This week the lads discuss the new exotic mission, Encore, and break down all of the season Dawn reprised weapons!
Intro / Encore Discussion: 0:00
Weapon Breakdowns: 34:30
Chronophage 37:15
Speleologist: 50:45
Breachlight 1:05:58
Patron of Lost Causes: 1:17:57
Perfect Paradox: 1:27:48
Martyr's Retribution: 1:35:30
Line In The Sand: 1:47:30
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DESTINY SCIENCE: https://linktr.ee/destinyspreadsheets
AUDIO PRODUCTION: https://twitter.com/CameronChollar
INTRO MUSIC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POdqgitXq64
[MUSIC] [MUSIC] Hello guardians and welcome to episode 115 of podcast versus enemies, a destiny podcast dedicated to the PBE sandbox. My name is impetus and as always I'm joined by my co-hosts court in st. Kabir. Lads this week we started at three of episode echoes and we've got a new exotic mission that we played this last week. I'll pass you off to court first. What are your thoughts on our new mission? It's very fun. I know Bungie said that this is one of their largest in terms of scope and we haven't played the next two weeks I guess so no clue if this will expand or if it will kind of get some other crazy stuff added to it but they definitely lived up to the scale of said exotic mission. It's a very fun one. We just came off doing a legend or master version just before we recorded this podcast so that was a lot more difficult to say compared to the normal one which is what I much prefer compared to just doing an exotic mission and it's you're just sort of gliding through it but yeah pretty fun. What's your thoughts? Yeah I don't know if you're just like trying to be nice there or what but yeah I got waxed a couple of times going through the legend version. It was for both of us because we were both kind of struggling. Yeah you come around the corner there's a cyclops there and you got about 0.6 seconds until you're out of there but yeah it was good. I'm thinking about so you know we're week one of three and I think that this is going to be kind of like a outbreak perfected kind of a thing right a lot of these exotic missions they have this iteration. Outbreak has the different like floor puzzles and puzzle sequences you know for the for the secret stuff there and I'm trying to think out of you know about the room that the puzzle sections kind of branch out of the the hub if you could call it that it's like it may be a one quarter one third away into the mission. I'm thinking that that is where some of our variation is going to start coming in right so our new puzzles maybe next week we're going to have some some new pattern thing to unlock or figure out and maybe that's going to be part of that main hub room and yeah in that case I would say that's pretty you know pretty significant if if as far as like the scope of the mission goes now it's like well not only do you have iterations of the puzzle but they're like in entirely other like physical branches of the mission it's pretty big you know and we had some other really like really cool really big set piece missions before I think everybody has their favorite but for me it's it's probably revision zero I would say was like a really big mission and that comparison also comes out from the little things but overall yeah it's very cool the lore too very cool and just how you feeling yeah I'm trying to think mechanically wise it definitely feels like it could be as complicated as serf shield um serf shield of course those mechanics were not new right those are the dsc mechanics basically reused whereas on core this mission we've got a new set of buffs where we're we're activating portals and spaces or platforms I guess would be the better term and I like that I also like that there's a lot of new spaces large new spaces for the on core mission so yeah it's very fun boss fight was was a fun one as well nice nice throwback to a certain raid boss that we don't have anymore um yeah those the cyclopses and wyverns do do hit hard on the expert difficulty there of on core but still a fun fun mission especially when you're playing with folks that are also using the choir of one weapon and you think that you're surrounded by wyverns but some of those void blasts are good void blasts and don't hurt you so that is uh our weapon that is dropping from the exotic mission it's a void special ammo auto rifle and when you hipfire you do get to roleplay as a wyvern how are we how are we feeling so far about the version of choir of one that we have right now it's again we just got the frame the first frame upgrades so that's just a nice stat bump to our core stats and then we unlocked the subsistence catalysts there are two others that are coming in the two coming weeks uh which are destabilizing rounds and onslaught will obviously need to circle back around in a few weeks to talk about all of them but how are we feeling about the catalysts for choir of one well I know a certain titan on this uh on this very podcast is excited for presumably next week uh catalyst destabilizing um I I'm just kind of a bit bamboozled that onslaught appears on this considering how fast it already fires in both uh ADS and hipfire modes like it's you're going to be chewing through that ammo once you get onslaught fitted into this so um the the gun itself a lot of folks already know it's it's pretty potent uh it's so powerful that bungee have came out and said it's currently bugged um in in a good way and in in the sense that we're getting a lot of damage out of it so they will be tweaking with the um reserves uh later in uh episode two they said yeah so very fun weapon I do love the concept of turning like a traditionally primary weapon into a special and this is another um version of say Ariana's vow we've got that many many men's ago with uh her first special hand cannon this is her first all rifle and uh yeah I do really enjoy it I'm not actually used it with your falcons yet but I do want to play around with it um saying what uh these stabilizing rounds oh yeah what's what's the vibe oh yeah it's already um if you guys saw the build that I was running we did a mission earlier but that was the that I'm kind of just getting myself ready for Tuesday I'm using a bullet type build control demo and it's already good it's good right now with Actium War Rig now Actium War Rig is not going to be great within just trying to spam the hipfire attack I I don't think it will frock because it's so quick maybe it'll frock once but that's not really the reason I'm using it the nice part is though that you can go from ADS to hipfire like two or three bursts and then go back to ADS and just keep shooting and that feels pretty good so even if it's not great for within just straight hipfire burst just using it as like a primary weapon which yeah you know they'll they'll be nerfing that down a little bit but if you run um I mean you know maybe going forward you'll need to run like avoid scav and maybe one reserve mod or something like that maybe you could stack that up with the the heavy that you happen to be using I think that will be totally will be worth it and it is already ridiculously strong I'm I mean yeah okay so Titan I'm definitely you know catering towards um control demo and the just massive amount of utility that provides but I also think onslaught if depending on how low the the reserves go could be tough to use because you're going to burn through that ammo potentially so quick but you also end up with this situation where you could get a few kills and then turn on a champion or something like that with you know a war rig like I'm talking about so you can get enough kills to where you'd still be able to get off a full amount of bursts of of of ammo and just like absolutely annihilate something and that could be pretty fun but I think there'll be more niche overall yeah destabilizing rounds and uh it's uh yeah I don't know it's incredibly good it's got me to put off my rocket sidearm which is saying a lot okay yeah see that's where I was going I wanted to know how we're feeling uh quiet one may stack up with a like if we pretend we've got our destabilizing an onslaught catalyst unlocked how we film this stacks up against Barry bloodline oh well for me I'm like I'm still generating health like we were just talking about now that's kind of a niche thing that's only going to apply to you know your titans out there but right uh man that I feel like people will still use buried bloodline to get devour on their non warlock or non void classes right that's still going to have a play there but man does this thing hit so hard it's crazy I think for hunters at or at least I'm speaking for myself I'm probably still going to use buried bloodline board and choir one I'm not certainly not saying choir one is isn't good because it varies right now and it will be once they tweak with it but you know warlocks already have quite easy access to devour if you're just doing monovoid builds and then as you've mentioned they're saying with like um uh destabilizing round rounds or any sort of volatility for a controlled demo you all have quite easy access to healing so buried bloodline might not be the play unless it is a different subclass or prismatic but yeah at least for me perhaps my fellow hunters I think a buried bloodline will still be the king of uh of uh getting that devour pretty easy I ask it's obviously there um void primary weapons that have been turned into specials but the thing for me that I like a lot about buried bloodline is that reserves and so I'm wondering what the nerf come in a choir of one like what what nerf what amount would it take to like maybe push it below buried bloodlines reserves and ammo count because it's got an obscene amount of reserves right now and we we were not given an idea of how much it will be nerfed but you know it like if we start with an extreme if it's cut in half of 50 percent nerf to reserves do you still think say that you're gonna rock that on void titan over buried bloodline uh you know it's hard to say and there's some situations in which it would benefit me more to be running buried bloodline like running buried bloodline on a art class with pulse grenades um can be super strong and this this cannot take away from that this I think is like yeah you gotta kind of double down on the specifically the void class for to to really benefit and I don't know we'll see I'm hoping it's like uh I don't know 30 percent or 25 percent on the reserves decrease and not like 50 but I mean it's it's definitely possible that they that they seriously got it so I you know I don't want to get too ahead of myself here but it's you know it's also gonna just be another situation where the other weapons that you're running are going to be really important so you can make sure you can keep a good rotation going like using something like a certain void machine gun in your heavy slot maybe able to uh help with that a little bit if you're you're in like a gm scenario where boss dps is not really a concern right you just need to be putting out steady pretty high damage the entire time that that would be probably still gonna be an incredibly strong build anytime you have a void related to anything um and the great part about that is you're you know and the build that I was talking about you're doubling down on the war rig so it makes it even easier to keep killing tally or any other perk going on a machine gun like that so that's like yeah again kind of niche but uh yeah period above mine uh it's definitely still has its place and you know nothing I was gonna say is I definitely didn't see this coming I was not expecting a brand new archetype weird I don't know if this is I think this is off air we were just chatting this past week but we have just been getting so many new weapon like sub archetypes and archetypes this past years or so far this year that's been awesome yeah this is a command frame auto rifle again not clear command frames are intrinsically special ammo versions of auto rifles and we can expect more special ammo auto rifles than they'll be command frames or if this is just made special ammo because it's an exotic and we might see legendary primary command frame auto rifles but yes that is the try to remember what is the entrance secure fires extended extended range heavy caliber projectiles a reduced rate of fire deals increased precision damage when aiming down sights that's what they say for command frame on choir of one good looking gun got a sick looking ornament yeah man I'm now I'm thinking I wasn't even immediately were my mind good you know what if they were vision zero this thing kind of to go to go back to the mission that we were talking about and all of a sudden in episode three there is a you know it's a solar version a kinetic version of this thing or something like that right I be down I'm here for oh yeah I'm gonna play with more frames you know that's uh it's the spice of spice of destiny for me is getting to try out new stuff it could be another like buried bloodline situation although we did get the um in date kindness with that dungeon but originally we weren't uh that was pulled forward for warlords rune oh yeah specifically um but I'm assuming buried bloodline was always going to be the the exotic for um warlords so that it could be another situation where we'll get um like a legendary version of this sometime in the future and yeah I'm all for that as well I was just looking at the reserves here I know we don't want to get too much into the the weeds of this one exotic but um it currently has a space total of 250 um ammo uh sorry in the reserves um so if they are the two things that they're they're going to tweak uh is the weapons holding far more ammo and reserves than was originally intended and the second thing here is hit fire projectiles are dealing more damage than intended when buffed by divinity which yeah I didn't know about but those are the two things that they're they're planning to to hit and then they said sometime in September they're going to go into a little bit more detail but in terms of damage just looking at what the destiny two team said on twitter um they're just reading between the lines they seem to be