When you think about businesses that are selling through the roof like skims or all birds, sure, you think about a great product, a cool brand, and great marketing. But an often overlooked secret is actually the businesses behind the business, making selling and for shoppers buying simple. For millions of businesses, that business is Shopify. It's home of shop pay, the number one checkout in the world. You can use it to boost conversions up to 50%, meaning way less carts going abandoned and way more sales going through to checkout. Upgrade your business and get the same checkout all birds uses. Sign up for your $1 per month trial period at Shopify.com/income, all lowercase. Go to Shopify.com/income to upgrade your selling today, Shopify.com/income. [Music] Hello listeners and readers of AwardsWatch.com. This is the AwardsWatch podcast episode 250. I'm your executive editor, Ryan McQuaid, and joining me today is our editor and chief Eric Anderson. Hello from the mountain. Our associate editor, Sophia Seminolo. Hi everyone. And our special guest returning from our last tell-you-right conversation, Christina Yerling Bureau of Pop Culture Confidential. Hello, Rumi. We are here to talk about the tell-you-right film festival. So much to get into. So many movies that we were able to see, so many events that happen. It's officially the start of award season and festival season. Obviously, I think we'll talk about maybe next week or if Eric wants to mention a little bit too, some stuff that's going on in Venice right now. There's been a lot of premieres, a lot of great things that have been happening. Obviously, those things will start playing out at TIFF and New York and upcoming festivals. But we're here to just talk about the films that were mostly what we saw here at the tell-you-right film festival. But first, and before I get into any general ideas, I want to kick it back over to Christina real quick. I'm throwing a curve ball to start off episode 250. Christina, before we talk about tell-you-right, there's a special thing that you were able to do that was the first time experience for yourself this weekend. How was going to the restaurant known as Chili's for yourself for the first time? Oh, my God. Well, I have to lay the whole foundation here. We met in the incredible city of Montrose, where we all came together there. We landed in Montrose and you guys said there's only one place we're taking you. I've been to most places, but I had never experienced a Chili's. So you were so gracious to bring me there and I'll just say it was a lot. That's good. We were going to have dinner at the ketamine restaurant, but we told Eric that's not a really good suggestion. You know, ketamine and vaping really, really popular in Montrose and we just didn't want to hit those kind of tourist spots. I'm grateful for that. Very popular also in the films at the tell-you-right Film Festival, referenced to ketamine and vaping. That's actually 100% correct. Yes. Shockily didn't expect that. Honestly, there were moments from the first day in Montrose, the Chili's experience, which I personally loved to see through Christina's eyes, her need to southwest April, and describe it to me as yuck. Well, there goes our Chili sponsorship podcast. Yeah, I know. Responsed by Applebee's. Well, my ching salad was tremendous. I loved it. Yes. Yeah. That's true. So we got through, well, one also, shout-out to the upgraded Montrose. But can I do say, though, I have to just say in terms of restaurants that we, traditionally, it's the second year I'm with you guys to have our first dinner at the Chop House, where we have wonderful, glorious conversations. We get to personal stuff. We cry a bit. We anticipate movies. We laugh a lot. And that's an incredible experience. That's the first night when we get up here to the mountain. Yeah. I got to say, the ride up here was my favorite one so far, because I didn't have a blistering headache and almost went to pass out. Nor did our bus break down this year for people. Yeah, it goes to the breakdown. That was wonderful. That was the godsend. That's a plus. Yeah. That is a plus. The working vehicle is always a good thing. Yes, exactly. But, you know, we got here. We had that wonderful dinner. And then the next day, we got it, well, that night we actually got our passes. We started looking at this schedule. It was it, so the difference between this year's and last year's tell you right is it's back to normal. It's the 51st tell you right this year. So no more extra days. Program ahead of the festival program, Julie Hutsinger said we will no longer have a extra fourth day for a very, very, very, very, very, very long time. And so we're back to how it used to be cramming as many movies in about three and a half days as possible. But the stars are back. The actors are back. The stars were back. The actors were back. I mean, overall vibes, guys, for this weekend, did you did it lead up to your expectations from what our previous conversation was, Eric? I think we had a good slate of movies and we can talk a little bit about what we thought was going to be here or maybe could have and kind of had fun with in our in our preview. We had fun the night before the lineup. Yeah. I'll tell you that. Yeah. We were like, hey, maybe knows for us you can show up. Maybe queer will show up and, you know, totally shock and get, get snagged from Venice. But there were no, there were no surprises like in, in, in that way at all. So we, we had a pretty good idea of what the, the lineup was going to be. And it's good. Obviously lots coming from can, a lot of world premieres. But it did, it does feel, or did feel just a little different. I don't even know if I'm using different complimentary or derogatory here because I don't know. It didn't feel quite as tell your righty as before. And for a year that returned from the strike, there were major world premieres that had no cast members. And that was surprising. And these are the, these are films that definitely needed that a little bit as a boost. And also just some strange places to have a world premiere here that, that feel like maybe they would have fit better as a, as a first jumping off point at a, another festival. Yeah, what was interesting to me was that this was my first back to normal tell your ride because my very first tell your ride was last year during the strike. So I think I expected a much bigger swing into something different. And I was surprised at how similar it felt just in terms of running into people or the general vibe of the festival. Now, I mean, it's amazing to be walking down the street and all of a sudden you see Naomi Watts or to see Selena Gomez and Zoey Saldana and everyone from Amelia Perez on stage. Like that's fun. And that's different. Something that we didn't have during the strike, but it did feel much more low key. I think than I expected when I first thought, you know, like back in, back last year when I decided to come to tell you ride again. So I thought it was interesting to even, you know, at the festival, people were already talking about next year's lineup and the movies we might get next year. So this did kind of feel like an odd in between lineup. And I think we also just worked ourselves up a little bit because we got those announcements about, you know, queer getting distribution with a 24 and Maria with Netflix. And then that knows for out to little rumor about its random film festival placement. And I have this whole theory of course worked, you know, out that because Werner Herzog made an adaptation of Nosferatu that we would get that year, that of course was sadly incorrect. But I still had a great time. I think I just expected it to feel much different than last year and it didn't. Christina. I mean, for me, tell you ride is, tell you ride is the movies, those incredible conversations that we have when we're in line with each other, but also with other people. And it feels like a big family. For me, it was incredible because everyone was back. I listened to so many incredible Q and A's afterwards. I cried at least six of the movies and I'm, I mean, I use, I'm a big prior, but I felt there was a incredible lineup. There's really only one that I really didn't like and at all and the rest, there were many surprises for me. So I just love it. It's a beautiful environment and it just feels very, very friendly and easy. So I'm very happy with the experience. And I have the same experience with Sophia because I was also here last year when the strikes were so this is my first turn back to normal. Yeah. I guess for myself, I mean, you know, my first year was a normal year in the 49th and so, but I remember that being a really big year of titles, obviously it felt like there seemed to be better. I wouldn't say, well, maybe better is a wrong word, but didn't seem to be so much animosity between Venice and between Telluride in terms of placements of when films could premiere to then come over here. It's starting to seem that that is becoming less and less the case. And at least for now, because obviously Christina's pointed this out that there's going to be a political change in Italy and that is definitely going to affect that festival going forward. But I do also think that the fact that, you know, Telluride was pretty great last year and Venice and especially Toronto as we talked about the past suffered. And I think that there was a lot of deals back to, you know, those festivals about having the stars there this year post strike. And I think that that might just be a one year deal and like to go kind of put all the chips in the middle of the table, like Cameron Bailey and Barbera did over at Venice. So I think next year, even though it was, I do agree to Sophia's point, a little silly to be like already looking at next year, even though we hadn't screened a single film yet at this festival, I do think that next year will not just in terms of the film slate, but in terms of the maybe the availability of people I'm more optimistic about next year, just because you don't have those excuses, but if this trend does continue in the next year, that that's going to be an issue going forward, I think for the festival. But again, I think things change and every year, there's one fest that seems to be gets the short change. You know, one year it's Venice last year, obviously it was Toronto and this year it's it's telluride. But there was still a lot of great stuff that did premiere. A lot of exciting world premieres, we were very spot on, even though we were very much like frantically hoping and praying and getting out the candles and getting in a circle the night before we really wanted to, you know, say that we were watching those for our two before everybody else because who wouldn't want to see that movie because it's definitely a movie up our alley, or even queer because that's another film that's very much like our one of our most anticipated films of the year for this group. But we did get, you know, a lot of the films that we're going to discuss here that were mentioned on that previous show and it's I think it's just best way to jump right into those. Our first film was Conclave and it was Edward Berger's follow up and two all quite on the western front. And I think no, all three of us had read the book, right? Yeah. Eric, you did not read the book. I did not. Eric's like, books don't have time for you. You saved a lot of time. Yes. They're writing. I knew the ending. So that's all I needed to know. And so that is one of those films that Eric mentioned where the cast was not here, but director Berger was. Very nice introduction to the film. I'm going to kick it over to Sophia to start. I know you were in a big fan of All Quiet on the Western Front, his adaptation of that a couple of the Oscar winning adaptation from a couple of years. I'm sorry. It's in the. It's in the notes. It's fine. What did you think of Conclave? Well, it's funny because I actually have pretty similar opinions about All Quiet on the Western Front and Conclave in terms of the problems that I have with both of these films. Generally, the dramatic scenes and the tension in those is pretty minimal to me. And that was the fear that I had going into Conclave and definitely something that held up. Additionally, I mean, Volcker Berthelman's score. It's almost a joke how I complain about that win and beating Justin Hurwitz's Babylon score that year. And this, he put in more than three