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There is no, you know, you got a guy right here, you got a guy right there. We're a hundred percent behind your COVID and I had an opportunity to talk to Drake. I had an opportunity to talk to Jacoby separately and also together. And I feel like we're all on the same page from that organizational perspective. - Stuck the landing on that one, Gerard, saying organizational perspective. As Andy joked before we actually launched our live stream this morning, oh boy. Seems like Mayo's already had his blank cut out from him and now Fitzy can't even frame the video, right? When we're dropping a sound bite of the head coach of the Patriots making news, saying that Jacoby Brissette is the starter going forward. And what a crew we have for you this morning on Six Rings and Football Things. Brought to you by WEI Odyssey in 2400 Sports. It is a treat, it is an honor for our annual edition. You got Fitzy, the Foxborough fan boy. You of course have the apprentice in the form of afternoon show host on WEI, Andy Jumbohart and the Sith Master himself live from the bunker at one formerly Tom Brady place, the one and only PFW Paul, Paul Perrillo joins the show. Paul, we were anticipating that this would just be a roster cut down 53 man analysis. But little did we realize that just moments before this monumental broadcast, we would have such massive world shattering news. (laughing) Can't even get through it. What do you think, Guy? What do you think, Mr. Perrillo? - Yeah, I mean, obviously not surprising. A little disappointing, I think for those of us that had sort of watched Drake May over the last, I would say, I don't know, eight or 10 days. And sort of started to wrap our heads around. There's a possibility here, he could start. I mean, I don't think you're ever truly ready as a rookie quarterback to just step on the field when you've never done it. But I think he showed enough that I think he made the decision a little bit different. Unfortunately, I think that they sort of went back to the plan, you know, whatever the plan was, I think that they had made this decision back when they signed your COVID per cent, and this was gonna happen. And here we are. - I hate the presentation more than the decision. I actually, and I know a lot of people hate the decision, wasted season, I'm not watching games, call me when Drake plays, like all that. - Yeah, if you don't mind. - I don't think any of those people. - Okay. - Are people really, all right, are people, just real quick, Andy. I know we're in touch via social media, you on the afternoons. Are people legitimately already saying that, I expect some empty seats if he stays in and started the whole season later on, but like are they saying that now already? - Yeah, people are saying like, wake me when Drake plays, I'm not watching blah, blah, blah, which I'm with Paul. I don't believe you. You may, you may put red zone on, Pepsi King Paul Perrillo. You may put red zone on, you may turn the channel in the second half, whatever. It may, that may come, but you're gonna follow your team or you're a terrible fan, 'cause it's your team, and you like football, and you're hoping that you're wrong, whatever, any of that. To me, the delivery of this is what has screwed the pooch. It's the mixed messaging, like even yesterday, Gerard told us, you're not supposed to timestamp podcasts, sorry, Andy, Gerard told us, - Well today, yes. - Yes, Wednesday, in a press conference when he wasn't announcing the starting quarterback, that, and listen, he cut off Phil Perry. What's best for the team right now might not be best for the team later, which to me was like, oh, so you definitively are going with Jacobi Bursett, 'cause you just told us why you'll switch to Drake May later. - I agree. - Except, which I love, like, okay, so you gave me that opening, my week five, Miami Dolphins plan is in play, get that tough first month out of the way, Drake, okay, now you're ready, whatever. Today, he said like 12 words, and in those 12 words, he said this season twice, while talking about Jacobi, excuse me, 'cause you better not be thinking about starting Jacobi Bursett this season, all season. You said this season, we're not doing that, and I know he wouldn't get in the hypotheticals, and then he ran off because even in the short press conference, he screwed the pooch by saying, we have decided, I mean, I have decided, 'cause I told you yes to my decision, even though today I said it's we doing it organizationally, to me, the entire issue for this plan, Paul, has been the way it was described by Gerard at various points. He could not have put more, I don't know, monkeys in the wrench or whatever the hell you wanna call it, and I don't think that made any sense, Andy, but let's just move on. He could not have screwed this up more with his words. Words matter, and his words have been horrific all summer. - So yeah, I would agree that I have less of a problem with the plan itself, as I do the execution of said plan. You know, and there's been some talk about this with regard to Belichick, you know, like, oh, the media's never happy, like when Bill did it, Bill never said anything, and they used to criticize Bill, and now Mayo is talking too much, and they're criticizing Mayo for talking too much. In both cases, they're missing the point. With Bill, when he had a quarterback thing, you know, that was similar to this with Mac Jones, Bill spoke, because you know why? Your starting quarterback is kind of important, you know, and it's important for the team to know it's important for everybody, the organization, and it's important to be one with a decision like that. And matter of fact, Belichick was so strong with his decision that he eliminated the other possibility and cut Cam Newton, and it was all Mac Jones in 2021. Contrast that to