quite okay with the damage it's just the reserves which makes sense it does make sense it has quite a lot of reserves yeah you could double special listen probably never even need the second special weapon unless you have like a specific enemy yeah like the call in the champions and that's the middle oh he's in a machine gun that um the new grenade launcher like the name escapes me in the moment um that would be a lost signal yeah that would be a great thing to pair with this because you're you know if you are on prismatic this is something I think we talked about uh this past week or episode but yeah you get that darkness energy charge up really quick it's good passive damage it's just solid combo there we've got a ton of all rifle artifact perks as well so very very fun and easy and this is the all rifle act of this particular episode so yeah bungee did say that go nuts have fun with it until they they do tweak with it yeah one of the thing I would recommend real quick is I find it easier to when you're dealing with overload and you're trying to use overload from the artifact to aim down sights and hit the enemy and then as soon as they get stunned on ads and hit them with the hipfire blast I feel like works good I mean I could be off on that maybe I was just missing my shots because uh you know magic is bad here but I felt like it was stunning easier with the with the ads version especially if they're moving around a lot and then going to hipfire just trying to dump some damage on them good call good call we did a few other things that we did in Destiny 2 last week court you have anything special to report uh just be doing some black ops 6 multiplayer beta this weekend more GTA online and a little bit of frostpunk on the side I've mentioned previously I'm getting ready for my vacation starting a week after this episode and also just a quick shout out to the d2 reddit discord in particular mystic aridio and spaghetti I gave them some visual design feedback on one of their spreadsheets and they gave myself and podcasts versus enemies a big special thanks section on that sheet so thank you very much for that thank you yeah um yeah pretty quiet period for me as I kind of wind down and uh take a little break uh saint what have you been up to read a few gms which there's like this bug with a node right now and it's kind of annoying but whatever it well I'm sure they'll they'll patch that it's just a little annoying to have to hit up your friends and figure out who's even got the node but we did the gms not too bad it's kind of like I don't know the disgrace is down to like 10 minutes flat these days which is ridiculous but I'm really here for it and yeah then then it was just one of the exotic mission a few times I also have been busy just started class again this past week so you know summer's over I'm back to some uh some ux ui and some programming stuff right now this semester um I'm taking part of uh like grad program here and it's a lot of time um to be going from like you know work into school so luckily we're in a bit of a lull here with destiny so it's pretty good timing but that's gonna be going um you know for a while totally into a semester for sure um amtis how about you man yeah I'm just working on catalysts getting through red death performed in tessellation on the pail heart while I farm for class items and uh ergo zoom rolls so slowly but surely making my way through those and uh yeah I think we're we're all thumbs up here on choir one obviously we don't have the fully completed version we've got to get more upgrades to the frame and then get the last two catalysts so we'll circle back around and a few weeks time once we have the fully complete version but uh gun is fun I think is the simplest way we can say it I'll pass you back to saint for some folks that we get to thank this week yeah start off give a shout out to new patron wolf for 12 thank you for your support of pve for joining the ranks of the patrons much appreciated also as always want to give a shout out to our grand masters pve patreon asking monk dirt wizard 85 deacon i'm k rose jelly puppy the shazzle the puxter the mirror and this moment we really really appreciate the support you guys you can set us all kinds of feedback to our socials over on twitter the the dps you know pve discord server and at pod versus enemies on twitter or uh patreon there's also ways to get in touch with us there you can find links in the show notes positive critical and constructive feedback about the show is always helpful for how we present and break down all the different kinds of pve builds and much more we also want to thank and give some appreciation to everybody that supports pve listening downloading every week and turn it in to discuss the show uh and to write in and ask his questions um supporting us via patreon speaking of which if you would like to support the show you can click on the link to patreon found in the show notes of this episode you'll get access to some members only channels in the discord behind the seats content uh text write-ups breakdowns and weapons input on the future of the show and more court what are we talking about this episode yeah so we are going to talk about the act three weapons and the dawn weapon the reprised dawn weapon and we're going to be breaking down all of those uh we do have some housekeeping so as i've already mentioned i'll be on for the next few weeks but saint and impetus will be here to cover any news and upcoming content as usual i know we're expecting the usual kind of end of the season here's what's coming in the next well end of the episode here's what's coming in the next episode i know we've got some armor breakdowns exotic armor so that may drop sometime in september so if that does i'm sure these guys will be back on to give their thoughts while i'm sat in a hot tub um we did get uh a little patreon question from just k12 and this is i suppose specifically for saint but we can all chip in uh he says i'm genuinely curious if you can think of any scenario that makes hollow fire heart worth it or makes it work it's an exotic that in isolation has a pretty decent effect i think and it has a good looking ornament but it just seems so overshadowed also i can't think of any way to make the new sunspot functionality of it work without running soul invictives and if i have soul invictives equipped then i don't feel like i need the hollow fire heart sunspot functionality because it's already super easy to make them um saint what's your thoughts yeah i feel like i feel like you really nailed it on the back half of the statement there on the kind of the end of the question if i have to run soul invictives then kind of what's the point or why would i use this and real quick to recap the functionality of this exotic titan exotic chest piece killing enemies with solar weapons while in a sunspot creates a sunspot while your solar super is charged you gain 350% melee and grenade region that does work with prismatic if you are using error soul and yeah i feel like the real issue here is that it's you know the new effect that they added is good but you still have to run soul invictives and i can get that effect running my incandescent weapon of choice and we have no shortage of really strong weapons with incandescent in our sandbox right now you get them scorching burning out you got your sunspots and you know the the the probably kicker there for me is also that the ability region is just not quite enough and yeah i would say i think for me to to put this chest piece on it's gonna have to essentially give me soul invictus getting solar weapon kills while i have a solar weapon buff maybe generates a sunspot or something like that is what's going to take to give me to use it invictus court i need you guys uh thoughts here i uh maybe need to go look up a few titanic sonics here in dim to reorient myself because i before before we were doing the recording i asked what exactly how the fire heart did and totally totally misread that i think i was yeah i i thought phoenix cradle's effect was what hallow fire heart provided phoenix cradle was the one where soul invictus last twice as long in the allies who passed through your sunspot or granted soul invictus and solar restoration turns out that's not what hallow fire heart does who knew no that's actually yeah i get support exotic is the difference there give you too much credit hallow fire heart come on you have a nice ornament what's going on here i don't know what they could do other than give sunspots some unique mechanic when you're wearing hallow fire heart because it seems like they're very committed to the sunspot part of it right but you've also got phoenix cradle that's also pretty well i don't know like i'm at the sweet point where what matters more to the designers of these exotics is it the fact that you can give soul invictus and solar restoration to your allies is that the more important part of phoenix cradle or is it that it has to come through your sunspot from phoenix cradle because i feel like if we're gonna really make hallow fire heart have a good identity make that the sunspot exotic and then phoenix cradle can just be the one where it's like oh you do some other action as your solar titan and you grant allies your soul invictus and a little bit of restoration right that's how i would fix it but again i'm not a designer and i don't know i don't know what what's the core identity part uh for the armor team for each of these exotics but yeah right now if they're not willing to change phoenix cradle i don't oh i forgot it provides 20 AE gosh that is yeah i'm sure that is a huge huge benefit to the nine titans out there meaning hallow fire heart i'm stopped i i again i think like just my gut instinct says sunspots have to have some new mechanic when you're wearing hell of fire heart or phoenix cradle needs to get some new ability to pass soul invictus on to your allies and let hell of fire heart be the sunspot exotic piece but again ultimately i don't think that's going to change whether or not i would play with either one of those weapons i just i don't know like it's it feels like they really overlap but they overlap in a way that isn't ultimately super important because as saint has said you can just run a solar weapon with incandescent to really get the the soul invictus sunspot generation stuff up and running and of course incandescent has a ton of tie-ins it can also work with certain abilities so i i'm truly stumped here i'm i was trying to think of something good i've got nothing court do you have any ideas or suggestions according i got one more but you go ahead first court so i we were kind of casually talking about this before we started recording and i did say why don't they just open it up so any solar kill will just spawn a sunspot doesn't matter what subclass you're on it's just as long as you kill with a solar weapon because way back when solar 3.0 was about to come out and we're all speculating that what's the verbs and i think many of us including myself thought sunspot would be a keyword or a verb or whatever that's something that you'd spawn but eventually that sort of turned into fire sprites which is very different to what we're talking about here but i just think opening up because i feel like sunspots used to be quite a more like visible more you'd see it more often before solar 3.0 and now it's very rare to see sunspots at all even like for those that are running Sol Invictus it just i don't see it a lot and they did nerf it as well i know that was quite a controversial thing they made they made sunspots pretty weak in a lot of the the sandbox including pve so that would be my number one suggestion is just opening up so you know if you wear howlfire heart you can just spawn sunspots if you kill with a solar weapon and that's it that's all you need to do you don't need to have Sol Invictus on you it's essentially like what they did with destiny one where an exotic would just give you one of those nodes and i know bungee did talk about this many years ago that they're not fond in doing that anymore they don't really tend to like put that on exotics it's not inspiring but i mean the exotic right now is not exactly inspired so yeah i that would be my number one the other the other kind of thing i am a big fan of like truncating exotics into each other and i would say this plus phoenix cradle i think we'd have quite a solid uh Sol Invictus or or at least as standard uh solar um sunspot build just with those two there's also Lorelai splendor i totally forgot about Lorelai splendor yeah there's three exotics that tie in the sunspots oh my goodness Sol Invictus originally was just the you know 350 or 3.5 ex ability region while you're super was charged was this original function right okay now if you want to stick with that part of the original function i and this is a this game to me while you're talking about this Sol Invictus right now is a hundred percent ability base region uh rate well change sol Invictus to like 2.5 while i'm wearing this howlifier while i'm in a sunspot and then giving 3.5 of my super is charged passive because it's kind of like doubling down in this idea of howlifier heart gives you your other solar solar abilities more so it's allowing you to create sunspots that's great now allow the Sol Invictus and i'm getting from that sunspot to give me even more ability you know uh return because it still keeps it a little bit separate from Phoenix Cradle because Phoenix Cradle is the the support one at that point this is would be like the ability spam focused one i mean i know it's not super different but it's something it's a more of a passive effect than just what it has now which is getting Sol Invictus um for free but it's actually still not free and you have to use the exotic so that's a wash i'm with court i think court's got the right approach here especially in light of prismatic like the idea of giving an aspect to an exotic armor piece not only opens up prismatic more but also lets you actually get a taste of prismatic kind of on just a regular other element right like i could run stasis and then get a sunspot if i'm wearing uh we'll