The Glossy Podcast
New York Fashion Week Edition: The New York Times' fashion director Vanessa Friedman on NYFW's noteworthy moments
(upbeat music) - Thanks for tuning in to this New York Fashion Week edition of the glossy podcast. I'm your host Jill Manoff and today, the final day of the official New York Fashion Week. I'm sitting down with Vanessa Friedman, fashion director and chief fashion critic of the New York Times since 2014. As I have a hunch, Vanessa attended even more shows than I did, I wanted to get her take on the biggest takeaways, including which business trends designers are newly embracing what the featured fashion trends say about the state of consumer behavior and overall which designers and shows stole the show and why. Welcome, Vanessa, so happy to chat with you. - That's great to be on. - Oh my gosh, tell me about your week and we're in the final day. Have you got another busy day ahead? - It's been a real kind of whirlwind marathon of week, but it always is, right? And it's the start of an even like longer marathon month. So I've been trying to pace myself a little bit, get a little bit of sleep. - I don't know how you do it. So from here, you'll be going to London, to Milan, to Paris, all the things. - I'll have it back October 2nd. - Oh my gosh, how do you even pack for all of this? - That's a whole other podcast. - Totally, completely. Actually, I think I bring the exact same suitcase every single season that I go and it's been like slowly accumulated over a decade. And if I ever lost it, I would be in such bad trouble. - I can learn from you. I'm only coming to New York and indeed, I brought two suitcases and they both, at the height of the weight limit, we'll say. Oh my gosh, but to help me. So we started on the sixth Friday of last week. First of all, how do you even go about your coverage? Approaching the coverage, you're pinpointing the big stories of the week. Does that mean going to everything and anything and talking to everyone in a nutshell? - I go to as many shows as I can. I try to go to a mix of both established designers who I know are the names that readers recognize or interested in shop, but also new designers. And some new designers I go to for a couple of seasons where before I even think about covering them, just to see what's coming up and you hear about them through school programs, through colleagues, on the grapevine. And that can be exciting and frustrating and horrifying sometimes. But it's the sort of way to keep on top of what's happening. And then they're the exciting kind of visitors, right? So officially, Fashion Week started on the sixth, but actually Fashion Week started on the fourth because the fourth was Proenza Schuller, who are kind of classic New York designers and very important to the city. And then the fifth was the famous Ralph Lauren show in Bridgehampton. So, you know, so there was a lot happening even before it was officially happening. - Oh my God, did you go to the Hamptons too? - I did go to the Hamptons, I did. It was, you know, the usual extraordinary kind of Ralph Fantasia. He's been recreating his own favorite places for a number of seasons now, right? He held a show in his classic car garage. He held a show in his office. He held a show that in Brooklyn that recreated his Colorado ranch. And this time he held a show in the Hamptons where he has a house, but not his Hampton, was like Ralph Hampton. And he created a sort of incredible vista and then literally meticulously down to the matredee recreated the polo bar. - But in Bridgehampton. - I mean, he had to make it worth the trip, right? - It was a very long trip. - It's great that you're going to the new emerging designers as well. I mean, I'm sure they see you in attendance and it's like the ultimate that you're there. What new designers are really like peeking your interests now? Maybe you've seen them for two to three seasons and you're deeming them worthy of coverage or considering? - I mean, I think certainly Rachel Scott of DoTima who actually won the CFJ Emerging Designer of the year award last year, but in fact, only started her brand three years ago is incredibly talented and I think going to be a major force in New York fashion. She's building her business very deliberately. She's building it slowly. She's still only having presentations. She's not doing runway shows and her work is both original and really desirable, I think. - Tell me what makes for an original collection right now and what cuts through the noise? What about it really like a peach or interest again and caught your attention? It's so hard, it's so crowded, it's so noisy. - I think whether you're talking about a new designer like Rachel or an established designer, this single most important thing for any brand is someone who has a unique point of view and understands what they stand for and is able to express that in the clothes they make. And you see it in the audience that comes to the show because you see an audience that often is wearing the clothes that is more like a community necessarily than just a group of kind of lookalooky-loos. And you see it at brands like Willy Chivarria, which for me was one of the highlight shows of the week. You see it at Who Decides War, which is another emerging brand that I think is incredibly interesting. You see it at Luar, you see it at Colina Strada, you see it at Alaya, which was one of the kind of star moments of Fashion Week, because it came to New York from Paris and held a show on The Guggenheim that was the first show in all six ramps of The Guggenheim in the age frame of the museum. And