this, where, you know, we'll probably know by Monday night, I might not tell you right away, but you know, by Monday, Tuesday, we should have a decision. Here we are on Wednesday, he says they have a decision, but haven't told them yet? Like, I just can't imagine those kinds of communication breakdowns happening under the old regime, and to Andy's point, earlier in the week with you guys, Gerard Mayo was talking about how Drake May is all played, you know, Jacobi Bursette. I don't think Gerard's a dumb guy. I don't think he said that by accident. I think he had a point and a purpose to that comment. I think he was kind of leaning toward, I want to get this ground, I want to get to May, maybe a little sooner than we all thought. And I think it sort of points to the fact that maybe they're not all on the same page. So to me, it's the execution of the plan that I would have a problem with. - Yeah, I think that's the biggest issue as well. And Andy, that stuck out to me. The first thing I noticed was when he said we, I mean, I, like, that just speaks volumes to what a foster-- - Like when my wife and I sit down to like punish the kids, and it's really her punishing them that, but I'm doing the talking, we've decided, I don't know. She's, we, me, I, us have grounded you for a month. Sorry, gotta go. - It's just, it's, it doesn't need to be, it doesn't need to be so messy. Also, you know what I don't really like? And boy, you know, the political speak in one day, he's talking this way, one day he's talking that way. If it's a true competition, then you should anoint the starter as the winner of said true competition. Or as Hart pointed out, ages ago on Six Rings, The Weeknd Show, wherever the hell we were talking. You know, you just should've said, like, the plan is gonna be the plan, no matter what happens this preseason, so long as both of them emerge from the preseason healthy, we're gonna stick with our plan, but instead, it's been this mishmosh of peas, gravy, potatoes, and chicken that has come out like a really lousy shepherd's pie of words. And the double press conference, I don't need a Wednesday saying, I'll be back tomorrow, but I gotta tell my players first, of course it's gonna leak out. And then you have a double press. It's a mess, Paul, I'm yearning for the days of the authoritarian autocrat in Belichick as opposed to the collaborative silo-free hive mind. - Right, and see, and that's where I can strike a balance 'cause I do like the way that Gerard has been a little bit more forthcoming with us about certain things, and I think that that's probably better because I was never a believer in the reason that they won was because Bill didn't tell anybody anything. I don't think that had anything to do with it, but I do think that there's been some sort of, especially lately, some mixed messaging, and that's where you sort of get in trouble. I don't have a problem if you have, if you wanna give us a transparent look at what your thoughts are, but let's keep them a little bit more consistent than they have been this week. Now, I see one of the messages popping up, and I agree strongly with this. Jeff here talks about, you know, Mayo's a rookie head coach. Let's give him a little bit of slack. He's not been through all this before, and I agree with that. So let's see him learn from some of the missteps 'cause I don't think this was handled as well as it could have been, but I agree with that. It's the first time he's been in this kind of a situation. - I have beaten that drum all summer, especially in the Judon thing when people said, well, this would never happen to Bill Belichick while it happened with Terry Glenn more disrespectfully in 2001. But the issue I have with that is, Bill Belichick built his career on I can effing coach, right? Exes and owes I can effing coach. He did not build a career on, I'm really good at press conferences and building bonds with players and relationships. Gerard Mayo has told us, I'm a rookie coach. I'm gonna make mistakes. But all we've heard is he's a leader of men who's gonna be a better communicator, who's gonna build relationships first with players and all those things. And the thing that worries me is I feel like he's struggling in the area that's supposed to be his strength right now. He admitted the football part is actually gonna take a while 'cause he's never been a head coach. He doesn't really know a lot about offense and all that. But he's struggling to communicate. He's struggling to have relationship. Like I said this on our show yesterday, I thought the one thing when Bill left, he was taking like awkwardness with him. So yesterday was as awkward a day as you could have. He has a press conference where he wants to say nothing, but they have practice. So there has to be a QB one in practice 'cause we're gonna run reps. So are you lying to us that you haven't told them yet and you wanna tell them which I think is admirable? You should. I don't believe they should find out on Twitter from Adam Schefter. - Absolutely. - But the whole timeline, it should have been done and addressed by yesterday or not like that's my issue is the communication and the things that he's supposed to be good at right now while he's learning the other aspects of the job and getting better at the other aspects. I think he's failing at those. And then my biggest criticism is what you said and old friend James White I think is 100% wrong on this 'cause he was defending Gerard. Like yeah, it's possible to win a competition but not win the job. That is true if the guy who was under center was Tom Brady. Then there wouldn't be a competition. Everybody would know it's Tom Brady even if he's failing or whatever late in his years. But this was a journeyman, a rookie and a head coach who said, no, no, this is a real competition. This is a real competition. And then in