All right, thank you so much. Thanks for joining us tonight. [MUSIC PLAYING] Good morning, Joe Sefan, 590, and the fan, Ben. It's Frank Gutting, one of the biggest touring comedians, Tom Segura, heads to Scotia Bank Arena. On September 28th for a stand-up comedy tour, Tom Segura come together. We've been giving away tickets all week long to enter. All you have to do, tune in to the fan morning show, listen for the code word, then text the code word to 59590 standard message and data rates may apply. Today's code word is come together. Text come together to 59590 right now to enter for your chance to win. Give it away on other pair of tickets tomorrow. But if you don't win with us, secure your tickets at ticketmaster.ca. OK, so for me, the perception of Vlad and Bo has changed significantly this season. Now, I'm not writing off Bob Schat. I think he's still a very good player. And I think when he's healthy, and next year, you can, and he's a blue jay, you can expect him to be among the leaders in hits in the American League. Agreed. And playing league average-ish defense at shortstop. I think Vlad, though, was the guy where-- Yeah, OK, I don't know what he is, year to year. It's like, I saw 2021, I thought that was proof of concept, and there was a launching pad, and off he goes into the stratosphere. The guy that was promised, he's arrived. And then 2022, in retrospect, wasn't so bad. But OK, it wasn't 2021. And then last year, really threw me for a complete loop. And especially considering the position he plays, it was like, is this really somebody you want to hand 10 years, 300 million to? This year has changed all that, because he's done it with no protection, granted now in games that are not meaningful. But OK, I can put that aside. We're both we shed before he got hurt was so bad. I am wondering if Vlad is the better bet to be an above average offensive player. They flip-flopped in perception. And it had us thinking about not just the athletes, because I have one non-athlete on my list. The people in Toronto sports that have had their perception changed the most. Who came to mind for you? Very first blush. And this is not a like it changing while it's here, but just how it started, how it went, how it ended, and where we're at now. And it's Matt Sundine. This guy gets traded. And there's other things in it. But pretty like for Wendell Clark. Yeah. The mustachioed Canadian tuxedo wearing, punching in the face, play through all pain. Captain, Captain, Leaf Nation beloved Wendell Clark. For a guy who had over 100 points in the season, big man. But not all of that. And there was a little bit of trepidation or a lack of understanding of exactly how that was going to go. And then all Matt Sundine did was continue to put up maybe, if not the greatest Leaf resume, at least of my lifetime, if not top five, whatever, all time. You look at what he did here. And then the weird end. And now where we're back to they have the Sweden trip. He's reading out the names in the room. It's awesome. There's no ill will. There's nothing there. So honestly, first blush. It wasn't that it changed a lot in the time here. But it was just what happened, how it ended, and where we ended up. So Sundine was actually the first one that came to mind for me. Yeah. But almost immediately upon stepping on the ice as a tournament, I believe you're like, oh, I get it. I understand. Yeah. No, good move. Good trade. It's pretty good. Yeah. But no, 100%-- What about you? Actually, the number one for me, I think, is a non-athlete. OK. It is a guy that's in town right now. It's John Gibbons. Oh, this is good. So initially, it was JP Ricciardi's hire. And they go back to their time with the meds together. And it's just a spectacular failure, right? Because JP Ricciardi spent some money. And boy, they were close. Remember when they finished second in the American League East and missed the playoffs by 10 games? And that was an incredible accomplishment. Hey, he's fired in income cedogast. And then out goes JP Ricciardi. In comes Alex Anthopolis. And what does he do? He brings back John Gibbons. Are you kidding me? Oh, my God. The discourse in the city, and then doesn't have any success, right? No, no, no, no. At all. And it's embarrassing. And what is happening here? And then they finally break through in a huge way in 2015. He becomes the lovable like, hey, aw, shucks. Like, I know you can have your analytics, but I'm doing it my way. I'm kind of the voice of baseball. Nut cutting down. I need to remind people. One no-world series where John Gibbons was the manager of the Toronto Blue Jays. Not 10? Sometimes it feels like 10. They appeared in two American League Championship series. And then the new guys came in and, like, they didn't necessarily fire him, but it was, yeah, a clear mutual parting of ways because he wasn't going to do their analytical thing or that anyways, there was a philosophical difference. He's beloved in this city. Forever now. Beloved. It's insane considering where he started and considering the discourse in the city when Alex Anthropos decided to bring him back. Like, what are you doing? No, that's a really given. That is not the non-athlete I had. I'll quickly give that one now. It's like it's you, Jerry. That's well trodden ground. It's like he was the guy who, oh, it's like he comes in. He could do no wrong. And then it like, eh, maybe it's wrong. You just keep bumping your head up against LeBron, then go on the incredible run. And now we spent the last two and a half years wondering what is the plan here. I think there's a turn that happened. We're kind of back to like wait and see mode with him. But the actual Raptors one that has been the most changed is Kyle Lowry. This was a guy who was ready to be traded to the Knicks. Or, yeah, I think it was the Knicks, the Dolan, and the Kai Bosch there, thank goodness. Then he was part of a very well-liked team, but ultimately he got frustrated. Because it's like, okay, Lowry D'Rosen, great. Gonna lose in the conference final. Maybe if we're lucky, probably to LeBron whenever that ultimately comes. And then now he gets to be the greatest raptor of all time, super beloved, the Kawai year, the championship. He's the one who has had