Talkin' Ball with Pat Leonard

Creator Series: Awthentik joins Pat Leonard to talk Joe Schoen, Malik Nabers, Giants' 2024 outlook

Duration:: 2h 27m
Broadcast on:: 30 Aug 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

The New York Daily News' Pat Leonard is joined by the one and only Awthentik of @AwthentikandTheBeard in the first episode of Talkin' Ball LIVE's content creator series to discuss Joe Schoen, the Giants' 2024 expectations, Malik Nabers in jersey No. 1, the Giants' corner situation and season preview topics @Bleav. Pat and Awthentik also answer fan questions and comments to provide a full picture of the team's roster and outlook. SUBSCRIBE to the @PLonNFL YouTube page to get the latest Giants updates and news delivered directly to you, and to participate in regular LIVE Q&A chats with Pat. Purchase a Super Chat or Super Sticker to have your comments elevated to the top of the feed and have Pat answer your question FIRST! Watch the full video of this podcast on Pat's YouTube Channel. Find Pat also on 'X' (@PLeonardNYDN), Instagram (@PLonNFL) & TikTok (@PLonNFL). Talkin' Ball with Pat Leonard is sponsored by @BoomChaga, the BOOM Chaga Mushroom SuperDrink, a natural extract loaded with anti-inflammatory, immune-boosting antioxidants and heart-healthy compounds. We are also sponsored by @BetOnlineag_Official and @Estate98Coffee on @Bleav.

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What I love about Shopify is how no matter how big you want to grow, Shopify gives you everything you need to take control and take your business to the next level. Shopify powers 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. and Shopify's the global force behind all birds, Rothy's, and Brooklyn, and millions of other entrepreneurs of every size across 175 countries. Plus, Shopify's award-winning help is there to support your success every step of the way, because businesses that grow, grow with Shopify. Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at Shopify.com/Westwood1. All lowercase. Go to Shopify.com/Westwood1 now to grow your business. No matter what stage you're in, Shopify.com/Westwood1. All right. Welcome to a special episode of Talkin' Ball Live with Pat Leonard, the first premier edition episode of our Creator Series. We want to welcome special guest co-host for the show tonight, the one and only authentic. Authentic has been incredibly supportive of this channel and obviously produces great giants and NFL content authentic. Thank you so much for joining me, man. This is awesome. Hey, thank you for having me, bro. This is definitely a pretty legendary on my bucket list of talking with some beat reporters, you know, that are really on the grounds with the New York Giants, but definitely appreciate you having me. I think it's a great idea to kind of, you know, give back to the YouTube community of people that are content-creating. So, man, I definitely salute you for having me on tonight. No doubt, no doubt. And like I said, I appreciate all the love. Appreciate you constantly telling people about the community we're building here. You have built an impressive one yourself. Hopefully, both communities are in here listening to what we have to say about the Giants weighing in in the comments section. We will answer your questions. We will answer your super chats and super stickers. But first, authentic and I want to talk about one of the topics of the day right now for the Giants organization and authentic for me. That is Joe Shane's reluctance to articulate expectations for the 2024 NFL season for a team entering a third year where we know expectations have to be high. They have to be much higher. And what I wanted to do right off the bat is have you and I give our take on what is a fair expectation? What should Joe Shane be saying when he's seething there at the microphone saying he really basically shouldn't have to answer that question. What did we want to hear? And what I wanted to hear was something very simple. And that is this is the hundredth season of the New York Giants franchise. We need to put a product on the field that the fans can be proud of. That the Giants franchise that the Giants organization can be proud of. I don't necessarily sitting there as a reporter in those press conferences. I don't expect Joe Shane to say we need to win 12 games so then when they only win 11 people say you missed your goal. That wouldn't be fair. That wouldn't be an adequate way to judge a team. I do think there are some specifics you need to see. Better offensive line play, a competent offense. Coaching staff needs to get together, collaborate well to produce results. But from the general manager angle, from the organization's angle authentic, I think it's more than fair to expect Joe Shane to sit there and tell forget the media, forget us. When they're talking into those cameras, they're talking to the fans, the diehards, the people paying PSLs, the people coming to MetLife Stadium, hoping for another run to the playoffs. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect him to say we need to put a product on the field people are going to be proud of and we need to be competing for a playoff spot because this is year three of a process and we're not asking for more time. We know the job we signed up for. Do you think that's fair on my part? How do you feel about what Joe Shane should have been saying? Yeah, I mean, I absolutely think that's fair, more than fair, to be honest. And I think at this point with some of the moves that Joe Shane has, you know, done or lacked thereof and I'm thinking about the quarterback position when I really think about that because I think that's the biggest blemish on Joe Shane's tenure here with the New York Giants. At this point, entering year three after two very lackluster drafts from 2022 and 2023, you know, my expectation is for him to go up to the podium and say, "Hey, we're about to bring you results." And if he would have put a win total on it, I would have felt really good about that. Instead, he kind of got offended when we saw, I think it was Dan Duggan that had asked him about that. Like, you know, I don't want you to put a win total on it, but what are the expectations considering what John Merra had told him, you know, that we're trying to raise the bar pretty much. For me, it's like, yeah, we're in year three. We need results now. We can't keep beating around the bush in all of these press conferences and pretty much just acting like we're dedicated to a rebuild the whole time that Joe Shane has been here because we know that's not the case. I've spoken about this a lot on my channel that, to me, one of the biggest red flags from Joe Shane was when he came in and he talked some of the same rhetoric as Dave Gedelman, which was, we're going to try to compete while rebuilding. And to me, that was just a major red flag because the New York Giants were in the position where that team should have been stripped down. Figure out who are the cornerstone pieces, which I will give Joe Shane his credit on that. He did re-sign some of the guys that I thought were cornerstone pieces, Andrew Thomas Dexter Lawrence, bringing in guys like Bobby O'Karrick. I like the Brian Burns move, but when you look at how they mismanaged the quarterback situation and also mismanaging coming out of 2022, it almost seems like Joe Shane is kind of putting Brian Dable in this like a bit of a tough situation if you ask me because you're in and you're looking at the GM, the roster, the lack of veterans on this offensive line and trying to bank on youthful guys that he drafted in his drafts and setting up Brian Dable in return for tough seasons that it seems like Brian Dable now two years in a row has overachieved but a lot of people are talking about Brian Dable being on the hot seat. 2022, he went to the playoffs, won a playoff game, you know, came out of that, went into 2023 and you lose your quarterback, you lose your left tackle along with plenty of other injuries, your offensive line was set up to have zero depth on it and Joe, and Brian Dable still went out there and he was able to win six games with Tommy DeVito and Ty Rod Taylor with a historically bad offensive line. So at this point, it almost feels like there's a little bit of tension there and that's just me kind of gauging the body language in the room. You know, Brian Dable just kind of looking over like you sure you're saying the right stuff here and it just seems like Brian Dable's being put in a tight situation here and I don't know what he's saying. I think it would be a shame that if Brian Dable couldn't get his quarterback in his whole entire tenure here being that he's a coach that has overachieved in both years that he's been here already. Man, what a breakdown that was. You have your finger on the pulse of that. It's interesting that watching the press conference, watching the dynamic, you were able to dissect what it looks like is happening up there that's unsaid, right? Because we hear the words, but there's so much that goes unsaid, but yet you're sitting there feeling it, watching it, understanding that there's more of a dynamic at play than just what we're hearing, the words that is coming out of the general manager's mouth. And I'll take it a step further authentic. I think that it wasn't just the topic of expectations that seem to get under Joe's Shane skin there, I thought the mentioning of John Mara specifically saying significant improvement is expected seem to get to him there. It seemed like he said, yeah, he's the most important guy. That's who you talk to almost came off as a flippant reference to that. I think when I go back to hard knocks and I watch some of those scenes we saw on hard knocks where it wasn't comfortable, right? And listen, there's discomfort when it comes to making difficult decisions in organizations in the NFL. But when you come to the owner and the general manager clearly, clearly not seeing eye to eye and bristling kind of on both sides. And then you see a question posted to the GM about the owner's expectations and back to back answers. He reacts to like that where authentic legitimately in the final answer that I know has gone viral. He looked like he was going to almost erupt at one point out of, I don't know if it was anger or frustration, whatever it was, and he kind of brought it back in. But interestingly enough, that's usually what we had seen. Like when Brian Dable has struggled over there on the sidelines losing composure, Joe Shane normally buttoned up. I think it really just points to there's pressure, like there's pressure on them. And I mean job pressure on them to show results early on is the way I see it. But we're going to get into all of that incredible breakdown by you right off the, right off the bat, right there. And I want to tell our listeners and viewers here on the Believe Network talking ball here with Pat Leonard with authentic joining us live on the YouTube channel, PL on NFL. You got to always check out authentic content as well. But we're going to tell you first about our sponsors here and then get into some more giants talks and more giants questions. We are sponsored here by the boom chaga mushroom super drink, a natural extract loaded with anti inflammatory immune boosting antioxidants and heart healthy compounds. You can easily pour this natural liquid supplemented to any of your favorite drinks. I put it in my coffee every morning and immediately feel the difference. I personally have felt a purse post workout like energy boost with boom. Chaga also has the ability to lower cholesterol, reduce inflammation and improve immune and heart health with its beta gluten and antioxidants. Go to boom chaga.com today to place your first order. 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When the game is over head on over to our online casino and get in on a game of blackjack or pogor or our wind with our over 150 slack games. Get in also on our $200,000 mega contest and pick five games against the spread every week for your chance at weekly prizes and a share of $200,000. Head to the website today to get in on the action. Then online the game starts here and authentic before we get into some more topics and the questions. I want to put it to our chat. I've been doing I started last chat we started doing a little bit of a trivia section and whoever gets our question answered first correctly receives a free bottle of a state 98 coffee. One of our sponsors here. So everybody who's in the chat get ready. Here comes the question. I'm only going to go simply on what I see the first answer in the chat. Okay. On the Giants current roster at the roster that was handed to me this morning at practice. There are only three players on the Giants roster who have double digit years experience in the NFL. So that would be 10 or more years experience in the NFL three players. You have to give me all three. Once I see a comment with all three names correct. You will win a bottle of a state 98 coffee. I will ship it to you once you win send me a DM on Instagram and I will ship it to whatever PO box or address you want. So three veterans with double digit experience. You know, it's funny authentic. The other day when I had the question of who had the second most TDS on the team in the last two years, answer started rolling in. It was dariously and dariously and dariously and dariously. Today took took people a while. Right. So I see one somebody says Geno road chest Van Rotten. That is not the correct trio. Casey Kreider, Geno and Nacho, not the correct trio. Let's see, we have Van Rotten, Geno, Kreider, not the correct trio. Looks like Bill is the first one to get it correct, I believe. He says Graham, Geno, Greg Van Rotten and Nacho, Raqim Nunez, Roaches. Is that the first person to say all three correctly there? I believe. Oh, wait. Oh, wait, authentic, what? Did you drop it first? Authentic? That's probably my co-host, the beard one time over there. Oh, no. I haven't got that one right. He's a card collector, so he might know that one. Oh, so it looks like the beard and build both dropped it in. So I'll have to hook you both up there. It looks like they came in back to back the beard. Good job. Sorry, I didn't see that first. So the beard gets one. Bill gets one. Way to go, guys. Way to go. All right. So thank you for playing. Thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. Let's get into a couple questions here, authentic. We'll bat that around and then we'll talk a little bit more. Giant's topic. Okay. So we have bluegrass picker says. Authentic in all. Yeah. Exactly. Right there. Oh, really with the exclamation points. Real people says let's go. Miz is in the house. G-men says it's 2 a.m. in the UK, but just here to say what's going on. Authentic keeps it real as always with the G-men. Michael Knight says hello to me and authentic as well. And Gabe with Chronicles looks like he's got a lot to say. This is a lot, Gabe. So I'm going to try to boil this down, authentic. He's talking about the Joe Shane press conference. And he says that he's demoralized as a fan. Tired of the same product and the press conference. Makes you feel like here we go again. Gabe, I think that's part of what we're talking about here. Hard to disagree with you. Randy excited about authentic's presence. Same with NYC one teased. My dog. Man, all the people in the house tonight. Barb is here as always. Daydan is here. Peter says. What's up? Gary excited. Fire episode coming. No doubt. Looks like we got our first super chat. Super chat in the house. And it is Peter Randazzo checking in with a $10 super chat. And there it is. Look at that. A donation just because authentic is on. My man. My man. Showing respect to authentic's content, creation, and how he keeps it real. No doubt about it. And let's see. Talk ball. Real talk says Gary. And Chris Peace. Looks like he's multitasking says this ND state Colorado game is pretty darn good. Well, if you're watching it, keep one eye here because we got plenty more coming. But I appreciate it. And I understand there, Chris. Itch for football is on, right? Authentic. Yeah. I was watching that right before we popped into the stream. And Shadir was looking pretty good. He had two touchdowns already. Good enough for you to say to put him on your board for next year's draft or what? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean, I just need to change the quarterback at this moment in time. No doubt. I hear that. All right. So as we go through the chat authentic, one topic I wanted to raise with you as well. We talk about Joe Shane there. We talk about, you know, the expectations these giants have for the season as D kit also checks in. Here's a donation. So authentic can hit the buffet, he says, shout out, shout out D kit, man. D kit there to talk about another supporter. But the one other topic of the day topic of the week for me is Malik neighbors putting on number one, Ray Flaherty's jersey, unretired for a rookie wide receiver who has not yet played in the game authentic. And I think there's a measure of coolness to this and the vibes are high with Malik neighbors, right? Then again, does this add a lot of pressure? And is this a little bit of a drastic step to take for a rookie for a guy who hasn't made his bones in the league? What is, what is your viewpoint on number one going to neighbors in this way? I think it does add some pressure for sure. It might have been better for the Giants to just roll out some kind of a plan to start to unretired these numbers. I'm glad they got, you know, approval, Malik neighbors did get approval from either the family or from Flaherty himself. So that's a really good thing. But I think it does add some pressures a rookie hasn't played yet. I've got no real problems with them, unretiring jerseys. I'm a, you know, when I play ball, I loved the single digit numbers. When I buy jerseys, like if it's like a Dexter Lawrence Jersey, I'm not about to wear a big old 99. I need a single digit. You I'm a slender guys. My guy. He's talking about the kind of sleek numbers. And I like that. I mean, number one, hopefully, you know, Malik neighbors really pans out so that, you know, those jersey sales go up and then I can actually cop on because I haven't bought a jersey since like 2017 Eli Manning. So I'm looking for a player to hit the ground running like that where I can purchase a new New York, John's Jersey. You haven't bought a jersey since Eli? Yeah. Yeah. I bought an Odell Beckham one for my girl and I was about to buy one for me, but I just didn't do it. Since then, all I have is a Eli, a Tiki and I have a shout out to my guy, Sir knock who blessed me with this. It was a 1986 Carson jersey that has the spider lock heart patch on it. Yeah. Bless me with that. So those are my really my only three Jersey. I got a duplicate of my Eli Jersey, but it's kind of from like the baggy hip hop Mitchell and S era where I probably won't wear it today. Yeah. Right. Right. Right. Nine years ago, he was tired of, you know, seeing the guys, he was wearing all their jerseys and they would either get traded or cut or fall out of favor. And he asked me one of those years, I was covering the team early on. He said, who's a guy, a good player, I can get his jersey and he's going to be around for a long time. And at the time, I was like, I'm thinking about the roster and I said, landing Collins. And he bought it. And it was like a year and a half later. He's out. Yeah. And I was like, I don't even know why I answered that. But I get it. I'm going to land in Collins too, man. Big fan is. Oh, me too. No, I mean, he was what all pro that year, 2016 that year of that defense with Januir's Jenkins, Jackrabbit and Snacks Harrison and Landon and the back man, his, what was that? An interception return in London, I think it was that was a great full circle moment. Yeah. I love that. Seal that game. That was awesome. What a player is actually funny. This is a random comment, but I was talking to neighbors today about whether he watches football or not, and because people might be surprised, but like some guys who play in the league don't really watch football when it's not film, like they watch the film of their opponents in this and that, but on a Saturday or Sunday where they're off or whatever, they're not just sitting watching the game, like landing Collins, for example, always would say like, I don't watch football. And it always caught us off guard. We're like, what are you talking about? Like you're an elite football player is like, yeah, I don't watch it though. Others was saying he loves college, you know, so like he knows NFL, whatever, but he said he loves watching college football. And I was talking to him and Ben Whitley, some guys in there about how like in college, everybody is so hungry to get to the league. And so it's so visceral, the amount of like effort and the hunger and the desperation that the guys are putting on the field. So that's always like a funny thing I always think about when guys tell me they don't watch football nuts. Yeah. So NYG Mason says, oh, first of all, $10 super chat. Thank you. NYG. Can we talk about why emlin tunnels number isn't retired? Good question. I do not have an answer to that. I'm not going to pretend like I do. I can tell you that in the organization, some things take longer and more time than they should. Right. Coughlin going in the ring of honor, right? Like remember him, he would, he was refusing to get off the podium when the band was playing him off the field because he felt like it was overdue. You know, guy like, you know, Leonard Marshall, who, or even even think about Phil Sims, Phil Sims is only now kind of really back around the organization, like a real presence more so than like you would expect one of the best players in their franchise's history would be all over the building, all over the organization, like an ambassador. You know, so I don't know the exact answer to the tunnel question there, NYG. I do know though, and this is not just about the giants, but like sometimes whether it's politics, relationships, or things that came, you know, came the past, why a player left, how that, how it ended when they were in their playing days, things just sometimes take time to heal or get overlooked. And I would answer you with this, NYG, people need to advocate for, let's say, a player's jersey number not retired, or a player who belongs in the organization who has become estranged or whatever it is that you need an advocate or else people don't talk about it. Yeah, I brought this one up today actually on Twitter because somebody brought to my attention that the number was not retired because I thought this whole time that the number was retired, and I've been doing a bunch of research on a lot of the older players, you know, from the Giants organization and whatnot. So I used to live in DC for a while, I just moved back to Maryland where I'm originally from. Okay. And Tuffy Lemons is actually buried like at the cemetery, like right around the corner from my house. So like in, you know, cutting up this documentary and doing some filming, I went over there and I got some footage from it, but I did bring this up on Twitter and Mason was talking to me about it. Emily Tonto, I mean, first African American player for the Giants in general, he's the first defensive player to ever be in the Hall of Fame. And you know, it's just, I think that it's been so long now, he would have been celebrating his hundreds birthday in July during the Giants 100 season, I think it would make sense. So I've been trying to do my part, telling people to retweet that post to try to, you know, get some attention on it and whatnot because I think at the same time of like opening the doors for unretiring a Jersey like, you know, formerly neighbors, I think that's amazing. But also like a guy like Emily Tonto, I think it would be proper if his Jersey is retired unless they're going to, you know, pull out all these jerseys out of retirement, you know. Wow. That's that I got to admit, this is not something I'm a school that on as, as you are, you're like teaching me about this right now, as far as the ins and outs, all that. And this honestly seems like something I need to look into more and cover and write about to be honest with you. Yeah, I do some, you know, because I used to wear number four in high school, and I remember looking up like why the Giants have retired certain numbers, and I saw a Tuffy Lehman's and then it was like, Tuffy Lehman's opened up this bowling alley that's like really famous around here was a duck pin bowling alley when we were kids, and also like had a hand in like something with the St. Michael's church that's around this area as well too. So I started going through all the numbers and then that's how I kind of stumbled upon Emily Tonto and like I said, I thought the number was retired. I mean, you would, you would think a guy like that, you know, first African-American in the Hall of Fame, first African-American for the New York Giants, and then his numbers back it up, you know, he's like second interceptions or something still. So I think it's something that, you know, the Giants should revisit. Thank you for bringing that up, NYG. Thanks for asking the question, authentic. Thanks for advocating and I'm going to do more reporting on this. This is not the end of that conversation for sure. Let's see. So Danny Dudd puts it, puts it to us this way about Daniel Jones. He says, by the way, Randy Guardiola says authentic is the truth. And no matter what it says, what's up. All right. So Danny says, what do you guys think is more likely to happen? Daniel Jones throws 15 touchdowns or plays 15 games, both huge numbers for him. More likely is 100% 15 touchdowns. In my opinion, like playing 15 games, the line might be better. I'm not saying it's fixed and injury prone guys are injury prone. I mean, not to mention just its football in general, I'm going to say 15 TD passes. What do you think, authentic? I'm going to go with 15 touchdowns passes, too. I think like if he could start off having a, you know, salvageable type of year, he wouldn't need to get the 15 games necessarily to throw over that amount of touchdowns. It does remind me of something somebody told me on Twitter today that you can go back eight years. Daniel Jones hasn't thrown over 25 touchdowns. If you date it back to college, so that number is a little sketchy of 15. The injuries have been a problem here four out of five years. He's been injured. It's tough. I think I'm going to go touchdowns as well too. Can we go total touchdowns? Like it would be tough, man. Daniel Jones struggles to get that ball in the end zone. No doubt, not to mention that if things slip early and they're losing games, he gets pulled because of the injury guarantee and all that. You could be sitting like if you get, you get money on and over under like that, it could be like when you, uh, when you got the guy in the NBA over under it, like 21 and a half and he's got 21 and they just pull him with like four minutes to go on the fourth quarter. You know what I mean? It's all too often. I'm speaking from experience. That's not someone else's story. That's it. All right. That Mike Goodman with $20 super chat checks in and says, thanks for saving me from a boring night. You got it, man. Anytime we're having a lot of fun here. This is talking ball live with Pat Leonard featuring co-host authentic, a big time giants and NFL content creator and a huge supporter of our community and I am especially and super grateful to authentic for promoting what I do and what we've been doing here. He came in here organically and was saying, I like the way that you talk. I like the way that you're including people. I like the way that we're building something here where people can bat around ideas about the giants and I'm totally honest, authentic. Like right there was a great example of, I start this and I'm like, okay, I cover the giants. I want to bring information to people. But that was a great example of you're bringing information to me. You know what I mean? Like I'm learning just as much doing these as I'm. Chat is like that too, I've noticed that on YouTube a lot, I learned a lot from them as well. They might update some statistics that I don't know and things like that. It's just, you know, I'm all about like, hey, if it's good, I'm going to support it. No doubt. Yeah. No, I appreciate that. All right. Let's see. Stephen says, Pat, I often think once the first round of free agency is over in the draft that any of the moves done after really doesn't help your team that much because if someone really could help, they'd already be gone. It's actually a really good segue authentic into Duke Shelley, the corner that the Giants just signed who was caught by the Minnesota Vikings. Now this guy's 27 years old, he's a veteran. He started 11 games appeared and I think it's something like 56 games in his career actually played against and started against the Giants in the playoff game where Daniel Jones set NFL record. So not great. I did check his coverage grade from PFF in that game was just under 80, which is interesting. It's not a bad grade at all. Not bad. Not bad. Yeah. His overall grade was a little lower, I think because I think it was either his run defense or his tackling, but his passing, passing grade was good. Now, this brings me to the question that I was going to pose to you about Duke Shelley, which is they signed into the practice squad. You can tell that this is, you know, this isn't a young guy they're bringing in to develop. You sign a guy like this, you're running them out there grooming them to play for your team. Do you hold out hope this late when a team makes a targeted acquisition like that, like a relatively minor, not a huge name, not a Stefan Gilmore that people were hoping for a type thing? Do you hold out hope that a guy like that could get plugged into a scheme last minute like this and improve the defense, be a better option than what the team has? Or do you think that's kind of fools gold to say that, you know, this is the corner that's going to kind of resolve the secondary issues from your vantage point? So for me, it's, you know, history can repeat itself, but I don't like to look back at history and think, oh, well, you know, Eli Manning started this way. Here goes Daniel Jones or Andrew Thomas came in this way, Evan Neal should follow suit. But the Giants do have some experience in this department already, you know, with Fabian Marro, who came in and he was a viable starter for us for a little while here. I do think it is pretty late in the free agency period and it does make it tough. And this isn't a name I feel like, I mean, maybe I was a little bit more familiar with Fabian Marro because I'm here in Washington, DC. So I kind of knew what was going on with him and knew he was a capable corner when he was here in that defense with Duke Shelley. That's a name that's been, you know, definitely under my radar. So I'm going to hold out hope and I'll be a little bit optimistic about it, but the expectation is not very high. And this is coming off Joe Shane just saying in that press conference that, hey, I feel confident with the corners we have in this room and I think that was an egregious statement as well. We already seen what Nick McLeod brings to the table. We already know with Cordial Flot, the weaknesses in his game and cornerback two is a weakness. I mean, obviously, and I think that the Giants would be better served if Deontay Banks was a cornerback two and they could bring in a guy that was truly a cornerback one. Instead, they're putting a lot on his shoulders, you know, going into what just his second year here, you know, hoping that he can mature and develop into a cornerback one, which to me is the same mistake they made with some of the offensive linemen in the first year here. But what one disappointing comments shade made when he was talking about corners to is he made this offhand comment about, he said, if you look around the league, most teams don't have three good corners anyway. I put that quote down. I thought it was mind boggling. I don't know. I didn't even know where to begin with a comment like that, like you just practiced against the Jets. Like the Jets have several really good corners, including their two starters who like you sign right now to have those two guys starting like he was essentially saying having multiple good corners is rare in the NFL. That's not a true statement, even against the Houston Texans as well in the preseason game. I mean, I know one of them was a rookie, but you can see that secondary is definitely stacked up. I think you make a good point though. You're allusion to Maro and your comparison there. I think is a good one. If we want to spin it optimistically for a second, the now Fabian Maro. This episode is brought to you by progressive insurance, fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to progressive and save hundreds because progressive offers discounts for pain and full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help you when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit progressive.com to see if you can save on car insurance. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary, not available in all states or situations. My dad works in B2B marketing. He came by my school for career day and said he was a big row as man, then he told everyone how much he loved calculating his return on ad spend. My friends still laugh at me to this day. Not everyone gets B2B, but with LinkedIn, you'll be able to reach people who do. Get a $100 credit on your next ad campaign. Go to linkedin.com/results to claim your credit, that's linkedin.com/results. But, he was an NFL player, that's something that I think people on the outside looking in don't always fully understand the difference between, there's a lot of veterans, like we're talking about now, getting recycled around the league. But the reason is because even though they're not high level or they used to be high level and they're not what they used to be, they're still professionals who give you a baseline of expectation of what you're getting from them. Like you know the bottom's not going to fall out on those guys. Like Fabian Marot was never going to be your best player and he was going to get picked on sometimes, but the bottom was never going to fall out on the game because he was on the field. And like that is what an NFL player is. You could even go on their offensive line and say that's what Greg Van Rotten hopefully has been signed to be. He's not going to be their best lineman, he's not going to be their second best lineman, he might not even be their third best lineman. But his job is to make sure that a play doesn't collapse essentially. And so, the optimistic view of Duke Shelley is, now he did practice today by the way and is interesting. They ran kind of like an out like fade with Hyatt, it was two on twos in the end zone and Hyatt beat him to the corner and caught it and then Shelley knocked it out of his hands as he was trying to toe tap, right, right? And yeah, it was interesting. I was wondering whether they were going to still give it to him and know that ref like right in Hyatt's face, you know, incomplete. So savvy move, savvy move there by Shelley. So the optimistic view would be, you know, if he is, he's not, you know, we're not expecting him to be a Stefan Gilmore, but if he's, like you said, if he's better than Nick McLeod and Cordell Flott, now you've, even if marginally augmented your defense, last thing I would say authentic. Tell me what you think of this. So Joe Shane, he didn't say it sounded like he was saying they prefer Cordell Flott if he's healthy and I'm seeing some more super chats rolling in. We're going to get to those in a second. Thank you so much, guys, for supporting me and authentic here on Talking Ball Live with Pat Leonard on the Believe Network, but Shane also said at one point, he's rattling off different players that are giving them something and he goes, Nick McLeod is still here. He's a valuable role player for us. Did that, did you, did that catch your ear when he called him a role player? Like that, I don't know where to begin. It makes me feel, that makes me feel like they have no confidence in that player. Do you read that the same way? Like as a starter, I mean, they don't think he can be that guy. Nick McLeod being the guy that probably has more experience. I think that does lend, you know, his way a little bit better than a guy like Cordell Flott who, I mean, we saw Cordell Flott, I mean, he can be decent in coverage. He had that nice pick in the playoffs. I want to say it through a flag when it got called back. But definitely not a guy who's going to step up and be an asset and stopping the run and stuff like that. So, I mean, I read into that a little bit too, and if I had to make a, you know, put some money down on it and make a bet who's going to start a cornerback to start the year, it be Nick McLeod. I think that the Jets practices really didn't help him out with Gary Wilson, you know, those highlights being all over social media, getting burnt on a couple of routes, but it seems like he's the most viable option right now. It's interesting. This is a really interesting question because I agree with you that it seems to track that McLeod as a vet is someone they may trust more to start out within week one, but I get the feeling they want Flott to be the guy. So, I'm very interested to see if Flott really is healthy, I'm very interested to see if they roll him out there opposite banks against, you know, Justin Jefferson, Jordan Addison and that offense. So, Michael Sedrone, $10. Thank you, Michael. He says, "We all know where this is going, 4 and 13 or 5 and 12, and a house cleaning will be upon us over under at week 10 when Dabel finally cracks." I agree. It's not going to end up well. This sets me up to ask you a question. I wasn't even planning on talking about this tonight, authentic, but now that he puts it like this, like he sees this going this way, do you want Bill