friends, here we are. >> You're four, Jordan's led here. >> Oh, wait. >> He's not coming. >> Okay, wait, wait, who's, that works. >> I got you, I got you. >> I got you. >> John and the Jordan. >> I've got to say, don't include me, please. >> Yeah, no, no. >> That youth camp thing is not all, we've matured since then. You're okay, I think we have, but-- >> You're terrible. >> That's amazing. [ Laughter ] >> By the way, I was listening to the episode that we did with the shout outs. >> Yeah. >> And the absolutely popped in at the exact spot who it needed to be. >> Yeah. >> And I was like, wow, I don't know, have you noticed that? There's an absolutely hidden in the podcast. >> Every episode, every episode, every episode, 20, 21 minutes or something in the episode, it's an absolutely. It's not him. >> Yeah, but it's not him. >> They flipped me saying absolutely. >> Right, so I had it on a sound board on the laptop and then every time it would come up in conversation or there was a good moment, I'd hit the sound board button and then I'd record and have all of those on a separate track. So I deleted at one point the track because we weren't using it for some reason, we just didn't have it. But I deleted everything but one singular one that I accidentally left there about the 20 minute mark. And then I was just like, wait, it fits where I left it. Like it fit in the perfect spot just by chance. And I was like, oh, that's terrific. So I just happened to be listening back and caught it and then now every episode I go back and find that spot and then move it where it fits and just see if I can put it in a good spot. >> Yeah, my job almost got taken by the laptop. >> So I stopped using it for that. >> Yeah. >> Now I think I say absolutely more than you do. It's just a common place. >> Well, yeah, that's because I got so sick and tired of the computer doing it that I couldn't say. >> Yeah. >> I'm just like, yes, there's no need for you to even talk. >> Yeah, it's true. >> Usually I just go, uh-huh. >> Well, I just clicked that, I just clicked that, uh-huh. You just said, nah, it's gonna be clicked in there well. It's gonna fit randomly in a spot too. >> Uh-huh, yeah. >> Toodaloo, John. >> I said Toodaloo. >> Make sure you clock out before you leave. >> Yeah. >> It's your last time. >> Flip your card up. >> Actually, you were two minutes late, that's right up. >> Oh, man, that's too real. >> Oh, absolutely. >> Man, he's already on the basis. >> He's got the job. >> He's got the job. I was like, an application not even in, no interview. He's just got the job now. >> But somebody did that with me with base playing. They were like, you don't need to audition a six-string player. You just say, give him the spot. >> You're right. >> He's got two strings. >> Yeah, you have to, you have to. If you're like a beginner that starts playing a six-string, something's wrong with you, man, like, you don't want to start with it. >> What'd you say? >> So, speaking of that, that's actually a huge honor to be on the podcast with the famous Bill Turner. >> Oh, Bill Turner. >> The famous, the famous COVID, base playing Bill Turner. Wow, man. >> It's crazy, man. >> I don't know if I should ask for your autograph now. >> I'm not even in most of the video. >> Can I get the autograph, too? Because obviously, it's getting famous. We're going to have-- >> Wasn't it a better autograph to give you, honestly? I don't have-- >> It's a rare thing to have. >> Yeah, because every time I do it, it's different. It looks horrible every time. I almost couldn't vote. That's an actual fact. The lady looked at it, she was like, that's close enough. But she gave me a look for a minute. I think that's it. That's the only time my signatures mattered. Every other time, it's just like, oh, just something here. >> This is like-- we threw out my driver's license. It's terrible. It goes up and then like, it looks like a house. >> I think I had to do it with my finger from my driver's license, which is hilarious because it's like one of the most important things. Like, they actually check your driver's license. >> I asked to do it again. It was still bad. >> Mulligan. >> What? >> Mulligan. So they call it radio and golf. >> I have no golf humor, so-- >> No idea what that is. >> So you haven't watched the debate with Trevor Biden? >> No, I probably haven't. No, I haven't seen that. I've only seen little clips of it here and there about the handicap. >> Yeah, that's for sure. >> Joe Biden. >> He's handicapped and I'm not talking about on the golf course. He's very special. He's got a special score, a special mind. Yeah, he was insane on that debate stage. >> Yeah. >> I can't wait to see him do it again. >> He ruthless. >> So did you guys see the story about Trump going golfing the day after he got shot? He was like, "I'm not like the shooter. I don't miss." >> Oh, man. I did not see that. >> Yeah, he called him right out. >> Wow. >> Oh, man. I mean, guys-- >> Not alive anymore. >> Well, I also seen that he paid for the shooter's funeral and all that. >> Really? >> Like all of his stuff, Trump paid for it. >> That is deep. Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold on, wait, wait. >> You guys, the family of the shooter is getting paid, getting the funeral paid for. >> By the man. >> By the man who tried to kill. >> Wow. >> That is like, that is the most Christian thing to do, bro. But you'll still have-- >> No. >> No, okay. >> That's the other way around. I think that's somebody's baller. >> That's a forget. That's an act of forgiveness. You'll go ahead and-- >> No. >> No. It may be a Christian thing to do, but I don't think that's why he did it. >> I have so much money I can even pay for my shooter's funeral. That's what I'm doing here. That's what I think it is. I think it's just him going, you know. I'm so rich and famous that you tried to shoot me, you couldn't even do it, so I have to pay for your stuff now. I don't know. >> I don't know. >> That sounds a little bitty. I mean, it does, it sounds a little bitty right there. >> Yeah. >> I mean, honestly, to go and say that I'm going to go ahead and pay for the shooter's funeral, it's just like-- >> Well, yeah. It takes the burden away from the family. That's the biggest burden. >> Man, nothing to do with it. >> No, they didn't, but they lost it. >> I mean, everybody already knows he's got enough money to pay for the funeral. I don't really know how it could be. I was talking to a guy at work the other day, and he was saying, we're talking about Trump not taking the salary and all that, and he was like, oh, he's all for himself. I'm like, yeah, but it's in a different light. You can't tell me, oh, he didn't take a salary because he's for himself. He's for himself by making the economy better and making business better. He's going to benefit from that. From that, he don't need the little salary that they get at this present. >> And it's nothing compared to what he has. >> This is like the Senate salary compared to what they actually own and how much their salary is. There's huge discrepancies between those two numbers. >> Because the stock market, they control that so heavily. >> There's no law against it unless you're just a random dude. If you're a senator, there's nothing you can-- they're just like, oh, no, that's perfectly fine. It gets rich on insider trading and everybody knows, people see it happening, they just are like, it's part of the job. It's weird. America is good most of the time. You can build yourself up to become somebody who can rip other people off. That's how it works, I think. Is America, you can build yourself up just so you can get rich off of other people, sorry. Get rich off of other people, not yourself. >> I didn't explain that to Mike there. >> The American dream is to get rich off everybody else. >> I'm joking with that. >> Absolutely. >> I mean, it kind of is a little bit-- >> It's how capitalism works. >> That is how capitalism works. >> It's just you're taking money from other people. >> Yeah. No, no, no, no, no. That sounds bad. >> What? >> That does sound bad. >> No, it's not. >> It's an oversimplification, oversimplification, taking money from people, that's-- I am not just political stuff, so I can't say anything but never mind. The whole, yeah, the capitalism thing is basically-- >> It's stealing that you agree to. You're just like, I'll take money for you. You're like, okay, yeah. It's right. Go ahead. >> Providing and providing something for people to get money for, like if I want to make something and then have people to work for it as well, making me more money, I'm going to supply something to somebody and have work for somebody else. You know what I mean? >> Yeah. >> That's-- >> But it's broken right now. I knew capitalism was broken with NFTs because no one knew what they were. No one knew how to explain them. The best explanation I've got. >> I'm not sure what it is. >> Okay, so it stands for non-fungible token. >> Yes. >> Right. >> So that means-- >> You can't spend it. >> You can't do anything with it. You just spend-- >> It looks like having video game money? >> Kind-- no, because you can spend that. Like that has a kind of real world value. It would be like-- >> It's like a poster. It's like it's like a poster. Someone sells you. >> Yeah. >> And you said, I like that poster so much, I'm going to pay $1,000 for it and you have $1,000 worth of a poster that you can't go through a store and sell this poster-- >> No, but you can-- >> --for eggs and milk and bacon or whatever. >> Yeah. >> But you can sell it again for money, right? >> Two other people who are also dumb, you can't use it for-- you can't use it to bake to buy a thing. It's non-fungible. You can't-- >> It's like using monopoly money in the real world. It's like some people will use monopoly money because they also are weird. Like, you know, you can technically it's money. But you can't always use-- It's like Bitcoin. It's like that. It's like it's translated over, but you can only use it with other people who are also weird and use that money. It's not like legal tender unless you're talking to somebody who also uses it. Because otherwise you're just like-- >> You can sell Bitcoin and have money. >> Yeah, but it's like so small that that value changes are great. >> Depends on what you talk to is-- >> That's true. >> --and how you do it. >> It fluctuates. >> Yeah. >> I mean, I watched Bitcoin a little bit and beginning of this year it was like I think it was like $18,000. I looked at it the other day and I think it was $63,000 for one Bitcoin. >> Yeah. It's crazy, man. >> Any amount will change later on too. >> Yeah. Gold and silver is the same way. Gold will be a certain amount per pound or for ounce and it'll fluctuate up or down depending on how the demand for it. >> Is it a demand? >> Yeah, it's a fine demand. >> Yeah. >> It's fun though. That's a fun part of my life is you get to watch everything go up and down. And you ever know if it's going to just blow up. >> Yeah, if you can learn how to watch, especially with the stocks. If you can learn how to watch and guesstimate what it'll do, you can use the broken system to further yourself. >> You know what else is broken? >> The statue that never can ever try to build, that's also broken. It broke. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> It's true. >> It did. >> It's knocked over by a boulder. >> I mean, come on. The feet are with clay and metal like. >> Yeah, what do you expect? >> Yeah. Do I bow down to a statue that is going to end up completely destroyed? >> The worst part of it to be built with. >> With different kinds of metals. >> If the head was made out of clay, that would have made so much more sense. >> Yeah. >> The whole statue made out of gold, it would have been perfectly fine. >> That sounds familiar. >> Yeah. >> The whole statue made out of gold. >> Who did that? >> Who did that? >> Did he? >> Really? >> Well, he tried. >> I'm sure I've heard those names before. Statue of gold, Nebuchadnezzar. This is dumb. >> Is it Daniel? Are we talking about Daniel? >> Yeah. >> Should we? >> Let's talk about Daniel. >> Let's do it. >> Daniel. >> I'm sorry. >> Wait, who's Daniel? >> We're all talking in code over here. I was like, Daniel, I ain't going to work with that guy. >> Yeah. >> I mean, we kind of went into gold. So I mean, like-- >> Yeah, it might as well. >> Yeah. >> If only that statue was made out of Bitcoin. >> It was like that. >> It was probably not a Bitcoin. >> Nobody would have been able to bow to it. >> You couldn't see it. >> No, it would have been the fiery frame. >> Oh, man. So for the Caleb, your favorite, one of your favorite stories is the three Hebrew children. The story about them. Why don't you-- >> Which we know because we asked him not-- he's not psychic. >> No, no, no. I'm just like, what are you talking about? >> Okay, we did talk a little bit before we got on the-- before we started recording. So he-- >> You could have played that really well. It would have been nice to like, you play that as a mentalist. And you're just like-- >> I was like, okay. >> I hold your right hand up. >> I wouldn't be able to. I wouldn't have been able to do that after the-- after the slave. >> That's true. Yeah, we did-- >> What? >> You're having a meat moment. >> I mean, listen, I'm sorry to-- >> You're turning into meat. >> You're turning into meat. >> Here's the question. How do I move the word premonition into the tense I want? I don't know, so I'm not going to do it. And I can't stop because there's no other words. >> What tensions are there? Did you take your medicine this morning? >> I'm much of it. Not enough. No, too much. >> What do you like-- what do you like specifically about-- >> That's catchy. [laughter] >> We are just all bad. I should have took my medicine. >> Yeah. >> I don't have medicine. >> What do you like about the three Hebrew children? >> So specific-- >> What's your favorite part? >> Specifically, the whole story, like when you were-- when you were talking long ago-- >> Sorry. >> Yeah. >> That was funny. It was like, okay, place to left to say specifically the whole story. >> That is funny. [laughter] >> No. [laughter] >> I'm horrible. >> I like the whole story, but I'm getting ready to tell you specifically what I like about the whole story. [laughter] Specifically why I like the whole story. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> So specifically-- [laughter] >> There you go. >> Oh, absolutely. >> Yeah, they're-- they're one of those, isn't it? >> Easter eggs. >> Anyways, how you were just talking about the statue and being clay and different things and all that. >> Mm-hmm. >> And people-- it kind of makes me think about nowadays, people bow for a whole lot less than like there, they really didn't have much of a choice. >> Yeah. >> I mean, it was bow or die. >> Right, right. >> And now we, you know, in the world that we live in, people bow down. Oh, because I don't want to offend somebody. I'm going to go ahead and bow down and go ahead and-- I want to accept your pronoun for, you know, what it is because-- >> Yes, deep. >> Because I don't want to hurt your feelings. >> Yeah, exactly. >> But, you know, for them, they literally were put to the test. If you don't bow, you're going to be thrown into the fiery furnace. Like, are we-- do we have enough of God to say-- to say, no, I'm not going to compromise with what society today says and what society today says is acceptable, and you have to do this, and you have to do that. A lot of times-- a lot of times, like we even-- even Christians, I've noticed, even if you take a stand, a lot of times, you'll just try to shy away from those situations and try to keep quiet in those situations just because, you know, hey, this is going to cause an uproar, and this is going to cause people to feel a certain way, but I don't feel like that we should be ashamed of the truth. >> Right, right. >> Yeah. >> I'm not ashamed of the gospel of Jesus Christ. >> No. >> It's the truth. >> Right. >> And, you know, I have family members that's in that lifestyle, and people that I know that's in that lifestyle, but, yeah, that doesn't make it right. >> Right. They made a whole month just for us to be there and see this June. >> Yeah. >> Yeah, the whole Pride month. Like, they literally just-- >> Oh, sure, you're going with that one. >> No, they literally said, "If you're not going to bow down or not going to accept my pronoun, we'll make a whole month so you can see it all month long." Google, when you go on Google during June, you'll see the rainbow colors. >> Four years? >> Uh-huh. >> Four years? >> Four years? >> Oh, yeah. >> Every company right now is during June. >> It's a major marketing. >> It's like literally, if you're not going to bow down to it, you're going to see this. >> Skittles are starting. >> Skittles are starting. >> Yeah. >> They were already sold out. >> Yeah, I agree with you on that when it comes to, like, I was thinking, even in our church environment, because that's what we're used to, even in the environment where we're most comfortable, let's say somebody walks in and you know their backstory, you know kind of what's going on, and then the preacher starts hitting on something while it-- and you tense up. You're like, "Why are you tense enough? You're fine." You're not upset about them. He's just saying, "What's on his heart?" >> Right. >> You know, we have situations where, you know, people come that aren't usually here, and then they will hear, you know, some preaching on it, but it's not-- we only notice it now because that person's in there. Sometimes, you know, your preacher will preach about that any day of the week. >> Oh, we get the little sensitive for that. >> Right, but we get it sensitive because we're like, "Oh, I hope that doesn't offend them." You know, I was like, "I went to a church and the family in the back." They were like, "You know, somebody told me before," no, "Oh, they're on this," you know. And so then it was-- who is it? I don't know where we were at. >> I can't hear you. >> Sorry. >> They were wondering-- >> See, he was bowin' right there. >> Yeah. >> I was bowin' down the window. I was like, "No, no, no, no." No, they were on this. And they were in a Pentecostal holiness church, which is not a usual environment for that. So it was, you know, it was just interesting, and I knew that beforehand. So then we're up there, and the preacher's just like, "And you have to have the gift of the Holy Ghost." And the Holy Ghost is the best thing, and he said, "Over and over again." And I was like, "I know it's not any different than what he would normally say, but you just feel it a little more." You're like, "Oh, what's going on here?" >> You're wondering what's going through their minds. >> Yeah, right. >> What are they thinking? >> Prepare this for this specific person, this specific day. >> Right. Yeah. >> You know, it happened to me. I mean, literally... >> You're getting pretty specific. >> Yeah. >> On this day? On this person. >> I think that happens. >> It does. >> You see people walk into church, and you're just like, "You know them. You know they're like back story." And then your church, you're like, "Okay, well, this is kind of a different scenario here. I've heard this." >> Sure. >> And it just seems like... >> And then they preach on jewelry all the time. But you notice it when it's... >> Exactly. Exactly that. It's like, you know... >> Well, I think I really don't like the whole religion aspect of Christianity. I mean, I follow religion, but I don't like the push religion, like the pushy religion stuff. Like, you have to do this. You have to do that. >> You have to be welcome. >> Right. And that's the thing I think pushes people away, really. And what I feel like more is you have to be accepting of Jesus Christ and accept Him as your Lord and Savior, and love Him as your friend or as your brother, before you can even do all those other things. Those things are shown to you by God. I mean, other than the black and white scriptures, you've got to follow those exactly words for word. What he's telling you. But there's things that are on there, like this religion just kind of gets pushed at. You push that. You push that. >> It's weird, too. >> And it just seems like it's a little bit of a... >> That doesn't work anywhere else. >> Things that don't seem necessary when I'm pushed. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> It's like things that you learn later on. >> Yeah. You learn how to do that later on, but it's like if you were in fifth grade and they pushed a calculus test at you, and then when you failed it, because you didn't know anything about it, they were like, "Well, you can't go to school anymore. You don't know enough." It's above your level. >> Yeah. >> I'm going to hit that three more times during this episode. >> And you want to just push your mic a little bit more, John, so he doesn't do that no more. >> And a lot of times, I think people major on the minors and minor on the majors. >> I got you. >> You said that, right? >> Yeah. >> And when someone first gets saved or someone that's not necessarily familiar with Pentecost or holiness, it's easy to say, "Oh, well, you've got to do this, and you've got to do that." >> Right, yeah. >> But I read a story one time about a Catholic priest who was praying, and he said, "I know there's more to this than what I've been doing." And he'd been a Catholic priest for several years and really just got to seek and God, and God filled him with the baptism of the Holy Ghost, and they literally drove him out of the church. >> A Catholic? >> Yeah. >> They drove him completely out of the church, said that he lost his mind, and he was crazy and all this stuff, but instead of forcing things down people's throat, which I believe that you should live right, and I believe in a good standard and all of those things, but those things are things that you get with growth. >> Right, yeah. >> Now, it's different. You know, I have five kids. >> Absolutely. >> It's different for me to teach my kids when they're young because all they know is the church. >> Right. >> They don't know the world. >> Right. >> They've not got deep into things of the world. So, of course, yeah, I'm going to teach them what's right now, so they're going to be able to understand it better than just, I would rather explain to my kids and teach them now than for them to grow up and somebody come up and say, "Why do you do this?" Or, "Why don't you do this?" >> Yeah. >> And they say, "Well, I mean, my dad told me that." >> Sure. >> Yeah. >> I've always done it my whole life, you know. >> And that goes beyond parenting, that goes into pastoring and being preachers. If you can't explain why your standard is the way it is without just copying out or just saying, "Well, it's blah, blah, blah," appearance of evil kind of thing, which that is important. I'm not saying it's not, but if the only scripture you have for a standard is, you know, abstain from all appearance of evil, you need more than that. >> Well, the whole issue. >> You know, you know. >> Because there's a very... >> That's anything. I know. >> Yeah. >> And there's a very objective view that it could be anything. If that's all you have, then you should really question that standard. >> Right. >> Because it doesn't help. I've grown up at church my whole life. There's still things that I learned. I'm like, "Oh, that's why we don't do that." >> Right. >> Because you just don't know. You're just like, "Oh, we don't go to football games." >> We don't want to mix. We don't turn things. >> Right. It's for you to choose for yourself. But if you don't know why you even don't do it, then you're like, "Oh, that's not that bad." And then you do it because you've always had like, you know, if they don't tell you why to not touch the stove and you touch it, it's not on, you're like, "Oh, there's nothing wrong with that." >> Right. >> You know, it's a big part of it. >> And one thing that I struggled with for a while was I had, I'll say, a real world reason. It's not a church reason, but just, you know, why don't you go to football games? Why don't you go to football games? Or like crowds? >> Yeah. >> You know? Why don't you? >> So what you're saying is you were bound down. >> Yeah. >> I mean, I guess, but it was a way for me to avoid having that conversation. >> Yeah. Right. And I get that totally because, so I, personal conviction, I've wore long sleeves since I was eight years old. >> I'm sorry. >> Okay. >> And-- >> I'm sorry. >> Yes. >> I'm sorry. >> But I totally get where you're coming from because, like, growing up, I would have kids at school, you know, say, "I don't know how you do that. Long sleep." You've all, I mean, I'm sure you've all heard that. >> Yeah. >> I don't know how you wear a long sleeve shirt in the summer when it's hot outside. And my answer for years was, "Oh, it's actually cooler." If you think about it, people, when they're walking in the desert, they don't wear short sleeves. They don't go, I said, "They wear long, you know, layers and this and that." >> Yeah. >> They're completely covering their head, everything. >> And it was an easier way for me to kind of cop out of saying, "Well, actually, this is a personal conviction." >> Instead of having to explain it over and over and over again. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> So-- >> Mine is on from Florida. I was at a camp in Virginia and it was on a battleship and it probably was 107 degrees just on the deck because, you know, and everything is hot. >> People's not about it. >> No. We went on a field trip. >> Oh, okay. I was confused. >> Virginia Beach in July, it was, you know, it felt-- it actually wasn't as bad as Florida just because it wasn't as humid. It was similar, but not quite as bad, but people were like, "Why are you wearing long sleeves? Why are you so hot?" And I was like, "I'm from Florida, it's nothing, you know, but it's just the cop out thing." >> Yeah. >> And it was a camp in which I wouldn't have been like, it wasn't like a non-Christian camp either. >> But what's--but what--why do we make that more difficult than it has to be? Instead of being able to take that as a moment to witness and to talk to somebody, not to say, "Hey, I'm bound by this," but to say, you know, not that this is a sin for everybody, but me personally, this is a sacrifice that I've made to prove my loyalty and prove that I want more of God, not that--not that if I believe--do I think God would send me to help if I put a short-sleeve shirt on right now, I don't know, you know what I'm saying? >> Sure. >> But for me, I would feel so weird at this point in my life. >> Yeah. >> I mean-- >> That's a big part of it. >> Over--I don't even know. Over 25 years later to put one on and go out in public, it would be--be unreal, but-- >> Sure, for sure. >> Yeah. >> But instead of copying out and saying, "Oh, well, you know, it's really not that hot, it makes me cooler," or, "It's this," or, "It's that," it would be a whole lot easier to just go ahead and use that as a moment to witness to somebody. >> Yeah. >> Tell them the truth. >> Yeah, are we afraid that they're gonna, like, hit us with something and we change our mind? That would be kind of funny. >> I definitely know that. >> I definitely know that. >> It's actually cooler if you're wearing shorts and you're like, "Oh, really? I didn't know that." >> Wow. >> Or they make funny you and you're like, "Oh, I'm never doing that again." >> Yeah, well, I mean-- >> There's nothing to be afraid of. >> No. >> Realistically, they're not gonna argue with you, your personal belief is wrong. It's just, that's how you feel and that's where the conversation ends usually, or they initiate more. >> Well, my high school year, I literally, in sophomore, junior year, I can't remember exactly which one, but I was, I think, sophomore year. I literally was in physical fitness class and I was wearing tank top and shorts. No, fitness, it's different, not P.E. This is where you're weightlifting, you're learning nutrition. >> Oh, yeah. >> It's different. >> Yeah. >> This is like 20 years ago? >> This is probably, and I was probably, but I was doing all that and I was wearing tank top and shorts and that was just how I was doing it in high school. One day, for the same class, my dress out was long sleeves and pants, shorts, and long sleeve pants and long sleeve shirt. And everybody was just like, are you gonna get hot? Are you supposed to be dressing out? You need to dress out. I am dressed out. This is how I'm gonna dress out, but the reality for me was the Lord made me feel uncomfortable for wearing shorts and shorts. That was the uncomfortable part, but he was dealing with me. I had gotten saved, born in church, gotten saved. And not really professed my, not really professed my love for the Lord, but just being in church and seeing the way that it was, I literally was just like, I feel uncomfortable. And my answer to them was I just started feeling uncomfortable, that's it. And I feel more comfortable wearing long sleeves and pants. And knowing now that I could have been a witness to the people that were there then, really just makes me, makes me know I missed an opportunity, man. It's a little different for me because when I was going to high school, I wasn't in church. Well, I was going to church, but because I had to. But I still, like I still dressed the same because it's just how I dressed. But for PE, we'd have to dress out and they had to wear the uniform or something close to it, which was gym shorts, which are really uncomfortable, especially if you've been wearing jeans your whole life. So my excuse was, yeah, my excuse was, well, I've worn long pants, but whole life, my legs are white. It's weird. And I don't like the wind, I don't like that feeling on my legs. Well, you need to get a tan on the legs. It was, it was, I actually got told that one time and I was, I didn't like it. But that's the excuse, I've just always done it. That's it. But I mean, bringing that back to the three Hebrew children, sorry. They wouldn't bow for death. I mean, like we read that as a story and think, you know, oh, this is a cute kid story that we've learned from the time we were, you know, young, but if we're honest and really think, you know, these were these were real people that was put into this place, you know, do this or die. And we we cop out for so, so much less, yeah, and I love specifically another, another part of the story that I love is when Daniel speaks up and he says, or, excuse me, one of the three Hebrew children speaks up and says we're not, we're not careful to answer the, even if our God doesn't deliver us. Even if we do, you throw us into this fire and we do die. We're still not going to bow, we're still not going to compromise. And yeah, you know, back to the whole, back to the whole pride stuff that you're talking about, you know, we just remain silent for the most part because it's easier. Right. Yeah. And really, that's the truth. We're in, we're in such a more difficult time now than I think really ever has been about peer pressure and about, about people wanting you to be accepting of everything. Everybody's offensive, you know, they get offended by everything, so I just, I want to be able to stay in a world that says you should be accepting of everything to say, look, I'm not careful to answer you. Right. We're not, we're not for that. Love me or hate me. I'm not going to, I'm not going to pat you on the back. I'm not going to say it's right. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to hate you. I'm not going to, you know, persecute you or anything like that. I'm still going to pray for you. I hope that God saves you and delivers you from that lifestyle. But I'm not going to bow. But that's where it is frustrating because we don't want to be the one that is too much, you know? And that's where sometimes that you see it on the news and you'll see people talking about it and you see a quote that's like filled with hate from a supposed group that is supposed to be full of Christian love. And you think, I don't want to be like that person. And so you pull back even more than you would, even though you're in a moderate stance of just saying, I don't agree with it, but I still know people, I, you know, I don't have any problems as far as the people are concerned, I don't like the sin. But now it's, it's such a, and the three young men that we're referring to were taken from their homes and their homes were burned and, you know, brought into another country. And the problem with us now is that they weren't afraid of death because they'd faced it. Well, now we don't even have inconvenience really anymore to say, so that's what we're afraid of is the inconvenience of somebody else criticizing us for things. And so it's such a different scenario because the stakes have changed. And yes, we're not facing death, but if we were, it might help, you know, it might help us to see, oh, this is actually, we need to stand up for this. It's like when those, the missionaries in Haiti were killed, everybody, all of a sudden was like, whoa, this is important. This is like, people could die for this and all of a, everyone, you know, where we need to start posting this on Facebook, which is not much, would not much help when it comes to all the things to do, but sometimes we don't know what to do. And so if you say something at least, you, you, you join the crowd of people that are doing it. Whereas I'm sure there are people, I mean, think of all the other Hebrews that were there that knew they shouldn't bow down to that statue, but said, well, I won't be, I won't be worshiping it in my head, you know, and there could have been countless. We don't even know that just, they bowed down for the people around them. And we do it the same thing, especially when we're in church, we'll bow down for the people around us, but we're not really worshiping in our head, although in this case, it's the other way around, you know, instead of worshiping God or worshiping an idol. And if you, you know, you're like, I can't believe those people are standing. Why won't they just pretend? You know, that's how we're at right now is sometimes we don't agree with things, but we pretend that's not that bad. Can I read? Can I start? Go ahead. Go ahead. Yeah, go ahead. Let's do it. I'm going to just start reading that. And if you guys just say whatever you want in the middle of it. I hit the bell. Huh? I was joking. I was like, hit a bell. Just ding. Yeah. Let's go. And Daniel chapter three, verse one, Nebuchadnezzar the king is made an image of gold whose height was three score qubits and the breath of three, a breath there of six qubits. He set it up in the plane of Dura in the province of Babylon. Then Nebuchadnezzar the king sent together, gather together the princes and governors and captains, the judges and treasurers, the counselors, the sheriffs and the rulers of the provinces to come to the dedication of the image which Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up. Then the princes, the governors, the captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counselors, the sheriffs and all the rulers of the provinces were gathered together until the dedication of the image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up. And they stood before the image that Nebuchadnezzar had set up. Then an herald cried aloud to you. It is commanded, O people, nations and languages that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbutt, salt tree, dulcimer and all kinds of music ye fall down and worship the golden image and that Nebuchadnezzar the king has set up and who so falleth not down and worshipeth shall the same hour be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace. Sorry to interrupt you. There you go. I never really even thought about this so literally just there when you were reading that. That's the point of me trying to read it so you can get more fresh. When it talks about the different types it says that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbutt, salt tree, dulcimer and all kinds of music ye fall down and worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king has set up and it reminded me, me and my oldest daughter went on a little daddy daughter date the other day and we were in a store and they were playing some music in there and my daughter was like this sounds familiar and I said yeah I said they've played like three songs since we've been in here and every one of those like I kind of know the song because of being in stores like I've never listened to them outside of a store or outside of a public place but I kind of know parts of those songs and people will say oh I don't pay any attention I find a hard time to be possible. Especially as a musician for me at least. When music comes on dad gets mad at me all the time because some song will be playing and I'll just be just bobbing with the music. Yeah but that's society every store you're gonna go into has some music and funny enough it's so faint that if you when you hear it it's in the back of your mind and it kind of gets stuck in there for some reason. And a lot of times you don't may not even realize that that's what's crazy to me because it's like with her that again it permeates your subconscious thoughts it does it really does but with like with her at six years old you know she's like wow that sounds familiar and I'm thinking I know for a fact you have never heard this you've never listened to this song ever but from being in the store and then she proceeds to tell me what the next line is and I'm like how do you even and then I realize hey wait a minute how do you know I know that yeah but but to go back to the story with this that was a that was their signal that was that was their signal to bow down yeah you know and and we live in a time where music is so huge yeah I mean there's so many different genres in music and and things out and yeah yeah so like it just goes deeper and deeper yeah and that's another way that's easier so easy to kind of bow down and yeah you know I've heard people that I know maybe at work or you know just family members talk about songs and music and I'm like sadly I have to admit I know what you're talking about not because I listen to it I don't but sure you know I live in the world I'm not under yeah yeah but not other it's so huge too and I was thinking of this it was I think was yesterday I was watching a video and it was like describing two different artists one was from the 70s and one was there were both funk groups but it was like one was rewriting they made their own song based off of the original song and it was they were talking about the difference in the quality of recording and one of them was they spent I mean millions actual millions of to get the studio to have all the mixing done all of this stuff the other one is intentionally made to sound like it was recorded in somebody's just living room because it was it actually was recorded somebody's living room it was just them sitting there and the way they produce it is just everything is super compressed everything is all together but it's it's intentionally made to just sound offhand and just kind of like oh whatever you throw it together right and that's the music scene now we're either because everybody's doing the pop scene of like everything has to be over produced and super like you know it has to sound the best it can versus somebody who now is trying to stick out by doing things like just oh it's whatever because that's back in the day they used to do that it was just throw whatever you have mm-hmm and it was super neat to me the difference in that but the fact that both of those can work as a song mm-hmm says something to how music is being produced today and how big it is because anybody can do it now you know it's just anybody can just pull up their you know how do you interface I could do it right now song can just put it out there mm-hmm and