The Jon Sanchez Show
09/03-30 year or 15 year mortgage. Which one is right for you?
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Little Beaten and Bruce, but, uh, surviving. You're smiling and I'm frowning today. You're smiling and I'm frowning today. Say it again? I think this week, right? Let's hope. Let's hope it's not a week. Do I? Don't jinx me now. One day was enough of this drumming. One day was enough. Yeah. Uh, and you'll understand, folks, what we're talking about here momentarily. Let's go over to Corey Edge of Edge. Really big. See how you do, my friend? I'm doing great. How are you doing? Doing all right. Doing all right. Good. All right, boys. Well, let's get down to it. We got a lot of things to talk about tonight. So, first and foremost, um, I want to give you a reminder because, uh, time is quickly approaching and it appears that our topic of our webinar is going to be just absolutely perfect timing. When we created our webinar that we're going to hold tomorrow night, um, we, of course, had an inclination that September was going to be a volatile month and boy, oh boy, has it started off that way. So, tomorrow night we invite you to join us and all you got to do is go to our website at Sanchez, wealth, management.com. Tomorrow night, 6.30 p.m. No charge to this. Jason and I are, of course, doing this for free, but we're going to be holding a webinar for you about the volatility and your retirement accounts. We're going to be covering a lot of things that are absolutely apropos, again, based upon just what happened today. We're going to walk you through strategies to help you secure your financial future even in these volatile markets. Yes, we do have strategies that can help you survive. Trust me. You're going to learn how to assess your personal risk tolerance. How to diversify your investments, how to establish safe withdrawal rates to make sure that your investments last plus we're going to help you create a contingency plan for those unexpected financial surprises. Those are just a few of the things that we're going to squeeze in tomorrow in our one-hour webinar. And then, of course, our favorite part is they're going to be the Q&A right afterwards. So that'll be 6.30 tomorrow night. Again, just go to our website at Sanchez, wealth, management.com and sign up for it. It's a great thing about webinars. There's unlimited amount of signups. We've got a ton of people showing up on this and we'd love to have you because, again, when we created this topic a couple months ago, it's like, "Yeah, you know what, September is always volatile month," and unfortunately, that's exactly what we are seeing happening. So I'll give you another reminder towards the end of the show to do that. But, guys, let's get into what our topic is going to be discussing tonight because, Dwight, as always, your market and my market sometimes work together, sometimes they work against one another. But this was a day where we had the extreme market volatility. We did finally see a flight to quality, meaning they bought the bonds, drove the yields down, can't wait to find out from you where the 30-year fixed mortgage closed at today, according to mortgage news daily. But let me tell you what our topic is going to be tonight. I was looking this morning, Dwight, and I noticed something that really garnered my attention. And this is what I wanted to have you discuss with all of us tonight. And that one item, again, is what is going on at this point when we see a 30-year fixed mortgage that is north of 6%. We see a 15-year fixed mortgage that is south of 6%. And I started thinking to myself, you know what, this is a topic we have not discussed in some time, and this may be the time that Dwight is advising those to take a serious look at a 15-year versus a 30-year. And especially since we're talking a pretty significant spread between the two, about 45 basis points, according to my calculation, based upon where the mortgage rates closed at today. And so, Dwight, is this a topic right now that people are starting to discuss with you? And of course, you're going to explain so many things about it tonight, how to run the calculations to determine, you know, basically the pros and the cons of how this is going to work. We've got about eight points that we're going to be covering. But talk to me about real life right now, and then I'm going to throw the same question to you, Corey, that we'll get to the stock market. Is this the time that we need to be looking at this? Well, John, it looks very delicious, doesn't it? But I think that the reality of it is, is that when you really break down the payment options, now we're going to discuss how much interest you're going to say, which will blow everybody away. But when you look at the payment, people are still struggling, and it's very tough for people to get into a 15-year fixed and be able to feel comfortable. So I mean, I think you're going to start to see it, especially now that, like you said, you saw it fall inside of the 6% range, I think it starts to come back on the table. I've seen time periods where the spread has been even greater between the 30 and 15. But it's always one that it's a fascinating topic for people, because they do ask, you know, what does a 15-year look like? And so, you know, the timing is good, it's always good, you know, because if you can actually afford the payment, you are living comfortably with that payment. Why not? You know, I mean, I had