This week, Leo and Steven explore prophecy and watch NIGHTBREED! They talk about outstanding masks, strange art, trippy underwear sex, monsters that don't look like monsters, a home run performance by David Cronenberg and what happens when the directors cut of a film fixes most of the issues a movie has.
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Nightbreed: Part 2
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haleo hello steven i kind of embarrassed myself in the gym today oh i definitely want to hear this right very different than every other day when i embarrassed myself in the gym just like showing up in the gym outside in the world that work wherever you know generally in life you know how your sixth sense can sometimes go off when you think you meet another horror person like we all have this like horror spider sense sure i was working out and of course it's class so there's a coach and the coach said something and i whipped around and probably way too aggressively joining in on another conversation said did you just say the words toxic avenger and he like went back on his heels and he said yeah we were talking about the cartoon and then he walked away which i forgot was a cartoon that was actually consumed by normies like regular people toxic crusaders i use that uh intro music as the ending of our toxic avenger episode and as great as it was i thought i was connecting with another horror fan but instead i was just embarrassing myself as a psychopath who according to him think some obsessed with 80s cartoons i think that's one of the big problems with some horror fans is that we get so excited it comes across as aggressive we just go at somebody else about wanting to talk about a thing versus just politely having a conversation which to be very fair to you nine out of ten we're not usually involved with anyway so we are awkward individuals just by being within this world it is true so i may get kicked out of that class we'll see oh they they have spin class or ribbon dancing whatever the fuck it is that you do pretty much everywhere in the city so you're all right perfect hopefully they don't talk about the toxic venture all right everybody welcome to spoils of horror my name is steven i am leo and this is episode which i hope we'll get right 142 this is part one of night breed the director's cut but an excellent day for an exercise look at me danny it's all for you i'm our number one fan i hope they are watching there see there see and they don't know pretty minds you know what's going on just get me close my eyes that was cute open up whatever you do don't fall asleep all right leo so we are in september now and we are in our month of two partners this is great for me because this is a total freebie i was going to pick this movie and you just got to it first so i am nothing but thrilled to be talking about especially the director's cut of night breed but why did you pick clive barkers night breed being a mentally unwell and self-hating individual for most of my life i can relate to the angsty teen notion of wanting to belong somewhere and feeling like you never do or never will midian is where the monsters were and as overdramatic as this going to sound that is exactly where i wanted to be at one point in my life i read this story kabal before the movie came out as a lot of people did and then the movie came out and it was a fucking train wreck i wasn't so deranged in my youth that i couldn't tell fantasy from reality but there was definitely something about having a belief in monsters in a place where one would be fully accepting of a person for exactly who they were no matter how messed up they were that gave me a sense of hope perhaps many people won't understand it but it helped when i was growing up in the situations that i was in and things that i had to dealt with to dream of a place like this where i would be accepted for the monster that i was and those who understand that will really understand that for that reason this movie has a special place for me and it always will being fully honest and transparent however watching this as an adult after so many years of being away from it i still have a lot of my mental health struggles but have since moved on and out of that anxiety and written emo goth era of my life and now this is just a wicked killer clive barker film with an amazing cast astounding effects and a wonderful story that i'm excited to share with you and everyone i do want to give a little bit of my own history with this movie because i think it matters and i can't wait to contrast this this is almost like house of dark shadows where we have different origin points with this movie i first saw night breed i probably five or six years ago was back in my in my old life with my old ex so i was dealing with monsters of my own i saw this movie and i really didn't get it to be fair i was used to a certain type of clive barker and i was not necessarily prepared for a horror fantasy i also watched the normal version of this movie which is horrible but now watching the director's cut it's a very different experience so i don't have the same nostalgia with this movie i'm seeing it with relatively new eyes but i also think that it's important because my feelings are very strong about this film in very different directions quite frankly there's a lot i'm gonna love and a lot of gonna hate and if you listen to any single one point you're gonna think i love this movie or hate this movie because it's gonna go in weird circles there's a lot to talk about here this is an interesting movie if you watch the director's cut well and that to be fair is a major point to talk about before we talk about everything is that there are actually four different versions of this film until recently quite quite recently as a matter of fact we didn't have a director's cut and the three versions that came out prior to the director's cut all fucked this movie up in various different ways that may do not make sense so yes it's perfectly understandable even when i was a youth when i watched it that i didn't really get it and nobody really understood it and it didn't really make sense to anybody which is why i chose the director's cut for this show because that's the one that actually does make sense and makes it closer to Clive Barker's vision than any other version out there totally agree so are you ready to do this been ready erin boone is having strange dreams of monsters living in a mythic place called midian he shares this with his girlfriend lori and his obsessive ice-cold therapist dr decker shortly afterwards a kind-hearted family is murdered by a mysterious slasher wearing a hideous mask decker calls boone to his office where he delivers the terrible news a recent string of murders including the aforementioned family matched dreams that erin disclosed during their previous therapy sessions erin has 24 hours to turn himself into the police and admit to committing the crimes after visiting lori at a club where she sings boone is hit by a car and taken to the hospital where a strange raving man named narcesis gives directions to midian the place where the monsters go after watching this man cut off his own face with a blade erin escapes the hospital driving to find the place he's been dreaming about it's a beautiful graveyard in the middle of a clearing filled with menacing gargoyles vine-covered graves and collapsed pillars after walking inside someone holds a knife to his throat it's two members of the nightbreed an assortment of humanoid fantastical creatures living underground erin believes himself to be a monster for his horrible crimes but the nightbreed senses innocence decker lied to him in a quick series of events boone is bitten escapes the graveyard and is killed by a small police squad waiting with dr decker outside lori identifies the body and mourns the loss of her boyfriend but very soon after finds that his body has gone missing not to always focus on the exact opening of the movie like i did in hell night and a few others but you got to give credit what credits do nightbreed has a fucking awesome title sequence i had never remembered that danny elfman did the music for this so it was like watching batman or something hit the music of this movie is just out of this world good and there is this great set of tapestries that come up that tell you a little bit of the mythology of the nightbreed and what this sort of prophecy is that's going to surround erin boons character but also there are these there's this great you know nightbreed sort of title card that crosses the screen and instead of just red lettering the image within each of the letters is of the nightbreed themselves is this sort of like rolling footage of the nightbreed characters like snarling and growling at the camera it is like all of the best b-roll from this movie that does not actually show up in this movie at all it's like that marvel logo that shows up before all of their movies where all the characters are inside yeah it's almost like everything that they just couldn't fit into the movie that look cool they put it underneath this lettering but man does it look great it's pretty awesome the tapestries in the background is the credits are rolling by reminds me of a legend of zelda game where oh yeah what you're seeing in the back is actually telling you the story that you're about to watch which i thought was very cool the very nice touch like they do in mid-sumar too the way the tapestries kind of have all these secrets for the story within them and also there's a dream sequence almost directly afterwards that has boons sort of remembering or dreaming of all the all the monsters that are in midian and you know again they're growling and they're running and they're screaming and all these different things that are happening i thought jesus christ if they start doing like flips or going up on ribbons this is a Cirque du Soleil ad i couldn't help but watch this and think oh this is what cat's was supposed to be right right the next Cirque du Soleil show protection this opening really is awesome and then it cuts to one of the first of many sequences that is a constant in my mind problem with nightbreed which is that it has to get really far along in its story very quickly like it just will have like just a few lines of dialogue that are meant to establish like very important ideas or very important character