Belichick to be the Giants head coach next year if they have a if they have a new coach? Have you thought that far ahead to it and did you want to know a little bit about it? I wouldn't be opposed to bringing in a guy like Bill Belichick. I mean, he has been away from the game for a second here. I just I don't want Brian to able to be the scapegoat for the the issues that are happening on the rosters, you know, for the New York Giants. And I've talked about this, like the Giants need more football people in the building and having a guy like Bill Belichick in a building, it wouldn't hurt. And honestly, if I had the ideal situation, it would be to pair him with a guy like Brian Dabel. And you know, maybe Brian Dabel gets relegated to offensive coordinator, but it's very rare that you see that happening in the NFL. I think there was only one case I've ever seen of that happening. And it was like in the late 70s, early 80s with Kansas City, I believe it was. So man, probably very unlikely, but I'm not going to shy away from one of the greatest coaches in NFL history that, you know, was was bred here with the New York Giants. I'm not going to shy away from that, but at the same time, I'm not one of these people that's very low on Brian Dabel and his the results that he's put out there thus far. No, that's fair. That's fair. As far as like you're saying, the scapegoating, which you don't want to see. And I think you make a great point, which is going back to how we started talking about expectations and talking about that press conference with Joe Shane and Brian Dabel. I think that this is setting up to possibly be like, let's say these first six, seven, eight games, right, pre pre by pre Germany, right? I think this is setting up to possibly be a finger pointing session, whether it's in leaks to the media, whether it's in subtle comments, post game, I feel like Brian Dabel sees that that possibly coming. Like, I think I thought his comments about how many injuries they had the other day, that like jumped out in my face because I thought that was him saying, like, I'm about to go into a season here with all the pressure on me and everybody's getting hurt. And no one's saying anything about what I'm working with here like that, you know, I thought that was very much a commentary on where he stands. And also, interestingly enough, you know, who knows what this means, but off of the really tense presser led by Shane's demeanor, Dabel today, as we sit here, this is Thursday, August 29th, was as nice and helpful in a press conference authentic as I've ever seen him. I mean, it was almost like him over correcting to say, like, listen, you know, you got treated this way yesterday, I'm here to help. What do you got? So, you know, people could say I read into things like that or someone's reading into things like that. But I've been around long enough authentic to know that where there's smoke, there is fire when when it comes to the NFL, these things that blame sometimes to looking into things a little bit too much. And one other thing on that, that topic there that I'm looking into here is if things start to spiral defensively with Shane Bowen coming in as the new defensive coordinator, that I think will also be blamed on Brian Dabel as well for not being able to salvage the relationship between him and Wink Martenail kind of not won't say forcing him out the door, but having a good partner. See, I so I would think that part of the blame is fair. Like I would see that as fair because that's his purview. I would not see as fair that they resigned Daniel Jones for four one sixty because that's not his job. That's not what he did. Right. So yeah, I think that see that's why it's so interesting. You go topic to topic, it's like where does it lie, but that's what happens when things go wrong is people look for blame people to blame. All right. So JJ and checks in. He's always supporting us. JJ and thank you so much as fellows. Thank you for all you do. We need CB to short, sweet, right to the point. He knows what he's talking about. Ryan also another constant supporter of the chats is smiling ear to ear right now. This needs to happen more often, gents. Let's talk Theo Johnson. That calls him boxy Pat. What do you say? Boxy. Wait, explain that authentic. I like that. So, you know, I definitely thought that we're going to address tight end in this draft, right? The closer we got to the draft because it just seemed like the retirement of Darren Waller was pretty inevitable. And you know, hearing Darius Layton on Kishan Johnson's podcast, he made it seem like all year they were trying to convince Darren Waller like, you know, come back, man, just play another year and Darren Waller was kind of clocked out. I would have went for a guy like Tanner McLachlan coming out of Arizona. The Cincinnati Bengals ended up drafting him. And when I was looking at guys that were going to be available for us in the later rounds, maybe like five through seven, I was thinking you could get a guy like Tanner McLachlan. And then, you know, I got put on at Theo Johnson as we drafted him and whatnot. And I started to look at his tape and I thought, you know, this guy is just a massive human being, definitely has the body size look like he was pretty nimble on his tape. And just seeing him in the limited reps, I've seen him in, you know, in the preseason games and what we've seen out of practice, seems like a guy who's not really that agile at the hips, in my opinion, and doesn't really have a leading characteristic in one department or the other when it comes to being a pass catcher or when it comes to being a dominant blocker out there. And I know it's very early. I don't want to jump the gun and, you know, having a egregious take on it. But that's just what I'm seeing so far. I thought he could be a guy who had some of the skill set of some of the, um, the more like a top end kind of pass catchers, you know, like the TJ Hockingsons and stuff like that with a larger catch radius. And it just seems like he's just not that nimble and not that agile from the hips. I think that's, I think, no, I think that's a fair evaluation of him. And in fact, you know, now this happens with rookies, like ball security sometimes with skilled players, running backs, whatever, like that's typical rookie stuff. He started out camp, you know, obviously banged up, but then once he was playing, even in the spring looked really good, both moving as a pass catcher, right? Like 11, 11, the 11 before they were hitting, of course. And also as a blocker physically, and this goes for their whole rookie class. Their whole rookie class is pretty big. And I mean, obviously these football players are coming in from D one, but like, I mean, these guys are built like they've been in the league a couple of years. Now that said, you know, I think he can help them more as a rookie as a blocker. I think is going to be where people like him, then as a receiver, because he is big enough to move people. He's tough as nails, but at a certain point in camp authentic, he started dropping a lot of balls. I mean, a lot. And that was purely from my vantage point, a hands issue in those moments. So that's a concern. I think the area where he will show up as most helpful as a receiver is the red zone. I think at Penn State, when you looked at that too, it was like, yeah, how are they using him mostly as a receiver? Where is he tracking as like where he could help an NFL offense immediately? It was in the red zone using his big body, using his size, using that ability. In fact, like when you talk about cutting a guy like Isaiah Hodgins, who's a bigger wide receiver who goes up and gets the ball and contested catches in the end zone, you're cutting a guy like that. He's back on the practice squad, obviously, but you're cutting a guy like that because you're saying we're adding a size like Theo Johnson at tight end to serve that role. So that's where I think you have to cross your fingers and hope that they're using him in the appropriate ways. They're not asking him to do things in the open field that are uncomfortable or not his strength or skill set. But I don't think I don't think you're off at all on the player there. And like I said, you know, it could just be a rookie wall and training camp where guys aren't used to going through this at the NFL level against the bodies they're facing. And so kind of get gassed a little bit and you have to acclimate to it before you bounce back. Right. So we've seen guys drop passes early, Darius Slaton before, and then turn into really productive players. But I think that's a really good point. And Ryan, thank you for getting us going on that. Chris checks in with five bucks, Chris. Thank you so much. As always, he says, do you think Joe, oh, hold on trying to read this here. Oh, do we think Jones isn't good this year? Do you think GM and coach are in trouble since they're the ones that paid him? Yes, I do. I do think authentic if Daniel Jones isn't good, the GM and coach are both in trouble because that means they're not winning games. I do also think there are permutations of how the season could go where Jones struggles. And if the roster and the strategy and game management side of this team are much improved and obviously improved and Daniel sticks out as the sore thumb and the only wrong thing. Joe Shane still has to take it on the chin that he paid the guy, right? But that to me is the scenario. They go into next year and they can look us in the face and say, we just need a quarterback. We're only a quarterback away. But what do you think of that? Yeah, I'm right there with you on that. I do think that the biggest issue that will be presented is if Daniel Jones has one of those middle-length 2022 type of years, I think that's going to cause more problems than it's going to fix things because we've already seen America kind of double down on it after the 2022 season saying, kind of like I told you so, like this guy has it in him. And then you saw him kind of regress after getting paid in 2023. So for me, if Joe Shane and the front office is thinking forward thinking, I think they're already thinking about what they need to do a quarterback next year. For me, personally, there isn't any type of season that Daniel Jones could really have outside of like Patrick Mahomes 50 touchdowns type season where I would consider bringing him back. You know, I talk about this on my channel a lot. There are a few statistics to me that are just extremely glaring about him. 39. I thought it was 38. It's 39 straight regular season games without having back-to-back games with at least two passing touchdowns. And that's an active streak happening right now. He hasn't thrown for three touchdowns in the game since December of 2019, the chase young ball. And it's just been a lot of struggling at the quarterback position that I feel like they're kind of trying to mask it and make it look better than it really is. And I think the New York fans are kind of falling for it. There's a bit of a smoke and mirrors here, I feel like. And fans think, oh, well, now we got the pieces around him. This guy coming off his ACL is supposed to have his best year to date. I like to take a guy's best season, remove it, and then try to assess him. So let's say that's 2022. If you take that out, Daniel Jones has been maybe even below an average quarterback. I don't like to say that much. But Jones has just been a guy that if you take away 2022, it's very mediocre. And he had more fourth-quarter comebacks in 2022 than he had in his entire career combined. He had more game-winning drives in 2022 than he's had in his entire career combined. I think it's more of what we saw under Jason Garrett and under Joe Judge and under Pat Schurmer, and what we saw last year than it is in that one anomaly over year in 2022. Now, great breakdown there. And also, the thing about 2022 is we're talking a little bit about this, the last talk of all live. That was such a full circle coaching job by Martindale, the defense, Dable, as far as the strategy of how to protect the offense from those key mistakes and do only what he felt they did well, right? They went into every game like, "This is the one way we can win this game. Here's how we have to do it." And they did it well. And Daniel was a cog in that wheel, but he was not elevating them most of those games, right? The Indianapolis game and the Minnesota playoff game were two examples where you started to see him kind of blossoming a little bit, right? Those are the games that got him paid for sure. But by and large, like you said, all of the most positive stretch of his career was when he was being managed, right? And listen, there's nothing wrong with quarterbacks being managed. Lots of quarterbacks get managed, right? Like Brock Purdy is in a system that accentuates his skills, right? Like, that's just one example of many, right? It's not the same about two as well. Oh, you get, oh, 100%. That's actually a better example because Purdy is, Purdy looks frankly like a better quarterback than Toa. That's a really good point, right? Like, if you put Toa on 32 teams, how many of them would he actually succeed on without a play caller who was protecting himself from himself and accentuating his strength? So that is the concern with Jones, really, is like how many scenarios can he survive in or thrive in, right? So that's a great point. And then any time you have a quarterback like that, like I split quarterbacks into two categories. There are quarterbacks that need a running game and need a running back and they need the game managed. And then there are quarterbacks that you can throw out there like Josh Allen that are just going to be able to just kind of get things done. And I think Daniel's in that category of I need things around me, I need a running back. When you have that quarterback, it's rare that a franchise is not thinking about, well, who's the next quarterback? And I don't know if they're doing that in the building or not, but it just seems like, well, I mean, from hard knocks, they're obviously thinking about it. You saw the interest in Drake May, but then I also felt like I saw in Joe Shane, the general manager, a guy that was convincing everybody else around him that I think we're just going to roll with Daniel and we'll be okay. You could see that in the office conversation with Brandon Brown and Tim McDonald. And you saw it in the conversation where they're in the dark room looking at tape where they were talking about Jayden Daniels as well. So it seems like there are other people in the front office that understand what they need to do with the quarterback position, at least for the future. But it seems like Joe Shane's kind of like, hey, well, this was the plan. From the onset, to be able to put weapons around Daniel Jones and bolster the offensive line. And it just seems like a bit of defensive and kind of making up excuses for the quarterback you paid. Yeah. No, well said. I think, well, one interesting thing is just like last year, so if you remember, last year, Joe Shane was seen at one of the top quarterback matchups right away in week one. He was literally looking at his future quarterbacks before the Giants played an actual game in the regular season. And that's happening again this weekend. He is going to be on the road watching quarterbacks, watching top prospects, looking for his next quarterback that I do think though, authentic, like in the backs of their minds, as they definitely obviously are preparing for that and thinking that way, I think right now they also recognize they just need to get through this year to be able to make that pick. So Jay, Jan checks in again. And the super chats are rolling in, by the way, tonight. Thank you guys so much, obviously, a lot of respect for authentic and well-earned and well-deserved. Jay, Jan says, I don't blame Joe Shane for wanting young guys to step up, but the key is the young guys actually have to step up. I believe in flot and Schmitz go Jimin. So authentic. I'm glad he mentioned Schmitz because Austin Schlotman, the backup center, hurt his right leg. And he's going to be out long term. Like he was in the locker room today and he had his right foot on one of those little scooters. So he's like walking and it was in a cast and he was also like on the scooter. And Dabel said it's going to be much longer than just the four weeks or even six weeks. So I guess my question to you is, do you think Schmitz can do it? Because behind him, if he either goes down, knock on wood, hopefully it doesn't happen or struggles, the solution right now is moving Van Rotten out of right guard over to center. So what do you think of Schmitz and what do you think of the potential pivots there? I feel like there's been a lot of assessment about JMS and it's poor assessment, right? Like people are saying like, this guy's not playing well. And if you look at the PFF grades, it kind of backs that up as well. But what I saw in the field, when he is healthy, I do think that he'll be one of those guys like what you were saying, like it won't bottom out, right? As long as he's healthy, I don't think it'll bottom out on him. And he's only in his second year. I mean, we do got to give him a little bit of time to kind of try to develop. It's unfortunate that the guy that they have behind him now is injured for a pretty long tenure here and whatnot. I always thought that they needed to address the center position again in free agency before Nick Gates had went over to the Philadelphia Eagles and then now he got cut from the Philadelphia Eagles. I thought a guy like him could maybe be somebody you could bring in as just a depth kind of security guy. I think at the center position, you need somebody with strength and it just seems like that's where JMS has been kind of lacking just a little bit. And I even saw that from from Austin Slopman a little bit as well to just kind of getting bullied, being pushed back into the quarterbacks lap and whatnot. And you know, it's hard to find depth on the offensive line, but it's something that you got to address because if you don't get that position kind of secured up and JMS has to deal with another injury, you're going to be right back to where you were at, you know, last season. No doubt. Yeah. Now, bad blood between Gates and the Giants kind of overall things ended. I mean, I don't know if that was stopping from actually coming back, but I would think it would. The other thing is like, this brings me back when you mentioned about the strength, which I do think is a little bit of an issue. I think that's dead on. I also agree it's not all bad for sure. John Feliciano and he was here, you and I both know, like if we wanted to, we could go find clips where he didn't make the right play or he missed a block or whatever. But he to me was a nasty, stronger like tip of the spear of an offensive line. Like, I thought that the attitude of that O line and of that offense on the ground had everything to do with guys like him and Gates and not to take away from the other guys who were