UK Column Radio

The Abdominal Brain with Dr Sabine Hazan, Consultant Gastroenterologist – Part 1

How important is gut health? Did you know you have two brains, and they are intrinsically linked? One is in your abdomen. What effect has ‘Covid-19’ had on the gut? How vital is your microbiome to your immunity? Do probiotics work, or are they a scam? Why did Dr Hazan’s successful protocols for the treatment of ‘Covid-19’ get withdrawn in favour of a ‘vaccine’? Read the full write up: https://www.ukcolumn.org/video/gut-feelings-the-abdominal-brain-with-dr-sabine-hazan-consultant-gastroenterologist-part-1

Duration:: 48m
Broadcast on:: 10 Sep 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

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And I'm also joined by Dr. Sabine Hazan, and before I introduce Dr. Hazan, I just want to make a few points because Dr. Hazan is a gastroenterologist, and she's based in the USA. So she's got up very early to speak to us. So thank you so much. And thank you also to our producer, Stephanie Sinclair, for facilitating this interview as well. But before I start, I want to say that the gut, it's a huge subject. So we'd already decided that we really got such a big topic to discuss. This is going to be the first interview of two. And we hear much research at the moment, don't we, of the brain and the heart and other systems in the body. But how many of us really know that we've got two brains? Yes, really two brains. We've got an abdominal brain as well, and it's known as the enteric nervous system. And many of you might think, yeah, actually, you know what, that gut feeling, I get that gut feeling, I go with my gut feeling, you might be worried sick, you might have butterflies in your tummy, or you might go with your gut. So your gut is connected to your brain in your head. And it's incredibly important in the biggest scheme of things, because when we talk about the immune system, where is the immune system? What is it? Well, I think we're going to find out that a lot of it is in the gut. We've got tens of millions of microbes in our gut that Dr. Hazan is going to talk to us about, because she has a wealth of experience in many areas that some of us might not quite trust as much as we did, perhaps, in the old days. Genomic sequencing, for example, laboratories, clinical trials. Dr. Hazan is expert in all of this, and yet she has literally sacrificed everything, literally everything, in order to speak the truth. And we're just delighted to be able to welcome you both. So first of all, Cheryl, welcome again. Thank you so much for agreeing to join us. Thanks, Debbie. And hello, Sabine. It's lovely of you to join us today, and we're looking forward immensely to what you have to tell us. We absolutely are. And Sabine, let me bring you on screen and say thank you so much for agreeing to talk to us. If you could just give us a little introduction as to who you are and why we're here today. I'm a gastroenterologist by trade that started doing clinical trials. I actually got into GI doing my first year of fellowship in research, and I kind of kept on with research and clinical trials over the last three decades to the point that when clinical trials became a capsule of poop, and we didn't really understand the microbiome, I kind of stepped into the microbiome to understand it and doing clinical research. And essentially, here we are today. Thanks to the microbiome telling the story, and my genetic sequencing lab for GeniBiome has been spearheading a lot of research. And I've published a lot of data on COVID. A lot of it that was censored, but I think it kind of demonstrated the corruption that of science and research right now, and medicine really, and why we're not advancing or finding cures. There is a big problem going on. So here we are. That's what I'm doing. Here we are indeed, and you found out a lot of solutions which we're going to come on to and protocols that we're going to come on to, but I also want to tell people of your book. Let's talk SH exclamation mark T. And that's really what it's all about and what we're talking about today. But Sabine, before we talk about what you found out, which is fascinating when it comes to in inverted commas COVID, the guts is massive. I mean, basically it goes from your teeth, doesn't it? Right down to your anus, your rectum. So which part of the guts? I know that we've got a diagram which we're going to be showing our viewers of the guts and it comes from it comes from your book actually. So which part of the gut will we be talking about today? I concentrated on feces in the colon. So that's the part of the gut that we're going to talk about is really the colon, because that's what I analyze. I analyze the microbiome, which is really the feces. So not a very sexy topic, but a very important topic. And I think most people, you know, tend to, you know, notice things when it comes to that region and definitely has been the number one complaint in the GI doctor's office. So I think something that we, you know, forever we're kind of like looking at the body, the colon, but we never really looked at the feces themselves to give us an idea on the disease. And this is the path that I'm spearheading, that I'm looking at, and