connections after a brief conversation between erin and lorry erin gets a phone call from his therapist dr dector who it this is the beginning of definitely the most healthy parent parent uh patient doctor relationship i've ever seen in my life getting calls at midnight say come to my office now it's about as well as any therapy i've been through i gotta be honest there is there is only the only two things that are at the end of that therapy section are murder or a blowjob that's it well maybe it's not like any of my therapy sessions then i never got left leo's still trying he's he's going through therapists left and right got a lot of restraining orders no blowjobs but when do we get to the murder and blowjobs part we've been seeing each other for a year now no wonder my mental health is terrible i'm sitting here shocked that my insurance won't cover this now i know why yeah right because i'm gonna be making calls instantly i'm curious about this nightmare he's having of course it's just for the dream purposes of the film moving story along things like that but as a small aside because it's relevant to the film what is your relationship with your own dreams do you have dreams do you remember what you dream do you have nightmares at all why don't i have cool dreams like this none of my dreams make it that my my brain is a garbage can it's recycling bin i don't dream of cool cities where the monsters go to live where i am the chosen one i would love to have a dream like that i dream of aluminum cans that i forgot to take outside and then i go outside and there's a giant monkey that's like i i take recycling like it's just nonsense it's just junk i don't actually remember my dreams 98 of the time every once in a while i will but generally i don't and my dreams tend to be more realistic like i can smell the smells and feel the textures and things like that i don't know psychologically speaking if it makes sense that my brain is trying to protect me because i don't always know what fucking world i'm in because everything is so real when i dream it unless something like a big monkey collecting recycling shows up and they go oh i'm dreaming you know that's obvious that i never know my ex used to dream only in black and white unless there was blood which would be red that is that is incredible that's the type of dream that when you share with your boyfriend he either thinks you're a psychopath or he thinks it's super hot i'll let you decide which one i thought that was but we'll do a poll on instagram hot or not let's go hot or not one of the things i've always appreciated about Clive Barker and you see this both in his books and also in hellraiser and a few other stories here and there is i just don't think that anybody is better at writing really minor characters and making them feel like fully fleshed out people oh i agree with that absolutely and so there are a couple instances of this number one lorry when she goes on her journey she's going to meet this woman that just sort of travels along with her and i've never seen a woman you know just so quickly established and so briefly in the movie that feels like a full real person and that comes up early in the movie too when we cut to this family that is just having a nice night in and all of a sudden this slasher shows up and brutally kills all of them including their little kid who's upstairs but i just got to give it to Clive Barker he just does such a good job making these people feel very real in just two or three minutes of the camera watching them and setting up suspense as you're waiting for something bad to happen you're waiting for something bad to happen i am going to land on the scene for just a moment first of all if i've learned nothing else from horror movies over the years i have learned that a small child interrupting whatever you're doing to talk about a quote unquote bad man in their room is something that you always need to take seriously you can't just go oh johnny you're so silly and send him to bed which they did in this movie i hang on to your point because it's it's good he's got these characters in about three minutes of film and you actually relate to them and they're not doing anything other than watching tv and just talking to each other and getting along but you can see how much they care about each other you can see the family dynamic all of the things that make them characters that you can actually relate to and go oh it sucks that you're dead because they're probably the nicest people in almost any film i've ever seen in my entire life with the three minutes that they're here exactly and they've got just little details their house is messy because they're you know a young family with kids and you know the freezer's a little overstocked which is what you do when you're you know you got kids you just want to like cook shit really quickly you know this just these little details that show you who this family is and the reason it matters is because it makes this random kill actually feel pretty fucked up back in the day slashers were all the rage Freddy Jason Michael all that shit so when this movie came out one of the reasons the movie sucks so bad is the studio was like hey slashers are hot right now let's turn this into a slasher film they actually reshot a bunch of scenes with this killer to make that theatrical cut happen and what's too bad and we'll get more to who this actual killer is later and if you haven't figured it out you're really not watching this film at all because it's probably one of the worst surprises ever put into film as to like who is the killer but anyway what I think is important here is that despite the fact that slasher scenes were added if they're in this film this version of it right now I like all of them I actually love the way that there are these three big stories kind of like all interconnected which is the story of our heroes and the prophecy the story of the night breed and who they are and this slasher killer that is this sort of Patrick Patrick Bateman S killer that is sort of also like stuck in this plot I actually love all these three big stories whether they can kind of hold all three balls in the air as a whole another question I love that you brought that up though because that's exactly right we have three different tales happening at once and I think on the whole masterfully done at least in this edition of the film the way they were put together the way the stories were told the way they were interconnected this killer looking like the scarecrow from Batman but acting like a character from American Horror Story which was fabulous delivery oh let me be clear this slasher looks fucking awesome I love this mask so much it might be one of my top three favorite masks of a slasher ever he's got some kind of cloth over his face that has like texture to it I'm not quite sure what it is but it is not just a flat mask it's like a potato sack almost yeah it looks like a potato sack exactly it goes over his whole head he's got like buttons for eyes he's got a zipper where his mouth should be I'm making him sound like fucking frosty the snowman he really he's got a cord cop pipe in a button nose he's got a scarecrow mask with coreline eyes is basically how you can put it yeah and I love I love just a small detail that the zipper is not directly over his mouth it's crooked it's crooked yeah and it makes every time this killer talks it just feels wrong no because what's great about that is when the zipper is closed he's really kind of just terrifying but when the zipper is open and he's speaking it looks deformed but it also looks like it should be that way because it's close enough so your brain really gets fucked with the design and I think that's a smart choice oh I think it's great I just it's one of my favorite masks I've ever seen and I also like that he has an assortment of weapons too because switch blades have their own kind of like awful feeling to them they kind of remind you of like giallo films and these those old slimy 80s slashers but I also like the fantastical nature of the fact that he has a blade that kind of looks like something you get after beating a boss in Final Fantasy like he had like it is a large it's got like some kind of engraving on it and it looks actually like quite cool and quite fantastical I actually really enjoy that it makes him feel like a bigger larger than life villain not just a slasher that is kind of a corner point to a larger story and also for those who are one of these studio heads or people like them who wanted to focus on the slasher you can tell that the movie wasn't about him because they didn't focus on his quote unquote main weapon and how important it was to him as every other slash and just oh sure no doubt the executives wanted him to be bigger in the story and this version actually uses him correctly I have a few like little quibbles with his character but for the most part it really does know how to use him which is that he's a third of a whole and not half of a whole right exactly that now I will say I would feel a lot more sympathy for this heart-wrenching disgusting murder that involves killing a little kid who is a terrible fucking actor kids like him are exactly why a bitch about child actors and I know on the whole they're young they're trying they don't know better they don't have all the same cognitive things that we do as an adult a blah blah blah blah blah child actors basically suck most of the time I don't want to look at this kid and say I don't care about the death of you and your family because you're acting is so laughably bad but this person's like 45 now so yeah you can take it he has the look of the kid that says boys have penises and girls have vaginas and kindergarten cop and he just stares forward even when the killer isn't coming from forward because the kid is standing at the top of the stairs and so the killer is coming up a winding set of stairs coming at him the kid's still staring forward like someone said look at that exit if you don't look at that X you will not get paid today yeah if you don't keep your eyes on this spot he will literally kill you and none of us will care I was gonna say I thought they could have used they could have used a little bit more method acting here like they could have like they could have just had someone use like an acting coach lean and be like listen kid where you're not really