the time when they were competing, Drake may won the competition but somehow didn't win the job. And I don't understand that still. - I do think and listen, I think I've been on record many times. I would just assume accelerate the process a little bit and go with me. But I do understand what Mayo's talking about in terms of the totality of the competition. If you're going off of since the Philadelphia preseason game, which, so that's August 15th. Since that game, it's been Drake May. Drake May has been better than Jacoby Bursett. Prior to that, I don't think that was the case. And I think people have sort of ignoring that part of it. But to me, that's understandable that the rookie would come in and need some more time to sort of figure out what he's doing and get comfortable. Once he got comfortable, I think now it's more of an even playing field and now he's playing better. - 100%. 'Cause it's not just rookie veteran, it's rookie and veteran who knows the HC of the offense and played in his offense before. Like that's another factor here too. Like he knew the class syllabus before the professor passed it out. Whereas Drake May is like, "Oh, this is interesting. I'm gonna have to get up to speed on this." Jacoby Bursett already took the class before. That's not fair. - Right, right. And this is why, again, I don't have any real problem with the fact that the Patriots have decided to go with Bursett at the outset. I'm not a huge believer in because of the offensive line or because of the lack of, like I don't care really as much about that stuff. Like I think it's, matter of fact, the way people talk about it, is grossly disrespectful to Jacoby Bursett. - Yes. - Like Bursett go out there and get his teeth knocked in. Like I don't really understand that kind of mentality, but I do think that there's something to be said, like what we're seeing in the summer is not indicative necessarily of what you're gonna see in the fall. So May might not be ready. And like I said earlier in the show, like I'm not sure that there are any rookies that just walk onto the field and are completely ready to play. So I understand if you wanna be cautious. - I would have rolled the dice. I would have gone with May, but I don't kill them for the decision. I do think it could have been handled better. That's really my only issue. - Okay, so Paul, the other day when Devin McCordy was kind enough to join us here on the pod, we talked about how it feels like the Patriots are trying to middle things to sort of please the coaches and the brass, but also try to please the fans and explain exactly why things are going the way they are because they're kind of caught in the middle thanks to two things that have happened recently. One being the beginning and end of Mack Jones' potential in career with the Patriots, started out great and then somehow through his own attitude, the Patricia experiment and whatever else, they kind of ruined him and he didn't do himself many favors. On the other side, so they're leery of having another Mack Jones in the form of starting Drake May if he's not ready and the line gets him crushed. On the other side, you have CJ Stroud, who last year just gets thrown in after looking lousy in the preseason and lit the league on fire to the tune of now being considered a top 10 quarterback in the NFL and winning Rookie of the Year last year. So I don't know which way they're trying to play it. When you reduce it, when you boil it down, do you think it's mostly just, is it out of deference to a percent who they paid $8 million to or is it a preventative because of the horrific offensive line? - I think it's probably a little bit of both and I do think that they made some assurances to present when they signed them. And it's another thing, like don't you guys get the feeling that this decision was made in March? - Yes. - You know, like they, quote unquote, the plan was developed in March. - Yup. - And that's okay, except for a, there's a lot of things that can change. It's one of the reasons why, and again, I know it's unfair to keep comparing it to Bill, but how many times did Bill tell us Andy, you know, like, well, what's the situation look like at left tackle? Well, fortunately we don't have a game until September. You know, like if it was an able, you know, these things have a tendency to sort of work themselves out. He never backed himself into a corner. I do think that they sort of let percent know that you signed with us, you're going to be the placeholder and you're going to be the starting quarterback. It's going to be your job. Well, things kind of changed. I think May was probably at a, do you remember the first preseason game when it was concerned because he only played six plays and people were saying, "May only play six plays," 'cause they think he's woefully behind. And, you know, and there was all kinds of panic. Well, do you think that maybe the other thing was true, that he's actually more advanced than they thought, and he's more ready to play than they thought? You know, people like Daniel Orlowski, who I really like, I say this all the time when I take this shot at him, said that he had to sit two years, not just one. Does he look like a guy who needs to sit two years? No. And my reaction to your plan thing is 100% right. I think this was decided basically in March, April, whatever. At the same time, it was decided that Chukes Okorafor was the left tackle. And since then they've decided, "Oh, I don't think Chukes Okorafor is the left tackle." Why? Because he can't play the left tackle, maybe some, whatever. Like, you have to, you can't write it in stone, to use Gerard's words, set it in stone that early. Because stuff changes, injuries happen, guys aren't as good as you expect, they're better than you expect. The offensive line thing we need to talk about, because this really