part of it. But to me, like those personalities, you have to have some of them on your line. Yeah. You just have to have dogs. You know, like the Giants love, yeah, like the Giants love saying dogs now and like neighbors says, I'm a dog and tables like neighbors, the dogs, draft them. You need dogs on the line, no matter where else on the field, you need dogs on the line of scrimmage. Yeah. And the trenches is very important. And I agree with you on that Feliciano take, and it was his first year playing center. You know, he had just got shifted back over to center, I believe it was, but, and then he went to the San Francisco 49ers and had a lot of success there too. Yeah, no doubt. So Joe Wilcox checks at JJ and thank you for that. Joe Wilcox checks in for five or for $10 just to support the chat, support the channel, authentic being here, thank you so much, Joseph. We also have D kit checks in. He says, 10 bucks again, we know D kits the man, he says, do you two agree that Shane's comment about the team needing to gel, even though they may not be the most talented roster is really saying, Dave will needs to do his job and coach up my crappy roster. D kit, I agree, I agree, you're telling it like it is. I agree that that is personnel front office speak for, we'll see if the team gets coach well. That is definitely what that is. He could have said it a little bit stronger, like if he was really taking a huge shot. But I do think authentic that Shane was, first of all, tepid in projecting how good even the team could be. Like I, I did, I agree. I did not feel like he was saying, I think this team is good, we'll see how the coaches do with it. I feel like he was saying, we, we hope it's good and we'll see if the players perform with this coaching staff. So yes, I did view it as him pointing the finger a little bit at like, why don't you guys watch for yourselves how this goes? But yeah, I guess this is another example to me authentic of just the subtle kind of like read between the lines, instances where it feels like, okay, these guys are both sitting next to each other. They're always presenting as a united front and they are this collaborative front office and coaching staff, but is it going to remain that way if they lose, right? Do you, do you sense that same kind of doubt there? Yeah, definitely. I had this quote in my notes here and I just wanted to read it again, you know, as we talked about it and it's, it's an excuse. This is something that like a over the top faithful fan would say to me in response on Twitter, some of the best teams aren't always the most talented teams, but they come together. It's like, to me that just says like you didn't do 100% of your job is building the roster and you know that there are issues on the roster, but you're now looking at it as we need to have culture and locker room type of vibes to be able to galvanize that. And to me, that's just setting up the fans to have another excuse when things don't go right. I'm a person that's all about accountability. And to me, that's a statement that lacks a ton of accountability on it. You know, that's why we see eye to eye so much authentic is because I view part of my job as, you know, accountability matters. And so getting to the truth of whatever these situations are, good or bad, winning, losing, finger pointing, supporting people, propping them up, it matters because there's so many people in these instances running from accountability or trying to take credit when it really belongs somewhere else. And I think trying to bring the truth of a team to light reflects and, you know, it kind of like, it's almost like pulling the blinds up to show people what's really going on. Because that's what the fans deserve to see what's going on with their team, what can be better so that the team can be better so that the team can win more games. I also, I have to admit authentic like you and I see so eye to eye on this because that I had my, I looked like a cartoon character, my jaw on the floor when he said that, that they're, you know, some teams are not the most talented teas. I'm thinking like, you know, you're talking about yourself, right? Right. So that was, that was alarming. I think that's a great point by you. Danny Dodd says, did you see Daniel Jones say he's not a stat guy? We know to talk about Oh, man, kill me. Go ahead, please. If you have. Okay. So it's like, when you say like you're not a stat guy, right? Well, obviously, right, because you haven't put up good stats. You haven't put pen to paper when it comes to stats. So clearly you're going to say, I'm not a stat guy, right? You remember when Dak Prescott led the league in interceptions, what was that two seasons ago, he came back and said, I'm not going to do that again. He didn't say, Oh, I'm not a stat guy and that stuff doesn't matter. The bottom line here is that Daniel Jones has to be a stat guy this year. You can't go out here and put up 15 touchdowns and not put up stats and expect to be the quarterback in 2025. So to me, it's like, I know a lot of fans are looking at it like, Oh, he said the right answer. That's the right answer for a quarterback in year two entering year three, maybe that's not the answer for a quarterback that's entering year six. You got to have across the board, this team needs more accountability and the quarterback. I think it starts there. Obviously the GM and could start there as well, but like you should just say like, listen, I'm going to raise my level of play and I'm going to go out there and try to put this team in the best position and that's going to require me to go out there and throw touchdowns. Simple. No, well said. I think, you know, knowing Daniel as well as I do for as long as I have now, the way I view his comment when he says I'm not a stat guy is almost like he rejects people trying to define the way he's going to think from the outside about his play. So he, you know, he feels like he doesn't want people to think or him to ever sound like he thinks that he cares about how he wins. He just wants to win. So that's it. You know, that's how when I parse it and knowing him, like, and, you know, talking to him and asking him these questions behind the scenes of like, why do you answer stuff like this? Or why don't you answer questions like that? That's usually where he's coming from in moments like that. He just doesn't want to entertain the idea that his stats matter because he never wants to sit there and say like, yeah, I need to throw 350 and three touched out. He doesn't care if they win by running the ball 35 times. He just wants to win. But to your point, authentic for him to protect his job with the Giants, it's got to be on his stat line now. Like it's a it's a it's a truth. That's a really good point by you. You know, it's funny, we'll see where it goes as we talked to him in the Minnesota week as well, but I loved seeing the chip on his shoulder, Danny Jones. I love seeing the, you know, the bearded Daniel. I loved hearing him say he was ticked off watching the draft, understanding that they were going to look for a quarterback. I love that stuff. I don't want him to revert to the person who speaks the party line, right, keeps his head down and won't stick his neck out because to me, like, just grab it. Like I remember I talked to Phil Sims on our talking ball with Pat Leonard podcast several months ago. And that was one of the things he said about Daniel, like US Phil Sims about a quarterback. He could tell you a hundred different things about how he's got to do something physically, how he's throwing mechanics, review some of the tape he's put out there, whatever. The thing he noted about Daniel Jones was it's time to grab this thing by the collar. Like stop waiting for it to happen. Don't be passive. Don't act like what's happened before has mattered. Just go out there and do it. Take it by the horns. I'm the quarterback of the Giants. This is my damn huddle. This is my damn team. And you know, when Phil's saying that to me, I'm fired up, right? I'm listening to that. Like hell yeah, right? Absolutely. But so that's what gets me more than anything when Daniel says if he's walking party lines like that. Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify is there to help you grow. Shopify helps you sell everywhere from their all-in-one e-commerce platform to their in-person POS system. Shopify's got you covered. Shopify helps you turn browsers into buyers with the internet's best converting checkout, 36% better on average compared to other leading commerce platforms, and sell more with less effort thanks to Shopify Magic, your AI-powered all-star. What I love about Shopify is how no matter how big you want to grow, Shopify gives you everything you need to take control and take your business to the next level. 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And one more thing to add to that is he could say that all day, but Joe Shane already spoke on the situation when he said we're not paying Daniel Jones $40 million to hand it off to a $12 million running back. I'm sure he didn't mean we're doing that to see him handed off to a $5 million running back in a couple of other guys by committee, so you already know what it is. You got to go out there and you got to perform. That's what it is. Authentic with 57 minutes in. That's the line of the chat so far that is fire right there. And you know, it's funny you say that the, you know, obviously, we know they want to push the ball down the field and they want to continue a locked Daniel Jones. I got these wide receivers, Malik neighbors, but I actually think you're going to see more of the run game and underneath stuff than people would want to because I think I think they'll view that as a way to unlock down the field. I think one day old neighbors catching run opportunities. I think that's going to be an extension of the run game. I also think Devin Singletary is going to touch the ball more than ideally people would like as far as like a giant fan thinking in their head. If we're going to be explosive, here's how it's going to look. I think Singletary is going to be a bigger part of this offense and there's going to be a lot more underneath and even Jones using his legs than you would like to see, you know, but hopefully it's a marriage of 2022 and, you know, the Josh Allen unlocked season with Steph Diggs. Right? So, you know, we'll see. All right. Getting more super chats because they are rolling in. Like I said, Joe checks in with 20 big ones. Thank you so much, Joe. He says authentic. I completely agree with you on DJ. He's way too inconsistent. Even if he plays better than in 2022, you can't really keep justifying him. We have to go out, get out of this, quote, let's see what we can do mindset. Yeah. No doubt about it, Joe. And actually while we're talking about that and not trying to keep running it back, I was actually asked this question on Zach Gelb's radio show today. And so I put it to you. We've talked about this on here before, but if the giants are in a position next year where like we talked about earlier, maybe there's a situation where Daniel's the problem and the rest of it looks like it's going in the right direction. Do you think that they would slash should go for a guy like Dak? Or would you rather see them draft a guy? Are you watching tonight's game with Shadora say and like, get me that guy who's going to grow with Malik and who's going to be here for 10 years? Yeah. Yeah. I'm looking at the ladder. I would much rather draft a quarterback. And I thought that that would have been the safer plan actually exiting 2022. You know, to go with the bridge quarterback guys like Baker Mayfield were out there. Gardner Menchoo was out there. Jacobi Percep was out there and you could have just maybe tried to trade up. Maybe trade some draft capital to kind of move up a few spots and draft a quarterback of the future. And now they've kind of buffered a couple more seasons here and, you know, going into this next draft in the 2025, I absolutely, I'm like, if they don't draft a quarterback this time, I don't know, you know, I've been podcasting now for five going on six years and all we know is Daniel Jones, right? So it's like, I just want a fresh start. And even if that quarterback comes in and he fails, you just keep drafting them until you find the right franchise guy. The game is just constantly shifting. And right now, all these guys on the defensive fronts, these linebackers, they're all getting faster. And I just feel like the older style of pocket passer is kind of making its way, at least out of the game for the near future here. So I like guys that have the dual threat capability, which Daniel Jones can run a little bit, but I'm talking more of a lateral mover inside the pocket and on the go outside of the pocket when running down the field to be able to bring, you know, just more versatility to the offense. And we know quarterbacks make this thing go. If you look at all the Super Bowl winners, you know, from the past decade plus most of these guys are going to end up in the Hall of Fame outside of a couple of names, like maybe Joe Flacco and the kid from Philadelphia, Nick Foles. Outside of that, all these quarterbacks are dudes. And I just want to have that reset for the New York Giants. I'm thinking this whole thing, we got to, you know, stay around 500 and win a few games, go out there, get the quarterback, address that. And then, you know, while you got them on the rookie deal, you can start to address other positions and other holes on the roster. Now, a great point, great breakdown. And, you know, it's just, just a quick point before I tell you guys about Boom Chaga again. But, you know, the worst thing, the last thing you want to see, not only as a Giants fan, but also like if you're Joe Shane facing all the pressures we talked about this season, is a guy like Michael Pennix Jr. or Bo Nix, turn it on and turn up, you know. Even now, obviously, they couldn't get to Drake May, but, you know, if they had conviction in a guy like that, if he even if a guy like that turns out to be the dude to think like, yeah, we didn't want to make that, you know, that home run offer, but you and I know it's worth it if you get your guy for the next decade, right? So those are things you don't want to see if you're a Giants fan, but you know, are on the table. Guys, remember we are sponsored here by talking on talking ball with Pat Leonard live by the Boom Chaga mushroom super drink right here over my shoulder, a natural extract loaded with anti-inflammatory immune boosting antioxidants and heart healthy compounds. You can easily pour this natural liquid supplement into any of your favorite drinks. I put mine in my coffee every morning and immediately feel the difference. I personally have felt a post workout like energy boost with boom chaga also has the ability to lower cholesterol, reduce inflammation and improve immune and heart health with its beta gluten and antioxidants. Go to boom chaga.com today to place your first order. And if you use the discount code talking ball 25 or access it through the QR code on your screen right up there in the corner, you will get 25% off your first subscribe and save order. Right now, that means a month's supply costs you only $30. Start feeling the difference today at boom chaga.com also brought to you by Ben online and by estate 98 coffee right here. It was the beard and bill, I believe earlier, who both got the trivia question right. So beard and bill, remember DM me on my Instagram account, PL on NFL, DM me at PO box address, whatever it is. And I will get out a free sample, a free jar of estate 98 coffee. It's basically a half month's worth of iced or hot coffee right there to you. So thank you for participating and for being here early. Guys, we'll do those giveaways early in these chats. All right, let's get to the next super chat. Like I say, we're rolling in here. Looks like next super chat goes to Chris. He says what giants do if Jones is not good and not place draft one next year or if not good QB class. So we were talking a little about that just now Chris obviously draft versus a guy like Dak paying somebody like Dak. I would say just to add on to it because Chris is supporting us here. And also this is another point I think that deserves to be said authentic is Joe Shane's the interesting point about him is he has said even this is literally since the day he stood up there and got hired and was announced as a GM. He said that he's going to build through the draft and supplement through free agency. But I think if you look at what he's done, his strategy is more like let's get great players at the most important positions. And I'm not saying that's the wrong strategy either, right? I think getting a premier Ed Druscher Brian Burns getting a guy like Bobby O'Carrickade inside linebacker where you say we got our dude. We got to support him, but we got our dude. Now obviously you already had these guys on the roster, but locking up Andrew Thomas getting the most out of Dexter Lawrence underwing Martindale and then locking up decks and he's now blossoming into one of the best defensive linemen in football. Those are great examples to me authentic of even when you talk about drafting a receiver high cost controlled important position in the past heavy league, drafting a corner like Deontay Banks physical first round pick at a position where in the modern NFL, if you don't have if you don't have one, then you're doomed. Joe Shane's investments in that regard to me, I actually view him the other way around. Like I think he wants to be known as a guy who builds with the young guys, but his young guys, first of all, haven't panned out enough. But also I think his MO to me right now is big game hunting. Like I actually think he's the kind of guy who would try to open up the checkbook and spend big on a big time free agent. I mean, I don't know, what do you think of kind of my read on Shane there? Do you think that's fair or do you feel like he's kind of doing all those other things because he has to, but he, but when push came to shove, he would go younger QB. Yeah, I think a lot of it is because he has to, you know, you're locked into the quarterback position here. You already failed with, you know, trying to draft guys like Evan Neal, Joshua Zidoo, Marcus McKeeson, all in a few drafts and whatnot, and it did not work out for you. So now instead you kind of pivot and go 180 degrees in this 2024 draft, you don't address the trenches at all. Didn't draft one player on either side of the ball for offensive line or defensive line. And now I think it's kind of like panic mode in a way. It's like, well, we paid this quarterback. We don't have the time to try to bring in new offensive line or defensive line talent and try to develop them. I mean, Cooper Beebe was right there on the board for us. I think that wasn't the third round. He was a guy that I was extremely high on. I wanted to bring him in a mauler in the running game. You could teach him things I felt like in the past pro and all