selling the scene I want you to imagine mommy and daddy being slaughtered downstairs yeah right guy fires a gun off three inches from his ear all right kick right right claps in his face come you're not crying enough kick him in the nuts go on kids yeah right I'm just gonna step on your toes a little bit just a little bit just to really go for that method style of acting what is it like lady Gaga lived as her character from uh she was in a Ridley Scott movie she lived as her character for like a year you know maybe give him some like maybe yeah come on back in the alley and chain him to a dumpster or something for a week three months three months throw scraps at him call him names every time you go by it's all the name of acting kid it's all the name of acting you got two answers so we're cutting now to Boone showing up to the doctor's office after this family gets slaughtered and there's Dr. Decker played by David Cronenberg who if anyone knows him from his work obviously in Jason X where he's probably got his most famous role thank you for thank you you beat me to the punch but you did it better obviously everybody knows David Cronenberg from Jason X where else would you know him from right exactly no there is a wonderful little like nugget of gold in this movie that is basically a match made in heaven who hasn't been waiting for nor would nor wouldn't want another collaboration at some point between Clive Barker and David Cronenberg you know this is the stuff that nightmares out of made of and it's wonderful just wonderful getting to have these two work together in this film and it pays a lot of dividends let's get this out of the way right now you're gonna find it later that Decker is the killer he's the slasher i don't mind revealing this because it's the worst kept secret in this whole movie when he's wearing the mask he's wearing his own clothes it's like putting glasses or a hat on someone and pretending they're a different person it's right him guy with the same voice and the same outfit just got the scarecrow mask on we dealt with this with Superman and Clark Kent for years like we dealt with this for years it is the same voice it's the same outfit it's the same clothes from the neck down just this hideous wonderful hideous mask and don't give me wrong the whole costume he thinks great but it's just so very very very clear when you meet Dr. Decker that he is the villain of this story but i want to give credit or credit credit is due other than maybe the special effects i think that David Cronenberg is the standout in this movie i think he's fucking amazing in this film and you could make an argument that his acting is bad i could literally care less i think it works so perfectly for the character that he is not reacting to situations as a human being would he's reacting to them like a computer i'm so glad you brought that up it's my take on him that he was as a therapist a little bit disconnected because you have to have that with your patience as a therapist you have to be a little bit outside of emotion and everything else but he played that disconnect throughout the entire film he was disconnected from humanity he was in his own space doing his own fucking thing which is a phenomenal killer trait if you have a psychotic as you put it american psychotype in your movie you really want them to be this guy because it sells so well and i love his arc and i love his motivation the movie doesn't good it do a good job telling you what his motivation is you it took me three tries watching this movie to figure it out but it's wonderful when you do and i won't get to the second half of it but the first half is just simple enough people have been talking about midian that he is curious and also there is an opportunity here to frame boon for his own murders which is the crux of this part of the film right here necker is i don't know i could gush the the constant tone in his voice the mild baritone that he puts on the emptiness in his eyes all of it made him devilish scary and dark which is perfect and i've heard the same complaints over the years a lot of people complain less what i've read and heard about his acting in performance versus his fight sequences which they said regardless and i'm like it's krona gree gives a shit i don't agree at all i don't either i'm just saying we'll get there in part two but i think that ending is fucking awesome anyway we'll get there krona berg is a character actor he's more of a director he's more of a like you said before it was really a dream come true to see him and clive barker together i was going to ask your thoughts on krona berg as an actor you illustrated them quite eloquently which is great because i agree completely people bitching about it don't know what they're talking about i think him being here and being the presence he was in this film was exactly what was needed for this character and you talk about the motivation he has just to have that as i said before disconnect to be so removed in his own little world and then he finds out there's this other little world and he wants to either be part of it or kill it or study it or whatever it is that he's after and they don't make a great argument for his situation and what he wants but you do figure it out and when you do you're like gotcha and i have a theory that i will bring up later as to how his motivation changes which is i thought kind of a brilliant idea but where we are at right now is simply what you're saying this is a person who's operating as a serial killer who is a serial killer and these things that he's passionate about murdering and killing people and and being a high-class therapist that allows him to get around and play around in people's minds that is what he has been driven to do forever he knows nothing else and so for something to come in and peak his interest to say that there is more than just the void of death and he has a lot of monologue moments where he talks about like death and the void of death or the finality of death which is i think it's almost like a little bit of a fetish for him is the finality of death there's different points where you hear some of his therapy sessions with Aaron and he says death is final like he gets he gets almost pissed off about it and then when Aaron comes back to life it really rubs decker the wrong way for those who haven't seen it deckers going to give Boone some medication to help him turns out to be hallucinogenics he's always having a bad trip he's on acid whatever and all of that is set up to set up Boone to take the fall i've killed all of these people the police are getting close they've came to me to ask who on my therapy list might be the guy i'm going to give them a guy so to throw them off the track yep and Boone being dead or Boone being in jail is beneficial to him because then it's over with he can do that rest period that serial killers do and then come back again later and try again to your point to have a man like this say his death is death and that they're just dead and then find out wait that's not true they can come back people can actually survive what i do that's not supposed to happen i can't allow that to happen you're nailing it because that's part of his motivation the stuff that's going to change later but this is part one half of what i love his motivation is me killing people gave me power and you're saying that now i don't have that absolute power that people can come back that there is more than just death and there's this world of Midian where something like that that sort of transgresses death is happening and i can set the pieces up into place so that i can both find out where Midian is and set up Boone to be basically to be framed for my murders i wish that the story could spell it out a little bit more but it doesn't mean i don't love the fucking ideas yeah they give us small hints later on i forget at which point he says somebody says like who are you and he goes i am death and that's your hint right there about all of what we're talking about where deckers motivation his whole thing is i am the final word yeah you come to me you die that is it and for any serial killer to have that narcissist brain to have that sort of brain pattern going on you don't allow things to push past that you don't allow things to be to correct you from that your brain won't let it happen it totally questions his identity exactly totally brings his identity into question to everything he thinks he is to everything that he thinks about himself and to how powerful he sees himself if leo and i are getting impassioned on this and i'm gonna bet leo agrees with me on this i'm going to take a bold swing here i think that decker is right up there with rose the hat and a few others probably one of my top 10 favorite villains we've covered on this show i was absolutely going to make comparisons i didn't bring up rose the hat but that is a very good one you're absolutely right on that i think american psycho's a great comparison i think kind of like there's a great comparison i think he's right in that category of that style of killer and i think what you just said about everything that happens here questions his identity to some extent and if we're not ready to talk about it that's fine i think that is one of the underlying tones of the film is questioning identities oh i totally agree no i think that that's a great thing to talk about with this film and of course it will allow leo to really let his social justice flag fly it's all about identity but anyway no i totally agree with you i think that this scene is fantastic i do laugh a little bit because he's got a lot of weird art on the walls and i always love weird art in the background and it does feel a little bit like this is a character who's just sort of playing human as opposed to being human which is the right call it's the right call for deckers character but i kept laughing because there's this weird art on the wall that has a bunch of footprints and then it has a bunch of like arrows that go back and left and right and i thought to myself this is what he thinks that human beings want to see when they're getting therapy is like dance instructions basically if you'll notice later in the film when he was killing somebody he was doing those steps he was actually moving in that way as is very american psycho he was grooving he was going oh well yeah now you come here to american