the biggest kind of, not even just like Switch. It's been up and down and up and down with him. Yeah, it was before he had the incredible run in 2019. Like, and the Raptors had made an Eastern Conference final where they got a game six against LeBron James. But yeah, clearly wasn't playing his best basketball. Come the postseason to, he was the best raptors to start that game six. The closeout game against the Golden State Warriors. Yeah, it's seven straight finals or something like that. Yeah, it was nuts. Yeah, Vernon Wells was another one for me where I was like, that guy was beloved. And, oh my God, even more so, he signed up, long term to be a Blue J. And then it's like, immediately, oh my God, what a horrible contract. Yup. Yeah. I think a lot of people still view him through that lens for whatever reason. He should be a beloved Toronto Blue J. But yeah, and it's so weird because I feel like baseball was the sport where the contract, like obviously, it hampers you the least. But it's also like, because of that, I feel like generally speaking, the one that you wear, the least although the numbers are so big. I don't know. Yeah. All right. Let's talk to our pal, Gord Stellik on the line as we get set for Toronto Maple Leafs training camp next week. How's it going, Gordo? Oh man, come on. You had the softball there. You're bringing on the beloved Gord Stellik. Come on. Come on. No, no, but Gordo, we were talking about, we were talking about changeable who changed. You're just, you've always been beloved. I would not hear any other writing in history. Just the always beloved Gord Stellik. I'm sure that's the way you felt about it too, Agard. Well, I guess when you ask how I'm doing, maybe I'm a little too sensitive. No, I'm good. I really like the topic. Like it is interesting. That's a very intangible thing about what makes someone beloved and then, you know, Gibby in town as a coach with the Mets, like he's beloved, whether you liked him as a manager or not. Right? It's a funny term, 10, 15, 20, 25 years, whatever, after someone plays. So I like the discussion. Yeah, well, we were talking about the change in perception, right? Because remember, John Gibbons, the first time around, was an epic failure in Cito, Gaston, Game In. And I guess attempted to clean up his mess. And then it was like a huge discussion in the city. How embarrassing it was that Alex Anthopolis's big swing, as far as managers concerned, is bringing back John Gibbons. What are you talking about? Can you imagine, like, I guess it was longer than 10 years ago, but yeah, like in 2014, talking about John Gibbons as being a beloved figure in the city of Toronto. Yeah, well, exactly. Exactly. It's just funny how those situations go. I mean, and there's extenuating circumstances to put it mildly when I talk about Roberto Alomar. But I mean, nobody owned the city more baseball-wise than he did. And then when you talk about Alex, I walked our dog this morning, and he still owns the house on our street, a few houses down. That's been rented out. But I'll leave that for another day. No, now you've opened a Pandora's Box, because I did a whole thing last week when the Blue Jays were headed to Atlanta to play the Braves, that now that he has his championship in Atlanta, he has a World Series. And there's a potential turnover in the Blue Jays front office this offseason. We talked about Conor McDavid. You know, if he ever won a Stanley Cup in Edmonton, how mad could the Oilers fans really be if he decided to play for his hometown team, the Toronto Maple Leafs? Could you ever see a world where Alex and Thopolis, you know, sticks it to the guys who, who I guess berated him on his way out the door in 2015, takes over for them, comes back to Toronto and says, it was great in Atlanta. I'm going back to the place that I made my bones in and majorly baseball. So, okay, it's funny saying that, 'cause you know what's probably apropos after a presidential election last night, where they're saying, are we better off than we were four years ago? Well, I think the answer's pretty simple. 2015 was pretty damn good, you know? And so, you give, he came back, Cito Gaston came back, Cliff Fletcher came back, way back when Leo Cahill came back 80 times. I think Bob, a bill of his came back. I'm not, yeah, he came back. I'm starting to stretch a little bit. But anyway, hey, could be. And again, like I said, it's more, like you talked about the Raptors as well. Like those runs just are embedded in us. Those playoff runs of the J's in 2015, the Raptors. And hopefully, what we'll talk about all year is one of those commensurate for the Toronto Maple Leafs. So, we'll see down the rows, but they always say, sometimes they say you never can go home again, but I believe you can go home again. Yeah, I mean, just to ask, I don't know, like arguably the two most beloved Leafs of the last 30-ish years in Wendell and Dougie, right? They certainly did it a couple of times there. I mean, you know, or itch it up for training camp here. They get Robertson signed. There's a lot of talk about Max Pacharedi. How do you see either both of those guys fitting into the forward mix? I mean, if you're going to have both to me, that is very indicative that maybe they're going to try to spread the offense across three lines and maybe you have the big four kind of spread up across three lines as well. But what do you make of Robertson getting signed and the flirting going on between the Leafs and Pacharedi at the very least? Well, I'm glad, like I'm one of those guys. I actually was surprised he played 56 games last year when I double checked it. I still, you know, what is he, 21? And you kind of go, I still think that there's, you know, maybe it won't be like his brother in Dallas, but I like what I see there. And I really think he's a spice that can add something. And, you know, whether last year it's kind of like, I know these guys don't necessarily, it's not like, this guy succeeded Nick Robertson didn't get as much ice time, but Tyler Batuzzi's not back. Bobby McMahon was a big surprise last year. You know, has things emerged. So he got a little crowded there, but I'm big on him. I know right away, some talk is, I think Frank Cerevelli among