it's just an okay computer and an instrument yeah right yeah anything just what we have here yeah but it's crazy how that uh that kind of stuff bleeds into the church to yeah yeah yeah like we obviously we know the church is supposed to be separate from the world like yeah yeah completely and yet you know not just not just a local thing but the church as a whole it seems like all of those different stages and different things of music yeah make their way into the church at some point or another yeah yeah I mean and you also use for some reason the same back beats that you hear in the world of music because it's interesting to the younger generation right and they they draws them into the church it's it's the signal is what they stay here and then they start to worship because they hear that that's I think it's because if you don't if you don't do that in ways and I'm not saying like completely rip off songs or whatever but just in general if you don't do that then you just have a gap so you're not going to take and go against the gates of hell imagine if you're imagine if you're listening to like let's say Christian or not Christian but say you're in the worldly hip hop sure right and then you go into a church and there's none of that at all you're just going into hymns the the transition into that is smack against the wall right then you got Christian hip hop which is the same back beat of the worldly hip hop that ends up the scripture saying um what's the scripture about um some of the part taking of the world um be separate from the world being not conform to the sword but be transformed by the renewing of your mind there you go how did you just have that I had it I had it for them I was like that was Roman's 12 and 2 yeah wow so basically yeah they have that to where you go from the worldly hip hop and transitioning into Christian hip hop and and it just it just so happens that they're taking the backbeat of the worldly stuff and making it into and slowly transforming the way that you process music as well yeah are you yeah it's yeah it would be hard to just go into a church with that but um that was awesome that just ran over and had the right churros real quick I want to I want to lord this is way less spiritual but the the statue was three score cubits which is um ninety feet tall and it was said to be nine feet wide that the statue was so your twin brother just kidding um it really seems no laugh track come on give me a laugh track seems like he made it so big so it would it would almost be imposing like like somebody who hasn't been to the city and you're walking in your hot tub is attached to liberty that's good question I don't know that seems like about but it's it's like the like he wanted it to be a great yeah overwhelmed thank I don't know why I couldn't think of that yeah like like that he wanted that to be a part of it so that your mind would be it'd be scary to just yeah intimidating yeah yeah it's like wow yeah about the same height no three hundred five feet this is ninety feet oh they're mine so that's triple that yeah um so it would almost seem appropriate something so big and grand then of course you're gonna do what he said when the music plays yeah that that's that's the thought that I had the first one of the day um but yeah that's so they think it's it's also made out of gold entirely out of gold yeah how bright that was with the sun shining on it mm-hmm and it like it must have been a sight for miles you like what is that and you know drive your chariot closer and you're like whoa is that a giant statue and then you hear fans yeah it was draw you into see yeah your fancy music but I was like oh some kind of ceremony going on here you know it just pulls you in and that's the goal exactly see that you know like who's that cool guy that they made a statue out of mm-hmm and it turns out to be a horrible guy he's a horrible system that so you know that makes sense right therefore at that time when all the people heard the sound of the cornet flute harp sack butt salt tree and all kinds of music the other people the nations and the languages fell down and worth the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up where for at that time certain caldians came near and accused the Jews they spake and said to the king Nebuchadnezzar oh king live forever thou king has made a decree that every man that shall hear the sound of the cornet flute harpsack but salt tree and dulcemer and all kinds of music shall fall down and worship the golden image and who so falleth not down and worshipeth that he should be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace there are certain Jews whom thou has set over the affairs of the province of Babylon Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego these men oh king have not regarded thee they serve not thy gods nor worship the golden image which thou has set up so so that part of the story too is is awesome because these men had found favor with the king they were they were prisoners they weren't you know they weren't supposed to be over provinces like they weren't supposed to be as exalted as they were and that's exactly what the devil does and the world does is you know you wonder why things go a certain way have you I mean you face trials and you think why am I going through this why am I facing this well I mean a lot of it is like you know at work why does this person have something against me I'm not done anything to them well it's because the devil does not like when God's people are lifted up and when God's people are exalted and they conspired against these men like they specifically went and went and ratted them out basically the same thing with Daniel exactly the same thing with Daniel that you know hey you made a decree that this guy's not supposed to be bound or praying and he is anyways yeah these guys are supposed to be bound down and they're not bounding right yeah and they won't sure not at all well sometimes you you know sometimes you get good things because the devil wants you to have something to lose so he you know you're in charge of all these nice things and you're like man this is going so well for me and all of a sudden it all comes crashing down mm-hmm but you know at this point they want to just afraid of losing their position they're afraid of losing their lives well as soon as you disobeyed what what the devil or in this case the king has said for you to do yeah there's outrage and you're gonna get the punishment that's coming to you you're gonna get whatever whatever we say you deserve you know whether that's gonna be burning in the fiery furnace or you know death or whatever whatever means jail prison sentence or right lions then well you bow you're swimming with the river you're swimming with the flow it's easy mm-hmm and then as soon as you stand up against it then all of a sudden it's like yeah pushes against you do you think if if one of the three boys had had Neil do you think the other two of the state standing mmm which hmm so which one do you think would would have no I don't think would have known most likely uh a bed nickel yeah I think yes I was thinking no I don't think any of them would know but if there was one that did I think they would both where's Daniel and I don't know where was he Daniel where was Daniel somewhere else I guess he wasn't there he was he was with the king they called everybody Darius no no there's never get his and they called everybody who was there he was after he was a replacement of right okay Daniel was a brother to the Hebrew children yeah yeah we're what they just never talked about where to be I mean it's script early I don't yeah they just didn't say I just didn't know cuz built a shazars and then shadrat me shad men ago yeah yeah so I don't know maybe he was checking things out for the king or something because he was a lot higher up they were they were in province positions because of Daniel because of him interpreting his dream yeah so you know because they had prayed with him then he said hey can my you know friends get in position and they're like alright sure yeah and then you know but for some reason he's not there I'm sure he wouldn't have bowed either he would have been right there with them mmm there's there's five men in the fire they would have to say that because there was four in the fire but yeah I don't know I don't know it's funny to think that everybody's called there but then they don't mention Daniel ever in the story then Nebuchadnezzar and his rage and fury commanded to bring shadrat me shack in the bed and ago then they brought these men before the king Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them is it true oh shadrat me shack in the bed and ago do not ye serve my gods nor worship the golden image which I have set up now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet flute harp sack butt salt tree and dulcemer and all kinds of music ye fall down and worship the image which I have made well but if I but if ye worship not ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands so now he's he's calling them out specifically yeah completely yeah and giving you know I'm saying he's you're gonna do this or you're gonna get that yeah your people your entire race have already fallen down to worship my god mm-hmm but you won't so here's your one chance second chance second chance to bow mm-hmm yeah basically somebody going are you sure yeah yeah and we're easy we'll sometimes we will bow down to ourselves like our own inner thoughts and not even when people are not even outside yeah people aren't even fighting a separate and our internal battle is just causing us to lay aside even though no one's actually reacted to it negatively right well just think about I mean didn't you mention peer pressure earlier about you know like some people will say you know I don't like the one of the most common forms of peer pressure hey why don't you grab the cigarette and smoke it you know let's just smoke it just smoke it or if you don't do it and you won't be in my circle of friends you won't deserve to be there you know how hurtful that could be but that's oh yeah the ultimate I mean yeah not to be not to be included right John his is a line he's got no friends right but uh my circle of friends but I mean in the same sense you're gonna be you're being told to do something or you're gonna be killed in a fiery furnace right yeah so I mean choose death let me at that point you're just what you're definitely doing so I'd like me checking the bed and go answering and said to the to the king oh Nebuchadnezzar we are not careful to answer the in this matter so it's all of them if it be so our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace and he will deliver us out of dine hand okay oh did I read that wrong he will be able he will deliver us out of dine hand okay but if not be it known unto thee oh king that we will not serve thy gods nor worship the golden image which thou had set up then was Nebuchadnezzar full of fury and the form of his visage was that say that word right visage was changed against had wrapped me second to bed in the go therefore he spake and commanded that they should heat the furnace one seven times more than it was than it was won't to be heated and he commanded to the most mighty men that were in his army to bind shadrak me shak and the bed in the go and they cast them into the burning fiery furnace then these men were bound in their coats their hosen and their hats and their other garments and were cast into the midst of the burning fiery furnace therefore because the king's commandment was urgent and the furnace exceeding hot the flame of the fire slew those men that took up shadrak me shak and the bed in the go and these three men shadrak me shak and bed in the go fell down bound into the midst of the fire of the burning fiery furnace then Nebuchadnezzar the king was anointed and rose up in haste and spake huh a stony oh then Nebuchadnezzar the king was a stony did i say anointed you said anointed yeah scratch that a stony and rose up in haste and spake and said unto his counselors did not we cast three men bound into the mist of the fire they answered and said unto the king true oh king he answered and said lo i see four men loose walking in the midst of the fire and they have no hurt and no form of the fourth is like the son of god then what how did he know what the form of the son of god good question what do you think about the king looking i feel like because he shown brought he shined brighter than the fire i mean you could tell a difference you know there was a difference in the son of god and the three children like the three boys yeah you could you could tell there was a total difference and he was so much brighter than the than the fire that they were seeing there that there was no denying who it was i'm curious as to the fact that he didn't even believe in their god that's the that's the crazy part and then believing and seeing that this is the form of the this person is the form of the son of god yeah he couldn't he couldn't even claim that it was one of their gods no he had to have known it i think god had to put it in his heart for him to see it because no there's no other explanation like god had to put that that um what's the word i'm looking for humility in his in his heart or tenderness in his