Hello, I'm Honor Baloo and welcome to the from the top podcast series where we have interesting conversations with interesting business leaders. And today, we're talking with Edgel Groves, who is co-founder and president of Pass Pass, whose mission is to keep every business in business. So welcome, Edgel. It's nice to see you today. Yeah, thank you for having me. Very nice to see you. Thanks for making time today. So tell us more about what you do. Right, so well, first of all, you and I just discovered that we live in the same city and we're not too far away. So that's it's actually pretty cool. Yeah, so pass pass. The easiest way to put is I actually like to tell a little bit of a story to lead into it. I started a media company with a business partner, friend of mine, who's also the co-founder of Pass Pass as well. But we had a multimedia company that had radio station and multiple podcasts and personalities. And we were struggling to find the proper partners and advertising and sponsorships last year. Even though that we had plenty of success, but we were looking for a way to scale it up. And so we thought, well, you know, we have a lot of followers and a lot of listeners here in Nashville. How can we provide more value to them? So we went out to a lot of the local restaurants and bars and tourism. We said, hey, if you guys could offer a discount into a marketplace, we might be able to get some members to pay a monthly fee to come into your business and patron and be part of a community here. So we built this thing called the Nash Pass. That was our idea to have a very like closed sort of cool club where if you have a Nash Pass, you pay $5 a month or $60 a year. But you get discounts to your favorite places around Nashville. And so we built that as a very just sort of stand alone business that sits on top of what we were doing at the multimedia business. And we launched it and it went really well. And we got some great feedback. But in particular, one of our vendors and partners in town here called and said, Hey, we really love what you're doing. Can we sell the Nash Pass to our customers on your behalf? And we got really excited. You're like, yeah, you said, well, of course you can. We said, how many, how many units do you think you could move? And they said tens of thousands yearly just from our one location. And that was a light bulb moment for us. As we realized, what businesses didn't have was a way to sell a membership to something larger than just their one location or their. So if you can co-op businesses together in a community together, they think they there's more value for the customer to buy into something as opposed to just a one time thing or just for one location. And so we came back to them and said, well, what if we give you a rev share? What if we give you a revenue share in perpetuity of every membership that you generate? And they said, well, yeah, that no brainer will do that. So when, when for us it's value to our customers, it's revenue for us that doesn't eat into our bottom line revenue. Nice. We went back to a bunch of other vendors and said, would you be interested in the same deal? And they all said, yes. And that was the moment we sort of pause Nash Pass and we go, this is a much bigger play. We need to build something that can support all these businesses. If we allow a a sort of global co-op community for businesses to sell a membership, which is a passive income stream that doesn't cannibalize their current income stream, it's just it just sits next to it. They can survive as businesses because they're bottom line. Everybody's having a tough time finding bottom line. So we built it out and we renamed it pass pass. And we have scaled since then to over 1000 businesses in the US, we have 1000 affiliates, which is sales affiliates in the US and we're relaunching in July as an application. So it'll be an iPhone and Android application and July 10 is our launch date. Fantastic. Congratulations. That's exciting. Yeah, thank you. It's interesting how sometimes these things not necessarily fall in your lap, but you just start putting something out there, right? You had an idea and you're like, you had a direction you're going in and then it became bigger than you expected, right? Without even kind of seeing that opportunity. That's exactly. Yeah, I feel like as a business owner, entrepreneur, you have to be ready to pivot and iterate at any point. And this was definitely one of the biggest pivots in my career because I come from the music industry and the music tech industry. If you had told me a couple of years ago that I'd be building a global discount marketplace that connects businesses with consumers, I would have said, I don't know what you're talking about. I don't know. Have any idea what you're saying? Yeah, that's funny. So what are the and I don't know if you guys have gotten as far things are moving fast, but what are your goals for the company same five years? Well, we looked at the addressable market, the total addressable market, and well, just in the United States alone, there are 33 million independent businesses, right? So this is the sort of bedrock