(upbeat music) - You guys know what that music is. What my young social media team calls my boomer music. He says it, you know, that's such a boomer music. But anyway, it means it's time for the Don Lemon Show. And it's time for actually, whoops. I think it's actually a lemon live at five as you can hear the music playing again. I like it so much that I'm gonna play it twice. So thank you for joining us today. I really appreciate it. Okay, so that was me listening to watching myself on YouTube. So here's the thing, usually, you know, when you declare yourself to be a black Nazi, usually that is like a career ender, right, in American politics. That's what usually happens in American politics. But look, you never know what's happening now. The entire senior staff, though, working for this Republican, Mark Robinson, remember we told you about him in North Carolina? The guy who said he was a black Nazi's running for governor? Well, his entire senior team has quit. After that scene and report revealed that these alleged postings on a porn website message board, as campaign manager, the deputy campaign manager, the finance director, and the senior advisor all stepped down over the weekend. Campaign confirming in a statement to US, to us media, or US media, I'm not sure what that means. So he is, but three staffers left. One of them is his bodyguard. We also have some rough new polling for the vice president, Kamala Harris. We told you about this. The folks on the Republican side, on Donald Trump side, it said, hey, to listen, when all of this hoopla goes down, and people get used to her being the candidate after Joe Biden, the president dropped out after the convention that it will settle back down. And perhaps even the polling would even go to back where it was when Joe Biden was candidate. And it appears from at least one poll that could be happening. It could be an outlier, but things seem to be settling. There's also a pleasant surprise, though, for the vice president out of Nebraska that we'll tell you about. So we have one great person here, someone else is gonna join us later to discuss, and that's Whitley Yates. Whitley is a Republican strategist, a journalist and a contributor to MSNBC, a political and the host of other publications. I'm so happy that you could be, or how are you doing, Whitley? - I'm great. I'm excited to be here. - I know. You're gonna be on with me. We're gonna get in trouble. I mean, you know. - I hope we don't get into trouble. But I do think we need to, you know, talk facts over feelings. - I do, I love that. I love that kind of conversation. So we're happy that you're here. So if it's all right, I wanna start with the reason that I asked you to join this evening, because I was on social and I saw this clip of you, right? I watched, it was your appearance on Jonathan Show. My friend Jonathan K. Parks, MSNBC show over the weekend. And I thought you offered some brilliant commentary. I want the audience to pay attention and then you and I will discuss. Here it is. - Okay. At his rally in North Carolina today without Mark Robinson, and what he had to say about Oprah? - Did you see her on Oprah? That's not gonna be, that's not gonna be president. Oprah didn't know what the hell to do. Oprah was like embarrassed. She went to hide under the table. But she's a professional and she was able to sort of disguise it. No, she wanted to go right under the table. - Whitley, why does Donald Trump lie like that? I mean, everybody knows, come on. - I think that there were times during that interview where it looked like Oprah was trying to figure out where VP Harris was going. And I think when we're looking at this circumspectly, when we're talking about battleground states and talking to working everyday Americans, utilizing a billionaire who's not dealing with the cost of inflation, with stagnant wages, with stagnant industries, is really just out of touch. And I think that's what he really meant to say, is that hiding behind Hollywood, as opposed to really just talking about the policies of your administration, may not be working specifically in battleground states. - That is literally Harris Whitley, who is a positive, positive, positive. Not Whitley. - Yes, Don. I know what you're gonna find. - No, obviously, that's not what he really meant to say. If he really meant to say it, why didn't he say it? You're, I think you're interpolating. - You think I'm interpolating? - I think you're interpreting what he, because he said Oprah was embarrassed or whatever. He never said like, Oprah's not relatable. And you're saying that, you know, being on stage with a billionaire is whatever. So anyway, go on. - No, I do. So here, this is what I said. I agreed with him. There were cringe moments where Oprah's face was, you could tell she was just like, what's happening? Land this plane. What is it saying when there was word salad moments, specifically when the VP Harris was like, if you wanna build my house, I'm gonna shoot you. And I was like, what did she just say? Then she cackled and then Oprah was like, like it was like, a moment was like, wait, did you just say what I think you just said? Now mind you, this is the same person who said that she wants the government to come in your house and make sure you're utilizing your weapons, right? It's talking about shooting someone that's coming into hers. And so I do think that there were times in that interview where Oprah was like, okay, girl, land this plane. It was getting a little word, salad-y. But I think the bigger picture for Americans and to paint this in the perspective of politics today, you do have a billionaire running for office. And so it is incumbent upon him, Donald