it gives the work and integrity that has to do with its design, but also the way it's worn by the people who love it. - Yeah, oh my gosh, that looked iconic. I was not invited to that one, but I watched from the sidelines, it was amazing. I mean, there's a lot of talk about kind of, there has been four years in every which way, kind of rewriting the, or I don't know, remodeling the fashion system. And are we doing scene out by now? And should we do more Fashion Week's per year and more collections or drop model and all the things? Like, it's just like what's always worked and still working, or how would you describe the state of that? - I think that Fashion Week has kind of morphed from the way it was originally conceived, which is kind of efficient way to communicate a designer's idea for a single season to press and to retailers, into essentially a content creating moment for the brand for everyone to see, right? Because whether you're someone in the room or you're just watching it on social media, you have access to it in a way that no one had access to it, you know, 15 years ago even. And so brands are using that as a form of communication, right, direct communication. So they don't have to be filtered through the opinions of people like me or the buys of department stores. They can show everything, all their big ideas, to consumers who may not even be buying their clothes, but might be affected by their aesthetic. I might be saying, okay, I can't afford that now, but I can dress kind of in that way. And it will influence me. - Yes, I love that. What were some of the big trends in terms of like, I don't know, anything new in terms of the business approach? I mean, it does have to do with product. I personally, I was hearing a lot of folks telling me they're launching handbags and a lot of folks telling me they're launching menswear. Like all the category expansion, but like, what are you seeing? - I mean, accessories are definitely still a thing. You know, Colleen Estrada, which is a, you know, a brand that has kind of been built on sustainability and has been slowly growing over the years. You know, Hillary Tamar, the designer, started out as this kind of niche person who was regarded as a sort of fringe designer because she kept insisting on doing everything green. You know, and now I think she's really at the heart of a movement in fashion and increasingly recognized as such, you know, but she's launching shoes, she's launching sunglasses because I think all designers understand that, you know, the way you get your big ideas seen, the way you get your values disseminated and shared is by having a healthy and sustainable business so that it can continue, right? There's no point in having a fantastic runway show and then going bankrupt and no one can ever see it again. - Right on, when you're talking about Hillary and it may be wonder, the more affordable options and it's more accessible, I would say, and it got me to thinking about like the shows in Europe and I'm doing, I'm working on a story about basically like, I mean, New York is a fashion capital and there was at a whole McKinsey report and all that stuff. How do you see New York in terms of like kind of the ecosystem? Like, you're going to three more fashion weeks. Like, I don't think, I wouldn't think that you would consider like a preview or a year, getting ready for the good stuff. But like, what do you think is, it's like, it's this role and it's, how do you define it? - I'm actually literally writing a piece called, that's, I sort of called in my head redefining New York fashion week, which is something I think was going on really powerfully this season, you know, I think for years, for most of the kind of evolution of the big fashion weeks, which are weirdly young, right? London is celebrating its 40th anniversary as a fashion week this year, which isn't that actually that, oh, it hasn't been around all that long. This whole sort of circus really started in the 80s. You know, for most of that time, New York was pigeonholed as the sportswear, right? The commercial sportswear venue, right? If Paris was like crazy and fantastical and imaginative and Milan was kind of leather and trends and London was just wacky new designers, New York was sort of very commercial sportswear as separates. And I think that is, you know, that those ideas are still present in the city and there are plenty of designers who are great at that, to where he birthed his great at that, Michael Kors is great at that. But there's this new kind of generation of designers that has come to the fore that are building real businesses but are significantly more political and more overtly political than I think we've ever seen fashion designers be before and certainly more political than they are in Europe where the conventional wisdom still, as it used to be here, is really like you don't express your politics in your brand. It's too off-putting to too many people. It's too risky. You keep that for yourself behind the scenes and you dress everybody, you make clothes for all. And I just think there are designers here who no longer hue to that idea and believe that you have to stand for something. The way to make your clothes feel relevant and urgent is to make them stand for something and be very upfront about expressing what that is. - Yes, I think that's so true and so right. And I see designers, it's like taking control, like they're taking control of their narrative, what they stand for. - Yeah, it's not that they have to, it's not like I'm Republican or I'm Democrat, it's really more like I stand