The Season of Self Love
Healing Beyond Betrayal: A Journey Through Depression and Self-Love with Cathelin
Welcome to another powerful episode of The Season of Self-Love with your host, Nyomi Banks! Today, we’re diving deep into the complexities of healing from betrayal and learning to love ourselves through adversity. Joining us is the incredibleCathelina, author of The Box, a novel that explores depression, family trauma, and the journey to emotional healing.
In this intimate conversation, Cathelina opens up about her personal experiences with depression, beginning from a traumatic incident in her childhood, and how she navigated years of internal struggle. Together, Nyomi and Cathelina discuss the themes in The Box, strategies for managing depression, and how writing became a form of healing for Cathelina. They also touch on the power of self-betrayal and the importance of self-compassion on the road to recovery.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
- Cathelina’s journey through depression and how it shaped her personal and professional life.
- The healing power of writing and turning pain into art.
- How to recognize self-betrayal and move beyond it to embrace self-love.
- Practical strategies for managing depression, including daily affirmations, exercise, and meditation.
Key Takeaways:
Healing is possible, and you are not alone. Cathelina’s story is a testament to resilience, the power of self-reflection, and the importance of reaching out for help. Through her book The Box, she offers readers a way to connect with their own healing journey.
Guest Info:
Cathelina Duver - Author of The Box
Instagram: @CatalinaDuver](https://instagram.com/catalinaduver)
Get The Box on Amazon and Barnes & Noble.
Call to Action:
Join the conversation on social media and let us know how you’re navigating your own journey of healing. Don’t forget to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast for more empowering discussions on self-love, healing, and personal growth.
#HealingBeyondBetrayal #TheSeasonOfSelfLove #DepressionRecovery #SelfLoveJourney #MentalHealthAwareness
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-season-of-self-love--6003379/support.
- Duration:
- 51m
- Broadcast on:
- 12 Sep 2024
- Audio Format:
- mp3
Every day we rise, challenging ourselves to work for what we believe in. At US Border Patrol, protecting our borders is more than a job. It's a calling. Agents answer the call, working together to keep our country and community safe. If you are ready for a new mission, join US Border Patrol and go beyond. Learn more at cbp.gov/careers. We wear our work day-by-day, stitch-by-stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So, whether you're gearing up for a new project or looking to add some tried and true work wear to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. Their work wear isn't just about looking good. It's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. Head over to Dickies.com and use the promo code WorkWear20 at checkout to save 20% on your purchase. It's the perfect time to experience the quality and reliability that has made Dickies a trusted name for over a century. - Welcome to the season of self-love, your daily dose of inspiration and encouragement. I'm your host Naomi Banks, and I am thrilled to be here with you today. This podcast is brought to you by Axe, Naomi, and Elevate Me, Self-Discovery. Are you ready to elevate your mindset and embrace the power of self-love or have you come to the right place? Each day we'll dive into topics that will empower and inspire you on your journey to our self-discovery and personal growth. Whether you're looking to cultivate healthy relationships, boost your confidence or find balance in your life, this podcast is here to support your every step of the way. We believe that self-love is the foundation of living and for feel and joy for life. And together we explore practical tips and insightful interviews and transformative stories that will leave you feeling inspired and lonely. So join me Monday through Friday as we embark on the daily adventure of self-love. Tune in to the season of self-love podcast to start your day on a positive note and discover the limitless potential within yourself. - Well, my beautiful people. I should go to the goddess, Naomi Banks here. All this is in the self-love podcast. And today we are exploring a deep, personal and powerful theme is healing beyond the truth. And joining us today is the beautiful Ms. Kathleen. She's an author of The Box, a novel that dives deep into the complexities of depression and family trauma. Kathleen, how are you? - I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. How are you doing? - I'm doing well. I'm doing well. I'm excited. I'm a little nervous to get into this topic 'cause as my listeners know, you are one of the first to really open up us breaking guests on. That's the one thing that our listeners ask for. We can have some more guests on. So we can kind of relate to other people whether they're a professional, gorgeous people just living their lives and going through transitional. And I just, I love that even with your blog, you have a blog that's called Kathy's Cross. Kathy's Cross, and I was reading some of that. And I was very inspiring. I even love the way that you use some of your own self tools to get you through depression. But let me start talking about you. And let me allow you to tell your story. But before we do that, Kathleen, I'm gonna do this first. This is something that we do every day, Monday through Friday, is that we start off our segment, our show with meditation and help kind of ground us to get us prepared and ready for our topic in here, all right? - I love that, yeah. - All right, thank you. All right, my listeners, if you're new here to the season of self love, you know what we do here every day, to get us grounded and get us set. So here we go. Find a comfortable position, whether you are sitting or lying down. Now gently close your eyes and take a deep breath in