say howlifier heart if that's how it got changed and i like that approach i feel like maybe kind of opening up the themes of prismatic but not requiring you to be on prismatic could be quite fun and some very interesting build crafting situations but if it's just to be on prismatic and also give you access to a new aspect i'd be fine with that too i mean i know that they say they are looking at prismatic i'm sure we'll probably get more aspects and fragments down the road but i think for some really versatile ones like sunspots or solen victus rather that could totally be an exotic armor and i would rocket on my non-solar titan i'm you know i would i would play with that that is a good it's a good function it's a fun function it's a useful function but yeah there's just so much overlap with sunspots right now my goodness i wasn't fully aware of it oh i just i feel like the the way the sandbox the specifically the elemental sandbox is the trajectory of that where we've got prismatic and it feels like okay bungee's really pivoting into the you you can use any element all you want so this is where my thinking of like howl heart howlifier heart will just you know you can just intrinsically spawn us on spot doesn't matter what what subclass you're on if you are on prismatic maybe they'll start adding the other aspects on to prismatic um i'm not too keen on that idea to be honest but if they just gave howlfire heart the solen victus aspect itself then that would be pretty wild of seeing like oh saints on his void titan but he's got solen victus intrinsically through howlfire heart um to be able to spawn sunspots as well as control demo um volatility so it's that sort of stuff that i feel like that they'll probably pivot into um but you know it's quite a low key exotic i know we've got other specifically for titans but no hunters and warlocks have quite a few exotic armor pier pieces that are and even some love at least this has some sort of synergy it's not the best synergy but uh compared to see uh you know uh the uh mask go on shoot him again yeah there we go um he said it but uh yeah i i just feel like they could really play into the the whole like just use any element and we can stop with these ridiculous restrictions where you have to use xyz for this exotic to work i mean we're getting better we we certainly are long away from uh you must have x aspect are super equipped for this exotic to work so yeah good question jk good question all right let's uh let's get into the weapons finally we've got two new echoes weapons for act three these are craftable this is cronophage the void trace rifle and spelliologists or speleologists i should say which is a solar machine gun and then we're also going to be talking about our now in full dawn weapon set that has been reprised these are not craftable but they are enhanceable and they can drop double perks and calm three and four through um what's the one like vexnet activity is that breach executable or is that the other one there's a few different ways to get double perks and calm three and three checks is impossible is the the you go into the vex network uh so yeah that will be um no sorry no first completion of that breach is the next double is the um nesus uh like kind of mini public event kind of thing it's the other one the one the vex network that you can uh uh whatever that one's yeah you can go into a very professional here yeah there's a lot of activities that and whatever and uh so in our dawn weapon set are reprised on weapons that we're going to be talking about breach light strand sidearm now a strand sidearm patron of lost causes kinetic scout rifle perfect paradox kinetic shotgun martyrs retribution solar waveframe grenade launcher and line in the sand which is the arc precision frame lfr now we do have some new origin traits here so again for our echoes weapons specifically the radiolaria transposer origin trait where there is a counter and upon reaching 100 of that counter which you get by scoring weapon kills within eight seconds of each targets will explode and create a radiolaria pool under them damage does scale with combat and rank modifiers and you can look at those specific modifiers by going to mossy maxes sheet and count as weapon damage so they are also affected by damage buffs that counter is progressed also by the combatant rank so rank and file enemies provide 34% and that's uh basically three kills of those enemies to spawn a pool whereas elite miniboss and bosses are a 100% so you need to defeat one of them to spawn that radiolaria pool now our dawn weapons do have a new origin trait that is cast no shadows and upon dealing melee damage grants some amount of handling we're not sure the exact number and it refills 20% of the magazine from reserves which is a fantastic origin trait for a few of our dawn weapons we'll cover those in time so i'll start off with chronophage here this is again is our void adaptive frame trace rifle adaptive frame doesn't really have a specific bonus or attribute it's just generally a good stats here and just a button sorry and just a negma protocol is the vex network activity could have sworn that was a sidearm but yeah it's not coming special rocket launcher oh boy good negma protocol there you go we are going to be comparing chronophage with incisor which is the strand adaptive frame trace rifle that is dropping from trials of Osiris and then hollow denial which is our first void adaptive frame trace rifle all the way back from season of the haunted that does currently drop from the presage exotic mission which you can get through the exotic mission rotator looking at her stats here i'll go chronophage incisor hollow denial here on range we have 67 versus 71 versus 66 so chronophage is kind of in the middle but on the lower end here and that 67 range translates to 21.5 meters hipfire and about 34.5 meters when 80 s on the stability side it is 74 versus 80 versus 76 so chronophage lowest stability there but still pretty good pretty high stability handling 51 versus 58 versus 55 again lowest here and that 51 handling translates to 0.38 seconds ready 0.29 seconds 80 s and 0.35 seconds stow 80 s pretty pretty fast for trace rifles that are 0.29 seconds is nice and snappy when you do have the weapon out reload speed 44 versus 55 versus 46 i'm sure you're starting to see a trend here chronophage not a stat monster by any means and that 44 reload speed does translate to just over two seconds 2.06 seconds at base to reload recoil direction on 99 again most trace rifles have crazy high recoil and pretty great stability here on the reserves this is an interesting thing here chronophage has the lowest reserves of all legendary trace rivals and hollow denial actually has the highest it's a pretty big difference here so going through the three again here on the reserve count chronophage has 430 in reserves versus in scissors 490 versus hollow denials 498 now it's not so far down that it's by itself there are a few other trace rifles that are pretty pretty low that is below 450 but yeah that's a pretty big gap here 430 versus 498 and the other void trace rifle is the one that has 498 so we definitely want to be aware of that stat when we're thinking about this when we look at chronophage as um perks here we definitely want to address our reserves again the whole point of using a trace rifle is to kind of have a slightly higher powered primary weapon primary weapons have infinite ammo so the total number of reserves the total amount of ammunition that you get from a special break very much matters to the viability of trace rifles and i think we can talk about how viable trace rifles are as a whole when we get to the end of chronophage's review but let's start with column one here are barrels for chronophage again you've got decent range 67 you got great stability it's 74 handling is probably the one thing handling and reload is the the two things that i'd probably want to touch right away here you don't really need to touch recoil direction you're at 99 so the arrowhead break is not going to be providing a ton of value to you you could go fluted again i think plus five speaking as an m&k player a plus five to that stability is not necessary at all but the plus 15 to handling absolutely is that would take you up to 66 and so that would be my number one recommendation um again if you wanted to do something like well yeah i actually i was just about to say chamber compensator but that hurts handling we don't want that so stick to fluted nice and easy here now on the batteries which are column two this is where we want to be thinking about magazines really boosting stuff like that enhanced battery is going to give a small bump to the magazine that's nice again magazines quite large here um you're going to be taking with enhanced battery over a hundred rounds in the mag which is good again this is the whole point of a trace rifle is to use this as your primary to use in a double special situation here so you're going to be using this and then swapping to that second special weapon for more specialized enemies maybe some more high health targets here so this is for our general ad clear to be used with our abilities here so more bullets it's going to make a lot of sense here ionized battery we could do as well if you really want to crank up the magazine that does hurt your reload speed that would basically have it down to 24 and i would only recommend that if we have something that could bypass the reload speed entirely as an actual trait and stake home three or four and we do have some options that we'll bring up here so ionized battery definitely but you would need a very special reload perk to kind of really make up for that minus 20 deficit as for the other battery options those are all getting bumps to range stability handling not necessarily needed especially if we're going to be running fluted barrel to give the bump to a small bump to stability but then a larger bump to handling range i i really don't think we need the range again 34 34.5 meters Ads is enough for the middle engagement distance i don't think we need to push that too much out that's not really the point like what i would do if i was worried about the range on credit page going into a particular activity as i'd bring along a sniper rifle or something like mountaintop where that grenade that mountaintop fires just will shoot in a straight line and that's what i would use for my long distance or i'd take in a more long distance heavy weapon um something that can deal damage at a very long range again a sniper rifle or rocket launcher or an LFR so that's why i'm not too concerned about the range stat here your mileage may vary now when we get into column three let's start thinking about some of our reload options here for committed to ionized battery we do have some pretty phenomenal ones here i'll read off kind of our total viable stats here or our traits here so we got strategist shoot to loot pugilist auto loading holster feeding frenzy and repulsor brace here shoot to loot not a loading holster are going to help bypass reload speed entirely i don't think i need to explain the viability of those two shoot to loot is going to be very nice in general for other bricks and orbs of powers so that's not just limited to chronophage in its reload speed but also what other special weapon and heavy weapon you're running and the orb of power stuff can also be used for a ton of different stuff now the real i i mean again i think the real viability of shoot to loot on a trace rifle is we've got a large magazine so you can you can expend a few bullets that would you know ten bullets on any other weapon would be a bit of a sacrifice to try and hit a pesky little brick from the other side of the map here but ten bullets is only ten percent of your magazine on a trace rifle so the value of shoot to loot on a trace rifle for me is much higher than a lot of other weapons however if you want a general ease of use reload perk i think auto loading holster is going to be the play here obviously if you want to lean into void of 3.0 shenanigans we do have repulsor brace and we do have destabilizing rounds and column four and this is where um chronophage does kind of take a step forward compared to hollow denial as hollow denial did not get destabilizing rounds so you have the void combo there between repulsor brace and destabilizing rounds on chronophage and chronophage only we do also have desperate measures demolitionist target lock and one for all in column four target lock again large magazine gonna take a very long time for you to ramp up damage and that's not really the intended role for a trace rifle right we want to deal with rank and file combatants and then we have our other special weapon or our heavy weapon to deal with those high health targets so target lock not really synergizing with the whole point of running a trace rifle one for all again you just need to hit targets and with that large magazine would be very fast to proc on a trace rifle makes a lot of sense demolitionist gradient energy getting kills very nice you could do a pugilist or a strategist plus demolitionist build for a certain combination there i'm sure that would be of interest to some folks maybe scheming about some prismatic build if you want to get a loop going there and use this to kind of keep that engine running there is certainly viability there i'm a huge fan of desperate measures speaking of prismatic i love running desperate measures on my prismatic subclasses and my builds i think that could be a very strong one and then of course destabilizing rounds for void options here now court saint what are you guys looking at on chronophage do you want the shoot to loot aspect are you more interested in something like repulsor brace or just an easier option for auto loading holster what are your thoughts for me shoot to loot is definitely one that i'm drawn to because we've only got other two other trace rifles that i've got shoot to loot and that is path of least resistance that's our our option and retrace path which is our solar option so this is our first void with shoot to loot um yeah i'm not i'm not too convinced all loading