that I'm, you know, trying to find solutions essentially. And solutions is exactly what you have found and we're fascinated to know about the gut microbiome. And at this point, I know Cheryl is champing up the bit literally to ask you some questions. So I'm going to throw across to Cheryl to start off all the questions about what you found out. A lot of people like you say, they don't like talking about poo, you know, it's something you don't talk about. They associate bacteria with illness. They don't expect that, you know, because they have got a healthy diversity, a number of bacteria in the gut that gives them health. They don't get that at all. So I think we need to go into that in more detail to explain to people that it's a good thing to have the right bacteria, the right type of bacteria in the right place at the right time. Yeah, no, absolutely. And I think what we've learned from COVID. COVID, you know, was, those were, you know, that was a time in, in my life anyways, that was extremely scary, I think, for most people. And we, there was a, there were a lot of unknowns. But I think there was also a light at the end of the tunnel from COVID. And the light is really understanding. For me, anyways, it was taking the courage to treat people and in treating people in achieving improvement of survival of one person after another, it was really a way to understand the microbiome better. Because through treatment, I got to see how a virus was in the stools, how a virus was eradicated in the stools with treatment, how the power of the microbiome allows some people to survive COVID and some people to not survive COVID. And I think that was, you know, that was the light for me and also a lot of, a lot of interesting, you know, facts on this for a lot of people in my opinion. Because nobody really even thought to look at, wait a minute, my poop can like support me, can help me if I have a solid poop, I can survive a virus. How does that make sense, right? I'm having an infection in the lung. To this day, people are saying to me, well, you're a gastroenterologist. Why are you even treating a lung problem? And I have to laugh because these people are completely ignorant to the fact that the lungs are connected to the colon. So you cannot fix the lungs without, you know, having to deal with the colon to begin with and having to deal with altering the microbes in the colon to make sure that, you know, half happens. I think we've all been educated to think that we go to a specialist for one particular problem. And that's it. And the specialists don't look at the whole body. They look at just their specialism. And that has been a downfall because obviously we need to talk about complete body health. So tell us some more about this microbiome. Tell us about the functions of it. Tell about the balance that we have to have in it. And then obviously the interconnections with immunity really I think is the important that we need to know about. Well, I think we're going to end up finding out that immunity is in the gut. It starts in the gut. It is in the gut. It is those microbes in balance. That's going to be the future. The future is really looking at these microbes and saying you've got too much of these kinds that are not so good. And you've got too little of these kinds that are good. Maybe we need to up the good and drop the bat. It's really, you know, the problem with this is that it's not necessarily a product. It's not necessarily a consumer product, right? And it's really the art of medicine. It's how do you fix someone that has an imbalanced microbiome, right? And especially since the technology is really not there yet, right? I mean, there's a lot of labs out there that are doing that, but they're not really validated. And they've not really normalized their samples to even know. And also there's no clinical data, right? On it. That's what we're doing. That's what we're doing. We're looking at the clinical data. We're looking at what does Alzheimer's look like? What does Parkinson's look like? What does autism look like, right? You know, so I think ultimately, you know, the microbiome is a complex organ. And it is an organ. It is where immunity starts. But at the same time, it's the Wild Wild West. And it's a new frontier that we need to explore because there's so many things we don't know. And here's the other thing. We've trusted animal studies to guide us in this field. However, the animal studies do not reproduce human beings. And so, you know, that's another challenge that we have. And every individual is different. So we can't even compare each other. One person that may think that they're healthy compared to another person is really, you know, not necessarily healthy, right? So, you know, they may have the same microbiome, but the, or not necessarily the same microbiome, but the same relative abundance of microbes. One person could be healthy with those microbes. And another person could be unhealthy. So those are the challenges that, you know, are in the field, in my opinion. I think a lot of people don't understand that we've got about five pound of body weight, the bacteria living with us. And we couldn't exist without them being there. And therefore, it's important to look