notes, but it was a very, I think, just loud and abrasive score that really overtook a lot of the moments. I think they were supposed to be a bit quieter. I thought, but I also want to just interrupt you for a second there about the music, also to sort of give a thriller aspect to scenes that did not have that at all. Yeah, exactly. Someone's walking up the stairs. Very dramatic music. Yeah. Right. It doesn't, it didn't trust the audience in that way, I think. But, you know, performance wise, I really liked Stanley Tucci. I think that he was the standout of those supporting actors and even, I think, compared to refines, who I did enjoy in the movie as well. I wish that Isabella Rosalini had more to do, but she does make a meal out of what is given to her. And I think that the movie, if you view it as a comedy, which it's not trying to be, it's a fun experience. Like, I did have a lot of fun watching it, seeing these cardinal scheme and refines basically eliminate them from the process one by one. That was very fun. It reminded me of some of my favorite reality TV. Not would you would expect, though, an Oscar contender, though. But this, to me, and we'll get to this, I'm sure you guys think the same, but it has, it still has major Oscar player written all over it. Christina? Well, yeah, it's interesting because the three of us had read the book and it felt like an airport novel. And I have to say that I felt that the adaptation is better than the book, but it still feels like it's kind of silly. But that doesn't mean it's not very, very entertaining as Ditto, what Sophia was saying about the aspects of electing a pope, some of the humoristic, how things happen. I don't want to spoil anything, that's why I'm being careful, how things happen can seem a little silly, but also very entertaining. And the Isabella Rossellini thing really worried us because we knew she was hardly in the book. She basically has one line, "How many copies do you need?" which didn't feel very grand for La Rossellini, but as Sophia was saying, she really made something out of this role and also was very needed in it because she brought some sort of satire and humor to it that I really appreciated. I do feel that the story kind of lets the church off the hook in a way that we've been discussing, that I have some issues with, but all in all, it was very entertaining. I'm a bit surprised that the immense love for it that was really huge, the reviews out of it were incredibly positive and I am absolutely positive that it's going to be an Oscar player. I think Ray Fiens, he's really up for an Oscar and he's tortured throughout the film and does it very well, so I think that he's going to be a huge conversation going forward. Eric? Yeah, I will largely echo that I think Bertelman's score is an absolute crime. It was horrible and to Christian's point, it would be so aggressive in scenes so absolutely unneeded when there were elements of the score that had just very small violins and just little plinks that would get you there and that's exactly what this story needed. It did not need thundering booms of war because that's just, no, it was awful. It was trying to really kind of amp up more than it was. There were some things I liked about it. It had punctuated humor that was really good and then at least from the audience response of that premiere night, one moment that caused unintentional laughter and so in my brief comments, I really do wonder what a general audience will feel about that moment and how they will react to it because it is an awkward moment for the story but yeah and also like Sophia said, it felt like survivor and drag race all-stars and I know that sounds like a crazy comparison but when you see it, then it will all make sense because it really is about these god damn queens trying to outdo each other for the crown. It is literally that so yeah, this is Drag Race Vatican and I think a lot of people have really appreciated that this selection year that this is bringing a lot of conversation to that and comparing it to American politics and every which way and I think that's going to be a very big selling point for it. Yeah, they make it direct, there's a direct line in it to American politics that's so wing-wing. There's multiple lines in the film that are right to it. Yeah, I mean, the review is up on the side I wrote the review as they started putting it together, it started to more and more fall apart and I did read the book, I do agree with Christina, the movie's better than the book. That's not saying much because the book's a pretty middle of the road novel and I will say this, the movie is intriguing enough to keep you interested even if you know what's about to happen because the book is so flatly written that it would put you into airplane mode if you were reading that airport novel, you know what I'm saying? But I do agree, I like to refinance this performance a lot, I think the best performance in the film is Daily Tucci, I think John Lithcount is not existent, like everyone was, a lot of people had him in predictions and stuff and it almost at times feels like a cameo, Isabelle Rosalini felt so bad for her, just from the book, just from this. I mean, the way in which she delivers her line from the book, the way she kind of just moves into the frame, it's very like, you guys remember in Elvis, when Tom Hanks, Elvis is crying in his mom's closet and you just see like, you know, Colonel Tom Parker kind of just slide right into the frame like that, that's kind of what it almost felt like for me in that moment and how many copies do you want? There's some great moments of humor and there probably should have been more, honestly. The movie kind of takes itself way too serious at times and needed to fix a third act in the book that was wild and kind of, like it didn't fit, and it still doesn't fit here and it doesn't fully explain itself. I do agree with Eric, like the, there was laughter towards the end of that film, whether that's intentional or not and then obviously from the filmmaker's perspective, it is not supposed to be taken as a form of comedy. I will be very curious to see how it plays at TIFF and how it plays at the regional festivals. I do agree with you guys, I think it's, I think it's going to be a hit amongst a certain demographic in the academy, whether it's a big enough hit to be a big player or a big winner, what remains to be seen, but yeah, it was kind of just like, I mean, let's conclave and that score, he listened to, I think he, I think, what was the guy, Volker, what? Yes, because Sophia has a death warrant out for him, that's what she goes to name. I think that he listened to every podcast, read every review, and just completely doubled down from the criticisms that, from that score, because it's literally within the first 30 seconds. I kid you not and it's so abrasive and it is so, you can't even hear the dialogue in those moments from, and it's important stuff, because it's literally the beginning of the film setting at what we're about to see, and it's just boom, boom, boom, boom, and then a little bit of strings and boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, and it's like, after every other sentence. That sounded better than the score. You're welcome. I'm actually, maybe I should get any composing, you ever think about that? There you go. But yeah, mostly mixed reaction from us, a lot of people didn't like it though. All right, let's do Nickel Boys. Sophia, you wrote the review, it's up on the site right now. I know you had a really great experience watching this film, kind of explaining your thoughts on the Nickel Boys and what you loved about it so much. Yeah, of course. So, Nickel Boys is Ramel Ross' narrative feature, director world debut, first narrative feature. Those who know the masterpiece that is Hale County this morning, this evening, and love that, we'll be very excited. I think to know that he stays with that sort of bold visual style in this literary adaptation, and that's a really bold choice. This is, of course, based on the Nickel Boys, which is a Pulitzer Prize winning novel by Colson Whitehead, and it follows these boys at Nickel Academy, which is a really abusive reform school in Florida, focuses on two boys mainly in their relationship, Elwood and Turner, and what Ramel Ross does here is he keeps everything in first person point of view. And I loved it so much because I thought it was a really creative way to think about adaptation and how essential adaptation is, especially, I think, when telling the stories of racial abuse and of what these Black boys experienced growing up in this horrible, horrible environment, and to be that strong in your vision and carry that out, I think it gave even more emotional heft to the text, and it was just a really inventive way to think about it. And there are images in this movie that I will never forget. The cinematography is absolutely breathtaking, and getting to experience those images from the perspective of either Elwood or Turner when the perspective switches, it gives even more gravitas and weight to the story. So yeah, I'm a major fan of this, one of my favorite movies of the year so far, one of my favorites of the best, and yeah, I wrote a review up on the site, gave it a big shining A. Yep. Who wants to go next, Eric, you want to go? Sure. Oh, we ran out of time. I'm sorry. Oh, and good night, everybody. I'm thinking that for me, this is going to be the movie of the year. We use audacious really quite a bit. Sometimes it's not always worthy. It's absolutely brave what Romel Ross does with that POV that Sophia was talking about, because in the first moments, first minutes, when we are looking at it first person, it feels, oh, okay, this is kind of a cute, a cute gimmick, and we're going to break from it soon. And it doesn't break from that. And I was actually so relieved when I realized that it wasn't going to do that because like Ross said in the Q&A afterwards, there is cinema and photography is the technology of racism because the stories are told about people of color, by not people of color. So by putting us in a literal POV, that's where we are. We don't have a choice from it. And we are both locked into it and given an enormous opportunity to see it. I was stunned at every single minute of this. I think the young men that play the leads, Ethan Harris and Brandon Wilson are absolutely extraordinary. Jomo phrase, cinematography, that 133 ratio, perfect love. I couldn't possibly love this anymore. I don't think. Christina? Oh, I think it's astounding. So like what you say, I think that the it's really visionary storytelling, the POV that you guys are talking about as well as the use of archival material. And what he does with this storytelling makes it both beautiful and totally devastating at the same time. But talking to people in lines about the ones that didn't like it, it very much feels like you have to, it's a sensory experience. And you have to feel that right from the beginning. And if it catches you that wave of getting into this POV, then I think it will bring you all the way until the end. But I feel that it's difficult for some and I understand that it's a very specific type of storytelling that that won't appeal to everyone. So I understand that it could be difficult. But if it does get you do not, you won't regret seeing it. It's such an emotional experience. I also want to shout out Angelou Alice Taylor, who plays the grandmother and is astounding. She just anchors this film so beautifully. And so for me as well, one of my absolute favorites of the fest. Yeah, it's such a bold swing. We have two films here this year from first time feature filmmakers that were documentarians in Remell Ross and Joshua Oppenheimer, we'll talk about the end here in a little bit. The thing about the Q and A that was the worrisome for a lot of people in the book when Remell Ross and onto this is when you do watch Hill County has such a distinct visual language as a documentarian to go to a celebrated book like this, you could lose that. And that's not what Dee Dee Garner, the producer, wanted it all. She was like, that's what we need for this story. And it was purposeful. I'm not as high on it as everyone else here. I still think though it is a beautiful film and it's one that's lingered and it's got that lingering quality to it that I think will carry throughout the year. It's like Sophia said, so much imagery and so many