BND Podcast
EP 5- Food Plots, Youth Seasons, and Horny Buck Seed w/ Doug Kostreva
Or whatever, it's 'cause you're lacking something. - Well usually I'm always liking sugar beer. (laughing) (upbeat music) - ED podcast, just wanna thank you guys for tuning in. Whatever you're listening on, YouTube, Spotify, Apple, you know, whatever is appropriate. Make sure you like, subscribe, follow, do whatever. - And today we got myself, Tyson Marker, got Dylan Marker, brother. And we got a very special guest, Doug Kastriva. - Yes, guest travel, whatever. It's all good. - Same thing. - Everybody know with me. - Horny buck seed. - There you go. - So, Doug, no. We met, what was that, probably June? - Yeah, maybe a little before. - About that time. - You know, I just kinda reached out on a whim. - Yeah, how did that all come? You never told me all this all game about it. - So, you like messaged me on face crack, I think it was. - I think I called you right away. - Who was that it was? - Yeah. - I don't remember. - 'Cause I asked my mom, 'cause she said you guys went to school together. - Yes. - I was just kinda looking through Facebook and Horny buck seed popped up. And I just happened to like click on it and look through all the products and everything. And I was like, I think I got some good stuff, you know? Like, some stuff I wanna try out. So, I remember my mom talking about Horny buck seed, whatever, and I seen the shirts everywhere. And I just asked her. I was like, do you know like who this is? Yeah, what's the school though? Well, she's like, you want his number? And I guess she had your number somehow. You know, either from a friend or whatever. - Well, our cell phone is our lifeline. - Yeah. - So, it's actually not that hard to find me. You know what I mean? - Yeah. - But, yeah. - So, she gave me it and I just happened to call you. I left you a message and you didn't call me. You sent me a text back right away. - Okay. - And it was like, no, just a great text that I got from you. And I was like, this guy sounds awesome. - Well. - You know? - Man, you don't know nothing, do you? (laughing) - So, then we just kind of went from there and, you know, we'd been staying in touch. - Oh, sure. But, - I mean, I love helping people out of a passion. - Yeah. - You know, so, and obviously with use too, you know, and then, obviously, then we ended up meeting you and then coming out to your place and putting out your race cars and doing all that stuff. And then we toured the property and stuff. You know, I mean, I do a lot of that every year. It's more so than probably ever, not lately. - Yeah. - And we're kind of like, I don't want to, I kind of private, my life's kind of private, but yet it's not, if that makes sense. My life, you know, with through the business, I always felt if I could help somebody in one way or another. There's no different than like our farming videos. You know, we do stuff like, you know, butchering chickens or butchering a cow or whatever, you know, a lot of guys, and I get some feedback where people, like, I had social, well, like, oh, that's kind of gross. And I'm like, listen, I'm only doing this to try to help people to understand this is how it happens. - Yep, yep. - All right? You know, this is the reality of life. And if we were at a kill floor somewhere, it would be a hundred times worse, right? So, you know, this is about as humane as it's going to get, all right? - Yeah. - Okay? You know, like our animals, you know, they don't know that they're getting butchered. - Yeah. - You know, they're in a barn and thinking, "Oh, I'm just going to eat." - How many chickens did you butcher? - Movie ended up, oh my gosh, but 90 some total. - Really? - Yeah, yeah. It would spin, yeah, it's been, you know. - You're done. - Well, I see you did this stuff. - Well, I'm laughing. I got to share this with you. That's kind of a funny story. So, I tell you, when you get older, you can't remember anything, right? So, you know, I could hide my own Easter eggs and this is no eye. So, my cousins got a hole in me, you know, before the fish boil, we had our fish boil. These is, when you're butchering your last batch, you'll let us know. We got four chickens we want butchered, you know. And, you know, if you got everything out in the plucker, blah, blah, blah, would you come, you know, do butchering. Yeah, absolutely. So, Saturday, you know, we killed the last 30 that we had, you know, and I totally forgot about their chickens. Totally forgot about chickens. - Okay. - So, got everything done, everything cleaned up, and all of a sudden, because it calls me on Monday, and he said, "Hey, when are you going to finish butchering "your chickens?" And I'm like, "Oh, we finished on Saturday." Oh, yeah, I had them four, and I'm like, "Oh, man, I forgot your four chickens." So, I'm sitting here, and I'm like, "They're such great cousins, and they're just awesome." So, I thought, "I'm butchering their chickens." I promised them I'd butcher their chickens. So, I went over there today with bags and brought their chickens back here, and I put your four chickens today, you know. 'Cause, I mean, you know, it's a natural for me, it's no big deal, you know. I got everything here, it took me, you know. I think it was like 45 minutes, and I had them all done, and bagged, and everything. I mean, you know, I mean-- - Oh, sure, the whole family was helping you. - I was myself today. - Oh, really? - I just didn't mind myself. Everybody was gone, you know, working and school and stuff, but, I mean, it doesn't bother me. You know, when you live on a farm, and that's kind of like, back to the business end of it, you know, I tell everybody, I'm a farmer, and I sell seed, and I help people grow deer. Farming deer is no different than farming cattle, or chickens, or pigs, or whatever. You're raising animals. You just don't have your control of them. - As much. - As much, right, in a while, right? But you're still, deer need supplements, they need things to grow, and they can get things in the wild, but they don't get everything they need in a while, 'cause our soil up here is terrible. It just is. We don't have soil like Iowa, we don't have soil. Even like in a western part of the state, you know. The dirt there is, I mean, the joy I help them, you know, with his, you know, with his outfit or business, and you know, he grows food plots, I mean, they belong in a magazine. Well, at 90% of the time, he didn't even have fertilizer. I mean, it's just, like, in here, you're begging for rain, and you've got to get your fertilizer. You've got to do everything just right, you know, to hopefully get a decent crop in there, you know. It don't matter, it depends on where you're at. Like in what are Iowa, or you're in Illinois, or Missouri, or Ohio, or wherever. You know, you've got different grounds, or you've got better ground, you can grow better crops. - Right. - And it's no different, you know, than here. I mean, you've got to, now you've got to spoon feed everything. - Yeah. - But if you're trying to grow deer on your property, you have to do it right. - Right. - You know, if that makes sense. - Yeah. So do you think it's more like the, I guess, along the Mississippi there? Like the minerals in the soil? - Oh, I think there's a lot to it. I think you're very much so. I think you get certain areas with certain veins. 'Cause here's the deal. So, and I try to explain this, when you're trying to grow a crop for your deer, the healthier your crop is, the less your deer you're gonna eat, because it's got more nutritional value to 'em. - Okay. - Okay. So you find out that if you're gonna grow something on your property, you want to definitely make sure that your soil is where it needs to be. - Okay. - The pH is where it needs to be. You got to fertilize where it needs to be. The problem is, is we're in a sandier type of soil. So on rule of thumb, you, like the other day, we were talking about the rains that came, right? You get an inch of rain. Inch a rain is gonna push your fertilization and lay the table down at least eight inches. All right, well, your root structure isn't gonna touch it. - Yeah. - 'Cause it went past it. - Right. - So now you're back to re-fertilize 'em again, you know? And it's just, and it's the nature of the beast, you know? - Yeah. - And it, it's just, it is what it is. - Yeah. - You know, you, you got to work around now. I got customers that, you know, even locally, are growing deer that I'm like, "Oh my gosh." I mean, I'm, I'm impressed, I'm impressed, but they're doing it right, you know? - When you're consistent, you know? - Right. - That's like the main factor. - Well, and I think that's, that's, that is the main factor. You know, I always tell everybody no different than any job or anything you're doing. You get out of it what you put into it. You know, I always tell everybody, food platen is farming and farming sucks. You know, especially this year, you know? - Yeah. - I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's a horrible year this year. - You work at the cornfield. - Oh, I mean, everything is, it prices, I mean, everything. It's a mess. - Yeah. - It's a mess. I mean, I got so many guys that are coming, you know, stopping and picking up minerals, stopping picking up feed, whatever, you know, right now we're talking and they're just telling me, man, we can't wait to get in the vine. - Probably. - We can't wait to get in the stand. Can't wait to get out in the woods. Really, man, this world is such a mess. So we just, I need my sanctity. I need to get back out and just to keep my sanity where I need it to be, right? - Right. - Right. - And that's where I find my piece. - Yeah. - I mean, you know what? You throw me in a blind or in a stand somewhere. I'm good. I'm good. I don't mind watching scrolls and I don't, you know, I don't care. - Right. - It's wild. - Yeah. - Birds, I mean, just, I mean, I don't think I've ever had a bad hunt. You know what? If you really think about it. And I mean, no, I've been a hunting animal. See a deer, you know. But I still was a good hunt. I got to see something, right? - Yeah. - I mean, you, you know, it's just, it, I mean, there's some that are obviously more memorable than others, but you can find glory in anything if you just let it look for it. And you don't even have to look hard, you know? 