Trump to speak directly to the people as much as he can so that they know that he understands what they're going through and that. - Okay, all right, point-by-point. You said that she said that she wants the government to go on your house to make sure that you're using your weapons correctly. I had never heard her say that she wants some sensible gun legislation, but she is a gun owner and she believes in the Second Amendment. That's all I've ever heard from her regarding that. - And as you can fact check me, there is a clip where she talks about the government coming into your home and making sure that she believes that it's okay for the government to come in your home and make sure that you're utilizing your firearms correctly. And she feels like that's their job in responsibility. - But isn't that for the safety of people in the home? Like, you know, if you have kids and what's wrong with that? - Anytime the government- - Anytime as a black woman in America, any time the government is coming in my home to do anything, I'm going to be sidying them and I'm going to be tall and alarmed because a lot of times we don't have the luxury of utilizing things like the Castle Doctrine and other policies that would, for all intensive purposes, benefit gun owners that look like me and that look like you. And so just her stance, when it comes to the second amendment seems a little flip floppy, but that is very common with our campaign, to be quite honest. - Okay, so you said that Oprah's a billionaire that's not relatable, right? And listen, I even question- - I said that Oprah's not relatable. - You said that she's relatable, tell me what you said. - She's out of touch and she shouldn't hide behind Hollywood and billionaires specifically in Michigan, which you didn't play this part, but it's specifically in Michigan where the- - We're going to play it, we'll play it. I'm going to continue- - So, and I say that to say you're in Michigan, you're in a state that has a stagnant auto industry. A lot of times because some of the policies predicated when it comes to vehicles and when it comes to the oil and gas policies of this current administration. And so you have people that are dealing with everyday things, everyday issues. What would that town hall forum, where is the forum, what would that forum have looked like? Had she had a president or member of the UAW moderating it, just an everyday American dealing with these issues and actually fielding real questions from the audience. As opposed to kind of what Jonathan said, like the nostalgia of, I felt like I was watching Oprah from back in the 90s. Yes, that's exactly what you were supposed to have. - But don't you think that was smart for her to do that? I mean, if you actually, I think it's really smart for her to lean into someone who is very popular. I mean, Donald Trump is a billionaire speaking of relatable. You think Donald Trump is more relatable than Oprah Winfrey, a black woman, as you know, you don't need black history lesson. But I mean, I am older than you. So I know Oprah's entire history and grew up with her and watched the very show, the show from the very beginning. So I know that she's relatable to all women and not just, Oprah's just not relatable to black women. She's relatable to all women, especially white women, maybe even more so hustlers around the world, around the country. Specifically white women, but once again, look at the demographics of Michigan. Look at the people who are undecided in this battleground state and what are their top issues? And I can tell you, it's not having the soldier from the 90s, from a talk show host. Because this is, in my opinion, what the problem is. - But that was, but not listen, hold on, hold on. For Jonathan to say something, that's not. I mean, you're saying what Jonathan Capehart says. And I love Jonathan, I'm not. There's no shooting. - Well, I was just watching it. - Because I was watching it. - But that was, I was watching it, but I'm just careful because you know, your screen will like do fireworks and thumbs up if you don't have care. But as I was watching it, the woman whose daughter died from, because she needed to have a DNC and couldn't do it, her daughter died from that. Talking about the reason that some black men now, more than before, are supporting Donald Trump. Issues as it relates to inflation and prices. There were people there who asked questions. It wasn't just about the people who were in Michigan. It was a nationwide town hall. Remember there's a virtual audience of people everywhere. By the way, let me just say Gretchen Barton joins us. Gretchen is the founder of Worthy Strategy Group LLC. She's a specialist in political strategy and a polling analyst and a polling analysis. So welcome to the show. So go on Whitley, you heard what I said. - Yeah, so what you're saying is that she has broad appeal. - Absolutely, this was a very strategic choice that reminded me of like a book tour you would, I would say. And so I think what they're attempting to do is utilize like the appeal of Oprah and these celebrities, right? To transition that into appeal for Harris. And what you're saying is that it's smart. And this is what I'm saying. - No, I'm wondering if it's smart. I think it's maybe, look, if they're playing their cards, right, but I question leading into celebrity as well, if that would turn people off or if it would bring people in. - It depends on if you value optics or impact and it depends on symbolism versus substance. And so right now in this campaign, we've had comillomania since they ousted Joe Biden and replaced him with her. And so we have kind of been, you know, in this comillomania bubble. And so with each and every move, very, very strategic on her part to continue to utilize people that have the type of following. You know, as the woman on MSNBC said, she's been able to garner audiences of 21 million. The question you have to ask is do you want that level of performance and proximity in our politics? And I think what we've seen time and time again for decades is sometimes it's level of performance, but then we get nothing in our policies. Specifically in groups like underrepresented minorities in the black community. - Okay, Gretchen, let me ask you, how is this different from Donald Trump? Uh-oh, Gretchen's gone. I think, did we lose Gretchen? Oh, sorry, we lost it for a second. How is this different Gretchen? Let's make sure. Do you see Gretchen there? 