choices, it's such an audacious way to tackle a novel like this and look at generational trauma and the look through the eyes of these two black boys and do it in such a delicate, elegant way of doing it. I mean I was thinking a lot of it Bill Street, Kataka was thinking a lot of another movie that came out last year, I'll dirt roast taste of salt and which has the same set of photographer. And I was thinking about the specific flash forward sequences in the film too that reminded me a little bit of after sun. And so there were all these things that were sort of flashing my head but then it's all but that's I think the point is is it's about memory and it's about images and taking what you bring in and what you're going to take out of it. It's going to be in New York. It's the opening night film in the New York Film Festival. I think we've all talked, we think it's going to do really well there, how it does throughout the rest of the season. I think it will be up to how people handle that POV perspective because it is unlike pretty much anything you're going to see this year and for some people that will be better and for others that could be for worse. But yes, it was a glowing review up on the website, absolutely great job by Sophia. I highly recommend going and reading it once the film comes out or if you've already read the book, then you can go ahead and read it too and get it anticipated for that film. All right. Next film is Malcolm Washington's The Piano Lesson which is the highly anticipated director of debut. They saw the Pulitzer Prize winning August Wilson play. Christina, I'm going to kick this over to you. The Washington family minus Denzel, we're all here. Denzel Washington is a producer but Malcolm Washington, his brother John David is in the film. I believe their sister is also in the film too and also stars Daniel Deadweiler, Corey Hawkins, Ray Fisher and Samuel Jackson who we thought was going to be getting a tribute but he did not get a tribute. He was not here at the festival. By the way, those tributes if we want to talk about them real quick because we kind of expected them to maybe be Angelina Jolie and Sam Jackson and I believe that we did kind of think about Jacques Odiard as a potential for that. Jacques Odiard did get one medallion and the other medallion went to Saoirse Ronan for the Outrun which is a film that Sophia can talk about here in a little bit. She was I think the only one to see it this weekend from us. And then Thomas Schumacher, the acclaimed collaborator with Martin Scorsese, she had a documentary out here. It was the Bob Bryceberger documentary but it was really just a retrospect to look back on her life and the legendary work that she's done. But anyway, piano lesson, I think some of us were anticipated for this. It had a trailer that premiered right before and it looked good. But we've been a little bit mixed on August Wilson adaptations in the past. Christina for yourself, what did you think of Malcolm Washington's debut? You know, I'm really impressed with his first directorial debut. I think we're going to see a lot of Malcolm going forward and I'm really looking forward to it. This is my favorite of the August Wilson adaptations including Fences and Ma Rainey and the reason for that is I don't mind the sort of stagey theatrical parts. I know a lot of people who don't like that. It is stagey and theatrical but I find the actors and the ensemble so amazing that I go with it and I really think that it works. But this one has particularly beautiful elements of magical realism that the end is gripped me very, very much and it's in the hands of Danielle Deadweiler who I think is phenomenal in this movie. You guys are a bit disappointed with Sam Jackson's, I mean at least his role. I thought I had a great time with him the whole time through. I think he's a good anchor to this and there's a particular scene in the movie between the men where they do a work song that is I would say my favorite scene in a movie of the entire festival. That was just amazing so in terms of just one particular scene that was so gripping. So I liked it. It's not my favorite of the fest but I'm impressed with it. Yeah I liked it a lot too. I was genuinely surprised by it, I agree with you, Danielle Deadweiler is the real reason to see this movie. Also Corey Hawkins and Ray Fisher. Ray Fisher was absolutely fantastic in this movie and I mean Sophia on your show you're going to be doing Smash or Pass later this year. We're going to be talking about Ray Fisher, Smash or Pass from this movie. Yeah for sure. Just thought from an adaptation of August Wilson we haven't seen the movie I think with this kind of visual scope before and feel so haunting and deeply ancestral at times. I felt the urgency of this more. There is the stagey aspects that's kind of hard not to but I think he understood the urgency here and I really did enjoy it. I was disappointed in the amount of screen time from Sam Jackson. But that is also, I have to go back to the text and look at it but that's also the character. I don't know how that will play for him later in the season. He will start making the runs to the festivals and stuff in about October. So I don't think he's out of it by interest. Next year we better see a full length movie with Sam and Isabella. Yes there you go. So to that point, no I'd love to see that but overall I think it was a very, very good debut and he went up dad and adapting in August Wilson material Sophia. I think yeah I think he did. It's also my favorite August Wilson adaptation and that's because I think he did take really big creative swings leaning into the magical realism Christina that you mentioned and my favorite parts of the film were unpacking that haunting southern gothic quality that I think is really baked into the play that you could see really I mean demonstrated really beautifully on screen when it settles into those monologues it feels like it's settling into them. It feels like that's the comfortable place for the film to be and I wanted him to stretch more outside of it because we could see those pieces right. We could see that potential there and I wish that we didn't have as many of those monologues and I think for me like to John David Washington his performance I think was playing to the rear mezzanine. It was like you were watching a stage performance whereas I think Daniel deadweiler especially in the second half of the movie really balanced that well and I love a scene that she has that I won't spoil near the very end that I feel like could be her Oscar scene. She has a couple. She has a couple. But overall liked it didn't love it but liked it more I think than I expected given where I was on past where I am on play adaptations in general you should listen to real quick. But can I just say even in a very real quick there's even in the stage scenes there's one of the most romantic beautiful scenes in there that he manages to get out even through a very staged yet-or-like scenes I don't want to spoil that either but but so I think he did that well too. Eric what about yourselves. Christian are you talking about the perfume scene? Yes. Or something else. The perfume scene. I mean I think it's really spoil but I don't think that was very stagey at all I thought that was. I thought you were talking about more of the Corey Hawkins scene with her. Yeah I think the earlier the earlier third of the movie has more of the blog driven kind of things and and there's a I mean there's an intimacy in that perfume scene that is so physically close that it that that's how you really kind of escape staging this because you you could never be that close to a person you're not just watching this this square box of things happening yeah that that's that scene is absolutely exquisite. Yeah I also like this as the best of the the three newest adaptations of his work and that's not that it's a low bar but it's kind of because the previous ones just weren't they're more stagey than this they would yeah they weren't as adventurous and I talked to Malcolm Washington this weekend really specifically about that and he's 33 years old and he said I wanted to make something that people of my generation or younger would want to see outside of the idea oh why would I go and watch a stage play so he really actively wanted to to play with expectation and then does so so many times and I agree with with Sophia that when it does really lean into the religious and supernatural and gothic elements I think it is the most successful but it's also again it's the only one that really of those three that that does that so I I am in a little bit of awe that that's somebody of a family dynasty as as his and a first film it has done that and you know we talked about working with Leslie Jones the editor who's done tons of Paul Thomas Anderson and Dead Run Blind and the cinematographer who did us you you're talking then about somebody who is clearly willing to go outside of the box of what a play adaptation can be and and it's yeah that's where it's really the most successful yeah and Ray Fisher is incredibly hot I Daniel Deadweiler and I talked for five minutes purely and only about how hot Ray Fisher is and was wearing shirts that were just a little bit too small and shoes too yeah yeah he's he's not a size nine he's not a size nine yes and I mean Eric just real quick I ask you I mean a lot of people have Deadweiler as their number one going into this before this premiere for supporting actress I mean we're going to talk about Amelia Perez here shortly but I think I think she deadweiler has like Sophia says those scenes and feels like the heartbeat of that film it feels very much like what everyone has been wanting since till for her to have a nomination and this could also potentially be a win for her too well I mean she's obviously in in that conversation yeah I wasn't as high on till as as most were and even in piano lesson I do think that she has moments in the first section that are just a little too also a little too stagey and she has to break out of that herself too and she does later when when the movie allows her to break out of that sageiness she's ready for it yeah and she's truly magnificent I think in that second half of the film okay the end Joshua Oppenheimer's what if we had ended the podcast with the end and that was it yeah you know what and then we never do another episode no Joshua Oppenheimer's feature film or narrative debut as a director starting till the Swinton Moses Ingram Michael Shannon George MacKay about a movie about a family who's living in a bunker when it's passed the end of the world and they're responsible for it essentially and a newcomer comes in and emotes his Ingram and that's all I'm really going to talk about in terms of plot because I think audiences should kind of go into this as maybe blind as possible it also is a musical it's continuing the theme of musicals at this festival and of the year but I'm going to start on this one this this this might be my favorite film of the festival I really loved it I thought you know I'm someone that loves these big bold audacious swings and I think that this is the biggest one it does it's messy in all the right ways for me it felt weirdly that I connected with these insanely unlikable nasty characters throughout I feel at times while the music can be repetitive I found it still really emotional I thought the performances are a little rough around the edges but I think that that's I know this is a phrase that's terrible but you know I thought that that was kind of the point it's a very interesting film that I want to watch again because I could just feel like there's more to pick up obviously listening to that music the world building and production design of that movie is insane I think this cinematography is fantastic and I do think all of those four performance performers that I mentioned give fantastic performances I was I mean it was one of my more anticipated films from the end debuts of the fest and it didn't disappoint for me but I know that it did for others and so I'm gonna turn it over to Sophia to talk about maybe that disappointment okay yeah so I think Ryan every year now is morally obligated to like a film if it includes the word Oppenheimer somewhere in the title or the credits so that my you know just had to just had to make that little joke but I think that I was like a movie I'm sorry I was really looking forward to this