psycho i sort of get it it's like his two interests in the world are killing people and accurately doing the electric slide that's right that's right how else are you gonna like pass off as human if you can't do the electric slide at a wedding obsessed with electric light orchestra right maybe it was the chicken dance i don't know what it was but it just thought it was such a strange art to have on the wall but it gets into i suppose the next beat is boon tripping balls from the hallucinogens that he was prescribed he goes to visit his girlfriend she's a singer he see him in the audience he he cries a little as she's up there and then he goes out and plays in traffic i guess his whole thing is i gotta i gotta not let this destroy my life so i'm just gonna end it i don't know where to start with this lsd trip all right so i have a lot to say here this is where okay this is where i talk about the the sort of like highs and lows of this movie are and so i could sit here and sing the praises of how much i adore david kronenberg in this movie and then i can get to this lsd sequence and be like this doesn't work at all like it doesn't work at all it does not come together i get what they're trying to do here which is that decker has given him lsd and said it was some sort of other drug said it was lithium or something yeah and it's basically meant to make boon look erratic yeah so that when he does go to midian there it's basically gonna make the whole plan here look foolproof because what decker has done is said hey all those dreams that you told me of murdering people as we were you know in therapy sessions together while all these murders have happened and they look exactly the same as your dreams now what happened was decker went out and killed people based on how those dreams you know we're told to him that's what he did but of course we don't know that at the time or we you kind of figure it out it's pretty easy to figure out he's the villain moving the moves this quick you get you get there pretty quick they they have not revealed that decker is a slasher but every time i watch this movie you meet him and you're like he's a killer right there he's a guy yeah it's this guy but anyway so they so they give him the lsd and he has this trip and they're just several funny sequences right in a row uh first of all there is this sequence where he starts to really lose it and he burns everything that he has in his house like his journals and all this other stuff because he basically wants to burn i guess evidence that's going to implicate him in committing these crimes even though there really isn't any he just wants to burn the description of his dreams but at one point there's this like prominent photo of him that burns and i get what it's supposed to mean it's supposed to mean he's burning his identities letting go of who he is but just i always love when a character needs for a beat a shot of themselves like how many of us have eight by tens of ourselves like our own photo right like you can't see it's so i'm good there's a there's a really good religious film that is really funny it's a terrible film i don't remember what it's called but it's a movie about um about like god getting rid of everybody and of course it's just the last people that remain and every time that they want to establish that somebody has been raptured it will involve a character who stayed behind looking at an eight by ten on the wall of their of the person that was raptured and of course the thing that's hilarious is how many people have an eight by ten of themselves on their own wall i i've been over to a lot of people's places and i've never seen it gotta be honest i might have small like four by six frame photos on the on the mantle or something of a family vacation but never like here's my head shot and it's a wall for everyone to see and that's why i laughed when i saw that part i was like i get what's it's was a symbolically mean but i touched myself yeah did he have a small run it's like a like a ballerina or something and he had to go away and like handle his head shot to everybody pretty much maybe that's what the footprints were all about yeah there is about all right that's was comfortable as it that's what it was and then he he burns everything in the middle of the floor which i can i can sort of like sign a ways okay he was having an LSD trip and that's why he's burning his journals on the floor of his own house never getting his deposit back yeah exactly that's gone but also he has this vision of himself and lory in their underwear having this sort of sex dream while there's fire but i couldn't get over the music that's playing in the background because even though danny elfman is really good it's this weird like fife and drum music it's like yeah it's a circusy it's very weird and you figure danny elfman of all people knows what music sounds like when you're tripping balls so i don't know where he came up with this because that's not the right stuff exactly it looks like the sex scene from hell night like it looks like it looks like this this underwear is never coming off like that's right it says this weird laundry that almost looks like a chastity belt on the top and bottom oh you know he just kind of leans her back a little bit and then the screen goes blurry as if we're having one of those transition sequences to another thought that dream that he's having and then there's flames and that's it we just talked about it in our last episode but it looks like the banded wraps that mila jojevich wears in the fifth element that's right absolutely that yes that is exactly what it looks like who wore it better sorry who wore it better lory or whoever that character is in the fifth element but so this whole sequence is really weird and then it gets to our main character boon going and visiting lory at her work and i get it it's his way of saying goodbye i get what's happening here he knows that in 24 hours he's going to be arrested for these crimes and he thinks he committed and so he goes and he watches her and i think that this would have worked a little bit better for me because she's singing as i can tell about a relationship and so i get what they're doing here it's so supposed to be sad and it probably would have worked a little bit better for me if i ever understood one fucking word of this song you know i was watching this movie i think for the second time and i was like i need to turn on the subtitles just so i can hear what the fuck she's singing so i can make the words out because i didn't get it yep absolutely she says at one point she says i did hear the phrase i want a brave man and then it's something that rhymes with that she's like i want a brave man i want to and i thought it was at one point cave man a straight man which you shouldn't have to ask for that like no right if you're asking you're saying i want a straight man you've you have been looking in the wrong places there are problems with this relationship between the two of them i didn't realize that was one of them it sounded like she said i want a gay man at one point which i always find that more plausible more plausible yeah i thought i thought she said gray man i thought is this some kind of alien fetish thing like i just never figured out what the second thing was she's i want a brave man i want a blah blah i got a better song out of howard the duck when they were on stage the actresses of is a fine singer it's not that it's just the beats are all off she's singing and she's not a great dancer and so there's a part where she sort of like struts her hips back and forth but she's killing the song like as far as like her actual ability to sing but i never heard one fucking word and then everybody in the crowd which apparently we're at a country bar somehow something yep they're all wearing like big ten gallon hats and you know they've all got you know they've all got like uh cowboy boots on and everybody is cheering like it's like the greatest song that they've ever heard and finally it's like you know tom play pettie playing even the losers or you know yeah but the the problem with it is she's in a country bar singing some kind of pop song there's not a steel guitar there's not a reference to a truck or sitting up by a lake or any of that shit so clearly she's not singing the right song i don't know what they're cheering about it's because the whole song is literally about i want a man like i want a man that's a bit which we'll get to laurie in part too but boy oh boy has never as i never put a song that so perfectly describes someone's character as i want a man i want a brave man i want whatever man whatever the other fucking kind of man i want a straight man gay man gray man whatever it was the fucking ride with that word that i could never hear and it's too bad because i do think that the song actually serves her character a little bit in that i do think it does a good job as far as a girlfriend character goes making her look like she has a job at apartment and stuff to do like you know they've got their own apartments from each other yeah but like you know sometimes the girlfriend character feels like there's really like nothing going on other than she's like waiting for a ring and so and and that's very a that's very apparent in this character but early on it's done very well she does feel a little bit like a person it's just this song is a weird be i don't have any issue with it other than it's just a weird be in a series of moments that don't totally work for me and then he wanders out and then he gets hit by the car and he gets taken to the hospital which of course is going to lead us to one of the most admired characters in this movie this guy is narciisse or narciisse like narciisse yeah something like that it's the face thing it's because he's no i know i i know who he is i just forget what they call them and i'm not saying it right i'm sure but it doesn't matter you all know who he is because he is for what this movie is the comic relief yeah and he does it very well to be very honest i understand why people like him so much there are two characters in this film that people generally speak of more than any other as far as the nightbreeder concerned it's him and it's the porcupine girl and the only reason people talk about the porcupine girl is because for some reason they get a furry fetish for a pointy chick i don't understand that at