after this quite a large body of microorganisms. And so we kind of outnumber the number of bacterial cells we've got compared with our own body cells about 10 to one. So, hopefully, people know that it's a big, big help. It's a big, big organ, as you've just called it. So we need to understand that this is very important to us. I do because I read your book, Sabine, and it's absolutely fascinating. It's really easy to read. It's for ordinary people. There's no language that you won't understand. And what I love about the way that you've written it. And in other interviews, you've said that actually you are a gardener because the gut is like a big garden. And it tends, it should have beautiful flowers in it, and it should be flourishing. But sadly, some of those fields and gardens end up as weeds, which is why they microbiome is so important. But when we, when you first heard of COVID, and I say that in inverted commas, you were seeing patients as normal, right? And you were, they were coming into your surgery and they were poorly. And that's when you started to realize that there was much more to this than met the eye. What were your findings when you were seeing patients? Because some of them were coming in and they were pretty sick, weren't they? Yeah. So, you know, I stepped into the front line, really not really thinking in that carefully, right? I just, you know, you step into, you know, you step into the front line as a physician, like you're stepping into a fire, you know, and you're just trying to like throw water onto the fire and helping the neighbors to remove, you know, to stop houses from burning, really. That's what it was for me. I just went in with complete faith and I just went in with, you know, I'm just going to do this and I'm going to do the research and I'm going to see what I see and if I don't see anything, then at least I'll have tried, right? So, I didn't really think thoroughly of what I was going to find and what was going to happen. I was, to be quite honest, you know, I think the pandemic for me was really witnessing miracles because when you see one person that should have died and doesn't die on your shares, you go, wait, what's going on here, right? And then you have another one and another one and then they're hypoxic and they're, you know, oxygen is 70 and then you realize where you're giving the treatment that you believe is the treatment that's improving the gut and killing the virus and somehow these people are surviving. How did that happen, right? And so when you look back, you know, the first instinct and I always said that, you know, from the beginning during the pandemic, we should have just turned off the fire. We should have liked used as many hoses, as many buckets, and just turned off the fire and then said, okay, let's look back and see what has helped, right? And so, in retrospect, when you look back and which is what I did, you see the power of the microbiome. You see the power of bifidobacteria. You see that when you treat COVID, the one thing that you notice is you have a virus in the stools and then you treat it and the virus disappears. And then you notice the bacteria that you were, you know, that put those people at risk of catching COVID to begin with, you know, start growing back after treatment, you know, a long time after treatment, but you see that that tendencies, right? You see what happened, you know, with the treatment, what happened after the treatment, long term, you notice like how do people go to being long haulers? You know, long haulers we published is loss of bifidobacteria. It's a microbound dysbiosis and I think a lot of people have discovered that and have talked about it, but also vaccine injury is loss of bifidobacteria. We showed that the vaccines affect the microbiome and kills the bifidobacteria. Is that what's happening when people keep getting COVID, COVID, COVID after vaccination? Because they've killed their bifidobacteria every time after a shot. You know, how many of your friends have had the shot and said, you know, I noticed that I got COVID a week after. Are they immunosuppressed now and therefore the virus comes in? You know, there's so many that you know, there's so much to this that I think the pandemic really, you know, opened our eyes to that is important. Sabine, you mentioned bifidobacteria. Could you explain to everybody what, because I know it's a really big, it's a big agenda for you and it's been groundbreaking what you found out. But can you tell people in layman's terms how important it is? So bifidobacteria is the bacteria that is in your probiotics. It's that industry of, I think it's probably up to a trillion dollar industry of probiotics by now. So that bacteria is very present in newborns and it basically disappears with the aging process. So essentially you're born with a lot of microbes and you die of a lot of good microbes and you die with very little. So there was a thought that possibly this bacteria could be, you know, significant in health, right? And that's the billion, trillion dollar industry of probiotics. When you look at the microbiome of people that have disease, when you look at Crohn's disease, when you look at ulcerative colitis, when you look at invasive cancer, Lyme