rubs me the wrong way. The reality is, in my opinion, I know everybody says they're gonna get better. Why? I have no reason to believe the offensive line is going to get better and be better. Now, you may argue you like match ups a little differently. Oh, the first month is really kind of a murderer's row and our line stinks, whatever defensively. Okay, but a line that lacks depth isn't going to get better in my, like somebody's gonna get hurt. And if it's David Andrews, we've already seen, you're porked. And if it's Mike Onwenu, you're probably pretty close to porked or porked. If it's both, I don't know what worse than porked is, but you're that. So I just, I don't find this idea that the offensive line will be better because, oh, they'll have some practice time. You know who also gets practice time? All the teams they're playing against, the D lines to see how much they suck. And they'll figure out how to attack it. But until I lick their chops and eat dubs like frickin' James Winston in front of them. So the line's not gonna get better. So that's the one thing I have a problem with is this, and Drake May, is he gonna get better? Is he getting, are we gonna change the practice reps? 'Cause backup quarterbacks don't tend to get a lot of practice reps. So how is Drake May getting better over the next month other than watching what not to do by Jacobi Brissette? Like, I just, that O-line part really-- - I'm gonna disagree with you just a little bit. - Okay, let's go. Let's do this. - No, I mean, I think largely I agree with you. - Wow. - We just, I think we do this a lot. We automatically assume things are gonna get better. Players are gonna get better, whatnot. But I will say this is, isn't there a possibility that your two rookie offensive linemen are better players in October than they are now? - Yes. - Isn't there a possibility that they could help it? What, you don't think this possibility that both of them get better? - I'm not sold on Caden Wallace. What's he playing? - I'm not telling you what you're sold on. I'm saying this, is there a possibility that rookies might get better as their rookie season goes on? - Right now I'm becoming a woman, but what? - Okay, all right, see, now this is, this is why I do not miss it. This is what I don't miss. - Right, just so up to, so just-- - You know you miss this. He loves the huggy-balling response to anything that you say. He gets the cheap laugh and then he cracks himself up in general. - You know what, actually, you know, he's the reason why sometimes at presidential debates they yearn for mute buttons and of course they don't have 'em, but here Paul, you know what, I could just do that and make him disappear for a minute if it makes it easier for you. And now Andy's in timeout corner and he's very upset. - So when I look at the face on his face, he's taking his hand. But when I look at the offensive line, like to me, the other night was embarrassing 'cause they couldn't line up. Like they couldn't get a snap off. - Oh, it was over, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Did you miss the press conference yesterday? Gerard said the offensive line issues are overblown. They averaged five yards a carry. - Okay, so I will say this, that was gonna get to that. I'm not talking about stats or anything, but that was the first time that, that was the first time that they ran the ball with any degree of effectiveness all summer. Wasn't that Washington game? - Against defensive line. - I did see some progress there on the offensive line. Past protection, he had like, they had one sack and two quarterback, there were plenty of plays that that ball came out really quick before pressure was getting there and it was coming. - So it's cool. - I'm not telling you, like everything was perfect except for the alignment issues. They had some holding calls, they had some penalties all night and the penalties have been a problem for that group all summer. So until they can clean that up, it's not gonna get that much better. But I don't think just because these guys are out there means you can't put a quarterback back there because he'll get killed. I don't think it's that bad. - But Paul, yesterday, if I'm not mistaken, I'm not sure exactly how intensely this was covered because obviously we've all been focused on Gerard Mayo and company. I mean, Gerard Mayo making the decision that Jacobi Brissette would be the starter for the season. He starts 17 games, so help us all. - So let me just cut you off there, Fitzy. - Yeah. - I think the last thing that he said in that press conference was also, as long as Brissette continues to play at the level we expect, he'll play. So he's telling you, they're going to school at three points the first two games. He's not just gonna keep playing. - Well, to be fair, he can't have played to the level they expect this preseason, right? - That's a fair point. - So he already hasn't played the level. - It was the level I expected because I've watched the first eight years of his career. But don't tell me he played to a level they expected and that's in a positive sense. You can say you expected it in a negative sense 'cause it wasn't good. - Right. - But what about, so what I wanted to mention was yesterday, if I'm not mistaken, there were photographs that came out of Mike Onwenn who were taking snaps at left tackle. - Yeah, I heard that was fake news, but-- - Yeah, that was fake news. That was Mr. Porter news. - That's fake news? - Yeah, fake news. Didn't happen. - It won't do that. - I'm not telling you it was fake. I just heard it was fake news. - No, I could've just been somebody mirror flipping a photograph and saying, oh, look, it's on window. Okay. So more to use triggering deflate gate speech, it is more probable than not that the Patriots will open the season with a core four, so Andrew's, Robinson, and