people- Right. Right. So, you know, which I think is about the lowest we can go is a 10-year term fixed. Yeah. But- Yeah, let me know. And I'm sorry. And I'm sure we're going to discuss one of your strategies you've mentioned many years or over many years, and that is, you know, you can take out a 30-year and turn it into a 15 or a 10, or whatever your cash flow can afford you to do. So another option. Yeah. Now, Corey, one of the points that we're going to be talking about tonight, and this is something I know you are a huge proponent of, and that is, of course, building equity as soon as you possibly can in your real estate purchase, whether we're talking primary or investment property, et cetera, and that, of course, is one advantage, assuming all things being equal, that a 15-year will offer you over a 30-year. Yeah. Assuming all the things are equal, and I go back to Dwight and I always defer to him. I really don't have this discussion too much with my clients, because we send them off to Dwight. You know, they do all the financial stuff. They figure out the payment-wise we go there. But when I do get the question, if it comes up a lot of times, it'll be from first-time buyers. And I always try to counsel them that, hey, if you're comfortable, great, but if not, you can always take out a 30. You can pay on a 15-year schedule, just like you just mentioned. And if something bad happens, you can always revert back. So we'll go into more detail on that. But sometimes that safer way is good in the beginning until you get established, and you know, okay, I'm going to have this job for an extra amount of time, and I can rely on this paycheck. Right. Right. Exactly. Okay. Perfect. And then you'll be able to get into the details with you and help you make that decision if a 30 or a 15-year is advantageous to you and your family. But in the meantime, let's get down to the stock market side. Let me get this motion going here, because what a day it was, guys. I'm going to take you back to this morning, and, well, actually, I'm going to take you back to, you know, yesterday, of course, with the holiday, you know, the futures were showing a bit of weakness yesterday afternoon as I began watching them, carried overnight, and they started to weaken simply because China did report an economic report that was weaker than expected. A manufacturing report, similar to our report that we received here at home, the ISM manufacturing report. So we had, you know, this data that was released out of China showing their manufacturing segment is slowing down. And then to add insult to injury, we had the same thing happen here at 7 a.m. this morning. So half hour after the market opened. All right. ISM manufacturing report. And remember, I won't bore you with all the details. Just remember, you want a reading of 50 or above, and that shows expansion in the manufacturing sector, the economy, a very important sector. Well, we didn't get that this, the reading came in at 47.2 here at home. Now, the good news is that this was August reading. The good news is July's reading was lower than that, the July's reading was 46.8. So it improved, but still showed the manufacturing side of the economy is struggling just a little bit. And whether you blame higher interest rates, whatever the reason is a slowing economy, whatever the data is the data. Okay. So that kind of set the tone for today. Then we began to move through the session and we started to really see weakness going on in regards to a lot of the major tech names, the Metas, the apples and so on and so forth. Everything was, you know, kind of holding on to its own when we shut up right after the open and then it began to fade and then it faded faster and faster and faster. And on our worst point, guys, we were down over 700 points. We went from, you know, north of 100 point gain to down over 700 points. So extreme volatility rebounded a little bit to finish with a loss of 626 for whatever that's worth. You know, I mean, lose seven, lose six doesn't, it still hurts. So what the heck happened here? Well, again, first of all, the manufacturing data. Second of all, Jason and I discussed this on the show on Friday. And this is why again, I encourage you to join our webinar tomorrow. We'll go into more detail about this. Even if you are a superstitious person or not, market in general is superstitious, right? That's why we have this thing called the stock traders almanac and so many other different pieces of information from a historical basis that institutions, traders, et cetera, look at. Well, as we mentioned on Friday, September is the weakest month out of the entire year. And you know, last four years, the S&P has lost. And depending on how far back you go, 1950, kind of as where the stock traders almanac goes to, you know, the majority of the time, September is a week month. And you know, it can be depending upon, again, what time period you look at, but you know, essentially, if you look at the last four years, S&P has lost a little over 2% on average over those last four years. Now, let's take into account, of course, we had the dreadful year of 2022. So that skewed the numbers just a little bit. So you wake up, we turn the calendar, we set a record close on Friday, right? We had a great month, we had a record close on Friday on the Dow, and then so what really changed today? So we had the PMI data here at home in China, then we have the September time period that we are