patients, those people have zero bifidobacteria. So you have to ask yourself, is the beginning of the disease the loss of bifidobacteria? And is this why it's a chain reaction, right? Everything in life is action leads to a reaction. You know, you eat a hamburger that where the cow was full of antibiotics and vaccinated galore. And then you get sick with plastridium difficile, you know, that bacteria starts secreting toxins, gives you diarrhea. And then eventually what happens is you need an antibiotic to kill that bacteria, but then you're killing off the whole microbiome. So a microbe doesn't just sit on an island. A microbe, you know, starts the chain reaction where action leads to a reaction. So that's, but that's really what I think. The bifidobacteria, can you say a little bit more about that? What is that achieving in the body when it's imbalanced and it's actually, you know, doing what it's supposed to do? Well, I think we're at the beginning of all that, right? I think we're just right now, we're studying that it's absent in certain diseases. We're studying how to increase it, how to sustain it, how to because if you notice a lot of, because people would have a disease and would take these probiotics and say, oh, well, you know, that would fix the disease. Why is that not happening? Right? Why is it that people can take probiotics and not fix their Crohn's disease or their Lyme disease? Because the probiotic doesn't either one reach the colon. Two, it's probably not real. In other words, there's no probiotic. There's no bifidobacteria in that probiotic. Three, it's probably dead, right? These microbes are very sensitive. So, if you grow them in a lab and then you put them in a capsule and you expose them to air, remember, you know, most of the microbiome lives in the colon, which is not exposed to oxygen, right? So, it's living in an anaerobic format, right? Form. So, what is that? What are you doing when you're exposing all that to the air, right? All those microbes to the air. So, and then the other thing is, how does it reach? How does a probiotic reach from the stomach all the way to the small bowel to the secum, right? So, you know, it's a complex science. It's not one that I can say, you know, I never put myself in the rabbit hole of saying what it does, what it doesn't do. I just discussed my research that I've done that validates and others in the field because, unfortunately, the microbiome is really about validation. It's about, I did a research, now prove me wrong. And if somebody proves me right, then that research is valid, verified, and reproducible. So, you'll notice, like, I talk a lot of things and I do a lot of, you know, hypothesis. They're not necessarily right until somebody else proves me right. And that's in danger as a scientist and as a physician, in my opinion, to say with certainty, this is what this microbe does. And this, and you should take this because this way because it improves this disease. I think it's a mistake. You know, all we can say in science and research is, you know what? I mean, in my case, with COVID, I, you know, I've treated thousands and I've lost so much. Okay, so that's a step in the right direction to show well, there's something there, right? Maybe my protocols, maybe my way of treating COVID was the way and maybe we should kind of, you know, reproduce those ways, right? It's the same thing with Alzheimer's. I treated a case of Alzheimer's where the patient improved his memory. And all I did was give him the stools of his wife into his colon and all of a sudden he could remember his daughter's date of birth. So something happened when I changed the microbiome of that patient for that one case. Now, can I say fecal transplant is the answer to Alzheimer's? No, absolutely not because this is an N of one. That N of one needs to be reproduced and then that N of one, you know, may not be reproduced in all the Alzheimer's patients. Maybe Alzheimer's is a microbiome disorder in some, maybe it's a neurological disorder in others, maybe it's the pathway between the brain and the gut, maybe it's the stem cells, maybe it's the, you know, any of the components that are linked up with the brain, you know, from the blood to the nerves to the lymphatics to everything. So, you know, to get back to, you know, what we said before, you know, the body is a complex organ that is all connected. So, I don't think, I think a lot of the answers today you're going to have for me is probably we don't know and, you know, we can guess but we don't know. I think that's very fair actually and I think that's what hypothesis is about and I know that you have submitted hypothesis and they've been pretty much refused but perhaps we can, we'll go on to that and we'll also go on, I think, to talk about fecal transplant because I'm sure people's ears are pricked up and they thought, what? Fecal transplants, so we will come back and talk about that but one thing that I did want to say very quickly was you brought up the subject there of probiotics because now that we told people what bifidobacteria is, many people watching are going to be saying, well, we want to increase ours, we'll give it a go, what do we have? And of course, I know that you did your own little