of our entire nation. Without that, until I was building this business, I didn't really notice as I drove around or walked around the underbelly of our society. But once I started to notice, I went, oh my gosh, there are so many businesses and they all support the community without the dry cleaners or the bowling alley or the pizza place in the corner. Like, what do we really have? We're all kind of just stuck with Walmart and Target, which is that's a terrifying notion in itself. So we looked at that and we went, well, okay, we're never going to run out of businesses that we can help in the United States alone. So our goal is to really keep going, keep putting deals into our marketplace that can drive consumers back into the doors and the websites and the brick and mortars of these businesses and help them find more customers, more revenue, and help them build a closer relationship with them. So each business that signs up with past pass, they sign up for free. We never charge them. There's no SaaS fee or platform fee. We essentially just go, look, you can put a deal in here. And if people want to come in and claim that deal, they can do that. And we give them a dashboard. So anytime somebody comes in, they claim that deal or they sign up for past pass on site through that business. They also have that person's information so they can now deal directly with them. So the plan for us really is to say, let's keep this going as long as we can. You know, we're not trying to take on too many overlords too early on and have people tell us what to do. If we can run a business that runs itself and it's cash positive and we can just keep going and expand this into other markets, into other countries, other territories, that's our vision. And that's again, why our mission statement really is keep every business and business. We're not here to just turn this thing around, flip it in two years and sell it and go, well, good luck with your business. You know, we really do think that our mission statement is probably one of the most powerful ones that we've seen in a long time. Absolutely. I mean, I think it's it's very ambitious to have a mission statement like that, right? To keep every business in business. And so it shows what's important to you guys. You know, it's not just about making money. It's about helping these businesses. And even it's kind of like, you know, eat local, the things that people talk about now, buy local, things like that. It's helping a lot of local locations, right? Across the country. That's super exciting. Yeah. Thank you. So, um, you've been you've done different things in your career. What would you say is one of the biggest learnings that you've had in life or business? Well, that's a great question. Uh, I, so I started off in a band. Let's start there. I left college early, started a band, got a record deal and hit the road and played 200 days a year for, you know, the better half of 10 years. And I never thought I would leave the music industry, but I eventually got out from behind, like playing the guitar, the drums, and I started a record label. And with a business partner, friend of mine, and that eventually got sold to a larger company. And as part of that deal, I was able to go work for a major record label. And I moved to Los Angeles, never thought I'd move there, moved out there. And I was so used to the old school music industry, meaning, you know, you would sell physical records or vinyls or whatever it was. And that's how you did it. You toured and you built a an organic fan base. Well, just about as soon as I landed in LA within two years, the entire music industry flips into Spotify and SoundCloud and the digital streaming services, which I never really saw coming. In a way, we did, because we saw Napster early on, and we saw that. But there was a point where even in that moment, I realized, oh, you don't know what's going to happen. Your job is not safe. The way you see things is not safe, and you're going to have to learn how to be okay with changing your worldview. So in 2015, I started my own company again, I left the label, and I built something with a few business partners that was it was great, and it was all based around streaming. So around Spotify, and the whole, that whole agriculture that was building out. And that company ended up getting absorbed by SoundCloud. So once SoundCloud absorbed that company, I was able to go in and really see the underbelly of a very large, very large sort of music streaming service platform. And it was my first foray into subscription, like truly understanding subscription applications and building a subscription business to consumers. And so we had tens of millions of paying subscribers on SoundCloud. And understanding how that tech is built, understanding how the product is built, the engineering, and what it takes to really sort of manage those teams, and then manage the sales teams around that, and the monetization that supports that. That, to me, was the biggest learning. Well, look, you can think you know one thing, but once you get into another sector, these things are all sort of connected. And I think it was a