all this one i understand why they like him because he's a really fun character and he's got a great personality hold that thought the porcupine lady's cool i'm not saying she's not cool it's very cool there is a lady that can turn into miss that is super hot uh see that that's what i'm saying i don't know why all of you are going after this one and the only thing you want from her is her titties and this guy here i get it i get it he's he's a really yeah when before he's a nightbreeder and he's just a crazy guy in a hospital and he's talking a bunch of crap and he says the word midian so boond goes over to him and goes like what are you talking about because this guy is crazy boond convinces him that he's there as a test to see if if you're worthy of getting into midian so he tells him all about it he tells him how to get there and then he says i got approved to why i'm worthy and literally starts carving his own face off it's great and i'll tell you why for me only clive barker has the fucking balls to do what he's actually doing with this character because the character says i have another face i have another face i have a face under this face he starts cutting it off the character is correct he does have another face most other people would would directors or writers would be like no we we can't we don't want to make mental illness look bad we don't want to we don't want to encourage this kind of behavior as if the fucking like end all and be all of movies is that we watch things that we got and do them you know the way i jumped into radioactive material after i saw him talk to the because i thought it would turn me into a monster yes if every bug's bunny cartoon has turned me into a psychopath wheeling bats and guns and cannons and shit right it's so fucking stupid but what clive barker is trying to just explore here and it'll come up more with the monsters is that sometimes our true nature is quite monstrous and so the fact that clive barker has the balls to say this guy is having this image in his head of cutting off his own face and then when he dies and becomes night breed he becomes the truest version of himself which is you know this person that has all the skin removed and would be you know quite horrifying to most people i oh god that's why i love reading his books he's so fucking bold still in his 70s he's fucking bold yep because he knows how to write he knows how to talk to a part of people that we don't often talk about well one of the things that makes him a great writer he'll take those bold chances he'll write about literal j what am i trying to say he'll write about topics that nobody else will touch and i'll write about them in a way that makes people who even aren't necessarily living that life or lifestyle or whatever he's writing about go oh okay i see what you're doing there one of the things that always gets lost in the first hellraiser is that the centipites are neutral right they're not frank is the villain you know the the centipites are neutral they they just don't care about centipites are literally just a plot point to move the story forward when needed which is why you barely see them in the fucking film that's right that they were never meant to be the central focus nobody understands that well leo come on when we get to hellraiser 3 and they're trying to take over the world by shooting cds at people i said hellraiser not hellraiser sequels hey the second one's awesome but anyway my point being and you're totally correct and you know some of his other books have those same things of same ideas where he's exploring very difficult ideas of like a character like transforming into something that we would find hideous but the character actually finds it to be enlightening they actually get something positive out of it's complicated and and that's very on display in this movie there are just certain things and even gillmo de toro would not be able to do as well as clifebarker does and he's the only person he's the only director that could even handle a movie like this but it would be handled differently and and clifebarker is willing to have this character that is funny he reminds me of um randy quaid he reminds me of randy quaid oh sure yep you know i mean in some of the characters that he's played um he is funny he's also complicated he actually does some really shitty things in the movie too which i will get to that later but i love the fact that clifebarker is willing to actually have this character come into their own by doing something that is so sickening and disheartening that we would never you'd never advocate for it but he's willing to in a horror story explore it and it does make a good segue because once he tears his face off the medical staff come running in and it gives boom a chance to escape because remember he got pulled in after being hit by a truck and somehow surviving that by the fucking way without a scratch on him i know like literally nothing wrong with him and he got maximum overdrive down on the highway so what the fuck ever i don't know what it was i don't know if it was part of his lsd trip and he just like envisioned the car but he was actually hit by a tonka truck like one of those or like a kid driving a power wheel i'm not sure what it was but it gives him a chance to get out under armed guard and drive to midion or hitchhike to midion or however the fuck he got to midion he finds his way out there gets all the way to the cemetery big wonderful cemetery some of it very clearly a studio set some of it very clearly a painted backdrop some of it on location it's a nice mix of all three and the nice thing is is all three of them look like totally different places i know but it is gorgeous and so much so that he decides after a long trip he's just going to take an app at the cemetery i totally agree it's midion if you consider midion the graveyard not the underground catacombs just like the graveyard itself is a set design dream it is beautiful but i did i did describe it as in case i was the one that led us into this i wrote midion is a gorgeous dot dot dot mat painting that's right that's right because it is that though it isn't that painting because when they show it as like an establishing shot it clearly is a painting and i actually know it's a painting and they added in after the fact i love Clive Barker and i'll never say anything bad about him but there are just things in this movie they're just incoherent and yeah and they're basic things you know like how you get from one place to another sometimes is totally incoherent he was learning a lot about us as a filmmaker that he didn't have to learn on hellraiser for some reason he had the right people around him that made hellraiser make sense because that is hellraiser's a better movie which is not saying i don't like night breed no no but but hellraiser's a better movie and this just has like establishing shots missing that they had to add later and the little things they had to change and put into fix the movie but this painting is such a painting that i thought the camera was going to pull back and reveal that we were at the midion museum of fine arts and we were looking at a painting of what the place used to look like i mean it's good enough that if i were rich enough to buy it and put it on my wall i absolutely fucking would and that's the thing it's gorgeous and so is this set you fucking nailed it it's just these beautiful columns that have collapsed and gargoyles and there's vines and moss over everything holy shit this thing is gorgeous i would be a night breed too just to hang around that set it's awesome it's so cool and there's like a light fog everywhere and they they use the shit of this set and i really appreciate that we don't just get a passing glance at it there's a lot of scenes that are going to take place here when decker starts trying to kill people and there's a big war at the end so you really get to milk this for all it's worth and the movie lives here for a while and i'm glad they did boond is woken from his nap by weird sounds around him a little dog licking his face yep just generally what the fuck is happening all of a sudden and he gets grabbed by two quote-unquote monsters who are going to be uh one will be his advocate and one is his i guess sort of night breed nemesis slash ally yeah but they never really establish that well enough but it's there so he's the johnny to his daniel you know yeah yeah pretty much that karate kid reference everyone yeah yeah one of the two monsters is hey let's take him below the other one is like no fuck him he's dead literally keeps saying he's meat he's meat and the other one says if we eat him we break the law which infers that eating people was once a regular thing for the night breed that got so out of control that they had to create a law to put a stop to it maybe it's like blue laws you know blue laws where they have ridiculous laws that nobody that nobody really follows anymore so maybe it's along those lines maybe it's like you know the rules of midian you can't eat people also you're not allowed to carry a bathtub through midian between two p.m. and three p.m. could be that i don't know it just it made me laugh the thought that the because there's this proposed war that happened back in time between these mythical monster creatures and the human race to where those who are living in midian are literally all that's left they are right the remaining survivors of this genocide that that people were putting them through and i like the notion that at one point during this battle this war this confrontation they were like fuck it let's just start eating them they've got to have rules to make their society work it's right up there with no shoes no no shirt no service that's it exactly don't eat the customers dot right don't eat the customers exactly i'm sure they have a lot of other blue laws you know it made no sense to anybody when they look at the books and they're like i don't understand why tap dancing is of the loud on midian bridges i don't know i just can't we just can't one time it was a problem and we had to write a rule and then it just sat there listen i know you're the monster that has 15 legs and this is sort of your dream but right sorry right right all those monsters i'm different different things you don't know there could have been one with 14 dicks at one time and they're like that's 13 too many exposed