[MUSIC] A shot taken by Riley deflects wide. Barners back to that. Centers in front Tavares can't pull the trigger on it. Hook free and there's the horn. So it was too little way too late for the Maple Leafs. The Boston Bruins come in here and play an exceptional road game. [MUSIC] And beat the Maple Leafs by a score of four to one despite being out shot 33 to 30 on the game. >> They're a premier team in the league, every night you play them, it's gonna be written for a tough night. Up to our start, so we can get a lot of them to scoring chances when it takes time to generate chances against this team. They don't make many mistakes. So you gotta really earn your opportunities and I thought we had a good process in place to do that. We had lots of time in there, half the ice, as I said, we earned a power play. And you know, power play struggled to get in on their entries, which created some little bit of frustration there. And then they take it to us, you know, they get momentum off of our power play with their short handed chances. And then I thought they grabbed the hole with the game. [MUSIC] >> Van Morley, Joe, sports at 5'9 in the van. >> Van Ennis, Brian Gunning. >> And I would just like to start the show. >> Yeah. >> Well, one by saying good morning. >> Thank you. >> And two, you were going to do something else? >> Yeah, I was going to say, I'm sorry. >> Because so much has gone right for this Leafs team over the week that I was away. And I returned and yeah, it wasn't like they got their heads caved in for 60 minutes. But that is good as they had looked certainly on Saturday against the Rangers team that they needed to shoot out to beat. But good morning, good to see you buddy. I know you were back yesterday. Matt Marquesi, both of us on vacation. >> You looked tanned and it is like a little bit of maybe a color difference? >> I was like the scene of my family grouping ourselves in sunscreen of more SPF more, more. So yeah, I didn't play around. I got a little burn on my shoulders and that was that. So I had a big sun hat on the whole time. That was my like dad. >> My god, the biggest disappointment of the trip, which was great. And an overall sense was I brought, I had one of those big sun hats that I tried to transport. I bought it in Mexico last year and was able to somehow get it home in one piece. And I was like, all right, you're going back on the road. Didn't make it like literally, it looked like my seat on the airplane going down to Miami. Looked like it was like the floor of a barn because there was just straw everywhere. And it was like the people getting on the plane as we were departing, they just saw it disappointed me shove that thing into a garbage can to start my vacation. So it didn't have the big straw hat. >> I would have laughed to have seen that. The thing that saved my saving grace was that it was a extremely floppy Blue Jays giveaway day. That's why that thing could, I'm pretty sure if I wanted to, I could roll it up into a ball and like stick it in my sock and it would just pop back to exactly the no form that it has. Honestly, I mean, I spent a week in Jamaica with it. So yeah, like frozen margarita proof, saltwater proof and lots of other things. But yeah, it was fun. >> Well, glad to be back. Big week to be back trade deadline on Friday. Lots of leaf conversations to get to today and the rest of the week. But like I said, it's not as rosy as it's been for the majority of the last week as the Leafs cannot follow up their victory against the Rangers with another one. The first of two this week against the Boston Bruins yesterday, they lose four one. They've now lost all three games against the Bruins this season, although that was the first in regulation, Brent and like the overwhelming sentiment, the hive mind thought around that game. >> Yes. >> Yesterday was see, there it is. There's the blueprint. Look at, look at how the Bruins are gonna beat the Leafs in this first round series yet again, not allowing their superstars, the freewheeling space that they so desire, they're gonna lock it down, come the postseason. And that's, you just saw it, you just saw the 60 minute recipe to beating the Toronto Maple Leafs in the playoffs, to which you would say, kinda, there's some element of that. I think Bonesy said it in the final call that we played to start the show there. That was a good road game by the Boston Bruins. That is, if you're gonna beat the Leafs, they're a million ways to do it. The Leafs are not some perfect team that there is only one way to beat, but that is certainly a way to do it, but I don't look at that game last night as well. You play that seven times, the Bruins are gonna win five of them, or something along those lines. It was to me a pretty even game. I thought the Leafs took it to Boston for parts of it and, you know, it's not, I'm not, I'm not, will have plenty of time to talk about goal attending today. I don't think that was the reason for it, but one team got some stops. The other team had, was able to take advantage of their super high danger scoring chances. I mean, the one that gets blasted by Walls Glove, it's like, I'm not gonna kill them on that one. So I look at it and say, yeah, there's an element of that is how you beat the Leafs. They say you beat a lot of teams. Now go play that game every night, Boston. Can you do that? You're some perfect infallible team that that's kind of, that was my, that was my takeaway to the hive mind takeaway. Yeah. No, to me, it just cracked me up. I was like, well, see, look, just get the better goal attending performance, win the special teams back. Well, yeah, of course. Like, clearly. And yeah, the Leafs power play needs to look a lot better than it has. Coming like since Morgan and Riley returned to the top unit as they are now one for 14, or one for 13 with the man advantage after reasserting themselves is one of the best five on four units in all of the national hockey league. Yeah, no, like get the better goal, technical performance, have the more desperate team, which it's like, it's hard to ignore that. And I know, hey, these are measuring stick games and it's the Bruins and it should, your eyes should light up at these midweek games and the two that come up, especially considering where you were in the standings and go to the front row. They were right there. They were both plus 34 going into yesterday's game and a win yesterday would have put the Leafs four points back to the Bruins with two games in hand, get it. But the Leafs have played exceedingly well recently had a big victory against yet another original six opponent on Saturday and the Bruins were embarrassed on the weekend by the Islanders and their head coach was not freaking out, but certainly had a little bit of a different tone around his team than Sheldon Keefe had around the Toronto Maple Leafs. So to take some grandiose lesson from that 60 minute hockey, I'm not there. Yeah, can the Leafs lose to the Bruins in the first round? Of course, there's not a single team on God's green earth that they're going to match up against in April where you're like, well, I feel great about that matchup, but I will tell you, I'm not scared of that Bruins team. No, I think, I think you nailed it that if you're scared of them, it's because