Onwennu. And Andy doesn't think that line has any chance of getting better, but offensive linemen do often say, Paul, that they feel like they need more reps together to function as a unit and they get to know each other. Maybe City So will come to learn that it's not best to run into the backside of Leiden Robinson when he should be pulling. Maybe they'll understand each other's chemistry and symmetry and whatever. It's, it is what it is. I mean, I know yesterday you had to punt on and now we'll get into a little bit more of the roster beyond Jacobi Bursett. Like four guys get released 'cause four guys get brought in including two tackles none of us have ever heard of before, but of course now there are two favorite and most important players on the Patriots roster. This could be a season-- - It's very low and Tyrone Wheatley. - It's all over. It's, I was just gonna say, it's low and Wheatley 2.0, right? - It's quite like, people like Andy and I, they talk about this stuff all the time. There was a lot made of this number three in the waiver wire process. You know, step, you're not getting difference makers off of waivers. If you have a young player, Fitzy and he's got some ability, why are you cutting a guy who makes no money, who can play? - Right. - That's the guys that are available on waivers, is young players with less than four years of service time that aren't good enough to make their team. Like there's not, I don't think the chances are great that that guy's a budding pro bowler. - Yeah, I don't imagine that all of a sudden they're gonna have answered all of their problems that left or right tackle or tackle depth overall. How long heart have we been banging the drum? - Please spend a top three pick, a top three rounds pick on a left tackle or like a left tackle. - Do you want a right tackle that you can convert to left tackle that just gets-- - They will next April. - They will next April. - That's my plan that Andy poo poo's because he doesn't like any of the rookies, but like if you were to sort of finish this season with an offensive line that included say, city so, David Andrews, Michael Wenhoo and Caden Wallace at right tackle, or Leiden Robinson of one of those guard spots 'cause he's better than city so. And then you draft the left tackle in the top 10 next year or the top five. - Will Campbell. - You can go from, this is an embarrassment we can't even line up properly to, hey, we got a pretty good offensive line. It can happen that quickly. - Absolutely. And I actually think it can happen that quickly at their two biggest positions of need next off season. They have the assets in place or they're going to have the assets in place in all likelihood with a top pick. Maybe number one overall that you then trade and whatever, get your Will Campbell. Although apparently I was reading Field Yates. I trust Field a little bit. The kid out of Texas right now is the number one tackle. Those two may vie for that spot at some point. They'll both could be top 10 picks. So you're gonna have that option. You're gonna have a boatload of money. And a boatload of money is usually the first step towards finding a wide receiver 'cause we all know there's guys that are gonna be pissed about their contracts and on the market 'cause right now, hell, there's what, three of them still dangling in the breeze. So yeah, you can turn that around pretty quickly. And I've been on that all along like, and I think Gerard has. I mean, the one thing I think he said that was true and consistent was how do you measure success? Laying a foundation, we're gonna win games. It may not be this year, but we're gonna win games. And we had one of the chat people say, you know, like the Red Sox. This is the first year I've left a season with the Red Sox thinking there might actually be a foundation. And if the Patriots leave December that there might actually be a foundation. If Drake May can play, if your offensive lineman can play, the one thing I've heard about your offensive lineman, they might need a little more grit in their Cheerios that they might be a little lacking of competitive fire that they're not exactly Logan Mankins looking to punch somebody in the testicles. And that could be part of their developmental concerns that they need a little more grit there. - Yeah, I mean, that is an interesting way of looking at it. And I do, like your Red Sox comparison is true. Like, this is a very good chance they're gonna end up with the worst record than they did last year. - And I'm fine with it. - The Red Sox, you've had something. - You know, unlike the last couple of last place finishes, you do have, you know, a tenor howl, Jared Duran, Sedon Raphael, like that you haven't really had these kinds of positive vibes about. Some of those guys are younger than others, you know, I think the Duran thing, you know, it's kind of a little older to be doing this, but you want to, if this is what he is, I mean, what he is this year is like one of the five or ten best players in the game. So if that's what he is, I kind of agree. If you could get to the, you know, I talked about the rookie offensive lineman, is Jalen Polk, can he just be a solid, like even if he's a third receiver? - Yeah, PFF told me that they now have their number one and number two receivers locked in for the future. It is all in. - Is that Douglas and Polk I assume? - No, I think it's Baker and Polk. - Oh, well, someone better tell the Patriots 'cause I'm going to predict that Baker's going to be a game day inactive on opening day. - Oh, what? - You can't have, we'll see what we'll see with that. We got a lot of time. Maybe I'll come back. We'll talk about predicting the game day roster. - Paul wants to come back on next week. - I'd come back on anytime you guys want. - Yeah, well, actually, I just wanted to actually trace all the comments, just telling