for inclusivity, I stand for the melting pot, I stand for autonomy over your body, right? Like area literally called their show bands off your bar for bodies. You know, I stand for the environment, right? You know, like these are positions and platforms and designers are simply putting them into their clothes. It's like instead of wearing your heart on your sleeve, you're wearing your politics on your sleeve. - Oh, I love that. I'm gonna read your story. Okay, I'll wait for that. - You'll be at tomorrow. - Yeah. (laughs) - Tell me you mentioned like the 80s. Like do you have nostalgia? Like I've been going to Fashion Week since, I mean late Brian Park days, but like anything about like the old Fashion Week that you're like, it should still be this way. I mean, it should definitely, I'll be in one location. We all know that, but like, what do you feel? - Okay, so when I started going to Fashion Week, it was in New York. It was literally Monday to Friday. It was in the working week. And now, like what other industry starts, it's biggest like working event on Friday. - Yes. - And then runs it through the weekend until Wednesday. Like who does that? What is that about? - Oh, I definitely know. And even though shows are generally better about starting on time, right? Which in fashion time means half an hour after the time you're actually called for. You know, I wish everyone had taken a page from that moment in Mark Jacobs' career when after his two and a half hour late show, he started his next show five minutes early. - Amazing. - You know, he proved it could be done. And ever after that moment, people show up exactly on time for his shows. - Nice. - And I just, I think that is a page that everyone could learn from. - Yes. - Did you notice Willie started at like quarter after? I was like, "Whoa, I'm glad I'm here." - You know? - I'm all for that. You know, Anna Wintour is always in her seat at the call time and frankly, the rest of us should be too. - Yes, you're not kidding. Tell me about the state of luxury. - Like you said, the accessories are there. It's becoming more accessible. We're hearing about the leather goods market and it's up and down and it's not seen the growth that it did. Then again, coach came out with like, it seems to me another it bag, that big old coin purse. Tell me state of luxury. - It's complicated. - Yeah. - It's not, I mean, it's not great. Asia, which was an incredibly important market for any international brand, has meaningfully slowed down. That's affecting all everyone's bottom line. And I think there is a sense that consumers are nervous and are not spending the way they spent post-pandemic. You know, we sort of forget that there are causes and effects to consumer behavior. And after, you know, everyone was sort of in lockdown, not spending money, not buying stuff, not going on outside. There was this then like, big swing in the opposite direction when people had some cash lying around next. They hadn't spent it. They wanted to spend and they wanted to buy stuff and they wanted to dress up again maybe and you know, do something indulgent and fun and luxurious. That itch was now scratched. The pendulum's swinging in a different direction. You know, I think people are what I'm hearing from most executives is they're expecting it to be a tough, a tough time for a while. - Yes, is it the same tone that I'm hearing when you talk about the state of the company and the direction, it is basically like, we'll see as of November. Like everyone's like the election and everybody's kind of just like bracing for the election and the outcome and yeah. Brace yourself. - You'll have big implications for sure. - Yeah, good or else, exactly. - What were some highlights from the week in terms of the shows you attended and why they kind of stood out in your mind besides the designers? And I mean, is this show to you? Like the extravaganza of it all, like does that add to? Is it necessary? - You know, I appreciate it when it feels really genuine, when it feels like the audience is there because they really want to be there. You know, as opposed to they're paid to be there, which we all know is what happens often. I was absolutely like a fan girl over, you know, watching Stephanie Seymour run into Naomi Campbell at Linda Evangelisten, have like a mini reunion at a lie. I could say it all been on the catwalk together for those shows in the, you know, in the 90s. I just thought it was so cute. Yeah, you know, and because it was also like, they had a real connection to the brand, right? They weren't just there to see a fashion show. They were there to honor as, you know, I himself had passed away to honor the current designer, Peter Mulier, and, you know, and that was lovely. And, you know, and he made clothes that were literally echoing the ramps of the Guggenheim. And the reason he was at the Guggenheim is because he made a dress last season that had a sort of spiraled around the body. And the museum had gotten in touch with him, right? He didn't reach out to them, they reached out to him and said, wow, that dress looks like our architecture. And a conversation developed and that's how he ended up at the museum. So, you know, to me, that was just like a great connection between place and clothes and audience. And it gave the whole thing a lot of meaning and that made it particularly powerful. Yeah, you know, I felt the same way about, about Willy's show and the clothes he puts on the runway, which are, you know, very graceful, beautiful versions of clothes that aren't normally seen on runways, you know, nods to farm workers, nods