of was, let's say one guy, but it's two guys because you don't know which one it's going to be. It's who's between the pipes on any given night. They've just found a way to have until last year against Panthers, right, this is the thing. But you can't just like skip over that. No, no, I'm not. But that is, I think the unlike here in Toronto, where I think we have two guys that we can certainly talk ourselves into feeling comfortable about, but we've got to do some talking to get ourselves to that spot. You look at the track record that those guys have and yeah, fell apart in the post season last year, but if I'm going to sit here and talk about this leaf team for the better part of five years and they've had their chances and I don't think you can look at it just a seven game sample. I don't think Boston's goal to do is going to fall apart again, but that is the one thing that I think they do have the clear advantage on is McAvoy, a better defenseman than anything the Leafs have. Yes, of course. But when I think you just look at forward group, give me the leafs, yes, yes, yes, please defense core. Look at some of the bodies that were playing for Boston last night, I'll take the Leafs, but goaltending matters so much. And again, I don't think the Leafs lost that game because of their goaltending last night, but it was a part, it was a big part of the reason why Boston did win. Yeah, I think if we're going to talk about the goaltending and you're right, like, hey, they have the guy that didn't even start yesterday win the Vesna last year, but like, I almost view that as a negative as opposed to a positive because Swamans haven't the better year, but yeah, I think we go back to the seven game series against the Panthers last year, it was like the, the, the lack of certainty in a goal and who's going to start and Swamans getting his first start of the series in game seven, right? And, and allowing four goals in that overtime loss to the Panthers and a Panthers team that, yeah, in retrospect, we have to view differently because they went all the way to the Cup final, but in the moment was like, oh, well, I mean, there was no bigger favorite in the first round of the postseason last year than the Bruins, Florida Panthers. And I know Jeremy Swamans numbers look good. They don't look great in a very limited sample in the postseason. Just one relief appearance before the game seven and game seven, allowing the four goals against the Panthers. I mean, the Leafs do have, and it wasn't the guy in goal yesterday, and we'll have a conversation about the decision to, to start Joe Wall in that game as opposed to Ilya Sampsonov coming off the incredible performance on Saturday. They do have a guy that just outdo all the future Hall of Famer in the first round series in Andre Vasilevsky. And another guy in Joe Wall, who in his first foray into the postseason, acquitted himself pretty nicely. It wasn't the reason the Leafs lost in the second round of the Panthers. The reason was the none of the core four guys scored. I don't look at the goal tending as being a major discrepancy. In fact, I know this is silly to talk about a team that has had like such a small amount of postseason success, by which I mean one. Literally once. Yeah. Yeah. That's more than the Bruins have had over the last couple years. And with this goal tending tandem, it's it's more than they've had. Yeah, it is. And I'll just throw my favorite thing in there. David Pasternak, who's never won a damn thing. Yeah, he's lost in a cup final, but wasn't around for the one that they won. And to your point, like, yeah, that group made it to a cup final. But since then, and again, we'd all kill for since then, it hasn't been the same thing. When I look at the kind of compare and contrast to the two groups, I guess the way I look at it is, I think the leaf ceiling in terms of goal tending, not not teams at all. I'm just drilling down on the goalies here. I think the ceiling for the Leafs is as high if not arguably, maybe not. It is as high as what Boston's capable of producing. I just think those guys have a much lower or sorry, a much higher floor. The Boston goal is given. Well, we've seen Ilya Sampsonov look like exactly like Joe wall. The floor for him is high. The problem is it's like occasionally a joust gives out. And then I think that's what they call them in flooring. I don't know, a choice. Like I like in building a house, like a joist across the. Oh, it's like one of those caves out then because he's heard all the time. This is what I'm trying to get at. Okay. Okay. How about like a foundational like pillar? How about a pillar? Sure. Pillar. Pillar falls out. Yeah. I don't follow it. Yeah. Let's just move on. Joe wall. He has a high floor as long as the floor is healthy is what I'm trying to say. As long as there's no hole in the floor. Yeah. No, the floor is really high. You just hope that you don't fall through it. Yeah. And then Sampsonov is he he is the ultimate highs, the ultimate low. I think to your point, if if I just tell you right now, though it is it is the middle of April and Ilya Sampsonov has outduled both of those guys. I'm not I'm not shocked. Not not put money on it either. I think that's the difference. I was just feeling in floor of the two groups. You're not putting money on any part of the Leafs being better than any other part of any other team in the postseason because we've seen it happen. So I mean, we're we're we all know what we're watching here. Yup. That makes sense. And listen, I love to defend the fans and you can do whatever you want to pay your money. Oh, okay. It's got to be good. I can't wait to see where this is kind of amusing to see the Leafs getting booted in their own barn in the third period trailing the ruins. What? Three one at the time or maybe it was for one when when the boob birds started showing up in the third period. I mean, this is a team that's played exceptionally well. And it's not it's not like, Hey, the Morgan Riley winning streak with him sidelined because of the suspension, where you can look at the soft underbelly of the schedule. It's like, Oh, no, they beat the champs twice and the avalanche in there. And I know they've returned home and like, yeah, didn't go nearly as well again. But so like they've and then they just beat a really good Rangers team over the weekend that they've beaten twice and every time's over the season. I get it. Like the Bruins games, I guess, are different. That's it. That's it. It is. That is all the proof you need that that's still the Ross nerf for at least the segment of this fan base that gets in the building, right? Because there are a million different segments of the fan base and certain people hold different things sacred, whatever. But I think that is proof positive. This is pick your other pick your other contender. If let's say the Rangers game goes that way. I don't know that it's happening. I mean, they'd be booing, Rempay and Reeves for not that fight again. Do it again. Give us something to be happy about. But I think that that is the reason why you see that is because it is still the Ross nerf. It is still with the lightning kind of, you know, aging out of being the beast of the division. I think Florida. I mean, quite honestly, the way the