heart for him to know and see that this is not anything that he's known or seen before that's something that he cannot understand so what else can it be but the son of god but deep i think deep down he had to have known that these idols that they've worshiped all their lives i mean yeah their man made idols like like how do you how do you make a golden statue and you know proclaim it to be a god and and truly believe oh you know this this is our savior no like you made it yeah especially if you mess it up i mean what an ignorant dude the same thing oh that doesn't look good let me remake it but that's that's the god you know i think this is how i think this is how you know and this is Matthew 16 and 16 and Simon peter answered and said that were the christ the son will live in god and jesus answered and said unto him blessed art thou Simon bargeona for flesh and bloodeth not revealed it unto thee but my father which is in heaven i don't think you need to have anybody tell you what it is i think god will show you i was right god had to show him yeah i mean that's just you know my thought on it is that i mean that's the only real explanation is god had to have given him in his heart and get made him a tender heart and to understand that this is something that he cannot explain and that's such an impossible thing for other people to believe that the other versions change that he saw his mighty men burn yeah before getting to the fire furnace we need to get back to those world leaders being so creative and inventive like off the fly you know what i mean like we need a fire yeah we're like we're like i mean that is inventive on its own but then he got mad and in the middle of his horrible anger he had enough clarity of mind to just go seven times hotter and put all their clothes on bind him up yeah he did the biggest guys we have like it's just like he has all these details in there that he just he didn't need to throw that in but he's like seven times hotter it's crazy because they had to do it they didn't just turn up a dial they didn't go get wood they had to go stoke the wood seven times more how do they measure that but somehow he called for it and they had to go through and they were they were bound in their coats and hose and and their hats which i didn't think they had a lot of work you know do you know what though there's a little pumps they use to to the bellows yeah yeah those things they had to have used those two because you know you have you ever done that with a fire like big the set of bellows we told my dad my me and my dad i'm sorry i don't know i just have a mental image of a guy that just has to jump on it i believe is the guy who was operating the bellows out of breath and winded and then he watches all the guards get burned up and he feels like it's his fault like my side's about to hurt guys oh my god well me and my dad were me and my dad were making a fire and we had the vacuum and we put it and we put it on it we put the hose on the and on the exit side and he put it toward the fire and the fire just went like it's so big it was so big it was so crazy but i imagine that's what it was like i jumped the giant guy jumps up in platform all i could think of is willy wonka and the and the and the umpa lumpus jumping up and down yeah oh man that's so worldly it just willy wonka he was uh thomas's brother you don't know what he wonka it's like candy maker he's the um chocolate maker the uh i don't know why he explained he had been the one that created skittles yeah he was he went i think he was you know what he wonka he actually did create gobstoppers that's the same thing um gobstoppers everlasting gobstoppers was a custom engagement you heard of charlie and child effect there you heard of it he's charlie man it was actually uh it was nessanel's brother that was under the fig tree with him he uh no these uh this is uh uh can any good thing come out of cana and then you know or nazareth or whatever it was yeah nazareth and it was like yeah it was like something can but but yeah that's i can i can just see the people blowing the thing and making it hotter too not just poking the though to make her chocolate yeah yeah chocolate yeah making it a lot more smooth and rich the hotter it is the easier it is to cook yeah it goes down the pipes last year yeah then nevekineser came near to the mouth of the back whoa do you think they were hot sorry i just realized they were in all their clothes and but i i don't think they were hot no no they weren't hot fire but were they just overheated because all their clothes i don't think they were overheated that would be funny i don't know i think in the middle of a fiery furniture like man i didn't think it was like dac he's like taking this his hat off in fan yeah mmm man and they probably there's hardly these hoes are really clinging to my legs like you just i think it was the opposite i think they were needing a coat in there oh this true maybe oh yeah that'd be good man i'm glad it gave me my hand it was like AC and now yeah oh here jesus you cold you only have your tuner here let me put let me put a little bit on you then nevekineser came near to the mouth of the burning fiery furnace and spake and said shadrapt michak and abednego ye seren to the most high god come forth and come hither then shadrapt michak and abednego came forth of the midst of the fire and the print and the princes governors and captains and the kings counselors being gathered together were the sheriffs they're dead oh that's probably oh my word being gathered together saw these men upon whose bodies the fire had no power so right there proves to you they weren't hot yeah true fire had no power oh yeah because like neither were their codes changed mmm man nor the smell of fire had passed on them they didn't even smell like smoke oh man i wish i could sit by fire can you wish that can you wish that and all seriousness like uh at the homecoming last year they had the little bonfire out there and everywhere i would move my chair the smoke was yeah always blowing right in your face coming right at me and you you walk away and you're like oh man you all you smell like fire yeah you smell like the smoke mm-hmm right but these guys were literally in the midst of like standing in fire standing right in the midst of it probably the hardest thing that had happened up to that point yeah like you just seven times hotter furnace and how do you how did they get out they had a door door at the bottom it's like a it would actually it sounds like yeah it sounds like i've done it before do we actually know what the firefighters look like yeah it's like a giant tube right you have this and you just have a hole you just throw people in when the fire is going right it's like a little oven but there's like a hole at the top so it's just like i'm opening here so you and then if you're one of the soldiers you i burn up and then and then you there's like a door at the bottom i guess we collect the ashes or something i don't know but the they have a little door at the bottom you come not about it and put the wood i would imagine you had to tend to fire with a door at the bottom yeah that makes sense which he was where he's watching you know when you like you like look in the microwave to watch your food cook he was like you know i got to see this and he just walked down and went through i always had like the image of like like a melting pot sitting above a fire my concert just called him yeah like like that's just like throw him into the fiery pot yeah that was just the image that i had like it was a solid piece and most of the fire was coming from underneath there was some inside but no you know what a furnace looks like no they've never seen a furnace well that's the easiest way to answer that yeah so we i worked at a uh die casting facility one time uh making just on all kinds of i have i've worked on what they did read jesus's crucifixion they did die casting as well well that's crazy but but it lasted a lot that's all right yeah but at this facility at this uh facility they had these big furnaces that they would put all this aluminum in and it was so like it was molten aluminum yeah and i that's kind of what i imagined when i see there's a big there is a big opening kind of kind of the same concept as you're talking there was a big opening where they would feed it and they would just put bars of aluminum in there yeah they would melt and they had they had access like they had to have access panels to get in there to clean them periodically because they would get built up and yeah i'm sure somebody's made a rendering of it of some kind of like kind of what it would look like i think it was like you had to throw them in so then they wouldn't like i don't want to get up and run out maybe it's like he did say come up yeah i think it was like a lower an elevated platform they throw them all the way in and then you see it you know you see them cook at the bottom hmm so he said come up you know throw them in i think i'm trying to see where it where it showed where it asked him to come come out of the fire he says oh i'm sorry he said come forth and come here yeah yeah so come come get come out of the firing come here okay you're coming here you're all right so uh where am i at 28 then they'll be connected to spilt uh then they'll be connected to spake and said let's be the god of shadrach michak in abednego who has sent his angel and delivered his servants that trusted in him this is troubling me because he says first he said he was a son of god now he's calling him an angel in the heat of the moment net pun is not intended there uh in the heat of the moment if you if you have it's intended it wasn't intended not i would have noticed you're right that's why i've realized halfway through saying it that it works but in the heat of the moment you you like uh you say things and then when you have to give a speech you kind of back off of them a little bit you have to you know like make it presentable to all audiences so i'm sure that he was you know he said the son of god because that's what he knew but then he's thinking about it later and he's like yeah i don't know maybe angel i don't i don't want to call him out by that i could be wrong you know call him out by me he started overthinking yeah i wouldn't want to mis- misidentify this gentleman here you know uh so then he says also doesn't the Bible say that no man shall see the face of god of god yeah yeah but jesus also said if you see me he's seen the father so he did say that truth bomb i just i just i'm not saying that he got roasted yeah he said they were all i got roasted it said that they were walking around his brother it doesn't seem like he was walking around back to him the whole time to me hmm it says his face is very it was its form of yeah the form of the fourth yeah so i think that's the son of god it's really hard to see through a fire i just realized so possibly he just didn't really you didn't really see what was going on been an outline and yeah it kind of makes sense yeah that tunic looks a little like it's not a god or maybe the gory could have just been that much brighter than the fire yeah and i think that's what it could have been to i mean if the lord showing you that this is this is jesus or this is the son of god he's gonna see him as a different figure you know look just moses receiving the ten commandments and and glory was shined the glory was shining so bright on him can you imagine what like the son of god the son of god in that moment i think it'd be a lot brighter maybe maybe ten times brighter could be seven times probably seven times brighter maybe seven times brighter well i should i should have lived with that first oh sound like you're surrounded mosquito who has all right then never heard a spake and said let's be the god of shadra me shakin abednego who has sent his angel and delivered his servant that trusted in him and have changed the king's word and yielded their bodies that they might not serve nor worship any god except their own god therefore i make a decree that every people nation and language would speak anything amiss against the god of shadra me shakin abednego shall be cut in pieces and their houses shall be made a dung hill because there is no other god that can deliver after this sort then the king promoted shadra me shakin abednego in the province of babylon that's a big a big way to to in the story where he goes yeah it's a very big change you guys bow down to my statue as my god you didn't bow down god saved you delivered you there is no other god than shadra me shakin abednego's god and if anybody talks about their god they'll be cut up in their houses be done or done well it's kind of like tom is doubting until he saw him there was actual evidence of it and then he was like oh no you right you right basically yeah pretty much i mean yeah i mean back to that more extreme punishment by the way but he was i mean no prompting whatsoever he starts to give a speech and he comes up with a completely new way to punish people he's just like cutting the pieces and your houses made a dung hill he's like you didn't need the second part you're already dead but yeah it's so funny to me that he was just so good that's just a testimony of what happened yeah yeah i mean wow more evidence and then until he forgot like you know to