them, that he's going to be flipped. That part of it was okay, you needed to get him signed to trade him so you can bring Max Pacharedi in and, you know, sign him to a contract. I mean, what a difference. You got a guy what's going to be in his late thirties in November on the veteran side versus Robertson. I, you know, in a perfect world, I would hope they could keep them both because, you know, Craig Ruby is the guy. Like he's, you know, and that's not a shot at Sheldon. Keep, it just means the new guy in town, you know, gets to craft the team that how he wants to. And these are two very, you know, very different elements that I'm curious to see what Craig Ruby and his staff think about them moving forward. I mean, you can never go wrong with depth. - No, you can't. Is there enough ice time to go around on the left side now? If you've got Pacharedi and Nick Robertson and Matthew Nye's and Bobby McMahon, like, is that enough? Like, do you want Nick Robertson on your fourth line? Does it make sense if those are the four options on the left side? Like it feels like they do different things, but I don't know if Nick Robertson necessarily makes sense playing on, you know, checking fourth line, if that's what the Leafs have. - No, exactly. And then, you know, to your point, you bring up Matthew Nye's who kind of, you know, came in, came in, he had an easy transition to his credit about playing in the NHL. So, so you're right about that. There's only, and that's probably what they're, that's part of what they're looking at, right? You could only have, you know, there's six, well, they have six top six players. That's easy math to do. And that's kind of where, or maybe a top nine, that's where you see Nick Robertson sitting. I mean, really, in a lot of ways, fourth lines is pretty interchangeable who is there or not. And then, and that's a bit of the Rubik's Cube there. But you do have some runway to try to figure out how you want to deploy things, deploy players at the start of the season. If you genuinely believe, you know, Nick Robertson, you know, is worth another kick at it, or if you're already made up your mind that you're gonna go the patch already. But we'll, we'll find that out pretty soon. - Yeah, we will. It's the beauty of training camp is, you know, we get answers to these questions, not because of the games, but just 'cause like usually guys get hurt or waivers or whatever, whatever it ends up being there. Easton Cowan is going to be the talk of camp, right? Everybody else on this team one way or another, we pretty much know what they bring. I mean, Chris Tanev is not the guy you're gonna watch in a preseason game and go, wow. I know why they've pwned up the money for him. It's just not where you want him to kind of pop. It's gonna be Cowan that we're gonna have all eyes on. How much are you gonna read into how he's used throughout this? Because, I mean, they're not going to put him with complete slouches out there. Like they're going to put him in a position to succeed. How much do you read into, you know, what group he's with at camp and how much, or the role he plays in these preseason games that we're gonna see starting up in a little over a week here? - Yeah, you know, you know, Brad, you just find, I think I don't recall them preseason or exhibition now. I remember at Arrow where they were big on calling them, don't call them exhibition anymore, call them preseason 'cause they were trying to sell them at regular season prices, but they are exhibition games, whatever you want to call them. And so I don't put a lot of stock in that. Obviously, to me, the expectation, like you've seen with most players the last number of years, is they bring them into the regular season and don't burn the number of games, you know, before they lose the year. So, you know, the player generally is gonna get, get some regular season action, which is way more indicative of where they might be at. And yeah, hey, what a guy keeps going. Everywhere I go, I'm the MVP, right? So, you know, I kind of am ready for, I think I'm ready for a move. So that's gonna be an interesting case and a very positive, exciting case because like Matthew and I's earlier and Brent and Van, we've talked about it for a long time. When you traded so many draftics, like Kyle Dubas did over the years to try to win it all, you're not restocking with young talent. So, it was refreshing to see Joe Wall and Matthew Nighs, you know, make that jump and be really legit NHLers. - Yeah, no doubt, Easton Cowan's gonna play in some preseason games and he's gonna pop though, right? Like, and is that gonna put any pressure on for him to crack the roster? Like the fan base is gonna wanna see him, at least for the nine games he can play before he loses his junior eligibility. I mean, and I think we've seen enough preseason to know that, you know, a good preseason does not a good regular season make, but yeah, well, what is gonna happen when he does the thing that I expect him to do, Easton Cowan and that's lighted up in these exhibition preseason games? - Well, and especially because it's like, not to diminish all the other skills he has, but the biggest one we hear about all the time is that he cares the most. And there'll be guys who are fighting for their lives in these games, but there's also gonna be a, you know, sorry to pick on him, but a Christina who's like, maybe I don't need to block every shot in these games. Like, I think that's the other thing that we'll allow him to pop as well. - Yeah, and the disparity now about, you mentioned one of them, guys that are just trying, and you know, really, mostly now, and I don't know, other guys play in NHL in recent years, the coach says, how many exhibition games you wanna play? And most of them say, well, I'd like to play two at home and one on the road or maybe none. I don't know, Ryan Zooter apparently wanted to play non-Bruzto-cho set, whatever. But that's kind of a easy and to-shape thing versus the others that are fighting tooth and nail for a job and wanna make an impression. And then the other thing, generally, is wherever the game is at, you've got the strong lineup because you got people paying good money to watch it. And it takes 10 minutes to get through