beginning. Then we started to see, like I said a moment ago, we started to see the technology needs begin to roll over. And that acceleration just occurred throughout the entire day. Nividia led the group down 9.5% lost. The semi-conductor group had its worst day in a number of years, led by Nividia, one of the darlings, of course, of the last few years. Nividia finished down $11.37, a 9.5% loss. You can call profit-taking, call whatever you want. But then not long after the market closed, it came across the wires that Nividia got served by the Department of Justice for antitrust investigation. And it's not only Nividia, but evidently they served a few other semiconductor companies. So right now Nividia is selling off a little bit in the after hours down about $12.95 on top of the $11.37, so-called bucket-of-half further decline. But it was one of those days, guys, where we just did not have any real positive catalyst. And again, you can say profit-taking, you can say whatever you want, you can be superstitious and say it's September. Whatever the reason was, it was a tough day today. And I'll tell you what the rest of the market did. When we come back, let's turn it over to Kristen Snow. She has right now traffic forest, Kristen. Let's turn it back to the John Sanchez show on the stock 780K, which with a core age of edge-rility, Dwight Mallard of Guild Mortgage. We finished down, as I said, 626 on the Dow, a 1.51% loss with a closing level of $40,936. Then as they gave up 577.3.26% with the finish of $17,136 and the S&P 500 lower by 119 points are 2.12% to finish the day at $5,528. Well again, one of the other excuses, concerns of a global slowdown this surface today. So oil prices, they fell on that news, or I should say that rumor or concern, 4.3% loss on oil, 70/37 a barrel. Gold gave up $4.60, $2,523 an ounce and a big 7 basis point declined on the 10-year treasury out of the close of 3.84% on the yield. All right, Dwight, how do we do on the 30-year mortgage according to mortgage news daily? Yeah, so mortgage news daily on a 30-year fix has us down three basis points to $6.40 and to your point the 15-year at $5.93. I would argue, John, and I brought up several pricing metrics and the 30-year is probably slightly better than that, the $6.4. I'm going to say it's closer to the-- I'm going to say it's closer to the $6.3, maybe even a $6.25. So I think they're a little high on that, so that's the good news, but I like the trend. I mean, without your issue today, I mean, this was a good day for the mortgage market to keep these rates coming down. They're already starting to say and see that more people are coming out of the woodwork, so it didn't take much to start getting people-- Cori and I were talking about earlier, we had a conversation really, and John, I think that paying the right cost, you could get into the fives right now in a 30-year fix. I think we're still probably a good point in a quarter, maybe a point and a half away from really seeing the fruits of lower rates. We'd have to probably get down. I'm thinking five, five and a quarter on a 30-year fix to make it difficult for people to not-- What would it mean? You'd confuse me. What do you mean? Well, I think you'll start to see people move, they'll give up that 3% and that 4%. So I think it's got to come down to at least another point, a quarter, maybe a point and a half before you start to really see the impact of what you see as lower rates. Right now lower rates are just drawing people out that kind of hibernated, right, took a sabbatical. They're coming back out. But I think people that will sell it. I had an interesting conversation with a client today and that was-- now he's in the real estate business, so he's pretty sophisticated, but they recently sold a house and pocketed the profit. He bought it relatively low during the recession and then sold it now and then he and his wife had decided that they're just going to rent for a while and wait until, as he said, the next recession, which I don't know how you time that, but I thought that was interesting that maybe you're starting to see some people and they're one of those Dwight that had the 3% mortgage. So Corey, do you start to see more people talking about that saying, "Hey, you know what, I've made good money. I bought five years ago, 10 years ago, I've made good money and I'm just going to pocket it and I'm going to sit back and I'm going to rent a while and let the market calm down. You're hearing anything like that?" Absolutely. I've been mentioning that for a while and then there's people talking about it and the rates are going down a little bit as far as in the bond, but for a while there were people trading in that equity because they built up some nice equity. They could give it to you, they could put it in, see if these are some kind of mutual fund or something that's relatively safe. And if you sit down and do the math on it and say, "Well, if I'm going to get-- if I can find something that's going to pay me 5% for the next, I don't know, three years, five years, something like that," well, then what's the difference between your money being stuck in a house that's hard to get out of and something like that? Well, it's still the one up, so I don't think that's the worst move in the world and like I've always mentioned, you can only give people so much equity before they're going to grab it. It's like-- Yeah, you said that. I thought of you and he told me the story. Yep, that's