and it was my most anticipated of the festival because I love really weird out there movies I do love a Golden Age musical which is what this is marketed as and what Oppenheimer says it is I do not believe it is that's another issue I think I have with the movie is that I don't find it to be one I think it reaches for it and I think it touches aspects of it and it might be that family's idea of a Golden Age musical at the end of the world but it's not actually that when you get down to it I think that for me I loved George Mackay in this I thought he was great I thought his songs I really liked all of those and you know in Moses Ingram when her character shows up as this unexpected visitor and we learn more about her character and also how specifically Tilda Swinton's character feels about her and having strangers in the house I loved those moments and I think that she also Moses Ingram really shown through here with her voice and her performance the production design by Jess Gontre I also loved and there were a couple of really fleeting beautiful moments for me but it never I think coalesced into something greater than I was really hoping for and I am a in a net stand I gave that movie five stars when I saw it so I think I was really hoping for something that clicked together a bit more for me here just in terms of vision and music I think the music it reminded me a lot of Wonka actually and I can't think of any of the songs now and that's something I need from a musical I need to be able to cling on to at least one song and have it stuck in my head after and wanting to visit a soundtrack and that just didn't happen here but I want to mention that one of the people who worked on the music for this film his name is Marius De Vries maybe De Vries if I'm just pronouncing that but he has a wild career as a music producer working with artists like Bjork and Madonna and David Bowie he was grammy nominated for Album of the Year for Ray of Light which is just Eric and I had a moment about that yesterday just couldn't believe but he also has worked on films everything from Baslerman's Mulan Rouge and Romeo and Juliet to scoring Coda the best picture winner Coda if you're listening Jay Ledbetter and also executive music producer on Annette so I could see the vibes there but even more importantly he worked on La La Land which I could see little traces of La La Land I think in the music but again those songs I think while also not performed by traditionally you know trained singers in Emma Stone I could still I think the songs in La La Land hit me emotionally and were much more memorable to me than the songs in the end Eric yeah I may have to stop like being really really excited about things because sometimes the the fall from that disappointment is is pretty huge this was easily the thing I was looking forward to the most at Telly Ride and it's the thing that disappointed me the most and oddly it started really wonderful because the the songs the music comes on almost immediately and it's George MacKay and he has this little song and I got like little goosebumps but then yes in retrospect it sounded kind of like a Wonka song and his other had sort of like a West Side Story vibe but you could feel that La La Land influence more than anything else throughout and I think there's like 20 songs in this and you get to a point really after that that all of the songs sound exactly the same their themes are exactly the same and they they became completely I could not really tell them apart I did have a great reaction to Tilda Swinton's mother song I thought it was beautiful but there is such a it's a beautiful thing there is a very I don't know intentional or unintentional chasm between the vocal abilities of George MacKay and Moses Ingram versus Michael Shannon and Tilda Swinton and it's kind of here where I'm generally pretty good about tone and and intention I could not figure out what the intention was of kind of mixing very very good singers with bad singers Tilda Swinton I love her so much is not a good singer and that's kind of what it seemed like it was supposed to be because we're sort of laughing at her she has a high pitch that she can't really keep and she's really in this weird place where it felt like Tilda Swinton pretending to be Tilda Swinton there was something it was a caricature of herself but it didn't feel like that's what she was supposed to be doing maybe it was maybe I really missed the mark on that but yeah it was repetitive and disappointing and frustrating and not in a fun way Christina bring us home on the end I'm sorry to say that this was a complete misfire for me this is the one that did not work and it breaks my heart because I as you all really wanted it to but and and you've said most that has to be said but for me it's that loss of momentum had a really interesting start some really interesting songs and then it just nothing happened and and the songs are not memorable they're very one note particularly in the themes I think I wanted it to you know put them to say something else so I'm kind of wondering what Oppenheimer really wanted with this what does he want us to say what is he saying why is he used to all these questions like why is he using musicals to begin with why is he doing something he says it's golden age that you don't feel as golden age what is the big objective with this movie and since that almost is completely lost on me and and I asked you guys to and several other people to what was your point of view what was your point of view and I just really can't figure it out so to me that became a really big misfire that doesn't mean there are certain aspects that I don't really like for example George McKay and there are several numbers that that are really funny or really touching but all in all it just did not work out for me yeah that's I think it's been one of the more divisive films of the festival for sure I think you guys are actually more in the majority than the minority on this one it's been very divisive and a lot of but I love that you like it Ryan that's the point of a festival like this yeah no I mean I love the hell out of this thing I can't wait to watch it again and you know I don't know if you guys want to but I just think that I think they're fine not what you know that's fine I think there is stuff to go and tackle into and we'll be fascinating to hear more from Oppenheimer and his team as as they talk about the film throughout the year I'm you know I I just love a big audacious bold swing and those things work for me and I and I can forgive some rough edges if the swing ultimately lands for me and so and then maybe and you know that's my fault you know I guess I'll say I'll say this I think what happens there's always this accusing nature of festival response to movies which can be just you know just over over done and that's not the case with this if I recommend go and check out the letterbox bar for it I don't think I've ever seen white like it and that's kind of that's kind of a cool thing because you know sometimes it's just everything's almost five stars or everything's down to like you know ones and twos so it is it's it'll be lots of opinions exactly it was room for everyone well it's that to part of the show folks it's time for Saturday night from Jason right um you didn't think I was not going to do it on this show that's right Saturday night premiering on Saturday night at the tell you right film festival who would have thought again ah who I mean it was like it was made for a programmer's dream anyway the film was introduced by Jason Raymond we had a special guest show up along with him to introduce the film the legendary SNL comedian not Chevy Chase that would have been something I would have been worse it was the one and only Bill Murray who obviously has a connection with right men and in his family and had another film the friend that was at the fest too that sadly none of us had time to get to it's a short fest folks we'll get to it sometime soon though we got we did get to meet the dog yes his name is Bing I went over to him twice at the festival to pet him he was the real star of the week of majestic great Dane he's coming for messy from anatomy of a fall I think yeah but he'll never be brandy right on a time Hollywood and that's just something we need to make clear we'll talk about Mikey Madison later exactly yeah our fiery takes on Mikey Madison's performance um Saturday night we were all kind of worried about this going into it salt trailer poster all that stuff um let's get the negative reaction in here first so Eric you you didn't like this thing nearly as much as it seemed like everybody else has online which has been it's been one of the bigger surprises and celebrated hits of the festival and a lot of people have really responded to it um so what what about it didn't work all the way for you Eric um and I'm sitting this to search me as you speak or to Sony as you speak here this is an example like the end which was sort of the opposite for me where my expectations for this were pretty low and my interest was even kind of low and I like Saturday Night Live um I like the majority of this cast I thought they're they're really fresh and cool and fun people and there are a lot of good performances in here I think Dylan O'Brien as Dan Aykroyd is amazing his impression is fantastic um I think Corey Michaels Smith as Chevy Chase also really really good it's you know if you have a setup of here is 90 minutes in real time it's not real time but like just a 90 minute period um you know kind of what to expect you're going to get lots of whip pans and fast editing and walking through hallways and walk and talks and what you hope or think is kind of like an inherent kinetic energy uh of time and that's what it's supposed to be and there's even a time clock that goes throughout the the movie and there is something absolutely lacking in that and I I I don't know how I don't know how you really couldn't because there are just certain restrictions that a story like this uh comes with and and certainly Reitman doesn't uh stray outside of them very much at all when he when he does do a sides that are not the crazy energy of everybody moving around uh they're just not very interesting at all so I don't I didn't I wasn't compelled by them it just sort of drops things into a dead zone uh I really like Gabriel Lebel as a up and coming actor I think he's obviously fantastic in Fablemans I thought he was horribly miscast here there is nothing in his energy that was speaking to what the energy of the timeline of this story of the 90 minutes before the very first episode of Saturday Night Live in 1975 none there was none there for me at all and he's too young all right Sophia yeah I mean going into this like we talked about in our preview episode like Jason Reitman and Gil Kennan not names that I that make me excited to go see what's your favorite film of the year we're talking about their next movie the Ghostbusters Frozen Empire I do anything for Caracoon but I think here you know I went in with a very low bar and I had a fun time I thought it was a lot of fun I thought it was like a really good Saturday Night Festival movie I think especially when you're getting a lot of heavier stuff and for me I think coming off of the end I needed something a bit more straightforward and just that I could slip into a bit more easily and I feel like here what I did really love are the performances so specifically Dylan O'Brien and Corey Michael Smith you mentioned Eric also Cooper Hoffman was great as Dick Evansl he has I think actually one of the best scenes that actually stretches out of impression and into creating a fully realized character and that's a scene in the stairwell with Gabrielle about which is also in the trailer but it's a bit more fleshed out in the the full movie obviously and also shout out to Tommy Dewey who plays Michael O'Donohue I thought he was fantastic I think that overall it's hard with movies like this to not feel like you are just watching a bunch of actors cosplaying really famous comedians and just doing impressions which a lot of comedians are known for being able to do and I think some fall into that trap and can't get out of it and others can transcend that a bit um specifically for me it was Corey Michael Smith as Chevy Chase who I just I saw as Chevy Chase and saw him I think stretch for a little bit more than what was written in the movie I