study, didn't you, on probiotics and you just went to your grocery store and you analysed what was in your grocery store and I think it's a very sobering reality for people that are watching now that are maybe thinking about doing their supermarket shop and they're going to pick up a load of probiotics, what did you find in your study? I had killed my bifidobacteria and I was drinking a leader of kefir every day and I couldn't find bifidobacteria in my gut from that leader of kefir so I tested the kefir in my fridge and basically noticed there was no bifidobacteria even though it said on the label, bifidobacteria. So I was curious because here I am telling all my patients to drink kefir, of course it's not going to improve their microbiome if mine didn't even improve. So I went to my grocery store in Malibu and picked up a whole bunch of yogurts and a whole bunch of drinks that sent bifidobacteria in them and then out of the drinks, out of the 26 drinks only three of them had bifidobacteria and it was shocking because here I am telling patients, well go get kefir and improve, go pick up a drink that has bifidobacteria. It was shocking to find out that actually so many drinks didn't have bifidobacteria. It was also shocking to find out that out of the drinks that didn't have bifidobacteria not only did the drinks not have bifidobacteria but even the probiotics that say bifidobacteria didn't have bifidobacteria in there. 16 out of 17 probiotics on the market have zero bifidobacteria. It's just a gimmick. They don't put bifidobacteria in there. So consumer beware because that's the problem. You are thinking you're taking on some probiotics or some drinks that is improving your gut and it's not necessarily improving your gut. Well the next question and I know that if our audience could see us they'll know that Cheryl and I both we've got our hands up because we want to ask so many questions and before I throw to Cheryl for another question can I just ask you then for people that are watching? If we go to our supermarkets and we're picking up probiotics that have no bifidobacteria in them complete waste of money what can we do to make sure that we are increasing our bifidobacteria? I mean I've heard sauerkraut mentioned. Is there anything what do you put in your diet for example to increase your bifidobacteria? So the first thing that I put in my diet are vitamins. So you know don't underestimate the power of vitamins. Vitamin C, vitamin D increases the bifidobacteria, zinc increases the fermic cuties. So you know vitamin C, D and zinc that's why all my protocols throughout the pandemic had this formula. You know was very important. It was really I cannot emphasize how important it was. Especially as that was the key vitamin that I gave all my patients. So and the problem is even in the vitamins there's a lot of you know I ended up making my own vitamins during the pandemic because I didn't trust what was out there and they're just vitamins for our research you know what I mean. But unfortunately if you look at the majority of vitamins products out there there's a lot of fillers in them that actually make them obsolete. They don't even help. So you could have a person taking vitamin C, vitamin D, zinc and it didn't improve them. Then I would go back and say well probably your vitamin had a lot of you know stuff in them that basically was not good you know for your microbiome. Okay so that's one. Two and this is why you kind of like see a doctor do a research you know there's a lot of doctors that I've trained over the pandemic on the biome squad that I've you know helped out. So you know anybody that wants to know a doctor in the area we've trained a lot of doctors on how you know to treat etc. Saying that the grocery stores now know or at least the companies that make these probiotics and make these probiotic drinks now know that there is someone watching right. And what we've learned from the pandemic is word of mouth PR. So when something works it goes viral right like you saw Ivermectin went viral because it worked because people couldn't breathe. They were short of breath. They took it and then all of a sudden their chest opened up. What was the mechanism of that you know by what why did this happen because actually they increased their bifida bacteria with Ivermectin. But Ivermectin only does short term increase of bifida bacteria. There's no data on it increasing bifida bacteria long term. So how do you increase your bifida bacteria when you've lost it. You go back to a normal to your diet that if you were healthy before. Go back to what you were eating. Increase fermented foods, vitamins, decrease the stress, decrease the alcohol. I actually tell all my patients one glass of wine helps the bifida bacteria. However more than that doesn't. But as you're building your bifida bacteria it's probably not a good idea to drink because you're trying to increase those microbes. Drugs you got to be careful what drugs you're taking. If there's some drugs that you're taking that are suppressing the microbiome. Foods if there's you know meat that you're taking that's suppressing your microbiome. You know everything you have to be kind of a detective and it's not easy. It is not easy to grow what you