'Cause, you know, if you can go and you don't, you don't hear a vehicle, you know, how peaceful that is. - That's nice. I was telling you guys about like, you'd go on a Canada any hunt, you know? You're up there somewhere in the middle of nowhere. It's like deafening. - Yeah. - 'Cause you don't, like, you're like nothing. - I actually, when I was, I was out in North Dakota at Pheasant hunting, two years ago, I was out there and I had an instance like that too. I was just, we were out there and, I guess the four guys and their dogs were pushing birds and I was just sitting on posts or whatever. And all of a sudden it just like went completely silent. I was like, it was actually like deafening. Like almost, your ears like start ringing. - Isn't it so quiet? - I was like, this is weird. And I like, it's just weird, like actually noticing it. It's like, whoa. - You know, there's so many. - And you don't get that around here really. - No, because there's always noises. - Yeah. - I mean, there's just always noises, you know? I mean, and I even know, and here's another thing too, like we were talking about, as time went a lot, customers here in Alaska, we were talking about gun hunting, like rifle on season. Rifle season when I grew up was very prominent. I mean, everybody rifle, nobody archery hunted. There wasn't a lot of archery on it. I think now it kind of, with the, you know, with the crossbows coming out now, you know, and the technologies, I think a lot of people have flipped, flipped. I think a lot of people now are more archery hunters. I think there is, I feel there is. I feel like there's a lot more archery hunters than ever. - I think so, yeah. - I mean, and then you throw youth season in there, which that's the only thing if there's anything that I'm not, I'm for it and I hate it. - You? - I'm for it and I hate it. I, maybe it's just because I grew up old school. - Yeah. - You know, I grew up where the weather sucks and you're gonna sit with me and you're gonna like it. - Yeah. - You know, 'cause this is what hunting is all about. And nowadays, I mean, it's cushy. You know, you're, you know, the first major weekend of October, weather's pretty nice, okay? - Good, yeah. - Um, turning point, you know. - And you could shoot whatever you want, you know. And, you know, and I mean, and to me, it's not fair. It just is just my opinion. It's not fair to all the archery hunters out there. I don't believe in this. Because when you start, them deer aren't dumb. And when they hear boom boom, they go deep somewhere. - Oh, yeah. - All right, and now you take some stinky kid, you throw him in a bind and he's eating Cheetos and Twinkies. Guess what? Kid, I always said, I was laughing one time, Mark Drew and I were sitting and we were eating dinner and I'll never forget this. We were sitting and we were talking about youth season and I said, you know one thing about kids? Every time you take them out, they all stink. Every one of them. And he just started laughing. Because we feed them to keep them quiet. Every ounce of garbage you could think of. - Right, yeah. - You know, from Snickers bars to soda cans to Cheetos to Doritos to whatever, just to keep them there. - Yeah. - So they can share the experience, you know. But all of that atmosphere, we were just talking about scent-free, right, okay. We're trying to hold, we gotta keep our clothes clean and we gotta make sure we get out in the woods and we're, and yet you take the drag of 10 year old kid with his backpack full of garbage food. Throw him in a blind and guess what? - Yep. - Stunk up the whole 40. - Yep. - And you wonder where these deer go. - Mm-hmm, no. - I mean, and that's why, you know, I'm not, it's just not fair, you know, the kid, the kid itself, it's not, it's, I understand what we're trying to do, but I still think we're going about it wrong. And that's just my opinion and I know I get some parents that get really fired up when I say that, but I'm just like. - Which, yeah. - When everybody you see is when I was a kid. - Yeah. - Didn't exist. - Well, I think all two is like, you know, the first impressions like the biggest thing. So if a kid can go out there and they got, you know, a great time of season to go out, they can eat snacks, like all of a sudden, and they shoot a booner. - Yeah. - They're hooked for life, you know? And then otherwise if you go out like, you know, I mean, we didn't really get that, like what you had, you know, going out in the harsh elements, 'cause we had to use season, I think. - I think so. - But, yeah. - You know, I don't even know when that started, not that you say that. - But then it's like thinking that like you go out and you're going out and, you know, negative 10, whatever. And it's your first time going out, you're like, this sucks. - And it did, but you know what? It was a whole different camaraderie back then. - Yeah. - We had, not even want to say a hunting camp, but as a family, we lived off the deer, okay? So everything we shot that we harvested, we cleaned and, you know, as we were talking about earlier, we took care of everything, right? And it was just a whole different world back then, you know? Now, you know, somebody's kids, you know, they're vicariously living through their parents. - Yeah. - Right, you know, and they're killing deer that no disrespect. They didn't earn them. - Yeah. - You know, I mean, and I think I shared with you, is that, you know, that customer arrives from Iowa who, grandkids killed, you know, I one killed a 200, so maybe eight years old. - Yep. - Shoots a 217 inch deer. - Yeah. - We're gonna drop dying. - Where do you go from there? - Yeah, yeah, what's left? - He's always gonna be searching there, like, passing up, 'cause like our first deer, like, I shot a little four or six-pointer. - Yeah. - It's like, you're happy as a clam. - He's never gonna shoot one of those. - Yeah. - He'll see that one and say, oh, that one's not big enough. - I mean, when we were kids, you know, when we got in the hunt, man, if it had three inch spikes, man, you were slamming it. - Wow. - 'Cause that was legal. - Yeah. - You didn't care. - You know? - Still shaking like a leaf. - Nowadays, you know, and I mean, but it's kind of like what we're also saying, oh, Tyson, you're talking about, you know, why are deer getting a little bit bigger? - Mm-hmm. - You know, that we're getting even locally. - Yeah. - You know, it's getting better. It is getting better, and I think a lot of, I think a lot of the neighbors are, you know, getting together and we're trying. You know, and you're gonna always have your couple. I paid a tax, I'm killing what I want to kill. You've got every right to do that. - Yep. - I'm strong. - I'm not here to hurt you with you. - Mm-hmm. - I don't, I don't, I tell my neighbor, you kill it, it makes you happy. - Yeah. - No different than my family. I don't, you know, they're like, would you be mad if we shot a year and a half? I'm like, no, I don't care what you kill. - Do you know what you want? - I don't care what you kill. I don't own the deer, you know? And I think if the public would understand a little bit more and understand what goes into it and what you could reap from it, if you do let some deer go, I think they would have a whole different thing. But their mindset is if I don't kill it, the neighbor will. - Yep. - And well, first of all, the neighbors gotta see it, and they also have to hit it. - Yep. - Okay. And that don't always happen. I mean, does it happen? Sure, doesn't always happen. So, you know, you gotta, you've always got a, in the world we live today, because you locally, you gotta have a kind of a different mindset. You know, don't over hunt your property. You know, try to have a safe haven for your deer to live, right? - Yeah. - You know, keep deer on your property. I mean, you know, are they gonna still wander off? Yeah, you know, and I was telling you what you know, what gets a big buck killed as a digger's got. - Yep. - That's the truth. - Yeah. - You know, 'cause I mean, people don't drive deer like they used to, remember, when I was younger, deer drives, you know, you'd be going and you'd see deer drives all over. - Yep. - Yeah, definitely much. - Not as much. - Not as much. - Yeah, like, we hear this, yeah. I mean, we try and do it a little bit, but that's just out of tradition, out of fun of it, you know? But, my dad tells us stories about deer driving back in the day, and that's like, pretty much all he did is, hounded like, you know, everywhere around the area. - You know, you got that, that king buck replica downstairs, and Johnny was telling the story about, he got on a drive. - Yeah? - That buck was killed on a drive, and he normally was the driver, and he ended up being the poster. - Oh, really? - And actually, that buck came back into the post. He shut it on the way back into the, yeah. - Really? - Oh, that's awesome. - Yeah, it's kind of a, it's really a cool story, you know? But, I mean, so, I mean, you know, everybody's got their different traditions, and they're gonna like, you know, and it's, but we live in a world where hunters hate each other. It's pretty bad. You got guys that are like, oh, I shoot a long, I shoot a straight bow, and why you crossbow hunters, you all suck. And then the crossbow hunters, well, you know, just because, you know, don't hate me, because I can't pull a bow back anymore. Well, you still could if you really want, you know, here comes the debate. You know what, listen, if it's legal, and you want to do it, knock yourself out. I don't care if you want to use a stick. If it's legal, knock yourself out. - Right. - I mean, look at these guys that are spearing deer. - Well? - You know, they're my heroes. I'm like, why do you want to do that? I don't know. I don't care. If it's legal, knock yourself out. - Right, right. - I don't care. I mean, or you get guys with compound bows, and you got guys with long bows, or recurves, or, you know, I want to go back to your traditional. Go back to it. I don't care. I don't care if you use a wrist rocket. If it's legal, knock yourself out. I don't, it just doesn't mean I have to want to do it. And I don't have to accept it, because I'm not doing it, you know? So, and that's the world we live in now. - Yeah. - I mean, the situation's different. - Right. - Everyone likes their own thing. - Right. - So now everything's so kind of divided, it's like. - Well, everything's divided. - Yeah, you don't got much say in anything. - No. - I mean, you do, but it's like, you could only care so much about it, really. - Well, and it's kind of like we talked about it. It all starts with these stupid things. - Yeah. - You know? - Those are great. - You know, they're a great tool, and they can do so much good, but