think though that this is going to it played so well the festival I mean the audience was laughing so hard and cheering during this movie that you couldn't hear the punchline of half of the jokes because it was such a big hit with crowd and I think that when it comes out it's going to I think really play well for general audiences it's really fun it's short it's also really familiar too you Christina I know you like that I had a great time I thought it was fantastic I think the choice to do it as a 90 minute in real time leading up to the first broadcast of not doing like a week before something like going to with the perfect choice to to document the energy and legacy and just the genius of SNL and they didn't veer from going into certain dark aspects drug use and and whatever I was thinking maybe this would be a little bit more um PG so to speak and I think they got to those things but they within the right amount of time they had the perfect amount of use of these it would have been a much more cosplay as you were saying if they would have settled longer on each character but it was a perfect amount of chevy chase perfect amounts of dana kroid um so you got the touch of it and it was mostly their voices and mannerisms there weren't a lot of look-alike wigs and things like that and I thought they really captured that early essence of SNL which is kind of lost in in the broadcast that we see today and I had a great time I thought it was really fun I think it's one of the and Jason Reitman is very hit hit or miss for me as well I think you mentioned that's me as well so so I would all of us to be fair yeah and I think this is some of his best work and best choices I think this is the film about how you really had to make choices as to how you were going to do this and it just feels like the perfect run up to the 50th anniversary for me I think he made a lot of specific choices that only someone who had it's it's not fan servicing um that and and just pure nostalgia I think that's there's like literal deliberate things that make it fun and make it uniquely only someone like Reitman who has this reverence and coming from a a background where he's been around most of these comedians or his father like there's there's a great moment in the film where literally we have the musical break and it is a wonderful joke and it's set up just like at times a regular episode of SNL in terms of his punchlines I think that the humor it does not shy away from the humor that is back there it doesn't try to update that by any means and I think that that's the right thing to do it's weirdly funny from Reitman and and because they're not particularly funny screenwriters they're particularly in their collaborations they've been a little bit more let's use a kind word today mundane um and trying to in their last couple of films they've been making movies that are purely nostalgic machines and they're hollow empty pieces of entertainment um for for families and this isn't that I think that it is propulsive and it has a lot of fun and it's a perfect lead in into the 50th anniversary year that they're going to be celebrating um on SNL this coming year with a full anniversary piece I do think that people will really like this movie um because I think that's it's just a lot of damn fun and I I know Eric you didn't like Lebel and you thought he was Miss Cass I actually thought he was great um there are I thought Cooper Hoffman was great that stairwell sequence Sophia you what the thing that I would want to mention is it felt like he was channeling his father um when he was getting angry in there and it made me super nostalgic for even just that I thought that Corey Michael Smith don't know Brian I do think though that the female characters could have been fleshed out more especially very much you know the Jane Curtain yeah and the Gilder Ratna characters I feel like we could have gotten more of those I also thought that the the John Belushi character uh it was what it was um like it's it's it's not good um there is a a moment though as an SNL fan though where John is skating and Gilder's talking to him and it did make me and then I guess that's the purpose of this album but it also I thought it was really sweet and I think that For Rightman was a director that's kind of been you know all over the place the last decade or so I think this is the best movie since up in the air and maybe since Juneau even I think that um it might be a low bar and I think it's a very low bar oh I think those are good movies um but also yeah there's a couple good movies in between there but um but I also think that it's going to go to Toronto and I do think that the audience there is going to have a great time with it they're going to probably have the cast that was something that we didn't have here uh and it's you know more Michaels will probably be out there as well too it's going to continue this run of having a big celebration and uh it's it's also has this is the thing also too to keep in mind every single actor in that's in this movie that's in the main part of this movie has single title cards at the end of this movie and that's huge for SAG ensemble down the road which I could totally see this thing getting um even though that there are more of the veteran actors that show up in this movie I think actually suck and shouldn't be in this like Matthew Rice and JK Simmons and um you know there's I mean Nicholas Braun playing two performances that are bad um both of Andy Kaufman and Jim Hanson no thank you um but but I think cousin Greg wandered on to the set of I got a beard today um but I think the rest of the ensemble does a fantastic job and um yeah I had a lot of fun with it and and and Sophia knows I was very skeptical of the trailer hell I was even making fun of the poster and so um yeah I had a great time with it um all right anora palm door winner we finally all got to see it um we woke up super early too uh see it so uh thank god we all liked it right and so oh yes um I'm gonna kick it over to Sean Baker's favorite fan uh Sophia Seminole right here and uh she's your big fan of his work um so uh no I'm just kidding I know Sophia you're you're mixed on Sean Baker as a filmmaker a big fan now after our conversation oh yes he's a a great person I think to talk to is you major cinephile um but uh I know that you're up and down with his last couple of directorial efforts but I know you really really connected with this one um let's go around right this is the story of the festival for me it's these filmmakers who I'm very up and down on and I had really different responses to each one of their films at this festival really you know being really surprised in how much I loved it and saying or saying yeah they're still really not for me and in this case I loved anora I thought it was just this really wild almost screwball comedy at times I thought that Mikey Madison's performance as the titular anora or Annie as she calls herself as this dancer who meets this very young spoiled Russian like billionaires child I mean he is just so amazing in this movie and also delightfully awful um and I just I thought that this movie had so much energy I think that sometimes Sean Baker's movies drag on for me and this one I think felt very intentional I felt that Annie as a character was so fully realized both by Baker as a writer and director but specifically by Mikey Madison and what she's bringing to to the film her comedy is next level I think all of the actors their comedy is I was surprised by how funny it was but I also think that she gives a very fearless bold performance in just what she how she carries herself throughout this movie and how she isn't really afraid to go after these guys when we have a really extent a long extended sequence when she's just all again no spoilers because I think you should go in as blind as possible to this but I think this movie also has one of the best endings of the year and everyone knows challengers is my favorite movie that ending is still supreme but this one is close and I felt incredibly moved and touched by it and I didn't expect to cry during this movie but I did at the end so I highly recommend it one of my favorites that I saw this weekend Christina are you usually a fan of Baker's work and I think more than Sophia but I this this was way by far my absolute favorite and I really I like his work but I am all of his filmography or yes I'm blown away by this movie I loved it it I I had not realized that it was gonna go in so many directions for me it was a drama as you said a screwball comedy it's also story about class and privilege it's romantic it's Mikey Madison is her career I cannot wait what she does going forward this was one of the absolute best performances I've seen in a long time and I was just really taken by this movie and I also want to mention the supporting characters in here which are superb so the son of the when the parents of the son of the oligarch find out that he got married to this exotic dancer for Brooklyn um his parents get some people involved to go get him get her and have this marriage and all and that whole sequence with the characters that come and pick them up is is like something out I mean several long takes of screwbook screwball comedy that are amazingly difficult to film and and we're so funny and I didn't realize I was going to laugh so much in this movie because I usually don't and Sean Baker's movie said and I laughed so much and then I cried so much and for me it was just the ultimate cinematic experience to have so many emotions in one little package this is for me I'm so hoping it's gonna get a Oscar love in many different ways but particularly for Mikey all right well as a fellow exotic dancer from Brooklyn I definitely connected with what was your stage here with oh yes no no no we we don't talk about that time in my life anymore if you email the podcast if you want to find it yeah color me surprise that this is the first year like how oh my god sorry I need to take a beer oh that's amazing that's well you know it's coming to this stage awards crotch the moment that this industry collapses I'll go right to right to the the the only fan side and award that's that's your sub-sac right there wow that's I don't even know where to go from here anyway you guys still like me no that was amazing I'm gonna have to I'm gonna have to go and get the domain name like right now yeah um yes no I I couldn't have been more surprised at how funny it was there is an extended absolutely slapstick madcap sequence in the middle of the film that is so funny and it's really carefully modulated because it would be very easy and kind of silly just to make a woman that's a sex worker but she's really strong too and she's feisty and Annie is so much more than that and I'm pretty impressed that Sean Baker was able to draw her so beautifully um because even like in that sequence there could be a lot of very obvious moments of abuse or the wrong kind of intimidation of her and that we see of women that are sex workers and movies many many many times and it avoids nearly all of them to such a refreshing degree and and yeah Mike Madison talk about also somebody who is the opposite in person to any one that she has ever played she she's just a firecracker yeah I thought of we're I mean bringing it back to challengers again but she in person she reminds me of how like Josh O'Connor is so different from Patrick like couldn't be more different so that performance like both of those two are some of the greatest performances of the year just because of how far I feel like they had to stretch to achieve those performances and yeah she's fantastic she is and I think if you know just because of the way that the Cannes Film Festival awards work if it hadn't won the palm she probably would have won actress and then Amelia Perez maybe Palm and that it just there's a lot of of workings you know that it takes to get those awards because of how it has to happen but yeah she should be she should be coming for quite a bit of attention you know she's the fresh face on the scene this year for sure and she delivers one of the best performances of the year easily it's not even close she's up there with another actress that we'll talk about another couple of actresses I guess we're going to talk about here really shortly I'll say this I'm I'm I'm most you know I'm I'm kind of hot or cold on how much I love Sean Bakers works I sometimes I just think they're good or I think you know they're like that was fine or I never think about them again for the project but I thought this is this is his best work maybe ever I agree with Christina I there's so much in this movie if you want to dissect it but it's also just so damn entertaining maybe the best second act in a movie all year and and and that says a lot because like you know I think that is obviously some second acts can really ruin it but like this movie turns into a whole different thing in the second act and has that sort of I was so in Sofia it had like an after hours vibe to it very you know 70 and you know but even before that it was very 70s New York run around the city trying to to find someone vibe to it uh that's part of the story and I just had a great time with these buffoons and with anora just just a wrap just in this car doing these things it's hope they're all hilarious but then like everyone said it subtly sneaks up on you and the ending is so touching and heartbreaking which is not really something Sean Bakers known for and I think that has a lot to do with Matt since performance I think it also has to do you know this isn't the first time Sean Bakers made a movie about sex workers but it's like his mo it but it's the most mature version of that weirdly enough even though it's also the most chaotic version of that at times too um I don't know it's it a very justifiable wonderful palm door winner and I'm happy that it won um you know still no true life but it's well worthy of being the the successor to the first palm door winner since that's by an american director which is an enormous thing to be because it's very rare of a narrative feature or a narrative feature yes and so it's very very rare that that happens um but it's a very worthy winner and I could see why it won because it also has directorial influences like when Sophia and I were saying we were able to talk to Sean Baker a little bit and just he had so many influences that he was pulling out of just for scene by scene um for character decisions all those things he's a fascinating uh guy to just talk about and break down movies with in his movie specifically um so and he was talking about film stock and all these different things so I can understand uh why and I do think christina to christian sport I do think it will be a big player because it is neon's big push this year and I do think that it's I think it's gonna do really well um maybe not wins but I think but I'm I'm confident and now I'm putting it into some nomination categories um speak one shout out I want to shout out uh euroborosov uh among the amazing supporting male lineup in this film all of whom are absolutely A+ comedic geniuses they are but yeah euroborosov as Igor maybe the most gorgeous supporting actor performer of the season you want to take you want to take that praise offline award scratch my yeah we might be we might be having to go into the the patreon for that one um the after hours podcast yeah after dark is he is wonderful yeah he is wonderful no he really is he is quiet through so much of this film and the camera has him outside just on the side of the frame and we are looking at him while other things are happening or other people are speaking and what a gorgeously expressive face it's also like there's the funny scene where um also kidnap me go ahead please it has like where he's like eating the popcorn on the on the like right off frame so it's it's it's not it's not just moments of subtle beauty or or uh or even sadness in that performance there's also just these little jokes in there if you don't catch them they're in the they're on the side of the frame or with that so yeah it's a really really damn good movie right after that we saw Amelia Perez which Christina was able to see it can um and uh so this was her second time seeing it was our first time seeing it um Netflix Netflix is biggest player uh in the in in the race this year um or maybe maybe it isn't i don't know uh they did pick up a title like like you said Sophia in Maria um but uh i was not prepared for this i'm gonna go first year real quick uh i'll talk you know we talked about big swings i talked about it just recently with with Joshua Oppenheimer in the end uh holy shit uh like like it's like this movie it's so much to talk about and you really can't spoil it but yeah it's just like a mix of all these campy fun i was kind of delirious at a certain point but then it's then it's the movie is a musical and it settles down and then it becomes emotional at times and then it becomes like a little bit of an action movie by the end and it's like it's all these different things but um i think it's what really i think is a good movie um i have to see how it does on a rewatch i know Christina it was better for you on the rewatch um Zoe Saldani's performance my god all the actresses but i thought her specifically there was just this energy to her and i know you know i know the category placements and all that would stand you know we'll talk about that as the season goes on but that is one of the best performances of the year um and i mean she has multiple scenes where she's just delivering these great songs um and call her "Soviet Gas" on she's fantastic too um Selena Gomez anyway uh Christina what do you what do you how was your second viewing for yourself well i really like it the first time so saying it's even better the second time is high praise um i think the first time you see this movie it's a lot it's so much that you kind of really don't slow down to see how they've actually put it together and i think it was um i was struck the second time around how a moving i thought the last part of it was when they really go into los desa parathios and what's the sort of politics and and mixed with all the disappeared and the families that are you know in distress over the loss of their children which you know of courses at the hands of our main character Manitas who was in the cartels and they bring that around beautifully in a way that that moved me more but um i think you guys should talk to it so seeing it the first time my echo your own performance is so is al danya is just amazing in it then i think that you can tell in the q and a's i've seen with her that this is really personal to her she's she feels um incredible gratitude to have done this and she's really brought everything to it yeah she didn't have to spend the summer with big Jim she got to work with odeo right eric yes your thoughts eric i i really really really really like it it's um it is though one of those funny things where i knew what i was going to get going in because the the reviews and the the commentary about and around it it's a trans musical it's it's so many things uh so it wasn't that i wasn't surprised i did have going in you know what i thought it was going to be it did jump over that a little bit with some of those numbers that that that were more on the absolute almodovar kind of camp level android level was what you were describing yeah it was like android light weber at times two uh one of the things i really appreciate about this movie is it has multiple songs and they are all different they all have proper perspectives and points of view and sometimes it was really funny because it was just literally every line was just here's what's happening and it would break you know between um i just thought that was really cool i really like that i i thought it was having a lot of fun with all of these different styles too and and i really love Zoe Saldania in this i feel like she is somebody who has wanted to give a bigger performance than she's really been offered and she's been in the business for two decades this isn't but this feels so new for her she's been stuck in the marvel big gym world for like the last decade and it feels like very much she's been under under either motion cap or you know green makeup for quite a bit of the last decade and i don't know this is this is just really something special for her after the piano lesson or her i was just gonna say after that my favorite number of the piano lesson the work song my second favorite of the festival is one of the musical numbers here whether she's visiting different doctors to see how um i don't want to spoil it because you go in fresh but you all know what do you mean when i see that that's one of the events of the year i'll tell you that yeah it's it's easy it's easily one of my absolute favorite musical moments in a year that is pretty packed full of musicals and music driven films let's just say that that is the song that uh awards crotch will be performing yeah yes absolutely old and speed out ladies and gentlemen so you know what we mean um Sophia your thoughts on Amelia Bres yeah so every every year every year without fail there is a movie that i try desperately to become a fan of or like feel like i just want to support because i love the actors and there are things in it individual components of the movie that i genuinely love but it's like there are films that i just can't get on their wavelength and this really was one of them for me i am pretty much in the middle on it which i know is surprising because most people are very positive we're very negative i'm actually right down the middle um and i think the reason why is because i was actually really vibing with the campy arch quality of it at the beginning like the first act yeah the first act those early songs i was loving it and the camera work and just how out there it was it felt so different and fresh and original and that is something that i really loved when it gets into the politics and the cartel and it becomes i think much more of a straightforward dramatic musical that is when it lost me and i actually didn't feel anything from those songs or i just didn't find it moving and so that's why i think i need to watch it again because i think it was just a sensory overload the tonal whiplash was too much for me on a first viewing and i think i mean i know i'll see it at other festivals this season and we'll be covering it come award season because i think it will be a big player i'll see it again and hopefully it will click in more for me on rewatch kind of know what to expect there at that point i mean christina you you did have reservations i think a little bit you liked it but you you had reservations on the first go around and i think it did clear up for you a little bit on the second go around it did it did yeah i think that um i i think that again um as i said when the first time you see it it's so much it's such like just a few points sensory overload you don't know what what direction is this going wow what's happening here that the when you know that the next time you can really see the thought they've put into it and and in another measured way at least for me i want to get to the last film that we all saw together and then we can do some individual films that we all saw and get some quick takes on those before we get out of here so we were able to see maria which is the new film from bobbler vorraine which stars angelina jolias maria calas the acclaimed opera singer this movie had an interesting ride to get all the way to the mountains to tell you right as it premiered at venice and uh was received very uh mixed uh to even negative by the venice press out there um vicious uh you know things sometimes um there's usually one movie every year that that maybe either comes over here or has that then um that maybe then we don't necessarily agree with the takes out of venice um we saw this this morning and um i'd loved it uh i really loved a lot of it and i know that uh i wasn't the biggest fan of of spencer well i'll get to the spencer head here in a moment uh eric um i know you're a big fan of that movie that's what was it again the greatest one of the greatest performances of all time by christian stirrer it was the tweet um but i i thought july was incredible in this movie ed fucking lochman in his cinematography the production design i mean that's the thing with pueblo rangers you're not going to get shorted on the on the technical aspect he always has a you know a really precise and delicate and and and that time's also bold take on these on these worlds uh in his movies and while his movie last year alcande put me to sleep up here in the mountains i was at the edge of my seat and very comfortable in this movie and i thought it was very moving this was very much more in my opinion a connection and row companion piece with jackie both for a narrative standpoint as well as also in in terms of the narrative with what's going on in the story but also in terms of how i felt watching it in the vibe that i had and also the all-encompassing performance by the lead actress um i think july i keep i have said it about mikey madison just a couple of minutes ago but i do think that angelia july also delivers one of the great performances a year this is going to be the again already we're already seeing a difficult actress race and we have a meadams coming next week um you know and the reactions for that and we have some other contenders you know to talk about too during the year um but i mean between mason and and um and july here those are two just performances i don't think people are gonna get out of their heads um but i think july's is actually just a smidge better there's just there's just some just it's one of those things i was telling christina about real quick and then i'll get it over to to to you guys you know that thing uh we talked about this on director watch a couple you know during the tony scott series about will smith and that you have these at and hear me out just hang on it's that you have these great movie stars in their presence and when they decide to want to you know do a project like maria or even like king richard um those projects get elevated because they have a fucking movie star attached to it that just understands how to grab the audience and bring them in that gravitational pull and she has that not only in the film but in the q and a that we listen to afterwards she is just she just has that and then i hope that she's around all sees among this is a performance of of her career and um it's so glad to have her back um so fia for yourself um your thoughts on maria yeah i really really liked maria i was very emotional by the end of it and i think a lot of that has to do with july's performance i was talking to our dear friend and best actress connoisseur kevin jacobson after i saw this movie because i told him that it reminded me this performance reminded me of that very specific lost old hollywood melodramatic diva performance that we don't get anymore you know it reminded me of something glorious once and would have done a lot yeah it's and that i am just always so in the back for it and there's just something about her i think it's just such a deep emotional it's a deeply emotional and vulnerable performance from july i think also considering her personal life and her journey as an actress and what she could bring into it i i just was very very moved by her the whole entire time she's very funny in the movie too her line deliveries are great you know steven night i have some issues with his scripts always but here i think july she really elevated the material in a great way i think she really understood it and i mean the costumes it's um massimo cantini perini who did the costumes a long time favorite of the academy and just seeing her walk the streets of paris in those first and the boots i just thought like this isn't all-time character and performance for me like one that i will come back to and really think about all season but even longer than that and ed lachman's work reminded me a lot of victorio storaro's work one of my all-time favorite cinematographers i thought quite often about the conformist which was also mentioned at the q&a today so yeah all around i really like this and i think i was a bit surprised based on those venice reactions yeah and also your relationship to laryna's yes because i like jackie and spencer it was lower on than others but and i'm a khande and i'll khande yes we're gonna okay clearly i forgot about it so yeah and christina i know you love it um i loved it i really did i i was also thinking of the sunset boulevard element of it not not just only the gorya swamps and esque performance but also with the butlers and and the whole hidden away in her in her house and and how she meets reality so to speak this is also a film i mean angele julie just i echo everything she's mesmerizing really does a great vulnerable job as as maria calas but this is also a movie of choices for me how he chose to go back in her life and and in ways that you can really when making a biopic if you want to call this a biopic you can really misfire doing that and i think he made particularly interesting choices giving her both diva qualities giving her a lot of vulnerable memories but just enough of those memories for us to realize what was actually going on without going way too far into that and i just think i don't like spencer it's not my movie but it's this trilogy is so interesting and i think that we're going to be seeing you know film research projects not only of the three women that he's depicted but also of the women who have done them Natalie Portman christmas steward Angelina julie and we're going to just be talking about these films for a long time i think this really ended the trilogy in a magnificent way i don't know what they're thinking all the reviewers over in Venice because i was blown away right well we can move on we don't need to talk about this we don't need to hear eric's opinion i think it's safe to say we're running long oh i'm sorry eric but let's let's get it out what did you think about this movie so and also how it relates to the trilogy because i know you've been a big fan of i know you're a big pabola rain fan and i know that you yes first two entries into this um into this yeah you know trilogy that he has here so every year we kind of stray further and further away from the concept of a movie star we're not certainly making movie stars anymore ironically enough as this is a Netflix film streaming has kind of killed the movie star this is a movie star performance just one of those it could only be her and only be now and i love that the convergence of of the right movie star and right role at the right point in their professional and personal life is my sweet spot every single time and and that's what this is for for jolly um it's it's a it's a born-to-play role she is extraordinary and so vulnerable the opening shot is her face up close and an all-time great face singing and what a face uh yes i am a huge fan of of Jackie and Spencer and especially Spencer i was over the moon for it i love that this that Maria weaves in Jackie Kennedy into this story it weaves in the anbalin part of Spencer into this story and does so naturally although i will say the Kennedy stuff at first i was really nervous about and that's mostly because of night's screenplay and his writing ability can be a loop that's where it's iffy uh because they also have Marilyn Monroe's happy birthday is recreated that that sequence is was right on the edge for me uh but i was really surprised at how well uh it was it was done and the conversation between callous and janeve Kennedy about who they are as people beautiful absolutely wonderful um i just love that little Marilyn Monroe sequence because another one of these women that we would have much prefer to see Pablo Lorraine de Blonde maybe and uh so i thought that was a little area yeah i i think that i think i would have been pretty pretty amazing and it was it was really fun because i think i got halfway through this and i thought wouldn't it have been like really cool if Lorraine had been able to do a vida and do the ava perone story because absolutely would have been a natural person for him to explore but you know obviously i love the Madonna version it's great and that was 96 and he wouldn't have been able to do that but then we get a balcony moment that's sort of satisfied that and that's where i just was like oh that got me that that moment that that got me and i was yeah i was in i was in it i was just thinking about you know you said that it and we both said that it tied to jaggy i was just thinking about the moments when they do refer to jaggy that Natalie Portman was just on set but they didn't use her and she's just sitting over there we're like we'll get you we'll get you in here like it felt like but it just felt like that's like again like that's i think the cool things about like you're saying there Eric the connective tissue to those other films but it doesn't take away from talking and looking into callous and it doesn't take away from this movie and from jolly who is in every scene every moment all encompassing doing singing being vulnerable but again just commanding the screen a lesser director would have actually had portman in a cameo yeah there would have been in this in credit sequence maybe that was and and to and to to hold that for somebody who enjoys uh uh you know a little bit of hyperbole and and and fun this is also really the most reserved this is coming coming after Spencer's uh moments of very heightened there's no pearls ghost story and the pearls there's ghostly elements in this but it's handled very differently and she's just a very different woman yeah then then either of them it's she's not going to kfc do you hear me don't dog that scene because it's my favorite scene in that movie i know it is but it's it's not good um okay we love this movie um we'll be talking about it throughout the whole year because she's a bonafide i mean best actress nominee easily okay four movies we're gonna each do one of them um because we all individually solve them so i'm going to kick it over to eric to talk about a movie that played in venice uh september five fifth how are we going with it however however you want to you want to refer to it you want to talk about this movie because i it it a lot of positive reactions for i know you and sophia solve but um i think talking about you you kind of on the same page that is is a pretty good effective film right take it away eric yeah and and we didn't really mention too much that that maria was really the only major venice title to make it over to tell you right normally there is a lot of crossover yeah and there just was not this year which i think goes back to what we were kind of talking about earlier that that there was clearly some some things missing uh it was clearly a a negotiation in this yeah but the titles later in the best but yeah september five was one of them it is a dramatic telling of the news side element of the 1972 munich olympics uh with the hostage situation it it's a really tense uh film and it it does kind of everything that for me saturday night didn't do obviously different tones it's not a comedy uh but it's it is also trying to it is doing the same thing it is it is a behind the scenes uh look at what the pre-digital age was for telling news stories how split second live news uh drama is and it wasn't really news it was the sport side of abc that was telling this story and just going through the the political fights within between networks so that abc could get the satellite from cbs uh and whether they can show somebody being killed on tv because they were in a brand new era this was the first olympics that had ever had a live broadcast across the world uh which obviously made it the target that it was uh we've seen film versions of the other side of this with steven spielberg's munich one of the best movies of 2005 there is the oscar winning documentary one day in september from 1999 also really brilliant being able to see different versions of pieces of history that either we think that we know or or even if we don't because i was really getting a vibe in the audience that they were not very familiar with this and i get it 1972 was 50 years ago but it was one of the most defining moments of the decade and certainly for media uh and i think the cast john macaro um peter sars guard ben chaplain really really good another weaving of archival footage with uh with not absolutely seamless it's it's a remarkable film yeah i heard a lot of great things i know so few you really like you really you liked it i did i really liked it i mean 1972 that is my time period so i was very happy to be in the 70s be home taught yeah be home for a taught political thriller i feel like it was a really good final film of the festival yeah um should be playing at other regional festival throughout the rest of the year um so fia do you want to talk a little bit about our medallion winners film search ronin the outrun which played at the sundance film festival garners a lot of attention for ronin and it's going to be her push i think