schedule just works out where you don't see these teams for months on end. And then they play them two, three times in a week. I think that's what leads it to it. But Boston is still clearly the Ross nerf. It's the one where the emotions are. They shouldn't be because it's not the most fresh. It's the least fresh of all of these got to play off rivalries that the Leafs have now. But it is still the one that kind of packs the most punch. And sure part of it is Marchan. I'm sure part of it is that you got to hear about how perfect this organization and culture is. And they're kind of the antithesis of everything the Leafs have been. They've been able to keep a core together forever. And guess what? Continue to do good things with it. And the Leafs, they're able to keep a core together for what? To win one playoff round so far. So I think that's that's why you see it that way. And just it's the aftermath of the chara and the, I don't know, maybe this just me. It's like a close my eyes. Can hear Jack Edwards screaming at me about the underbelly Patrice Berger on with the dagger. Like I just, that one hits home for me still. So I totally understand what you're saying. They did not deserve to be booed in that moment, but I also kind of get it. I do. Okay. And like I said, they've lost all three matchups against the Bruins this season. The first two were in overtime. That was the first time in regulation. They didn't get blown out of the building yesterday. They hit two posts and had a Yeah, puck pulled off the goal line. Okay. And they had four power play opportunities and the power play looked horrible. And I mean, the turning point of the game was the first power play of the game where not only do they give up a ton of shorthand, like the short handed chance, the like single rush, like, it's not, you don't want it. You understand it. It's like the subsequent like three shots after that you literally you have the numerical advantage. How are you allowing a team with fewer players to like cycle the puck in your zone when you're on the power play. And like I said, this has been a, I mean, there were so many positives that were starting to develop a winning streak. And then even when Riley returned, one of the major positives before he returned was how good the power play was starting to look and Tyler Bertuzzi taking John Tavares the spot on power play one. And we had the brief for I with Jake McCabe, but it was mostly Timothy Lillegrine there running power play one since Riley has returned. And he's been, he's quarterbacked a very good power play in years previous. And maybe it's just the ebbs and flows of a season. But I will tell you, it's best. It was without Morgan Riley this season, like there's just no denying that this Leafs power play has looked at its best without Morgan Riley. He returns and the numbers would bear it at one for the last 13 with Morgan Riley back as the QB, PP one. Yeah, I think I think you look at those numbers and you can't just poo poo them away, especially because we've been through this a couple of times. I think specifically with last night, I think the problem that was at play there, Keith, again, we heard it already was the idea of it wasn't so much they were making the wrong reads with the puck in the offensive zone. Once they get got set up, they weren't just weren't getting set up. And that's not a, that's not a Morgan Riley issue. Morgan Riley is the last guy, quite honestly, in that unit that you want to be the zone entry machine. It's like you got Mitch Marner, you got William Neelander. That's what they're there to do. And if you're gonna, if you're having problems with that, chip and chase, you should be able to do it. If you got speed and strong guys. So I look at it and say that last night, I don't look at it as a Riley issue. The other problem, I think, though, is that Lillegrine struggled in the game last night. And Keith, who is, he's not afraid to, I know we've gone away from this a touch this year. He's not unafraid to switch things up in the middle of a game. Do you think he watched him at the Lillegrine last night and said, you know what this guy needs? He needs some people one time. That's what's going to turn him around. No, I don't think so. I think he, I think he, he wouldn't be in the defensive zone if he was on the power. This is true. But I mean, when he can't identify pucks that are going right through his legs, like that's, that's tough. Well, so you look at it, right? And it's, it's the Tyler Bertuzzi corollary of what did they do? Was Tyler Bertuzzi playing well enough to get power play one time? Not necessarily, but they force fed it to him and look what's happened. The puck's starting to go in. You're getting a more effective version of that player. Now, this is just a one game thing. I'm not, I don't know that this is why Keith refused to switch it up. But would it not have been good to give Lillegrine some positive puck touches, have him out there in a power play spot where he can in theory at least be a little more confident, snap it around, give it to 34. Like he says, the best thing to do on the power play. So that's the way I look at it is I do, I do wonder if you had a better game on a Lillegrine last night, if Keith would have said, all right, let's switch it up and in game here. Yeah, I don't know that he would have, but I think that Lillegrine's play kind of removed that from the equation last night. Brody Lillegrine was not so good. Wasn't, wasn't, wasn't ideal. The John DeVarr's line is just like good. It's really good. Like all the time. Take these and happen it under the bar five on five goals. I think the discussion that will continue to be had as we approach Friday is, is that second line centered by Max Doney, don't be sustainable. I don't think we have any questions about any line centered by Austin Matthews and with Mitch Marner on it. Okay, I guess you can quibble a little bit about the Matthew Knives part of it. But okay, I think the top line seems pretty entrenched. Yeah, I think the more sample we get with John Tavares in that third line role, we're now what he's scored four goals in his last seven. The more that and men Cali Yarnkrock, how quickly we were to forget his, his omission from this lease lineup and what an important role he plays on this team and sorry Nick Robertson, who's done a fine job of establishing himself as an NHL caliber player. But clearly that makes a whole lot of sense with Cali Yarnkrock. Like the more we see of that thing, the more I want to see more of it. Yeah, I agree. I think it's not a perfect line. I think in theory, you would ideally like one of those guys to be not so singularly focused on shooting the puck all the time. There were and again, like I don't want John Tavares to change his game. I like that Yarnkrock wants to shoot it and by McMahon's got a good shot. So I don't think any of those guys need to change it. But there were a few moments last night where a little pass here or there would have maybe had a guy in a better shooting position. I love what you're getting from them though because we talk about floor and ceiling a lot today. The floor for that line in terms of responsibility, there's going to be nights where foot speeds an issue. Yes, that's going to happen with that