to the communities that he grew up in. And he gives them this kind of balm and beauty. By the way, he constructs them, you know, but then they also have all these extra dimensions that feel particularly meaningful today. You see, talking about community and community building, you know, one of the funnest shows, I think, of the week was The Off White Show, which was held on the community basketball courts in Brooklyn Bridge Park. And so there were still people, part of the deal with the courts, was that they kept some of the basketball courts and the handball courts and ping-pong courts open for the public as the show went on. So there were people kind of gathered all around the outside, watching models walk by kind of like, what is this? And you could see the Statue of Liberty in the distance, you could see the Brooklyn Bridge, you could see downtown Manhattan skyline. So it was this very sort of romantic New York vista on a Sunday afternoon. And, you know, it was a coming home really for the brand, which was founded by Virgil Ablo, you know, it was from Chicago, who had shown in Paris to kind of prove that what had been labeled a streetwear was absolutely as worthy of aesthetic value as any high fashion. And had been brought back by the current designer, Eb Kamara. And, you know, it fit in perfectly. It was this incredibly fun audience of Arina Sablanka, who had just won the U.S. Open, of Francis Tiafo, of Flavor Flav and his U.S. women's water polo team, hockey goalie, not hockey goalie, water polo goalie Ashley Johnson. And, you know, and then a great combination of sort of typical off-white brand messaging, the arrows, the iconography and Eb's African heritage. And a kind of super cool aesthetic. It was like the perfect New York melting pot brand. - I love this. There's so much talk about, well, obviously creative director in the shuffling and all that's happening. And there was that question mark about where does off-white go from here? Can it thrive? Can it, I don't know, stay true with DNA and all the things? But yeah, you're saying it's working. And what about it really fits like the DNA of off-white and yet it feels not like a replica of what Virgil was doing? - Well, I think it was, you know, who is from Sierra, grew up in Sierra Leone and Gambia and then emigrated to London when he was 16. You know, really brings that sense of the global melting pot to the brand, which was something that Virgil had started, right? 'Cause here he was an African-American man with a brand that was produced in Milan, but showed in Paris, you know, he already had that kind of international cross-assianic never in one place for too long mix in that was embedded in the DNA of the brand. And Eb has just brought further elements to that. And I think it helps sort of make it richer and bring it along. You know, Virgil had always wanted to come and show the brand in New York according to the CEO and they finally managed to do it. So it was also in a sense, realization of a dream that had existed before it took over. - You know, in terms of trends, like there was tons of fringe, there was like fringe all over the place. There was a lot of nautical stripes because I think, you know, stripes and springtime often come together. There was also, you know, it felt like sort of tryouts for potential Madam President dressing. - Oh, yes, I could see that. (laughing) Yes. And when you said fringe, I was calling it like this car wash flaps or whatever on skirts. - Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. You know, car wash flaps and fringe at Parenza Schuler at area at, God, I just saw it at Michael Kors, I think. It was like, you know, everywhere. - Yes. Oh my God. When you were talking about how the location in the show has to be a fit. I mean, there were some interesting sponsors. This season, and you have to like feel for the designers. Like they're just trying to make a go of it. But I thought that that was, they were exceptionally interesting, we'll say. - Are you talking about only fans in Elena Villas when I got that invite? And I was like, excuse me, Pournhub. Okay. - You know, it's happened before. I think you do what you need to do to put your show on. - Oh my gosh. And let's say in New York is the ultimate influence of what, where fashion is going. What is New York and what we saw this week? If this was, this is us forward, you're not gonna see any of their shows. What would you say about the direction of fashion? - I mean, I think it is, you know, increasingly overtly political. - Yeah. - I think it is about wearing your, you know, your value system on your sleeve and not just your heart on your sleeve. And I think that that is relevant to also a new generation of consumers. So it's exciting. - I mean, just a fun question to sign us off. Do you have a wish list item? Something that's sticking out in your head. - Are you allowed to say this? - I really liked that a lot of bag. I really liked the a lot of bag and I like a lot of do your team is closed. But we'll see if my budget can actually stretch to that. - You have a lot of fashion beaks to attend. You need this in your life. Oh my gosh, Vanessa. Thank you. Thank you for being here. It's such a great conversation. And yeah, for making time for us in the middle of all the hoopla. - This is great. - Nice to talk to you. (upbeat music) - That's all for this episode. Our theme music is by Otis McDonald. If you liked this episode, be sure to share it with someone else you think would. Thanks for listening to the glossy podcast. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [BLANK_AUDIO]