through your nose. I want you to hold it for a moment. Now exhale, slowly through your mouth. Now as you breathe in, I want you to imagine filling your body with warmth and light. Visualized as a light bringing you to a sense of peace and comfort. And as you exhale, I want you to let go of any tension or negativity that you may be holding onto. Now again, I want you to inhale deeply, filling your lungs with love and acceptance. Now hold it. Now exhale, releasing anything that no longer serves you. I want you to leave each breath guide you to a deeper relaxation and peace. And I want you to exhale the heart. Now take one final deep breath in. And as you exhale, I want you to gently bring your awareness back to the space around you. Now when you are ready, open your eyes. And I want you to thank you for taking this moment at this time for yourself. - Again, I want to thank you all for just being, giving us a moment. Thank you, Kathleen, for just joining us in this moment right here right now. All right, so let's start, let's start from the beginning. Could you share a bit about your journey of depression and how you came to create the box? - Sure. So first of all, thank you so much for having me on here. So I feel that, well, I started experiencing depression when I was about 11 or 12 years old. And it was because of an incident that happened with a boy who touched me inappropriately. And I did not know how to process that experience. And even though I confronted him and I sort of retaliated, it left me feeling shameful, it left me feeling negative about myself, it left me feeling hating myself. And I did not know how to process that. I didn't talk to any adults about it at the time. I was 12 years old. And so I kept all the feelings inward. And in doing so, I learned to distrust myself and my opinions of others. I learned to distrust other people, especially boys. I learned to speak negatively about myself. And I'm saying learned intentionally because it certainly was something that was ingrained in me through me. Nobody else was telling me that I was not worthy or that nobody was telling me these things. I was just telling myself that. And because I didn't talk to any adults and I didn't talk to my sister about how I was feeling, I just kept all those feelings in and I kept through them. And this was all throughout grade school, high school, college, and they were, of course, years and moments where I was fine. And when I was around other people, I was fine for the most part. I feel like it enhanced my introversion and for that, I didn't like going places. I didn't like being around other people, especially around boys. And it wasn't until my mid 20s where I realized that this is, there was something wrong here and my sister helped me see it as well. She was like, this doesn't make any sense why you're always so upset, why you're always so sad. And mind you, remember about 25 years ago, people weren't talking about depression like we are now. And so I know what I was going through and we did my sister but she knew that there was something wrong. And she's the one who picked up the yellow pages because that's what we're using back then. She picked up the yellow pages and looked for a therapist for me. And when she did that, I was like, okay, I didn't even fight it. I was like, it's time. I need to find out what's going on with me. And when I was diagnosed with clinical depression, I was also prescribed pills. I think I was prescribed Zoloft. And at the time, I was happy to call them my happy pills. I was happy to take them because they felt like they would help me. But a few years down the line, I left my job after my father passed and I was no longer insured. And I couldn't keep on with the Zoloft. And I was going to therapy. Every week I was going to one-on-one therapy and group therapy. And I found that they really couldn't help me because I was airing out things that I never even realized about myself, my need to drink to excess in order to feel comfortable around people, things like that. And so when I ran out of insurance, I had to figure out a way to, well, not even had to figure out a way. I was just like, okay, I ran out of insurance. I'm just going to deal with this and I think I'm good. I think I could deal with the symptoms of depression, but I couldn't, I didn't. And little by little, quite by accident, Naomi, my sister and two of my cousins, we all got together and like, let's exercise, let's help each other motivate each other through exercise. So we started doing that and we started saying, let's motivate each other by doing daily affirmations and meditations. And all of these things started happening that all these things came together that I realized a couple of years down the line that I haven't been depressed as I usually am. I haven't needed medication. Now, mind you, I didn't cure the depression. Of course, I had bouts of depression, but it wasn't like before where every single day was like, I had to hide under the covers and couldn't go outside. And it was amazing when I realized that I felt powerful when I realized that all these little things that I was doing was coming together in a cocktail for me to help overcome the depression as well as writing. So about 25 years ago, when I started seeing my therapist, just before I started seeing my therapist, I didn't understand what I was going through as I mentioned before. So I wanted to write a story. I've always been into writing. I wrote a story about a woman who was going through issues. She didn't know what she was going through either. But once I was diagnosed with clinical depression, I knew exactly what remained character was going through. And writing as well as all the other things that I was doing helped me expel my demons, what I call my depression month. And it helped me deal with it on a regular basis, on a daily basis. So it wasn't that I just did all these things and I was done. I had to continue something that just like we shower every day, I had to do my motivation, my meditation