me not to come on and let you do this to me anymore. - Yeah, if Paul was going to like no longer talk to me, that would have happened 20 years ago. I mean, we're past that point. That one time on TV, where we're in a double box and he got so mad at me that he broke the fourth ball and looked at me sideways instead of looking at it. (laughing) - Oh my God, no, the Bobble P, the Bobble P tick bill for all the furniture that he had to smash on commercial breaks. My God, no wonder why they take out insurance. So, but I wanted to go back to your point to Andy about the Red Sox 'cause it's interesting. I agree with you. I heard you take yesterday on the radio and I'm going to exit whether they win 75 games, 83 games, make the wild card more than likely. Don't make the wild card. You do have three, four, five guys. You can now build a team around with several more, supposedly coming up from Worcester. I have more faith in Roman Anthony and Kyle Teal than I do, Marcelo Mayer, because that guy's heard as often as JD Drew and there's, which has been way too much pressure on him for years to come now. But is back a big way because of all the pressure. So, but I feel like 2021 was the equivalent for the, for the Patriots. Like, hey, look, they got Mac Jones. They got some, they got a couple of guys in the uncharacteristic spending. Yeah, it was not a young team though. Yeah, it wasn't that we were deluded into thinking it was. It was an old team with a young quarterback. Right. And I would also recommend that the Patriots, rather the Red Sox don't make a pitching coach, the hitting coach next year as well. They would, they should probably avoid that 'cause we saw how that went. But if we, now to the 2024 Patriots, if you exit this season with May and Polk, maybe Baker, Jeheem Bell, maybe Jeheem Bell, one or two guys on defense that are recent dish additions like Gonzalez, maybe Alex Austin, who knows. If they can all play as well, or maybe we finally figure out exactly what Marty Mapu is, if all these things come to pass, that's a reasonably successful season for a team in massive roster turnaround with a new GM, new head coach, new just about everything. Yeah, I think if you can get all of those factors to be on the rise, that's more than just a reasonably success. To me, if you just have Drake May looking like he's the franchise quarterback, that alone qualifies as a successful season in my view. Yeah, but really a franchise quarterback. Not like, oh no, start 2021. Do we have a franchise quarterback? 'Cause Paul, I know you were not, but don't you believe the majority of Patriot Nation, including Bill Belichick, kind of indicated we got our franchise quarterback in Mack Jones and then it all blew up and Fitzy kind of detailed some of the aspects that led to that. Everybody forgot to watch the second half of that rookie season too. Including cold hard football facts. Right. Yeah, not in four, number one seed, Super Bowl likely. This is why I don't read 538 anymore, that in the 2016 election. But when that, if you watch the last, whatever it was, six, seven games counting the playoffs, he had like one and a half good games. Top. He played really well against the Jets and against the Jags. And the Jags were dreadfully bad that year, if you recall. That was. Terrell Bevel was coaching and I don't even know if Lawrence started that game. Yeah, so that was a really, really bad team. Otherwise, it was a bad performance against the Colts, a bad performance against the Bills, another bad performance against the Bills. They just didn't look good down the stretch of that season and offensively, it started even when they were winning games. There was a Thursday night game against Atlanta. I don't think he played very well in. The second half of that season, it was basically the offense had gone south and it culminated with that three pass game in Buffalo. Why do you think that happened? 'Cause the head coach didn't trust him to throw the ball any more than that. I mean, it was pretty clear. (laughing) That's how we're referring to the NEP. All right, so Paul, let's move away from the QB issue now just for the last couple of minutes here. A lot of, they did cut it down to 53 the other day. They went with seven receivers, now they paired it down to six. Born is on the pop, Jalen Rager's been released. One, do you think a guy like Rager has been told, don't rent out the apartment in Franklin, Adelborough, Foxborough. We may be giving you a call soon enough and B. How do you like this, the youth movement at receiver? Kind of saying like, okay, booty, polk, Douglas, like I need a couple of you guys, this is gonna be a receiver rumble. I'm gonna need a couple of you guys to prove it. That's what this whole season is all about. - If I had to choose between booty and Rager, I would have chosen booty as well. And I do think that he'll probably stick around. - Paul likes booty. - I like booty, you know that. I used to like boys too, you remember? - Yeah, he used to like boys, he likes boys and booty. - But the reason I liked-- - What are you doing? - I think if you look-- - Josh Boyce was a wide receiver that-- - I remember taking out a TCU in the fourth round with Kenrell Tompkins in the seventh round and Aaron Dobson in second round and 2013. - And I like Josh Boyce better than Aaron Dobson at the time, turns out they both were bad. So-- - You got a taste of Boyce. - Sometimes you miss. - Sometimes. - None of us is perfect with these evaluations. I like Boyce. What do you want me to tell you? So with the young guys, I think there was a reason-- - And that guy. - To try to get this back on the rails. It was Rager, it was Michael Jordan, it was Tristan Hill, all guys that don't have to clear waivers. - Right. - They can just-- - They can hang out-- - If you wanna play some roster games, you can tell those guys, hey