change the man you change the man's idea of what god is not not their own god but god the father who who sent his son you know that's that's the god he wants he has to keep finding punishments that won't kill all his guards yesterday but that one that's funny i didn't see the sheriff's dude that's yeah that's crazy yeah that's well who would you want to be your sheriff's the little scrawny dude those are the strongest people in the kingdom is that sentiment in the fire oh my word well that's just speculation right yeah that's just a game that's just a theory right now that it might have been this sheriff's that sent them in the fire there's no evidence against it and there's speculation for it so far so it's probably fact yeah true basically yeah they were the only ones left out of the i think he had a list of punishments he just thought of randomly and he's just like these he had he had a guy who's only job was to write down the punishment yeah yeah he's got a fish boy he's like you're cut the pieces yeah house just made it down yo that sounds good so don't bow down because you'll be glorified later true master hopefully yeah hopefully yeah or you'll get burned in earth i mean it's like it sometimes it doesn't work well on the earth like yeah you know sometimes it's you feel like it's not the right call you like they should have done that and then later on we have our reward in heaven that we don't even know that's what this what the bible said you know they have their reward yes right you know that's and i mean both ways if you whether you serve the lord you have your reward if you don't serve the lord you have your reward yeah well and then reward both ways why didn't you earn it and you earn both for sure well and what back to that either one in secret versus you know rewarding in heaven why were shadrek micha gonna bid to go not bowing down it wasn't for the promotion they didn't know they're gonna get a promotion no it wasn't for any other reason it wasn't for other warriors not dishonoring god sometimes people are standing up for their glory and even those people the year like oh they were making a stand the whole time their true intentions will be revealed at the judgment we might be very surprised by some people because we don't know yeah what people's true intentions are all the time and some people may appear selfless and have selfish motives behind the scenes even unbeknownst to them sometimes sometimes you have to check yourself and make sure you're not doing something for the wrong reason yeah because you feel like oh it's the right thing to do but i don't think there's a person in the bible they didn't think that it was the right thing to do and they were evil and wicked you know oh what's the right thing to do neighbor needs you know to give up his vineyard just kill neighbor you know it's the right thing to do it's easy and all this stuff and consequence was doing to follow anyway exactly and that's what they probably didn't understand sure yeah it's true this might be a complete rabbit trail but the lord gave me this the other night um when we were at church when Jesus went back to Bethany after Lazarus had died the sisters came to him they said lord if you had been here our brother would not have died yeah he knew before he died that he was very sick and that he he was going to die i mean he told he told the disciples are from Lazarus sleepeth yeah and i mean he knew he was dead right and then when he gets there you know we all know john 11 35 Jesus wept right but they they basically ask him they say lord why didn't you come and he said so that the son of man might be glorified yeah he let this he let this happen so that he would be lifted up and then he also said if i be lifted up i'll draw all men nyan to me so kind of what you were saying while i go you know if you do lift him up you'll be exalted with that not that you do it for that not that you you know not that you live the certain way because you want everybody to think oh i'm this holy great person that you know that kind of goes the opposite direction if you have that motive but yeah right yeah but it is in that story there is evident you know jesus specifically total you know for my glory yeah and we wonder sometimes why do i have to face this and why do i have to go through this and why is it a constant struggle and a lot a lot of times the blind man that he fought that that um in the same exact chapter right whether the same chapter same same same book the blind man went to jesus and he said would you hear me and the people around him said jesus what did this man do that he said his parents stand or his saying that he was born blind and he said neither his parents nor him that was born blind but that the son might be glorified thereby and that was just like yeah that's the reason why but that's not not you or not not you're saying it's for the glory of jesus that you will be healed but in the moment it's so hard to accept that yeah i mean it's it's hard to to say you know i my bills are due next week and i have no money in the bank account yeah thank you lord let me let me just go ahead and let you be glorified i mean i'm worried about it it's it's it's hard in that moment but i mean it is now we know that all things work together for the good of them yeah that love got our calls according to the right so so i mean finish it finish it finish it uh-huh finish that ship those are the called according to his purpose yeah here you go here you go sorry i couldn't finish it sorry but we you know yeah in the moment it's so hard to accept that and be be jolly about it and who wasn't this almost david said uh though he tried me i come forth his gold right i mean it's not it's not easy to be happy in the trial counted all joy when it's all and it's every temptation it's it's one of those things how do you in that moment counted as joy right how do you in that moment say wow i i am so thankful to go through this for the glory of god then what were you talking about to mama about you remember she was going choose listing all her troubles oh yeah you talked to her about paul and all his things yeah he had a list and i you you don't even know i was literally about to say that that paul had his list that he went through and he was like you know twice i was beaten right you know these numbers right and i was thinking yeah i was shipwrecked two times and i was thinking about how you know you you didn't call world war one world war one in 1917 it was the great war right because he were like my man i hope we never have another one of those but it's like if you told paul like oh there's a shipwreck number one buddy like he would be horrified but and and wouldn't be happy about it at the moment but now at the end of his life he has this long list and and at the end he's like it's not for me i was that's not you know so i will be glorified it so the father can you i i went through this he i made it into the race he didn't do it so people would say you went through this to reach people yeah he did it so that it could be said that he went through it so god could reach yeah he was he was he was the vessel yeah i mean the list is awful and our list is nothing i mean you know bank account low that's stone to raise back that's like you know and then right yeah same city but it's it's all in like at that time it was and now these issues are are for us you know it's it translates now to us in different ways yeah and it's proportional in that way and so our list sometimes is viewed as badly as that for us you know we have our individual list that some people can do a lot more and take a lot more than we can even today with these missionaries that go out and you're like i could never do that right and there's i can never handle all the you know things north korea you could be jailed and and things for just having a bible series consequences just for that and and it does exist today but we're not we're not in it you know and so we have to deal with the list that we have and and if we have um if we have our list that we're going through i agree it's hard to find the joy in that but sometimes we go through it just i mean think of the woman with the issue of blood it wouldn't be the same story if she had had it three years how many thousands if not millions of times has that been preached and that been used and and helped people yeah for sure for sure i mean yes and and it's something about that that huge number that we would never want to have but when you do have it is something greater that like i went through this for blank years and you're like man i wish i hope i never have to do that but that person can go through it and then you you know and then when you have a small number that feels it great to you then you they went through it for 12 years i can you know i'm that's enough and and the the detail that she had spent all she had she had done everything in herself to solve the problem that she had or to have others solved the problem that she had and it it failed sure you can also look at it through papal lens and say i went through it so i can pray for you right i know how to pray for you because i've been through it and if i had a hurt back for 18 years or whatever and there's someone who's going through a hurt back right now and they're and they're you know devastated about it i know what it feels like i know what it feels like i know what it feels like i can i can pray with sympathy then knowing that or is it sympathy or empathy that and is it empathy for if you've gone through yeah so i can pray with empathy knowing what it felt what it feels like and i can pray un earnestly because i know i've been through it you know same situation and the human reaction is to go the other way human reaction is not not even working hard for two weeks long we're our 18 years you know but it's a different thing we have to control that because we all humans want to be better than the other human yeah you know most of the time so we have to control that and just say you know sure man i'm so glad that you haven't gone through those 18 years of tournament let me pray that you don't you know let me pray that it gets healed right now yeah you know but i i read a story i think it was polycarbon who was who was a martyr and the story that i was reading if it wasn't him i'm sorry but i'm pretty sure so it was um he had a little boy um like eight or ten years old and when he was being burned to the stake he uh his little boy told he came to him before it happened and said daddy i'm scared he said why you know why are you doing this why are you letting this happen and he said because he said i feel the presence of the lord and his his son young son didn't understand that and he said how do i know that god is still with you and he said whenever you think that i'm all um he said watch me and if my hands are raised that i still feel the presence of the lord oh wow and he was they they burn him um they burn him at the stake and well we try as the as the fire as the fire began to come up and it it got about you know chest high was getting ready to completely consume him he had his hands to his side and his little boy stood there just crying and he said god why did you why did you leave my daddy why did you forsake him and all of a sudden through the through the weakness that you know no doubt he had his arms slowly begin to raise and he had his arms held up high what a testimony yeah wow to be able to lead that for your kids to say in the midst of the fire literally yeah not not just the you know not just the trial fire but physical fire of death that i can say just like just like these children that we've been talking about i i'm i'm not going to compromise i'm not going to give up because i still feel the presence of the lord and he's right there and he's right there it's the friend that's taking us closer than the brother it's amazing like like you were saying hindsight's 2020 so to look to look back so you can look back and and see well you know that wasn't so bad i made it through that easily but when you're there it's a little harder to say when you're in the middle of it it's the worst thing right i mean when you're in the middle of the storm it's it's it seems hopeless it doesn't yeah it's bad we've you know probably all said it god where are you at why did you leave me here yeah but at the end for those without even that to to call on it's hard that's why we have so much is that our time is a depressing time and for those without god to call on it's it's much much worse because even if we feel forsaken we know at one point that we felt the presence of the lord but it you know that's why suicide is so high i mean i just went to the doctor and it's just a normal checkout going through the list of questions that's always on there of just you know if you ever are you depressed have you ever thought of hurting yourself and for me that answers no thank the lord for that but if i didn't have the lord to call on and i had all sorts of things going on with me then it is it is stress it is more that's a very real question too i think a lot of times we as a church overlook depression and we over we we think of it as we think of it as maybe a crutch and that sounds bad to say but but i've i've been there to where i think well you know come on you know yeah like the old saying says suck