that we did, affirmation, exercise, writing, all of that stuff. And that's how I can't realize how I was able to deal with my depression. - That's beautiful, that's incredible. - Thank you. - That's even knowing that at 11 years old, you know you feel that something is going wrong in at 12. You know, I have a question for you. - Sure. - We wear our work day by day, stitch by stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So whether you're gearing up for a new project or looking to add some tried and true work wear to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. The work wear isn't just about looking good. It's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. Head over to Dickies.com and use the promo code workwear20 at checkout to save 20% on your purchase. It's the perfect time to experience the quality and reliability that has made Dickies a trusted name for over a century. - When you need meal time inspiration, it's worth shopping king supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouth-watering meals. And no matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy our everyday low prices, plus extra ways to save, like digital coupons worth over $600 each week and up to $1 off per gallon at the pump with points. So you can get big flavors and big savings king supers, fresh for everyone, fuel restrictions apply. - For your parents, not to recognize that they're not, 'cause I read that you had a twin sister and I can see how that intuition and that connection with you, where she can actually feel what you're going to through, but not knowing, but as for your parents, how do they not recognize, you know, the attitude changes, the things that you go through when you are going through depression. You, they've never asked you, you know, in that moment when you were going through that, you know, like, Kathy, what's going on? You know, you understand what I'm saying? - Oh, yeah, completely. I'm getting a little emotional, don't mind me. This is what I did. I think, so my family, I'm Haitian. My parents come from Haiti. And I feel like I've come to realize that Haitians are a really tough group of people, right? And they're not very empathetic and I kind of understand why because we had to, there's a lot that we had to deal with, right, as a people. So my mother knew that I had anger issues. And I think she just translated it to me being difficult. I don't think she understood that I was depressed. I didn't understand it myself. And she had her own issues, she had her own problems. And if my sister, if she was rearing us the same way, and my sister was fine, and then there was something with me that, you know, that I had to get over so that I could be fine. So I really, I don't fall to my parents, and my father was hardly ever home because he was always, he worked as a cab driver. He owned his own medallion. And he, so he never got to see me during the day when I would have my attitudes or get into these depressive moments or emotional moments. But I think that's what it was. My mother just probably thought I was being difficult and I don't fall to her for that. I never told her what had happened. I never told her the thing that caused it. I didn't even realize it at the time. So I think, I just think that she just thought I was being, that that was my personality. - Now, in your book, you deal with a lot of, you know, heavy themes that's in your book. How does that relate to your own experience and what message do you want to convey with your readers? - So, great question, thank you for asking. So it's interesting, I tell people that my main character, her life is completely different from mine, you know, I feel I made her a stronger person, type of person that I wish I was. The only similarities that we have is that I gave my depression, I gave it to her. I wanted to see what she would do with it, right? But it, so as I was writing and I was expelling these feelings that I have onto the page for my character, I made a conscious decision to make sure that she dealt with it differently. I don't know if I'm answering your question, but let me continue with my thought process. And so what I did was she, people around her know that she's depressed, her friend knows, her father knows. Her mother and her sister didn't really know that, but I intentionally made it so that she told a few people, a few people know, but other people don't know where she will sort of keep it in. And mind you, her friend who does know, she treats you as a joke, oh yeah, yeah, you depression. Oh, this thing that you need to get over. And that's how I felt for most of my life, how I felt like I just need to get over it. And people have told me when they see me emotional, just get over it, right? And so the message that I wanted to convey in this book is that depression is not something that you can just get over, it's really not. Even if you go through a short bout of depression because somebody has died, it's all so serious. It's very impactful, not only to your life as the person who's going through depression, but to people in your life as well. My main character, she does suffer with depression is she is seeing a therapist, but there are moments that she is combative with her therapist, right? She challenges her therapist. And in that respect, she's not taking her therapy seriously, not seriously, but she's not taking her therapy in a way that it will fully help her. And I found myself combative with my therapist because she was challenging me in ways that I didn't let those emotions, I didn't want to go there, but you need to go there in order to overcome it, right? And so the message that I want to share with people through this book is that depression is something that's very, very serious. It's something that you need to talk about, that other people need to be there for you. Even if it's something like what my sister, my sister didn't know how to handle it. So she was just like here, you go talk to a therapist. And she let me know that her presence was there. She