right. That's right. You know, I don't want to pretend like, you know, this is kind of your world, but if I buy a dividend stock and I'm getting a 5% dividend, but the stock price keeps going down at some point. I'm probably going to tell the stock just to make the pain go away, so you know, if people think you've kind of met your threshold or you're at the highest, you're going to get it more close to it, then they're going to tap that equity. Right, right. And that's-- yeah, that's the-- I mean, I was like, you were a fly on the wall during that conversation, and Cory, that was exactly what their theory was, and we can't invest the proceeds because eventually they want to buy another house and you is-- I've emphasized you never, never, never want to invest your house proceeds. If you are going to be using it for another home purchase in the future, you never want to invest in the stock market because that's your safe haven money. So yeah, something like short-term treasury, CDs, things that really have no risk associated with them are a great allocation. And as long as these rates are higher, you know, 4.5%, 5% on a treasury, a CD, whatever the case may be, then yeah, not a bad alternative whatsoever, just to make sure you account for, you know, the interest that-- or the taxes you're going to pay on the interest, et cetera, and you know, consider that. But I just thought that was interesting, guys, and I just thought that was really interesting. All right, the 30-year or the 15-year mortgage, which one is right for you? That's what we're going to be discussing. We're going to go through about eight different scenarios. We're going to be talking about the monthly payment difference, the whites are on some calculations for us. Obviously, we discussed the interest rate. We'll talk about total interest paid, equity building, so on and so forth to help you make that decision as these spreads continue to be somewhat attractive for those of you. All right. Let's turn it over to Greg Neft. He's got news, traffic, and weather. Hey, Greg. Welcome back to the John Sanchez Show on his stock 780K OH, Dwight Mallard of Guild Mortgage and Coriage Evangelity. Joining me, of course, down 626 on the Dow, the Nasdaq Lost 577, S&P down 119, just a tough day to start the month of September. Give you the reasons at the beginning of the show. Quick reminder of two things. Don't forget, if you missed any of our shows, don't forget, you can pick up our podcast at any of your favorite local, national, wherever there may be podcast distributors. Speaking of local, we're going to host a local event for you in tomorrow night. Jason and myself are going to be hosting our worried about market volatility affecting your retirement. Yeah. The webinar free. Join us. 630 tomorrow night, September the 4th. Just go to our website at sandchizwealthmanagement.com and go through all kinds of great things. How to assess your personal risk tolerance, how to diversify the investments, how to establish safe withdrawal rates, plus help you create a contingency plan for those unexpected financial surprises. All that and much more tomorrow night, 630 PM, again, just go to sandchizwealthmanagement.com to sign up for our event. All right. 30 year versus a 15 year mortgage. Which one is right for you? If you just join us, right now the spread, according to mortgage news daily, as of today, about 47 basis points between a 15 year mortgage, again, at 5.93% and a 30 year, at 6.4%. Like Dwight said, that's 6.4, maybe a little bit on the high side. But we're talking nearly half a percent difference between the two. Now, before you go, oh my gosh, of course, the 15 years what I want, there's many things that you need to understand. And so we thought the best way to kind of get the discussion rolling and really understand is we're going to kind of consolidate our first three points, meaning monthly payments, interest rates, and total interest paid into one scenario. That scenario was this. I asked Dwight to run some numbers and I said, excuse me, give me a $700,000 mortgage. And let's talk about the difference in the interest rate. The payments, and of course, the interest paid over that loan. So you can kind of get an idea where the numbers sit. So Dwight, fire away. Yeah. So John, let's just take the monthly payment. So on that 700,000, all I did was took mortgage news daily average, 6.4 on the 30 year. And then the 5.93 on a 15 year. So the 30 year payment on that 700,000 would be 4378. On the 15 year term, it'd be 5880. So you're looking at a difference of $1,500 a month, John, in some cases, that's somebody's half their house payment or some people's house payments. So it's a pretty big difference, but it's manageable with the lowering of the rates. It's making it more, I guess, attractive to do that. Interest rates, as we discussed, according to mortgage news daily, we often refer to that because it keeps me out of that whole compliance, you know, now we can refer to anybody can look up mortgage news daily. But on that 30 year fixed, you're at 6.4 today. And then on the 15 year, you're at 5.93, almost a half a point difference. So you'll always see a significant difference in the payment as we talked about $1,500 plus interest rate, half a point, if not higher sometimes the spread can get higher. And then total interest paid. So here you go. This is where everybody wants to. This is where the rubber meets the road here, John. So on the 30 year at 