the scratches of the other team because it's go, add number 172, and you know, whatever, basically. So you kind of have a double disparity in a lot of exhibition games. - I can't wait to analyze them to death, though, Gorra. That'll be great. See, Ben, say that sarcastic thing. - Blue, white game, God, the blue, white game. You couldn't sleep the night before the year's squad game. I know, you're a little different. - I know, you know me. I'm excited for the rookie showcase. It's like, Cowan's gonna play against the Habs this weekend. - I can't help myself, Gorra, do you know I'm a sicko? - Yeah, he is. All right, keep us updated on Ianthopolis' house, right? Like, if he's coming back and, you know, maybe you're chatting him up, just taking the garbage out. I was gonna say, just ring the doorbell every two weeks. Just see who's living there and give us an update, Gorra. - Well, I think that two parts. One is the previous people renting wanted to buy it, but he wouldn't sell it. - So there we go. - Yeah, and then the other one is, I think, unfortunately, well, fortunately, I think, I don't know, maybe they've just got more kids. I don't know, but I think our daughter, Jessie, now is out of being the babysitter now. She was there to go to a babysitter and his wife really liked Jess. But I think, I think that era's gone. But maybe winning baseball, that's never gone if that possibility, okay? - God, I can't imagine there would be anything sweeter for Alex than to stick it to these guys one last time. - By taking over for Mark Shapiro and Ross Atkins after they've been fired this offseason. But yeah, maybe that's a fantasy that will never come to reality. I just, I think it'll be all kinds of fun. - Anyways, Gordo, great to chat, buddy. - See you guys, here are my most beloved morning show. I really enjoyed it. - Thanks, buddy, appreciate it. Be great, Gord Stellick. - Believe it or not, not contract with the obligated to say that. - Yeah, I guess. - Like, you could have just said nothing. That's the thing, like, you could have said nothing, right? - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - No, I, those are my favorite stories. I like, you know, I worked with Gord, long-time doing Leafs and stuff, and it's like, yeah, he'd always tell him, oh, so I walk in the dog, and it's like, God, what a world do you live in of just a couple, yeah, just a couple GMs, talk and shop, walk in the dogs. Yeah, he has connections to this city and obviously this country. And yeah, there's another guy that has changed perception, right? I was ready to show him the door at the beginning of 2015, after 2013, when it's so pear-shaped, who didn't love the trades with the Marlins and the R.A. Dickey, this is a Cy Young award winner. Turns out that making your team out of former Marlins not the greatest plan. - No. - I mean, Emilio Bonifacio is horrible. - Was it Reyes? Reyes could not play the position. - I was just gonna say, like, it didn't even work for the Marlins when they were Marlins players, right? - They've tried the win forever, and it's like, I know they do the thing where they, like, win and tear it down, but they haven't really done the first part of that in a good long while. - Yeah, but Alex Antopolis, like, maybe people forget was, I think just about everybody, there's a reason why Mark Shapiro was hired in 2015 is because, like, yeah, clearly, Alex Antopolis was going to be fired at the end of the year, and, you know, they were moving off from Paul Beeston, and they wanted a guy that was going to oversee the whole thing, and it turns out, he flipped the script entirely. The couple of desperation trades that worked out swimmingly. - And then got berated on his way out the door by Mark Shapiro, and I just, man, what a fantasy land I live in where he gets his revenge by coming back to Toronto after winning the World Series in Atlanta, anyways. All right, when we come back, let's talk to James Sharman. His Canada's really good at soccer, and we just ran rough shot through the Americans in Mexico. That and more next, as the fan morning show continues, the NNS Brent Gunning sports at 590, the fan. - Big opinions and in-depth conversations covering the Leafs, J's, Raptors, and the NFL. - The J.D. Bunkins podcast. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. - Fan morning show sports at 590, the fan bed at his Brent Gunning, so I've been this morning trying to scour Mexican newspapers for, like, explosive headlines. - When you told me you were going to start doing that, I was very excited because, like, this is very unbrand for me of, like, "Well, that sounds fun. "I'm not doing the work, but if somebody could bring that to me." - Yeah, I would have been a great king. It's like, "Bring me that." - Yeah, I wasn't exactly sure what the go-to definitive newspaper is, and I don't know what's, like, there's obviously one that's probably more sports-oriented. Anyways, the biggest headlines that I saw were about how the Mexican fans just, like, abandoned the game. They're like, "This is awful. "This is not entertaining. "Why are we here? "This team stinks, and they're just trying to chop Canada "in half to try and salvage a point, which they did, "in a friendly, but yeah, things are not going well "for the Mexican Soccer Federation, and currently the United States, "either who drew yesterday against New Zealand. "They got a new head coach, though, who is legit, "and Mauricio Pochettino, but I think it's pretty fair to say now "that Canada is the big boy of CONCACAF. "Let's talk to James Sharman, host of the Footy Prime podcast. "You can listen to Footy Prime, wherever you get your pods. "How's it going, James?" "It's going well, boys. "Thank you very much. Yeah, excellent. "Another good result, I'd say, last night to performance." "Yeah, is it like, is that overstating it? "Is it obvious now that Canada is the team to beat in CONCACAF?" "Well, you know, it's funny. "I think we get to a point now where we should be winning "these types of games, right? "Which is saying something against a Mexican team "and traditionally have its way. "With Canada. "But they've made such an evolution under Jesse Marsh, "they're paying us such confidence. "And the fact is, you're playing