was there for me without so much as saying the words or saying just try to feel better or you don't have to cry. We don't need to hear that. As depressive people, we don't need to hear, get over it. We don't need to hear, stop crying or it'll be all right. We don't want to hear that. Sometimes we just want somebody to just sit there with us. And I just want to really point out for those people who know others who are going through depression, just let them know that you're there for them. Understand that it's something that the depressive herself or himself has to be strong enough to want to jump those hurdles and seek the help that they feel like they need to get. - Yeah, I love that. And even turning, 'cause what I've seen and you're turning your pain into art. - Yes. - And even in the beginning when you were just speaking and you were talking about how you and Mia, is her name Mia Amaya? Mia is the main character of the book, okay? And for you, you just, you said you just gave her your depression, that's it. But as I'm hearing you speaking, you talk about her, you actually made her your superhero. You made her someone who you wanted to have done throughout your time, from the time you were 12 to you were 20 something years old to be able to speak to all of these people, your friend, this and this. And so there is so many similarities besides that depression. You wanted that superhero to be you. You understand and be that superhero for yourself. And you created this amazing character of Mia to do that and to tell your story on what it is that you, a part of which you thought your healing should be in the beginning. Does that make sense? - Yes, it does. I never thought of that, that I created my own superhero, but that's kind of true. Yeah, thank you for that. - Absolutely. - You know, it's interesting, you know, when you're writing a character, they can't be passive. They have to be, you know, they have to have agency to do things in order to move forward. So that's why I actually, I made her do the things that I did, but I also come to realize that like she's a very powerful figure at work and she lets people know what she wants and what she needs. And I don't feel like I'm like that at work sometimes. So you're right in that sense. I created a superhero, somebody who is gonna do the things that I wish that I could do with and that sort of take strength from that. - Yeah, that's beautiful. I like that. And my next question was a longer writing, what other strategies do you have to help manage depression? - Yeah, yeah. So I already mentioned the daily exercise. And it doesn't even have to be that good. You know, I thought there are a lot of people who are like, I don't have that time for exercise or, you know, I might hurt myself or I don't have time to go to the gym. I don't go to the gym. I can't stay and go in the gym. I do it in my living room, right? And I use videos in order to follow. And I literally started 10 minutes a day, literally. I used to feel like I had no time to exercise so I did it 10 minutes a day. And then I realized, okay, it takes me about 10 minutes to get dressed. It takes me about 10 minutes for the workout and 10 minutes to cool down. I might as well put a little bit more into it. And that's how I went into working out for at least 30 minutes a day, right? I do the meditations. I either do it at night as I'm falling asleep or in the morning when I wake up. I read positive books too. Any motivational books that I can get my hands on, right? Especially somebody motivational. Like I read Michelle Obama's first book and I loved it. It just gave me life, you know? So in reading about these celebrities, they go through their own issues as well and they've overcome it. What we see on the screen is this fabulous person but they went through their own demons, you know? And so it's really, really motivational to read about that. Self-affirming, not self-affirming, motivational videos, you know, when on YouTube and they have these series of images of people doing great things and a voiceover saying, you can do this and you could do that. I love those videos and really empowers me. So a number of those things that I do, and I also list a few of them at the end of my book too, acupuncture, you could do talk therapy. I highly believe in just a number of things. And just like you mentioned before, art. There are some people who are so talented in so many different ways. Find, I always tell people, find that thing that you feel like you can't live without that art that you just love, immerse yourself into that. You become so proud of yourself and you look forward to doing that thing on a daily basis. I just love writing. Oh my gosh, I don't know where my life would be without writing. So yeah, those are some of the things that I do. - Yeah, I find myself getting lost. Getting lost, it's like a movie as I'm writing with some movie that's happening, writing with eyes and I get so excited. Like I'm writing like two or three chapters and then before I do it, I'm on the phone, talk to my husband like, oh my God, did you know what she just did? Like I love you. (laughs) - I love you guys. I love that. - Yeah, that's awesome. - Now for you, this month we're talking about living beyond betrayal. And it's not just about betrayal for others. You know, the others, you know, done for us. How have you been able to get beyond yourself? I know that you went through the depression because you did have a betrayal. I don't know the backstory of it, but even with the young man who had touched you unwanted me, there's a part of betrayal in that. But also I'm gonna go deeper. There's a part of betrayal that we have within ourselves when we don't, when we feel like we don't protect ourselves or take care of the needs that we have. So when a part of you going through your depression, did you find that you recognize any betrayal that you have within yourself? - That's amazing. - And it felt like I would get over it. - I never thought of myself as, I never thought of betraying