6.4 on a $700,000 loan amount, you will pay $876,275 in interest. The same 700 on a 15 year at 5.93 is 358,500. So a difference of 517,000, 775 is the difference in interest that you would save between the 30 and 15. That's where everybody starts to focus in on, right, John? That's huge, right? I mean, imagine what you could, imagine what you could grow that savings to, right? You know what I mean? The challenge that way, a couple areas, John, is that I've only seen one client my entire year pay the full 30 years. So you know, but for number purposes, it's clearly demonstrates the amount of interest savings over the additional 15 year term. And if you're breaking down, there's another way, big numbers, big, big savings there. Thank you, Dwight, for one of those calculations. That's perfect. And another way to look at it if you go, "Okay, my gosh, another $1,500 a month, yes." Okay. If you can afford it, great, obviously you probably would want to consider the 15 year. But if you can afford it and you go, "Oh, my God, that's $1,500," especially those of you that are young, go get a second job, start a business, do something to bring in additional passive income because if you think about this, I like to break big numbers down into bite-sized pieces, as I call them. $1,500 a month is 50 bucks a day. Okay? I'm going to give you, I'm going to be kind of a smart alec when I say this, but I mean this in all sincerity. Go drive for Uber or Lyft or do a gig economy type job and make 50 bucks a day. You can do that and save yourself again, as Dwight said, $517,000 over the term of this loan. Okay. So that's up to you to make that decision. We just wanted to give you the data. Now, Corey, let's go to the fourth point, which is the equity side of things. 30 year mortgage, of course, you're going to build equity more slowly. It's going to be a larger portion of your interest is going to go to the payment, especially in the first few year. Dwight, what's kind of the cutoff? Let me interrupt myself. What's kind of the cutoff now, let's say on a 30 year, I don't have an amortization table in front of me, where the principal portion of the payment starts being larger than the interest portion. Is that used to be like around 10 years, doesn't it? Yeah, I think it's a slightly longer than that, John, but yeah, you probably got it being in at least half term before you start to really see it. I can see if I can bring that up. Explain to the audience what I'm talking about there, because a lot of people don't know about interest calculates. Yeah. So the balance is going to determine how much interest you pay each month, and so the higher the balance, more of that payment you make will go towards the interest paid out, you know, the interest on that loan. As you continue to chop away small, but consistent, as you continue to chop away at that total loan balance, then more of your payment will go to the principal rather than the interest. So most of your payment in the first three or three years or so, all you got to do is look at your tax statement, right? Your end tax statement, it all goes to interest very little to principal. So it's really important to, you know, and we'll go on the next point, but even if you choose to pick a 30-year, try to make an extra payment a year, right? It makes a huge difference. Absolutely. Other things you can do. Yep. And just the opposite, of course, a 15-year, you're going to build equity much sooner. Now, Corey, I was thinking about this a moment ago, okay, 30 versus 15, $1,500 a month difference in our example that Dwight gave, building equity, right? That's the key to successful real estate investing. And folks, your primary home is an investment. Yes, it's a roof over your head, but theoretically, it is an investment. You've put a lot of money into this thing. You hope in some point down the road, you're going to be able to cash in and make some money on it, right? That's the bottom line. But Corey, for those that maybe down the road, and hopefully in their financial plan that they have, down the road, they're going, "You know what? I really want to get into the real estate investment game. I'm going to buy this primary home. I'm going to figure out a way to come up with a little bit extra money each month so I can do a 15-year because I want to build more equity because in, I don't know, let's pick a number, five years, I want to go back to Dwight and say, "Hey, Dwight, I want to cash out a little bit of equity and go buy a rental property or maybe go buy a business." In other words, free up some of that equity to diversify my assets and create additional cash-full streams. Are you asking me if that's a good idea? Yeah. I think it's a good plan. I think you sit down and you look at all of it, right? You can do that. Again, I don't want to leap out of us, but you could do that by getting a 30-year loan and paying an extra $1,500 a month towards your principal. You could put $1,500 away and invest it somewhere. There's all different ways to do that. I can honestly say I've never had a client come to me and say, "I want to build equity as fast as I can." I know that it's not clear, but a lot of times they'll say, "Hey, I need the payment I can afford." A lot of people now will let the market force the equity on them, if that makes sense. I think back in the day when the markets were going up 3% a year as a normal thing, then yes, the fastest way to gain a big equity cushion was to pay down