blessing for me to see what it was like to be at a company that big that was building subscription revenue, because I didn't know it would serve me later in what I'm doing now, which, you know, subscription is subscription. And knowing how to build that out is not an easy task. So I would say that was probably one of the biggest moments for me is not knowing what I was getting into, but then looking back and going, "Thank God, that happened." Well, you seem like a person who sees opportunities, and you know, you're kind of a serial entrepreneur. Have you always sort of felt that full to kind of do your own thing? Absolutely. I have a tough time with authority. Not in the bad way. I love mentorship, and I love being in business with people, and I love having business partners. But I also love being the tip of the spear. I think that is what I am best at, is identifying something, building something, and taking it from zero to 10. And that is, that's what gets me out of bed. I'll be honest with you, I've never been one to just fall in line. So that's a yeah, you're spot on with that. Yeah, I can see it. And I can see, you know, all the passion behind that too, you know, especially when you have something that you believe in, right? So for you, music obviously was important. That's something you believed in now, kind of helping businesses. It's got to be a good feeling and sort of feed you, it seems. It is. It is. I think a lot of people strive to find purpose, and it's very difficult for them. And what I usually tell people is, "Purpose doesn't hit you. You have to go find it. You have to go looking for things and be unafraid to turn over rocks, meet new people, try new things." And if something doesn't work out, you can't get down on yourself, you have to just pick up and go, "That's fine." Well, what's the next thing? How does that lead into the next thing? And usually purpose is built out of that. If you're waking up every day with the idea that you want to, you know, leave people better than the way you found them, which is what my good friend Mike says actually works with me. I mean, that's his mantra every morning, five minutes, "Leave people better than the way you found them." I truly believe that that, that is how anybody can find whatever purpose it is. Yeah, I think you're right. Some people really struggle with the word purpose. It's like almost overwhelming. I don't know what my purpose is. I don't, you know, and it's interesting. I love your thought process about sometimes you just have to try something. And if it doesn't go well, you're going to learn from it, right? If you pay attention and you have the right mindset, you're going to grow from that, you know, failure is, is, you know, the scary effort for a lot of people. But if you look at it in the right way, you're going to learn from it and you're going to do better. So I love that perspective. I like that too. I mean, what about you? Is there, is there something that you really strive for every day, something that really, yeah? Well, as I mentioned, when we talked previously, I work with CEOs, groups of CEOs, and I, you know, I love helping them sort of find the answers that they need. I mean, obviously people are CEOs because they're problem solvers. But a lot of times, it can be lonely, right? That's why they say it's lonely at the top. So helping them have somebody be a sounding board for them and just kind of lowering the anxiety sometimes and the feeling of loneliness and helping them see that there are other people, you know, put them in a room together and they kind of look across the table and go, Oh, there's somebody that has the same pressure that I do, you know, the weight on my shoulders. And it's somebody to talk to that kind of gets it because it's hard to find somebody that really gets it the pressure of being a business owner and unless you are one, right? That's a really, really nice thing to hear. I think that can be easily overlooked is also how it affects your personal life. A lot of people that people understand when you're running a business or you're starting a business, it's easy to overlook your personal relationships, your friendships or for those people to feel like you're not giving them enough attention or you're not, you're not, you know, heating to their needs and it's not personal. Sometimes it just needs to be brought to our attention or we need somebody to help sort of refocus us. Because look, it's in our DNA. It's very hard to balance those things. It doesn't come naturally to just balance all the things all the time. We're usually very focused. Right. You have to be aware and intentional. Yeah, just like finding your purpose. It doesn't just happen, right? You have to make an effort and work toward it. But like you said, if people don't tell you, you're so focused on whatever it is you're focused on, especially if you're starting something new, there's so many things to think about. If somebody doesn't bring it to your attention, then you might miss it, right? And so I think in helping others realize it's not personal, it's not purposeful either, right? I didn't realize that was happening. So