myself, right? But in a sense, I did because... - We wear our work day by day, stitch by stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So whether you're gearing up for a new project or looking to add some tried and true work wear to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. Their work wear isn't just about looking good. It's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. Head over to Dickies.com and use the promo code WorkWear20 at checkout to save 20% on your purchase. It's the perfect time to experience the quality and reliability that has made Dickies a trusted name for over a century. - When you need meal time inspiration, it's worth shopping king supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouth-watering meals. And no matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy our everyday low prices, plus extra ways to save. Like digital coupons worth over $600 each week and up to $1 off per gallon at the pump with points. So you can get big flavors and big savings, king supers, fresh for everyone, fuel restrictions apply. - Like I said, when that boy touched me, I didn't know him, I had met him that night and we were playing hide and seek and he was behind me and he had his hand inappropriately where it should not happen. And I moved his hand away innocently. So you know, just told me on my stomach area. And then he whispered in my ear, don't worry, I won't tell nobody. And I was just like, that traumatized me, right? And immediately, I was not angry with him. I was angry with me, with myself but allowing it to happen. So in a sense, I betrayed myself, right? I felt like I did. I betrayed myself in that I didn't give myself that grace to say no, it wasn't your fault. I didn't give myself that grace. And even as I grew older and I told you that I no longer trusted boys, I didn't trust men, I went, I got into a relationship with somebody in my early 20s, 17, 18 years old into my year 20. And I was, I didn't know how to handle somebody who found me attractive, somebody who wanted to be with me. And those times when he, when he disrespected me by, so certain things that he would say or do, I wasn't angry with him. I wanted, in fact, I wanted more from him, right? And I felt like those were complicated feelings from what happened when I was 12 years old. When I found out that that boy, the one that I was involved with in 17, 18, I was with him for three years. And all those three years I found out later that he was cheating on me. And I was angry at first at him, but then who else did I have left to blame myself? Why didn't you see this? Why didn't you see the sunlight? How could you have let this happen again? And then I felt like I betrayed myself in not allowing myself to see these signs. - Yeah. - You're absolutely right with how I came over it. I just had to keep talking about it in therapy. I had to keep talking about it in therapy. I knew that it wasn't my fault, but somehow I kept blaming myself and my therapist had to talk me off the ledge. And writing it down, I found recently in storage a bunch of poems that I had written when I was younger that I don't remember writing, but they're all about that thing that happened when I was 12. And they're all about that first boyfriend that betrayed me, that cheated on me when I was in my late teens. I kept writing about it. I kept writing about it. And eventually I was not able to get over it, but I was able to deal with that pain and deal with how I felt about myself. - All right, my next question. What value would a depressive find in your blog? - The value of themselves, first of all, right? That they are not alone. Then they're not suffering with this alone. They're not the only ones in the world who feels this. And I feel like that idea of what's the word. I'm thinking solidarity, but I don't know if I'm using it correctly, but just knowing that, oh my gosh, you go through this, I go through this. I can feel better about myself. I'm not a freak. I'm not somebody who is abnormal, right? I think somebody would find the value in that they can understand themselves a little bit more, reflection. Even when to sit down and write all of those blog posts, I had to really reflect on the situation that happened and how I felt about it. And that was a new kind of therapy for me, right? And sometimes what I was writing, I was just like, oh my gosh, it was too much for me that I had to take it to my therapist and be like, this is what I'm writing about and it's making me feel not good about myself. And so it's a constant, constant reflection. And so I feel that the person was reading my blog posts and relates to it because they're going through some different feelings, they can reflect on what's happening and it could probably bring them closer to either forgiving themselves or forgiving the person who's wrong with them. And I think that that's where they would find the value. - Yes, yes. Oh yes, yes, that's beautiful. What would you say to someone? And I know you spoke about it a little earlier. What would you say to somebody who will tell you, just get over it? - That there's no getting over it. That I wanna think about it in a different perspective. It makes me mad when I hear that just get over it because I've heard it all while growing up. And with somebody who's saying just get over it, that's somebody who's not willing to sit down and listen and hear you. And they don't have to. They're not obligated to do so. But I would tell that person, if you don't have something constructive to tell this person to heal from what they're going through, then don't say anything at all. Just say, okay, I hear you. I'm just gonna go that way, you know? Or because depression isn't something that you can just get over. If you want to tell anybody something, you could just tell them, maybe you should find a therapist to talk to. No disrespect, but it's always good to talk things out. You could tell that person instead of just get over it. Have you ever thought of art therapy, you know? Have you ever