a Mexican team, "who, as I mentioned, they're traditionally beat Canada, right? "I speak into Craig Forrester and Jimmy Brennan last night, "who have had some great losses to mess over the years. "And they couldn't believe this. "And listen, we're playing Mexico, "and Mexico's coming out cynical, defensive, "lumping, long balls are over the pitch. "And Canada's team trying to play the football "passing its way out of trouble. "I mean, that's such a reversal of how this has been "for so many years. "So, you know, are we the kind of CONCACAF that he's coming up now? "And, you know, we'll find out. "We'll go up next year, of course. "But right now it's the informed team, for sure. "And the other teams are showing fear when playing Canada, "which has never happened before." So I want to pick up on that element of it. But first, just like, let me expand the CONCACAF conversation just a little bit. So it's like the States, they have their new sexy manager. Maybe this guy's the one. Obviously, you know, a little bit of a longer track record than some of the recent coaches they've had there. How much does that change things? I mean, we see what the right coach has done for Canada soccer. And, I mean, no offense to these guys. But it's been John Hartman and Jesse Marsh that have been the right coach. Not the who don't have the accomplishments that the new American manager has. Like, how much do you think that is going to change the complexion of CONCACAF over the next kind of 18 months or the lead-up to the World Cup in Gold Cup? Well, it's, you know, international football. So it isn't a club football and income is Poshatino, who's got an incredible CV at club football. Very, very smart football man. It's Tuesday, a really, really great brand of football. Will it translate to international football? Well, Jesse Marsh, who isn't that far removed from Poshatino, he managed it. So I think it's a great hire for the States. And, you know, we should not dismiss the US, you know, just, yeah, yes, they're in a bit of a low right now. You know, they drew New Zealand. They drew New Zealand. I don't want to scream out from the roots. But listen, they had a good World Cup right not that long ago. A bad Cup America, they got some really, you know, good players missing from this current score. They're young, the players are playing in the top leagues, albeit a lot of them are fine for minutes right now. But, you know, don't roll out the States just yet, you know, if Posh gets it together, which I'm sure he will, they'll still be a force. But can of very much, you know, it is at this point, knows who knows with them. Yeah, I know, Jesse Marsh knows how to play the media game, though, too, right? After that, win over the Americans doing, like, the Ric Flair. It's like, I, like, I wouldn't, no place I'd rather be than here. I would never want to coach that American team. God, I mean, it's, it's, there's obviously a partial truth to it. And part of it is that Canada right now is better than the Americans. But, like, where do you think is that the truth lies with Jesse Marsh's, um, I don't know, feelings and, and, and maybe a feeling that he was overlooked by the American Soccer Federation? This is an American who went to the English Premier League, right? And, you know, so he was battered by the fans and by the media, unfairly just because he was American. He's got a very thick skin. He doesn't care like it. He plays a media really, really well. And the fact is, you know, I think he thought he had the US job, um, a year or so ago. And he had the interviews with the process in the end. They stuck with Greg Berhalter. And he was bitter about it. And I don't blame him, fair enough, right? So he's got a big chip in his shoulder. And now he's, you know, using this Canada vehicle to drive his, his resume forward as well. After that, that stint at Leeds United, which didn't end too well. So, um, you know, yeah, I think he's been such a breath of fresh air. And he's smart. And like I said, he knows he's going to work the US Canada library. You know, there's importance. He's already demanding fans come out and sell out BMO field for the next match against Panama. He's just been brilliant. You know, forget the football in the pitch. He's playing all of us really well. Yeah, and I appreciate him for it. So we dominate concur calf. We got a good head coach. And now it appears like the contract stuff is behind us. You got to be careful because there's been moments where I'm like, it's all coming together for Canada soccer, you know, making a World Cup for the first time in 30 years in the head coach leaves and, you know, their bankrupt. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But doesn't it feel like now everything is coming together as we head towards a Canadian World Cup? It really does. Yeah. I mean, listen, they got this framework up. They work framework in sports. I'm here all the time, there's CBAs and frameworks that the modern sports pilots. That's why we got into this charm. So we love talking about contracts, yeah. You know, Brenna, absolutely. You know, forget the pitches and then, you know, the games. It's all about that. But no, listen, they're close. It was from a complies, which is now contingent on Canada soccer business. We work in their deal with Canada soccer. And now for my understand, that's going to happen. Both parties are at the table. They're making great progress. CSB are aware of what needs to be done. So that could be done very, very soon. Then you've got the investigation into drone gates. That could be done in the next few weeks as well. So, you know, I think this new leadership at Canada soccer done a great job led by Kevin Bloom, Peter Garuso. But when you see the women's team come out and make those comments about how great it's been working with the new leadership at Canada soccer, it says it all. So hopefully we can't put that stuff behind us pretty soon in the next few weeks. And then just focus on what I keep being told by people at Canada soccer is that they're so excited about the next two years for Canadian soccer because of the World Cup on the horizon. That's the big carrot to get people involved. But they are saying we have to get rid of this