listen, this is procedural, we're gonna claim some guys off waivers and we're gonna keep you around. I wouldn't be surprised to see those guys, I mean, I guess they would have to go in the practice squad, but I wouldn't be surprised to see something like that happen. Whereas if you go with booty and you, if you release him, now booty's exposed to waivers, you could lose him, if that's a guy you wanna do it. Like you don't have that risk with the other guys. - And so let's look otherwise at the roster. Do you have, is there one guy or two guys that you have confidence or faith in that you think are gonna be quality prospects that could turn into legit info players? Like anyone that you're looking to shine early on or that you've got more confidence in becoming like a long 10 year patriot. - Are we talking about the receiving court? - Yeah, overall. Just anyone, a first or second year player that you've got high hopes for? - So I don't know like how high, I think they have some players. Like I think Jalen Polk is gonna be a good NFL player. I don't think he's gonna be a star. I don't think that's in his game. I don't think he has enough sort of explosiveness to his game. And I think he can be a really steady, and I think he's a tough player, and I think he can be a good NFL player. I think he on white will be a good sort of just physical defensive lineman. I don't think he'll be a star. I don't think he's gonna be one of these guys that's gonna make his living coming off the edge with 15, 20 sacks of season. I don't think that's in his skill set. But I do like his power in his tenacity. So I think he can be a really good player for them. - Do you say he's like a bit more beginner stars? - Okay. Would you say like for people that are thinking like, 'cause you'll see a lot of fans on Twitter or in group chats and whatever else saying like, he on white season, this guy's gonna be a monster. I heard you guys discussing during the Eagles, joint practices that he looked a little stiff, was a little slower than guys like Judon. 'Cause I think he's more McGinnis-like than Judon. He's not gonna just race off the edge and be in the quarterbacks. - I think he's more Dietrich Wise-like or Trey Flowers-like than even McGinnis. I don't think he's an edge guy. I think he's a down defensive. Please with his hand in the dirt, Andy, are in sharp and tired. - Yep, that's true. - I think that's what he's more suited for. Like Trey Flowers. - Okay. - Which is like Trey Flowers was a good player. Like I don't, I think Mike Dusso has been a little bit, I don't wanna say like out on key on white, but he hasn't been as high on key on white as some others have. And I think when we talk about comparing him to guys like Trey Flowers, I think people look at that. Oh, that's a bust. No, no, it's not. Like Jalen Polk, I think Jalen Polk can be like Tyler Boyd. I think Tyler Boyd has made a really good living being a really important player as the third receiver for a good offense. That's what ideally, I would say Jalen Polk can be. - We need your markings. - If he's, yeah, if you have-- - You know what beat you on Jennings. - But if you have two good receivers, Andy, I think Tyler Boyd becomes a very important guy. If Tyler Boyd is your best receiver, you're probably not gonna be as explosive in the passing game. He's a good player, Tyler Boyd. And I think Jalen Polk can be in that kind of a mold. - And I think, and I think Leiden Robinson may prove out to be a pretty good pick. And if you can exit the season with another starter that you feel comfortable with on the line, that's another small win. We're looking for small wins here, not 10 and seven. We just want small victory. - Unlike, you know, we talked about it unlike a couple of years ago when everybody said they were young, but the numbers said otherwise. I think they have 18, I think is the number first and second year players, that's young. That's a young team. - Yeah, no, they're legitimately young. Now, I don't know how much of that is, 'cause I said this the other day, if I were Elliott Wolf, I'd keep all my draft picks too. Nothing comes good comes from my future if I start cutting my draft picks immediately after I'm following up a guy who supposedly couldn't draft. So sometimes I wonder like, Marcellus Dial, did he really earn a roster spot? I don't know, but I would keep him if I were the GM looking for long-term stability, I think, sort of, and they clearly care about perception right now, maybe a little too much, maybe they're kind of-- - There's a reason why Sean Wade went in Marcellus Dial stayed. - Right, and so, which I'm fine with, it's why I'm also kind of fine. I know Gerard and just kind of finished where we started, 'cause I saw somebody say we and I terrible, like that caught everybody. We made a decision, I made a decision. But in reality, the way they are structured, we made a decision. Elliott Wolf's career is tied to Drake May. So shouldn't he have some say as to how he is unveiled? And I know we're used to a power structure where it's Bill does everything and Bill has final say and Bill is this and Bill is, well, that's not what they have anymore. They have a defensive-minded young head coach with a personnel man who has final say, he told us that all spring, and a head coach of the offense. So if that's your set up, I'm not saying you have to love that set up, but if you've gone with that set up, shouldn't those three guys be deciding Drake May's future? Shouldn't they be deciding the plan, not just one of them? 