thought of a movie? Hey, I saw this movie that I saw when somebody was going through the same things that you're going through. You might wanna check it out. I don't know. Getting, telling somebody to get over it, is telling them, is dismissing them. Is telling them their emotions are invalid, so that their feelings are invalid. And how dare you? Don't tell somebody to get over it, don't. Just don't. Now, now you have being a 11 year old, going through your pre-teens teenage, going through depression. And I read somewhere that you are a second grade teacher. Am I correct? No, I'm not a second grade teacher. I'm a middle school teacher. I'm middle school teacher, but that's even better. That's even better. So you being a teacher, have this any moment of time that you've seen that signs of your students being depressed. And if so, what have you done to help them along, or, you know? Yeah, so it's really a fine balance with that. You have to walk a really fine line with this, because when I did that, I almost got in trouble. So let me explain. One student had written me, this was just at the start of the pandemic, students were not going to the school building, only a few whose parents had opted for them to go in. And one student, so classes weren't the same. I would give my students work to do, they do it on their own, I grade it. So during that period, where one of my students had to do her own work, she sent me an email saying, you know, Ms. Jane, she said, "I, sometimes I feel like I don't like myself "and this and that." And I was just like, oh my gosh, I used to feel that way too. You're fine, you're fine, you know. Just, you know, you matter. And I was telling all this stuff that I went through. And then she brought me back saying, "Oh, Ms. Jane, I'm crying right now." You know, because nobody has ever talked to me like that before, and I felt so good talking to her. But I almost got in trouble because, because when a student writes that to a teacher, they're not supposed to sit with that information. They have to go to the guidance house right away. And I eventually did go to the guidance counselor, but I didn't do it right away. But now what I do is I tell, I share with students all the time that when I was their age, I used to have feelings of loneliness. And when a student comes to me and tells me something like this, the first thing I do is talk to the guidance counselor about it, but then I also talk to the student and I check in with that student. I mean, these days, you know, are you able to talk to the guidance counselor? Look at the guidance counselor do for you, you know? So I'm open. I am so open in sharing my story with anybody who asks. That's why I love doing these podcasts. And I'm not, I don't shy away from the things that happen to me. And I don't shy away from my feelings of depression and what I want through that. And even with my students, I am so open. So I always let them know that I'm there for them. And I always let them know that the guidance counselor can help them even more than I can. I can only help them on a personal level, but the guidance counselor is trained to help them the way that they need to be helped. - Well, that's beautiful because you're giving them more of an experience that you went through, you know, you went through it as a three teen and a teenager. So they can kind of see that. So they kind of got it in both ways. And I'm glad that you did, you do embrace your purpose. 'Cause I'm always complaining more, you embrace your purpose and know what that is and what that means. I always say everything, it doesn't happen to us. It happens for us. And I love that house to, you know, to go into, to be these vessels and be able to speak our stories and tell. You understand what I'm saying? - Yes, absolutely. - That's amazing. And I thank you for that. Because I have a middle school and my two oldest one. But I know that sometimes they don't want to speak to parents. They rather seek outside to see that because I know I was a teenager at one time. I don't want to speak to my parents, I'm not. - Right. - But it's always good to have someone that's of an older age, that's of an authority that feeds you. 'Cause sometimes your parents don't see you. Just like you said, your mother was very strong-headed. You know, you come from a background that, you know, that doesn't have empathy. That's, you know, that don't have that. So it's good that they had that. It's been a long time since I've been in school to be on that, the opposite end. And I know my three babies, my three babies, they're all three different personalities and characters. And... - We wear our work day by day, stitch by stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So whether you're gearing up for a new project or looking to add some tried and true work wear to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. Their work wear isn't just about looking good. It's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. Head over to Dickies.com and use the promo code Workwear20 at checkout to save 20% on your purchase. It's the perfect time to experience the quality and reliability that has made Dickies a trusted name for over a century. - When you need meal time inspiration, it's worth shopping king supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouth-watering meals. And no matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy our everyday low prices, plus extra ways to save, like digital coupons worth over $600 each week and up to $1 off per gallon at the pump with points. So you can get big flavors and big savings, king supers, fresh for everyone, fuel restrictions apply. - Sometimes school doesn't do what I think they should do, not taking care of them. But when they do come, 'cause sometimes they don't want to talk to parents and then do their, then give them that gear to be able to listen to them and talk to them and not just label them. - Absolutely, I completely agree with you. And that labeling is so detrimental to a young person development, I