have killed. So the best advice is to stop the killing. Why I was so adamant and why I was so strong you know why I was such a voice during the pandemic with these vaccines is because I was noticing they were killing the bifida bacteria. And what and it's fine in those people that basically survived and you know they have a resilient microbiome and they bounce back and their bifida bacteria comes back after the vaccine. But it's not okay for those people that do not bounce back where they constantly stay and believe me I'm treating a lot of those patients and you know it's like a flat line you're trying to resuscitate them. And it's not easy to hesitate what has been killed. So you got to be careful and you got to stop the killing to begin with. And you got to stop drugs that are killing you know when you think about a drug like hydroxychloroquine that was like deemed you know it was great for like people that were severe COVID zero bifida bacteria. So if arthritis and people that have already killed their gut you know that's a great drug for those people. But for people that are healthy that's not a great drug because it kills your microbiome. So you know same thing with antibiotics. Antibiotics are good for someone with a pneumonia that's in the hospital that's dying or an infection that requires an antibiotic. That's necessarily good for that young kid with a strong resilient gut. Now you're giving him an antibiotic. And you're risking dropping his bifida bacteria and him not coming back up again. That's really what the problem is. I think the confusion for people is that our food isn't as good as it was. Our diet isn't as good as it was. You know you've been drinking all that caffeine for all that time and then obviously it's not been doing any good at all really it's not solving your problem. So you're blind aren't you? You don't know what you're taking. No you're absolutely blind and unfortunately that's what's happening and it's the blind eating the blind. Because here you're blind and then another person trying to sell their product and influencer is selling a product and now they're in the limelight selling this product and they don't even know it hurts them. I mean how many influencers have I treated that were using their own products that they were raising awareness on and actually that product ended up killing their guts. And then they killed the guts of others. So I think you know we have I think people need to be vigilant. I think we need to stop the influence of health care. We really need to bring it back to the doctor's office. We really need to have that doctor patient relationship and we need to educate our doctors to understand the microbiome better to step out of the guidelines. We need to encourage our doctors to step out of those guidelines to be brave to innovate. You know we've lost our medical field and and when you lose your doctors good luck when you're the patient right because who are you going to go when you have a doctor that's scared of giving you a safe drug. So what we saw during the pandemic is a bunch of scared doctors afraid to defy the government as if the government is the doctor right so I mean at some point we all got to keep our hats on to realize who we are what degrees we trained for. You know I would never you know trust a plumber on you know on a colonoscopy just because he deals with the same thing ideal poop right. So I think we have to be you know we the people need to stand up for what's happening yes you're right we're blinded but here's the wake up call now that says we need to demand of our agencies to have clean food. We need to demand of our agencies to test these yogurt we need to demand of our government to test these products if it says before bacteria. It needs to have better bacteria. I'm not the government that's not my job my job was to do the research I showcased something that's really important 16 out of 17 probiotics on the market have fake labels. 23 out of 26 products with probiotics on the market have fake labels they're fake there's no bit of bacteria in there. It's up to the government it's up to the agencies to step it up and say you know we're going to start testing the products stop testing the paperwork you know I've been in the clinical trial business for years. And almost three decades or three decades and I got to tell you you know the one thing the FDA always looks at is the paperwork stop looking at the paperwork higher independent lab to test the product. You know how do I know what's in that product the FDA needs to know they have the the right formula they need to test that and they need to retest it once it's in the market because here's the problem. A lot of products do great in the research and clinical trials and then they get to the market and it's a substandard product and we're having complications. What happened from the clinical trials to the market the product change the transportation change the temperature change of these products you know. Is that why these products are no longer working you know what we saw with you know we're stepping into the microbiome world right now. And fecal transplant as we said before fecal transplant when we do fecal transplant as gastroenterologist for CDF a