here's a very popular monster so they had to create a blue law that was like that's right 13 dicks is too many one is fine that's right somebody get a big blade let's get to talk with that that got dark anyway call them oil so what happens here is that we have this run in between boon and the night breed and then boon runs outside and he gets shot by police you know in a really great scene with decker basically pretending that boon had a gun so boon dies and i've said four happy cops is on with with the fucking war war journal punishers arsenal from hell night he's the decker says he's got a gun and every cop just unloads on him and that she's a squirrel i should have just pointed a tank at him and shot him in his face he's never seen so many weapons i swear to god they threw grenades and boomerangs and hit him with rocks and like oh jesus christ i didn't interrupt it was just so funny oh god i think somebody came over and scalped him like i'm not sure it was kicked him in the shin fuck you right exactly no you're totally right they threw fucking axes at him and they did everything i've never said only for him to have three bullet holes in him by the way right exactly yes there's a reason these cops lose the battle at the end they're not their stormtrooper level shots after this it gets to something that we've talked about in other movies before when a script is able to cover a whole lot of ground in 30 seconds we talked about this on a recent episode of house of dark shadows but man oh man oh man within about 90 seconds we established that boone is dead lori finds out about midian she grieves she talks to decker boone is resurrected and then boone this boone escapes the hospital all within 90 seconds not move that story long man gotta keep it going and it's it's so hilarious because it's just like shot after shot after shot it's like decker looks at lori and he's like tell me everything and she's like i just found out about midian and then it cuts to her packing her suitcase seeing her boyfriend standing shirtless as a ghost in the window yeah yeah that's a choice yeah she does this whole and it's it's coming up but she does this whole i'm gonna drive to midian i'm gonna find him i gotta know what happened and i guess the plot there is i need to have closure and say goodbye but codependent much like demands dead let him the fuck go and dream dream of him with a shirt on come on that's right a little bit you know at least he gave you laundry come on yeah right right right right can you imagine if that was in reverse like how people would react if he was like oh i just remember i just imagined my the love of my life standing by the window with their tits out that's right yeah moving with that so many bad reviews i will say is not totally inaccurate welcome to good beer bad movie night where each month we drink finely crafted brews while watching terrible films in order to see just how drunk you have to get to enjoy them so tune in enjoying troy keloland cry oh that was pretty good thank you dave i have the weirdest boner and peat ipa's are ails meaning they are bottom fermented excuse me they are top fermented i fed up try it again as we drag kathleen earrings kicking and screaming through an alcohol fuel podcast dedicated to movies of questionable quality and the frosty adult beverages that help make them tolerable good beer bad movie night clearly it's the beers fault lori travels to find midian and learn what happened to erin she befriends a woman named sharrow who agrees to tag along unknown to them they're being followed by decker meanwhile erin has returned to the graveyard where he meets the night breed they're led by dirk lisenberg an elder who performs a blood ritual to test our hero's worthiness in the eyes of their god befomet lori and sharrow drive to midian and find a majestic graveyard they split up lori searches amongst the tombs and finds a small mysterious child lying injured on the ground a voice nearby asks her to carry the child into a nearby crypt lori obeys saving the child's life and putting its mother in her debt she demands to know where boon is after getting scared lori runs back to the car where she finds sharrow's body dead tied to a tree the mass slasher approaches and reveals his identity it's decker who he believes that killing lori will lead him to erin she runs into the graveyard trying to escape decker and it's about to be murdered when our hero comes to save her too bad for him decker escapes he drives to a nearby gas station to call the police tells them where erin's body can be located and then begins torturing the gas station attendant for information on midian he learns that the night breed are not immortal and they can be killed i watch this movie on tubi so of course random commercials will pop in as you're watching the film it really speaks to how impressive ai has gotten that it can literally read my mind i'm watching this part of the film and we are introduced to sharrow and sharrow is the main is the small character that i mentioned earlier that is surprisingly well written for a person that has 20 lines of dialogue at most and they actually convince you in in the reasoning that she has to be a part of this plot does a good job i was impressed by it but as i was watching the film i thought you know she's kind of got that older lady hot vibe this this woman's very attractive and she's got a very low cut shirt on her i thought to myself man she is smoking hot and as soon as i thought that it cut to a commercial about lactation it just shows how scary the ai is getting these days and just get right into your brain and figure out what you're doing it went right to a baby sucking on a tit i thought to myself i have never wanted to be a baby so badly in my life it is primal attraction that's going all the way back to the roots right i was like whoo wow that was that was a hard twist right there i laughed uncontrollably i gotta say it shows a fundamental difference granted that yours was more interrupted by the ai invading your brain but when i was watching this scene i was far more distracted by everyone in this bar wearing big floppy cow horn hats like what's the fucking occasion what was going on was it a sporting event was it just the way these people in this town dress what that was happening wait a minute there is a line of dialogue at one point because there's a lot of i think nightbreed script relies too heavily on one line of dialogue that will explain some gigantic thing for instance there is one line of dialogue that says that midian used to be part of a gold rush town which you can see in a book would have been like really fleshed out there would have been a whole story about how you know what the town was like and who's buried there and i don't know why people from a gold rush town have fucking bats and snakes and dragons and shed on their headstones but whatever why they're fucking badasses but there's a line of dialogue that says everybody's out at the rodeo and so i don't know if some kind of celebrity rodeo persons in town or whatnot but there is a small blink and you'll miss it far at the wrong time and you won't notice line of dialogue that says the rodeo is in town so for anyone out there who feels i might be a little repetitive in my reviews or uh think i'm not really paying attention to what's going on or say the wrong things and contradict myself this is what i'm talking about and i will i will blame Clive Barker and the directors for this you have to give us more i know sometimes i say i don't need it spelled out for me because sometimes that's true other times you can't just rely on one thing that i'm not going to pay attention to because i farted at the wrong moment and distracted myself you have to give us just a little bit more so that's one of my issues with this script there is a two and a half of our version of this movie and i'm gonna guess it's even better than the two our version because oh it's not all right you think it's not fair enough so there is just a simple learning curve that comes with writing a movie script versus a book and look what the fuck do i now all i know is as a reader and as a movie watcher they are different mediums and i've noticed before that often authors struggle with the fact that they can justify things in a book that are very hard to justify in a movie because in a movie you have to show and in a book you can tell and so the book can have a whole monologue happening in decker's head as to why he has a special blade or why he's trying to frame boon for this crime in the first place but you have to really stretch to figure it all out you know and that's nothing against kronenberg it's just simply that you have to watch a couple times and hear a couple line of dialogues that are rather miscellaneous and different things like that and then you have to piece it all together this whole thing about midian being a gold rush town actually doesn't make any fucking sense when it's first introduced because i lied it's two lines of dialogue and first one is by sharrel when she says oh well maybe he came up here for the gold rush saying you know why boon came up to this graveyard in the middle of nowhere but the line means fucking nothing and it sounds idiotic because you don't get it when it's said and then later on there's a random piece of dialogue that says oh these are all the minors that used to live up here and so like it just does do it does a poor job with past history and it does a poor job at explaining things in a book would have just been a monologue and i agree with you i think when people make their choices because you have to like he said very different mediums book to film you have to take liberties you have to make cuts you have to add some things blah blah blah i think it's about knowing what to add what to subtract and what to emphasize i don't think the gold rush was important from the book to the film there's no reason for the film to have it there's it doesn't make anything for the plot it doesn't advance anything it's kind of worthless information the rodeo is cute i actually fundamentally don't even care why they're all wearing floppy cow horn hats i just thought it was funny it's funny but you don't need to spend 45 minutes spelling it out in the film in a book you could mention by the way there's this big rodeo in town and we cut to over here where they're doing the same you know it works in