feel like emotional development, I agree. - Yeah, it's just funny when I think about the work that I'm doing now, and I think about just growing up in high school and grade school, I remember these few kids, they had very trouble, they were very troubled kids, they were always in trouble, always at the principal office. I mean, even one of the parents used to come in and work the child in front of the class, you know? So can you imagine not how, not only embarrassing that is, but how you actually tore that person down? You know, that's on the East, but I think it was in second, third grade when that happened. And then, you know, when you really see how he turned out, he turned out to be really a criminal. Like, I believe he's in prison now. - You know. - So you, and that's the thing is, you know, people in school did not take the time, and I know people say, "Nayomi, that's not their responsibility." I understand, but when you go into something like that and you are around children and people like that, I believe that's of a service. I think that's of us a part of us of being a service of one another, because you don't know what that person's background is. You don't know where they come from. You know, you don't know if they ate that the night before, you know, let's find them more help. Let's find them, you know, let's go beyond the guide, you know, the guiding council. Let's make programs within the school or mentoring, you know, those, you know, those type of things. But I'm now, now I'm just going on a list. I'm still going to say. (laughing) - I completely understand, and I completely agree with you. As an educator, I feel like we do need to be doing more of our students. It's just, it's, there's a lot of rotate, and there's a lot that the teachers themselves have to juggle, oh gosh, it's so stressful being a teacher and dealing with all, like, in one classroom, you have 34 students, so you're dealing with 34 different personalities, and maybe a few of them notice that they're not, they may be emotionally hurting, but how do you approach all of them, and how do you talk to their parents, and then, oh, but I have to give them homework and I have to test them for this, it's a lot. - Yeah, and I can, yeah, yeah, that's what they're, I mean, seriously, when we talk about funding and we talk about politics, and I hate talking about politics, when we talk about funding and stuff like that, this is where they need to put more money into the schools. Two-half programs that's within the school like that to where there's a mentoring, where there's not only just the counselor, but there's other things to hit, different aspect, like it says, sexual abuse. You need a whole person that's in there that only deals with that. You know, just deal with that. You have kids that send us some drugs. You need that right in within the school. We need to start funding these schools to be able to have each one of those for these children, 'cause you just don't know what's happening at home. - Yeah. - Yeah. - And it's not just, they need to be there in the school on a daily basis, because sometimes we have people from different programs, they come in and talk to the students for a day, and then that's it. And then we don't do anything else with it. They talk about sexual abuse, they talk about drug abuse, and then they leave. And I know it's up to us to keep talking about it, but then we have all these other things. - Yeah, but I, man, I love that you were educator, and I love it, because it is a part of servicing. I just think I need more help. - Yeah. - But thank you for that, I appreciate it. - Yeah, really, really. Okay, let's go on. I had some more questions. I'm scrolling down my theme right now. I'm sorry, I had to give you more questions. Okay, within your book, I know you like me or is, I'm gonna tell her, me is your superhero. That's just the first version of me. What other characters in your book that were your favorites or that you enjoy creating? - Okay, so I really enjoyed Tyree's Black, which is her love interest. And the reason why I enjoyed him, enjoyed writing about him, because he's supposed to be that charismatic guy, like all the girls who've smeared over him, but he's also the person that speaks about loving yourself, about putting your art out there, putting yourself out there. He's the person who talks about just dealing with your emotions. He's the voice of reason for me. And I liked creating him because he was so positive. And everything that he speaks about in a positive way are the things that I learned from myself when I was doing all the meditations and all that stuff with my sister and my cousins. So I really like him because he's so charismatic and because he's the type of person who's like, let's make this a positive experience. How can we learn from this negative thing and turn it into something positive? So I really liked that about him. And my other favorite character is Mia's best friend, Gory, who's just like, she don't care about anything. She tells it like it is. She's the type of person who's like sexually liberating and she will let everybody know. And she's just a fun character to write. I just had so much fun with her. I'm a person who doesn't use swear words. I don't use expletives, but she does. And I thought that that would be a fun way to make that a part of her personality. So those were the characters that I really enjoyed writing. - Beautiful, okay. - So I was gonna ask you, do you have a Gory in your real life? Is that one of your girlfriends that like, just, you know what I mean? You have different girlfriends and they do. - Yeah. - That's all right. - Well, yeah, my sister, actually, she's not as, we talked as, what should I say, a vulgar as Gory is. But my sister tells it like it is. Sometimes she will use some swear words or whatever, but she's the person that I go to when I need a reality check. So yeah, that's my sister. - Yeah, beautiful. All right. So we're gonna wrap all of this up. - Okay. For you, what's next on you? What's the next project? I know you get the box, the box is out right now, the book is out right now. So what are the things that you have going on that you can tell my listeners? - Sure. So this summer, I've just been promoting the box. I'm going to be going to some festivals, park fairs and stuff like that in order to sell it. But I did start writing a moon novel. I actually started it about two years ago, and because I've been working on the final edits of the box, I haven't really been able to tackle it, but it's going to be about a pair of twin sisters, Haitian American twin sisters, who are dealing with a mysterious illness that their mother is suffering with, and it also has to do with them being twins in identity. And I am really looking forward to starting that and really going deep into what exactly it's about. 