'Cause no, okay. Then Whitley, how is this different? All right, Gretchen. - Hi, how are you? - Donald Trump calling up Kid Rock on stage or Bryce or whatever, the influencer or any of those guys to come up on stage and say, "Hey, look at this person who loves me. "Look at this person who loves me." How is that any different than having Oprah like one of the biggest and most powerful stars in the world? - Well, if I may, if I may, and Whitley, I totally hear you. I think the difference is that people really like Oprah across the aisle, across the board. I mean, she's one of the most popular people in America, along with Michelle Obama. I think that what she did, Kamala Harris and having that town hall was incredibly important. And look, this is an unusual election. We had a big, what I like to call switcheroo with Kamala Harris coming to the top of the ticket in an accelerated format. There's all the things that we would like to see her do in the time that is there. It's just not possible. She's not gonna be able to do all the things that we want, right? And we know from movable voters, the folks that she needs to get, she is short up the base. She has secured the ticket. She needs to have FaceTime with them. I think that the Oprah interview, the town hall, whatever we call it, was a really excellent format for her to get that exposure with voters. But of course, I think Whitley, you were bringing up black men, she needs to do more. There's some huge opportunities to get into the community, but she thrives in those settings that I think that she's gonna do really well. - Okay, so Whitley, I'm gonna, let's play, continue on with Whitley's interview that caught my eye this weekend, and then we'll continue to discuss who it is. - That is literally rich, Whitley. - Thank you, I mean, it's wealthy. - It's wealthy, it's wealthy, it's wealthy. - Rich one of my life. - A couple of things here. So Oprah is one of the only people who has had been able to have an audience of 20 million people for over many, many years. So I mean, she does, she is a professional here and she does have an audience and she knows how to coordinate, or how to appeal to wide audiences. The second thing is everyone, I'm really tired of all the surrogates and Donald Trump and the JD Vians all saying this, that's not what the candidates are saying, that is not what they're doing. They're insulting people personally, they're being mean, they're being really vindictive, they're not sticking to the issues and if they were sticking to the issues and saying what you think they mean to say, we've been a much different race, but they can't control themselves and they just need to be mean and vindictive and that's not winning them the independent voters. - Well, I definitely don't need a history lesson on Oprah who's black history, because I'm very familiar with all that she has done, but what I'm saying is when you're talking to people specifically in a state where the average salary is $49,000, bringing the billionaire up on stage is going to present out of touch, specifically for working class Americans and let me explain why, is because the issues that they're talking about does not impact her the same. As opposed to having working class people, maybe engaging with her, maybe a town hall forum, she has been utilizing celebrities to promote her campaign as opposed to utilizing working class people or utilizing them to speak to working class people and there is a disconnect. - No, I mean, okay, so Whitley, I would say, all right, I understand what you're saying, if Donald Trump wasn't a billionaire flying into these places on his own plane with his name on it and he didn't live and literally lives above the clouds in New York City and owns one of the most expensive properties in Florida, I don't know about relatability and by the way, we have a poll up for relatability and it says in our thing, who is the most relatable? I can't see though, is it Oprah or Donald Trump? These are our folks and they are very, they will get you in these comments. 97%, 97% in this poll says that Oprah is by far more relatable than Donald Trump. - Right, but you see what we're doing here, we're juxtapositioning the interviewer and the candidate as opposed to the candidate and the candidate and that-- - Well, that's the point, Whitley, he's-- - That is the poll. - Interviewer is the actual candidate. - Hold on, hold on, let's go back though, because when I say you're hiding behind, right now we're talking about Oprah versus Donald Trump as opposed to Oprah versus Kamala and the reason that we're having that conversation is 'cause once again, she's utilizing these people in these big names. What we should be talking about is what Kamala said or more importantly what she didn't say in the town hall, but instead it's Trump versus Oprah. Trump has to, as a billionaire, as I stated before, he has to be able to speak to the American