just open communication is always a good thing, right? It is. It is. So I'm kind of similar to what we've been talking about. I've talked to a lot of people and everyone seems to define success a little bit differently. How do you define success? That's changed over time. Success used to mean people really responding well to whatever you're building and getting a response that makes you feel good from people. And then if you could parlay that into that response that makes people feel so good, also makes you a bunch of money and a bunch of money means you get to have all this freedom and independence and then you can go do whatever you want. I think that was the original definition of success. But I think success to me now, just in the past few years, would be defined as doing something that I know is creating change, that I know is doing good, that I know will affect people whether they realize it or not. And I get to go to bed at night knowing I did something great. And if that happens to make money and I'm comfortable and I don't have to worry and I can have a nice work-life balance and family balance, to me that's success and of course having my health, right? That's paramount. But I think the definition shifted, right? Sometimes it's about attention and accolades and all these other things and then one day you wake up and go, "My goodness, if I can just build something meaningful that's going to last a long time and change people's lives." And at the same time, my life becomes balanced and a little bit more pure each day. That's success because who wants to wake up when they're 70 and go, "Look, I have all these things I've accumulated but I'm lonely and nobody cares about me." Yeah. And that's one of the reasons why we talk about these things, right? Because again, if you don't shine a light on it, what is success, then you might go down the wrong path. And if you're not aware of the path you're going down, like you said, you wake up in your 70s or so and you look around and you're like, "What have I been doing with my life? Has it been worth it? Has it really ended up the way that I thought it would?" Well, that was one of the reasons to leave Los Angeles. I was there for nine years, almost ten years and I found that the sort of paradigm in that city was chasing the stuff that sort of leads nowhere, the pot of gold in the rainbow. And I wasn't meeting a whole lot of fulfilled or happy people. And I realized it was just a cultural thing. And I'm not everybody, of course. I'm not making a Blake statement, but it was just part of it. And I thought maybe it's time to go somewhere where I could center myself and find a sort of, find a new path and new purpose and moving to Nashville as definitely assisted in that. I mean, I'm from Atlanta originally. So I'm from the south. So coming here was kind of coming back home, but it was the right move. It was definitely the right. Yeah. Yeah, I think Nashville is a special place. I've been here about five years and it's a warm and welcoming, but vibrant city. Yeah. Where are you from? I don't think I know that. So grew up in Oklahoma, lived about 20 years in Dallas, eight years in London, eight years in Michigan, and then Nashville. Oh, wow. It's been fun. It's been fun. But we love it here. Yeah. So saying on the subject of success, we can't talk about what success means to you. Who comes to mind when you think about success? Hmm. That's a really good question. Who comes to mind when I think of success? Boy, that's a loaded question. I think of all different types of people. Hmm. Kind of stumped me there because I usually have a very specific answer, but I've also again, started to rethink that recently. Yeah. Yeah. You know, clearly, somebody like a, you know, Elon Musk is clearly successful. He's very smart. He's built a lot of great companies that have helped humanity for the better. And I think there's a lot to learn from people like him. There's a lot, there's a lot of lessons as a CEO or as a president or a founder that it's hard to find elsewhere just because he's done it at the highest level in so many different places. Yeah. And made a lot of mistakes along the way too. So, you know, like you said, success can be defined as the people who made all these mistakes, but they're not failures. They just made mistakes and they got better and they got better. I definitely see him as one of those people. I also see, you know, somebody like a Joe Rogan as one of those people, right? Like, regardless of beliefs or political beliefs or where you stand on anything religion, I see somebody who started a podcast because they just wanted to start a podcast and they didn't know what it was going to do. You know, he talks about this. He goes, I didn't think this thing would ever make any money. I just did it because I wanted to talk to my friends and I wanted to have open conversations and it was like 15 years ago, 16 years ago, he just started it. And here he is, you know, the biggest podcast in the world and he can get anybody he wants you to sit down and talk with him and for better or for worse sometimes. But I think to me, that is all some success. You