that debt because the equity cushion wasn't going up as much. These last, call it 15-20 years, you're relying on the market to push that equity up, so it really didn't matter what mortgage I had because the market was doing the work for me. Not to say it's the best way to do it, but yes, I guess on a basic math level, if you get the 15-year mortgage and you pay more out of, you're going to create that equity cushion faster, assuming the market stays flat over that same period. Well, even if it rises, you're going to have more equity than the guy that's got the 30-year, right? Correct. Yeah, exactly. Okay, perfect. All right, guys. Real quick, if you can squeeze this, well, actually, I don't want to squeeze this in. This is an important one. Both of you keep coming back to the financial flexibility, our fifth point, which is, again, turning a 30-year into a 15 without getting a 15. We'll explain that when we come back. Let's wrap it up with Kristin Snow in the right now, traffic center, Kristin. Welcome back to the John Sanchez Show, a new stock 780 KOH Show. Here's a little bit of good news. Check the futures market. And by all means, it is very early. Futures will start trading at 3 o'clock. Here we are at 3.53. Dow features up 9, NASDAQ's down 18, S&P's lower by 3. So it looks like things have calmed down, at least for the moment. Mr. Edge, can we get your phone number certain? 6736700. Mr. Millard. 2402022. Thank you, fellas. All right. We've been discussing that 30-year versus a 15-year mortgage. Again, we've gone over a lot of different things. We ran some different scenarios, different payments, interest savings, so on and so forth. Dwight, you have some additional figures before we move on to our next point. Yeah. You asked me at what point in time does the principal equal the interest payment that you're making the payment? So here you go, John. We said about 10 years, a little longer. So on a 15-year loan, you start your, you equal your principal interest at 3.4 years. So the 41st of all, which is not bad. Wow. And the 30-year, you ready, 231st month or 19.25 years will your principal and your interest be at the same. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Isn't that incredible? Yeah. Yeah. 3.4 years versus 19.25 years. Okay. Let's go over that again. When I asked Dwight to calculate, I said, yeah, I don't have an amortization table in front of me, but I wanted to see, you know, again, loans are, do I, are these still considered simple interest loans, mortgage is still considered simple interest? Yeah. They, they just, each month, they just look the low, the balance lowers each month and your payment is the same and you just keep, yeah, you just slowly chew it off. Yeah. So what I asked Dwight to calculate, which he was kind enough to do during the break, was again, tell us when, you know, the front portion of the loans called front loaded were it's almost all interest. And then what's the, all kind of called the break even point, not a correct term, but for our sake, when that principle equals the interest, and as Dwight said in, on a 15 year mortgage, 3.4 years, but on a 30, it's 19.25. So that means the first 19.25 years, you're paying more interest than anything else. You wonder why banks love lending you money because, you know, they're getting all that interest up front and, you know, and the odds are, as Corey has always said, and you've said, Dwight, you know, most people, what's the average length of time, guys, that people stay in the house, it's like 7, 7.5 years or something. So crazy. Yeah. All right. Listen. Yeah, I think it's gone up a little bit, but yeah, I think it's never near these terms, right? Yeah, that's right. So the 15 years, it definitely better play. That's right. All right. Real quick, guys, we got about 90 seconds. Financial flexibility is our next point, which is, as we discussed at the beginning of the show, the, you know, give the 30 year to, you know, keep that payment manageable if you need to, but maybe turn it into a 15 by making an extra payment or two. Obviously, I don't know the exact numbers, but to turn that into a 15 year, Corey, you like that strategy? I do like that strategy. And here's what I would recommend for everybody. We've talked about it before. Go online, get an amortization calendar, or calculator. They're everywhere. They're free. Yep. And so plug it in numbers and, and in your calculation, say if I make an extra $500 a month, an extra $100 a month, whatever it may be, one extra payment per year, and look at the whole schedule and see where it leads you and how long it takes to pay that off. If it may, how much you save, and you can keep the flexibility in case you lose a job, or something happens to go back to the minimum payment. Absolutely. Our six point, consider your long-term financial goals. You know, if you're going to retire in 15 years, you may want to consider a 15 year as an idea. Talk to your accountant, the tax considerations, of course, the interest deduction, and of course your risk tolerance. So, a lot of great things, but that's why the boys are the experts at what they do. Give them a call if you're trying to make that decision, Dwight, of course, can look at your personal situation as well as Corey. Good job, fellows. That's an excellent topic. Great job, but we will see you tomorrow on the John Sanchez Show. God bless. Have a great evening. Bye. Thanks. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks.