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Let's be out there making contributions in support of the show to keep these conversations coming your way. Those patrons are eligible for some bonus content like the pre-season Patreon zoom room that we had earlier this week. That link is available on the Patreon page for all contributing members. Head over there if you couldn't catch us for the live chat. You can get caught up on the replay with some fellow listeners and Patreon supporters of the Bird Shop Podcast and GDIY podcast. Patrons also get exclusive discounts. We've got one for Marshwear clothing right now, which is a Patreon giveaways and we set everybody up with some Bird Shop Podcasts, can coolers and stickers. If you want to learn more or sign up, you can do so at patreon.com/birdshot. If you're out there listening and you love the show and you want to support us in another way, you can always leave the show a rating, review, subscribe to the show, follow the show, share an episode, tell a friend, I appreciate that as well. Alright, this podcast drops on Friday, August 30th, which means we're days away from September 1st and by the time you hear from me again, it will be September. So just want to take a second to wish everybody a happy hunting season officially. I am certain some listeners will be hitting the field on September 1, be it a dove field or a wide open expanse of prairie grass. I won't be out there quite yet, but I will be out there with you all in spirit. I want to wish everybody a safe, successful opener and that goes for the rest of your hunting season as well. The Bird Shop Podcast will be with you all along the way, of course, and we will hopefully keep you entertained and informed on your drive time. For your next hunting trip or in between bird covers, we'll be there with you. Let's all go out and have another enjoyable season filled with great dog work, exciting flushes and good times in the field and back at camp. Enjoy it everyone, hunting season is here. Alright, and speaking of enjoying it and appreciating every moment, I could think of few other guests that embody that mentality and that spirit more so than our guest today, George de Costa, man with an incredible attitude, a wealth of knowledge, and just a genuine appreciation for all things, hunting, upland birds, bird dogs, the entire experience as you will learn today, or perhaps recall from when we interviewed George a couple of years ago after the release of his first book, George's Back with another addition to your upland library, this time being Tails with Tails from the heart of a man who loves life and bird dogs, the pages of which are filled with stories and anecdotes from George's adventures and experiences over the years with memorable dogs, good friends, old and new, and of course, upland birds. With that said, let's welcome into the conversation and back to the bird shot podcast, George de Costa. I do one more thing, I always forget to do this and I usually end up, for some reason, right after I hit record, I always remember, I like to know, do you remember when the last time you were on George? I don't, I was trying to think about that this morning and it's been at least, I'm thinking, I, you know, when I was thinking about it, I thought to myself, you know, in the book, I say things go by a blink of an eye as one of the chapters, and they literally are, I, you know, I was like, was it a year ago, two years ago, three years ago, the years just clicked by so, so quickly that I'm not sure. Yeah, episode number 170, April 12, 2022, two years ago, over two years ago. Yeah. Wow. Jeez. Well, you're cranking those books out and, and here you are again on the bird shot podcast. Welcome back, George, my friend. I appreciate it. It's going to be a fun chat today. Thank you for joining us and heck, man, you got another book for all of us to read. Yeah. Thank you for having me. I'm, I'm excited to be back and I appreciate the invitation. Things have been going really well for me and, and it's exciting. I'm, I'm on this side of the terrain looking at the cover and the dog still. So I'm a happy guy. Yeah. Love it. Love it. Yeah. You've, we're going to get into a lot of that today. I love, I love your attitude, George. And I imagine that anybody, anybody that spends more than a minute around you probably has a sense for that. And it's one of the things I think people appreciate about you, but you were, yep. Did you shoot sporting clays yesterday? I did shoot sporting clays yesterday. And I was scheduled to shoot sporting clays this morning too, but we're doing a podcast instead. So. Again, you deferred sporting clays for the birdshot podcast. I, I got to thank you for that. I appreciate it. I know you were packing the camper yesterday. I mean, we are, we're, we're talking on August 28th, uh, this episode will go up in a couple of days actually. So not too much time delay there, but boy, can you, can you feel it is the excitement palpable yet, buddy? Oh, absolutely. I, I felt like a little kid yesterday, you know, getting my, uh, have a Baja, uh, addition, a little 14 foot trailer and I was getting it ready yesterday and I, I, I mean, I felt like I was, you know, 14 years old, 12 years old again, getting ready to go hunt and it's just, it never, it never changes for me. And same thing with the end of dog on point. I just, it's always exciting to me and, you know, I hope I keep that forever. Heck yeah. The excitement and the, and the fire is still there as it should be. And yeah, who doesn't get excited about when September is right around the corner. Yeah. Yeah. This is actually my favorite time of the year. Things are cooling off. Um, you know, the things are changing, getting ready for hunting season. I'm shutting down my training season. I have, I'm training a few dogs on Friday and Saturday, um, they're all testing at the end of, uh, uh, September and then Saturdays, my, my last day training and I get everything buttoned up and I head out on Wednesday to Montana, northern Montana and, uh, yeah, I'm ready to go. The dogs are biting at the bit. It's time for them to have their time and, you know, me to have my time with my, my dogs, my favorite time of the year, like I say. Yeah. Yeah. You and, you and just about everybody else listening. So we all have that in common. Awesome. Awesome. I love it. Yeah. Uh, how'd you shoot yesterday? You feeling ready? Yeah. I, I, I am. I, you know, the, I, I go to three different sporting clay courses and some of them are more difficult than others. And the one I went to yesterday has four targets at each station and AB targets are more like bird, um, presentations and then C and D are like the crazy stuff for competition. So I, throughout the year on my training season when I'm not hunting, I shoot all, all of them and I, you know, focus on doing some scoring, decent scoring on the, on the more difficult ones, but yesterday I focused on the bird presentation and that's what I'll do. And the rest of the week just to kind of get me in that, in that mode, you know, um, low gun mount and flushing birds and things of that nature to just get my confidence up and get my, my skills home because it's the ethical thing to do for your dog and the, and the game out there is to be a, you know, try to be a good shot and a, and once that dog points a bird, it's your job to do the rest of it. Right. Yeah. Yep. Exactly. Right. I tell you the story. Last year I got a dog saccage who's in the book, uh, on the rehome I took back last year and, uh, I kept him. I just love him so much. I worked with him when he was a pup and then the person had a problem that in his personal life that he had to get rid of him. So I took him back to rehome him and then I ended up keeping him. Well, I had him for a few months and, uh, he was, he's just a fireball. He's really good and he, I was chucker hunting and looked down at my GPS and he's 423 yards out on point over two ridges and I'm not the fastest guy out there anymore. So it felt like it took an hour, but it probably took, you know, 10 minutes, minimally for me to get to, to sack it. And it's one of his first real true, really good bird encounters where he's had to hold a point that long and I, I, I get there and I do a thing. I always woe my dog as I work with him on steadiness. That's kind of my foundational command and, but when I'm hunting, I use my palm up as my woe. I don't, I don't talk much when I'm hunting. I'm pretty quiet. So I get there and he's still on a rock solid point and I walk to the side of him. So he sees me coming in and I don't walk up his rear end, um, because I think that makes dogs nervous and as I walk by sight, I can see his eyes kind of peek at me and I give him the palm up command and she's rock solid. I get about 10 to 15 yards in front of him and about a dozen or more chucker pop up right in front of me and I whiff three shots. I shoot two at the first bird and I miss it and so I swing to a closer bird and I miss it and I'm distraught. I'm like, Oh man, you know, a young dog. That's important. It's important to give it its reward after it's pointed like that and I'm, I'm a decent shot. I'm not the world's best, but of all times to miss that one just guess I was, I was beside myself. Luckily, the birds flew over another ridge and we kept working forward and he pointed again and I dropped a double in front of him on this. So I felt I redeemed myself so speak for my dog, but, um, you know, maybe squeezing the shotgun a little tight there, putting, putting some additional pressure on yourself maybe to reward that young dog. That's absolutely right. In the book, there's a story about a rescue dog I did and that was, that was a real touching day and you know, the guys I had shooting, if you read that story, they missed the bird and I know exactly why they missed the birds. That dog was a, was a mess when we started out. I mean, it was actually urinating on itself and problem between it's, it's a rescue owners and, um, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that was, yeah, the dog that was very sort of timid. Yeah. Yeah. Um, cool. And, uh, by, by the time we got ready to shoot, he'd come out of a show. I mean, the birds brought him out of a show and, and they missed. And I know exactly why they miss. They all, both gunners knew what was at stake. This dog was 11 years old. It had been abused. It'd never been around birds and it was coming out of a shell because of birds, because of its genetics. And they wanted to hit that bird so badly that they whiffed just like I, I did for four seconds. But hence the sporting clays, you know, the more you shoot, I think the, I think the, the more comfortable you get and then it becomes automatic instead of thinking about it. And when you think about it, that's when you miss, right? Yes. Yeah. One of those things where you got to practice in preparation and build the muscle memory. And then, but when you're out there, it's not a, it's not a super in your head kind of thing. Um, fine line. And yeah, it's, it's one that we've talked about many times before with wing shooting instructors and, and on this show and it's, uh, it's the challenge and it's, it's kind of what draws a lot of people to it. And then there's obviously the, when you parallel that with hunting and why we want to be proficient and efficient with their shotguns for sure. Yeah. But that was a really neat story about Colte again, just kind of obviously a very tough life for that dog as, as you told it and you really gave him something tangible and sounded like the dog at least found some, some happiness, right? Oh, yeah. And it's still doing it. I got an update the other day. Um, they brought out, uh, another little German, uh, short here that I was working with that I'm working with. I'm done with it now for the year. But, uh, they told me that cold had gone out and pointed a cover that morning prior to them bringing out, um, their dog and that I just love it. I mean, it just goes to show how the genetics are in dogs that, that have good genetics, that they're in there. They can be brought out at any time. I, I have people who it's always better to, to start the dog in the correct manner when it's shot. No question about that. I mean, it's so much easier, um, but those, those hunting genetics and dogs, it doesn't matter what age they are. If they're in there, they'll come out given the proper exposure and, you know, letting them, letting it come out at its own pace and not pushing the dog, it, it am, it, it amazes me. It always amazes me. I mean, that dog was 11 years old and I've had people bring their dogs to me that are three, four or five years old rescue or whatever and, or have a challenge and you know, let the dog work through what it needs to for those natural genetics to come out. And all of a sudden the dogs, the different dog also, and it knows what it's about and, and it's happy and it's, it's got the drive comes out. It's just wonderful to see for a guy like me. It's just really special. Yeah. Yeah. Without a doubt. So you're, you're out in Idaho. George. Yep. Okay. So the listeners, just a little bit, you're in Idaho, you, are you doing the dog training stuff kind of year round full time? Nope. I, I do, my dog training starts up my, my facility. It gets snow and so and so forth. It's, I live about 45 minutes west of Boise and I've got, I'm on the pay at river. So it gets a lot of snow and stuff, not a lot, but it gets some snow on it and the pasture and the cover goes down. So I shut down my dog training next week, well, this week, I'm coming up. And when it's hunting season, I hunt. That's for me and my dogs and my family and my friends. Cool. That's what it's all about. That's why I have the dogs. That's what I love to do. So I will start my, I'll do a dove hunt here in Idaho and then I'll head out to Montana. Then I'll be chucker hunting and Jason Huns and quail and pheasant and everything for the rest of the hunting season. And then around February, depending on the weather and depending how my cover looks, if the snow's melted and things are popping up where there's enough cover to work birds, is when I start the training season and then take off from there. So usually it's around February and March that the hunting season kind of slows down or ends for me and the training season starts. So you know, I'm lucky enough I can do that and, you know, I'm blessed actually. Yeah. Do you have a, well, how was the hunting, actually, I guess there was some commentary in the book about last hunting season sounded like a great season. That was, I mean, there's always things to enjoy about hunting season, right? I mean the bird numbers tend to be a part of the conversation, but you're certainly of a mind that you're, I know you're finding enjoyment in hunting season, no matter the outcomes as it relates to birds or bird numbers, but last year, pretty good, you have a general sense of this season, what are you thinking, have you been out running birds or anything? Well, that's a great question because of what's been happening here in Idaho. Last year was a phenomenal year, the best I've had in many, many years as far as like you say bird count. I mean, every year to me is a, if I'm out there with my dogs, I'm happy, but bird count last year was absolutely phenomenal. And this year was expected to be a carryover and be maybe as good or better. Unfortunately, there's been fires. Before you jump in, did you guys have a very mild winter as well? Yes, yes, it was, yep. And then the fires started and one of the areas I hunt, which is very close to me, it's about 20 minutes, 20 minutes from me, it starts at a place called Patek Reservoir and goes over the hill, goes all over the place, there's hundreds of thousands of acres out there, well, about 190, last I heard was 190,000 acres burnt. And I probably, I would say, at least 15 to 20 spots that I hunt regularly are gone or completely gone. And I have a friend that I hunt with, Jim Giordelli, and he's a fireman up there and he lives up there. He got a half mile from his house while he was fighting the fires and he had to evacuate his horses, his donkeys and his dogs and everything. So he kept me updated on everything and he was just, he kept telling me this part's gone and that part's gone and this part's gone and I'm like, oh my goodness. So having said that, I lost a lot of the areas that I hunt at, but I do hunt a lot in Oregon. In Oregon had its fair share of fires too, but a lot of the places that I hunt are okay. So I'm expecting those areas to be really good with bird count, but probably really pressured with people because of a loss of so many other areas. So we'll see what unfolds, you know, I'll also travel a bit, I'll be going to, to starting in Montana, but I also plan to do some quill hunting in Arizona, maybe some quill hunting present in Kansas and Oklahoma, we'll see, I just kind of, I start my season and as numbers come in from people that I know and, you know, people are telling me it's good here, it's not so good here or I want to meet up with somebody that I haven't seen or something, I just kind of go with the flow, you know, it's my time of the year to do that with my dogs and so I'm just going to enjoy it and if the bird counts great, which I hope it is, fantastic if it's not, that's okay, I'll still be out there hunting and having fun. Yeah, there'll be birds and places to take a dog for a run somewhere, right? Yeah, that's cool, yeah, if you've got the flexibility to do that, I can't think of too many better ways to go about hunting season if you could be sort of geographically and time sensitive and just sort of move around and meet up with certain people, that sounds like a blast. Yep, yep, that's what I enjoy doing and I say I'm blessed enough to be able to do it. I worked hard to get here, paid my dues in my younger days and I'm kind of enjoying the benefits of it and, you know, life's too short if you can do it, do it because, you know, I have a really close friend right now who's in the book a lot and you just found out this past month that he has a bladder cancer and we'll see what happens, he's going to meet me in Montana, he's going in for a procedure and life's just too short, you don't know. Yeah. So, you know, enjoy it while you can, enjoy the journey and I'm doing that, that's for sure. You're pretty good about sharing that sentiment in conversation and in the books. I was surprised you got time for hunting season, you don't have like a big multi-city book signing event tour lined up, George? You know, I, you're my first podcast, I have two others scheduled and one other person, so the podcast people are starting to call me. But hunting season's my hunting season, you know, the training and writing and books and magazine articles, that's all the outline, you know, things for me. I do that, you know, I've got into testing and judging and running field trials and doing all that stuff to supplement my time with my dogs or with dogs in the off season. But you know, the hunting season is the hunting season, that's what I'm here for. Everything else will fit in as it can but, you know, the priority is now to be out there. Chase and birds, following behind my dogs, get in excited when they go on point and hope and hopefully dropping a few in front of them with some good shots. That's the way it should be, George, hunting season is, hunting season. And fortunately for you, yeah, you can, you can jump on a, on a call with me and do a podcast and a few others and you can get the, get the word out and still not miss a day in the field. So that's the beauty of it. Yeah. And that, you know, you, you mentioned the books, I am, I'm still blown away on how the, the first book tips and chill tales on training your bird dog is, is doing how much it's going and it's just, it still blows me away. And I was, I was actually telling a friend of mine, a wolf lady, Diane Boyd, she's got a book coming out the other day that I get these royalty notices coming in from Amazon and Amazon sells the book all over the world. And this one came in and it was pretty good amount. I was telling my son about this yesterday too. And it comes in and it says from Amazon dot whatever, esp, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I look and I go, where's that from? I have to Google it just to find out where it is. And it was from Switzerland and right now my book is taken off in Switzerland. And I have no idea why I think what might be happening is there's a lot of breeders who, when they have lidders, they will, they will buy those books and give them one with each new puppy owner. So I'm thinking maybe that's happening in Switzerland that somebody bought the book and there's a breeder and they talk to somebody else. But all of a sudden my book's on like crazy in Switzerland, I don't have any clue. So I just kind of let it go on its own, whatever happens happens, you know, it's just, it's, you know, I'm blessed in that area too. I love it that people enjoy the books. The new book is all stories. I don't know if you ever read much of Gene Hill, but Gene Hill was my kind of go to outdoor author when I was a kid, I like to read his magazine articles, like about six feet from me where I'm sitting right now. I probably got five of his books and he wrote a lot of books that had a lot of just, each chapter was a story about a puppy or a dog or a hunting or a fishing trip or something like that. And when I wrote my first book, it was a training book, but within the, within all the training chapters, there was story chapters that kind of went along with what, what were trained for at the time during the book. And I had thousands of people, you know, text me and say, I enjoyed your book. I like the training method that you use, but I really enjoyed those stories. I hope you continue and write more stories, have a book come out with stories. So that's what, that's what generated the next book was Gene Hill's type of, type of book and the people asking for it. So I'm, I'm still honored and kind of blown away with all that book stuff. It wasn't something that I had planned to be, you know, an author with the best selling book. I never planned that. I just planned to work with dogs and train dogs and hunt with dogs. So, you know, it happened in, and wherever it goes, it goes in the meantime, I'll work with my pups and dogs during the off-season training and hunt during the hunting season and let everything else take its course on its own. Yeah. That's cool. I'm glad you brought that up because that was going to kind of be my next question just as far as what the, not so much what the response was because I had some idea about that, but the inspiration for, for writing the next book. And yeah, you shared a bit of that in, in the second book Tales with Tales, which I have copy sitting right here next to me, thanks to you, George. Gene Hill, yep, he, he was one of the first, I think, outdoor writers that I really started buying his books and kind of diving into and just appreciating it. I'm actually, I would say that I'm a little bit overdue to circle back around and read some Gene Hill stuff. And I kind of, you, you put it in my mind when I was reading it and you mentioned him in the book, I mean, if, for the listeners, if, if you haven't read Gene Hill stuff, it's just the kind of stuff that fills your heart, fills your mind with, with all of the things, tears and laughter at times, which is actually the name of one of his, one of his books. But yeah, he was, he was one of the, one of the best. That's for sure. Yeah, tears and laughter is not, not, not, probably six feet from me as we're talking right now. Yeah. And, you know, it's interesting about Gene and, and I tried to write in the same manner. I have a lot of people telling me that, you know, when you write, it's like you're talking to me is you just feel, I feel like I'm sitting at the campfire with you and you're just telling me a story. And most of those stories haven't told the campfires. And yeah, Gene Hill was a Harvard graduate and where he went to Harvard anyway, I'm not sure he graduated and very brilliant man. But when he wrote, he wrote, he wrote to us down to, down to earth folks, you know, and told the stories and yeah, that's, I, I hope, I hope I, I did him a service or in, in memory of him with that type of a book that I wrote, and you know, when I tried to do it in, in the manner of little short stories on every, on every, every chapter. What did happen though, was as I was writing the book, I, I was just going to do it just like that. And I realized that I was kind of also telling the story of my life because all of those, all those chapters are kind of special memories, either growing up or things that affected me or hunts that I remember all the time. You know, those, you know, you have a million hunts in your mind, but there's a few that always just that they're out right there in the forefront. And as I wrote the book and I got about three quarters of the way through it, I realized I was kind of telling the story of my life with dogs. And so I kind of arranged the chapters, there's a little bit differently so that when you read the book, you also felt like you're kind of seeing my life with dogs at the same time. That wasn't the initial intent, it was just to do a bunch more stories because people had requested it, but it, it kind of almost came off like a, like a story of my lifetime at the same time, my dealing with dogs and how I got into them and all that stuff. So, um, yeah, I hope, I hope you enjoyed it. I hope people out there are joining us through one of those, through one of those people that, that sort of measures your life in the, in the stages you had with, with different dogs, which I think is very common and something that I've started to do as well as bird dogs have come into my life for the last decade or so. Yeah, I think I mentioned that in the book, you can ask me about different things. I can't remember where they were, but I tell you what was happening with which dog at what time of my life and how old I was then, you know, so I guess that's been my priority. I was curious, so I was going to ask you about that. Um, do you have a, just like a, do you take, do you write in a journal? Do you take notes? Do you jot stories down and then has that, did that change since you did the first book? I mean, maybe had an idea in mind. I mean, how do you, how do you keep track of these stories? Um, well, sometimes I will have an event that happens and that was some of the stories in my first book that, and because I knew I was writing the training book back then. And I like to write, actually, when I'm out hunting or doing something, um, and I'm inspired to sit down and after a hunt, just relax and, and write. Um, so I will do that in my computer. I will write something down just out of my mind. It just kind of, I just write it, how I feel it for the day or a few days ago or what to have you, and then it's in there. And then later on, if I want to use that for a magazine article or in a book or something, then I'll go back to that and it'll refresh my memory and, and, um, then I'll write the story and using when I write a story, I write it like four times, I write it, then I go back and reread it and, you know, do all that kind of stuff. There's a, there's a chapter in there, I think it's called Rare Gems about a whole guy I met shooting sporting clays. He was 80 something years old and he said some stuff. Yeah, old John. Yes. That's old John. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yeah. I jotted that one down. That was a, that was a neat story. And I'll tell you as soon as I got home and I was into my computer trying to remember all this stuff. And my son, Nick, he's a, he's super, super smart. He's a computer scientist and he's kind of helped proofread the book for me and, and, and looked at stuff and gave me some ideas and he was proofreading Rare Gems with old John. He sent me an email, he goes, I'm reading old John and I'm just laughing my butt off because I remember everything he said, plus more, you don't even have it all in this chapter. But yeah, as soon as I got home, I, I wrote that down. And then in some of the stories, they're just good memories and, and that's not a training book. The new book's not a training book, but there's a lot of stories in there about dogs that I worked with that I go over how I worked with them, how I got them to someplace. And so there's training, training techniques in the story, but it's not meant to be a training book, but there is training techniques in the story and those things I have memories of like, you know, Colt and there's another one with Brandy and as I work with those dogs, those special moments, they just stick in my mind. They're just, they're just there, you know, they're special to me and they stick in my mind. So I remember what I did with the dog and how things transpired. The one with Brandy, I'm trying to think of the chapter, a sense of loss. That's the dog that was brought to me and had five weeks to test and it was eating birds and so on and so forth. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I hadn't used this technique with a guy that trains with me a lot named Sherman and we're out there and that dog, when I finally let off. Was that the dog that was, that was like basically like ripping through all the fields just to get to the bird? Eight, two of my favorite pigeons and I'm a dog trainer and I have, it sounds weird, I love my pigeons. I won't shoot my own homie pigeons. I have a kid that traps wild pigeons for me and a couple of guys who race pigeons and they give me their cold pigeons, I can't shoot my own pigeons, I just can't, I'm sorry, yeah, I shoot everything else. And my pigeons, they have been pointed, sometimes they're pointed three, four, five, six times a day. They'll be, I'll work with one dog, they're pointed, they're back in their coop. I pull them back out and I have about 20 to 30 that are just, I use all the time. Well, the first two that dog got to were like seven, I think they were seven eight-year-old pigeons that I could reach over there and grab them and just pick them up and they killed both of them. Like, oh my goodness, I mean, it took off, boom, across my fields. But I used a technique and I hadn't used it with Sherman where when the dogs just want to hunt with you, I let it take off, I took it to an empty field after that, I'll read the story. And as it's just going off by itself, I started throwing pigeons out of my vest and having Sherman shoot in the air and it turned around to see what was going on and it's 200 yards out hunting for itself and it sees all the birds coming out by Sherman and I. And here's shots and it comes running back and then I had them shoot a bird before Brandy could get to me and I go and pick the bird up real quickly and Brandy shows up and I just stick it in my pouch and turn my back and walk away. And did that about three times and I found out Brandy liked to retrieve and it was amazing about the fourth time Brandy was like, I'm not leaving, I'm going to hunt right out front of you guys, 70, 80 yards and I'm going to check in and then we planted the bird and shot it and bam, the light came on, we're a team. This works way better as the team. And so, you know, those little stories actually share some training tips but there's things I remember Brandy was a wonderful dog that went from a full blown, crazy, eat your birds, don't care about you, doesn't care about you, dog to a wonderful team player who wanted to please and those are special to me, those moments, those interactions and bonding with different dogs, my own and client's dogs are special to me and some of them just wore my heart and I remember them so that's why they end up being a chapter. 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Whether you're in the field or on the clays course, True Lock Choke Tubes deliver unmatched consistency and better patterns shot after shot. With a wide variety of choke tubes, constrictions and available thread patterns, True Lock Choke Tubes are built to the highest standard. If you're ready to take your shooting to the next level, check out truelockchokes.com and discover why bird hunters all across the uplands trust True Lock Choke Tubes. Hope that answered your question, I tend to run off sometimes. Oh, yeah, it did and I mean, yeah, the more stories we can tell on here, the better regardless of the questions that Nick asks. So, yeah, I appreciate that and yeah, it was, as you're saying the book is, it's definitely, you wouldn't put it in the how-to category, but there's, it's situational, there's lots of situations and challenges and things that you describe in there where there's obviously concepts and ideas, so it's, it's a enjoyable read and, but there's, you know, there's tidbits and there's wisdom in there for sure, I will say that, George. So, well, experience, that's for sure. Yes, yes. So, you know, the more you do, the more you get, the more experience you get, you know, the more mistakes you make, hopefully you learn from them and you figure things out, you know, that's how it goes through life, you know, at least for me, anyhow. So, well, I was kind of, I was reviewing some of my notes from that I tend to do this when I'm reading books, I'll jot things down so that when I'm chatting with you, the author, I can, I can maybe draw on some of those little tidbits. One of them that I got to hear a little bit more about is your Instant Pot Chucker recipe. Do you have a favorite? You mentioned the Instant Pot a couple of times, I think, but I know when I read that, I was kind of, I think I was hungry, so started telling me. It's just so easy, you know. I just, you know, I like to, I cook a lot by myself and so I like to do simple things or something that I can whip up and the Instant Pot is just so easy because I just throw chicken broth down at the bottom and I choose you with chucker and I throw some chucker inside of there and then I throw my vegetables in there, onions, carrots, celery, things of that nature. I like capers and the flavors, so I'll throw some capers in there and some Italian. And the capers, that really piqued my interest. Yeah, and then Italian seasoning and so forth and then just pop it in there and let it cook and there you go, I always put potatoes in there too. It's so easy because then when you're done, you have this really great soft chucker that's been cooked in the broth and with all the vegetables and then you have all your vegetables and, you know, potatoes and everything and so I just pull it out of the plate and there I go. So if I'm tired and I think in the book that when I talk about it, I think I had just done a hunt that day with my friend Jim. That's so easy, I'll just grab the chicken broth, cut up stuff, throw it in and start cleaning stuff up, you know, start cleaning the dogs and so on and so forth and loading the car and while that's cooking and then come back in and I'm ready to eat. So yeah, that's kind of a very, very simple one. Another one that's not in the book that I was running dogs in Nastra many, many, many years ago and there was a lady who would keep all the pheasants and birds afterwards and then cook us lunch and it was always so great and it was a juicy pasta and so one day I asked her, I go, you know, how do you make this? This is so good and she goes, oh, it's so simple. You just take a slow cook pot, you know, I don't know what you call them, crock pot. And so I've done this many times and you throw your birds in and you just pour spaghetti sauce in there with a whatever seasoning and then you take whatever's your favorite salsa. She goes, whatever salsa you really like, throw some of that in there because it'll give it some flavor and just let it cook, you know, for a few hours and while you do that, then get your spaghetti ready and you can make the last reason she did it because she had all those leftover birds. You can make a meal for 20 people, 30 people easily and I do that when I have a big party and it's so easy to do and it's so good and you're using up, you know, a bunch of birds and spaghetti is always easy to cook and cook a lot of it. That's a real simple one that feeds a lot of people and I can't even remember her name. This was probably 25, 30 years ago. But you know, some of those simple recipes are the best, they're easy to do and off you go. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. So that one, you're putting like whole pheasant breast in there and then basically just spaghetti sauce and then salsa and then what you're just, are you chunking that up or something and serving it over the spaghetti noodles or I'm curious. Yeah. Yeah. So what she did is she just cooked and this is how I do it. I just throw the whole breast in there. Sometimes it's a chuck. Sometimes it's a mixture of, sometimes it's my extra birds that have been in the freezer for a while. You know, it might be a chucker and a hand and pheasant and just throw them all in there. Gotcha. And then just let them, let them cook and I throw, you know, I used to put basil and all this stuff in there. Now I buy the stuff that's Italian season, it's already mixed, I'm lazy and I just throw it all on top. Yeah. I do that too. That's good stuff though. It is. And then maybe some salt, pepper and whatever and then just let it, let it cook. And when it's done cooking, the meat literally falls off the breast. You can just kind of rip it off the breast, right? So then I'll rip the meat off the breast and pull all the bones out that I can and then cook my spaghetti and then just take a big ladle and just pull it out. It's kind of like, I guess, a gash wash. I'm not sure if that's the correct terminology that you pull out all the meat and all the sauce and put it over the spaghetti and you're ready to go. Yeah. Really easy, really simple, really good and it takes all the birds and makes them real tender because it's slow cooking in the crock pot. Here we are in a cooking show and I'm not that creative cook guys. Well, so I love that, George, because I'm not either like I would describe, I would use the word lazy to describe my, like, I just, I mean, I can follow steps. I like, I like simple things that, that tastes good, but I'm not like overly picky and to be fair, I guess I don't know that I have the patience to like really commit to like a real intricate dish. But to your point, you don't need that. I mean, especially at like, if it's like, we're talking camp meals, you know, it doesn't take much to be satisfied after after logging a few miles for chasing birds. But one of the reasons I was curious about that is I've got tonight, I am planning to make my Instant Pot Sharptail Tacos. I was actually going to do it yesterday by ran out of time before we had a little patreon zoom room thing. But anyways, I will be making that and I use that. It's kind of funny. It started as there's a, there's a hanksha carnitas, like turkey leg carnitas recipe in one of his books. Fantastic. I did that one time, but now my adaptation is like a super, super simplified version of that where I just, I take chicken broth, like you said, put in the bottom of the Instant Pot, grab two packets of like this chicken taco seasoning mix, throw that in, cook the meat in the Instant Pot and then shred it. And then I take the, take the shredded meat and like you could do that one day. And then if you're going to have tacos the next day, you take the shredded meat, throw it in a cast iron skillet with a little bit of olive oil and then I'll put a can of like the diced tomatoes that you would use for their, you know, they're in the taco section of your grocery store. Yeah. Super simplified. And then you've got, and then you've got your taco meat and, you know, make a bowl, put it in tortillas, whatever you want to do with it, crack open a beer and enjoy it. So that's, that's on my agenda this afternoon. Perfect. I like it. I like simple, easy and like you said, I must be a bit lazy till my dad once told me something like, if you want something done quickly and find the easiest way to do it, find the laziest person you, you know, until they have to do it or else and they'll figure out a way to do it and they'll figure out a way to do it easily. So that's kind of us, I guess, on cooking and, you know, I, I enjoy eating what I shoot and, and so I enjoy cooking it, but I don't make a big, you know, ordeal about, I'm not a chef by any means. Now I have hunted with chefs that are, that are, you mentioned Sharptill and in the book I talk about a lady by name of Mackenzie and she's actually a personal chef and oh my goodness, Sharptills are not my favorite. They never have been. She and her husband Toby made them, they were so good. I couldn't, it was like eating steak. It really was and, and I just couldn't believe it. So sometimes it's knowing how to cook them and knowing how to do that stuff and, you know, I'll steal a recipe or an idea from anybody. So, yeah, yeah, I'm not a chef by any means and if somebody shows me something that's simple and easy that I can make work, I'll use it, you know. And I'd like, I do, everything always tastes better when you're out there camping and eating anyway, you know. So I like cooking out there. So I do simple stuff out there. So I was just going to say there was a whole chapter in the, in the book about your, and I jotted down you, which you'll, you'll find funny. It folks will have to read the book to, to get it, but epic, absolutely epic about your, your, your hunt and your Sharptill and, you know, part of it is, is time of year, it's, it's late August here and I'm reading about you hiking grass and coolies and chasing Sharptills and I was just, I was getting excited just reading that. Oh, yeah, in that great, yeah, that's, that's, that's, that's something now and then it's like our word to say, you know, people read the story and they'll get it like you say. Yeah. Yeah. I hope I, I hope have another epic season in Montana when I head out next week or an epic day or they're all, they're all epic, I guess, in their own way, right? Right. Right. But you know, some, some of them just have that memory and, and, and have a special spot in your heart. There's hunts that do that for me, there's dogs that do that for me. Every dog, I, I love every dog I work with. I don't care what breed it is, um, and then, you know, people don't believe that, but I do each dog is different. Now some of them are, are not heads and a little bit more difficult to deal with, but, but when you get those dogs to work with you, it's a thrill. Let's say, uh, it, it feels great. It's like you've achieved something, um, and as well as the ones that just go, they, they just follow, they want to learn and they just go really easy. I, I love working with all the dogs and, um, so being out there, um, having fun, enjoying time with dogs and people and things of that nature, that's, to me, that's what life's all about. You know, that's, at least, yeah, without a doubt, I enjoyed, you, you kind of shared again on the, some of the Sharpdale hunts you talked about seeing the old farmsteads and, you know, the old rundown, abandoned buildings and, and you like to walk up to them and, and touch them and if you can, if you can get over to them and you've talked about, I think something that I do and I think something that's definitely not uncommon, just kind of like you see something like that and it, it sort of removes you from, from time and you just, you go back in your mind and just sort of imagine like what that place looked like, you know, decades ago and all it, I, this is what I, in my head, I see something like that and I just think like, wow, all, you know, this, this house has been here in this place day after day, after day, after day, over time and you just think about how the world has kind of changed around it and you're there in that moment on that day and you're going to, you're going to wander off and follow your dog and that, that old farm said we'll be there. I just, I love that stuff. I, that, you know, they have a, I don't know, they have a, they're, they feel like they're a conduit to a time, you know, just gone. Right. Right. People, men and women really had to, had to tough it out and be out there to, to make it and when I see, like you say, when I see one of those old homesteads or barns or what have you that is from a bygone era, if I can get over there and just touch it, just put my hands on it and just walk around it, it's, it's kind of a grounding feeling to know that, you know, those folks, they paved the way and what they had to endure to, to, to make it and to get us to where we are is pretty special and you don't see the, you know, the less and less of them now, so I, I'll stop and take photos of them when I see them, but like that story, I was in the middle of a hunt, if I'm in the middle of a hunt and then I, I were on a cross one that I can get to, I'm going, you know, of course I'm going to watch out for snakes and stuff, cause they like, any other on that, but I'm going to go over there and walk around and it's a, I, in that story, um, and I find this often, it was interesting to see the old relics still on the ground in the, in the overgrown plants, you know, pieces of old equipment and things of that nature, that, that's, they, they use some stuff that they had to work their butts off out there and it's still lying there from time, from way back then, it's still lying on the ground, you know, um, I don't, I'm getting kind of romantic, I guess here, but, uh, or, yeah, it's sensitive to that. That's, that's what that stuff though, it kind of gives you, it gives you an excuse to just sort of let your mind wander and sort of make up your own story. Yeah, exactly, exactly, yeah, so yeah, they, they are, they are special to me and I like, I like, if I can actually walk up and touch one and, and get close to it, that's like a real gift, a real diamond to me in, in my memory. So glad you like to do that too, that's, uh, it's kind of unique, I think. Yeah, yeah, it's just, yeah, I think it's one of those, I don't know if it's like a whole perspective shift and kind of put yourself in that place and take yourself out of your head for a, for a minute or, well, you're, I guess you're still in your head, but maybe out of your own, your own ramblings and, and think about a different time, a different era. It's kind of fun. And it's all about the hunt. You know, hunting, and I said that in, in, in all my, my writings, honey's not all just about shooting birds. It's about the experience. And, you know, whether it's walking up to an old homestead or, you know, seeing the dog do something special or meeting somebody, it's all about the experience. And you know, I do youth hunts. There's a couple of stories in there about youth hunts, but, um, it's, it's all about the people, the family, the friends, the dogs, the environment, all that stuff is, is the hunt to me, getting it, as I say, in, in one of the stories. You mentioned, um, you know, going out there and seeing old things and old people on their, one story I didn't put in there is I was hunting in Montana years ago. And it's an old farmer. It was a, it was a, not a public hunting ground. It was, they have block management and, and different stuff in Montana and this upland areas that you can hunt. It was one of those public areas and, and I'm hunting that and this old, old farmer comes up driving this old truck, big truck and he's in his 80s and he stops and starts talking to me. And it's his property. I didn't notice his property when he stopped and he said, be careful of the snakes and so on and so forth. And we had a really good conversation and he drove out and so I'm, I continue hunting. A couple hours later, he drives back by, he went and got whatever he needed to get and drive him back by with, and he pulls over again because I was close to the end of the field and I walk out and how'd you do? And I told him how I did and he met my dogs and so on and so forth. And, and he said, you know, he goes, this one is in the, in the public area to hunt, but I have a, I have a big field over here that you're welcome to hunt over here and I live over here and you're welcome to hunt the field back there over behind my house and, you know, stop life. You need to use the bathroom and over where you see the silos, there's a, there's a little shed that's got a bathroom and it's got some things in there. You're welcome to go in there, use the bathroom and get some water for your dogs. And I, I stopped by and see this guy over here. I hope he's still alive when I, when I go by this year, because I'll go by this year again. And how special is that? You know what I mean? I'm out there hunting and this, this nice gentleman pulls up and talks to me and we become somewhat friends. I ended up giving them my book the following year and what have you and, you know, that's all part of the hunt to me. That's all part of the experience of what a special person I'm in, kind hearted and in just a nice, nice guy. And it's, it's not all about shooting birds. Yeah, I love to shoot birds. Don't get me wrong. I don't know. I can, I'm expert and fold and hit the ground and get the retrieve. But I love all the other aspects of the hunt too, you know, hunts, that's why I shut down my training season and hunt during hunting season. I love it. I love it. That is, that is good stuff, George. So I, all right, I know you, you talk about, you actually talk about refinishing and rebuilding old Berettas in the book. So, so talk to me about that a little bit, but, but what's your, what's your go-to bird gun? What are you going to be shooting on September 1st? Do you have one that you always go to old faithful? Well, that's a great question. I have a couple of those. My go-to gun for years, I've been shooting Beretta over and under and the box lock system on there from, I think I have one in here right now that's 40 years old and it's a 685. Didn't call them Silver Pigeons back then. It doesn't have ejectors, it has extractors, basic gun. I bought many, many, many, many, many years ago, obviously it's like 40 years old. That is actually my go-to gun. I shoot over what's called, it's called the gunner and like testing, they have UT testing for testing dogs, well if I'm going to shoot over dogs that are testing or a time trial or, you know, when you're out there and you're betting money to see who gets so many birds in an amount of time, money shoots or stuff, I'm shooting that gun, it just hits a bird. But it's old, I don't, I don't take it out in the fields anymore, but if I'm going to shoot over in a test environment or field trial environment or an environment where I'm going to shoot over a dog for points or money or something like that, that's the dog, that's the gun I pulled out, it's just there, it's just part of me. But other than that, I usually shoot over and under for decades, being a bread, a system from the 685, 687, 686, 682, they're all the same system inside so they're easy for me to rebuild and I have rebuilt a lot of them. I have a 20 gauge over and under with 28 inch barrels that is my favorite, favorite gun, I shoot that in pretty much everything. But last year, I'm getting older, I still put in, you know, 10 miles a day and I'm still in really good shape, but I'm getting a bit older to where it takes me longer to get way out there. And so I purchased a A400, which is the semi-auto, to get the extra shot in Oregon, you know, you can have three shots and Idaho, Upland, you can have as many as you want. But getting out there sometimes after I've walked four or five miles, there's that extra flush that I'm way out there and so the third shot has now never mattered to me before. But now I shoot that chucker hunting because I want the extra shot. But generally speaking, you know, if I'm hunting where I can get back to the car and I'm not out there for four hours at a time out in the middle of nowhere, I will shoot my over and under Beretta 686 for 20 gauge. That's my go-to gun. And it shoots well for me, you know, shells are the light, they're a lot less expensive than a 28 gauge and it just hits when I shoot at most of the time. So that would be my go-to gun. Love it, good stuff. Do you get into, I don't know how much you get into ammo and stuff, do you like certain shot size? Do you change up a lot? How do you go about that with the different, some of the, you know, you're a western hunter so I'm envisioning chucker, hunt, sharptails, you're hunting different species and stuff as-ins. I am and my go-to load is the golden pheasant, silver player. Okay, okay. Yep, that's my go-to shotgun shell. I'm usually shooting, for me I'm usually shooting six or five when I'm chucker hunting. I know some people now are using fours but I'm usually using six and five and that's another reason I really like it over and under because I can have a six in the first barrel and a five in the second barrel for a follow-up shot or a longer shot. So that's generally what I'm using on sharptail, I'm usually using six, that's size shot I use, and again I'm using the golden pheasant. I don't know, price is relative to everybody, you know, to what some people might be really expensive, to some people it's jump change or whatever. To me, they're a little bit up there in price but it's not like I'm shooting sporting clays. When I'm shooting at a bird, I want to shoot what I feel is the best for me to bring that bird down and over the years I've tried, I actually reloaded for a long time and I don't do that anymore, I just go to that load, the golden pheasant, you know, nickel plated or whatever, plated shot and it works for me, it drops them pretty nicely. If I'm going for pheasant, which I don't do a lot of pheasant hunting anymore, I get invited a lot, I'm usually using fours and I like pheasant hunting, I'll get into pheasant hunting, but I've always enjoyed cubby birds, that's kind of my love of my life quail hunting, you know, you break that cubby up, which is, you know, the cubby flesh is just something spectacular anyway, not that scene of Brewster Pheasant hanging tails and all that isn't incredible, but you break the cubby up and then you get the dog work on the singles and the doubles afterwards, and chuckers are like that, sharp deals can be like that, and huns are like that, and that's what I really enjoy is hunting birds that are covered up and then work in the singles and doubles afterwards and then go into the next cubby and, you know, so that's what I enjoy doing, I do pheasant hunt, next how I'll use fours on pheasants, but generally on the other stuff I'm using, you know, visor sixes and in a non quail I'll drop down to eights and seven and a halfs, so yeah, use the same shell on all of them, yeah, that's, appreciate it, yeah, I've used the, I like the pheasant hunt, I've used them more out west, I don't, I have used them around here, I don't, I don't so much anymore, but I like them, it's a, like you said, it's a little bit more expensive, but it's a premium shell, nickel plated shot, they have reasonable payloads and velocities, they usually, in most of the gauge, I think there might even be available in pretty much all of the gauges, so it's a good premium shell that's pretty widely available, so I've used them at 28 and 20 gauge. Yeah, that's my favorite shell, and 20's always been, always been my favorite gauge since I was a young kid, I, I haven't shot 28 and all the rest of them, I will shoot a 12 gauge, if I'm, like when I say if I'm shooting over UT dogs, I shoot a 12 gauge, I want everything out there to bring that bird down, that dog's testing or running a trial, I want as much as I can out there, it's all about, it's all about scoring points or getting a score on whatever it is that you're doing, and I'll use a 12 gauge, a lot of times I'll hunt with people like, for instance, in, in Montana, I'm hunting with a bunch of friends, and then I have a friend who's bringing two hunters in, who rarely hunt, they've never really hunted over dogs much, and, and she asked me, it's actually Diane, she asked me if I would hang around and, and that my two dogs work with her, so they can see more dog work and maybe get more birds, I will carry a 12 gauge then because I'm not shooting unless I'm back and something up, somebody hits a bird and it doesn't go down, or, you know, they miss and I want to get my dog a bird, and then I'll carry a 12 gauge because I'm just backing up, and if I'm taking a long shot, there's, there's not any more velocity or anything, but there's more shot out there to hopefully bring the bird down, so that's a rarity, but if I'm, if I'm backing up or someone who I'm, I don't plan to shoot at all, then I'll have a 12, or if I'm shooting over testing dogs or field trial dogs, and then I'll shoot at a 12, and 28 gauge is a great, great gauge, but, you know, I can get, I can get shows anywhere for 20, if I run out of shows, I can, I can get them anywhere, they're inexpensive, I can find some, someplace, I can borrow some, I'm usually loaning out, I'm usually the guy loaning, loaning, or giving shows away, not borrowing, but, you know, they're pretty, pretty easy to come by, you know, so that's why I shoot the 20 gauge, that's my, that's my favorite. Yeah, I'm going to mention something here, just because I, I said I'm using the one giving shows away, is I, I carry a very well stocked first aid kit for my dogs, and then I carry a first aid kit in my vest, a small one, and in the first book, there's a list of everything that's in there, except for alcohol, and I can, I can mention that on your, on your show here, but I'm generally speaking, I use that first aid kit for a more folks for their dogs than I do mine, because they're not carrying all the stuff that I carry, so I like to, I like to, when I go, I like to take everything I can to have what I need, if I don't need it, that's fine, but if I do need it, I like to have it there, so I take a lot of shells, I take a lot of, a lot of first aid equipment, I take a lot of stuff, because once I'm out there, you know, I want to, I want to have what I need, or if somebody doesn't have it, I'm giving it away or letting them use it, so on my first aid kit, I'll just bring this up, because this, I just found this out on a clinic either last year or about a year and a half ago, when I do my, my clinics, I, I have a, I have a vet come in, it's been many vets over the years that, that talk for a while, and people can ask them first aid questions and sneak by questions and all that stuff, and this vet worked for a, the Triad Center where they brought in dogs, an emergency center, and I always tell people, you know, if your dog, and I've seen dogs over here, I've seen dogs die from, from, from getting overheated, and I've seen dogs and never be the same. Yeah. From getting overheated, and so when, when I talk about that, I say, you know, if you're going to cool down your dog, don't pour water over its back, because that creates a blanket, take water and put it, put it under its arms, and this arm puts, flipped the ear over, put it on the skin of the, on the ear, and put it in its private area, the genitals where it can get to the skin, and it will clear your dog, don't pour, don't pour water over your dog, and I was talking about that, and she goes, that's absolutely right. On the other hand, the way we deal with a overheated dog that comes in at the clinic is the first thing we do is we take a bottle of alcohol, rubbing alcohol, and pour it all over the dog, that's the very first thing we do, and I was like, really? She goes, yep, she goes, the evaporation will cool the dog down, and we can, we monitor it, we can see it cooling the dog down, and I don't have that in the book in my first book with the first 8K, but now I carry a full bottle of, of rubbing alcohol, and if a dog's getting hot, and pour it right over the top of the dog, and then evaporation cools the dog right down. So, anyhow, and just thinking about that, I'm rambling on now, sorry, but it's a tip, you know. No, that's, that's good. And it's very timely. I had, I had heard that the evaporative properties of alcohol. I had heard that, and it's one of those things that kind of went in one ear and one out the other. I, I don't have that in my kit, but man, what, yeah, what a great reminder right now, days away from September 1st. Yeah. Here's another thing that I just, I, I'm going to put a video on this out at some point on just a, just a short one. So, the guys I shoot with, they, they, they carry these little handheld blowers. They're really powerful. Initially they carry the, like a little blower that you use for leaves and stuff, but now they got these little handheld blowers. They're literally the size of your hand. They call them air dusters, and they're used for blowing off computers and blowing off electrical and things of that nature, and they got them, they're really, they're really powerful. I mean, you put them on your hand and they blow. And so these guys started using them to cool down the barrels. So, because if you're shooting a lot in yesterday, I shot 250 rounds, your gun will get hot and so you can just cool it down. But here's, here's the tip for us is my property on the edges, not where I trained, but on the edges I'm fighting cheatgrass and some foxtails and foxtails. And if you hunt truckers, you're going to be, you're going to be in cheatgrass. I mean, there's just no question at, at the beginning of the season for sure. And so one of the things I've always done is I, I trim my dog's paws. I trim the hair out on top of my dog's paws at the beginning of the year and in between my dog's paws because the cheatgrass won't stick to it as much. Now, as the ears go by, my dogs lose all their hair. The front legs are raw. Their face is raw because they hunt so much. But at the beginning of the year, I'll trim that hair off and it stops it from, from a capturing cheatgrass and foxtails and other debris. Well, I usually take comb and comb out and I have long hair dogs, I have griffs. So I comb out all their hair and pull out all kinds of cheatgrass and all that crap with a comb. I started, I thought, you know what? I grabbed, I grabbed that air thing and I said, I'm going to try to blow this stuff out of my dog. And I blew in the opposite direction that the hair grows on my dog. And you and believe how many pieces of cheatgrass and other debris came out of my dog after being in the field, plus it laid the hair over or fur over with whatever you have to where you could see the cheatgrass where you couldn't see it. Your comb might not grab it. Oh, there's a piece that's really stuck in there and pulled it out. And this is the first year I'll use it, honey. And I was like, what a find. What a, you know, I have my little routine when I take my dogs out of the field, I check their eyes, I check their paws, I have a little routine that's mentioned in my first book. But add it to that routine this year is I'm going to be carrying one of those little things and they're powerful. And I'm just blow and I put my dog on low, which is my foundational command anyway. So when I say, well, my dog stand there and they just let them just blow all their hair off and and it takes off like 80% of the stuff that's in there, 80 to 90%. And I thought, what a great little thing I haven't done for 40 years. I don't know when they came out. But so that's another thing that's going to my bag this year. That's a new one that alcohol is in there. But one of these little powerful air dusters is going in there now. Now, if you don't have long hair of dogs, it's not as important, but it has folks with, with, you know, the longer hair. Well, I'm a setter, setter guy over here. So I mean, my, my English setters actually have fairly trim coats. I mean, they're not as long as some setters. But yeah, early season I'm we, if we hit the woods or something, it's yeah, they're going to have that stuff in there. And I do a lot of what you do kind of trim the trim, the real problematic areas to try to avoid that. And you know, got me thinking, I wonder, I wonder if those things I bet they could the way it sounds. I wonder if they could blow deer ticks off the dogs because I know a lot of people, I don't know how much you guys deal with ticks out there. I know you have them, but we're going to be this year, I think, from what I've heard this spring. And I think ticks are going to be a big. It's nothing new, but there will be plenty of ticks this year. And I mean, you have some areas where you go in and your dog comes out of the woods and they're, you know, they're kind of all over the head and face. And yeah, they can be kind of a pain. Usually, you know, a little, a little metal steel comb kind of thing can, can make pretty quick work of it. But gosh, I wonder if you could, you could speed that up with one of you have to send me a link to one of these air dusters that you're talking about. Okay, I will. And I bet you not only would blow some of them off, but it when it blows the hair to, you know, I go opposite direction to the hair goes, you can see the skin all the way, you know, so that's where I'm finding little pieces of foxtail and cheatgrass. I will bet that you'll find you'll find little ticks stuck in areas that your comb might not have grabbed. Yeah, that's a good one. I hadn't thought about that. I don't deal a lot with ticks. I do my property has them, but we don't have a, they're not deer ticks. There's these little ticks that they're using not problematic. We get them off and we don't deal with Lyme disease so much here. But we still deal with them. I hadn't thought about that. And, you know, the necessity creates an invention and I was dealing with cheatgrass and that's where the idea came up. But that's a great thought. And they're really not that expensive. You can get them. I've got, I actually get to test. I'm testing a whole bunch of e-colors right now. I get to test different things for Amazon for different companies. And so I actually got a bunch of those like four of them to test and they range from 39 bucks to 150 bucks. But you can get a real nice one for around, I would say 40 to 50, 60 bucks. They're not cheap, but boy, they do a really good job. And they say they're like 130,000 RPM to 180,000 RPM or the, are the ones that really put out, put out the air. I can't tell too much of a difference there. I'm just saying this right because of listeners. I'm not sending a link to, but if they're going to go look for them, they're called compressed air dusters and you want them. I use it for a lot of stuff. We're talking about shotguns earlier now. I used to buy a compressed air to clean out all the trigger stuff. Now I have one of those in my shotgun thing to blow out my shotgun trigger assemblies and things of that nature. So, you know, they're, they cool off my shotgun. When I'm shooting sporting clays, they're great for blowing the shotgun for cleaning. And also, they're really powerful. I use an ATV now. They actually blow all the dust off the ATV because I tested them in my ATV last time I was out my ATV. And they're, they're just thinking dust for sure. Yep. And they're just, they're a little bit bigger than your hand. I'll send you the link. So tip for when we're selling products so that we don't even know who makes them. But I, to me, it's like a great little find. It's like, wow, what a nice little tool to have. So maybe, maybe other people will find useful. So good enough. Yeah, that's a great tip. I suspect folks will be some people that take it and run with it and people have other ideas and how it's, it's one of these things, it's kind of unrelated. You know, it just the one of the things that these powerful lithium ion portable batteries have done is they kind of take, you know, power tools like that. Like I don't, I don't know about you. I've got a, I have an electric leaf blower, as you mentioned at the outset there and the, and a weed whip. And there's some things like the convenience of electric motor stuff like that. It takes a tool that was otherwise like kind of inconvenient to use. And then it makes it so easy to, to toad around and use, you use it more often and you think of more ways to use it. So this, this sounds exactly like one of those kinds of tools that put in the kit and, and who knows what you might come up with. I was thinking, you know, blowing feathers off the tailgate, cleaning birds, cleaning up your dog, blowing dust off the out of certain areas. I mean, shotguns for sure, blowing water or dust or anything. Yep. Yep. Out of barrels, that kind of thing, for sure. Yeah. I'll send you the link and then you test out and you let me know. What you think? Yeah. I will do that. I mean, whatever, whatever link you send me, I will, I will include it in the show notes just so folks can have something to click on and check it out. Okay. Sure. I wish I had a company that was paying me to do so, but I'll say, I'll find what it's into to you. So, so good. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. I'm looking forward to, to this year and trying out all the new stuff and getting my young, my young pup out. He's just turning two. He's two now, actually. And, and then my old girl who's in the book, Coda, this is her last season. She's, she, she doesn't guide hunts anymore or do anything and she's really slowed down a lot. And I'm, I'm taking her out just because I have to. I probably shouldn't. And just, I'm going to hunt her for maybe a half hour to an hour around the car and then put her up and then take the two younger dogs out. They're all related. CK is, is Coda's son and then Sacket is, is Coda's grandson, which is CK's son. So, they're all related. So, I'll take Grandma out first and give her just a little time. So, she feels like she's, she got to hunt and, and, and is still out there with me. And then, and then I'll take my eight-year-old and my two-year-old out after, after her. And it's, it's kind of, you know, it's kind of tough to, those old dogs, man, they find a special place in your heart and to, to, as they, as they age. And you hit those times where they can no longer do this or that. It's, it's tough. It's tough to, to, to not have them there and to know that you're, you're losing them and that they, they can't experience it anymore. So, I'm, I'm going to take her out. I'm, I'll deal with whatever I have to deal with. If I have to cut my hunt short, if I have to come back to the, to the, to the trailer sooner than normal or stay in the trailer. If it's too hot or something, I'll make the adjustments for her. But she's going to go out and this will be her last time, her, her last season getting out a little bit. And then, and then after that, she'll have to stay home from now on. So, this is kind of a, a little bit of a special year for me and her. Anyhow, now I'm getting sentimental. Yeah. Hey, find, find those, find those things in, in those, those moments and things that you can pull out of, out of every season. And I know you will, but enjoy it. Enjoy every, enjoy every walk you get with her this, this year. Cause it's, it's going to be special for you. I absolutely will. There's, I will absolutely will. Yep. For sure. Advice and or words of wisdom for folks hitting the field this fall with a, with a young dog, maybe a pup. What do you tell folks that are, that are kind of maybe just getting started there at their more, a lot closer to the beginning of their bird dog journey than you are, George. What would you tell somebody that, that's going to hit the field with the young pup this fall? There's a few things. First of all, they're young pups through children. People don't realize that the young pups are still children. And so, they're going to make mistakes. Don't, they're just going to make mistakes except the fact that there's going to be some mistakes made. So just enjoy, enjoy the time out there with them. And when they make mistakes, they make mistakes, don't get, don't try to deal with a whole bunch of stuff in the field. Deal with that in the off season. They make mistakes, let it go and move forward. There's certain things you can do to try to circumvent the mistakes. And I'll talk about a couple of those, but realize that you're, you're dealing with the young dog. You're doing the pup. Don't expect it to be a major league player. Expect it to be in tee ball or in little league, you know, something like that. Just enjoy those moments with your puppy, you know, it's a young dog. Common mistakes that I see is people will, I'm going to write some of these down to, just so I don't forget them. People will have a dog go on point, a young dog go on point, and they'll get excited. And as the dogs on point, they're going to walk right up the rear end of that dog. And if you've ever had somebody walk up to you from behind in a fast motion, you feel their presence and you might want to turn around to see what's going on. Well, when a dog's on point, it's on point. Once it's moving again, it's easier for it to break point. So if you come up, it's rear from behind and it gets a little nervous and it turns its head to see what you're doing, it's more apt to break or it's more apt to feel your pressure coming from behind and break because it thinks you're going to come over the top of it to get its bird. So come from the side, a little bit to the side, maybe five, six, seven, eight, nine feet to the side and come around your dog in a nice smooth motion. So your dog sees what's happening and is more comfortable and less likely to break. That's that's a common mistake. I see and I see that training all the time. I've been out shooting over UT dogs and other field trials and seeing gunners make that mistake and cost a dog a title from going up the dogs we're in. So that that's one. Number two, take a lot of water, make sure your dogs. Well, one thing if I could just jump in there, Jordan, I just want to add the like, just to just to really paint the picture, I think what what you're saying and please correct me if I'm wrong, but you know, if your dog is, say, in front of you pointing ahead over the next ridge, we obviously are coming from behind the dog. But what you're really saying is, don't walk up and brush your knee against the side of your dog's flank. That's to like be out away from the dog five, 10, 15 yards to the side. Let the dog see you in its peripheral vision and not feel you brushing up against the side. Would you agree with that? Yes, like, you know, sack it. I mentioned them when we sack it or I missed the birds. He was way the heck out there over two ridges. So of course, I'm walking straight to him. But when I get about 20 yards behind him or so, I start angling to one side just a little bit. Now I'm not real far out. Sometimes if I'm trying to pinch birds, many times if I have a dog, I'm pointing those dogs, those birds have moved. I'll be 20, 30 yards out to the side and I'll walk 40 yards, 50 yards past the dog, come back in and try to walk back towards the dog. The dog sees me. I'll put my palm up and walk all the way around the dog, walk away out there, especially with Chucker 40, 50 yards out, cut in. Now I'm walking back right at the dog and hopefully trapping the birds in between us so I get a flush because those birds are moving because the dog's been on point so long. So that's one thing I'm going to the side and I go way to the side. I go 30, 40 yards to the side because I don't want to pressure the birds and I want to come in in front of them if I can. But what I'm talking about is when you get 10 yards from your dog, 10 or 15 yards from your dog, picture yourself on a sidewalk and you're walking in somebody's way behind you. That's not a threat. But as they start getting 10, nine, eight yards, five yards behind you, 10 feet behind you, you feel that pressure of a person coming up on your back. And so when I get about about seven, eight yards from my dog, 10 yards from my dog, I'm about 10 feet to the side, 10 to 15 feet to the side. And then I will come in front of my dog around my dog. I might need to come in front of my dog to find the birds, especially in the test where those birds are planted. But in the open, in the wild, many times they just flush. But I don't want my dog to feel that pressure. I want them to see me. And also I can put my palm up then for my well command as I go around. But I would, I did a clinic in Miskin this past year, Muzzy Pheasant Farm. And there was a lady just prior to the clinic and she was having a problem with her dog breaking and where it was a Friday night meet and greet. And she goes, she goes, you know, my dog's really steady, but it's like she's in competition with me. When I go to get up to her, flush the bird, she breaks every time. And I go, okay, we'll get your dog out. Let's go plant a bird's on the sea. And first thing she did was walk up that dog's butt. And I said, okay, crack up a little bit. And I said, stand there. And I walked right up to her, right up her back. And I said, how's this feel? And she goes, doesn't feel very good. And then I walked around the side of her way about 10 feet and I go, how's this feel? She goes, she goes, feels fine. I go, well, you just did the first thing to your dog. And your dog feels that pressure and doesn't like it. So now let's do the same thing and have you walk away to the side around it. And the dog was steady. She's like, oh my goodness, it's been my fault the whole time. Yep, it's been your fault the whole time. Give the dog some space, let it see you coming around, let it feel comfortable. So that's what I'm talking about. I hope I clarified that for you. Yeah, definitely. And I will, I know you got other things too. I just, I do know that there are folks that they do walk right up, they kind of develop that ability to walk right up behind their dogs. And sometimes this cover might be crows wood stuff. But like anything, these dogs are smart, they can figure that out. So if you know what you're doing and you take the time to develop that ability to do that, that's one thing. But again, we were talking about sort of young pups, new, you know, if you're around it enough, you will see a situation like that where that dog is feeling that pressure and is not accustomed to it. And it can result in those types of things. So yeah, very, very well put. Yep. Yep. The other thing is just take, take water, take a lot of stuff for water. I see, unfortunately, I've seen dogs overheated in my lifetime a number of times that it's not a pretty, not a pretty sight. Some dogs are never the same, some dogs don't make it. Take a lot of water and take some breaks. Keep, keep, you know, you're excited. This is your young pup. You get really excited. And those pups with good hunting genetics, they will, they will literally kill themselves for you. They will keep going. The drive will be there. And they won't realize that they've gone too far. And now they collapse and they may never be the same. So it's your job to make sure that you're monitoring the heat level, keeping your dogs cool and have enough water for your dogs. I can't tell you how many times I've been out five or six miles chucker hunting. The dogs got all my water. I didn't get anything. We made it back. The dogs were getting hydrated. I had a headache, but the dogs were not going to suffer because I didn't have enough water for them. So make sure you're monitoring that. You will be excited. Your pup will be excited. It's your job to make sure that that dog remains safe and doesn't get overheated. So that's, you know, I've seen that, you know, oftentimes happened and it's just a sad sight to see. The other thing is, this is tough. This is a tough one. When you're dealing with a young dog and you, you're out there hunting and your dog goes for a takeout or flushes a bird and it's a pointy dog. I'm talking a pointy dog now and you start shooting those flushed birds over that young dog. You just taught it to be a flushing dog and you just, you're going to praise it because if you hit the bird and the dog goes out there and retrieves the bird, you're going to praise the heck out of it because it's bringing you back a bird. The dog pictures it as a praise for it, flushing the bird and retrieving it. It's not separating the two. So when you go out there with a young pup and it starts to do takeouts and flushes birds on its own, you have to not shoot for a while. Now on a seasoned bird dog that's pressured to a bird too much and it pops up and you want to shoot it, shoot it, it knows. But on a young dog, it's real important not to shoot those flushed, flushed birds that the dog has flushed because you are now teaching it to be a flush and that, and I see common mistakes. I get a lot of dogs every year that are no longer pointing and most of the time it's because their owners have been shooting birds over it that the dog has flushed. So you have to specifically, specifically at the beginning of the year, you might have to pass up some shots that your dog did not point so that it learns that if it doesn't point, it doesn't get the bird. If it points, you work as a team, it does get a bird. That's a real common situation that's hard to deal with because people get excited and that bird flushes and they want to shoot that bird and they shoot that first couple of birds over the dog and it didn't point. So from then on the dog starts flushing and they keep shooting birds and now the dog learns not to point. So that's another common mistake I see. So you might have to hold off on some shots at the beginning of the season if that dog hasn't pointed it. Now if the dog's pointed it in any manner, any point at all and moves and that bird flushes shoot it, the dog did its job, it's held the bird, it stopped for you. Another one that I see that people have to be careful about is too many guns around a young dog. I've had to deal with with dogs coming to me that are now gun sensitive or gun shy and it's always been human induced in my opinion because I start talking to people and find out what has transpired. It could have been improper gun introduction but there have been times that I've had to deal with the dog and what has happened is the dog had proper gun introduction. It was fine with somebody introducing you know a starter pistol 410 to 20 in there, single gun or double gun in training sessions and the dog was fine. Then all of a sudden they have a dog that's now gun shy or gun sensitive and what has happened is they've gone out on an early hunt for the dog has really gotten into the hunting mode where it's fired up and it knows what it's out there to do and it's got a number of birds shot over it and starting to learn how to hunt and learn what it's all about. On a very early hunt they've either been in a duck blind or on a dove hunt or they're working with like four or five people and the gunners and the dog goes on point and everybody comes around the dog and a couple of pheasants pop up or quail pop up and everybody fires and everybody fires two shots and so now the dog has been introduced with to a gun with one or two shots and all of a sudden it hears a barrage of shots above its head and it's like holy crap what was that and it starts to shut down or does shut down so that's not that's not something that happens all the time but I have had to deal with dogs pups that have had that happen to it so when you take your dog out for the first few hunts I would try not to hunt it with a bunch of people shooting over it you know hunt it with one or two people or at least if it goes on point don't have all the people come alongside of it and shoot and don't take it in a duck blind with the four gunners and then the ducks come come in and you know you have 12 shots over the ducks head in the duck blind try to let that dog learn to hunt first before you you put that many you know that many guns over a dog's head common mistakes like I'm saying that that happened that I deal with so you know that's that's a few of them I don't know that's that's that's great stuff and those are those are good things for people to be thinking about again whether it's your first dog or your tenth dog it never hurts to remind people of that stuff right yeah also one other I'm going to mention because I just said a dove hunt I tell all my clients on their pups that haven't hunted yet because everybody gets excited September 1st of stuff season and many of them want to go do a dove hunt I tell them not to take their young pup dove hunting wait do it next year take your dog out to something else that it's going to point in and it's going to work a field for a couple of reasons one is there could be multitude of guns around the dog two is the dog has to sit still so now it's becoming a retrieving dog instead of a working dog out in the field and a pointing dog but the big kicker on it is that dove feathers come off in a dog's mouth really easily and they stick to a dog's tongue and the roof of the mouth and if you have a young dog and it's first year hunting and you take it on a dove hunt and you make it sit you make it stay still and then you shoot some doves and it goes out there and grabs a doves and those doves stick to its mouth the feathers and it's spitting it out and stuff after it's retrieved four or five doves sometimes you'll find the dog go go nope I'm not I'm not retrieving those stupid things anymore I'm tired of dealing this I got cotton mouth like I'm not just not going to do it doesn't excite me and now they transfer that to upland game and now you shoot a sharp tail over it and it's like no I don't like retrieving birds so I don't like to try to circumvent as many problems as I can with a pup if you can circumvent a problem it's ways your share um to not have to fix a problem than it is to have the dog you know work through it in a manner that's conducive to the dog being successful so I don't I tell them I clients don't take your dog out on a dove hunt get it out on something else to begin with um because doves can make a dog not want to sit around they get antsy and then they don't want to retrieve them after a while now you have to deal with a dog that might not be a natural retriever any longer because the first experience wasn't a good one so that's that's another one so all right I'll shut up now I can talk all day long about dogs well I'm inclined to let you talk all day about dogs George I know I know you've got more packing to do and and we're getting to be about one other thing I because of the time factor and I had this jotted down I don't remember quite uh it was at it was at very early in the book um you mentioned blue-green algae um I can't remember if it was was it a dog that you had that had a running with that yeah it's coda and be okay yeah so just talk about that and and any any sort of tips you could give for because that's that's usually a factor or can be a factor and concern early season right oh yes and it's horrible I am gun I'm a gun shy guy when it comes to algae now um because I've had a dog get into it and my dog coda has suffered with um with some health problems throughout her years because of getting into it and there was four dogs um who had it in the bed clinic where coda went that day and the other three dogs died and coda didn't oh my gosh oh yeah that's that's yeah that I every call that now yeah and believe what you want I believe she fought fought because the love we have between us that she just wanted to live through it and she lived through it um you know that might sound crazy but I that's what I think that's my story and I'm sticking to it um but blue algae is kind of that turquoise green color that you see it's kind of uh yeah the turquoise is the best way I can see that I can I can say it but I do want to say you don't have to see it aqua blue maybe it's another way to describe the color it can be in the water and and it hasn't bloomed yet and it's it's deadly to animals and dogs even horses have died from it from what I haven't had an experience with it but I've heard they have um it's horrible stuff and it's usually in water that's not getting enough movement or and has become warm and become stagnant or so I got really warm and once it blooms it's there and it takes from what I hear I'm no expert at this and it takes a good good freeze cold to get to get rid of it um what I do now is first of all I'm watching if I if it even if I question the color of algae my dogs don't go in the water um but what I do when I go to areas like there's areas that are right now when I go to Montana I will be camping it um at least two maybe three lakes or reservoirs or ponds or something I will go to the local whatever the local grocery store the local whatever bar restaurant little town and I'll ask if you guys heard of any blue algae in any of the water around here any of the ponds or anything and if it's there many times they'll say oh yeah it's in this pond over there or this this reservoir stay away from that area over there because usually the locals somebody's dog or animal has died and they hear about it and everybody's like oh don't go over to XYZ area that's got an algae problem so-and-so's dog passed away or the horse died or something so I will go to the local areas if I'm going to stay around the pond now once it's cold and stuff and there and if there's other dogs that have been going in there out of there I'll ask that's another thing I do right when I see people with their dogs they're your dog's been drinking the water and then the pond oh yeah we've been here for a week or what have you okay I feel pretty good because that stuff doesn't take long to to get to a dog within hours or 24 hours your dog's mess usually within hours or sometimes even less than that so I will check with other dogs and I will check with the locals in an area if I don't see other dogs that have been in the water and then if there's a question and I can't find out I keep my dogs out of it it's horrible horrible stuff horrible and then I'm gun shy I'm I'm I'm algae shy I've had that experience so well yeah I can imagine and fortunately Kota made it through but yeah it's I know that's not the case for a lot of dogs that get into that so yeah yep so all right well well that's uh he that warning listeners but we will wrap up on a on a more positive note we've got a lot to look forward to and a lot to be thankful for we are on the verge of another hunting season and as we've discussed on our conversation today George I know you are just as excited as I am and probably everybody else out there listening so uh tails with tails from the heart of a man who loves life and bird dogs if that isn't evident after after this conversation in our previous one um I don't know what to tell you listeners but that's that's George second book would you amazon best place to go do you have your own website yep yep amazon's the easiest place to go okay yep they're pretty amazing how fast they can get stuff out I mean you know it's just yeah I would just go to amazon and just google my name or google it and it'll come up so yeah I will I will have a link to that in the in the show notes for listeners as well and yeah go go check it out there's there's a bunch of reviews I actually my last interview I had with Reid Bryant we were talking about one of his books and I was kind of saying I need to get better about leaving reviews for some of these books when I after I read them so I gotta I gotta do that and now I got another another reminder to go and leave a review to all these great authors out there so ah thank you I appreciate I appreciate the reviews I have a lot on the first book and I read them I do read them because it's nice to know especially that that book it's nice to know that you're helping people and and and their pups and so I I do read the reviews and I like I enjoy if people are enjoying the books and you know you're talking about getting ready to go hunting the whole time you're talking I had a big smile on my face I'm like yeah I'm ready to go yeah so I hope you're smiling right now yeah I hope everybody has a safe and fun hunting season and you and your pups and your dogs just have a wonderful time together you know have fun enjoy it right back at you George safe travel safe hunting have a blast this fall wish you and the dogs the best and we will chat again my friend thank you thank you I enjoyed it thanks for having me back on all right hang on with me for just a second George that does it for this episode of the birdshot podcast thanks for listening everybody thanks for tuning in to another episode of the birdshot podcast presented by on X Hunt final rise an up-and-gun company don't forget to rate review subscribe and share and if you really love the show and want to contribute above and beyond what you already do by listening you can sign up at patreon.com/birdshot thanks for listening we'll catch you on the next episode of the birdshot podcast on X Hunt is the number one hunting GPS app join millions of other hunters who trust on X Hunt to find more game discover new access and hunt smarter on X Hunt shows you nationwide public and private land boundaries they've got topographic and 3d maps you can track your route location and elevation profile you can save maps for offline use and take on X Hunt with you wherever you go the most comprehensive hunting tool you'll own download the on X Hunt app today and use the promo code BSP20 to save 20 percent on your next on X Hunt subscription know where you stand with on X when the miles rack up faster than your flush count that's when you'll truly appreciate your hunting best from final rise filled for the uplands and proudly sewn in the USA the complete lineup of hunting best from final rise from their all-new summit XT down to the minimalist sidekick system are all built upon the foundational load-bearing waist belt and low profile shoulder strap system which allow you to carry all the gear you need and do so comfortably while maintaining your ability to move freely and perform when you need to most with a complete lineup of accessories and newly released performance field apparel final rise has the gear you need to help you get the most out of every mile and every flush final rise gear is built for the uplands get yours today at finalrise.com hey what's going on everybody it's Bob from Woundux Gun Dog Chronicles podcast I hope you just enjoyed the episode you just listened to and if you did I think you'll enjoy hopping on hours we've got professional retriever trainers and upland bird dog trainers from across the country and world sharing their tips and tricks and great stories to help you and your dog get ready for the season we'll see you there