holster at least for a trace rifle yeah you could you know expand mulcher ammo and then swap out of it then swap to it i feel like trace rifles at least in their current sandbox is they're more used as kind of primaries i'm not going to be kind of juggling a trace rifle to to auto reload it via uh all loading holster i'm certainly not disputing the the viability just with this having a larger magazine and yeah the reload speed is not exactly great but uh yeah shoot to loot destabilizing rounds definitely viable for perhaps non-hunters if if you're uh if you're uh sort of for hunters obviously we have jr falcons so we don't necessarily destabilizing uh so for me i'd probably go for something like one for all very easy to to get that 35% it feels really great uh for for a trace rifle um the only other option maybe is demo but again that that occupying the fourth slot is quite uh it's not as appetizing if it was maybe in column three uh but then we would lose something like shoot to loot um but yeah it's direct competitor hollow denial it's quite old at this point it's also got one uh one less perk compared to uh chromophage um and yeah it's it's getting quite uh a couple years now since we've talked about hollow denial but i know it's got lead from gold in column three which is just a superb perk on on special weapons i was just looking the spreadsheet for at least for the origin trait uh for that radio malaria trace rifles are they're not the best in terms of combat and scaling but uh i think that makes sense because it is more of a kind of ad clearing weapon anyway so it is kind of in the middle when uh when you compare it with the the rest of the the the weapons set that we've talked about in the last couple of months um saint what's your thoughts here you know i love repulsive race destabilizing because of that with what that traits i could do for you but i don't i don't know if the base damage of this is good enough for its ammo type for destabilizing to beat out one for all each which is tough um so i'm feeling i'm feeling a shoot to loot one for all definitely i repulsive race destabilizing sounds good but i would just rather use it on a straight primary or a different special weapon and um there's a few that come to mind the other thing i was going to say about homed denial is yeah you know it's got like an extra 60 something bullets and it also has killing tally which comparable to one for all but unfortunately homed denial never had any kind of ammo region or reg or mag refresh perk ammo regen perk in the third column um versus scrotophage now has one for all which is just slightly higher damage still and it has a good um ammo slash reload perk and the third column was shoot to loot kind of like it just pointing out so yeah it's definitely very attractive uh i ammo and i think that's a decent you know play there i would definitely be leaning in stability a little bit more i prefer to go highest ability on trace rifles and i just don't think the tree circles in general are in a great spot right now despite the fact that this thing specifically this weapon chronophage has good traits and it's got a good origin trait that can be you know have utility to it and everything which shoot to loot will work with again nice but uh i'm just not reaching for a trace rifle much these days to be honest with you yeah rocket sidearms kind of showed up and started eating their lunch uh and it's uh it's been i don't think any of us are looking back because rocket sidearms rule but you don't really have a reason to run a legendary trace rifle much yeah all right so we uh move on to the machine gun then yeah let's do it let's talk about spelliologist this is a solar rapid fire machine gun when your mag is empty you get that .8x reload duration multiplier so nice 20 increase there when we compare it's stats we're going to be looking at alliatic principle from season of the witch and retrofit escapade from serif and that drops from serif shield that we were just talking about at the beginning of the episode so how do this base stats compare on the range front we've got 28 range versus 26 and 23 so really solid range there that's going to be 46.6 meters ads and i think that maybe you'll find that that's more than you can even manage and that is due to the fact that its base stability is 33 which is the lowest that is one point under alliatic principle and 11 points under retrofit escapade and and it is moderately noticeable appeared with the recoil direction which also happens to be very low at 58 that is two under alliatic principle and three above retrofit escapade the handling is 49 that is you know just one under alliatic and seven under retrofit escapade for you know basically 0.4 ready in ads or 0.35 stow and it's okay i don't find that to be that bad really and the reload speed is also pretty low at 61 versus 64 and 67 it's going to be like four and a half seconds there's some ways that we can mitigate that though yeah you know i mean honestly overall just not great base stats compared to some of these competitors here but there are some things that we can do to you know get around that reload speed or pump up that that the controllability of the weapon a little bit so especially in controller i think this the will find this thing kicks quite a lot and you're gonna want to increase that recoil direction as well as your stability now base range like we said is like 46 and a half meters and that is really far um you're not going to be able to consistently land shots at 45 meters definitely a controller um you know if you guys use this much on M&K any thoughts there i've not gotten actually this to drop for me so i cannot provide any commentary on it um yeah it could be slightly better but gourd go ahead yeah it's it's a rapid fire frame so it's going to be quite bouncy even on my some keyboard obviously you know my some keyboard's got a little bit more of an advantage with the being more of a 3d movement compared to a controller but yeah no it's a rapid fire going to be uh it's gonna gonna be all over the place yeah so oh let's jump into the weapon itself i'm you know we're taking errorhead break for ten handling and 30 recoil directions gonna put you up to 88 which we're manageable and then steady rounds which takes five range off but it's giving the plus 15 stability which i desperately need and my range is still gonna be above 46 meters you know 80s and and you know you you are not gonna be missing out on that um especially considering the fact of you know let's go you go for a stability masterwork as well and you're going to be all the way up at 58 stability at base at that point you're also mitigating that loss to your range now it's only at minus three which is not very noticeable at all um next couple of things i'll say is we have a few options to keep going down the line of mitigating it's a recoil and reload and some stuff like that so third column we have got enlightened action stats for all deconstruct and slide ways all you know reloads that are ammo one way or the other it's a firmly planted um i also have envious assassins so you know a few things here mitigating some of those weaker stats that we have um you know stats for all is just giving so many bonuses 35 handling 35 reloads the 10 range 10 stability really nice and then you know obviously envious for the ammo and my personal pick here is going to be slide ways for that 15% mag on activation to to really help get around that bad reload speed um and you get a little handling bump and then in the final column we've got a lot of different damage traits here adagio one for all target locks surrounded incandescent and killing tally personal pick here is going to be killing tally to pair with slide ways um court how are you feeling slide ways over envious or you know is there something else in the third column that's kind of drawing your attention what's uh what's your feelings here i think for me envious is going to be the the one that i'm going to craft um i can see slide ways being quite useful uh machine guns you know you you're going to have quite a large magazine anyway but like sliding around pretty easy to do it's not like with rock and launchers there's a little bit of a risk to that uh where you might blow yourself up with slide ways uh but uh yeah envious assassin just to really bump up the magazine because in column four um i'm probably going to be going for incandescent because i've been looking for something to replace uh fixed odds which uh you know it's been my trusted go to for incandescent shenanigans for machine gun but i'm also not a big fan of the high impact frame so uh you know that's already got quite a low um magazine with 44 uh compared to this with a much higher uh mag of 72 base um so yeah for me that's my pick um envious incandescent though i do see sofa is there uh been a wild sister spoke about uh stats for all and one for all it's nice to see that again your clip is a trap perk we do not suggest that whatsoever uh not on a machine gun on another weapon say a rocket sidearm or an all rifle sure but not not on this um but yeah that that's my pick uh EA plus incand i um i think i'm gonna go sideways i think i'm team sideways okay i was looking at our other solar options i too also have fixed odds that's been my solar machine gun of choice i did not get an unwavering duty that was quality for pve uh from trial suppose iris and that definitely had the perk pool i think to really edge out fixed odds but it wasn't craftable and it dropped from trials um notably though unwavering duty and fixed odds both have field prep and i think that was probably partially to balance out the fact that uh our rapid fires do have tend to have the larger mags to have larger uh reserves so not a huge bummer that spelliologists doesn't have field prep but um yeah you know you you got to play to certain weapon strengths and i think the naturally higher handling the naturally higher reload speed not that that's tremendous on machine guns anyways of speleologists those are the things that i want to double down on so slide ways to get rid of the reload speed and really just to take advantage of and even better feeling handling from when i'm sliding for a few moments and then probably incandescent um i don't know if this is going to just straight up replace fixed odds for me because i like having the bump of enhanced field prep there i like having the extra range that the high impact frame affords me um yeah i'll probably just need to play around with this i this is just going to be one of those things with rapid fires where you really need to fine tune your barrel your mag your masterwork to make sure that you can get a pretty decent uh you know kill at a good amount of range i'm not saying necessarily a precision kill but you want to be sure that you can at least proc in incandescent at a good good distance especially when i've been so uh accustomed to fixed odds and how that fires and you can't get decently ranged kills on that just because of the nature of it being a high impact frame so yeah i i hope speleologists can be my new my new solar machine gun of choice again it's really great that it's craftable but um if it's not chances are you've got a pretty good fixed odds or if you're a trials player you've got a really good unwavering duty that will continue to do their jobs just fine i was looking at the numbers for the ammo reserves so fixed odds with enhanced field prep is just at base 444 and then with speleo it goes to uh so that's compared to 514 uh so even with enhanced field prep it's just obviously get the benefits with reload with uh field prep but it's about what just under 60 um bullets less uh compared to the two then unwavering um with field prep is uh don't have values here yeah it does actually it's 467 so again slightly less compared to speleo but that's just with intrinsically having more because of the frame mm-hmm yeah speleo is definitely a pickup for me um and again i think having the benefits of like killing tally or uh incandescent is nice it's just that the other two solar machine guns that we have have killing tally and incandescent as well so it's more of a frame upgrade and i guess i don't know if i'd call slide ways uh reload upgrade but um yeah uh definitely getting a rapid fire within incandescent that solar is going to be nice for a lot of solar related builds oh and the origin traits sick you know yeah that is why i wasn't going incandescent because the explosions are already pretty solid but i understand the just you know one explosion is nice why not more explosions i definitely you know i can i can be a pathetic to that cause court were you going to say something uh would you guys pick an extended mic if you're going slide ways because it doesn't really matter what your magazine is if you're going to be sliding yeah because it would give me up to a higher return because i'm pretty sure if you put on you're getting 14 or 15 with backup mag on a slide so yeah so you know with um what does that put your mag up to so let's just presume we've got extended mag plus enhanced killing tally plus backup mag it goes up to 150 magazine size uh so 15 percent of that um they'll be like 17 or 18 if it runs up right yeah yeah i'll be roughly around about that yeah i mean man i don't know you know i'm giving up uh steady rounds though so that's a good chunk but if i'm getting you get stability from slide ways too yep is you know i think i think there was another reason i was thinking about that because you put that plus 20 stability it's helping you land shots a little bit more you know so then you're still at like 63 even if you take extended mag so it's you know yeah yeah it's not 78 but it's probably fine at that point if your mag size is 150 you get 18 back from slide ways uh just about 15 percent it's right it's 17.25 but it's rounding up um but yeah you can also get um this is enhanced um which we want um no sorry with uh slide ways you get around about 17 stability and then plus 33 handling for for three seconds which is you know it's not a lot but if you're doing that a lot then it's essentially forever uh but do do take in mind that uh that cooldown or