group. But they're not going to be nights where, you know, and McMahon's still young, maybe he'll have these, but where Yarnkrock and Tavares just go to sleep and it's a third line that's just giving you nothing. And we've had that in the past on this team when it's been David Camp. We've seen this in the on this team when it's been Max Domie in that role where it's just a quiet kind of dormant game. They just go away. So I love, love, love what you get there. The Domie at 2C is the best option this team is going to have. And much like the least goal attending, I don't know what you what I can see to make me wholly buy in. I look at it and I go, yep, this is great. I love it. I understand it. The eye test works him and Neil Ender fit well. And they could have a seven game series against Colorado in the middle of the season and it could go well. And I still would be sitting here going, God, just worry when that defensive laps is going to rear its ugly head. It is so hard for me to kind of trust that Domie and that's 2C role, despite how well he's played. But that's the spot he's got to be out on this team. There's no room to add another center. You need Domie in that 2C spot because you need Tavares in that 3C role. And obviously Matthew's in going anywhere, David Camp ain't moving up the line up. So that's it. Like three of the four lines are kind of entrenched now, right? That's it. Like the fourth line looks good. The fourth line plays in the offensive zone all the time now. Yeah. Ryan Reeves is driving pucks to the net and driving people into the boards. No longer a clear dash every time he's out there. Yeah, no, there's a lot that makes sense with this team up front. Now, I mean, the blue line, different story, you talk a little bit more about projecting as to what the biggest area of need and what the focus should be coming up to Friday. Oh, we didn't get to talk about this. What? I called Elia Labushkin like five months ago. I feel like I'm to the mic pretty early. I mean, good for you. Thank you. That's all I wanted. Yeah. I mean, you were the only one, but yeah. No, no, no. I do feel like I was early on that. I feel like everyone was like, Oh, what about Zadora Tana? And I'm like, yeah, what about Russian bear? Don't care. Yeah. Yeah, and good for him able to play through the pain or not have a concussion. I'm not exactly sure what the deal was there. You know, it's funny. We like to bog down and get a lot of answers on things. And sometimes I don't want anyone to ask any more questions. Yeah. It's like his head stopped hurting. Maybe it maybe it never started. Who knows? No, it was what they realized, Brian, and you're not a medical professional. So you wouldn't know that it wasn't a concussion. It was more like a neck, like shoulder thing. Like maybe it like crept up to the head, but not like a head thing. No, they have concussion protocol. Of course. Which he passed with flying colors. Again, I don't, it's more a question of how the human body works, because it's like we have seen the little weird slips and guys have concussions. And then we saw a nearly seven foot tall mutant try to maim and kill Iliel Bushkin with that hit. And it barely kept him out of more than a game. So yeah, good on him. Okay, anything else from the game? I mean, for me, boy, you look at the penalty kill, which I guess was trending in a better direction before they allowed the the power play goal against yesterday and the one opportunity the Bruins get in the hockey game, Leafs control the special teams battle as far as getting the majority of the power play opportunities, but the Bruins more efficient and looked more dangerous on their power play. And then I guess the puck that was cleared off the goal line was on the power play. Yeah, like they so they weren't as anemic as they looked early on in that hockey game. But yeah, the penalty kill among all Eastern conference playoff teams, Leafs have the worst penalty kill percentage. Yeah, that that is a growing issue. It is. And you know, I think that that is where people would like the addition to help be it a forward, be it a blue line or you would like somebody who can help shore that up. Le Bushkin again, fine player, I like him, but I don't think that's the guy who comes in to sure things up. But when we talk about penalty killing, who's the best penalty killer got to be? It's got to be your goalie. And again, I'm not going to sit here and say it was the goalies fault for that goal last night. But that is what good penalty killing comes down to is do you have a goalie who can kind of stand on his head and make great saves. And the Leafs have had that for stretches. They also haven't had that for long, long stretches. And I also do think it's a, it's a roster construction kind of issue. Just while we're talking on special teams, I don't want the NHL to adopt this rule. But I do want Sheldon Keefe to gaslight in his team into thinking that they have accepted this rule that if you get scored on short handed, you lose your power play. Because these guys love their power play so much. And maybe that is the one thing. It's like, you'll lose it. You can't be giving up short handed breakaways. We'll take it away from you. Maybe that is the one thing that could, that could sink that message in because still feels like the only team in the NHL this season that's allowed a short handed 2-1-0. Yeah, I do think that. But the Leafs do this, they don't do the 2-1-0 thing. But this is what happens when you use your stars on the penalty kill, right? Is that you're able to generate chances. The Leafs have done this at very fleeting moments this year. A couple other things from the game last night. Just bad whistle. Normally when I say that, I mean, I mean the calls. I did. The first two delayed penalties and early whistled denying them a six on five opportunities. Yeah, it's okay. It was only Mitch Marner cruising around in the offensive zone with the puck on his stick. And then the other time was only with off the Matthews with risk cocked ready to fire. Yeah, no, it's okay. Neither of those are dangerous spots for the Leafs. Oh, and then the third blowing the puck dead when it was nowhere near dead. That one, they cleared the puck. I mean Tyler Burtuzi couldn't get a stick over Swamin to get the puck into the net. But yeah, clearly it was sitting there right under his butt. And that happens. Okay. I don't like it when it happens, but these things happen. But for it happened three times in one game, it did drive me insane. And then I know this isn't the official's fault. But while we're doing Gunning Scripes here, I just, I loathe the call that I think it was McCabe who got called for the slash on March on, where the stick just breaks. March on basically breaks his own stick on Jake McCabe's stick. And again, this happens. This isn't a Leafs thing. This is not me putting on the tin foil hat. I'll let you know when I do that. I want to do it often. This isn't what's happening here. I just, I loathe that penalty call regardless of which way it goes. You're playing with fiberglass sticks or whatever they're made of these days. Not five thousand years old aluminum sticks. You know, they got good aluminum sticks. I will say bring him back. You and me having so many broken. No, so