condition called CDF and we take fresh poop from a family member or sibling or a stool bank that we trust. And it's fresh that patient has 92 to 99% success in resolving clostridium difficile bacteria that causes diarrhea okay. When we saw the pharmaceutical product even though they showed some great data well guess what the data on the front line of medicine using those products. I'm not as great as my fresh poop something is happening something's changing so you know we need to evaluate better and we need to make sure that these products that are out there are actually doing what they're supposed to do in the FDA needs to test these products. Obviously people turn to different things you're talking about I've a metin is a fermented product anyway so that perhaps is is one of the advantages of it. But you've got things like your vitamins as long as you get the right ones that are obviously made it the right way. How is that helping how is that helping the video bacteria does it make it multiply more or what does it. What we noticed is the vitamin C for example we published that paper increase the bacteria within 24 hours the vitamin C increase the bacteria. So that's what we noticed now does it increase it long term do you have to keep at it forever. Those are the studies we're still doing and looking at all that so we have about 1600 patients that have been on a vitamin product that we were testing. To see what is that doing to the microbiome long term short term does it increase you know I have patients that I tested. You know basically that I tested before and after vaccination before and after vitamin C and those patients I continue to follow them and continue to follow their stools. So it's interesting to see you know there's something to this but it's still at the beginning. You know we're there's only you know there's only a few of us doctors and scientists at Pergenivion. You know we need to we need funding we need you know all these stools samples are extremely expensive. You know I don't stop myself from looking at things so somebody tells me hey. Cumin for example cumin improves inflammation then I'll be the first one to say you know what let me test the stools before and after. In fact we're doing cumin. You know I'm the first one to test if somebody tells me hey this this product is I'm working on a product right now with a gentleman. Which is going to be a new drug with a gentleman from Switzerland and it's going to be a new product for ALS and cancer and let me tell you. It's unbelievable what it's doing to the bifida bacteria. So I'm very excited for this guy about this product because when it comes out when it starts in the clinical trials we'll have the data not only about the clinical trial the efficacy goes right now. Actually that product is in a phase three clinical trial. So there are pharmaceutical companies that are doing it the right way. They're totally legit and they're trying to help patients along the way and they're righteous you know and usually those are companies that are owned by physicians. Because they have a code of ethics for the most part. And so you know this compound was in a phase three trial and what we noticed is it actually increases the bifida bacteria by 20%. So this is something that I can put you know my company behind because I say hey you know what I tested this product and it does what it's supposed to do. Listen there's a lot of products in the market that actually increased the bifida bacteria and none of them that I can say on this podcast or say publicly because unfortunately it's not my job right. The data needs to be written first before it gets talked about. And so that's the way it's always been and that's the way it will be. This is such a big subject because the gut is a very big organ and we're not talking enough about what we're eating and where it's going because what goes in has got to come out. So we'll be talking very much about your experiences with COVID and your protocols and your work in the Senate in part two of this interview. And just before we finish part one and I did did warn everybody this is a big big subject. Before we go to your last word on on this particular part of our interview. I just want to come back a little bit on the fecal transplants because people will be thinking really, really doctor has an you're taking fresh poop from a family member in in a like in a test or in a syringe. And you're literally implanting it in somebody else's colon in order to grow back that beautiful garden of microbes and I get that. And I think my question will be after the injection with MRNA and spike proteins, etc. How would that affect because I know that people are very wary about blood transfusions and about whether things are being body products bodily fluids are being checked equally I would say, will people be worrying now if they want to go down the fecal transplant route as to how safe that is in 2024. I don't know those are the, this is one of those things that I don't know. I don't know if the MRNA stays in the stools. I don't know if the MRNA stays alive for that long. I don't know, you know, that those are, that's a good question. We don't know. I think we will know from like these products that are on the