nonsense or the crap and just move forward towards that. And they are so optimistic right now. More than I've heard a Canada soccer official for a very long time. - And where are we at in this current moment in time regarding drone gate? Every time I think this story is over, there seems to be another element of it. Do we think that that story's kind of in the rear view mirror now? Do we expect there to be more conversations out of this? Because again, obviously at the Olympics, massive story. And then I thought it was kind of dead and gone. And then, oh, hold up. All of a sudden there's some stuff from the Culpa America. Like, do we think we can finally kind of put drone gate behind us now, both like as a soccer nation, but also just like from a world soccer perspective? - Not yet, okay, okay. I wish I could say that. It will be so soon enough. They will have this investigation. They will release that to the public as well. And I think there's still some very nervous people in Canadian soccer circles. How far back does this go? Will an example be set? They set the example with the women's program. So far, Beth Priestman, a one year FIFA ban from more things soccer. What does that mean for those people involved in the men's side? So I know Canada soccer are going to come down pretty hard with wherever their findings are. They're not scared. They want to make a statement. And the new leadership can see that in Lima, that's innocent. We went around when this happened. This is previous leadership. But we will take care of it now. So I think there's still another shooter full there and it could be quite a bomb. - Yeah, it could. And maybe this is incorrect, but reading the tea leaves and not just tea leaves, some of it's explicitly written in reports since the Olympics. A lot of this is gonna fall at the feet of John Hartman. Like I expect him to be the major fall guy. Now he's still involved with Canada soccer because he manages the biggest club team in this country. But what happens if he is right in the middle of the target when this report is released? - Yeah, it's really interesting. You know, I know Canada soccer have a lot of tools that disposal to put sanctions on individuals and on teams. So, you know, it's hard to say without seeing this investigation how far back it goes. I listen, John Hartman is still very popular within Canadian soccer circles. Right, but the work is done there. The work is doing it TFC. But I don't think past successes will have much of a sway here. Canada soccer won't make a statement, I think. So, you know, we'll see that the reports, we've already read them, right? They mentioned names. They're pretty damning at this point. So, you know, if Beth Priestman gets a ban, then what does that mean for the men's coach if he wasn't involved, if he was the instigator of this? We'll see, you know, like I said, it's tough to really comment on it until we see the actual details of the investigation. But, like I said, this isn't going away any time soon. - Darn, I was kind of hoping we were done with it, but you sound not-- - It's a few weeks ago. Okay, next few weeks ago. - All right, that's-- - It would take on too long. - All right, that's good. I'm happy to hear that. You mentioned all roads lead to 2026. I mean, there's gonna be World Cup games played in this country. Maybe it doesn't sound as crazy as it did when we first landed the part of hosting it, but it's like, you've played in a World Cup now, you're going to play a game almost certainly on home soil. What needs to happen between now and then? I mean, it seems like when Marsh first took over, obviously, there were some questions because anytime you're changing a coach or a manager, you're uncertain about the direction it's gonna take. But what is the work cut out for Canada Soccer between now and 2026 to kind of put them in the best shape they can be? I mean, we know they signed a Croatian international or got him to, you know, decide for Canada effectively a couple of weeks ago. But what are the other steps that kind of need to happen? Because we can talk about tactics and funding and all that, but, you know, sometimes it's not the X's and O's, it's the gyms and the Joe's charms. If I choose the Joe's, there might be some in your national school, Jim and Joe. Yeah, if there are, let's sum them up right now. (both laughing) But, you know, yeah, the gyms and his actors will go, yeah. Do your nationals are a big part of it? Keep finding these guys, convincing them to play. Obviously, it's a young team, getting more minutes for these players at club level. You know, engineering moves for them overseas, you know, to top leagues, that's really important. But another one is still getting good opponents to play Canada. We've seen that over the club, America was it was a dream for football fans. The next games against Panama next month. So as much as you want to get the big nations, and now Canada is a real attraction, I think, for these bigger teams, because a lot of these guys are based in Europe. You can play European-based friendlies against some of these bigger nations. It's important, and Jesse must once that. You still want to win games too, right? So you've got to still play teams like the Panama's where you expect to win, and really create this, this winning culture within that room. Because I think it's there, it's really beginning with this team, it's just confidence within that room. So I think, you know, do your nationals yet, but get more top level competition. Let's see what these guys are made of. Yeah, that enough of Panama, Honduras, Costa Rica, like honestly, come on, Mexico, USA. Yeah, we're done with them. They're a joke to me now. Bring me Spain, bring me them. Honestly though, just to pick up on the dual nationals thing, I don't know what comes first, the winning, or the exposure, or whatever it is, but yeah, it does feel like Canada is now a destination. Like if you have a choice, and the dual nationals probably not making the same choice, if he's like a real, like if he's in the starting 11 for Croatia, that's part of it too. But yeah, how much has Canada changed the perception of these guys who have a choice on where to play? Well yeah, you've seen Canadians now playing in top leagues, making a name for themselves, right? Plus, don't forget, you know, the home World Cup really is a big thing for a lot of players. You know, that opportunity to play on home store, even if it's any good eat two or three games. You know, it means a lot, I think to them. And when you see, you know, some of the names being mentioned, we've moved to Canada, but this kid in Mexico, Santiago Lopez, who Jesse Marsh is all over right now, he's a really good player playing for a very good team in Mexico, a kid that can really step it up, that the most fascinating is from some CPL, he's had a great pathway, promised David, a guy who plays in Belgium, a great name, great young player as well. - Some promise. - Yeah, exactly. - I won that guy. - Just for the name. Just for the name, Dan Jeperson, Luca Colliocio. These are players who have options, but you know, in the past, Canada wouldn't have been an option. They would have looked right past them. But now you're seeing this team in the World Cup, beating teams like the USA, with a pretty high-profile manager as well. And some of these are very attractive place to play once again, and that once again, we've never seen this before, you know? The John DeGusement Owen Hargreaves era seems to be well behind us now, right? - Yeah. - So we still need to sign more of these players, obviously you can convince them, but I think you've got a great salesman in Jesse Marsh right now. - Yeah, almost no notes. The one note I have is that my kid got so excited about this national team after watching the Copa America and the excitement there that he was like, "Can I buy the EA sports soccer video game?" Which is not called FIFA anymore, because FIFA took the rights and then decided not to make a video game. Anyways, so we bought the most recent one, and there's a new one that's coming out, so maybe this is different. But it doesn't have the Canadian national team. You literally cannot play as the Canadian national team, so I don't know, Charms, you have many connections. - Yeah, go talk to the video game, people. - Hey Charms, isn't that a boy James Sposte, is he involved with the EA sport? - Yeah, you know what? It's people who are cool. - Yeah. - That's all I got. - Yeah, aren't they based on like Vancouver or something? - I don't know, anyways. - Yeah. - Yes, that's the answer to that question. - Of course, good. I can't help you now. I have no idea what that's going to do in a way. I haven't got a clue. Can you build teams in that game? - Yeah, I mean, that's work, right? Like, so what, he's got to build the roster? - Oh yeah, how much it sucks for your kid that he has to play more video games. Yeah, all right, Charms, great stuff buddy. Good to hear from you. - Thanks buddy. - Thanks, fellas. Any time, which actually sounds good. James Charman hosted the Footy Prime podcast. You can listen to that wherever you get your pods. - See, you should have let your kid skip school after his hockey practice, and then he could have spent the whole day making the Canada soccer roster. And then when you come home, you guys could play. - I, like, God, see, this is why, like I apparently not mentally ready to parent a person who's like a person as opposed to a child. 'Cause I'm just like, God, that sounds fun. Let's do that in the school. Which is bad, don't do that, kids. - Yeah, no, Otis, stay in school. - No, of course, of course. Brent is gonna have his child not in school and playing video games. - Not my child's in school already. I don't know what you're talking about. - Yeah, when he's old enough to play video games. He'll be playing that as opposed to going to school. - We've done some dalliances with video gaming, yeah. We have. - So I don't, it's hard to know what's real life and what's just like me working in sports, but I am telling you that my kid loves the Canadian national team. Like as a Canadian kid, like as an Alfonso Davies kid, he was really amped up to play as Canada and the EAFC video game, which he couldn't do. And I just, I feel like there might be something building here, right? Like the Copa America, the success we had and the excitement and the way they got to that point and the notable teams they played headed towards a Gold Cup. Do we get to a point where yet, honestly, I think a good indication would be what James talked about, Jesse March trying to build, like selling out these home games that Canada's playing in these friendlies against not necessarily a Spain, right? Like against Panama. Do people care enough about this team to just show up to see Canada put a whooping on Panama? - I think they do. I think there's definitely a group of people that care and it's way larger than, you know, whatever max capacity is at BMO. I think that is absolutely true. But you asked me of like what needs to happen. There needs to be stuff in between these big spark moments, right? Make the World Cup. Okay, that's great. We can all sit here and wait for the World Cup. We understand that. Then it goes the way it goes. And okay, like we've got a little downtime now. And great, right at Copa, awesome. And kind of go away for a little while. And this is part of the problem with like, you know, it's like complaining about rights packages and stuff, but it's like you have to have so many streaming services to be able to watch all of these games. I also think there's something to, and not that Alfonso Davies hasn't checked this box, but I think that's what you need is you need to be able to see these guys playing at marquee clubs. And it's like, I'm not blind to the reality that Alfonso Davies is a station is a little above most of the guys in this roster. But I think that's what it needs. There needs to be the ability to continue to like, have these guys in your life in between these moments. Like, you know, the exact opposite side of this is hockey, right? Like we have no international hockey forever, but these guys are in our lives all the time because we care about the team they play on and we care about the league. This is part of the beauty, but it's also part of the problem with soccer is that it's like, this guys are flung all over the world. It's like you watching the French league? Okay. - Good, probably