I just I loathe that call. And then you mentioned Yarnkrock agreed. I was happy to have him back. There's one moment that drove me insane. And I feel like this kind of indicative of the Leafs. And it maybe it just stuck out to me because it's Boston. But there's a moment super early in the third period where somebody I think it was Tavares tried to chip the puck was like basically bank pass off the boards and Yarnkrock couldn't quite catch up to it. And the the Bruins goalies, he smothers it. And instead of little snow with a goalie or a stop up right in front, Calli Yarnkrock looks like he's about to dislocate both his knees, doing everything he could to not make contact with the goalie. And hey, that's good. That's the honorable thing to do. Would it kill you to be a jerk? And he doesn't need to be. But it's the thing we have talked about with this group. And I feel like we've been seeing signs coming out of it. But that just stuck out to a sore thumb like me. I understand he's Calli Yarnkrock. He's not Brad Marchon. He's not going to go in there and snow the goalie and have a big dust up. But wouldn't you love to see that? Honestly, wouldn't you? And that's the little thing that I just think that this team is still it's not that they're missing it because we've seen it with Domi. And hey, if that's Tyler Bertuzzi, I bet he's snowing the goalie. So it's not that there are guys in this team who won't do that. But that moment just kind of stuck out like a sore thumb to me. That'd be lying if it didn't. Yeah, the results in the three Bruins games, they do stand up because there are zero W's among those three. I mentioned the Rangers game on Saturday and Leafs have also played three games against the Rangers this season. They've taken four to the six points against the Rangers. And naturally, when you got potential first-round matchup that you just saw against the Boston Bruins and one that could conceivably happen. Because you know, the Red Wings are playing some pretty good hockey. I think the lightning are just going to be touching go to make the playoffs now it feels like. And that's like the goal for them is just get in. But the Red Wings are a legit contender for a top three spot in the Atlantic division. Like the possibility very much exists that the Leafs find themselves in one of those wild card spots because they're going well right now. It's still 21 games to go in the regular season. I mean, roster for roster and maybe take the history out of it. Or maybe keep it in if you want. Sure. Who do you prefer? Rangers Bruins first round. Oh, man, I think it's tough because you see the record this year and how can you not take Rangers, but Schusterkin finding it. And that is the scariest part of this all. I know Boston has the reigning, Fresno winner. And I know they have somehow the other guys, the better goalie there who just beat you like I understand all that. I also saw what happened in the first round of the playoffs last year. And if this is any other goalie, I'm probably going to say, give me this team that the Leafs have had success against Schusterkin's terrifying though. Yeah, 100%. It's the Bruins team. You want to face the Bruins. Like, listen, I don't, again, there's no good options here, right? Like, unless the Sharks are getting into the playoffs, like the last minute edition. There's nobody you feel exceptionally great about. But again, like, it's not like you're moving heaven and earth or if there's an opportunity at the end of the season to manipulate things to avoid the Bruins. Yeah, you can lose the Bruins. You can lose the Rangers. You can lose to anybody. You can lose the Panthers. Obviously you lose the wings, honestly. You lose the church, church, church. This is not a situation where you're like, oh my God, it can't be the Bruins. No, not the Bruins. Like, okay, yeah, you can be like, and not the Bruins. No, that sucks. And that would hurt again, obviously to lose to the Bruins. And yet another series. And God, man, what would the odds? I just want everybody. It actually doesn't matter who the first round opponent is. And I guess last year that you would go against this, that it only went six games, but you got to put everything you have on that series going seven games. It really feels that that would, that would be the way it would trend there. Why would it be easy, though? Also, I will say you're right to say this, that there's no right opponent. There's no, the goaltending will be the scariest part of this. A little PSA for you. And I know they're having fun with it on the pregame last night. Just let's all agree to keep that to ourselves. Okay, we can have this conversation via text. We can have it with our friends. There's no chanting in a town square. We want to act. How about just like we want to win? How about that? How about that? No more chanting in a town square about wanting an opponent. That's, that's for a lot of fan bases chanting that has it ever gone well for that opponent? Probably not. Yeah, probably not. And especially this one with, I mean, get, man, you want to talk about the feeling of confidence after winning their first postseason series in 20 years, yeah, to have that amount of hubris to say you want anybody on the second round. God, let's all remember that fleeting moment where the Leafs were Stanley Cup favorites after a round of the postseason last year. What a time to be alive. It certainly was. Great time for sports. You got to love sports. All right. Much more sporting conversation going forward. But when we come back, Blue Jays are, you know, the route for this Blue Jays team to be in contention this season is through again pitching in defense. What was the one issue with counting on that is, hey, can this Leafs team or can this Blue Jays team be as healthy on the mound as it was a season ago? Early returns, not so much. We'll get into that in more next as the fan morning show continues. Ben Ann is Brent Gunning sports net 590 the fan. Hey, it's Ailish for afar and I'm Justin Kusser. Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. It's the fan pregame, 6 p.m. weekdays on sports stats, sports at 590 the fan and wherever you get your podcasts. Alec Manoa, fell a little sore on shoulder yesterday in the bullpen. Didn't really bounce back the way he wanted to after his start. So we're kind of just taking a day to day. Yeah, I think it's just familiar. I mean, he was throwing and, you know, kind of just said, that was a little bit cranky and just wanted to be extra careful. I mean, we'll see, you know, probably Tuesday and kind of go from there. I know we got the off-date Wednesday. Hopefully, it's nothing crazy and he can get right back into it. But I think just wait and see after a couple of days. Yeah, he did an MRI last night. No structural concern at all, which is good. So, at this point in camp again, just making sure that everything is everything all right. Kevin Gosman, he was supposed to throw today, not didn't really bounce back from his bullpen, just with some general shoulder fatigue, he had an MRI, no structural concerns, no injury. So, we'll just reevaluate him in a couple of days. Yeah, kind of just popped up, didn't really bounce back after his side, you know, no injury. So, it's just kind of like fatigue. So, yeah, we'll, you