it up buttercup like you can yeah but you're a little sad but but to look yeah exactly but but when you have dealt with that because you know i i know everybody or i feel like everybody at some point or another in their life deals with some sort of depression now there's a difference in being depressed from time to time and chronic living in the spirit of depression i mean that's the spirit it is and there's so many spirits we we don't say suck it up that's the one that we're like no just be happy like you know cry and then so many if you were possessed by a devil we'd pray it out of you we wouldn't say no no just get better like it we have to treat it with consideration what is wrong with you it's a real thing yeah i mean it and sometimes we throw those people aside and just kind of say it'll be fine just write it off as write it off as like i'm almost almost as a minimalist look at all the good things in your life yeah it's just it's not that easy mm-hmm that's sad man it that it really is and to feel hopeless like is that that's heartbreaking to me to know that there's people out there that know god and that that have been saved or maybe even are saved and still feel as as there's no hope yeah i've been i've been with depression for quite a little while and i mean as far as diagnosed by a therapist being depressed right and you know one of the biggest things for me was the Holy Ghost not i mean not receiving the Holy Ghost for a long while and i'm just like i'm not receiving because there's something wrong with me and i don't know where to find it at and then also just every life every life with depression that i've got like no one cares about me i'm not enough you know i will never be amount i never be enough but then you have the reassurance from the lord that you are enough that you know once you get the Holy Ghost which i received the Holy Ghost you know once you receive the Holy Ghost all that gets cast away you don't have any doubts with it what what who use who's you are you know you are the lords the lord comforts you and there's no more questioning you know why am i ever going to feel that way again and that doesn't mean that the Holy Ghost is comforting for you that doesn't mean that you that that isn't there is that doesn't mean that it's never going to try to come back no it but you can but you can point and say uh-huh this is where i was delivered yeah doesn't necessarily devil's never going to give up yeah nope he's not ever going to stop and say well you got the Holy Ghost now i guess guess you proved me wrong good good game man you know that that's never gonna have any time you try to put adhg back on me it's i feel like in this episode no probably yeah i mean specifically yeah right even those normal human experiences of us forgetting things to do because that's all it is it's just almost expanded yeah and the devil say oh it's back you know it's back oh exactly you know you you thought about this that means you're not saved anymore it's just like no that's just how our minds work we have to go past that yes and if it's something serious as for repentance but if not keep going you know the thought is not the sin catching the thought keeping it yeah right because it's the reaction yeah there's there's times when i've when i've stubbed my toe and the thoughts popped into my head i'm like what no yeah right but there's there's the difference in well yeah you know that's a that's an appropriate response that's that's where it becomes an issue i was in the church i would have said that yeah listen you know the bible said jesus said that if you even look upon a woman and desire that you've lost it not what i was talking about cussing then you've cussed it but then you've desired the cuss but having the thought and then immediately saying no that's at at least to me i was allowed bump what did it even go it's gone it's fine i fell into the void it's okay it's okay don't worry about it it's but as far as that goes to like you're saying looking upon a woman with lust looking at a woman doesn't necessarily yeah mean it's with lust right you know you can't help what walks in front of your face it's it's these days one i'm scared to go Walmart it's when it's when you take that prolonged look yeah or you take that second or third look i mean fifth many yeah it's it's true it's true it's but it's the thing it's like uh i forget who said it but the the attraction isn't the sin it's the reaction to the attraction that's good so if you talk to sous sure just let's let's blame it let's blame it on dr sous but if you see a woman and she's an attractive woman just doesn't mean that you've sinned because you looked at an attractive woman but if you react to that attraction and say in your thoughts wow what a woman and what things that's that's the attraction that you shouldn't be having right that's the that's the reaction that you shouldn't be having those are the thoughts that makes it a sin and then reacting to those thoughts and actually doing that makes even second even more deeper but that's where i mean even jesus was tempted he never sinned but that doesn't mean the thoughts weren't there right exactly you know it's the reaction to it you know he said man shall not live but um i'm read alone but by every word that proceeds of the morning when he and this i don't know if he's worried of the lord yeah yeah i don't know if this is out of line or not but he had to consider the temptation to come up with their response he couldn't just throw it because like many times we'll say oh don't even think about temptation just throw it out yeah but if we just throw it out then it's just going to keep coming back so we don't have a good reason why we're throwing it out because we're not even going to kill it you have to say this is why it's bad and you have to consider what it is to figure out why it's bad and not just immediately just you know before you can even see what it is you know you're just like oh this is bad boom you know and and we should to a certain extent yes we should abstain from that yes but we also should recognize where the danger is because sometimes if it doesn't look as dangerous it's like oh that's not even that bad compared to this and then you start partaking but it's just a smaller version of that yeah and all of a sudden we're in the middle because we didn't consider what this truly is all its forms yeah exactly that's good you never start out with heroin you know you always have to start wow and move further along yeah or so i've heard it's true you know but it's it's like you can't okay this this analogy might not work we're going further i'll just say this how many analogies we've just wait what this is the only analogy i'm going to try this is the only analogy i'm going to try but it's like yeah out of out of work there's a lot of of bugs and critters right um for the most part it's usually a mosquito you don't work in a restaurant field no i don't know in construction but the same reaction the same reaction that you do for a mosquito where you just smack it yeah won't work on a wasp yeah i don't want to smack a wasp i'm allergic to those that's not going to be any good i'm just i'm just a big baby i hate wasp right so the same thing can be said about sin where some sins you immediately push it away and that's the end of it others you have to deal with it differently right but somebody that's allergic to bees is going to have a whole lot more of a reaction to the bee than i'm going to have yeah to me i could clap a bee and it would be the end of it and it wouldn't bother me right and that's why that's why i think it's so we're we're individuals like we're all our own people and so so you may have you may face something that to me i'm like john are you why are you struggling with this yeah like what's like what's going on here why are you why are you acting like this is a big deal i mean we've we've all seen people that maybe a little spiders crawling on them and they go crazy you're like you're like what are you serious it's a little spider yeah but spiritually spiritually speaking you know that happens a lot i may i may make you know something huge out of something that's nothing at all yeah and vice versa but i think that's why it's so beneficial for us to have brothers and sisters in christ that we can be close to and be friends with yeah to be able to say like you were saying hey i've been there and i've faced that and you can you can do it right you can do it and you can't fully forget where you're tempted because that doesn't help it doesn't help to just go oh i'm never going to be tempted by that again boom it's gone what's the what's the scripture that's so easily beset us what's yeah the weight and sin that that's so easily beset us laying aside and that's the sin that's going to bother us a lot and we have to know what those those are because you know some of them are weights and some of them are sense and and the weights it may not a weight may not send a weight that affects me may not send him to hell right but it will meet right well and there's a you can list five pounds but he can throw it well yeah i mean i'm a little insulted it's used five pounds well well think about this is the thing think about somebody i think we already use i think i already said something about it but think about people climbing Everest i think i said it during lunch never mind uh thinking people climbing Everest they're not going up without any weight at all on them because they have to have equipment and some people might need to carry more equipment than others and can handle that weight right but you know sometimes our weights we can bear it and and sometimes we need to carry those to equip us later on but sometimes you know you carry too much you're like i need all of these utensils and you know here's here's an extra soft mattress and you just carry this all up the mountain but you don't necessarily need it and you're just carrying it on yourself and that's where the that those are the sins if it's going to pull you back and pull you off your course and wear you out that's going to turn into sin yeah versus just being a weight that we all carry weights of things we deal with i'm not a smoker or a drug addict so those sins yeah praise god i'm not going to be i'm not going to be uh easily uh you know it's not a worry of mine that i'm going to i'm going to smell well they're presenting stuff or not i'm not going to be i'm not going to be easily beset by that because that's not mine but it's not an issue in this world that i have partakened in before that i would easily be partaking in if it come up and give the opportunity yeah those are the sins i want to be careful of for me at least because i don't have a very good attention span something like that could happen what i get distracted very easily case in the library and now i'm starting to line what happened no it's it's like one thing can lead to another so quickly for me that yes it escalates before i realized that it went from amount or a mole a mole hill into a mountain and a back and square one yeah right that's true and the mountain will always be bigger the second time you go through it yeah and it repeats every time you know the sin gets bigger and bigger because you're just expanding on what you've already done yeah i know i've already talked about it but at dathan youth camp uh brother shannon used a little analogy where he had i think it was like a lunchbox or something and he was he was on his way to heaven uh it may have been a weight and he set it down and he was on his way to heaven but then he turned around and he picked it up and he started walking the other way yeah well then he turned back around he was on his way to heaven and he set it down but every time he did that he went further and further away he only ever went he only ever went so far this way but every time he went back he went a little further yeah so he said every time you every time you face him out it's a little bigger it's a little harder to get over it's true we've got to blow a holder and make a tone yeah so hold it goes this way yeah that's what the holy goes it's going to do a lunchbox share because like it wasn't even a lunchbox that's what you're thinking about okay well um we're going to start wrapping this up here we got to ask the question we got to ask the question yeah i'm going to ask the question i mean just looking at the time that we have but um brother kaleb i'm going to ask you this one question you probably have heard it um if there's anybody in the bible that you would want to sit down and talk to about whatever no matter what it is besides Jesus and besides Paul who would you pick to talk to and what would you talk about it would probably be for me peter he's just such such an interesting disciple to me because really all the ups and downs that he had yeah and i feel like i that's very relatable you know not not saying that i've always been up and down i mean like that but um he's very human to me yeah and sometimes we can we can read the bible and people don't seem so human you know they don't seem they just seem like characters yeah true but to me peter is so human and like i think of when um he followed Jesus when they when Jesus was being crucified and he followed him all the way he told him he said lord i'll go with you and um then