that kind of mask him in the interior would have to develop him. But then you're going to mess with the timeline here, like you got a quarterback that you paid 160. You brought in Brian Burns at $28 million a year, Dexter Lawrence and Andrew Thomas aren't getting any younger. You need this quarterback situation to pan out for you within the next at least like half a decade. So I think a lot of these moves are not necessarily out of like panic, but out of necessity to protect his quarterback and to protect his investment and hopefully win more games and prove that they are headed in the right direction. No, well said. I thought the one that stood out to me was the Burns, the Burns trade, obviously you're not trading as much as what the Rams were offering the year before that contract though. Wow. I mean, I know he's a good player, but like I've talked to a lot of people who say burns should be good. And I say good. He needs to be great. He's making almost $30 million a year and they need him to be great to be a good team. I agree with you too. The investments not made on the fronts in the draft really surprised me, especially not getting an old lineman, whether it was BB at guard with another player I loved. I know Brian Baldinger Baldi absolutely loved him. He's like whoever gets this guy, he is a mean SOB, like you know, you'll love him. He belongs on the line. That really stood out to me, even not getting a swing tackle authentic. I thought was really interesting and surprising. All right. If Giants Chronicles checks in five bucks, thank you, Gabe. He says, I feel concerned about the defense because what Wink did well was taking okay talent and scheming them up. New defensive coordinator seems to just want to run his defense no matter what. Listen, I think it's only fair to be skeptical of what the defense will be because you're going from a more accomplished and multiple coordinator to one who was, we know not their first choice and who runs a simpler defensive scheme and whose past defense wasn't good in Tennessee, right? He did stop the run, his defense has stopped the run there, but I agree. Simpler defense means maybe guys playing faster at times because they're not overthinking but also becomes more predictable, I think. You know, I think that Martindale's strength was, so when I first started covering the league authentic, people used to say to me, like I used to ask a lot of people to say people, like, what makes Belichick so much better than everybody else? And one thing everybody said back to me at first was, well, every week, he approaches the game like a completely new game and if he has to change his entire defense to face that offense that we compared to the last one, he'll do it. And I thought, doesn't everybody do that? And I learned that that's not the case, like some coaches do go week to week. Some coaches though, because it is difficult with some players to get them to pivot that hard from week to week to schemes because you also have to be able to teach it in a way that is smooth, that can allow them to play fast and doesn't have them locked up mentally. So it isn't easy, but I agree that losing a coordinator who was essentially attacking protections of specific offensive lines and specific offensive schemes and going to something more vanilla is concerning and is a question mark. I think it just puts more emphasis than ever authentic on the front four. I think that you know, you're paying Brian Burns. You got decks already under contract cave on draft at number five overall. To me, they're basically saying these guys are going to do it for us. You agree with that? Yeah, absolutely. And if you look at what Shane Baum was doing in Tennessee, it was a lot of that relying on the front four, rarely blitzing and when he does blitz, he might drop somebody from the line back in the coverage and take somebody from the second level and send them at the quarterback. But one of the lower blitz rates in the NFL, you know this from some of the talks we had on Twitter that Danar Wilson was definitely the guy that I wanted to see the New York Giants higher and I have some close ties to some of the people within his family that let me know right off the bat that he had the job. But you know, they didn't, they wouldn't allow him to bring in his own staff. And I do understand that with guys like Jerome Henderson, you know, in that coaching staff, we have some good guys there and being unable to fuse that together to make the right move in my opinion, might cost them in the long run. But I am willing to give Shane Bowen, you know, his fair shot at this. And I think like what we're seeing in the preseason is probably not exactly what we're going to see, you know, in the regular season, but I do expect something similar to what we saw from Patrick Graham and, you know, we did see one year of grand success from Patrick Graham where the New York Giants defense was a top 10 defense. I want to say that was in 2020, I believe the year that they almost made the playoffs correct when the commanders won the division and then he came back, lost a little bit of personnel the following year and you saw that Ben Doe break kind of like keep everybody in front of you defense kind of fall apart and I think that kind of cost those guys their job. But we'll see, I think that, you know, Wink Martindale, I prefer that type of style more, you know, aggressive blitz when you're playing quarterback at that type of, you know, against that type of defense and makes things very difficult. You can look at the back half of the season, the last six games for the Philadelphia Eagles when teams figured out, hey, they have no answer for the blitz, let's just blitz the hell out of Jalen Hurts and in return, Nick Siriani and Brian Johnson, the offensive coordinator from last year really had no answers and Philadelphia looked like a team that went from being one of the best in the conference to being one of the worst overnight. So I like those styles a little bit more, but like I said, I want to give Shane Bowe and his fair shot. No, for sure. He deserves his fair shot. No doubt about it. There's no insight there, Undenard Wilson for sure that you brought at the time as well during the search. That was really good. You guys have to follow authentic. I'm sure everybody is already, but if you're not, follow them everywhere, X Instagram, YouTube, authentic in the beard, as you see down there, brings great content, great insight, breaks some news, you know, you will love following all of authentic coverage. You hit on something too defensively that I wanted to add. You mentioned Pat Graham. You mentioned the BEM, but don't break. And I remember one thing Graham's defense is struggled with, even when they were playing well, was that end of half, right? It was kind of like dropping those two minute situations, they could just never get it under control. And one thing Martindale got a hold of, even though his defense wasn't perfect, right, when they came right in in those in the first year, even when that was a really strong year, they got a hold of third down and red zone, right? Like they were plenty of times when he first got in there, where they were driving down the field on the Giants, opponents were driving down the field on the Giants. The Giants just weren't letting teams in the end zone. They weren't letting them score touchdowns. And eventually they built some confidence over that. And it kind of started to snowball in a good way for them. And so like to me, that's what it's going to come down to. I think the Giants defense is going to give up yards authentic. I think that teams will drive the ball on them, but I think they do also have some guys to make big splash plays, particularly in the past rush, Dext Brian Burns, et cetera. I think when they get in those tight spaces, if they can just get off the field on the third downs, if they can turn touchdowns in the field goals, that to me will be like the stats might not look, the stats could look one way and the results could look another in a good way for them. So I think that's, that's maybe the recipe. You're right though. He deserves his fair shake, Shane Bowen, two toe, two toe always checking in, man, showing the love. It's five bucks there from two, though, he says massive salutes and respects to Pat and authentic Kings. Oh, authentic and the beard. I like how he, yeah, he abbreviated it. I like that. All right. Kings, the Giants fan world at all die, die hard Giants fans across the pond, greetings from our entire rugby club in Italy. How's it going over there, two, though? How's the season going? We love having your support here always. We appreciate it so much. One of the best and most die hard Giants fans. Got it. Got to connect next time you're in Princeton, one of these times to toe. We got to connect. All right. Let's see, Joey B, another die hard big time supportive fan checks in with 20 big ones. Thank you, Joe. He says, okay, boys, this is good. I'm just joining. I need an IG live one day a week on with you guys. What do you think? You also, what do you think we are going to do with the roster going forward and what's your honest prediction on our record? First of all, love collaborating with authentic. This is a blast. I mean, I can already tell is not going to be the last time we're doing this. I hope you agree with that. No doubt. Absolutely. No, this is a lot of fun. So, Joey B, we'll get some stuff in the works for sure. And then what are they going to do with the roster and the honest predictions on the record? Well, first, I think, I mean, you tell me if you think I'm wrong here, authentic, but like from a roster standpoint, like Joe Shane, one, you hit on a lot of like key points that dissecting the press conference of things that he said that stood out. And one thing he said that stood out to me to answer Joe's question is he says, like, the team on the field is the team. I think is what he said. I'm paraphrasing, but he was like, the team we have out there is our team. That told me, yeah, we're going to add a piece here. We're going to add a piece there. But the guys that you see in uniform right now, that's the Giants for 2024. Don't expect it to look different. Don't expect some savior to come in last minute. This is who we got. This is who we're rolling with. So from a roster prediction standpoint, Joe, I think, you know, the Duke Shelly's of the world could get added. Like if he doesn't work out, you could see another typical corner. I keep mentioning this phrase, but it was just so good on August 1st, Shane Bowen saying, we signed a corner yesterday, we signed a corner last week, and we'll probably be signing one on a Tuesday in October to start for us on Sunday. That's just how it's going to go. I know no one wants to hear that, but what a comment. And it's really, I think, accurate. Honest predictions, Joe, I mean, I think I still fall in like the four win category. And I say this all the time, but I think it's only fair. That's combined with certain deficiencies I see in their team. It's also, I don't trust them to stay healthy. Like they don't stay healthy enough for me to feel like, like if you told me, authentic, that this team as comprised was going to be healthy all year, I might give them six wins. But you and I both know that they've struggled with this year and in year out. And so I know that, for example, if Andrew Thomas misses games, they're screwed. If Daniel Jones, as much as people, as he's a lightning rod and people are tired of them, if he doesn't play, they ain't winning a game, I'll tell you that right now. And that's sorry to upset any Tommy DeVito fans out there, but that's my feeling on it. And I think they're like that at a lot of positions authentic. I don't think they're deep enough to be able to stand that. So as I sit here right now, this is not my final prediction, but I'll probably end up staying with for I'm a four-win guy. How you feeling about it? It's interesting. So I do streams on bleacher report when the schedule released, I said four wins myself. I will give Joe Shane a couple of props here, even though some of the situations that we are in are, you know, the fault of his own. But coming out or coming into the free agency period right when we like the season of 2023 ended, and you knew that Sequan Barkley wasn't going to be back and you knew that Darren Waller was going to retire and you knew that Xavier McKinney wasn't going to be back. That roster looked terrible. And I think he's done a really good job of at least bringing in guys that can be competent starters, right? For me on the roster where things really kind of fall apart is the depth pieces. The secondary is obviously an issue. We don't know what we're going to get out of Tyler Neubin, especially year one. You're hoping that some of these draft picks that were for need of position are going to pan out. You know, Theo Johnson, Tyler Neubin, Andrew Phillips, maybe even Tyrone Tracy being a bit of a gadget with all the injuries that we've seen inside linebacker, maybe a Darius Moore Sal can be a guy as well. But I think he's done a decent job. It's just depth. I think that where they have to address, you know, or getting guys that are better at the starting spots so that some of these guys that are in the starting spots now can eventually turn into depth. I think I'm going to go with six wins. And the reason why I'm going to say six wins is because of Brian Dable. And you know, some of the points I said earlier about how he won six games last year with Tommy DeVito playing a lot of those snaps and Tyrone Taylor. The unfortunate part is that we don't have a Tyrone Taylor on this roster this year that's going to be able to push the ball. I mean, they could have even ended up with eight wins if you look at the Jets game, you know, kind of not falling apart there before the half. And if you look at the Los Angeles Rams game, which I think was the best quarterback performance of any of the quarterbacks on the roster last year from Tyrone Taylor just stretching the field. I mean, the highlights from that game look amazing. So I think it could be as low as three, even, you know, but I'm going to go with six just off the strength that I think Brian Dave was going to work some miracles. No, I think, I think that's fair. I think that's fair. They over under is six and a half, I believe in Vegas, you're covering, kind of hovering right at that line. I think your rationale is sound there. I do think the schedule provides some opportunities for them if they're not going to either fall on their face with injuries or, you know, there's going to be dysfunction that takes them out. I do think if they just stay steady and they have some of these key pieces they've added like Runyon Jr, Aluminor, Van Rotten, Brian Burns, et cetera, who can just stay healthy and stay on the field. You do have opportunities to, instead of being one of the bad teams, beat the bad teams and just get yourself more into that room where, you know, people can, you know, feel better about the future and feel better about this as a process going into 2025. Mark Sullivan checks in with $5 says, Pat, is this the year we finally realized the wisdom of tanking if in the same situation as last year. So Mark, that's a, that's a really good question. Here's what's so funny about that. So first thing is the first season that they were here, the funniest or most ironic part of that season is they didn't even think they were good and they didn't intend to be good. And now they weren't not trying to win because obviously they went out, tried to win one enough games, made the playoffs, won a wildcard game. But the whole point of that season was like, let's just clean up the salary cap and get out from under this mess, right, that we have here and look at what happened. And so I'm not saying they were tanking that year. I'm just saying, like, I think they didn't expect it to not be much better than a tank. So it flips on its head. It doesn't go the way they expect it affects their draft status the next year. But now, Mark, when you say, yes, okay, this is a regime that understands they need pieces. Another high draft pick could get them a quarterback. When you get to year three, it becomes awkward and difficult because you can't tank a season like this and know that you're definitely coming back for year four in the modern NFL. You just can't do that when you're in these guys positions, certainly not in Brian Dable's position. And actually going back to our conversation earlier about where does the finger get pointed if things go wrong, usually in those situations in the NFL, it splits between the GM having the owners here and trying to say, let's take our medicine, let's trade a player at the deadline, let's get some assets, look at next year's draft, see what we're building, make it longer term. But the coaches on the sideline looking upstairs saying, what about me, right? And so that to me is the tricky part. I don't think personally, Mark, that either Joe Shane or Dable will be in a situation this year where, like, let's say something goes catastrophically wrong very early and they realize right away it ain't happening. I still don't think either of them is in a situation authentic where they can like subtly behind the scenes kind of bag it and look to the future. But what do you think? This I look at it, the overachieving of 2022, I think bought them an extra year of the seat being hot. So I think that there'll be some, if the Giants kind of go off the tracks this year, I think there'll be those conversations moving forward about, you know, are these the guys? But I wouldn't expect Dable or Joe Shane to be fired this year simply because of the history that has happened between the New York Giants and John Merra hiring and firing coaches within a two year span so quickly. I think that if you now go and do that again and fire Brian Dable in his third season, it's going to look a certain way. And I think that the optics are very important to the way that John Merra operates. So I think that as long as Joe Shane is on board to have Brian Dable still be the guy here, I think they'll both have their job secure until we go into 2025. And then that's when they'll they'll start the seat will start to cook up a little bit. Interesting, interesting. All right. I think and I have agreed a lot tonight, we disagree on this point. That'll be an interesting one to revisit authentic. Yeah. All right. Yeah. I think on a normal occasion that they would be on the hot seat right now and turn 2024. But I think that, you know, just imagine if we didn't have results from 2022, how John Merra would be feeling right now with this team being a poor team for now a decade, literally straight without any success. I think that really helped them out. And then it's going to buffer it just a little bit more and set it back one more year. No, I mean, listen, it is only fair to say, look at what they did in the first year. It counts. It happened. They did it. They deserve credit for it. Right. And to be honest with you, when last year was going off the rails right away and I was very critical, I did get some feedback from the organizations from some people saying. This guy was the coach of the year last year. We were in the playoffs. Like we're not happy with this, but like, why don't we like pump the brakes a little bit on whether a change needs to happen type deal. So like internally, their feeling was this stinks, but we're not ready to redefine what we think we have as ad head coach and general manager just because it's kind of regressing here. So that's how they felt a year ago. I do think, I think part of my belief that it's earlier, the seat is warm and hot earlier on for both of them, then you believe is I do think the coaching dysfunction and dables role in it makes it is much a bigger deal internally than they will ever allow people to understand or like portray to us when we see them. But I do think that that is a huge concern from the ownership level of whether that will continue, whether it can get rained in, right? To be honest with you, like they didn't want to lose Martindale, right? Like they didn't want to lose wing Martindale, he just, he didn't want to work there anymore. So like, right. So those types of things, I think way heavily on the coach as far as when they're judging okay, evaluation and whether the seat is hot, the general manager, then that's the question. You know, that I agree with you that I think after really kind of handing him the keys and tearing up a lot of their processes of how they operate as an organization, I think that would be the much more reluctant move for the ownership to make. That's why I think a day like yesterday, so that would be August 28, 2024, that type of press conference kind of smacks me across the face because it's almost like, well, wait a second, the GM's acting like he's had under the same pressure as the coach, right? Kind of makes you do a double take and kind of blink your eyes and say, am I seeing this all correctly here, but totally, it'll be, yeah, it'll be interesting to see which way it breaks. So Ryan checks in again. Thank you so much, Ryan, a real one as we've set. He says, Shane was on the horn with Patriots GM Elliot Wolf with a chance to offer a bag for the third pick. He came off as a non exec, in my opinion. Your job is to close the deal. He looked weak historic moment missed in my opinion. Yeah, Ryan, you know, that was odd. It came off to me like they had had maybe as more serious conversation prior to that. That was not on camera where this is me trying to give Shane the benefit of the doubt. You're authentic, but like, maybe he pushed harder at one point and Wolf was like, I'll get back to you, but sounded tepid. And so then this is his last ditch effort of like, do you still feel that way? Is there anything I can do? That said, I was. Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify is there to help you grow. Shopify helps you sell everywhere from their all-in-one e-commerce platform to their in-person POS system. Shopify's got you covered. 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This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance, fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to progressive and save hundreds because Progressive offers discounts for pain and full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help you when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit progressive.com to see if you could save on-car insurance. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates, potential savings will vary, not available in all states or situations. Prized at how kind of easily he said no in that moment that we saw on HBO's Hard Knocks. Part of me wondered, and this is the, maybe I'm a jaded old reporter already, but part of me wondered whether Shane didn't want to be viewed as somebody who, basically he can come off of that conversation being shown and say to somebody, "See, I made the call, but I wasn't really trying to replace Daniel. I was just doing my due diligence, rather than looking like someone who was being aggressive because he knows he needs a new quarterback." So like optics-wise, it looks like he's feeling it out and not charging up, but I don't know. Did you view that as him looking weak or looking like he should have done more there or authentic? You think there's nothing you could do there? Yeah, I mean, I definitely agree with a lot of what you said there, like there was, I'd say obviously a conversation before that. You can hear Elliot Wolf when they're on the phone. He says something about Joe Shane being more diligent to the communication being open. So to me, that kind of said, like, you know, this guy's been hitting me up, maybe sending me text messages and I kind of been, you know, ignoring them a little bit. That's what that kind of said. It does seem like the Patriots were pretty set on, you know, what they wanted to do with the number three overall pick and that was to get a quarterback. You got a new coach over there, Gerard Mayo. That was something that they needed to address, but maybe Joe Shane really didn't want to make that lofty type of offer because, you know, it seems to me he was more invested in bringing back Daniel Jones and making his investment in the quarterback be the correct answer for the Giants. Yeah, right. He's become his guy now, whether he likes it or not, that's where it's at. So Chris Peace, he must have been listening in before we started recording because he says that needs to roll into an overreaction on a Monday. What do you think about that authentic? I mean, absolutely. Yeah. So for those that don't know, I do a show called the giant overreaction on Mondays. And what we do is we take normally we take tweets from social media and we deem that either an overreaction or if you're going to take the under, meaning that you would agree with the statement that we have on the screen and that that shows a really good hit, the fans who pull up and the family who pull up really like that and are very interactive with the chat. I kind of go through all the votes and whatnot, real dope show. I would love to join that love to roll into an overreaction. And like I said, authentic content is amazing. You got to check it out authentic in the beard and he's at authentic. You see his handle right there on X on Instagram, wherever you can find him, Chris, thank you so much for saying that though, because yeah, you must have been listening in because we were talking before this about all the great content authentic does and how we can continue to cross promote. So all right, Joe Wilcox checks in again with another five bucks. Thank you so much for that, Joe. Let's see. These are rolling in. I mean, this is an all super chat show right now. This is a first on talking ball live and that's obviously because you're here. We really appreciate that. We're cutting you in on this, obviously just so you know, because you're bringing the people here. We appreciate you. All right, Klein says burns contract. Thank you, Klein, by the way, for the 10 bucks here. Appreciate you. He says burns contract doesn't matter much for giants because we don't have any young players. We need to pay soon. The problem is not Jones's contract, not Saquon leaving and not able yelling. It is Shane's drafting that listen, that is a fair criticism. And I think it's one that I'm glad to see the fan base as a whole. I think take a fuller picture of like authentic you were saying about if they bowl is going to get scapegoated here. It is only fair to look at the three years of drafting that Joe Shane has done and to adequately assess it as incomplete would be the best way you could say it. Now I am encouraged by some of what I see from the rookies, but also there's a lot of pressure on them to produce right away, like all these guys, neighbors, new bin, phillips, Theo Johnson, Tyrone Tracy Jr, and Darius, Darius, Muasal. Muasal might start next to Bobby O'Kareke in week one against the Vikings here. So I think I agree with Klein that that is a big issue. I also think we're going to find out pretty quickly about not only the rookies and what they can handle, but also more of the pressure authentic. She agree with me on that is guys like cave on John Michael Schmitz. And even I don't honestly, I don't blame Wandale Robinson for being selected in the second round. Like I was saying to somebody the other day, if he got drafted in the fourth or the fifth that'd be like great pick, but taking a gadget player in the second round. That's tough. I mean, he's undersized. There's a lot of places in the field where if you get him the ball, he's getting completely blasted. So I think there's a lot on Shane's first two drafts to show and a lot of pressure on the rookies. Do you feel like it's fair to put those expectations and pressure on the rookie class especially? Do you think it should be more on kind of the second and third year players or is it kind of like, hey, neighbors are starting, phillips are starting. These guys are in there like we got to expect high level play from these guys right away. Yeah, I mean, that's the unfortunate thing about getting drafted especially early, which is where I feel like Joe Shane has kind of found guys who can be at least contributors. But you're looking at, you know, these guys are going to be in their contract year from his first draft here in no time. So I do think that it does matter. But the biggest blemish on Joe Shane's resume right now is the drafts. They've been bad. You know, you just look at the first two draft 17 picks and it's really like there's not many guys there, Michael McFadden, Kay Von Tippido, and you name Wanda Robinson. George Pickens was on the board when we draft the Wanda Robinson too. And I know that makes Giants fans feel a certain kind of way when you see Pickens go put up a thousand with Kenny Pickett and, you know, Wanda Robinson struggling with injuries and just struggling to get over 600 yards. But I'm a fan of Wanda Robinson. He's a good player. But for me with Joe Shane, I do agree with this statement from from Klein here because Joe Shane has not only struggled to get superstar players here, we have zero superstars from any of his drafts. It looks like Malik neighbors is going to be one. But when it comes to drafting from rounds like two through seven, where are those like gems that you see other teams find? I forget that that defensive lineman that the Jets found just recently. A Leonard Taylor, the third, the UDFA Leonard Taylor, the third, I think his name is Leonard Taylor, the third, right? Where are those kind of guys? You look at the Los Angeles Rams who I want to say they brought in five UDFAs to play defense. The Kyron Williams, the Pukka Nakuwas, the tank Dells in the third round who looked like they can be wide receiver once. We don't have that. And it's almost like Giants fans have now been conditioned to kind of understand that if a guy was drafted in the third round by Joe Shane, well, he's going to kind of go out there and look like a third round or worse type of player. So for me, the draft's got to be fixed and then doubling and tripling down on positions that he's already drafted. You know, we went out there drafted a bunch of offensive line guys the first two years, it didn't work. defensive backs. I think there's been like seven or eight defensive backs drafted in his, in all of his drafts. Gervarious Owens, a guy that was cut. Some of these guys from his drafts are, you know, not even making the roster at this point. And then like I said before, addressing tight end, you know, in every draft, you went out there, you got Daniel Bellinger the next year and he had a good rookie year. And then you go in the next year and it's like, Oh, well, that's not good enough. Dale Jones needs a wide receiver one. We all know it. We'll try to get this guy who's on the back end of his career, this dealt with injuries and trade a third round of friend. And then we go up and we draft the old Johnson with the fourth round picks. So for me, I want to see the Giants and the draft get, get back to more BPA type of vibes rather than drafting for need. And I think when you miss on drafts like this, the only thing that can fix missing on drafts like this and Giants fans should know this is what Bill Belichick did with the New England Patriots is win games. The drafts from Bill Belichick were not great. You didn't have no all pros, no promo type of players, but the Patriots found ways to win games and nobody really cared about it after that. That's a really good point about them making fairly significant investment in tight end three straight years under Shane. That is a really good point. I never thought of it like that. Like definitely the waller to Johnson draft pick connection retirement, drafting him, connecting that. But the fact that they went Bellinger, waller Johnson continuing to use like real assets on that position consistently. That's an interesting one I hadn't really thought about. I think that's I think that's a really good point. One player I'm kind of excited about in their rookie class that I like. You know, we'll see. Obviously these guys are rookies Tyrone Tracy Jr. like I really think he's had a good camp. I mean, I'm out there watching with a close eye when I watch these guys saying even if they have a couple of good days, it's hard, especially for rookies to sustain and be consistent, which is what you need. Bobby O'Carricki's got a sign in his locker that says like being consistently okay is better than being occasionally great or something like that or being consistently good is being is better than being occasionally great. I think is what it says. I like that. Yeah. And I got it. I got to confirm the exact language of that. But that was I was looking at that today. And for rookies, that's what they have to learn and Tyrone Tracy Jr. obviously dodges that that injury bullet, but he he runs harder, stronger and bigger than I would have expected as for a converted wide receiver. I was actually talking to him about in the locker room the other day and I asked him about like his physical build just being like seemingly so ready for the NFL and he said that when he converted from receiver to running back a year ago at Purdue in the summer, he lifted weights with the offensive lineman because he was like, I know I have to get way bigger. I know I have to put on more muscle. He said he completely changed his diet. He was drinking like four protein shakes a day. He was lifting with the lineman, basically eating like a lineman and he went from 198 to 210 going into his senior year. So it gives you an idea of what these guys are doing. But he's a player that I'm kind of excited about and also at running back, turbo Miller was talking to him. He's kind of eyes were lighting up today because so his like he played in that preseason finale authentic because he's he's fighting for a roster spot. This is what happens in the NFL. People don't know. He's in the lineup. So people are like, Oh, he's not hurt anymore. He played through his hamstring injury because he didn't want to get cut. And he was like running a certain way to try to play hard and get yards, but avoid injury at the same time and like he's excited though because he's getting back right. He's on the practice field. He's doing the running. He's doing the kick return stuff and he's back in the building, obviously on the practice squad. And I think the thing to glisten in his eye that I saw was like, he's basically saying like, I'm going to get right. And then I'm going to be able to help this team. Like he feels confident that he's going to be able to do it. So I don't know how you feel about obviously, Saquon's a big loss, but you know, single Terry's a good player. I'm not, I'm not very high on Eric Gray. I still need to see more, but I don't know about you. I'm kind of, I kind of really liked it, the two young backs there, Tracy and, and turbo. Yeah, me too. I'm a big fan of Tyrone Tracy. Um, I'll start with, with single Terry, who I think is definitely a capable back. Eric Gray had the, you know, the splash in the preseason game. The first one, lettuce and receiving yards and rushing yards had a couple of big plays and something that we haven't seen from him, but he also is a guy that was very limited in the amount of touches that he had in his first year. I think it was just 17 rushes for him, Tyrone Tracy, you know, coming into the draft. I was high on Ray Davis coming out of Kentucky who was a similar skill set of Tyrone Tracy with a little bit less in the passing game, I would say, but both older running backs. I think Tyrone Tracy's going to turn 25 this year. The big difference though is that Tyrone Tracy has a lot more tread on the tires. I mean, he's a guy that like went throughout his first, I want to say played six years of college ball, four years not playing running back at all, playing wide receiver. And then, you know, his final year being a guy who had one of the highest broken tackle rates and, you know, just explosive after the first hit. So I'm high on him. It's just, you know, the injury was definitely a scare for me because a guy at that age, you can't be able to deal with an injury in your rookie season and then come back when you're going to be turning 26 years old in 2025 and expect to really see some, you know, meaningful snaps and whatnot. So that was a blessing that he was not, you know, out for a long period in time. And I'm looking forward to him. I think that he can be a guy that's also a gadget kind of like out of the backfield and the passing attack kind of takes some of those runs that we were seeing from Wanda Robinson last season. And if they can like get him going early in a passing game, I think he's a guy that you could see on second and third down, making some plays for the Giants. No doubt. Talking to some guys this week, like we've seen it in camp too, but they're running some two back, you know, in their, in their offense too. Yeah. Yeah. They're running old school pro form. Yeah. Exactly. No doubt. Also, sometimes I'll run it like guy like Tracy and even Singletary, like they have skill sets where you can line them up wide. Like we know Tracy's played receiver, he knows receiver, right. And so Dable is having some fun with that, you know, he's not going to show it to us right now. But I think come the regular season, like we talked about one day, I'll be in in that neighbors like being multiple, even today, it was funny, authentic, they normally with the X and or, you know, the X and the Z and then the, with the slot and they're running all their different routes to start, just routes on air, to start practice to run in their stops, they're running their hitches, they're running their posts, whatever. Neighbors was the one guy who they had him run with on the one side, the X was Slaton. And then they sent only neighbors across the field to do one rep with the Z's and catch a ball from Daniel Jones on that side of the field is almost like, no, like we're lining you up everywhere. We want you