know, see literally day to day and see how he kind of bounces back. But he was supposed to be up two innings in around 40 today. So, I'm serious a few days. Fan Morning Show Sportsnet 5.9 in the fan bed and it's been getting us fine. That's fine. Putting guys in MRI tubes and just cranky. Yeah, yeah. I will say shoulders. I'm the last guy in the world to be bothered by something being cranky. I'm like, good. It's a natural state of things. No, no. What you want is the shoulder that, I guess, if you're Alec Manoa, you're pointing to as the number one reason why you had the worst season you've ever had as a professional baseball player, the shoulder in which you had a plasma-rich injection into as a cranky shoulder. Like, that's what you want in March. I love baseball-isms because it's, and rightfully so. Like, we hear any arm discomfort, whatever we go, don't like that. So, we have to find as many words as positive, like the thesaurus for baseball terms, as I'd argue bigger than in any other sport because we have to, we have to have such varying degrees of crankiness. Will the arm be angry tomorrow? Maybe it'll be right. What? Dead arm. You do hate being dead, though. Dead arm. For what it is, and I mean, baseball people will tell you it's no, there's no like actual medical diagnosis there. It's like, the arm's a little too sore. The ball's not coming out of it the way I want. It's like, dead arm seems like the worst. It's like, what would you rather have? Tommy John's injury or dead arm? At least the arm's alive with Tommy John. No, actually, dead arms not as bad as it sounds. I think it was Gibby who was, what was wrong? It was just dead. That's all. It's just dead. That's all. You're right. So, nobody has dead arm. That's good. We should probably clarify that. Yes, no one's arm that we know of is dead at J's camp right now. No, it's just, you know, bouncing back the way we expect it to somebody's shoulders cranky, maybe some barking is happening in in the area of toddler and dog analogies as well when he comes to that. Okay. So here's the deal. Kevin Gossman has yet to make his spring debut in a grapefruit league game. He is being backed off a couple of days, if not a week, because his arm is not bouncing back the way they anticipated it doing. MRI done, no structural damage. Alec Benoa, cranky, shoulders cranky again, same shoulder in which he had the doctor inject stuff into last season. Cranky also being backed off. Also, underwent an MRI. Also, the results being, hey, there's no structural damage there. So that's good. But I will say, it's not generally good. Obviously, you'd like your players to be fully healthy. I've enough of the two guys. I mean, maybe this is such an obvious question, but maybe this is like a way to get into this. Yeah. Hey, what's the more concerning situation for you, Brent? Probably the guy who pitched for the team last year, not being able to potentially pitch that that's the one. You know, the guy who's been like a young front runner, it should vary each time. This is one one. You know, that guy, the Kevin Gossman of it all, is immensely more concerning. But, you know, I don't know that it is such an obvious answer, because I think with Gossman, I think you can take a pragmatic approach. And yes, this is not ideal. This is not, but this is not cataclysmic. I don't look at this as some sign that this is the beginning of the decline of Kevin Gossman. It's baseball. Anything can happen, but I don't look at it that way. With Manoa, I think it's a bigger concern because the only path, and hey, feel free to prove me wrong. I know. I know it's a long list, but hopefully I can make it on there, Alec. Feel free to prove me wrong. The only way I thought this was going to work out was him hitting the ground running, feeling like a million bucks, the confidence almost taking over, and then the muscle memory of what he was being able to just kind of refind himself with spring. And just with the way this is starting, it to me nukes is probably too strong of a term, but it kind of nukes the chances of him having this comeback season that he wants. So that's why, like, of course, it's Gossman. But I can make the case it's Manoa. Yeah. Kevin Gossman makes 30 starts a season. And again, no structural damage. If the Blue Jays are without Kevin Gossman for like the entire season or something, like, I don't know how you replace it. I don't know how anybody replaces a front line, like Ace, like Kevin Gossman, maybe it's not the ace ace that Garrett Cole is or the very few people in Major League Baseball, he's right there. He's had his two, so he's had three, his three best seasons in the Major Leagues have just come in the last three seasons. But the two Jay seasons have like improved on what he did in San Francisco. He's been one of the most reliable starters in Major League Baseball. As much as the Blue Jays are hoping for some internal improvement, as far as the offense is concerned, they're only going to go as far as their pitching staff goes. And it was, I think, reasonable for everybody to raise an eyebrow at the possibility of this rotation being as healthy as it was a season ago. And maybe right now they're all saying, "See, I told you so." But let's wait until we see Kevin Gossman miss an actual regular season start, which he hasn't yet done to, I mean, he's missed a couple, but he's made 31 starts. Again, it's two seasons as a Toronto Blue Jays. So let's just pump the brakes on that. For Alec Minoa, yeah, I mean, you're right. To me, it doesn't nuke the possibility of a comeback season. What it does is it nukes the possibilities coming north with this team. I really don't see it. I don't see it at this point because, well, one, so spring training results mean very little to anybody that's an established Major Leagueer, right? Like, if Alec Minoa was coming off his first two seasons, who would have cared about the first start in which he hit three guys and he's walking in the fastballs all over the place despite its velocity being up, who cares about that? But we do have a season in the interim in which he was not a Major League caliber player. So the results do mean a little bit for Alec Minoa. Plus, I think what we've learned in this past season with Alec Minoa is that as much as he felt like in his first two seasons, what did everybody say going into that first postseason start? This guy feels like born to play postseason baseball and ready for the moment. He feels like a guy that would embrace the moment because his confidence is unshakeable. I think we're at a different spot with Alec Minoa and what you have to do as far as managing the confidence. For sure. You need Alec Minoa feeling good going into the season. And if Alec Minoa, you know, he's pushed back a little bit in spring and then comes back and he's not 100% and he doesn't have the results he wants. Like, is that the guy that you want to throw out there in the fifth game of the season, considering the attention that that will garner and considering how how the momentum feel. It feels like it will be shifted on the result of however long he goes in that baseball game. I think we're at a point now. Yeah. And I understand it's still early March. The Blue Jays do start the regular season this month at the