know, somebody who just followed their nose, they did something because it felt right to them, felt good to them. And they didn't have this gigantic plan to take over the world or manipulate this or manipulate that. It was very much just a I'm just going to do this because I feel like it's the right thing to do. And in a lot of ways, the universe rewards that. I truly believe that. And it took him took him in the right direction. Right? It did. So there we talked about you always sort of felt that entrepreneurial pull. What advice would you give to a young entrepreneur who's thinking about starting their own business? Ooh, try a lot of things and educate yourself on a lot of things. You don't have to go to college for this stuff. I mean, there's online courses, there's YouTube, YouTube University. Know how to do a lot of things is number one. So teach yourself about AI. Learn basic coding. Know enough about how to build something very, very basic. Again, you can learn that in two or three months. Learn graphic design. Open Canva and figure out how to make something look semi beautiful. Know how to make a pitch deck. Know how to make the I mean, speak the language of an entrepreneur first. Know how to craft a proper email. That sounds really simple, but know how to write an email. Know what's too long to it. TLDR, as we call it, too long didn't read. Yeah, read it because you're overselling and the bounce between that and something too short. I would start there. And then lastly, I would say, if you are good at sales, you will always have a job. So whether you're a CEO or you're just an entry level sales person, if you are good at sales, you will always have value in the marketplace no matter what happens with AI or technology. People need people to go out and get things done because we're still people. And I've never met a great sales person that was jobless. I've never met one. I love I love the specificity of your suggestions. I think that can really be helpful to young people who are got an idea, but they don't really know where to start or what to do. I think that's really helpful. So thank you. And I love your advice about sales because I talked to people where sales is still kind of a dirty word, right? Well, I know I don't want to go to sales, you know, but the reality is is that everybody sells, right? It's a skill not just for salespeople, right? Yeah, I think the better word for it is relationship building. That's really what it is, right? What you want to first date with somebody in your mind, you're thinking, I'm trying to start a relationship because that's the language we use. But really, both people are selling. I'm selling myself. They're selling back. If we use that language, you go, Oh, I'm going to go on a date and sell myself. That's weird. That's really what's happening. And I think even with past, past and in a few months, we've been building our marketplace. If you really take a look at the businesses that are most excited to be doing this with us, it's relationships. We built the relationship. Yes, of course, we sold them on the idea and the vision and the passion, but they they trust us and we trust them. There's something a little bit deeper there because we want it to last. You want these things to last. You can't, you know, this idea that sales is dirty. It's because we're used to this. Get them to the sale, get them to give you some money and then poof disappear. Right. That's the idea of sales to people. That's not good sales. That's actually really bad sales. Great sales is you build a long lasting relationship so that it's mutually beneficial for a very long time. Yeah, great. And I think that too many sales people have given sales a bad name, right? But I think what you said, if you focus on building the relationships, that's a lifelong skill that will always serve you. Absolutely. Well, thank you so much. Is there anything agile that we haven't talked about that you'd like to share? I will say this, every business in the US right now can sign up for pass pass for free. Go to pass pass dot com. Register your business. We're launching in July and if you are an affiliate or if you are somebody who wants to earn passive income without having to worry about having a day job or clock in, clock out, you can refer businesses into pass pass and earn a really meaningful income with us too. Again, doesn't call affiliates to register either. There's no buy in or buy out. So at the end of the day, whether you're a business or you're just an independent person who wants to earn passive income, we've set it up so that either way, there can be a recurring income stream. And so I would just urge anybody who's listening to this to go to pass pass dot com, read the literature, watch through some of the videos and register yourself for your business. All right. Fantastic. I'm excited for this new endeavor and I'm excited to see where it goes. And since we're both in Nashville, we'll stay in touch and I'll get to learn about it firsthand. So thank you so much for making time to be here today. And I look forward to staying in touch. Yeah, thank you very much for having me. I enjoyed it.