sorry that duration also acts as a self-cooled down so you can't trigger again during the three seconds um so it's just getting the habit of sliding as soon as the uh the the timer drops off but uh no i do agree that like incandescence definitely what i'd probably go for but killing tally is a very powerful um the parrot for a machine gun i mean we all use delirium back in the day so you know it's uh it's really strong but getting that uh passive uh magazine bump uh on top of that uh it's great especially for our rapid fire does radioleria transposer also inherit weapon traits that give damage buffs uh you know like does that scorch from incandescence uh well i mean i'm also thinking like if i have killing tally times three up is the explosion that i'm getting from radioleria transposer getting buffed by 35 or 30 percent yeah it does yeah so oh yeah see so man we get the damage skills with baton right modifier which is pretty high for machine gun i think it's overall it's the highest or one of the highest uh i think it drops off quite dramatically if you use it against like a mini boss or uh like a boss but i mean i wouldn't really suggest using the machine gun against those anyway uh but at least for like minors and elites it's very high for uh uh uh for a weapon in this set and yeah it will also affect but it is uh sorry it's affected by damage buffs um which you know this is the perfect weapon for the origin trait is what we're seeing yeah um very easy to get because you only need three to spawn the for rank and file which is the primary target for a machine gun you only need three for that uh to spawn and yeah you get the explosion plus the uh uh the the actual radioleria pool um in terms of your question but incandescent i think i've seen a few comments i think it does i i'm assuming it does because it's inheriting all these like weapon damage buffs and that so maybe i got to test with aberrant action yeah because i don't have a i don't have a spelliologist to test but um i have incandescent on my aberrant action so yeah so to recap this this is the weapon for the origin trait yeah yeah it's going to excel really great uh against add dense activities which we are getting frequently uh this is to go to okay any final words about spielo lots of uh fond uh fondness even though we haven't managed crafter as yet oh it sounds like uh really good to really enjoy the way this thing sounds do i see the only thing i got left from you looks great i really want to get it okay well we're moving over to our don weapons which is um we're going to start off with breach light that is our strand heavy burst sidearm and a reminder that's your two round burst so it was renamed to be heavy burst uh much like our hand cannons and you do get that small flinch resistance well aiming down site um so we're going to pair this with liminal vigil which is the spire the watcher dungeon sidearm and empirical evidence which is the throne world two sidearms i've not uh talked about for many years at this point um so comparing it the three of them breach light versus liminal versus imperial we've got 48 versus 58 versus 52 range and that uh represents a 12 0.92 meter hipfire or a 15.5 meter ADS so quite a small uh damage range just with this being a sidearm obviously stability of 37 versus 39 versus 33 handling of 35 versus 35 versus 34 which represents a 0.33 second ready a 0.27 ADS and a 0.36 second stall and the reload is 23 versus 28 versus 24 which is 1.87 seconds reload and recall direction here of 82 versus 94 versus 98 so it's been a while since we've talked about heavy burst sidearms um i suppose we're very fond on the other uh sandbox for sidearms that's the special variant um so this might be a quite a short review uh just because the nature of primary ammo sidearms we're not really uh utilizing them unless it's a certain uh plunder arc vault shot one which we spoke about many many months ago uh so starting off with our perk one i think just another kind of classic kind of arrowhead break gives us your maximum recall direction plus 10 handling um we could go a little bit more into handling with a little bit stability flute barrel that plus five stability and plus 15 handling uh same i i think i know the answer with this being uh kind of a heavy burst i did ask this with the heavy burst hand cannons but how does this feel with controllers i'm assuming it's quite steady anyway yeah it's not you know it doesn't look like it has great stats with like whatever is 37 stability and 82 recoil direction but it's yeah honestly fine it doesn't feel like that at all in terms of what we're going for in comms too um i can it's a bit of a like personal choice here i mean we do have the magazine perks for boosting up that uh that magazine i'm just looking at extended mag yes that does bring us down to uh three for the reload speed but with this being a sidearm it's not too detrimental it does uh slow your reload down to 2.11 seconds again it's not it's not too bad uh but we do have uh some uh perks in comms three and four that could help with that um in terms of others you've just got your classic selection here of the pennies and tactical mag if you want to go down that route if you're not interested in having a uh a slower sidearm but okay i don't think it's too much of a detriment having extended mag to boost up to 36 in the magazine in terms of comm three uh we've got kind of classic sidearm perks that we've seen before we do have demo and pugilist in comm three we've got perpetual motion uh which will buff your stability stability and handling we do have uh threat detector which is the one that i was thinking about because you do get plus 60 um sorry plus 55 reload speeds with threat detector makes sense for a sidearm we're going to be quite pretty close quarters very easy to activate you do get a smorgoslord of other uh bonuses here with uh 40 stability 100 handling uh and you get some handling animation duration multiplier again it doesn't i mean it's going to make a benefit for sidearms but with just the nature of sidearms uh they're already pretty great in the first place uh we do have slice in comm three um you know lads what we think of is slice with a sidearm i know it's showed up with a lot of other strand weapons before but uh would you pick slice for for a sidearm if you wanted to uh take that out for a little spin i um i'm planning to i mean this this weapon's got a range of about a little over like 15 meters effective you know it is usually where you're sitting at so i'm probably going to be playing pretty aggressively with this weapon and especially if i'm at pve and i'm using a sidearm like this so i don't you know i don't know if i'm super interested in slice um i see some value there i feel like i'm typically using slice on on weapons that i'm more likely to be found using in a gm to like stun a champion and things like that it's kind of where my mind goes amethyst i i am not a slice fan i'll be honest um i was willing to give it a try last season when it debuted just not doing it for me um i know there was some buzz about it and pvp for reducing your enemies um ability to hit your ttk but yeah i am not i'm not sold on it not for sidearm at least i again i'll have to go back and look at what i even have as a slice weapon i think i have an incisor with slice but yeah it's just far too niche for me right now again not to take away from the uh the sever verb but i feel like i've got that pretty well represented on my ability side like um titan melee severs doesn't it that's correct yeah see i most of the time if i'm like really leaning into sever i will probably just hop on prismatic titan or my strand titan class if i really want to go crazy because like you know you just you're you lean into the melee part already as as a part of that kit and then you get more charges of that so i'll just apply sever through my fists rather than my sidearm at that you know from a range point of view like i'm already up close i might as well just keep using my charge maylays because that tends to be a lot stronger than my sidearm bullets so no slice on breach life for me in column four uh again we've got another classic collection of perks we've got ag we've got swash buckler uh we've got collective action which i suppose will play into if you do want to go for slice you can obviously spawn a tangle through that and then utilize that to get that 20% damage increase for seven seconds doesn't have to be a tangle though it can be any of the elemental pickups uh we do have hatchling here um precision kill or three kills within three seconds of each spawns a threadling uh again may come into play just with the nature of being close quarters with the sidearm a threadling popping out and then doing some just additional damage while you're in the thick of it might come helpful not going to be picking verbal weapon though not on a special it's certainly not sorry not on a primary and certainly not on a sidearm and we also have desperate measures here which i suppose nice little synergy if you go demo or pugilist with desperate measures very nice kind of synergy there uh to to get that initial 10% and then 20% and then 30% with desperate measures so for me personally i think threat detector plus uh desperate measures or hatchling or one of the the the isths the demo or pugilist with one of the the adrenaline john kate or swash blocker or or desperate measure but probably not going to be picking this because you know we we also have another strand weapon in the top slot which is special and it is also a sidearm it's the call so it's it's certainly eaten its lunch with normal sidearms unfortunately i suppose it would play quite well with cast no shadows just to get a slight extra bump if you are concerned with reloads you get 20% your magazine back um doesn't matter what your reserves are because obviously primaries don't have any um but you do get some additional handling for that plus you're uh 20% back on your your sidearm so play that uh with say some like pugilist and desperate measures that's nice little synergy all right lads any other thoughts like breach like i what last thing i'll say is i like the combo of threat detector and hatchling because threat detector gives you a huge boost to your stability is plus 40 stability at two stacks and it works up to 15 meters which is pretty much the optimal range of the weapon so it makes getting those precision kills for hatchling really easy which if you are on a you know build especially that it's gonna benefit from that then it's kind of nice um other than that i use when it's like if usually swatchbuckler a little bit on prismatic to you know balance out my transcendence meter getting charged and it was fine you know i it's um it's just too risky to play these days for like most of other options you could do in the sandbox but again that's kind of a more meta topic about you know conversation around sidearms in general uh still a fine weapon i think overall in solid like you know treat mix i agree i agree um yeah i have a i was looking at my vault here i have a pugilist swashbuckler role of it and i think that's probably if i am going to use this that's the role i'm going to use but i got the call so you can sit in the vault breach flight uh until the the time comes when the call can no longer uh bring the satisfaction as my strand sidearm of choice i mean it's got one up against the call and that's the looks i do enjoy the metallic dawn weapons compared to a lot of the other uh aesthetics um not a big fan of the the faces on the side of the weapon i know that's supposed to be quite uh iconic and you know 10 years into destiny as a franchise but uh yeah i can can't go wrong with these metallic weapons it's also got a special place in my heart because a long time ago i was clearing deep stone crypt on day one we got all over the funnel boss and the issue that i ran into uh that we collected we were running into was literally running out of ammo by the time we would get to final man and a weapon that i had in my vault that was a good dps primary was a vocal sidearm and that sidearm was a breach like and it carried us through to that day one clear of like that was cool yeah love to hear it i can't help but feel a little offended given that the call has a picture of a warlock on it and apparently that's a problem for the two of you hold on i never seen it's a problem it's not a fan of it look just because i use the blacked-out shader and you can't see any of the detail on it it hides everything doesn't mean i don't know what it looks okay don't leave my pugeless swash that's the breach right now don't need you at all bitch take a video of that and post it in the picture on that bit i see the worst bonus all right well let's move on then to gun that i hope we have nice things to say about uh patron of lost causes who look who doesn't love scout rifles right classic primary that we all use on a regular basis this one is a kinetic lightweight scout rifle and that lightweight frame bonus is plus 20 mobility and 6.25 percent forward movement speed bonus we're going to be comparing this to vouchsafe which is dropping from drinking city and it's void and tarnish metal which is the arc lightweight scout rifle all the way back from season of the ponder and it is unfortunately unobtainable right now when we look at the range here it's actually all of these stats pretty close between the three here so lost causes has 33 range compared to 33 on vouchsafe and 30 for tarnish metal again that translates to just over 35 meters hipfire and just over 70 meters eight yes so we do not need to touch the range that because scout rifles are naturally blessed with very very good range even though that number is quite low stability also very neck and neck 32 versus 32 versus 33 so tarnish metal just slightly better there handling 63 versus 63 versus 66 yet again tarnish metal slightly better that 63 handling though for patron of lost causes translates to a 0.36 ready a 0.30 second ads and a 0.34 second stow speed and on the reload front 53 versus 55 versus 53 so vouchsafe slightly better on the reload front that 53 reload is translating to 1.94 seconds at base and on the recoil front this is where things actually get the most varied 59 recoil direction versus 47 versus 52 so patron has the naturally high number however saint have you fired a patron of lost causes recently and how did you feel that 59 translated to in real in real practice yeah it's it's still bouncing around a good bit it's not horrible but i'm yeah i'm definitely gonna be looking to pump that set up of all the things especially like you said because there's several stats like the range stat on the scout rifle it doesn't really matter right so you know when there's stuff that i can afford to not really worry about i'm definitely investing on you know like a road ahead break here well there you go there's our column one taking care of there so again patron of lost causes pretty par for the course as far as stats go and again it's kinetic whereas i was comparing it to two um energy slot weapons here i'll bring up that distinction in a little bit here so yeah column one arrowhead break again takes your recoil up to 89 would definitely make it a little bit more manageable also boost that already high handling up to 73 it will feel nice and snappy again we don't need to touch the range whatsoever stability if you want to give that a little bit of a bump you know fluted barrel or if you really need to commit to it polygonal rifling or master work would would probably suit you there on our column two our magazine side here we've got accurate rounds completely unnecessary we've got steady rounds which could help out on the stability front if that's really a struggle for you uh also hurts the range but doesn't actually hurt the range you're just under 70 meters ads with with steady rounds so you're fine you are fine and pretty much every piece of activity here as far as hitting crits before damage fall off we do of course have tactical mag appended mag extended mag alloy mag and flared magwell tactical magazine is the one perk i was really chasing again i'm a big tactical mag fan here that's gonna be nice for extra bullets but i wouldn't say no to flared magwell or appended mag either going on to column three here when we start getting into the actual traits we have triple tap rapid hit strategist stats for all and i guess if you want to get really fun discord um again triple tap rapid hit are going to be the well on stats for all would be your easiest ones to proc here triple tap going to be giving you just bullets every three shots that's always nice rapid hit will be taking your handling and your sorry your reload speed and your stability to the max here in no short amount of time here well i lied i won't take your stability to the max is it'll take it to 57 so it will feel absolutely superb but your reload speed will be up to 100 at times five uh basically at times four it's 98 reload speed there so very very solid for making the scout rifle feel nice and easy to handle on column four we have explosive payload for weapon column four osmosis we love to see it focus fury kinetic trimmers and precision instrument i think we can safely say that it will really come down to if you can get a kinetic trimmers or an explosive payload roll um precision instrument i think on this weapon in particular probably would lend itself more to a pvp environment uh connect trimmers so of course has tremendous pbe potential here and i did get a triple tap kinetic trimmers roll uh in i think act one when this did debut i've fired at a few times again it feels great i love connect trimmers on the lightweight frame and the lightweight frame for scout rifles is one of the better ones again i know i was ragging on scout rifles and their current performance in the sandbox at the start of this breakdown but when we're looking at the actual frames for scout rifles we're trying to figure out what's the best it's the rapid fires and then the light weights so really triple tap connect trimmers for me is the pinnacle i could also understand a triple tap explosive payload or a rapid hit explosive payload or rapid hit kinetic trimmers that is to me the most pbe centric roll connect trimmers is a fantastic one for kind of getting a little bit of aoe damage at a long distance uh really at any distance when we think about that 70 meters of range that scout rifles have saint or court do you guys have any other roles that you're chasing this is probably the one weapon of our set where our cast no shadows origin trait is going to be a little bit out of reach consistently i should say but do you guys have anything else maybe for those that have ranged mailings you know thinking to strand hunter that might come to play but yeah i totally agree that the origin traits maybe not too friendly for this connective trimmers is definitely what i'm going for um with rapid hit uh for scout rifles it's it only requires six uh uh hits for to activate which puts it basically uh joint third um because snipers only require three uh pulse rifles require a living but obviously you're only pulling the trigger trigger three times uh and then uh yeah joint with hand cannons for six so fairly easy to uh to get that to activate compared to like auto rifles or SMGs where you might you know mess a few shots or uh not hit your target while you're spraying um but yeah that's what i'd be going for uh saint what's your you got any other perks you might be going for something like you know rapid hit explosive payload is just absolute classic mmm the name escapes me but there was a scout rifle for a long time you gave from one of those intro sahan quests that was overflow to explosive payload and that was why like co-2 ebb and anybody it was like brand new to the game um if you need like a champion weapon usually scout rifles from the artifact that was always my go-to recommendation was just go get that from um that quick quest and i you know something like triple tap also is really solid um i would want to the uh the idea of pairing that with focus fury is nice but i find that i i just straight up prefer explosive payload or you know in this case yeah connect trimmers is another kind of like more standout trade that i would still i'd probably be picking over uh focus fury because explosive payload it's got the damage and it's got the utility versus focus fury's uptime is not quite as good it's stay just a little bit higher but yeah i i know i'm just i'm not sold on uh focus fury for a weapon like this was it nameless midnight or maybe no it was night watch the night watch suck at most annoying sound in the game yeah yeah yeah yeah it sounds so bold it's effective does not sound good like a like a small caliber nail gun or something really odd blink blink blink blink blink yeah but now uh you don't have to use that anymore just come get you get a little patron of lost causes and uh you get to go don't worry about that thing it sounds way better it's very strange seeing osmosis um i just don't quite see the vibe i know they buffed it so i mean it's maybe not that great for prime race but uh grade ability usage refills 50% of your magazine rounds up from reserves sure it works for prime race but this would be more kind of akin to specials if you have that um yeah osmosis very strange when i first uh pulled up patron on d2 foundry i thought i pulled up the old one i was like wait osmosis again but yeah it's there um yeah not entirely convinced with osmosis but hey it's got a little buff um if you want to plan to say like hunters with jar of falcons using your void grenades sure that might be a little bit of fun but we i mean vouch safe is already there yeah it was like this other void stuff that's just just straight void out of the box yeah yeah so yeah all right same we have a shotgun up next very app that you're covering it yeah this is the perfect paradox it is a kinetic rapid-fire shotgun it's an old weapon it's a famous weapon and it is it is back with um with some with some good-looking stuff here and probably one of the the best um you know the best origin trait for cast no shadows right we we talked about that earlier with the machine gun and how well that that capitalizes unreal area this is probably the best weapon that we've got for cast no shadows and just the way that it flows it's like about some stats and we'll get more to that in just a second um you know comparing this with some other really popular rapid-fire shotgun options um you know Ikelo shotgun v103 besto ostinato and deadweight coming from dia muna and gambit respectively it has 32 range base that is second Ikelo's by two points the stability is 36 which is the highest by four it's handling is 43 second to Ikelo's v3 by one point the reload speed is 64 tied with deadweight for the highest I'm talking about the mag and ammo a little bit here now um just you know those stats are nice having good stability and range and reload and all that stuff that's nice but really important for shotguns here and some of the people are very keen on is you know our mag and reserve so we've got seven in the base mag with appended or tack mag or extended or backup mag you're gonna put that up to eight um you can also have you know appended plus backup mag all gonna you know put you up to eight um and the ammo economy and this is where I'm gonna jump ahead a little bit and you know let's say that first of all it's got 28 base pretty good uh one reserve mods can put you at 29 and then two or three are both gonna put you at 31 so pretty solid there but where this really starts to pick up is the fact that we've got field prep and the third column field prep at base is going to put you up 30 and you only going to get one more because it's going to max our number serves there and then with enhanced field prep no reserves 31 so it's it's it's hitting it's max reserve amount with no mods and just enhanced field prep at base so to say and if you're you know how does this compare to some of our other options well you know v3 is going to be at 28 rounds so it's three extra shells here and that is particularly important for some shotgun builds uh depending on how you're using this thing so what's you know what what am I looking for i'm on our barrels and mags on the barrel side i'm probably going full choke uh and if not i would say corkscrew which is just a plus five stability range and handling obviously full choke for that pellet spread is going to get that pellet spread down by 3.75% and then i'm not you know i'm i'm probably just going to run backup mag because there's not really much else to run on this thing as far as mods go so that's going to put you up to eight rounds so i don't i i don't think that there is a ton of reason to run a something that is kind of up your magazine size here which pretty much leaves you with steady rounds accurate rounds and light mag you know you do also get a little bit of reload speed and stability stability from tach mag light mag is giving you plus 10 reload speed and five range though and i i think that that's much more appealing on light mag there um and then of course accurate around for just plus 10 in range now you know you you got our pellet spread down a little bit of mag is up into eight thanks to backup mag maybe you've got accurate or light mag on there in the third column this is where things really start to get interesting we have got threat detector slideshot delodar mutualist threat remover and of course field prep which we previously mentioned and then in the final column trench barrel swashbuckler opening shot vorpal weapon one two punch in barrel constrictor and then of course cast no shadows and i'd be remiss if i did not also mention saints inspiration which allows me way hits to overflow weapons with cathode ados which i believe is very strong um i know i'm just probably grabbing straight towards the one two punch as made famous by strand titan uh and this build i went to one that's super long though so i'll just go ahead and pass you up to court and say court how you feeling about this you're using perfect paradox much these days um well not these days because i still have to get some of these to drop i've had a few to drop but i'm that field prep is such a draw and i was just looking at other shotguns because it's a very rare perk to see on shotguns and the last thing we had a field prep on a shotgun was without remorse which is the haunted way back in 2017 one right uh yeah yes um and then before that was the original retold tail uh which uh yeah it still gets it with the sorry i'm mixing up with some of the the dreaming city weapons but uh yeah retold tail was our previous one um with uh oh sorry i'm i'm not including dead weight as well dead weight also gets uh field prep um so yeah like that is my uh that is the main draw um with um perfect paradox to me it was if it did drop with uh slide shots so we we spoke about slide ways the other slide perk um with the trisha rifle earlier on slide shots a little bit different where you get 15% the magazine and grants 20 range instability for your next shot um and it does have that 0.3 second cooldown much shorter cooldown um sweet like you can activate this a lot quicker than uh slide ways but we know slide ways is getting above in episode two that was one of the perks that they they highlighted so if that did drop with um with perfect paradox and say something like one two punch or trench barrel i'd be fine with that i'm perfectly uh happy with getting a slide shot but yeah field prep is the main draw um dual loader with this being enhanceable getting that additional on top of the additional round pair reload so you're reloading three pair shot that's perfect for a trench barrel because that's the the shots that you require which then has synergy with castile shadows um so like there's a lot of options here that i'm pretty excited with but field prep is the big like uh the one that's just my eyes keep drawing towards it when i'm looking at d2 foundry uh impetus what's your is there any perks here that you're you're looking for it's the role i've got when we just did our expert run of the encore mission before we start recording field prep one two punch hmm let's go but uh yeah i way way back when this first came out uh a little kind of uh story like what you were mentioning earlier with breach right breach light sorry um this was a shotgun that i used frequently a lot of the time i was a big shotgun i stand back in the day and this was the one that i would go to uh just just a solid shotgun the rapid fireframe is just the best floor pve um but i do remember do remember that quite uh fondly uh with uh with perfect paradox all right well i think it's time to talk about our newest newest oldest edition the one that dropped with act three here that would be martyr's retribution this was our first ever waveframe special grenade launcher back in the season of the dawn and this was our solar it was our first solar one of course waveframes are of course uh projectiles do release that wave of energy when they contact the ground you've probably heard about us talk them talk about them at the on the podcast by this point we're big fans of them they were changed a little bit so now that the um blast radius stand actually does affect the size of the wave i was not a concern in the original iteration of martyr's retribution so it's coming back with a a very different sandbox for waveframe grenade launchers and it's also coming back with a lot of competition so we're going to be taking a look at some very competitive uh peers here when we look at our stats we're going to be comparing this to undercurrent which is the arc uh waveframe from knife falls right now and then of course for barrence the the one and only the true king of waveframe grenade launchers also arc dropping in two different places because there are two different versions of it remember one dropping from onslaught and then of course the original forbearance dropping from the val the disciple raid so this will be martyr's retribution versus undercurrent versus forbearance blast radius all have 50 this is that change i was talking about so reminder here blast radius does affect the size of the wave mostly the width but also to an extent the length and the height here so they all share that by default on the velocity front very close here it's at 73 versus 74 and 74 for the two arc waveframe grenade launchers handling it is 65 versus 69 versus 70 and that's 65 for martyr's retribution translates to 0.37 second ready 0.38 second ads and 0.34 second stow speeds reload front 63 versus 69 versus 71 so the gap is starting to widen a little bit between forbearance and martyr's retribution that 63 translates to just over 2.16 seconds uh reload speed there ammo capacity for martyr's retribution specifically at base holds 23 shots with one reserve mod that goes up to 24 and then with two and three reserve mods that number goes to 25 now we do have field prep on this gun so with field prep either normal or enhanced it is 25 at all levels that's at base and then one two and three reserve mods as an fyi here so let's get into our barrels mags and our perks here again with explosive weapons you know you got to ask yourself are you team blast radius or team velocity here do bear in mind that blast radius does actually have a real impact on the wave so i think a lot of people that prefer blast radius will have a stronger argument when it comes to waveframes when we look at blast radius uh options here for column one volatile launch is going to give you plus 15 that'll take you up to 65 but it does come with a minus five malice to velocity and handling however those two stats are pretty high when we look at the rest of the stat package all together right takes your velocity down to 68 and then takes your handling down to 60 it's still going to be a snappy weapon and again the velocity you're still going to be able to shoot the ground pretty quickly with uh martyr's retribution with a volatile launch here you could also go confined launch that will provide a lot of stability which is not at all needed and it would hurt your velocity a fair bit here probably not the most needed thing um and then if we wanted an even smaller bump to blast radius linear compensator is just plus five to stability velocity and blast radius not the worst thing at all um but again you don't need any help to your stability and plus five isn't a tremendous bump so volatile launch i think is going to be everyone's top pick here for really affecting the the size of the wave through that plus 15 to your blast radius on to column two really easy answer here you do not want implosion rounds implosion rounds comes with a minus 10 to blast radius it is never the pick for wave frames now with the change to that blast radius stat you will always want high velocity and the good news is every drop of martyr's retribution will come with high velocity rounds so just pick that in column two and we're good to go to column three here's where things get great every single trait in column three is excellent for different use cases here i've already talked about field prep you know the benefit there from taking your total reserves up to 25 at any level you don't even need reserved mods with a normal field prep we've also got demolitionist threat detector heel clip auto loading holster and envious assassin there are strong arguments to make for a lot of the different perks here uh field prep i think auto loading holster and envious assassin would probably be the top three here if you plan on doing a lot of reloading we can also start factoring in heel clip demo in column three also could be quite useful um but again i think people are going to want either the extra shots the envious assassin can provide or uh no reloading at all through auto loading holster or just very high reserves and quicker reloading when you're utilizing field prep to its fullest extent if you are going for a heel clip if you're committed on taking advantage of that and doing a reload there is kill clip in column four and i think that would actually be probably the most natural pairing for a heel clip roll i don't understand the logic of trying to get heel clip to consistently proc on a wave frame i would much rather use something like aberrant action for heel clips and shenanigans so that is there if you want to do the double clip roll but again i don't think that's the strongest version of martyr's retribution we've also got strategist so you could do a demo strategist combination but i think what more people would want would be a demo adrenaline junkie combination and adrenaline junkie being in column four you've also got desperate measures incandescent enforpal weapon fellas i mean realistically it's going to come down to incandescent and then maybe what desperate measures adrenaline junkie uh for column four i think that's that's pretty much locked up for the most part by incandescent as far as being the only solar wave frame in the game to get incandescent of course our other solar wave frame all the way back from season of the chow no not chosen risen season other risen that debuted with which we had explosive personality that was our other solar wave frame had the land tank origin trade very very solid weapon but it didn't have incandescent so i think it loses out just on that fact alone but what are you guys going for in column three uh court you go ahead so i was actually looking explosive personality that is the last wave frame we read launcher that had uploading holster so we've come kind of 180 here where it's solar sibling uh we're kind of directly comparing to um but uh yeah so it's a lot of great perks in in column three um nonetheless column four with the weapons that we do cover we're like we're kind of stuck for choice here but in column three all of those are viable even threat detector is threat detector is probably the the quote weakest though it's not a weak perk i'm certainly not disputing its viability but like all all of these perks because martyrs is dropping right now and you could potentially get double perks you could roll something like a field prep plus envious in column three and just kind of swap between them um or you know something like all loading holster and heel clip in column four though yeah i think it's just a toss-up between incandescent or desperate measures for me um both have got uh some great confiability i put in the script here um a potential like combo builds here so it's demo plus whatever field uh fourth column perk let's just say like incandescent and we're going to be utilizing the origin trait here so it's a little bit like it's envious assassin with extra steps it's just a little bit different so fire your shot your initial shot throw grenade you get an edit you get your shot back uh fire that you do melee damage origin trait kicks in you get your shot back uh so there's no reloading uh required but because envious assassin isn't column three it's a bit like a bit redundant just with uh you can just lay out and get three in the magazine anyway um but you could combo that with desperate measures as well just with a nice little synergy um in terms of the origin trait though this is this a very solid weapon to get that because 20 percent of one is just one so you're you're always going to get uh a shot back from your from your reserves and if you've got field prep on you know you've got 25 all the time uh once you've got your your full uh ammo kit you don't um but yeah really solid uh st you you thinking of anything else here i know it's uh it's another weapon that sounds great though it sounds like an artillery shell almost you know coming out of the barrel of this thing it is is really nice i'm i am a sucker for auto loading holster and you know enhance you get that extra like point you know like quarter of a second off of there um and yeah if i'm going on a loading holster i'm probably going incandescent if i was gonna go yeah maybe threat detector with one of my other damage traits on there um and kind of like you've just said i'm not super keen on heal clip i haven't tried it yet i'm you know i'm willing to give it a go and maybe if you get lucky with like a reload speed master work you know you're looking at like 83 reload speed maybe i'd probably still be running up a loader mod oh my gosh let's there but i don't know i i just find auto loading holes are more appealing for a weapon like this so it's possible definitely give the clip clip role a chance just because it is something unique but haven't gotten one to drop yet so i'll definitely be spending some of my seasonal engrams and trying to get a better one of these things to drop soon classic gun comes back it's good we love it love to see that love to see that yeah classic one that was the og breach loading wave frame um when we've come a long way with wave frames especially one of them that we've talked about with that comparison uh forbearance and obviously we saw that nerf a few sandbox updates a go with specials no longer being the tearway that they are they've just been replaced with special sidearms but uh um yeah like this is a great uh weapon to try and farm for just a lot of great options here okay well i'll take our last pick here and that is line in the sand another classic weapon here a lot of these don't weapons just classic from from back in the the days prior to sunset and then they all disappeared and now we've got them back and it's really fun to see them back so line in the sand is our arc precision linear fusion rifles so remember precisions are your single shot um and they do have that intrinsic passive that's negative 20 percent recoil rio which equates to reduced horizontal recoil so we are going to compare this with a suspectum for fr that's our stasis episode one world drop that we covered a few episodes ago and laser painter which is our void option from gambit now there's not a lot of precision LFRs we've only had three which is including line in the sand since lightfall do remember that cataclysmic is also a precision it's we're not pairing it today we all know it's a very powerful LFR it's one of the best so i think we'll we'll give a cataclysmic a little bit of a break this time we'll just see our recent options so looking at our stats here line the sand versus suspectum versus laser painter so range of 29 versus 39 versus 34 sorry quite a large range for suspectum plus 10 over line the sand stability of 42 versus 40 versus 40 for 3 so a little bit close between the three handling of 26 versus 27 versus 23 and that 26 equates to a 0.46 ready speed a 0.37 ads speed and a 0.37 stove speed and over on the reload option sorry reload stat we've got 23 versus 25 versus 25 so it's certainly no stat monster here but you know for some of the stats here quite close and that reload of 23 equates to 2.44 seconds in terms of the mag size thanks very important highlights highlight this because there is a lot of kind of confusion when it comes to mag sizes especially for fusion rifles and LFRs so at base it is a five mag size with enhanced battery there's no change so it's still five with backup mag or normal slash enhanced reservoir burst which i'll come back to shortly here or ionized it's six and if you were to pair ionized plus backup mag or sorry ionized plus backup mag or enhanced battery plus reservoir burst plus backup mag and you get that seven so probably going to be focusing with ionized but i'm getting a bit of head myself so line of the sand the ammo capacity again other important factor to highlight for LFRs so at base it's 23 with one res mod it's 24 2 it's 26 and 3 it is 27 so yeah not exactly the stat monster um this is kind of uh if you haven't managed to get some great drops from our other precision LFRs if you can get one for lane of sand great but i know a lot of folks will be listening to this podcast wondering why aren't you just recommending cataclysmic well not a lot of people um play raids you know it's not uh uh you know not not a lot of folks can obtain that um pantheon is long gone so if you didn't get your your double what what'd you call it the not the enhanced version but the the shiny sorry yes a debt uh version for cataclysmic i wish they were shiny oh um so yeah not a lot of folks may have cataclysmic it's been in the game for quite a while now but uh yeah uh so calm one and two i can i think when it comes to LFRs probably still going to be recommending floaty barrel which is just your plus five stability plus 15 handling handling is a really great stat uh just with the nature of LFRs scoping in swapping two if you do get that floaty barrel that plus 15 uh it's uh kind of a change to your ready speed of 0.44 seconds uh your ads speed of 0.34 seconds and your still speed of 0.33 seconds so it's a small amount but it's certainly helpful when it comes to damage phases battery choices here uh ionized like i mentioned for the larger magazine or one of the coils perk now i think this is still the case i haven't read or seen any changes but uh LFRs are still uh when it comes to liquid coils and accelerated coils it still tweaks with your damage profile so just take that into consideration it's different for um regular fusion rifles they did tweak with that a while back but for LFRs this is still the case so accelerated coils for your dps option and liquid coils for total damage for comms three and four uh got a nice little selection um so right at the top we've got rapid hit we do have demo in comm three we've got climb cartridge also in comm three deconstruct i mean it's had quite a uh quite a wild lifespan considering it's quite a relatively uh new perk um i'm not too convinced with deconstruct you could make it work if you're using this for like construct shenanigans and know it got a nerf so it's not generating ammo or thin air it's now doing the regular uh pulling from your reserves it's just a lot of things going on with deconstruct that uh i just don't think is all that uh it's not my recommendation for an LFR climb cartridge though very interesting to see that now the reason why we're highlighting climb climb cartridge is because of reservoir burst when you overflow with reservoir uh with climb cartridge uh you will have the benefit of reservoir burst for that overflow magazine and remember reservoir burst gives you that um uh 25 25 increase damage and it causes enemies to explode in death uh explosions inherit hair weapons combatant damage scaling and it deals 30 increase damage if triggered with a linear fusion rifle we go over to mossy's fantastic spreadsheet when it comes to combatant damage scaling for LFRs let's see here um it's it's not it's not as great uh compared to say regular fusion rifles but it's still it's better than nothing you do get a nice little explosion bonus here you don't want those kind of explosions you're not interested in having an explosion build i think it's pretty fun to have uh you can go down the classic route of rapid hit or climb cartridge with bait and switch and remember you can take the advantage of the origin trait uh specifically for this you'll get two rounds if you're using an ionized but as we mentioned with the scout rifle this might not come into play unless you're using something like uh a much longer ranged melee you know thinking of strand hunter with their um with their uh the name escapes me uh the oh boy and i call myself a strand hunter it is uh thready spike there we go thank you um yeah so if you're using something a little bit more longer range you can exploit cast no shadows but again just with this being a longer range option it might not be the play now lads any other perks that i have missed out here now i do see volt shot as in column four but i think that's a trap perk i'm not too interested in volt shot yeah agreed it's a it's a bit of a trap there i mean yeah reservoir versus fun if you can get it with climb cartridge there could be something there um otherwise yeah it's got to be you know being switch and like rapid hit yep that's the role that i have you just look tight with all these rolls they can yeah dude no wonder if this is like i don't need to play anymore why you guys still playing you know i have just god rolls of every seasonal weapon dropping to your lap whatever what's the yep still not pinnacle cap but i have all the dawn weapon god rolls so man isn't this wasn't this one of the first weapons to ever roll firing line maybe it was the first weapon to ever roll fire we went this is before my dawn i can answer that i believe so you might be right because i know back in season of dawn this was quite so not as so after as martyrs but i know line the sand was like you have to get this because fire line was a big option let me just double check with our database here that's crazy i didn't realize firing line was so new well it also the only weapon from season nine that got firing line um it was not like they weren't in a great spot at the time so i remember people thinking this could be great right but lfr's were all the future pick yeah yeah uh so it's the second option we had sole survivor which is like classic gambit that was like reckoning um also debuted on a sniper first interesting hmm but yeah there it was well three three seasons after sole survivor we got uh firing line um and then another sniper we got seven serif saw the machine gun with the firing line that's when things started really picking up like oh firing line is actually you know quite viable or potentially viable for for some weapons so uh just scrolling like scrolling up the list and we've had tons of weapons since then with uh firing line um yeah now we're at a point with like critical anomaly gets firing line and we barely talked about it in the breakdown it's like well it also gets uh chaos reshaped and bait and switch so re-enchanting why doesn't automatically heal you that's what the what is this obviously i i mentioned at the top of this uh particular weapon review cataclysmic still going to be the go-to but you know some folks may not have cataclysmic if you're playing a lot of this season uh sorry this episode for some of these weapons you could get a double drop double per in comm 3 and 4 for this weapon and it would be perfectly viable we're certainly not seeing LFRs are topped here when it comes to damage they have had their their time in the sun so to speak when it comes to damage rockets and grenade launchers are kind of doing all that now but um for bringing into uh like a grandmaster or even a dungeon still viable like LFRs are all perfectly viable and you can link up with the uh the the surge if it's an art surge or if there's overcharged LFR i'd be perfectly happy bringing this in uh being able to land those shots i would like to get a client cartridge with reservoir bursts but uh i'm okay with like the traditional you know rapid hit bait and switch yeah i agree not a bad gun you know not in redefining but it's not bad and i think compared to so what what was the last set of weapons that were reprised in a season uh it was was it true what a time it would have been undying from last season yeah so how are we feeling compared to that set with this set i'm a lot more friendly towards done weapons i'm way more favorable i mean it's undying it's the worst seasonable everything's going to be an upgrade uphill battle the solstice weapons are an upgrade over the entire year but uh yeah great set uh love to see the reprisal of these weapons that we always ask for like these weapons to come back and you know i still waiting for that kindled orchids but uh i know i feel like this just leaves black armor here i just don't want to make your well i'll be asleep rice mason clan is going to be a huge aspect of next episode don't you guys know that well is fallen are you getting my hopes upright i don't know the lore here what does rasp mason have to do with uh no i mean i i'm trolling a little bit to be frank still a little bit trolling although the next next season is a fallen based season that is true it's maybe a episode so so we're getting the tangled short weapons no warden of law v3 baby come on oh no go figure dude yeah i know i know some people would be very excited for go figure but come on black armor wrong side of right we know that they only they only bring these weapons back when there is a narrative tie-in and it is so hard for black armory to have a narrative tie-in at this point now that uh miss ada is making my fashion even more fashionable yeah i mean you jolt about uh uh like um forsaken weapons coming back and you know i'm just looking at the list and it's like well it would make more sense since the black armor because next season there's like fallen slash scorn um oh yeah with the thick from all that the different weapons would i mean who wants an ether doctor or uh right side of wrong a trackless waist uh oh dust dust rock blues is there wow oh that's the lord pvp tearaway man sweet all right well i guess uh it's about it a bunch of weapons today a lot of weapons some pretty good stuff in there yes yes we now have all of our our episode weapons we have the full suite of our don weapons that they've chosen a reprise how are we feeling about all of the echoes weapons set let's start there first and then we can we've already given our thoughts on the dawn weapons i feel like so the echoes weapons now as a whole how are we feeling about that set it's a larger set compared to what we got during the seasons but it was spread out of course over a much longer period of time than the seasonal weapons how do you think it holds up there he's been one weapon at every act that i have been excited about minimal and i think that that's you know it's pretty solid start right there for act three i thought okay like just very early just thinking because all these were within the api so we knew what was coming but uh act three was the one that was least looking forward to but now that i've looked properly at spelio and kronofage i'm like okay these aren't bad at all they're like if you can get a nice little role obviously these are craftable but if you can craft those yeah i can have some nice builds but acts one and two those weapons were just absolutely crazy i mean aberrant action is i think probably the highlight um for act two and probably the rest of the episode but yeah i feel like we just need a race rifle buff at this point is yeah we're really going yeah yeah because we got the pulse rifle buff with uh uh curation um with our first or sorry joint first heavy burst yeah and i know why in curation or juicers i love those weapons we talked about loss signal at the start of this episode and yeah like i think maybe maybe they're waiting just to fill up this lot but uh i think that could do with that just a slight buff and i think i would use that quite a lot with uh with other kind of specials or just with other primaries um but yeah like i think we've had a really great set across the board big thumbs up ten weapons yeah it is a lot yeah ten weapons plus the dawn set obviously of course spread out over many months right broken up into three acts but it's a massive set again there are a lot of really high points aberrant action for sure curation for sure i'm sure time worn wafer will will prove to be one of the more dominant scout rifles with its buff but it lost signal of course you know brand new so yeah very uh i'm happy if this if this is the worst the episode weapon set is i think will be in a great spot right as far as keeping people coming back for each of the acts for the new stuff obviously the dawn weapons were nice to of course that helped people come back in and everyone was waiting for martyrs retribution to eventually return but yeah good good set of ten weapons um very much excited to see the scorn aesthetic for for episode two for revenant and i'm sure there will be some sick hive stuff for heresy great orange trade as well because i know when we first discovered these weapons i think we're not as positive i know we were not quite aware of its potential but i do recall is you know it's it's there the origin trait is there i know i definitely spoke about uh it's just an origin trait that works passively but now that we've dug into the the specifics the science behind it it is one of the kind of you know we're getting up there in the tier list it's uh it once you get going especially with the machine gun yeah that thing will be a tearaway all right well that will bring us to the end of episode 115 thank you so much for listening and thank you to our audio engineer auto didactos for his work behind the scenes as he has done for many many episodes now helping us sound slick and professional thank you so much next episode is gonna be a little bit interesting court of course is going away on his vacation so please send him some well wishes as he goes off and enjoys his time in a hot tub somewhere but uh saint and i we're not quite sure if we'll be back next week again we don't have uh any more weapons to break down right now and i think what we're kind of waiting on is a uh a sandbox preview is what they call it for episode two for revenant so if this next week's twob twib twib whatever that article that they publish on thursday if that has our uh exotic armor breakdown or exotic armor preview ability preview we'll probably get back together then next we can cover that information but um if not then there will not be in the episode and we will of course notify you if that's going to be the case either on thursday night or friday if it looks like we don't have enough to talk about so we will reconvene when there is more news to talk about but until then my name is impetus you can find me by that name in discord and a destiny uh getting god rolled on weapons and chugging away at my catalysts and my pinnacle power court work in our listeners find you watching impetus get all his god rolls from afar in a hot tub in in in the scottish highlands uh yeah you can find me over on the various social websites as court projects in the discord as court you can find my spreadsheets along with many other spreadsheets and documentation to enhance your destiny experience via the destiny spreadsheets link tree and yeah you can also find me in the middle of the scottish highlands in a hot tub listening to these guys hopefully next week if there is any sandbox changes because uh i did that last time and it was a lot of fun uh saying where can we find you yep you can find me studying for my javascript assignments and grinding for that damn dead gramory role that i just cannot get for some reason until then thanks for listening to another episode of pve [BLANK_AUDIO]