end of this month. I think we're at a spot now where like Bowden Francis has to feel ecstatic about his chances about making the team. And I think Mitch White, despite the fact that yeah, it feels largely like that was a misstep as far as the trade was concerned and a guy that's already been DFA'd off this roster and not claimed via waivers. And he has to feel pretty good about this about making this team as either the long man or if Kevin Gossman starts the season on the injured list, also in the rotation. Yeah. I feel very differently about those guys. I got to say now the Mitch White, you know, we've all seen the reports. I don't think a pitcher, you know, touching a number he he's not want to touch normally of him running it up there to 98. That's not quite best shape of your life stuff. That actually does matter. It's nice to see him prove Vilo, but you need to see it matter. We've seen guys step up velocity and it not be the be all and end all Francis is intriguing to me. He is a classic back end of the rotation starter that, yeah, if you are a, you know, capital W World Series contender, then no, that's not a guy you want is your four or five starter. But I also think that as the season goes on, they're they're going to be plenty of guys who you would who you would look at and say, you know what, I'm actually happy that J's have Bowden Francis over that guy. And when you look at back ends rotation, so him, I'm a little more bullish on the Mitch White of it all. It's concerning. If you need him, he can be a piece. He can be around. Again, it's a bullpen in the month of March. If that's what he is eventually a part of. If he performs well, great. They'll be able to use him and stretch him out and potentially as a part of it. If not, fine. Good. Good. Good riddance. It was never meant to be the trade. Not a good one. But I look at it and say that Francis is a guy who I do feel like provides strong organizational depth. The guy we've kind of been talking about them needing. Now, again, you you only get these guys when they don't eventually become full fledged starters. But France is a good guy to have in the full white. I'm just much, much less bullish on. Yeah. And Bowden Francis just factually got major league baseball players out last season. Now, I will say it's a different deal when you're coming into a blowout in the seventh inning as opposed to starting a game for a team with at least playoff aspirations. I was looking at like the splits. I could wear exactly and did the leverage change from Bowden Francis by the end of the season considering how well he pitched and no. So he made 20 appearances last season 14 of the 20. He came in with the Blue Jays trailing in the baseball game. Only 12 played appearances when the game was within a run. Only 25 within two runs. 47 within three runs and 63. The most he's had actually know the most he had last season was when the margin was at least four runs. He faced the most batters that he faced last season when the game was completely out of reach. So, I mean, his pitching pitching? Yeah, generally. But I will say if you believe in any level of clutchiness or the situations dictating performance at all, you do have to go into this with eyes wide open when it comes to Bowden Francis that he is really never pitched in a major league baseball game in a situation that mattered to any degree. Yeah, no there. That's I think that's a good point to bring up. I think the thing about baseball that lends itself to that mattering a little less is, you know, we don't we don't see guys getting taken out of games late. Like you're not unless it is a blowout of epic, epic proportions. You're not seeing guys sit down. Generally, you're in the lineup. You're finishing the game. You're playing. It's not as though you're getting the, you know, the bench players when you're out there in these blowout spots necessarily. The other thing is as a starter, not that leverage doesn't matter. And clutchness doesn't matter. Of course it does. One thought let me just be on record that doesn't matter what position you play in sport that matters. I think it matters a little less for a starter because it's just the body of work is longer. And if you find yourself trailing in a game, yeah, it's possible that you are the reason for that. But we've seen this Blue Jays team play. It's entirely possible that somebody ran into one and they weren't able to your teammates weren't able to pick up that one for you as well, where you're in a kind of tough spot or you're pitching from behind. So I think it's smart to point out. But I think that of all the positions in this sport, maybe that's the one that I think clutchness kind of matter kind of, especially when we're talking regular season stuff matters the least. Yeah. So ultimately, we put a bow on that with with this comment. Bow one Bow. Yeah. The rotation issues in general. Is it an ideal scenario to again, have the one route to contention for your baseball team? It seems and things change over the course of 160. Like maybe the Jays have the best offense baseball. Don't think that's the case likely. I think it's going to be on the strength of having some great defense and some great pitching. If that's your one route to contention, do I want two of your five starters dealing with injuries in spring training? I don't, but it's better that these are the type of injuries, I suppose, than yeah, obviously anything structural. And even if you what, I mean, Kevin Gossman doesn't make the opening day start and you miss him for a week, two weeks is back on the rotation. He's still making 30 starts. Obviously take that. It's not ideal. It's not the blue Jays don't have an easy slate to start the season. But yeah, I guess you can't freak out too much with the blue Jays are telling you, hey, just he didn't bounce back the way we liked him. We had a look in there and we saw nothing actually structurally wrong. It's been a bad month of March for Scott Morris, which is a lot of people like to dunk on Scott Morris and I understand it. Right? Like, okay, he is a lot of hubris, right? Like he he's the megaphone people will generally speak and point it right back at you. Yeah. And he's made a lot of money and he's generally been right a lot of the time when it comes to the dollar figures that he expects to get for his free agent athletes and the amount of money that they actually factually receive that's usually pretty much on par. And it doesn't matter that he goes into spring training. Hey, his guys usually get paid. It's not happening this year. And it didn't happen again with Matt Chapman. I'm surprised it hasn't happened because usually I do look at just despite how how many issues I think you can look at each one of his dudes is having that usually there's somebody that's willing to overlook that and say, okay, we just have such a glaring need. And we got to do whatever it takes to get this person despite the fact that Matt Chapman's not a perfect player, despite the fact that Cody Bellinger is not a perfect player, despite the fact that Blake Snell is not a perfect player, he's the best option we got and we're up against the wall. And that's why I think Scott Boris generally wins hasn't won at all. I got to say, I'm surprised. Matt Chapman essentially