taking everything even in warm up. So a good example of how they'll go multiple running backs being a part of that as well. You know, one thing I didn't see in the preseason was some of the slot fade stuff that Malik Neighbors really had a lot of success at LSU with Jayden Daniels on. So I think they're kind of keeping them as well, because I'd expect to see him do some damage out of the slot as well. Great point. Great point. All right. Well, then says great duo on here, realistic fans who know ball. Thank you. Well, then really appreciate you. Thanks for the super chat. Joe checks in with another couple bucks. He's loving what we're doing here. Thank you so much, Joe. All right. No Mets. No Mets always bringing it, keeping it live says other than quarterback and corner and the O line. What are the other positions of concern going forward? We just named all of them that no, that's not just kidding. And Pat, can you see Brandon Brown as the future GM? I love that question. Wow. All right. All right. Let's take that one first. I think it would be an amazing thing because Brandon Brown, I just I like to read body language and I just think on some of the moves where Joe Shane is kind of a little bit puzzled, like, say, Juan Barkley, maybe only commanding $7 million on the free agent market, Brandon Brown's kind of like, and some of the other executives as well. I think Brandon Brown is definitely an up becoming a general manager. I don't know if it will be with the New York Giants, but I think that would be an amazing thing. I'm not out on Joe Shane, though. I don't want people to think that quite yet. I am willing to give him through this year to see the product of some of his draft picks, earlier draft picks and this rookie class as well to just kind of see if they pan out. But I would have no problem promoting a guy like Brandon Brown. I think Brandon Brown right now, obviously, he's an up and comer, he's a promising young executive, seem to nearly get that Chargers gig before Joe Ortiz landed it. I would say though, still wait and see from the standpoint of this. This is just, unfortunately, how it goes is if you're affiliated with a front office as Assistant GM, if you get results, people get jobs. If the team loses and it's personnel is a huge reason why, you don't. And so that's the way I see it is kind of like, it's going to be merit based, I think, in a lot of ways. And that's how it's going to happen for Brandon Brown. My hunch is my belief and, you know, just obviously looking at how he has, his star has kind of been rising publicly and prominently. I think if the Giants have any kind of success, especially with the young players factoring in like we just said, they need some of these draft picks to pan out, it'd be very easy to connect the dots to Brandon Brown on some of them where he had more of a say or significant role in scouting and, you know, selecting those players. And that's that's how you'll see him in a chair. I don't think it'll be here though. It's more likely he'll be a GM somewhere else if he lands in the big chair. And then your first question was, other than corner, quarterback and offensive line, other positions of concern, going forward, I think a quiet one, what the quiet ones, no Mets and authentic. I'd love to know your take on this. I think the one thing no one's talking about with the Giants team is whether they can stop the run or not on defense. And I think defensive tackle position is worse than it was a year ago, of course, they trade Leonard Williams. Yeah, they got great assets there, whatever it was, it was a, I think a good move at the time based on where they were, but they haven't replaced the talent there. They don't have somebody reliable next to or behind extra launch. They're asking for people to step up, grow and projecting guys to either improve or become something, right? You do have Nacho, serviceable, not an elite player, right? DJ Davidson, they want him to become something. Can he do that? Unanswer question. Elijah Chapman, exciting camp, makes the team well deserved, looks like a guy who could give even first string offensive line problems. Will he be able to do that in the regular season, weekend and week out? Will he be able to solve that issue? Don't know the answer. And then going back to inside linebacker authentic, I think, okay, okay, obviously excellent player has really helped the Giants across the board on defense. But even when they're healthy at inside linebacker, we know there's certain things Mike and McFadden does well, and he has certain limitations. Deontay Johnson, a player I'm really excited about, who's now an injured reserve out at least four weeks, I think could end up helping them and be the guy. But right now they're banged up there and there's incomplete talent behind Bobby. So with the detackled depth and talent, not great behind and next to decks and then inside linebacker unresolved next to and behind Bobby O'Karaqué, that's where I'm a little concerned, no Mets, that it doesn't jump out on the page at you. But like to me, everyone else talking about Justin Jefferson and week one, I'm looking at Aaron Jones, like to me, Vikings go up by 10 points and hand the ball to Aaron Jones. I think it's going to be tough to walk off that deal with a victory. But do you agree with me on the positions of need or concern? Is there something I didn't mention you think that you're looking at? Yeah, I mean, I think you nailed it, you know, definitely three tech, detackle on the line, depth when it comes to the edge rushers, I think is an issue, which you spoke on about being worried about stopping the run. I've been talking about that a lot on my channel. You know, you look at cave on Thibodeau and you look at Brian Burns, they're very similar style type of edge rushers like to get to the outside a lot. I know Brian Burns has that nice spin move, but it's very rare that it works to the inside. I've looked at everyone of his snaps from last season with the Carolina Panthers and he's rarely winning to the inside and stopping the run. I think he's a hair better than what cave on Thibodeau is, but we're hoping that cave on can take that leap. And then I also think tight end, you know, even though they've addressed it three straight drafts, I do think it could be an issue this year. If one of these guys don't step up, it seems like Daniel Bellinger's kind of in the dog house a little bit. So if that's the case, then rookie like Theo Johnson is going to have to hit the ground running. And outside of that, I agree with everything you said. Yeah. So Daniel and your two, like he's a guy, like you said, promising rookie here. They want him to be good. They want him to be a big factor. I think his problem is he doesn't block well enough. Like he, you know, he's got the build for it. He's got the attitude for it. He's just slower in in his movement, being able to handle the athletes come in his way and has took from my vantage point, I don't remember how many penalty penalties he had last year holding. It was something like six or seven or something like that. But it felt like last year when they could never get anything going, and then they would like finally call a play to get the ball down a field a little bit. I remember at least two or three times it came back because of a Bellinger hold. You know, I think that's what it is is just like the same reason why Cajor, when he was healthy, they wouldn't keep him on the field was like there would be a moment here or there where whether it was a block or an assignment, he would miss one play. And they were just like, okay, we need this to be buttoned up or we can't rely here, right? By the way, Cajor taught to him as well. He feels like he'll get back healthy. Definitely again, another guy like turbo Miller, who he pushed it a little bit harder than maybe he should have at the time in camp because he knew he was creating momentum and he wanted to show that they could count on him, you know. And so this is the reality, the NFL kind of the hard stuff behind the scenes that's happening with guys now, obviously with the hamstring, he's banged up, but he feels like once he gets healthy, he's going to get right and hopefully solve the issue that you're talking about there. Mark Sullivan checks in again, five bucks. Thank you so much, Mark. He says, speaking of Shane's drafting, don't forget we gave up a pick to move up to get banks when we could have held our water and picked Joey Porter Jr. Yeah, no doubt about it. I do like Tae. I mean, I don't know if he's, I don't know if he's going to be the number one they're asking him to be, but I do think he's really good. I have a hunch, no one has told me this. So I'm not reporting this. I do think he's going to travel like I know they're going to play a lot of zone though. So when they're when they're playing their zone, that's not going to happen. But I do think in some of these matchups, I think you're going to see him going best on best and them trying to give him that opportunity. But yeah, no, I like him though, Mark, it's funny you bring that up because I was just working on a story earlier about, you know, Duke Shelley and the corners and really like how they went through this off season, knowing they needed one and didn't get one. And if you remember in hard knocks, they showed that, um, so I'm kind of connecting the dots here between our topics and talking, talking points, they showed that they wanted Kool-Aid McKinstry or Kamari Lasseter at the top of the second round, but Shane knew that if they gave up that pick for burns, which they did, it might cost them that corner. That's exactly what happened. Shane also said in hard knocks that they probably could have traded up from 47 to get one of those corners, but he said, what did he say it would cost authentic? Do you remember? He said it would have cost us a fourth round pick. So why did he not want to trade that because he had to draft this tight end because Darren Waller retired, right? So it's like, it's all connected, Mark, to your point about the machinations and the domino effects. It's like you never know in the moment necessarily which calculation, which risk reward is going to go the right way or the wrong way, and you're doing your best with your judgment at that point. But you don't necessarily want a need to prevent you from going to get a player, right? For sure. So that's my take on that. What do you think of that? Giving up the pick, getting banks when you could add a Joey Porter? I mean, Joey Porter, definitely a dog. I'm a big fan of Deontay Banks, though. I'm actually out here at Maryland University doing some filming with them and Coach Loxley's my guy. He actually asked me, last time I saw him, I was Deontay Banks looking out there at camp. I had to kind of gloss it up and not tell him, you know, Malik neighbors has been kind of doing some damage at camp. I'm a big fan of the Deontay Banks pick, but I mean, that makes sense. And what you just said about connecting the dots, you know, and having to use the fourth round pick to go out there and draft your tight end and Theo Johnson, this was a fairly decent tight end free agent period as well. There were a lot of guys out there like Mike Jasecki was out there, but maybe they didn't fit the mold of the type of player that the Giants wanted to bring in, which is likely a guy who's more stronger in the blocking department than, you know, a guy who's like lean going down the field and making big plays. Yeah, no doubt. No doubt. Well said. Well said. Who else we got here? No, Matt says, has Joe, has Porter Jr. looked better than Banks? What do you think of that authentic? How do you, how do you weigh that? Um, I mean, it's early. Yeah. I'll say I'm not disappointed in having Deontay Banks on my team. I'm not going to throw any shade at Deontay Banks. Yeah. That's what I would say too. I, you know, Porter Jr. is a really good player for sure. I'm not ready to call the banks pick it like, and believe me, you guys know, I'm as critical of the Giants as anybody when it comes to where I feel like they need to get better. But I'm not, I'm not, I like Banks getting to know him watching him play. I think he's a player. I do think they have to be careful using him too much in zone this year. This guy's strength is what it's his body. It's getting physically into receivers. It's winning at the point of the tack. He's a big dude. Like, if you walk up on him, you would be shocked at how big he is for being a corner in the NFL. Like every time I see him in the locker room, I'm startled that he's not like a tight end practically. I mean, and he's, he's ripped his body fat, body fat has got to be nothing authentic. He needs to hit the buffet, but, uh, but yeah, no, I like Tae Banks a lot. Um, not ready to call that a pick that they shouldn't have made. Joe Wilcox, again, checking in, supporting the channel. Thank you so much, Joe. All right. Let me see if I can get to some of these questions that we missed that weren't super chats authentic real quick while I'm looking for a couple to highlight authentic. Can you tell people or remind people, even though I know they already know where your content's at, what they should be looking for coming this season? Definitely. So, um, the main portion of my content is on our YouTube page. It's just authentic and the beard spelled the way you see it right there. Um, we cover the NFC East and it's from a Giants perspective. And my sandbox brother, the beard, who's a commander's fan. So it's kind of from those two perspectives where lifelong, like just like his mom is like my mom. We go way back. I've known them forever. So it's a, it's an interesting take on the way that the fan base, you know, or like the fandom is for two fans in the NFC East. We go through previews once a week. We recap once a week, we're four days a week on that channel. We do a fantasy show on the weekends and we, on Monday, we do the show giant over reaction. I'm trying to get a pat on. Um, I'm also doing content for bleach report these days. I got, um, I'm doing 10 streams for them in the month of September doing all the recaps for the games as well. Wow. Um, I'm working on an in-season documentary as well right now to I'm a cinematographer and aspiring cinematographer kind of transferring from like the audio world by damn an audio, audio engineer. A slew of things in the audio realm from, uh, working with J Cole on the off season, um, to doing, uh, some recordings for, uh, the Martin Scorsese film, which I still haven't watched yet, uh, Killers of the Flower Moon. So I'm kind of trying to get into that world as well and start directing films. And um, I figured what better way to do that than starting off with an in-season documentary, which is going to be the first episode will be probably around week four, week five, and it's going to be focused around the rookie quarterback class. I'm doing some interviews with a bunch of fans and just compiling as much, um, footages I possibly can. I went out to a bunch of training camps over the summer as well. So keep your eyes peeled for that as well. No, those episodes will be released on my YouTube channel as well. You're making me feel lazy right now, authentic, all the stuff you're getting to right now. I'm a work smarter, kind of not work harder type of guy. I like to, there's a, um, what's my dude's name, uh, Pat Flynn. He's a streamer and he has a quote that I kind of live by and it's like leave the running shoes by the door. And I just try to set up infrastructures to be able to, you know, make things easy for me. Um, we were talking about it off air before, like about the streaming setup and how difficult it may be to get a camera and do all these things. Yeah. And, um, I just try to lead the running shoes by the door. Like my streaming setups, just on wheels, I can kind of move it around the studio wherever I want. And everything that I do is kind of like that. I try to make things like most of my hobbies, I won't even say most of, I try to make all my hobbies into ways to make income and passive income. So that's how I'm trying to do it. Smart man. There's a lot I can learn from you authentic and a lot I've learned from you tonight. All right. Check into a couple more questions here and then we'll get you guys out of here, but this has been an amazing episode. Tuto says, Pat, we, we are going to use boom chaga to boost our energy mate. We hit our irons daily basis without excuses to get fired up mate. Tuto, we got to get a bag of boom chaga out to the rugby team in Italy. You are the man. All right. That said something here that stuck out to me. He said, it's just more of a comment. He said, Malik neighbors was a great pick. If we draft a quarterback next year, he should have it a wide receiver one authentic. This is one thing I think, you know, in the moment when they drafted neighbors and they didn't make that trade out for the quarterback they were trying to do. You think, okay, didn't get the QB it's Daniel Jones again. Frustration sets in, but when you watch neighbors on the field, you see what he looks like he could be. This could end up being the best kind of pick for a giant's turnaround coming in, what, two, three years, whatever it is. This is the kind of Shopify is the global commerce platform that helps you sell at every stage of your business. Shopify is there to help you grow. 