all of a sudden they start noticing him and they say aren't you one of them and he's like no i like i don't know what you're talking about yeah well your your speech betrays you aren't you one of them and we we find in that scripture that where peter's warming himself by someone's fire like somebody else's fire yeah and to me that's like spiritually speaking i have found myself trying to warm myself by someone else's fire you know john john put the work in to find the wood to put it all in a barrel right to to light it up and i just want to you know he's the one that's been praying he's the one that's been fasting he's the one that's been doing all these things but yet when he comes to church and the holy ghost starts moving on him hey i want to run i want to show you all these things i want to build i'm just going to warm myself by his fire yeah so for me for me peter like to sit down with him and say what was going through your mind like as you stepped out on that water and you started walking to jesus like how can you take your eyes off because to me it's it it seems so like yeah it it seems so um wild like how do you how do you literally walk on water we and we we criticize him a lot by saying oh he took his eyes off the master but he's still walk on the water yeah sure he's still the only man other than jesus that we know of has walked on water so so to me like i feel like he would be such an interesting person to yeah to get a good first you know first-hand uh conversation of of what he's seen and what he went through and how how he reacted because he you know he had a lot of anger issues and he had a lot of he had a lot of things that um he did that i would just i feel like i would like to to hear more in-depthly about yeah yeah and it's funny because i've talked about peter as one of my answers for that because we hear the question all the time and and almost word-for-word the things you said i i was saying because it is it's like you view the characters is just you know they're real people but they don't seem like because they're too perfect sometimes right they're just like oh that they knew exactly what to do in that situation and all worked out great for them or they were horrible failures and it didn't go well for them at all but peter's just one of those guys that he was in the perfect place could not be closer to Jesus could not other than being john you know not this one the other one uh uh uh and uh and like that's all that's all and and even then in that spot he still said things that you're just like how could you not but it's because we have the context we have all of the after story how did you not see what was happening yeah it's all that stuff like i'd love to see in the garden you know did you did you want you know did you want an uprising to happen is that where you were like this is going to be where he's going to take over right it's not defending him it's starting your you know doing what in my mind Judas thought of of of i need to get this rebellion started and this is the way to do it and then and then the devil twists that right but i in my mind that's where he was going is Judas is thinking well nothing is happening he says he's going to die maybe if if i turn him over then everybody will rise up against him so so do you think yeah to get this thing rolling yeah right so do you think um i know we're trying to wrap up but when you brought up Judas and it made me think about this um do you think Judas was ever genuine yeah like i think before the devil entered into him maybe i think he had a chance before the devil entered into him yes was he ever um really trying to be one of Jesus disciples and caring about it i don't know i don't think so but it's hard to tell because he did miracles too like he sent out the twelve and he was one of them but he was also a thief right so i think that it's you know that he ever had good intentions there are people who have done huge works for the lord and many miracles in this modern time and then all of a sudden everything's revealed and you find out they were sending the whole time but i feel like that's the mercies of god it is i agree it's it's not god put and a lot of people will take this as god's putting a seal of approval on it but it's not it's not that at all because um i i actually had a friend one time tell me that he was he was preaching and after after church he he was he was doing things that he knew wasn't right sure and uh he said after church this woman came up to him and said i just want you to know brother that god is so proud of you you know and he he said that his heart sunk because he knew he's like god is not proud of me like you know he said i i've got this in my life and i've got that in my life that i'm facing not saying that that god didn't have mercy and god didn't sure use him i mean he used a donkey yeah yeah he can he can use anything so it's not it's not putting his seal of approval but it's um and i mean he's never gonna answer i mean you know exactly pronounce it weird but that's you know but i me personally i feel like Judas was uh was genuine at first and and i feel like in the beginning i do and i feel like at the end when he when he cast the silver at their feet and the bible says he departed and went and hung himself like he could have been forgiven yeah like like and and we look at him as this big villain in this you know this terrible person but we've all done the exact same thing yeah it bowing down yeah we need it we need to we need to go back to granny's episode where we talked about talking to Judas yeah that kind of like that was that was real deep about that you know he could have he could have been forgiven if he hadn't hung himself sure but then again afterwards when jesus went to uh when jesus did his ministry and he could have been saved there too right and i think maybe god lets you prolong that in the event that you will transform and you've already been doing work and the work will continue and be greater you know he doesn't just it's like if you if you start to make a mistake when you first start driving your mom's in the car she's not gonna immediately just snatch the wheel there's a time of art are you gonna correct or are you gonna you know yeah right yeah there's time in which you're like are you gonna correct your course you know and you watch to see because you never know you know will this person fix themselves or or are you just waiting yeah for their demise well and as a parent i've noticed with my kids especially like there's times when you know you have to intervene yeah right and you know uh i've got an eight-year-old son and him and some of the other boys at church will fight with each other and do these things and they think like they think oh he doesn't even see her he doesn't know but i i do yeah and bro john can be my witness like there are times that i'm like i would like to step in here but i just i sit back and i say okay you've got to learn on your own how to handle things sure you've got to learn on your own they can't they can't always depend on you to solve the problem exactly yeah so but but it's awesome to be able to know when yeah that's it would be great and there's there's time there's times that it is needed for you to have to sure to do that yeah so they know i started getting into and this is way to advance for the group that i'm uh that i'm trying to do this with no not for you not at all not at all i'm not i'm not i'm just saying the the the words that i use in the logic that i'm using when i'm taking your kids home with lauria and they start oh that's all they get into it man over nothing and i get upset somebody i was on the phone with them the other night and or the other day and like somebody is somebody like lost a fork or something what was it what was it no so me and my i started hitting lauria with a fork a plastic fork i don't even know where i got it and then she took the fork away so he got upset then she dropped the fork on the floor and it got all dirty and so he started crying fake tears i knew it was fake i knew it was fake and i was on the phone and then it got real and i was like oh come on are we really crying about this so i immediately i'm i'm breaking everything down until everybody feels dumb that's because that's what i do i just break down your comments so let me get this straight you had a fork and started hitting lauria with it so she took it that's fair why do you why did you start hitting her with it oh you don't see that's a problem and then laur you know lauria is like blah blah blah blah blah and lauria be quiet because everything she says makes the situation seven times louder than everybody yeah seven times hotter every time she speaks and so she's you know she's trying to explain herself and i just that's how i do with everything though if it's just me am i in the car and he's crying about some are upset because the seats aren't the way he wants it to be or or he this is the situation it was the funniest thing to ever happen i don't want to take too much time but it was funny uh i was driving and it was right before i dropped off lauria and i was going to take niamaya and amani home and they all had their little snacks that they had and niamaya gave lauria his uncrustable because he didn't want it right so lauria ate something of amani she had these orias that amani had given her they were just kind of sharing snacks around niamaya had his fruit snacks he had already eaten them and and so lauria didn't eat her uncrustable as she ate the orios and then she didn't want the encrustable as she got out so amani's like can i have it and she said sure and she handed the encrustable to niam to amani then niamaya got upset because he wanted it because he only had one snack and i was like no no you had two and you gave one away and he's like that's not fair amani can't have it i was like it's not yours you gave it to lauria so now it's lauria's to do with as she feels fit and she gave it to amani and you weren't upset about it until she gave it to amani so it doesn't have anything to do with the snack and it has everything to do with you feeling left out and i mean i'm psychologically breaking down everything to the point where now he's crying i'm still going on and i have a headache yeah you know because i but back to your point that's anti-therapy do you just well no it is but if they don't know where the origin of the problem is they're not going to solve it for themselves right if i don't explain why it's a problem and i'm just saying you're just crying and upset because you want everybody else to notice how upset you are then that's going to go on forever and then very kindly or because you wanted the crying to stop amani shared the sandwich with miamaya and a balance was restored in the universe oh wow and it was perfect and i said but he wouldn't say thank you for a very long time it was all right i said thank you amani and and it was all it was fine typical of right anyway it's just a situation that seems like a whole lot until you know when you're when you're as old as they are and now i i understand it if it was back i would not know how to talk about it at all i just be like no i want it you know but you have to say like as a as a parent as somebody who who is working with children you have to say this is how you break it down because if you don't think logically you just get mad you just yell you just hit yeah but if you break it all down to the root of the problems and you do that in your spiritual life as well as adults we have to do that we have to break it down to the root where's where's this coming from why am i feeling like this is it and and sometimes the answer is just the devil sometimes it's just that it's a spirit that's in our lives but if we don't figure that out and just we start reacting based on things that are the reaction to something else we're you know reacting to the copy of a copy of the problem then we don't fix that we fix just a little thing and then yeah it all comes springing up and springing up and you know adhd is a symptom of something else or as with sleep apnea there's a hundred things that that causes that when we didn't know i had sleep apnea there were big problems in my life and once we figured it out we're like oh that's what it is for sure it all sorts of things it's like it's like a what's the what's the uh um hydra where you cut one yeah right and it becomes yeah or two more you keep cutting that head right you don't go for the main source you keep going for the head just gonna keep on multiplying what you multiply yeah so that's just yeah yeah the good conversation speaking of two heads every head we cut off in this conversation we grow two more i just keep going well that was a good conversation guys i really appreciate this one this is good thanks john for bringing Caleb and Caleb thanks for coming yes it was an awesome episode and great conversation like i said great experience yeah um guys if you're listening we are listening if you're hearing this um all the way through thank you for listening thank you for watching hit the follow button hit the like button follow us on all of our audio platforms we'd really appreciate it give us a comment down below and let us know what you want to hear us talk about next until next time we'll see you next week all right see you [BLANK_AUDIO]