'Cause you decided a certain power structure. Now you gotta roll with it, you made your bed lie in it. - Yeah, no, I agree. Like, do you guys feel, so I get in an argument in some of the appearances I make other places, do you guys feel like Gerard Mayo has final say over who plays? - No, well, since he said, I'd like to think I decide who plays when he was asked that question. - I see, I think he does. - I think he does. - I think he still thinks it's a hive mind. I still think that-- - Well, I didn't say that there's a lot of voices that have a say. I just think that ultimately, the decision as to who plays is his. - But he's very deferential to Alex Van Pelt. And so I don't know. I, all we can read like we knew in the day that Bill made the decisions. Like even Scar, I keep going back to this. Scar was as proven, trusted, relied upon assistant coach and Scar used to sort of defer to Bill and say Bill will decide, you know, which linemen are available. And then I'll coach him kind of thing. And I believed him. And you couldn't have more credibility than Dante Scarneki, a coaching offensive lineman. It's not possible. - I agree. - So like now we're in a world where the most proven offensive minds probably have at least really strong say. Can Gerard veto them? But if Scott Peters, Alex Van Pelt and Ben McAdoo all say, Chukes Okorafor should play left tackle. And Gerard is like, I've been watching. The guy kind of sucks. Let's put Wallace there. I think Chukes Okorafor will play left tackle. And then maybe Gerard midway through the third quarter goes, Hey, this guy blows. Can we do what I wanted to do now? - Yeah, see that's kind of how I looked at it. I think there is a collaborative going on. I mean, they told us that a million times. - We made it 40 minutes without the C word. - But I do feel like if he decides like, listen, that's not, I don't think that's right. And I don't think he's going to do it. Now, you can make an argument that maybe quarterback is different. You know, maybe the other 52 he has final say on. - Right. - I just feel like the head coach needs to be able to decide who plays. You know, who's earned playing time. I think he's very deferential on offense because he's admittedly told us many times, he doesn't have a great grasp of the actual schemes, the systems, West Coast offense. You know, he doesn't know this stuff. - So he's very green. I think he's deferential to it. But I think ultimately as final say, and Wolf obviously as final say over the roster itself. - Gerard Mayo is the first green head coach in the history of the Patriots. - Probably not the first, but obviously he's learning on the fly. And like all AI, it has to take in as much information as possible before it starts working. - When you look back and look at, what was the last time they had a first year head coach? - I believe Raymond Berry. - Raymond Berry. - I believe I read that. - And he's been a head coach anywhere. - Hold on. Rod Russ was a head coach? - Yeah, probably him too. - Yep, and that's why people now said they are calling it. Is it Rod Mayo or Gerard Russ? I can't figure it out. - Oh, see, you say I can't be. - No, he's Dick Mayo JK relax. - Everybody like Dick McPherson. I still think Gerard Mayo is gonna work out in the long run. It's just a, there's just so much going on right now. He needs to share about that. - I do. - You all in on that? - Hey. - Would you bet, would you bet your pendant, let's just say that Caleb Williams gave his offensive lineman? Are you willing to bet that? - That Gerard Mayo turns out to be a better coach than not. Yes. - Paul, you didn't see that? - Caleb Williams gave his offensive lineman a- - I'm sorry, what? - I'm not, you can't, I'm not sure I'd get that. - You testicles, all right. Listen, between love and boys and booty and talking about people, dog sniffing and dog whistling. That'll do. All right, Paul, you've been more than generous over your time as always. - Everybody wants to come back, don't you hurt him, it's on the record. - I'll come back anytime, you guys know that. You know where to send a check. - He says that now, then I text him, it's like, yeah, I can't. - Well, sometimes I can't. It's not because I don't want to. You taught me it's not a want to, it's a can't. - That's true, okay. You got a big afternoon show to attend to. Paul's got the show and all of his responsibilities for Patriots.com and I'll be here. So on that note, Paul, always a pleasure. You can follow him at PFW, Paul, read his musings and analysis at Patriots.com. And of course, Patriots unfiltered, Tuesday through Thursday, live 12 to 2 on the @patriotssocialspatriots.com. And of course, he'll be a part of the show today, I'll tell you that. - And it's gonna be an excellent show today. He's even bringing out the best and do so, making Mike shout out opinions that are borderline heart-esque at this point. So you're doing your job and you're doing it well, sir. And of course, Paul is part of the second best post-game show in town with the Patriots unfiltered live show, which of course you can listen to on thepatriotssocialsandpatriots.com. Paul, thank you very much. We look forward to having you back. Good job, Andy. Good job everybody. A lively chat today. We're thrilled to have so many people watching and participating live. Hopefully you enjoyed the podcast as well. Make sure you subscribe. ApplePods, Spotify, The Odyssey app, or wherever awesome football talk is found. For heart, for PFW, Paul and everyone here today, this has been Six Rings and Football Things live, reacting to Jacobi for set being named the starter in the Patriots 2024 roster cut down. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks again, Paul. Good day, God bless. And oh, go pets. America's favorite place to watch football is stadium swim located at Circa Resort and Casino in Las Vegas. Catch all the biggest games and a viewing experience built for sports fans. Chill in one of their six pools on three different levels for a perfect view of their massive screen. Plenty of seating options from cozy daybeds to private, temperature controlled cabanas, stadium swim. Book your spot today at circleosvegas.com.