they can make people get really big heads really quick. - Oh, yeah. - You know? And, you know, like, they sit there behind the screen and, you know? - See, you know, I bind. - Yes. - Right. - Yeah. - Right, and you know, and the thing of it is, and that's a problem, we degrade so many people for so many different things. You know, like, why are you doing this, or? Like, you know, I get it that it's too, you know, like food potting and baiting. I'm like, you know, food potting is more for growing, dear. It really isn't an attractant, yes. But it's not an attractant, like a corn pile. - Yeah, right. - Okay, all right, it's not, you know. You know, so you know, you're back to farming, and you're back to growing, dear. You know, you gotta do it. That's what you food pot. - Yeah. - You know, you put them out, and you're like, well, that's just like baiting. Really? I don't think so, but if that's your interpretation, knock yourself out. - Yeah, think you want. - I mean, I mean, I could go take a food plot, and have a gorgeous food plot, and I could go take a five-gallon bucket of our feed, and go dump it in the middle of that food plot, and guess where they're gonna all go eat at that pile? - Yep, yep. - 'Cause that's what a deer do. - Right. - You know, it's just, it's the way it is, you know. And, but you know, so it's not, it's not apples to apples, in my opinion, but you know, is baiting necessarily bad? I mean, is it bad for deer? No. Does it make them not kernel? - Yeah. - Uh-huh. - Yeah, you know, deer's Romans are made, they're made to eat every four to six hours. That is what they're made to do. Every four to six hours. Well, it's really simple. If you don't feed 'em, they're not gonna eat. You know what I mean? So, you gotta, if you're gonna put it out, just give 'em their feed, and let 'em come and eat. When they wanna eat, let 'em come and eat. They're back to people that are, you know, they wanna sit there when they wanna bait, and they wanna feed deer, you know. And they're gonna do it. - Uh-huh. - And, I'm not necessarily against it. I don't, if that's what you have, you know, other than, you know, is it legal? No. No. Is it stopping? - People are gonna do it. - People are gonna do it. You know, when I laugh, I laugh at this all the time. You can't help it laugh at how stupid this is. So, you know, baitings illegal in a state of Wisconsin. But you go to every gas station, and there's 50 palm bags of corn for sale everywhere. - Or apples, or carrots, or sugar, bleeds, or yeah, our mineral blocks, our salt blocks, or whatever. You know, oh, it's all squirrel food. We should have squirrel, lunar squirrels, everywhere in Wisconsin, right? - There's a lot of squirrels though. - Well, you know, but you know what I mean? I'm like, you know, wow, wow. And I don't even tell, yeah, well, we know that, you know. But I mean, it's just all part of, you know, people I don't think realize that I don't, I'm not against it. It's just a legality thing, you know? I mean, I can tell, and I mean, I'm just gonna go off what customers tell me. So, customers come in and nobody talk, tell me right out, they're like, oh yeah, our deer, our deer change their pattern. You know, and they're like, and here, this is actually kind of cool, funny story. You know, like, our deer change their pattern. And I said, I really, it's his neighbor's baiting. You know, I'm gonna tell you a story, the guy told me, he said, I had a friend of mine come over and was drone, and he fooled my neighbor's property. How am I gonna compete with nine bait biles? He said, and he's got nine five-gallon buckets of corn on his 40 acres. - Really? - He's like, oh, my deer are gone. - And he's a food potter, right? - Yeah. - And I says, I get it. And how do I tell him to fix that, right? - Yeah. - I'm bait beggar, and he goes, I'm not baiting. I'm not baiting, I'm not baiting to find. And he goes, and I'm not turning him in. I said, well, good for you. I respect that, and I, God bless ya. You will get rewarded. I tell him that, you'll get rewarded. Don't get, you know? - Good karma. - It'll come, you know? And he was, you know, he came, and I was laughing 'cause he bought two bags of feed. And I said, you know, listen, you know, you gotta do what you gotta do. - Yep. - You know, he's like, I gotta compete. All my deer are gone. - Yep. - And I'm like, and that's tough, you know? - That's a feed against, yeah. - Right, and it's, and it, and like I said, in Wisconsin, it's everywhere, you know? And the only thing that's really good for is the deer. It's good for the deer. I mean, you're feeding 'em, you're getting 'em through winter. - Yep. - And it doesn't matter. That's all I look at it. So I think it'll, it'll, but, you know, and the DNR, I get there, well, and I wanna get into the, to that. - Well, let's transition into horny buck seed. Let's hear the story. How did it get started? Where did you start? When did you start? - Oh boy. - You know what kind of-- - We'll turn you from farmer to deer farmer. - Oh, there's a, okay, the, well, you went to long version? (laughing) - Okay, well, okay, so here, okay. So there's a kind of the funny story. We, Allison and I, I was working for a company out of Fond du Lac, believe it or not, and we were a vendor rep company at Fleet Farms. - Okay. - So I was a manager for the company, for a division, and I took care of seven fleets. - Okay. - Okay, we had, and I, every day I went to a different fleet, and we basically took care of the companies that we represented, we would stock their shelves and put a POP, and we babysit all their products into stores, okay? So I had seven stores, and I had, I don't know, I had maybe 13, 14 employees helping me pretty much, and I had, and she was one of them, and Allison was one of them, and she'd work part-time, but we had two kids. We had Emily and Tyler, both in diapers at the time, and it worked out honestly nice, 'cause Allison could watch our own kids one day, and then the babysitter that we had babysitting 'em, she worked for me a couple days a week. So it worked, it was just, I mean, it was like, it was like one of the best jobs I think we've ever had in our life, 'cause you were always going into a store, you were always making the store happy because we were making doing their work, and we were making the vendors happy that we were, you know, taking care of their products, and we were getting it out on the shelf, and we were selling their products, so it was, everybody was a win-win, you know? Well, then third-generation mills took over, and they wanted our percentage. So they started eliminating vendor reps, in the store, so we lost our jobs. So I think I had to lay her off on a Tuesday, and then I got laid off on a Wednesday. So now we have two kids in diapers, and we had the farm, but it wasn't like a big farm at the time, and we just, a little bit, just so we could eat kind of one of those deals, 'cause I was working a lot, right? And then, you know, we, I don't even know if we would talk about moving, but we thought, well, we gotta find work, 'cause we got children, right? So what we ended up doing was one day, we know her and I were talking, and we had some friends over, and I kind of got into doing food plotting when I had my landscaping business, so when I started doing landscaping, I took care of a lot of customers, like north of here that were to live the Ronda Lakes, and they had cabins and stuff, and they wanted to watch deer in their backyard. - Okay. - So I'm like, well, you can plant stuff for them. Really, you know? So I started planting different clovers and different things that they can mow and maintain, but yet they didn't have to mow, they're like, they're lawn all the time, and they could watch deer out their backyards, and they loved it. So I started with that food plotting end of it, and then we ended up, like I said, we started, we lost our jobs, and then we ended up, so I had that background with the farming and doing that, and I was helping a couple of friends of ours were deer farmers, so I was helping them a little bit. And I said, I think I want to, I told her, I said, I think I want to go back into business again, I said, I think I'm going to start a seed company, and I had a couple of our buddies were over at the time, and they're like, also like, what are you going to call it? And I'm like, well, at the end of our road is whiskey crack, so I thought, well, we'll just call it whiskey crack seeds, you know, and in her right away, are you an idiot? You're not calling it that, you got to come up with something more original, that's stupid, just call it horny buck. Now, there's a flip side to this, so when we used to hunt, every deer with horns or antlers was a horny buck, okay? So there's a little kind of a little ploy back into that, so any deer that would come out and are like, oh, there's a horny, you know? So she said, why don't you call it horny buck? And I'm like, I am not calling it horny buck seed, because people are going to take it the wrong way. - Yeah, right. - Right away, right away. They're going to take it the wrong way. So this is before the days of cell phones, pretty much, I still had a blackberry, I think, at the time, so this is like way before, right? Like, you had them, but they weren't like technology. So I got up in the morning because I never slept anyway, so I was up at three in the morning, and I went on my computer like I always do, and I started googling, looking up cartoon characters in the altar industry. There wasn't any, there was none. I mean, the only thing that I seen that was kind of cool, if there was anything, was honestly Bone Collector had, you know, their antlers, yeah, they just call it the antlers, right there. - Yeah. - That was, that was it. - Yeah. - That was it. So that same morning, I ended up getting, I call my brother, and my brother does graphic arts, and he does a lot of that, you know, video stuff and things, and I said, are you in the office today? He goes, yeah, I said, can I come home and visit you? He goes, yeah, sure, it's going over. What's up? I said, I'll explain to you when I get to you. I said, okay, so I drove over by him, and he said, what's going on? I said, I'm going back into business, and he said, really? What are you going to do? I said, I'm opening up a seed company. Well, for what? I said, for food plots. Oh, that's right up your alley. Either I could see you doing that. He said, what are you going to call it? And I said, horny bug seed, and he started looking and he goes, all right, are you serious? I said, well, now hear me out, now hear me out. - That's not what you said. - I said, yes, but I want you to understand something. I want you to draw me horny of the buck. So I grew up during Bugs Bunny, Warner Brothers, right? - Yep. - So fog, horn, leg, horn, whatever. So I wanted him to draw me horny the buck. So horny the buck is our mascot, so horny buck, right? So after about 14 prototypes, - Yeah. - The 14 pointer was invented. So horny the buck was made, and then we had a trade market. And that took another six months or so. - Oh, okay. - And it just kind of, we started out slow, you know, and a lot of bumps in the road. But I got to meet, we've been blessed to meet the people we've met through this adventure, call it an adventure. We've got to do some really cool things. Even to the point of, you know, Tyler being up for the comedian Golden Moose Award. - Really? - Yeah, for his crapping episode. - Yeah, and that was actually, you didn't see that one yet at all. - No. - Oh, I got to show you. - No idea what you're talking about. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, he made it to the finals, so we got invited to Vegas. - Oh, really? - So Alison and I had to go to Vegas. Yeah, we had a good dressed up formally for the awards. 'Cause he wasn't old enough, and he was in school, so he couldn't come. 'Cause he was only seven or eight, maybe. But yeah, Tyler has a nervous disorder. - Okay. - Okay, so I got to have him find it for you. The clip, it's actually, "You Will Laugh." - It's sad. I never heard of it. - Oh yeah, it's a good one. It is a good one. Yeah, and it made the whole show. It's actually, the whole show is pretty funny. - Yeah. - Yeah, so, but yeah, he had irritable bowel out of the stand, and he had a poop like now, and it's all on film. - Really? - Oh yeah, yeah. - Geez, boy. - Yep, yep, yep, and it's, you know, to this day, kind of, it is what it is, but yeah, so, so with that being said, you know, emphasis on this nickname Tank, 'cause he was always a big boy. - Yeah. - You know, so we just nicknamed him, 'cause he was as big as a Tank, you know, so we'd nicknamed him Tank, and then Alison, you know, was really good at naming Horny Buck and everything else. - Right. - We had to have a blend, 'cause we made up a new blend, and we had to change a name, or put a name on it, so she called it, she called Tyler Tankalicious. - Tankalicious? - I like it. - So, his blend is Tankalicious, and that's our number one seller today, still is. - Yeah. - So the number one seller. So, there's kind of a lot of, like I said, we've been down, well, like I said, we got to meet so many different people and help so many different people along the way, and we're still, ironically, friends with lots of them. I mean, they still call, or talk, or X-packers, like Jeff Janice, you'll still chat once in a while, or text, or whatever, you get to know people, and then once, see, the thing of it is, is, but hunting, we call an extended family. It's an extended family. I mean, if you're a deer hunter, you're a family. It doesn't matter, and like I said, I don't care what you hunt with, I don't care where you hunt, I don't care how you hunt, as long as it's legal, knock yourself out. I don't care, I don't care what you kill, if it makes you happy, kill it. And we're all part of the family, 'cause we all have that passion. The problem is, is the family, no different than any family, you're gonna have friction. And that's what's kind of ruining it for a lot of people. And be proud of what you do, and be proud of what you got, and be happy for what you got, 'cause some people don't have these fortunate things, right? That's how I look at it, so. But that's basically how the business realistically got up and running, so to speak. And it's been a great adventure. It's been a great adventure. - It seems like, I mean, the stories that you tell them, like all the people that you met. - Oh, it's just-- - Like churries, and new gin. - Oh, damn. I mean, it's amazing what you do. - It's crazy. - Who you find, and what you find, and you know, the people are just, most of the people are just salted to the earth people. They really are, they really, really are. And you're gonna always run into your few. I hate to say a lot of your pro athletes are the worst. - Yeah. - A lot of them. - Okay. - And I think it's just because they'd be, I wouldn't wanna be 'em. I wouldn't, I would wanna have my pride. I love our privacy. - Mm-hmm. - I mean, I love our privacy. I don't, we live in the middle of nowhere, and everybody's like, you know, you don't call me, or you don't do anything. I'm like, if you know how busy my life is, sometimes I don't, like she had to come find me tonight, you know, that's our normal life. - Yeah. - I mean, that's our normal life. I mean, you know, when it's seed season, I mean, on an average day in July, into August, I'll take anywhere from 40 to 60 phone calls a day. - Wow. - And 90% of them is doing one thing, answering questions and helping 'em. - Yeah. - And it's usually not a three minute phone call. - Yeah, right. - It's, okay, you need to do this, and this, and this, and you know, because we're only as good as you do it, right? And I think that's one thing that we discussed from when we were out at your place. You're gonna be only as good as you do it, right? And you can do things half-assed, but you're gonna expect a half-assed problem. - Right, yep, exactly. - So, you know, and in farming, you can do everything right and still fail, and it can happen. - Yeah. - You know, I, and I, this, back to the phones, there is nothing more rewarding to me, and I'll guarantee you it's gonna start this weekend. - Oh, yeah. - They'll start. - Yeah. - I'll have guys texting me pictures or snapping me, now snapping, I'm still trying to figure out how to do that. So, you know you're old, right, right? I'm still trying to figure out how to put your thumb on it and do it, you know? Or I hate when people snap me pictures of their food plot and ask me a question, okay? So, if anybody's listening to this, don't do that. Text me, please, because they'll snap it to me, and I'll look at it, and I'll be like, "What is it?" And I'll say, "It's gone." - It's gone forever. - What the fuck? You know, I get, I'm like, you know, and I tell people, text it, just text it, 'cause I, back to hiding my own Easter eggs, I can't remember what the fuck you just sent me, let alone, I got to watch it in a video three or four times, right, right? - Yeah, right, yeah. - So, I tell people, you know, if you, you know, I love videos and I love pictures, don't snap 'em to me, you know, but text 'em's fine, that's good. But, like this weekend, I'll be the opening of a hunting season for many places. - Yep. - And people will be sending pictures of their kids sleeping next to 'em, in the blind, you know, or it'll be, you know, look at the one I got, look at the one I passed, or look at the one I shot, or to look at the one in the neighbor shot that I've been growing for the last four years, you know, I'll get lots of those, you know, and she knows, we'll be sitting in, she'll be like, you know, and I put my thing just on vibrate, and because, you know, she'll be like, "Now who's texting?" You know, you know, and also, 'cause we usually sit together overnight, it's just kind of like a traditional thing. - Yeah, that's kind of what you're saying before. - And it's just, you know, we just kind of, we just get together, and it's where we can have our time. So some of our best dates are in a deer stand. - Yeah. - Yeah. - There's nothing wrong with that. - No, and I mean, we just, and we have fun, and we laugh, and we giggle, and I love it. - Yeah. - And you know, and you find out in hunting, it's in how many, well, I don't know, their one, that's her first buck, that's actually kind of, - Oh. - Yeah, that was, that was, what was that? 17 minutes, eh? - 18 minutes. - 18 minutes, I was off, I meant it, yeah, yeah. We sat in the blind, 18 minutes, and she was done for the year. - And we were taking selfies just before. - Yep. - We were around and laughing, and... - Yeah, it was great, it was so funny. It was so funny. - I agree. - Yeah, and all of a sudden, I'm like, and it was, we were sitting in a blind, you know, in a shadow hunter, on the ground. Just sitting in the ground. In the middle of a woods, you know, and it's like a swampy woods. They were just sitting there, and all of a sudden, I look in the dead, that stupid buck, walk eight feet from her. - Oh, really? - Yeah, walk right by her, like walk right by her. And then I went to move, 'cause, you know, I have a little bit of a weight problem, and I went to move, and the chair went, "Dink!" And the buck stopped, and I'm like, "Oh, no, I just screwed up her hunt." Then all of a sudden, it took his alley and started scratching his back, and I'm like, "She's gonna kill this thing!" I knew right then and there, she's gonna kill him. - Yeah. - And he's gonna die over in a little bit. - No way. - She's gonna kill him. 'Cause when he, that didn't bother him, I'm like, "She's gonna kill him." - He's got her. - She's good at dead, and then all of a sudden, I'm like, and as he's walking, I'm just putting a window down, 'cause he's walking on a path, you know? - Uh-huh. - Put the window down, she put the bull up, and I'm like, "Put the 20 on him, whack!" - Take him. - Yep, and then it took off, and then you didn't see it, right? - Was that opening day? - Yeah, first 17 minutes of opening night. First 17 minutes. Done. - That's awesome. - And we got out, and it was funny, 'cause the deer ran, and we seen the Luminox sticking in a cedar tree. - Oh. - Went right through it, blew right through it. And I was like, she goes, "Did you hit him?" I'm like, "Oh, you, oh yeah, it's all hole, are you right?" I mean, you couldn't hit it any better. Really, I'm like, "Did I kill him?" I'm like, "Gonna be dead, it's gonna be dead." - That's awesome. - So we got out of the blind, and we walked over there to it, and I'm like, "Well, let's go look for blood." You know, do the right thing, you know? And we looked in, and there's a couple of specs of blood, and there's a little bit more blood. Then all of a sudden, I'm like, "You stay right here, "and I'm just gonna go." I didn't go, that deer did not go from this table to that wall. It was laying there dead. And all of a sudden, I went to her, and I'm like, "This," and she goes, "You got blood?" I go, "Come here, look at your deer." And she just lost it, and she just, that was kinda cool. - Yeah, and that's awesome. - Yeah, I still got the growing selfies on my phone. - Oh yeah. (laughing) - That's cool. Nice. - That's awesome. - And that's what hunting's all about. - Yeah. - You know, that's what it's all about. You know, and to her, every deer's a trophy, you know? But we had a little history watching the deer, you know, behind the man rule, and you were watching it all summer, and you know, and I hope it makes it, or I hope we get a shot at it, you know, and we'll all sit and watch, at its velvet, and you know? And it was just kind of a cool, just a cool, you know, a cool memory for me. - Yeah. - How you morsel, well, I'm probably for her, but it was for me too, you know? So when you can share that with somebody, and I don't care, you know, I don't know if you guys, you know, sit with anybody or whatever, but, you know, I mean, I always enjoy it. I mean, it kinda breaks up the day, too. - Yeah, right, yeah, exactly. - Just to share the experience, like I said, it's a big thing. - Well, I think it is. - Yeah. - I, you know, I think it's, I think it's awesome. I mean, you know, like, you know, back to Tyler. We went, this is the very first time in his pooping episode. He did not, we did not even see a buck to shoot. - Yeah. - And he ended up shooting a doe at about 150 yards with a slug gun. - Oh. - Okay. And I knew he hit it. - That was a good shot. - Yeah, well, you know, I don't know how good it was like. - Sounder 50 yards. - But he hit it, he hit it a little far back. And we had to go the next morning to look for her. - Oh, okay. - And then that's all part of the show. And we found her, you know. And that's the picture that's on the back of the bag. It's a doe shot, okay? But what was so cool about that whole experience was the next year we went back and hunted again. This was at Salfork in Illinois. - Okay. - And we went back and hunted again. And I, this is where we're gonna get back down to the youth hunt, okay? So Tyler and I are sitting in a blind overlooking a bigger axe plot that we had. We're sitting in a pop-up blind. And the owner says, there's two bucks coming out there. Every night on camera, religiously. He said, one's about 160 and one's about 170. And I'm sitting there thinking to myself. I've never shot a 160. - That was a big deer. - But I'm like, you know, all right, whatever. So, tad told, let's go sit there. He showed us where to hunt, whatever. So, Tyler and I went and sat and we're sitting in a blind and my clockwork here they came out. And I'm looking at them, I'm like, oh my god, these are giants in there, 60 yards. Tyler put the gun up, the gun wouldn't fire. - Really, what was that? - Found out that in them savages, it was a abold. No, it was a pump, it was a pump. A savage pump, I think, it was a Mossberg. I don't remember what gun it was. I just, I just know we looked it up and we found out that there's a spring in the trigger that's that, not that they're recalled, but there's a problem with them. And it has to be rectified, you know, it's supposed to be gone through. And they didn't, we didn't know. The gun didn't go out. So we had to watch them deer, couldn't shoot him. And he was just crying like a little girl. - Really? - 'Cause he's sitting there and all he can do is go bang, you know, and there's nothing, you know. But, - Well, sometimes that's a good part though, is just being able to watch him. - Okay, so it goes right back to what we were talking before, kid didn't earn it. You know, he didn't earn it. You know, he was like eight years old, whatever, nine. He didn't earn it on 170. He didn't earn it on 150. You know, so you sit there sometimes and you're like, that's where I get like a little bit aggravated, you know, when somebody's parents or grandparents take their kid out who is seven. - He's shooting two partners. - And he shoots a boner as first deer. - Yeah, right. - It's like, yeah. - Yeah, you know, I mean, I mean, you know, I think as parents are, and I'm not a grandparent, but I mean, old I'll be a grandparent, but I'm not a grandparent. But with that being said, I still, you still got to know your limits and what you need to do with your children. - Right. - I mean, you know, I mean, and that's why, and then we got the center, I don't care what you kill, which we're talking about. I don't care what you kill. I don't, I'm not here to sit there. I used to be, I used to be a little bit more, you know, let's let 'em go, let 'em go, let 'em go, let 'em go, and then, but you know what? Why? Why? Why? What for? What for? You know what? If it makes you happy, smoke it. - Yeah. - I don't even care. - Where do you think changed that? - For me? - Yeah. - Selfishness. - Yeah. - I think we all are selfish, right? We're all a little greedy. We're all a little greedy, a little bit, I think we all are, I, I, I, you know, like, Alison always tells me, you are in constant competition with yourself. - Yep. - And I'm like, she's right. 'Cause I mean, there'll be times that I'll send her pictures of deer and she'd like, and you didn't shoot that? And I'll be like, no, are you nuts? I don't know, didn't wanna kill it. - Yep. - And then the next time, you know, and I mean, I, you know, and I don't know, that one's not back here from Texas, like that 17-pounder I shot in Kansas. - I'd ever seen that one. - You know, that was a very, you know, what was, I think to me, what was the coolest part of that whole hunt was I was vicarious, they kind of live in that whole hunt on social media with a lot of my friends and followers on there because everybody knew I was in Kansas hunting and everybody knew that Kansas had, you know, really good deer, right? I mean, they just do, but what ended up happening, and I'll see if I can find a quick picture of it for you, what was kind of to me, the coolest part of the whole thing. Oh, that was one of the, I posted it. Wow. Oh, I'm sitting with my in-line, and I'm hunting, and Miles, Will Hite, we were hunting with him and Mickey, and Miles told me right out, he said, you know, I got, you got some really good bucks there, he said, and I ended up with a picture of him from the year before, and then he had a picture of him from this year, okay? And he said, I don't know what that buck is, he says, I haven't seen him in a long time. And, but he says, Shorty's there, which is the buck that I killed that year. So he said, if you see Shorty, shoot Shorty, 'cause he's seven and a half, and he said, he's about 150, so 160, he said he's a good buck. Well, I seen Shorty, but I already seen his guy, but I didn't see his antlers. Well, I've seen his body, and I've seen him at 400 yards. And all I can see is the trees where they're hanging, that's all I can see was the deer coming to me. And I couldn't see his head, couldn't not see his head, couldn't not see his head, and then all of a sudden, he got to about 150 yards, and then I could see his head, and I'm like, I put the binoculars on him, and I'm like, oh my gosh, here's points everywhere on that stupid thing. And I'm like, well, he's coming, let's let him keep coming. So he got to 100 yards, and I smoked them, and I dumped them right there. Yeah, dumped them right there. He was just went right now. Then I was sharing pictures with people on social, and then I got, then that post got really blew up. And then it, so it was kind of like one of those, I think Miles is calling him Forky Fred. That's Forky Fred, he's like, he's eight and a half years old. Yeah, and he says, this is the first year, 'cause Miles shot his running mate, which used to bust him up every year. So that was the first year he wasn't broken, because Miles killed his running mate, and he killed, and that was a big gear, that was 180 inch gear. Yeah, you know that one scored. And then I didn't put a tape to him. No, he was, you know, it was just a lot of points, just a lot of garbage, you know? 'Cause he had all those, what you call on him, like all the kickers and stuff. But I know I was laughing because what was kind of to me was kind of funny, we were giggling 'cause I sent, I told Miles that's what I killed, and then he's like, there's no way. I said, Miles, I know that's him. So I got on, I took a picture of his antlers just laying there, and he's like, oh my gosh, I cannot believe it. Really? I said, yeah, well, I told ya, I wasn't lying, do ya? Slaying and seeing him for a couple days before that, or? That was the first picture I took of him. Yeah, yeah, and he goes, oh my gosh, you did kill him. I said, I told ya, I ain't lying, do ya? I said, I wouldn't lie to you about it, you know? That's awesome. You know, but yeah, I walked up to him, I took a picture, and I sent the to him, he goes, I'll be dog on. Really? I said, yeah, kill them. That's cool. I killed them, you know? But, you know, like I said, you get, you get, like I said, back to the business, we're blessed to. Yeah. And Miles, okay, so I call Miles a dear friend. Met him off of a phone call. Really? He called me, he's living in Kansas, and he's like, I follow you on Facebook, and he said, I watch what you're about, and I watch what you guys are doing, and he said, I really am excited, 'cause he says, I don't find people that are genuine anymore. He said, everybody's chasing the money, and I'm like, well, I ain't honest, I don't pour a farm or so, I don't even think about that, right? And we just, you know, he bought some seed, and then we just became a friend. You gotta come and hunt, you gotta come and hunt. And then we had a, we used to have a golf outing every year, and he came all the way from Kansas to the golf outing. Really? 'Cause he's a scratch golfer, you know? Really? Man, yeah, and we just became like really good friends, and then when I shot that one, he ended up, you know, Emily went down with me. She drove with that one, 'cause she wanted to go with Dad on a hunting trip, and I took her with me, and we went down, and she just hit it off with them, and now they're family. That's all. They started out with a phone call, don't know them from Adam, and I think that's a lot of our, a lot of our people we have. That's how we, there were customers. It all started with a phone call. And some of them, we get invited to their weddings, or, yeah, I mean, it's just crazy. That's cool. It's just crazy, and I mean, and it's that thing back to my memory, we meet so many people, and I am terrible at remembering everybody. Yeah. I struggle with that, and that bothers me, because I really know who they are, but I don't know who they are. Like, I don't know their name, I know who they are. Right, right, right, right. Oh man, and I'm, I mean, I was in downtown, I was right in the middle of Atlanta at the airport, and a guy comes with me, oh my God, Doug, what are you doing in Atlanta? I said, well, I'm catching a flight to go up to, you know, I was going up to a trade show up in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. And they're like, oh man, I have no idea to this day who that guy was. Really? But he knew everything about me, knew all about the farm, and I'm just like, do you follow me? Oh, I follow you on Facebook. Oh, yeah, yeah, I got you. I follow you steady on Facebook. Right. Okay, no idea. No, you still don't know who he is. You know, I mean, it was, Dolly went out of his way to come and say hi. Right, yeah. So, you know, you know, and I don't remember, I think he means quite a few years ago, I think he even messaged me, thanks for taking the time, and I'm like, well, thanks for introducing yourself. You know, good. I don't know. You know, so social media can be great. Yeah. You know, in that avenue, you know, it can be great, but parts of it are the devil. Yeah. It's just that is what it is, you know? It's true, you know. You can make so many connections on social media. It's like... What are they genuine? You know, that's another thing, right? Yeah, exactly. You know, but with hunting base most people, most people are pretty good though. You know? But then you read all the comments and other stuff, and it's, ooh, we talked about earlier. It's bad. Really bad. Oh, I don't. Was it at all? You can't. I mean, I get people that, I ask me questions on them pages, and I can't even, I won't even answer. Yeah. I will private message them. I will private message you, but I'm not gonna answer on there, because you have 19 other geniuses who never did it, and the thing in their day in their life are gonna tell you how you're doing it wrong. Yep. And I'll be like, "So I tell everybody when I do stuff, "I do my seminar. "I'm not telling you you have to do it this way. "This is how I do it, and it works for me." Yep. It might not work for you this way. Yeah. I don't know. Exactly. But I've been doing it for this many years, and it's been working. Yeah. So, you know? Yeah, let's talk about, well, I guess, Tyler and Tinklelicious. Guess, what's your other, I mean, I kind of know, but to everyone else, like, what's your other most best-seller seeds that you got there at all? Well, here's the deal. For Wisconsin. You know, okay, so for pure tonnage, our dead zone pushes out a lot of tonnage. Okay. There's a lot of feed there. But now, I think we talked in depth a little bit more about growing here. So, your big racks, or your tagged out, are both very, very good. Okay? 'Cause a clover elf and chickery come back the next year, right? So, when do you want to start growing your deer in the spring, right? Right when they're coming up a winter, when things start greening up, you got to have them on something. Right. Because if you want to grow with these inhalers and have good fawns, that's what you need to do. So, I mean, those blends, you know, and then if you're, you know, for me, any of those are good. You know, clover is a great food source for the spring, summer, and into early fall, but now they're going to start switching over to carbs. Yep. But we're still a little warm yet for carbs yet. But they're eating corn. I mean, I can see it at the deer in a corn quite a bit, but it's just starting to really dent up good, you know? And the acorn crop is not near what it was last year. Thank God. Life was nuts. Yeah. It wasn't right. Last year was just not right. I don't know what went on, but... It was just kind of a crazy drought year, you know? Yeah. But I mean, it's just one of those, one of those situations, you know? Yeah. But I think as a whole, I mean, those are the main blends that, you know, most people purchase for the most part. So what's your... I guess... I don't know how to explain it, but like, what's your most... distinguished between like a bow season and like a gun season? 'Cause, you know, Wisconsin obviously is more prominent on gun season. So what's like your main blend for like the gun hunters? For the gun hunters, usually between the tank, checkmates really good too. We do a lot of guys that have checked me 'cause they've got the winter rye in it. Okay. Okay, so that's really good for late season. Okay. Comes in really well. But I'm all about tonnage. So sugar beets and turnips in a dead zone are really money. But the tank, you got the radishes in there, you got the kale in there, you got the collards in there. You got the turnips in there. I mean, it is just an absolute smorgasbord. And what's nice about that, that doesn't necessarily have to freeze. So a lot of our customers that are down in like Missouri, Kansas, Illinois, where it doesn't get like in the 20s, right? It does really well. Really? Yeah, it does really, really well. So these are all kind of parts. So it does better when it doesn't freeze? Well, it doesn't need to freeze for them to eat it. So some of your brassicas do though, you know, like-- Otherwise they're bitter. In bitter, yes, yeah. So like your turnips, your turnips and rape or canola, a lot of times that needs to freeze. And then it'll turn to sugar. Okay. And it wants to turn to sugar and then they'll love it. Yeah. And if it's sweet frost, right? Right. It's frost, it's well sweet, you know. So is that what's in the sweet frost and just the turnips? The turnips and rape, yeah. Okay. So, I mean, it's kind of one of those, you know, you know, and I get this a lot of things too, a lot of guys are like, my dear won't need turnips, they don't know what they are. Yeah. My A, you know, I had a guy, he was on the other side of the state and he called me up, and he was pretty upset. Okay. 'Cause he's like, I got all these turnips and I think he used his language, but it was pretty choice. And he was like, I got turnips out there and they're like tennis balls, off balls everywhere. And he won't touch him. I said, they eat all the greens, I go. He goes, yeah. There ain't a thing left on that plot, uttered in all them fricking balls. And he, I said, I'll tell you what I want you to do. I want you to take in, go with your foot, roll a bunch of them out, take an ax, a machete or whatever, whack up some. Before, I said, dear, I don't know what they are. And he's like, are you playing with me? I said, I'm just telling you, you got nothing to lose. Right. Hmm. I said, just try it. Yeah. So I could tell you it was reluctantly and I think he thought I was lying to him, but he said, all right, I'll do it. And I'll let you know. So he did, I think a couple of days later, he goes, you ain't gonna believe this. My dog on a plot is getting murdered right now. They finally figured out what they are. Really? Wow. Because they didn't know what they were. Yeah. This was like maybe five, six, seven years ago. Okay. They didn't know what a turnip was. No idea. Well, they ate all the greens off, like the tops, but they didn't eat the ball. Now he says, I mean, it's just like a little craters. They just eat when it's freezes. They just eat everything they can when it's frozen around. It's kind of cool. That's interesting. Yeah. I guess they're really thought about it. Mine do it the same thing to do it the same thing here. Yeah. I mean, this is our first year, planting turnips and radishes and stuff like that. So they definitely, they know what it is. They're eating the greens right now, aren't they? Yeah. I can see them eating it. Yeah. And by noticing just driving around there too, you can see all the bulbs up already. And they're, you know, they're not too big yet, but they're not really seeing the touch those as well. No, no. They don't have the greens. They'll, they'll, it's this longer in there, but it's all that matters. Cause I mean, I told people don't overthink it. You know, just don't overthink it. I mean, you know, you put it out there and once they learn what it is, they'll take care of it themselves. Yeah. And sometimes you gotta teach them. You know, cause some deer don't know. Yeah. They just don't know. And like, you get further south, like in the southern states, they don't want to touch them. All right. They don't need to cause down there for whatever reason, oh, it's right grasses are big down south. Okay. You know. You think it's more like the soil type down? I think so. I think it's the heat. Just the heat. I think it's temps and it's sandy. Those probably stayed better than. I'm very much so. Okay. Very, very much so. I guess. Very, very much so. So in the deer, it's smaller than up here. It is, everything is different. Yeah. Everything is different down south. So we did text about like the lowland wet area seats. I asked you a question about that. You got any? It's hard to grow anything. It's hard to grow anything in wet soil. Okay. It just, it just is. It's just, because you're not going to get any vibrant, you know, plants out of it. Yeah. You know, a fool of thought. You're just not going to. Yeah. I just didn't know if anyone ever like made like a, like a creek bed or, you know, just a little spot in the field. Like where it's super wet, just like throwing something in there and having it. I mean, you know what they, you know, like that would grow and something like that. Well, you could grow different grasses. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So let's just go through a protein level. Okay. Average grass is below 10% protein. Usually way below. Yeah. Usually like six. Okay. Five. Okay. Well, what's that the same? Isn't it? Deer know what to eat. Five. But there's carbs. Yeah. See, there's a difference. Yeah. There's a, there's a sugar in a plant and there, and the car, there's a carb. So it, it, it's a whole different animal. Okay. Where grass doesn't have a much value. It's a roughage. Mm-hmm. Grass is a roughage. Yeah. And they're not that a deer don't like it. They'll eat it to an extent, but it's mostly roughage. Okay. So you got to kind of like think kind of outside the box a little bit on that. Yeah. You know? Yeah. I was definitely just curious about that. Because I was like, I'm just looking at either some of the low spots in our field or, you know, people just asking our buddies that I know about how these low areas. I was like, I wonder if you could put like something in there. No, you can grow, you can grow clover in them when they're dry, you know, and then let the clover establish. Yeah. And then you're going to have some drowned out. Okay. A little bit. Uh-huh. But you're going to still have something there. Right? Yeah. But here's the deal. Are you utilizing your time and effort and money? I really. Because that's a big hit or mess. Right. And it's more of a missed than a hit. Yeah. So, you know, I mean, I have a customer who's out by towards the like the Bay area. Okay. Very low ground. He went and he tiled his whole ball's food plots. Really? I'm like, you are my hero. Dang. Oh, yeah. That's expensive. That's dedication. Dedication. Yeah. Yeah. And I tell you, talk about being bound and determined. Yeah. And you know what? It worked. Yeah. It worked. Yeah. I mean, just think about all those. You're there in that area. Yeah. Yeah. He's like, I always have water. He says, not anymore. Really. So, it's pretty amazing if you ask me. That's crazy. Yeah. So let's talk about, I guess, you know, what are your plans for this year? Like, Illinois, I know what you talked about. Well, hunting this year, yes. I got Tyler. Well, obviously, I think we can hear Wisconsin, so I'm going to go sit with my wife. And then, Tyler will be coming up in two weeks, it'll be the youth hunt, that'll be the last year you can hunt youth season. So, we're going to run them down to Illinois. Nice. Hunt there. And then, I'm going to come back and I'm going to probably sneak over to Buffalo County and hunt with Joel a little bit, and he's going to show me Minnesota a little bit, because I plan on gun hunting out there. He said he's got a couple of real old relics that he wants gone, so, and I'm into big old eights. Yeah. Those are kind of my, those are kind of my go-tos, anything, you know, I don't, I don't care about scores, so it don't bother me, but I like old, old, old deer. I just, kind of, and it's a challenge to me. Yeah. You know, like I said, that's six. That was a challenge. You get an old deer, that's smart. They're fun. They're fun now. It's smart, you know. They're a lot. You learn a lot. I learned a lot. Yeah. I learned a lot. You learn about when to and why not to, kind of one of those deals, but, so, I'm going to go hunt out by, I'm going to end up hunting by him for gun season in Minnesota, then I'm going to come back and I'm going to gun hunt, well, I'll go and sit with the family. Okay. I don't even know if I'll gun hunt much, but I, I, I had some good friends that I kind of help manage your property and I know I'll probably end up having to go to a wack, a couple of those, so I'll go take a couple of those out during gun season, and then I'll end up going back down to Illinois for the second gun season, so I'll hunt the second gun down in Illinois, and then, then I got Kansas in December. Nice. So. That's the last one. And that'll be my, yeah. And once I get through December, then ice fishing starts, and then, then I'm good. Awesome. Then I'm good. So I know you're talking like big old aids, and you know, you're talking about ages of deer, so like going into that stuff, like what's, what's your telltale for aging deer? Like what are you, what's your good baseline? Uh, chest, chest and ass. Yeah. Yeah. I was just looking at your text at Yosemite, because I asked you and you're like, chest and butt. Yeah. It's like I know. Yeah. If you can, you know, you can, you can, you can, you can, you can really can't judge by the wrong nose, because I've already had deer that didn't have a wrong nose at all, and they were six and a half year old, okay? But when you got a stock, when you can look at a deer in their square, especially if the butt's bigger than a chest, you're like, oh my word, you know, it's, it's a tank, you know? Okay. Now, here's a little deception, the one that, you know, it's always nice to have somewhat of a history, because I get into this all the time with people about all that deer is only three and a half years old, and I'll be like, dude, that deer is six, you know, five or six, or vice versa, right, you know, you know, like, oh, I shot a six and a half year old deer, and I'm like, oh, congratulations, that's awesome, you know, they'll send me a picture of it, and I'll be like that, and I'll be like, three and a half year old, you know, and I'll be like, all right, and I'll be like, all right, and I'll be like that, but, but, but, but, but, but here's a deal. Don't talk yourself into it. If you killed it, instead you're happy, who cares, right? Yeah. Right? It just doesn't matter. Yeah. You know, we live in Wisconsin where you need to really think long and hard about what your goals are, because most of us don't have 7,000 acres in one block to hunt, we got 40, 80, 120 if you're lucky, if you're lucky, okay, and it ain't the easiest thing to keep all your deer on a 40 acre block, especially if there's only 10 of its acre of wooded, you know, I mean, and I tell people, you got to be realistic here, you know, you got to think outside the box a little bit, but you got to be realistic. Yep. Mm-hmm. So, I mean... It's kind of what that we're at, too. You know, I mean, you just like, I'll tell you, you take what the land gives you. Yeah. Yeah, I have to. You have to. You have to. I mean, you can't, you know, and I mean, if you're, if we all want to shoot big deer, right, I mean, most people, right, I mean, that's your goals, it doesn't always happen. Mm-hmm. And it's okay. Mm-hmm. You know, it's all right. It doesn't, you know, it's just, you know, back to the old thing, shoot what makes you happy. Right, yep. You know? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's just, and like I said, I run into people all the time that, you know, and it's funny because some people they watch too many TV shows or they do too much, they must be laying in bed thinking too much or something. Yeah. Well, there's so many YouTube videos out there now, too. Oh, yeah. Like, that's all I do. Yeah. I don't even watch TV anymore. It's all on shows on YouTube. Interesting. Yeah. I just love it. I mean, you, you do learn a lot, too, especially like watching some of the public guys, just like, just listening to some of the stuff they got to say and hints on where to look and where not to look, because I mean, we only get to see so much in Wisconsin here. Oh, sure, sure. I want to hunt. So you get to watch some of that. You know, it's just more thoughts in the world. Well, and I mean, and it's funny you spring that up because, you know, when you get to travel to states and hunt different states, you really learn a lot. Yeah. You, you know, you, it's amazing what you can learn. And Wisconsin, believe it or not, hunts like five different states, if you ask me. Yeah. I mean, there is some place like you go up north and it's like Canada, you know, northern Wisconsin, just like Canada. And then you can get down on the southwestern part of the state and it could be parts like Kansas or like Iowa or, you know what I mean? I mean, it's just unbelievable how what they have, you know, it's, it's, it's weird, but it's, it's the truth, you know. So it's kind of, it's kind of neat, but you get to learn that, you know, and it's all the people you meet along the way too, because, you know, like I said, we're all hunters. Yeah. We don't have the same camaraderie, you know, but, um, no, so I mean, it's just one of those things where, you know, you get in life, you're going to go out hunting and you're going to learn a lot. You can, like you say, you will watch YouTube's that works. That's great. I mean, yeah. It hasn't worked yet, but well, I feel like I learned a lot. That's all it matters. If you're learning, that's all it matters. Yeah. Like I'm for sure going to Missouri and Minnesota this year. So I'm excited to, you know, get to use some of the knowledge. I feel like I've gained. Are you hunting public? Yeah. Good for you. Just public. Yeah. I went to Minnesota last year, but that didn't end up well. Yeah. Why is that? I just went in a bad time and I scouted one day and I brought, uh, my uncle with me and it just, it didn't work out the best. Really? I'm just going to leave it at that. We'll tell you after. Okay. Yeah. But no, I'm excited. You know, I got to scout there and like even just looking there, it's completely different. Like all the crop fields are top of the mountains or top of the hills, I guess. And it's just like you go there and walk around. It's like where do I even start? Sure. Yeah. You know, but no, I'm excited. It's going to be cool. And you're hunting Missouri? Yeah. What part of Missouri? Probably in northeast thinking I might do like southeast Minnesota. Just stay around. Good ground. Yeah. I've heard good things about northeast Missouri, but. Well, and it's all going to be a wrong hunt and pressure. Yeah. That's true. You know, I mean, it's hard to go and kill deer on public ground that's been trampled. Yeah. Which is hard. Right. I don't care. They can go print down there then. Yeah. I mean, it's just, you know, can it happen? Well, you can get lucky. Uh-huh. But you're going archery, right? Yeah. It's going to take some work, but, you know, that's going to be very hard. It's very, very hard. Yeah. But, and that's okay. Is it's all about the experience? That's it. Killing is just a bonus. Yeah. Right. I just want to go and learn. If it works out, it works out. You know, I'm not totally against, you know, eating take soup. I just struggle there and learn and see the land and, you know, be able to look at deer and watched deer and figure it out for, you know, future years. Well, and hopefully there's just wherever you go. And it's that thing is, is it, you just got to hope that it's not being over-hunted. Yeah. That's all. That's the thing to it. It's like, and I kind of want to get there earlier in the season rather than like, right at the rut, you know, when everyone's going to be there kind of thing. Yeah. You know, so. I don't know. I hate the rut. I hate it. I hate hunting. Right. In the entire area, ours is kind of like just a travel. It completes a circle it feels like. So we get some new deer, but then if we have deer that we're watching, usually they're gone. They're gone. Yeah. But we don't have much acreage at all. So it's like. The best time to kill a big buck is right off the get, right out of the gate. Mm-hmm. That's how I kill my first one. It was three years ago. Three years ago. I think it was still September when I got him. That's perfect. Yeah. And go on Saturday and go kill one. Maybe he'll kill. Maybe he'll kill gimpy. He's going Saturday morning. I'll go Saturday night. He has a