not. - Probably not. But if you need to see like, Jonathan David, and I think Cornelius made a transfer to one of the French side, it's like, that's where you got to watch to see, and that's two of them. It's like, you want to watch Celtic to see Alistair Johnson. Like, these are the things that happen. I don't know what the fix is for that, 'cause you know what soccer people would tell me, stop complaining, go watch all these leagues. But that's what it is, is how can there be stuff in the interim to keep that spark lit? - I would say that if you're a basic soccer fan, like if you watch club soccer, you're probably watching the Premier League, right? - Yep, yep. - And any of these guys playing the Premier League? - I don't think so. - I mean, you're also watching the Champions League, which I think is a different streaming service? - Right, this is a part of the problem. Like, I had this exact moment myself, where like, hey, I'm never gonna be a soccer guy. But like, you know, I own the same video game that you and your son own, okay? - Oh, you do? - Yeah, I do, yeah. - Really? - Yeah. - You bought that? - Wild ago, yeah. - Okay, good for you. - I don't have some surprise. - You didn't notice that there's no Canada there? - No, no, I'm not just playing international friendly, so anyways, so I look at it, and I just, honestly, I got so distracted by my comment, I forgot what I was gonna say. The thing about this is you need the things to kind of light the spark in the interim, and it just isn't, just isn't there. - Yeah, even these two friendlies against the United States in Canada is on a streaming service that not a lot of just casuals have. You have to be a hardcore soccer fan. - Well, and I feel like that's part of the problem is like, and the hardcore soccer fan is like, excuse me, don't change my sport for you. - Yes. - And also I've committed dollars to see this. - Well, we just talked about this with Gord Stellik. It's like, for the average North American sports fan that is not a soccer fan first and North American sports fan second, the idea of like, hey, I'm really geeked up for this game that don't matter a lick just to see how my team looks. I'm sorry, what? - Yeah, that's another tough one too. - That's the biggest problem for me. It's like, yeah, it can't, but great. Did they do well? Oh, they drew awesome and not wrong to call it awesome. But I think that's still the biggest hurdle is it's just like, there's no stakes other than it mattering in vague terms. And we want to see it and we'll talk about it, but that's the other part. - And there won't be an ice tech before the next World Cup 'cause we're in. We've qualified. - God, the ice techa was so good, right? Yeah, eating himself into the snow. - Yeah, and we'll have the Gold Cup and maybe that'll get the juices flowing as well, but it will be against the concca-caffe nations. It was a different deal playing the rest of South America than the Copa America. - But you went toe-to-toe with Messi, man. How can anything, how can a friendly against Jamaica feel like it matters? You went toe-to-toe with Messi and again, it mattered. - That's true. Last one on this, before we get to the Wakin' Reich, John Herdman probably not sleeping too well these days. I can't imagine that there's not at least some specific sanction coming down on him. And again, like I'm not just pulling names out of a hat here. His name was mentioned explicitly in both the e-mails and by pepper, priestsmen and by some of the correspondence between Canada Soccer and the International Olympic Committee. It seems pretty clear that he was involved to some degree, was he the mastermind behind it? Was he the sole reason why Canada was flying drones? I don't know, but it seems like he was involved to some degree. And I gotta figure that when this report is finally released, he will be the fall guy. And that sounds like, hey, he's made to take the blame for something he's not necessarily responsible for. Maybe he is responsible for it, but it would be nice to just put him in one package as the guy that is responsible for the whole thing. And I do think most of his people left with him to Toronto FC, I don't know how many remnants of the John Herdman regime are in Canada Soccer. - For all my succession fans out there, they would love him to be the Christmas tree. - Allah, Tom in the last season of succession there. They'd love that. The difference was that Tom was maybe willing is too strong a term, but like open to the idea. - I wouldn't imagine. - Pain sponge. - Yeah, that's right, good term. He used it. I would imagine Herdman feeling a little differently about that. - Yeah, probably. We'll see, that'll be an interesting element to this. All right. Time now for the Wakenrike presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown Sportsbook 19 plus bet responsibly, Blue Jays wrapping up their season series against the New York Mets this afternoon, 3 p.m. Sports Net Sports Net 590, the fan, Bowden Francis, Staff Ace on the hill against Sean Manaya. By the way, it's the final work from Dome Game of the Season at Roger Centre. Blue Jays with a robust 0 and 5 record in the other work from Dome Games. Blue Jays are plus 105 underdogs. The Mets minus 125, the total is eight Brent. - I'm actually gonna go to an individual player prop on this one, Bowden Francis. Just picture straightcoats, five and a half. Give me the over. I have faith in this guy. I know that it's, you know, maybe asking a lot of them, but I don't think he is unspecial and unhittable or whatever that guy called him. I think he's got the stuff, and yeah, give me the over on five and a half straightcoats, minus 105 to do it. - I like under four and a half hits allowed. - The man who already has two one hitters this season. Give me under four and a half hits allowed by Bowden Francis paying even money plus 100. And that was the Wakenrake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown Sportsbook 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, Kevin Barker at the game yesterday, perhaps at the game this afternoon, he joins us next. He of Blair and Barker, as the fan morning show continues, Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, Sportsnet 590, the fan.