market already and their success rate and seeing, well, why aren't they as successful as before the pandemic, you know, what has changed, right. The fecal transplant, you know, doesn't work as well using a family member or a fresh donor than one wonders. Maybe there is something in the stools. We are developing a stool assay to look for spike protein. I think that's important. We are, you know, and here's the thing, you know, when we process these stools, you know, I mean, some of us use the lab, you know, from University of Minnesota or a fecal bank that's available for doctors. And also, and those are processed very well. You know, my lab, we do from families and we have patients, you know, that want to know who their donors are. So we do very extensive testing. We test for COVID in the stools. That's why we're developing this spike protein assay to look for spike in the stools before we transplant because we want to make sure we transplant a quality microbiome and not just poop, right, because otherwise anybody could do that in their kitchen counter. But if you do that in your kitchen counter and you're in planting a micro that's toxic, you're pretty much could kill yourself, right? So, you know, there is a process of sterility within the poop, right? I mean, it's not just like we're taking fresh poop and we're just planting it. It doesn't work like that. Although we do make it seem like we're just taking stools, putting it in a blender, you know, like the South Park episode that you all saw where, you know, they take the poop, they put it in a blender, blend it and put it in the colon. You know, it does appear like this is how we do it. But, you know, there is more to that. And it is kind of a, you know, semi sterile procedure. And I always joke because, you know, my staff in my lab, the everything is sterile, you know, when we do these things, you know, when you're in this foundation. And, and I always joke, because I go, you realize we're sterile when we're dealing with poop, right? But, you know, here it is. Here's the thing. It is an organ. It's an organ. You have to start thinking of it as an organ. It's like a kidney. It's like a heart. Why wouldn't you do a transplant if you have a gut that if you have a microbound that's out of work completely and you have a disease? Why wouldn't you take a healthy organ? And implant it into a human. We actually are publishing data that's going to be coming about what's in the poop. So, you know, it's not only poop that you're transplanting. So it's important for people to understand, you know, you've got blood vessel, you've got blood in the stools, you know, so you've got to do the proper work up to make sure that it's the bacteria that you're transplanting and not the poop. Right? So, you know, that's an important concept that when we talk about, and I think it was named in a way, it was called fecal transplant. But I think it should have been, you know, and Dr. Alex Kurud says that it should have been called, you know, microbiota transplant, because it is the microbiome that we're transplanting, not the poop. So, you know, the poop is with the fibers and the food and the blood and all that. So, but we just are taking the stools. Well, I want to thank you for that because I know for sure in the UK, our government is very keen to have our our poo. We, most of the population have been sent bowel tests, and they're very, very keen to have that so perhaps we can talk about that in part two, but to you for your word, and I am super, super grateful for your time. I just want to give Cheryl the opportunity to come back before we go to your last word, Cheryl, is there anything you would like to add to this before we end this interview and head for part two. I just hope that what we've said so far as welcome people up to how important your guts are, and in particular your colon and in particular the microbiome within it, and whatever they learn about themselves to try and improve that, they should do it, because it's a main part of continuing with health. So hopefully we've got that message across. Yeah, and thank you, thank you, Cheryl for joining us and if you like what the UK column are doing, and if you found this interview helpful please share our work and please share. Dr. Hazan's work, all of the details of where to find her and details of her book will be in the article that will be directly beneath this interview so on that note, Dr. Hazan for the end of part one, I would like to thank you enormously for joining us and to give you the last word. Thank you again. Well thank you, thank you for having me and I think the last word is the last word would be hope for peace and microbiome and save the beef. That's my, that's my mission. That's my path to for increased awareness on bifida bacteria, and make sure that we still have it in this planet. We wear our work, day by day, stitch by stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So whether you're gearing up for a new project, or looking to add some tried and true work where to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. The work where isn't just about looking good, it's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. 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