signing a one year $20 million deal with the Giants. Now, I know there's it's a three year deal, but there's opt out after the first year and the second year, but they're declining value in those second and third year. I think if Matt Chapman is around for three years on this deal with the Giants, he's devastated, right? Like that's it's basically an insurance policy for Matt Chapman. If he gets injured, he suffers a devastating injury that you cannot project him being a majorly caliber baseball player. Like, I think the only scenario where he doesn't at least test the market again next offseason is where he's worse than last year. And I guess that's possible, but it feels like that's that's about the floor for Matt Chapman. How do you feel about Scott Morris and and all his dudes on getting what we all thought they would get? I you know, I look at it and I quite honestly, and I know that people will say, well, hold on, it takes two to tango. I look at it as a problem with ownership and I don't mean that for one specific team, but just the idea of what owning a sports team is in 2024 across all leagues, you know, they're and you're right, Blake Snell is not perfect. Matt Chapman far from it. How many conversations we have about him? I'll throw a Montgomery in there. Okay, he's not a perfect guy as well. But in the era of the boss, you know, the singular one person says, I don't care. I don't want to hear this. This. I don't want to hear this jerry to Poto 57% to 40 or 54%. I don't want to hear that. I want to build the best team possible, go out and do it. You just have people that do things much more pragmatically. And it's honestly, it just makes me a little sad, makes me wishful for the old time of people saying, I don't care, go get it done and find a way to get me that guy. Now, if that guy is Shohei Otani, we saw that people do say that and they do move, heaven and earth. But, you know, there's, there's a big gap between a replacement level player, Shohei Otani and Blake Snell, like you can fit him in there somewhere. So guys, one is pitched, we talked about clutch guys pitched in big moments. I'm shocked, quite honestly. So, yeah, am I, am I sitting here agreeing with a lot of people to a certain extent on Boris saying, good play hard ball eventually, it's going to come back to bite you. But I also look at it as a sign of not the teams don't want to win in baseball. Because if you are, if you're running a professional team, you want to win. But that it is not the absolute be all and end all because you can't tell me that Blake Snell is not helping plenty of teams rotation. You can't tell me the same with Montgomery and Matt Chapman. Okay, maybe that's a different animal there. But that's the way I look at it is that there is a price per win or however you want to look at it. And what those guys are asking for, I guess to these front offices is too much. And I'm not even saying the front offices are wrong to think that way. It just makes me sad, quite honestly. Yeah, I do look at it. So I think you hit on the correct thing at the beginning that thank you. I don't know what I remember what it said, but thank you. Is that the money was there for show Aotani? Guess what? The money will be there for Juan Soto. Because Juan Soto is Juan Soto and Matt Chapman. And despite the fact that Cody Bellinger has won an MVP award, like that Cody Bellinger, I mean, is it possible that he re emerges this season? Sure. I mean, he made himself a passable Major League Baseball player last season with the Chicago Cubs on the strength of hitting some more duck snorts. But this is a guy that the Dodgers with their like just limitless resources decided to non tender, right? So like, what are we talking about here? This crop of dudes that he's banked on, they all stink. I mean, that's extreme. But then I was on record as saying I thought somebody was going to be absolutely hamstrung and devastated with whatever they signed Matt Chapman to because I thought you look at the overall number and the defense they played and maybe parsing out, you know, the injury that he suffered with the finger at the end of the season that somebody was going to convince themselves that, hey, this is the Matt Chapman of old, a guy that was in the MVP conversation, which we clearly watch for five of the six months of the beach ball season not being that guy. I think people are just smart. None of these players are worth it. And I guess you can look at the ceiling of Blake Snell and the fact that he's the reigning nationally sigh on the award winner is being the outlier and he's the guy that hasn't yet signed. But also look at the depth that he's giving you or lack thereof. It's a guy that, okay, made 32 starts 180 innings like this. He's life and death to get you through five innings, let alone six. Well, I mean, this all goes back to the race, ruining baseball. I'm not building them up the way they should have. I guess, sure. I mean, it's more like the five walks per nine innings that he also provides, right? Like, it's fine if you put them on if you're striking everybody out, but that's no, none of these guys are perfect baseball players. They're not, I didn't think Matt Chapman was worth a hundred plus million dollars that he's projected to get. I didn't think Cody Bellinger was worth 200 million dollars. Guess what? These other major league baseball attacks agreed. And I think it's just a product of this crop of free agents that Scott Boris has. So not being as elite as previous versions, I think we're going to have a very different conversation with Juan Soto is getting 600 million dollars from the New York Yankees next offseason. So what do you, like, what do we think ultimately happens when you're flyers? They they limp to take their Chapman-esque offer. I'm talking about like your Snell and Montgomery types that are still out there. Like, what do you think ultimately happens with those guys? So one-year deal, I wonder. I think, yeah, Snell's probably, I mean, he's not going to get what he hoped to get, but I think ultimately with the, I mean, there are enough pitching injuries to just have them. But I think the Blue Jays, I think it's pretty well established that they have their payroll numbers that they're happy with now and it's money and money out. Yep. And there's no money out that you can conceivably see with this team where you can throw 30 million dollars at Blake Snell. I don't think so, no. But I think, yeah, the Phillies seem like a team that's more than willing to go above and beyond for a guy. And especially if he falls right into the lap at a three-year, you know, 100-ish million dollar deal. Yeah. I think that's what you're looking at for him. And it feels like the Red Sox are going to do something and Jordan Montgomery is probably their fallback option. And hearing that for a few years. All right, well, we'll come back. Ilya Sampsonov gets sidelined yesterday after his incredible performance on Saturday against the Rangers. Does it mean anything that Joe Wall is likely to get the two starts against the Bruins this week? Or is he? And what are the Maple Leafs priorities as we head to Friday's trade deadline? That and more Nax is the fan morning show continues, Ben Addis, Frank Gunning, Sportsnet 590, the fan.