for a lot of people think for a best actress uh run this season uh your thoughts on the film yeah i mean we have so many as we've talked about incredible lead actress performances at this festival it's wild it's wild move over ben it's yeah it's it's very dominant and serger ronin definitely deserves a place in that conversation i think that you know for we were a little bit surprised that she was one of our medallion winners just given she's so young and we have you know Angelina Jolie with the film sam jackson like we talked about so even refines so there were a lot of options but i think one everyone if you haven't read it look up cersha's tribute written by Greta Gerwig it is so beautiful an incredible piece of writing and in this film cersha is channeling a jenna rollens type of performance it is very ron vulnerable it's very real and lived in she's playing a woman who's 29 years old who is an alcoholic and the film itself isn't as successful as her performance i think that the way that the narrative is structured is a bit tricky and because it jumps around so frequently sometimes it just it feels more like a shell of a film than an actual fully you know envisioned narrative and i think if it would have been that cersha's performance would have been even would have felt even stronger but what she does in this movie i think is pretty breathtaking she is an incredible drunk actor fans of lady bird will know this from her hospital scene there's actually a shot in this where she has a little bit of mascara under her eyes when she's laying in bed and it reminded me of that great scene when she's gone to college and she wakes up in the hospital after a bender but yeah she i think she's really great in those those drunken moments and they feel very real and not a lot of actors can actually do that very well but she's even better in the really vulnerable moments there's a scene when she's you know she's sober and she's at a grocery store and the wine is behind the cash register it's behind the counter and you can just tell that she needs it she just wants that so desperately and she doesn't she doesn't get it because she's in recovery at that moment but you can just in those moments where she has anxiety after a bad night or she's you know really itching to just smell a glass of wine it's i mean it's pretty profound stuff so i was really really impressed by her performance the movie less so but i think it's worth seeing just for her alone all right so many pictures classic stuff i'm not mistaken yes on that one they don't have to run great campaigns over there they have a couple films though this year though that they have to run uh as well Christina last film of the fest that we saw was a film also at at Sundance it was Jesse Eisenberg's a real pain um featuring iserberg and also uh Kieran Colkin of succession a lot of buzz uh it was one of the surprise films that showed up along with uh the apprentice the Donald Trump film um with Sebastian Stan those were the surprise films the TVA films that came uh and they played uh i don't know about the apprentice but a real pain played really well in the two screens that it was at and um and for yourself how was it oh it's a real gem i loved it um i wasn't a big fan of Jesse Eisenberg's first dark or his directorial debut and it seemed like everything came together for this one um so it's about two cousins who travel to Poland for a tour um where their grandmother they want to see their grandmother's house where they live they tour um concentration camp it's in the same way sort of that anora uses humor and very difficult topics i think it's so successful and it is a beautiful little ensemble i didn't know that Will Sharp from White Lotus was in it he's amazing Jennifer Gray is in it but i have to talk about the two leads in particularly Kieran Colkin who is doing a sort of version of Roman um Roy in a way but with much more he has the humor he has the um he's very much in a bad place but if he has much more emotional depth than Roman is doing a really great performance and i think that this could be Oscar talk for him at least nomination Jesse Eisenberg was playing the opposite type of character from his cousin and also real doing an amazing job and in a way i think an even more difficult role because he's just sort of reacting to his cousins doing all the time and it really bounced um the bigger picture of what they were visiting and the horrors of what um leg family legacy and what your forefathers have been through with a very small um movie about emotions between these two cousins and what's happening right now at the moment and i thought it was it was really really lovely i think i understand that this is gonna play really well yeah i think it's gonna play really well erica no you give it a glowing review out of when you i loved it it's incredible um i i mean it's a mandatory rule that the last film of of the telly right film festival makes rama quaid a blubbering mess um and it happened last two times i was here and it made and it did it again this year i think it's a really special film it's it's i cannot under uh undersell what christina set there it is a massive improvement as a writer and director for Jesse Eisenberg that other film is a bad movie um and um and i i just think that also too with him in it it feels very personal centering around kolken who gives a magnificent performance uh a magnificent lead performance um and uh and i will not budge on that all season folks um but i i think it's great writing and it's very and it's it's it's 90 minutes but it is but it's extremely effective uh last one moment i was the first one i saw um it was actually kind of like on a chance and on a whim christina saw this in the schedule and we went to it and this is uh it's a movie called casa bonita miamore and you would think oh like what you know what kind of documentaries that about well it's about uh trade parker and matt stone the creators of south park saving essentially what is just what is casa bonita which is this disney land of mexican restaurants that's in the middle of colorado um they they decided to go ahead and buy it out of bankruptcy it's like a childhood place that they've gone to for so many years and a colorado institution and they ended up putting millions and millions and millions of dollars into this renovation and it's a it's a fairly simple documentary but one it shows their passion and creative process um better than i think a lot of their other documentaries have about those two guys but then also um you know this was a real story and they really tried to go ahead and restore something that's very positive and by the way in the community reminded me a lot of like places that i went to as when i was a kid and no longer exist but were so unique like arcades and uh these places should you go for your birthday or you know you know celebrations for team you know you your soccer team or whatever they don't no longer exist and it's about saving that for the next generation but then there's a sadness to it as well as that when you do save that then you can become a distraction as a celebrity inside of it um and it was funny and um and quite moving at the same time for those guys um and uh you know i highly recommend it i know that it's going to be out and streaming here very very soon um and so yeah it's just a quick simple easy 90-minute doc um about the and it felt very actually the right thing to watch to start off the fest because it felt very Colorado it felt so much love about the state and um you know in the people here which are always grateful gracious us uh to us uh during this tell you right film festival uh Christina can you tell everybody where they can find you and all your work and Christina I'm going to throw in a bonus for everyone here um we've just saw a bunch of films but we still have a lot of films that we're anticipating for the rest of the year so i'd like you to give us your now new most anticipated film left to see this year the brutalist my number one that i really want to see right awesome and where can we find all your work Christina yes you can find and my show is called pop culture confidential it's an audio podcast you'll find um so listen to that you'll get interviews it's tarlax with yaga scone for example we just talked about here and um and you can find me on twitter and or x sorry and instagram @Christinabiro and i just want to say a quick thing here um i also saw the Martha Stewart documentary which i reckon i recommend and i just want to say do a double feature with maria for ultimate diva evening yeah i mean most anticipated for the rest of the year i would definitely say the brutalist if you compare movies there will be blood and tar i am in automatically and the godfather my god father oh my god i also love architecture and architectural history oddly so very excited about that little nerdy detail and of course the room next door because tilda swin and julian more i love them both so much to my favorite actresses and i love petromodova i also just thank you guys for another fantastic telly ride i know we were a little ho-hum potential lineup at first but it was so much fun and i really enjoyed spending the time with you and watching all these movies um you can find me on twitter at sofia_sim letterboxed @faedunaway you can find my podcast oscar wild wherever you listen to podcasts and reviews interviews and future award season coverage at awards watch ericanderson mr. one of those crotch himself yes oh my god uh i think my sloppy answer would be gladiator two but uh but i i'm realistically um queer is the thing that i am looking forward to most it's uh the history of that novel is fascinating it's a very small novel uh so it's clearly been expanded upon quite a bit and i i just want that two lukas in one year please give me it uh yep you can find me at awardswatch.com obviously hopefully if you're here and awards underscore watch on twitter and awards watch everywhere else uh venice film festival is still ongoing on uh we have reviews of that coming in every day uh telly ride reviews still coming in and that's gonna just budis right into taranto because we are knee deep in the passenger seat of festival season right now i'm not going to finish any of that thank you very much eric um mr. crotch anyway uh you can find me on twitter instagram letter box at ryamikwait 77 you can find out my work at awardswatch.com if you like podcasts uh there's this little thing called director watch we do it every thursday we're in the middle of a taranto malik series the new world is the episode that we'll be releasing this week um five stars on iTunes and spotify wire over on the website sign up for the newsletter um it is the best way to get all the work that's being put on the on the website and this is the time to get the newsletter because this will be a best chance for you to get all the stuff all in one place sent to you twice a week uh for news reviews interviews and well maybe twice a week if you're except to it and um and podcast all in one place most anticipated film of the year uh here oh my god no i'm just kidding um it's a complete post down in the corner yeah i'm sorry um it tough i mean probably the brutalist after the responses but queer is also right up there there's like it's like the it's like the three films we mentioned those are the three right um baking those are the big three i'd still really it was the film that i did not get to see here and i really want to see and i'll give a different answer then out of those three it was the movie i didn't get to catch here and i'm really after reading the logline i really want to see it's the seed of a sacred fig i really want to catch that i thought you were gonna say better man oh well you know no um so um yeah that's another neon title i know that uh you know it'll be playing a bunch of festivals as well but uh i do want to catch that one sooner rather than later um thank you all so much for listening we will be back next week and um till then so you all next time [Music] I am Anne-Marie Kelly. Wild Precious Life is a podcast about dreaming big digging in and connecting across distance division and loss. In each episode i talk with prize-winning writers musicians and wanderers who remind all of us how we can make the most of the time we have so meet me here let's walk and talk and dream and discover what it means to be wild precious and [MUSIC PLAYING] [BLANK_AUDIO]