the book doesn't work in the film you got to get the balance you got to understand how to do it right now sometimes i think that the leap of faith that you make you know trying to figure some out backstory and i think it works just fine for instance when we're down in the catacombs of Midian and now we're seeing how the night breed live and what they do we find out that they have this sort of leader that is sort of the one that's sort of setting up all the rules inside of Midian and you really quickly learn something about his character that's very important and it's just simply in his name because his name is Dirk Lysberg and i've never had a name tell me so much backstory because clearly in that character's previous life he was someone that sold dragonclaw necklaces outside of a mall from his van right which had a wizard on it and a wizard and a unicorn big cloud right for 20 bucks you can get a samurai sword i heard that name i thought what a fucking dumb name it's been too long since i've read the books i don't remember all of the night breed characters and and they all had some sort of little backstory about where they came from and shit and i think marvel picked up a did a comic book rendition of it didn't read that either so i don't know i don't know i like your explanation of where he came from better than anything those two mediums could have ever pulled together dirk like kester whatever his name is that is someone who was once named shelled it and changed his name to dirk but we do get to meet a lot of the night breed which is uh always fun you know it's always fun in these movies to see these kind of casts of characters and you have you know our our main leader who is played by Doug Bradley and uh has these kind of like razor cuts on his face very different character than pinhead which is very nice to see and then all uh you have you know your lady with quills on her and you have you know various monsters that have you know their their skulls removed or their jaws removed or their you know it looks like a moon like a crescent moon yeah one of them is a moon you know different things like that and there's a lot of great creature effects here but it didn't just i kept laughing every time they would show us this one that was just a guy in like parachute pants with like flowers around his neck lots of tattoos and a dog and i thought it looks like somebody died at a lua with their emotional support animal that's probably exactly what happened right i don't know how he got to become a night breed like and he also the one that had the tentacles coming out of his stomach because he was getting all the food from the buffet line no that was somebody that was somebody else the only thing that we can tell about him being a monster is that he's the one that dies in sunlight because it's one of the things that they talk about is that they all have different vulnerabilities which is a nice touch and we'll get to it later but i just kept laughing every time i saw this guy i thought jesus christ this guy looks like like the drummer at a luau like like at a tourist event where you get pineapple and ham like wikiki is the one carving up the pig roast for you yes exactly is the lovely vacation here you take pictures with it could possibly be wider came right off the cruise ship yeah right off the ground off the cruise he's the one that gives you the lay like that's right welcome to Hawaii acting like a native exactly uh afternoon drinks starting at four o'clock that's right don't forget the moonlight dive exactly torus leave it to snorkeling it new oh i'm not from the area i'm from minnesota could you tell i blend in so well the boon is down getting to know all of the night breed he's getting their leader there's their god i guess baffle met to prove whether or not boon is worthy of being a night breed which he is because he'd have to be roast the movies over and shitty movie if they just turn away nope sorry everybody kill him please baffle it says thumbs down but in a way that actually weirdly would have worked in that this is the point of the film where our main focus hero character starts to switch and go sure a little bit away from boon and more towards his girlfriend who starts becoming the protagonist of the film at this point yeah so we'll get a little bit for me we'll get i'm gonna save some of my feelings on that a little bit longer but but it there is a really important scene that is really well done fucking home run this is again the highs and lows of this movie let's go back to the highs which is that lory gets really scared while she's in midian she has a nice scene where she saves a child it feels a little bit i don't want to say tacked on but it feels like the movie needs a very quick way for the night breed to basically owe her one yeah so she saves a child the child has gone out of one of the crypts and clearly the child is sensitive to sunlight and i don't mean like gen z sensitive to sunlight like vampire sensitive like she's gonna like vampire sensitive not turn into a little rat creature or whatever not needs a therapist because she went out to the sun but but it's actually burning up or transforming and changing but i mean all lory has to do is like pick this kid up who looks like kind of like a giant rat and then bring her over two feet to a crypt and then put her back in the shadows and then this child is saved so it feels a little bit like they had to think think of the quickest reason possible that the night breed would even speak to lory it's a bit of a gimme yeah it's a bit of a gimme i wish that it had been just a little bit had a little bit more meat on the bone but at least to a great sequence where lory gets scared and she runs back to the car and when she gets back to the car Cheryl is missing and i love i love the setup for the scene because the car doors are open her Cheryl's purse is on the front dashboard of the uh front of the car like the hood of the car there's some blood on the windows but they've caught all the danny elfan music and it's just some country song playing on the radio and it really puts you in lory's shoes because all you can hear is the wind of the field that she's in and just the nothingness of not knowing where this girl is this blood on the windows and you can just hear the country song and the way that is lory wanders away from the car going Cheryl Cheryl are you what's going on are you there and that music from the car just gets lower and lower and then no music replaces it it's just just deathly quiet until she finds the body at the tree it's fucking awesome yeah while i recognize this film was way sooner than the reference i'm making it's what i call a sam rami moment where somebody is smart enough to know when to fuck the turn the music off and let the scene just live for what it is yes i couldn't agree i can't hear me i'm clapping totally agree i totally agree they nail it and it adds so much tension so that when decker shows up in his fucking awesome mask and we it's revealed that he's been following lory and he kind of had this relationship with Cheryl for a short moment which is all fine it all works and all you know adds to the characters but he's been following lory basically to get to midian and to try to draw boone out he's figured out that boone is probably still alive or something has happened with boone's body and he's just fucking curious he just wants to know what's happening yeah he's he's tracking boone's body he doesn't at this point know that he's dead because eventually as he's chasing lory around the graveyard the killer boone shows up to savor yeah and decker's like what the fuck you're not alive you can't be alive and he stabs him right in the heart and boone goes idiot i'm the undead literally yeah and decker does not know what to do with himself because also something we didn't know before the guy that cut his face off in the hospital decker took a moment to talk to him and figure out where midian was and all that it was all off camera they cut scene to something else yeah but he's like don't worry officer i'll go talk to this man and figure it out and the kid shows up going hi remember me you fucked with me when i said my most vulnerable now the two of them are going to be like let's tear him up fuck this guy yeah and he doesn't know he being decker what the hell to do with himself everything to your point earlier in this conversation everything he believed in everything he was everything to him that this is final death his final is now being tested is now being thrown out the window is now being challenged and it's fucking with his head and you know one thing that often happens to Clive Barker is that people get so in the weeds trying to read his films and don't get me wrong his movies work on a second level as well but they get so in the weeds that they miss the point that also Clive Barker is just a very entertaining fellow when it comes to his movies he just you know he he loves video games and comic books and he he loves it all and so he is able to create just a really good villain and hero dynamic yeah and that really plays out in the scene i love the chase with with decker and with Lori through the through the graves it looks really good it looks really horrifying they're both running after each other but i love the way the decker is just letting her get away a little bit he loves the game yeah he loves the power of the game i'm glad you said that because i brought up earlier how people think he's bad at the fight sequences kronenberg yeah i don't think that's true i think the script said hey it's the cat and mouse you you got to come at her but then you got to let her get away you got to come out or let her get away and i think that's what he was doing and i think he did that very very well i don't think it was that he was so clumsy with his machete that he couldn't get to her and he didn't know how to do a fight i think he made a deliberate choice for the character and pulled it off he wants to maximize her terror he loves this he loves it and so he wants to let her think she can get away for a little bit and have some near misses and then basically take control when he's ready to take control he's having fun with it but again the movie is also setting up these hero and villain dynamics i also forgot something about the hospital there's a shot whereas boon is escaping decker runs around the corner and they have