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I do think, from a team building perspective, Andrew Thomas has become this type of player from Dave Gettleman's tenure, the kind of guy where you add him and three years later, you say our team is dramatically better because of that one selection, that one addition. I do think in the long run, it's possible, and the arrow seems to be pointing this way more than not, that as much as you wanted a quarterback now, and let's face it, if you hit on the quarterback now, that would have made much more of a difference. But without getting that quarterback, I think this could end up being a great thing for the organization, and that is separate from Dable Shane, like separate from whether they keep their jobs or not, I think Giants fan X, I think has to feel good that three years from now, neighbors' addition makes their team and their franchise a more stable and better one. What do you think of that? Yeah, I agree with you on that, and, you know, the feeling of at pick six, when we picked Malik neighbors, you knew that it was a safety net, you know, if the Giants didn't go quarterback, I put out some videos before the draft, and I had a hunch that the Giants were going to go with Malik neighbors. No. For me, I would have pulled the trigger on Michael Penix at six. A lot of people didn't agree with that at the time, especially, you know, in current time, not knowing that the Atlanta Falcons were going to draft him at eight, everybody pretty much had him as a second round grade. The injuries were a concern. The age was a concern, but getting a guy like this, like Malik neighbors, who looks to be like an alpha wide receiver one, looks to be, you know, a bit of a clone of what Odell Beckham was. And, you know, as Giants fans in the Giants organization, we need a little bit of luck here. We need this quarterback class coming out in 2025 to give us a little bit of luck so that we can get our guy. And I've had my eyes on a couple of quarterbacks coming out. Shader being one that I watched tonight, I like back a little bit, but I'm a big fan of Cam Ward. A lot of people, you know, are kind of throwing Cam Ward, you know, he's kind of a guy that's under the radar. And also Donovan Smith coming out of Houston, I'm a big fan of his too, because I like those dual threat type of quarterbacks. But what I think it's, it's very important that the Giants hit on a quarterback when they draft because you don't want a guy like Malik neighbors prime to kind of run out and then see the same thing that we saw from when Jerry Ries drafted Odell Beckham. And then when, when, um, Dave Gedelman got here, he decided to trade him and then, you know, it's kind of just wasted talent at the end of the day. Right. Right. No doubt about it. Yeah. Somebody asked the question, um, a couple of chats ago about why don't the Giants more often like add quarterbacks to the room, select quarterbacks with a mid or late round pick, just get guys in, try to develop. I thought that was a really like fair question. And you know, I'm not someone who like, I understand when you have a roster that needs to be built and needs better depth as we're always criticizing the giants of right now, then if you're picking a quarterback in the fourth round, you're not using it on a position player that can actually help your team. So that's totally a fair comeback and the reason why they're not doing it. But you know, I do think like an organization like the Eagles, for example, the way that they kind of continually just like roll the dice and grab one in the second and the fourth or whatever it is and not every guy's a hit, but like the jail and hurts pick. Like when they made that pick, it was kind of like, what the hell are they doing? You know what I mean? And now listen, that doesn't always work out. And that's easily the type of pick that you can make. You're kind of putting your neck on the line when you do that, get easily just as easily get fired as have it work out and have it be your next franchise quarterback. But I do think there's something to be said for taking swings at QB. I remember when I first met Steve Palazzolo at Pro Football Focus, he was constantly talking about the value of swinging at QBs because hitting on just that one, like you mentioned earlier, the QBs in two different classes, if you swing enough, the just the percentages chances increase of you landing on a guy who's going to change your team, who's going to change your roster. Now, you know, it's not usually going to happen in the third round or in the fourth round or whatever it is. But I do think there's something to that thinking and obviously you kind of have to be a team that has the luxury to be able to use a pick on a player like that, for sure, though. Yeah, I think that's important. I'm a big fan of Steve too from a PFF. I know they just shifted over to a new platform doing a new podcast and subscribe to them too. But I do think it's important that you at least bring in, you know, you need the picks to do it. And I think that was the tight position that the Giants were in this year. They only had six picks. So are you really going to use one of those on a quarterback? Spencer Rattler was there in the fifth round and he looks to be pretty decent over there with the Saints. I've been charting some of his throws and putting together compilations of some of his stuff on my channel and he's got he's got some good arm talent. And then the New England Patriots also tried to, you know, take a flyer on Joe Milton, which doesn't look like it's working out as great. But, you know, it never hurts to have that many quarterbacks. I forget who I heard talking about this. I think it was somebody in Cleveland. It might have been Bill Belichick actually talking about bringing in quarterbacks and kind of farming them to be able to use them as trade value later down the line. Like if you look at a Hendon Hooker with the Detroit Lions right now, I'm sure if a team, you know, or if the Detroit Lions wanted to part ways with him, they could absolutely trade that guy yesterday. So, you know, I don't think it hurts to bring in that kind of talent, but you kind of can't be in the struggle mode that the New York Giants have been in draft wise and record wise, you know, to do those things. Right. Right. Really good point. Stephen makes a good point. He says he just wanted to say the Giants are doing well by their season ticket holders with the ring replica package for the 100th season. Glad I got him. I agree. They actually had it on display for us in the media room, took some pictures of it that I'll post. I'm sure you guys have seen it by now, but I was even like holding the replica rings in my hands kind of comparing them and this and that the first Super Bowl ring to me, even though it's not necessarily the one that would look best on me, that 1986 Super Bowl ring beautiful, just with the single Lombardi trophy there on top, beautiful. I think they really did do right. They also gave us, check out what they gave us authentic. So, this apparently I believe is going on sale soon. I'm guessing it's going to be on their website, but it's like this enormous Giants 100 seasons book and it comes in like a commemorative kind of like blue box. And it's got their 100 top players all in it with writeups on the entire team and the history of the team and like beautiful photos and everything. And so, it's so funny. They gave it to us and they were like, but you can't announce the top 10 yet because we haven't done it yet. So, they're like, you need to embark on this. They're like, all right, all right. I think everyone knows who number one is relax. But yeah, that's, I have some information somewhere where that's available. I can bring it to you guys in the next chat. But you're right. They are doing well by the fans by the season ticket holders. I think the only way they're not is wearing these uniforms a week one. I can't. I'm not a fan of them, but I think we all know that everyone's going to love those uniforms if they beat the Vikings, right? Like it's. When they release those uniforms, I was kind of like, yeah, they're not that bad. And then I saw them in the shop when they released them. And I was just like, listen, ignore everything that I said about those uniforms. I can't stand them down. I was going to buy one, you know, being that it was the 100th year and all that. But I saw them and they, they don't look, they kind of look like a soccer uniform. So I'm not a big fan of those either. But I do agree that the replica rings, shout out to Mike C, who was in the chat. He posted some pictures and one of the group threads that were in and I got to see them and they look amazing. I mean, he said that they're weighted really nice too. So that's awesome by then. Yeah, no doubt. So wait, before we get out of here, and Tommy health and wealth to all. Yeah. Thank you, Tommy. Thanks for always saying that for being here. So wait, authentic. Do we have, don't we have to figure out right now what, what's the jersey you're going to buy? I mean, are you saying it's going to be neighbors one now? Is that if neighbors puts together, like if we get to the bye week and neighbors is, you know, pushing that threshold of a thousand yards, I'm, I'm a pool to trigger means number one. And I don't know if you know this, but like I'm, so I'm 41 years old. And when I played ball, if you wore number one, it was a target on you, like in high school, like you pull up to the field and you see, you know, why receivers warming up and you see a guy wearing number one, you don't just wear that jersey for no reason. Number one was a, was to signify that you were a playmaker. So if Malik neighbors can be that guy, I'm going to absolutely buy that jersey. I mean, it can't go wrong with number one. That's a great call about the target on your back. You got to, you got to live it. You got to back it up. It's funny. I was just a coach soccer and we were just on the field. I was joking with one of the coaches, some of the kids out there wearing like some, some wild looking cleats, you know, and we're pointing at him and we're like, you can wear that if you want, but you got to be the best player on the field. You're going to wear that. You know what I mean? You got to back it up. All right, guys, thank you all for being here. I want to tell you real quick before we get out of here about talking ball with Pat Lender being brought to you by boom, Chaga mushroom super drink, natural extract loaded with anti inflammatory immune boosting antioxidants and heart and healthy compounds. You can easily pour this natural liquid supplement into any of your favorite drinks. I put mine in my coffee every morning and immediately feel the difference. I personally have felt a post workout like energy boost with boom, Chaga also has the ability to lower cholesterol, reduce inflammation and improve immune and heart health with its beta glutes and antioxidants. Go to boomchaga.com today to place your first order. And if you used a discount code talking ball 25 or access it through the QR code on your screen, you will get 25% off your first subscribe and save order. Right now that means a month's supply costs you only $30. Start feeling the difference today at boomchaga.com guys, we have a lot more exciting stuff coming here on the talking ball with Pat Lender channel. Obviously in week one with the Giants Vikings, I will be there at MetLife Stadium talking ball live post game from the press box coming right out of the locker room. And after Davos press conference telling you all about what the players said, their reactions to the result, injury updates, news, whatever you got, you need to go follow all of authentic's content as well. Overreaction Mondays, I'll be checking in on that we'll get that going at some point early this season, this call lab has been fantastic. We got a rebrand or super chat too. Oh, we do. Super chat. Yeah. And I definitely want to respond to it. Hold on authentic. Sullivan, the one authentic's a man of the people. All right. Definitely. I make that mistake sometimes too of like signing off without getting to the last one. Um, yo, you keeping me honest. I appreciate it. I appreciate it. I wanted to bring that to your attention. So wait, hold on. This one right here. Mark says, for what it's worth, Porter's PFF grade is 73.2 and banks is 63.8. Okay. I mean, all right. I'd love to respond to this one first. So looking at, I'm here in DC and like I said, I cover the NFC East as well. And Emmanuel Forbes has been what I call burnt toast and coffee time. This dude has been struggling on the field in a regular season last year. He has struggled in camp, Gary Wilson had this dude looking crazier than Nick McCloud. It's been a bad year and a half for this kid, right? Yeah. But when I looked at the PFF grades and the rankings for all of the cornerbacks, I noticed that Emmanuel Forbes was one hundred and eighty eighth, I believe it was, and that Deontay Banks was a hundred and eighty third. And I was like the stark difference in the perception around those two guys, Deontay Banks being a guy that people think can turn into a cornerback one, which I do have that faith in him as well. And Emmanuel Forbes, who I saw in camp the first year, he got there and I thought this guy was going to be an absolute stud and come to find out he's just getting burned by AJ Brown and all kind of why receiver ones and they had to bench him. So I do think it's something to keep your eye on now, I don't allow PFF grades to necessarily just determine my, you know, assessment of a player. And I'm glad that Mark said for what it's worth because you got to take PFF for what it's worth and also use the eye test. I do think that Deontay Banks is, you know, a cornerback that will be climbing those PFF grades very soon. But just something to think about now, that's why that one stood out to me a little bit. No, that's interesting. That's a great breakdown by you too, especially comparing it to Forbes. I think the way I view banks too is I do not expect a rookie corner to be anywhere close to dominant or perfect. Like it is the most difficult position arguably on in football outside of quarterback. Did you hear Darius Slayton kind of downplay that on the key shot podcast? He was pretty much like, yeah, if I had to play another position, I'd play cornerback and like everyone always says it's one of the more difficult positions, but I think it's not. I was like, it's kind of interesting because I've heard that throughout my entire time of like watching ball is like cornerback is difficult, especially when you play a man and man coverage, but maybe in a Shane Bowen scheme, maybe that's what Darius Slayton's kind of leaning towards me by a little zone. Yeah. He could be saying that. And you know, also the corners will be coming back at him saying, maybe you'd play corner 15 years ago, but now we're not allowed to touch you or not allowed to jet their five yards. It's defensive holding. It's a first down. If I hold you six yards past the line of scrimmage on third and 15, like what are you talking about? That's true. That's what would come back to him. And that reminded me too of a slate and a bunch of the receivers were having a conversation last year. It was a huge argument tight ends receivers. They were arguing about what would you rather do catch a ton of touchdown passes or go off with yards and like have like four TDs. Yeah. And they were arguing for the most part, a lot of guys felt like it's better to be a yards guy than a TD's guy because TD's guys who don't have the receptions and yards to back it up. Don't get paid. But the guys who go off for say like 1500, you know, 1800 receiving yards, if they get in the end zone a little bit less, but they're going over a hundred yards every game, those are the guys who get paid. And I thought that was really interesting because it was about it was also connected to like we were talking Gronk versus Kelsey and all this stuff. And I was saying like, look at how many touchdowns Gronk is scored. Look at this guy was a beast in the red zone. But they were saying that it's better to be a yards guy than a touchdowns guy from like a career earnings perspective. I thought that was really fascinating because I'm like, pretty sure scoring touchdowns wins games. And they're like, no, you don't, you don't understand. Yeah. I think you need to hit a certain threshold. Like Terry McClellan is a good example of that of a guy who always gets the yards for a straight 1000 yard seasons, but he's always hovering around like four to six touchdowns, you know. So it really doesn't show up. I'm sure quarterback play has hurt him in that, in that regard, but I think if you can get to that 1000 yard mark and then you stack up the touchdowns, the touchdowns might be more important. That's interesting, interesting dynamic. There are some crazy, hilarious, fun conversations and arguments that happened in these locker ribs too. Got it. All right. So we're going to close out with everybody telling us and telling really authentic here. What an amazing show. Marjorie says, thanks for having authentic on loved it. No Mets says great show to Ila says, thank you for the time authentic and Pat. So does Randy. So does show everybody looks like they've enjoyed what we've been doing here. We had as much fun as all of you. Thank you so much for checking in on talking ball live with Pat Leonard with me and with authentic. Like I said, go follow all his content. Thank you for being here and the one last tease I'll give you. We got a rebrand coming on the podcast. So I got a new logo, got a new rebrand for the channel for the YouTube channel that as we head into week one here, authentic. And I know you, you got everything looking sharp. You got the graphics. Everything's looking good on your channel always. So I hope it's up to snuff. So I hope you like it. Sure. We'll be all ready. I like what you got going on here. Thank you, man. I'm going to need, I'm going to need the feedback though, but authentic. Thank you so much. This has been the first episode of our creator series, given back to people who have given so much to us and supported our channel here. Thank you so much, authentic. Any last words before we head out? Nah, man. Just thank you for having me on. And again, I think this is a great deed for the community of people who have like been on YouTube and talking ball and being that you're somebody that's really on the front lines on the field on a week to week basis. I mean, this was amazing. Great conversation. And we saw a lot of it alike and, you know, definitely looking forward to doing this again and possibly having you on my channel to, you know, talk some giant overreaction stuff. Anytime you want me there. I'm there. I'll see you again. And we'll see you guys later. See you next time. At your job, do you ever have to deal with a nose roller? How about a snub bully? Well, if you're installing a new conveyor belt system, dealing with the different components can sound like you're speaking a foreign language. Luckily, you've got a team ready to help. Rangers technical product specialists are fluent in maintenance, repair and operations. So whenever you want to talk shop, just reach out, call, click Granger.com or just stop buying Granger for the ones who get it done. Bingo. All right, Phil, we're recording now. So it's live. Go ahead. Pick on me the way that you want to. Did I say that? I would say that to my son and I mean, come on, man, just go. This isn't CBS. All right. Be quiet for a few seconds. Why would people want to listen to the Sims complete podcast? Well, a couple of things. One, if you like to see sons pick on their father, this might be the place. If you want to see a place where the father just kicks he out of his son, this will be the place. What do you like about it, Matt? Ditto father, son dynamic duo talking about the game of football that we love and share and appreciate together. And, you know, hey, it's an extension of what we did right growing up. I was able to watch my father play football, then obviously watch him as a broadcaster. And then he taught me the game of football and share the wisdom that he learned throughout his playing career. And, you know, hey, sometimes we're full of it and sometimes we actually know a thing or two. Well, we do do a lot of research. At least I do. I'm you, you little spotty, but you know, you're, you hang in there. It's fun. I love doing this and it's been awesome. Sims complete. Check us out wherever your podcasts are available on the Believe Network. Appreciate it. See you. If you like the show, please take a moment to rate, review and subscribe. It really does help the show to grow. Thank you for listening. [BLANK_AUDIO]