wedding. Yeah. Who gets married on opening day? Hm. You better sit on have a union meeting with that individual. You're going to have to. Oh. Two individuals. All I know is that last time we were after a nice buck and it was consistently kind of showing up. But this one is. I had an event to go to. Doing to a concert. And he shot that buck that night. Yep. Also you're going to repeat? I just feel like I have a really good feeling. Oh. I think the cycle is going to repeat. Oh, that would be so romantic. So I'm hoping I get a picture on Saturday night. Oh, that'd be cool. We'll see what happens. I haven't seen him out there in the morning. Granted, you know, Chocam or, you know, we could see the field from the house pretty much. But I haven't seen him. That night though, he won't even be on Chocam or but you'll see him. Over there or over here. It's like. So it's hard to pattern him. Yeah. A little bit. Yeah. I know he's there though. He doesn't go far. Especially with that broken leg. But yeah. He, I'm sure he goes a lot farther than we think. Like there was the buddy that we've seen my buck that I shot the last time that rode over there. Where are the field that when you're swallowing? I'm trying to think a little bit. I'm trying to think a little bit. Or acres away that is. That is the way. It's probably. I don't know. But he had a video, he had a video on Snapchat last night and I was like, I think that's him. Over there. Yeah. But then he started running and I was like, oh, I don't know if he's a broken leg. I don't know if he's a broken leg. He can run like that. But. So yeah. Well. We'll find out. Yeah. We'll find out. Well, thanks for, you know, taking the time to talk to us and we'll do this again. You know. It's a nice place here. Yeah. It's peaceful. Yeah. Awesome. So far. Oh, I enjoyed it. And thanks for inviting me to the races. Yeah. Never done that before. So that was actually pretty cool. Yeah. I'm very happy that you came. Yeah. That was pretty cool. I'll definitely do that again in R.B. Yeah. And I wouldn't mind trying to grant anything. Yeah. It's just, like I said, what our family thing is every year at the same time. Yeah. There's other weekends. Yeah. There's a lot to do. There's a lot to get you to a couple more. Yeah. I mean, it was fun. Yeah. Yeah. Both the is or? Yeah. That's the plan right now. It'd be nice if we can sell our current ones and then get some new ones and build. Just start fresh. And we got some ideas we want to try and throw out some cars. So if we can get some new ones, it'd be awesome. Mm-hmm. If not, then just do what we did again, you know, runner. Yeah. I mean, we're still competitive with them. Yeah. A couple of weeks and something, right? Yeah, right. Right. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Because I mean, like I said, well, you got a lot. There's a lot of cars too. You know, and for you guys to do as good as you did. Yeah. You know? The main thing is like the factory guys that we're competing against, you know, it's just hard. There's not a whole lot of them at all. But there's a select number and I mean, they're just, they're on it every time. And there's like that fine line where it's, you know, the two or three and then it's us. Yeah. Every time. Yeah. Well, we're there. It's just, you got to find a little bit of-- Get to that neck. That little edge. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I could talk for hours and stories and yeah, but I could tell you're tired. I'm tired. Well, it's been, it's been a long, it's been a long day. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, I appreciate it. Yeah. Another episode soon. Yeah. Yeah. We'll be back through this. Yeah. Whatever. I could do this for days. Yep. I mean, I mean, there's just, I've been, like I said, I got so many lifelong experiences. And it's been kind of, like I said, I've been blessed. I really have been. You got some great stories and great knowledge, like even just what I've gained from you, just talking to you for the short time that we have, it's like everything I've learned from you. I mean, I always, and I'm not afraid to share it. You know, I don't care. I don't, like if I can help somebody and you're successful, I don't care. I had one year, a couple of years ago, I had a guy, he called me, he called me because he was struggling and didn't know what he was doing, right? So I don't own this guy from Adam. And he was reluctant to think that I would even help him. And I says, like, well, why won't you think I'd help you? Well, because the seed I have isn't from you. I bought it from another guy and another company and, believe it or not, they're not really helping me much. And I said, well, then how in the world did you get a home of me? You know, he said, well, another one of my friends said to call you because he said you'd help anybody. And I said, well, your friend knows you're pretty good. And he said, because he knows me, he said, most of me pretty good. So anyways, I want to help them plan it. Hmm. That's awesome. Not even my seed. Yeah. And I went over to him, I helped him plan it. And I don't worry, I don't, I don't diss on other companies. I just told him, I said, this is how it's going to do. It's verbatim. I know the reputation. I said, this is how it's going to do. And I said, I explained to you why, you know, and everything. And I did all of that with him. And we planted it and it came in like I said it was going to. And it grew to what I said it was going to. And then it started stalling, like I said, it was going to. And then he's like, how do you know all this stuff? I said, because I just know, I know, I know my competitors, I know kind of what they're doing. Right. And I said, let's, you know, let's, you know, and in fact, if I remember right, we planted some of our that took some with him, put some like side by side. And he said, and I remember it wasn't even, like it wasn't even fair, like close, you know. And he said, you know, he said, well, I'm just learning and I said, well, you learn a lot to share. He goes, oh my gosh, I guess. And I mean, and that's good. And he's so customer. Yeah. And he comes every year and he buys piles. That's awesome. That's cool. You're right, most of them are most, most of them. And I mean, you're going to always, you know, I got a better deal or iPhone, whatever. I don't care. I don't care. I told you, I don't, do I want you to buy your stuff? Yeah, if you don't, I'm not mad at you know, you got to work around your budget or you got to work around your convenience or you got to work around your shipping. I get it. I respect it. I don't, I said shipping is, kill this this year. Yeah. I don't believe it. It killed us. Yeah. It was bad. Yeah. And what do you do? Yeah. Well, we're not the only ones, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. It's true. I believe it. It killed us. Yeah. It was bad. And what do you do? I guess 12 grand then was like $100,000 now. No, I would. I would believe that. Yeah. That's ridiculous. I would. I would. It's just I just can't even fathom what how much stuff is right now. I know it was actually, it was a podcast about buying, he was buying world class deer or whatever. And he offered the guy like 12 grand to buy it. He was doing like the calculation so it would be 100 grand for whatever it was. It was like second or third world record for, I think it was typical from summer. It was like Ohio buck or something. Really? Back in the day. Yeah. But yeah. So they did like the calculation. I was like, that's crazy. Yeah. I don't. Well, I mean, where does $100 go? Not far. Not very far. But tank of gas and yeah, yeah. Case of soda or something. I mean, you go the goods, anything halfway decent. It's a scene out. Yeah. Pretty much. It just is. Yeah. You know, it's just, I don't know. I don't know. I know you could spend it. Party bucks. Yeah. Well, and you know, one thing that's kind of cool is, you know, we're just seasonal. So I mean, you know, you know, and I get it. You know, I ain't like we're, you know, like I said, we're just about ready to shut down for the year. Mm hmm. You know, I mean, I, I still shipped some seed last week yet. So guys. No, it's more your southern states. Yeah. Yeah. Just trying to finish holes up probably. Yeah. Which makes sense. Yeah. But it's just, I mean, it's hunting season now. So now people will be calling and eat feed or, you know, or it's a more mineral. You know, that'll still be coming, you know, but it's, it's going to die now. Now it's time to hunt. You do good this year. When everything? Um, this is the first year as long as I've owned the business that I have, like, ran out of seed. Really? A lot of stuff I ran out of. Wow. I have never ran out. I've always had left over for me for next year, the plan. Yeah. And I ain't gonna. Really? Yeah, I couldn't believe it. It is. That is. Yeah. But I have some pretty big. Consumers. Yeah. Yeah, I have some. Pretty big customers that buy. A lot. Yeah. I believe it. Yeah. I mean, you told me about some of them. Yeah. Yeah. When you sit there and you buy 50 acres plus out of crack. You know. It's a lot. Yeah. That's, that adds up pretty quickly. Yeah. You know, but. Customers happy with it and he loves it and comes back every year. Right. You know, started out with one acre and then from one acre went to like five and then went to 10, then it was up to 20. Then it went to 30. And then now it's over 50. Wow. And the guy is killing 200's. I believe it. That's impressive. You know, it's, I guess it's a good problem, right? Right. It's a good problem. But is he pretty well known? Yep. I feel like I probably know the name. Yep. Yeah. Yeah, I don't, I don't, I'll tell you later. Yeah. Got it out. Yeah. Well, nice. We kind of get a closing, but anyway. Round two coming up. There we go. Obviously appreciate your time. Oh, yeah. Everyone for listening. If you made it this far. Still listening. I guess you had any questions for dog that we could ask next time. Yeah. Let us know. It's all good. Let us know in the comments. You know, go on the socials, leave a comment. You know, make sure to like, subscribe, follow, do whatever is appropriate. So, yeah. Doug, Barney Bucksy. Appreciate you. Thank you very much. Thanks for everything. Thank you for having me. It's actually kind of fun. I enjoy this. Well, we got to. Like the round table. We gotta get more guys though. Yeah. Well, we're supposed to have one more. Our main character. Craig. You met Craig. Yeah. Yes. He's a big talker. Where the heck is he? Yeah. [music]