that moment that kill bill to moment where hero and villain are looking at each other from opposite ends of the hallways then they stop and you know boon jumps at the window and decker tries to go after him i love that shot i love that shot because that really is like a dynamic that plays out here really well you can read into what the monsters mean and what the larger story is about identity but there's a pretty damn good hero versus villain story being told here as well decker escapes because boon made the fatal mistake of saying he's mine i get to fight him alone chases after him and his friend with no face is left alone with his girlfriend lori and starts acting weird so boon has to double back and so decker escapes now midian is out in some nowhere defunct part of the world and is basically the cemetery on the edge of forever or whatever good star trek reference thank you very much he uh decker runs to the local gas station wherever the hell that may be how many miles down the road and calls the police to say hey i found boon's body and there's a bunch of weird shit happening out here please get here but his drive and desire and his need to know and midian and all the stuff that is absolutely pulling at him at this point causes him to put his mask on and start torturing this old man at the gas station saying tell me everything you know about them and this guy he's the harbinger he's like that old dude from children of the corn you know i mean he has this line of dialogue going well it couldn't last forever they were going to get found out eventually so he knows all about midian obviously but he's just an old guy at the edge of this it's not even a town it's just a big cemetery this property saying don't go here don't there's nothing here just a gas station fuck off only dead people up there he is the one telling skinny dipping teenagers to go elsewhere book that's right midians got a death curse right exactly exactly oh man those guys never fare well nope nope nope i adore this scene i love this scene because not only does decker need to start playing the pieces to be able to you know win the fight and and that's one thing that decker's really good at too is he's good at uh he's good at plotting he's good at using the police and using his position of power as a therapist to create this army of officers that we're going to see in the second part and go after these monsters so he's really good at forming a plan he's a little bit of a Lex Luthor type and then he's he's thinking of a plan and that makes him a great villain a very very effective villain but also in this scene he tortures this poor guy at the police at the uh at the gas station what does he want to know can i kill them but what i love about it it's not just the you know every villain needs to know how to kill a hero it's not that it's also a character it's a character thing too because it bothers him that they might be unkillable and he has his model log in this scene where he says i am death and explains what that means is awesome yeah and to your point earlier the little bits of hint of motivation that we get from him pretty much all right on this moment this is when you get to figure decker out this is when you get to understand if i am not death i am nothing ergo i realize now it is my calling to destroy midian and murder everyone in there right that's what i am i am a i am the harbinger of death and he delivers this monologue so well i love that he's still in the mask while he's doing it but you can see his mouth out the side of the zipper because it's partially on zip so he can talk it just looks so fucked up you would never want to meet this person on the on the side of the road and we say that as horror fans like i mean are we allowed leo or we allowed to say this looks scary this dude is scary it's like we said before it might not have caused me deliberate actual tangible fear but i can recognize it as a scary thing this is yeah if you were just somebody and got tied to a chair and were being poked with a knife and what you were looking at was this it would scare you i recognize that yeah if somebody knocked on my door and i opened up and it was this character asking me if i had time to listen about the environment it would scare me like i tell you about my lord and jesus baffle me like this character showed up to drop off my amazon package i would be definitely that with that we are officially going to stop for the first half of night breed and not go into our final thoughts and things like that we'll save that for the end totally which is the end of next episode but we want to thank everyone for joining us on the first half so far yeah just to give you a perspective on the theatrical cut versus the director's cut i think that the first half of this film is about the length of the theatrical cut yeah seriously how much junk they cut out and we've already said by the way that there's still parts that we don't totally understand how they all connect so the thing of it is just for those who are curious because i don't want to spend 100 years on this they did the theatrical cut which was the one where the studios decided we're making it a slasher film fuck you kleibarker and he was never happy about it the cast was never happy about it makes sense yeah they did what they call the cabal cut the cabal cut is the next major one because the fans eventually learned that the studios screwed kleibarker over they went to all the old tv runs of this movie and vhs copies and everything else and cobbled together a massive edit that had literally every piece of footage imaginable in the film i'm i'm not even making that up like anything that exists from superman to like in this movie the movie is almost three four hours long it's fucking ridiculous and half of the footage is garbage it's it's terrible vhs copies it's it's not worth watching it i mean for you someone like you and me sit and watch it i want to see it you know what i mean but i'm not recommending it to people i'll tell you that it's there's a ton of shit in there that is not worth it yeah i think it was scream box i think that's their name the ones who make those great steel covers uh different movies and stuff and then re re 4k them and all that and they got hold of night breed found the original negatives took them to kleibarker said what do we do with these basically and he put together the director's cut which is his actual vision of the film using the original negatives from the film to put it together the way he had originally envisioned it which is why we're covering that version of the film the theatrical version is hot garbage it is absolute nonsense it makes no fucking sense they refilled sequences to put in there just to make it a slasher film which made it even stupider and more confusing the kabal cut is equally confusing because now it's got too much and half of as i said what they got in there doesn't make any fucking sense and doesn't belong there anyway which is why it was cut to begin with watch the director's cut that's the one to go with yeah it's on to be right now and it's i don't know how much longer it's going to be there but it's a it's a good cut of the film it's a good cut even parts that move kind of fast uh it still hits all the beats it still hits all the beats so the quality of the film is better yeah you get where you're going the only thing i quibble with a little bit is the uh is it some of the character motivations i just think we're never put to print anyway like i just because i think that's what it is literally this director's cut also doesn't make sense in some ways i can't deny that it's the most sensical one that exists version of the film but even in that i think it's just because to your point some things did not get filmed some things were never put to screen in the first place some things might have been cut and lost to the point that they could not be recovered i'm not really sure i wasn't involved in the process all i know is that this is the the difference between the theatrical version and this version it's two different movies it's two entirely different films and if all you've ever seen is the theatrical cut you owe it to yourself to come to this before we go i want to give a shout out real quick to a friend of ours that celebrated an anniversary recently i just unfortunately we weren't able to get to it till now but our dear friend peat over from good beer bad movie night just celebrated his eighth season on that show they've been doing that show for eight years i actually didn't know that yeah that is impressive it's obvious and i believe now they don't produce as you know as many episodes as we do or give me back my action or movies or anything like that you know i think i can't remember if they're once a month or once a year so you know maybe they'll have eight episodes that's in right so congratulations on your eighth episode eight years later no i know they're once a month perhaps i will run your ad for this one and that'll be my treat to you exactly nothing else to give you so other than a big round of applause or a sad slow clap either way either way congratulations go listen to their podcast they are a lot of fun peat is wonderful here and uh and by the time this comes out we should have actually had an episode with him on good give me back my i was gonna say give me back give me back my good beer night um it's uh that's uh that's uh that's like a man cave show that's right yeah because give me back my action movies isn't but anyway but uh give me back my action movies we were on an episode with them we got to cover a movie that leo and i have nothing but love for which is the movie crawl and we also got to meet the lovely hosts of cinema slab who were also on with us Anna and Anna so go check that out crawl so well they just kidding they didn't grow up with it like we did it's not it's not the same it's not the same it's like watching the breakfast club when you're 45 you know gross yeah exactly not 45 just watching the breakfast club gross i was combining the two but anyway so go check that episode out as well we love any opportunity that we have to use magic or hacking or whatever it takes to get us on their show because they won't just invite us so we often have to force our way over there and our key well yeah but anyway we'll see you next week for the second part of nightbreed bye so so so so so you (upbeat music)