'Cause I don't know just yet. I just know their names. And I know the fact that they're gonna be really, really close identical twin sisters. So yeah. - That's beautiful. I can't wait to read it to see what you come up with. Yeah. - Didn't be great. - Yeah. It's just amazing when writing books and creating these different characters. Even as I don't know, as I'm writing, usually I do it like an outline. I do a nice little outline. I do like a background build up with each one of the characters. As I go to writing, then this is something just like kind of just burst open. And then I got this character on a nice little role. And I'm just like, "Oh yeah, yeah, yeah." - You get as excited as I'm describing myself when writing these characters. - I do. I get so excited. And it's like, I don't know where the ideas are coming from. It's like coming from somewhere and either like being downloaded to me somehow. I get so excited like, "Oh my," just like you said before that you call up your husband. Like, guess what this character did? That's how I feel like, "Oh, snap. "I didn't know if this was gonna go there." But she did, you know? - I get really excited because you're really, you're creating this person, right? And who has their own issues? And I just think it's amazing. It's a fantastic thing. I just love writing. Yeah, yeah. I do get excited about creating new characters, yeah. - Well, beautiful. Again, thank you, Catalina, for just coming on and sharing your story with us. And I would love for you to come back soon and share. You know, we have different series every month here. This is in a sub-love. And my co-host, he comes in twice a week. It's my therapist friend, Dr. Will. We have good times and we talk with, this is all about sub-love, it's about learning how to fall in love with yourself, have an intimate relationship with yourself. But once you're able to do that, then you're able to teach others on how to treat you. But it's supposed to have to treat themselves and it's like a domino effect. So once you pass that along, you know, it just keeps moving forward and forward and forward. A lot of times we don't, we're not taught how to love ourselves or what sub-love really means. And so what we do is we kind of go deep down. And so I wanted to really, truly go into about the betrayal, not only having a betrayal from others, but also for ourselves. - Yeah. - We're able to heal ourselves from that. So we can be a better us for whoever else we are connected with. - I love that, I love that, I love that. Yes, I completely agree with you. - Yeah. - Well, again, thank you. And I wish nothing but good luck with the box that you sell, that you're on a New York best selling. - Yes, yes, yes, let's put it out there. Let's put it out there. - All right, is there anything else that you want to share with my audience before we let you go? - Nothing except that you can get the box on Amazon, bondsandnoble.com. You could also find me on Instagram where I post daily about the novel and you could also find ways to contact me through my Instagram, which is Catalina DuBere. - Okay, beautiful, beautiful. All right, so to my listeners, I want you to remember that the death of betrayal or pain and healing is so possible. And not only you're not alone, so check out Catalina's book and box and join us next time on The Season of Self Love. Go into then, take care of yourselves and each other. Have a good one. (soft piano music) - Thank you for listening to The Season of Self Love podcast. If you have any questions or would like to connect with us, you can follow us on social media. Just search for The Season of Self Love on Instagram. And if you have any questions or topics you like us to cover, feel free to email us at elevateme9999@gmail.com. And remember, you are worthy of love, growth, and happiness. So keep shining bright, and I'll see you tomorrow for another episode of The Season of Self Love. We get to one another in yourselves, and I will keep it sexy. Send a light, love, and prayers. (soft piano music) (soft piano music) (soft piano music) (soft piano music) (soft piano music) (soft piano music) (soft piano music) We wear our work, day by day, stitch by stitch. At Dickies, we believe work is what we're made of. So, whether you're gearing up for a new project or looking to add some tried and true work wear to your collection, remember that Dickies has been standing the test of time for a reason. Their work wear isn't just about looking good. It's about performing under pressure and lasting through the toughest jobs. Head over to Dickies.com and use the promo code WorkWear20 at checkout to save 20% on your purchase. It's the perfect time to experience the quality and reliability that has made Dickies a trusted name for over a century. When you need meal time inspiration, it's worth shopping king supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouth-watering meals. And no matter what tasty choice you make, you'll enjoy our everyday low prices, plus extra ways to save, like digital coupons worth over $600 each week and up to $1 off per gallon at the pump with points. So you can get big flavors and big savings, king supers, fresh for everyone, fuel restrictions apply.