people directly to the constituents. What Kamala has to do is utilize people to speak for her, to allow Oprah's relatability to somehow transcend her own unrelatability. - No, I think-- - I hear, if I can speak to this, if I may, I have data on this and I think that this is gonna be useful here. One of the things that we're tracking in our work is the kind of leader Americans are looking for. We're looking for everybody from an innovator, someone who has a vision for the country, who can get things done, who challenges, who breaks rules and when needed, is fundamentally American. Some of the metrics that we're testing, consistently over time, compassionate, cares about you, nurturing, kind, looks out for the little guy. And what I wanna tell you is in recent data that we got back just after the debate, Kamala Harris has advanced 10 points up, Donald Trump, nine points down on every factor of cares about you. The American people are getting the picture that Donald Trump doesn't care about them or at least they're getting the impression. The data is showing us that there is-- - We're also showing you Gretchen. - What's that, the polls? - The polls are not the only factor. - No, but look at this as a whole, right? If everything that you're saying is emphatically true and the American people are not relating to this man, then she would be up 10, 15, 20 points from someone who has been consistently in the media, consistently barrage with lawsuits, consistently entangled in all types of scandals and all of these things. Why isn't she doing better? And that's what you have to ask yourself. If your data in the data-driven decisions that the campaigns are making is accurate, why isn't Kamala performing better? That's the problem here. And I think we all kind of know and we can speak to what it is. When you go back and when you look at her previous election cycles, her previous races, like back in 2020, they weren't America. America was not connecting with her. Right now, because we went from an F-minus candidate to her, every group just looks and feels better because she can string together with sentence because she does know where she is. - Are you talking about Donald Trump? An F-minus candidate? - You know who I'm talking, we're talking about Shady Acres-Biden. That is exactly who it is. He's not an F-minus candidate. I mean, he was actually doing pretty well in the polls. Yeah, that's why he's not an F-minus candidate. - What does he do when we look at the economy? - Yeah, he's a look at the economy. He's doing very well for America. The economy is much better than it was under Donald Trump. Job mark is much better than it was under Donald Trump. You can acquire our prices, inflation is coming down. - Coming down from being a 40-year-old. - Right, it's coming down because Donald Trump bucked up the economy during COVID. That's why we were in the problem. - Every situation, we're in the best economy before COVID and we had a- - Without the best economy. You know what, I'm gonna tell you, you need to get- - For a lot of people, we have the lowest unemployment. - Joe Biden had the lowest unemployment. - Now he has the lowest unemployment. - Right now, because he doesn't it now. - You can't get people back to work now. - Thank you, giving him his due. He's got the lowest unemployment. He's with the black people. - Come on, Donald Trump. - It's fudge, it's fudge if it's Joe Biden, but it's not fudge if it's Donald Trump. Is that what you're saying? - It's all the way around and we have to be able to trust the government no matter who is in a position of power to do what's right. - So who do you trust that has the lowest unemployment numbers in history? Joe Biden or Donald Trump? - This is what I'm saying right now, in America. You guys are telling us it have been telling us- - And it has the lowest unemployment- - I don't know what the- - Donald Trump or Joe Biden? - I don't know what the unemployment job numbers are right now. So I cannot speak to that and I don't want to say it. - Okay, as of right now, Joe Biden has the lowest unemployment numbers for African Americans in history. And is the lowest unemployment lower than under Donald Trump. - Do you want to know why I believe that to be true? Because- - Because you support Donald Trump, that's why you don't believe it to be true. - No, I believe it's not true because the people that I know are over-employed, they have two and three jobs that they are working right now to make ends meet. - So there are jobs available for America again? - Hold on, hold on. - There are so many jobs available that they can have two or three jobs. - Let me reclaim my time. One of the problems in the disconnect that I believe is happening specifically in America is that people keep telling us that the economy is so great and a lot of people are out here struggling. So there's a disconnect between the data that you guys are purporting and what we are feeling in everyday citizens. - No, but listen, context is everything. - Wait, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. - Hold on, both of you, let me just say this. Because context is everything. And also we want to be precise with our words. I want to say that the economy is great. We have the best economy out of any developed nation. The economy is great if you look at what happened under Donald Trump. That's what people are saying. If you look at the economy we had during COVID and under Trump, no one is denying that people are struggling. People are struggling, but they're doing better now than they were then. - But COVID was unprecedented. Let's look over the past decade. - Two things can be, COVID can be unprecedented and Donald Trump can also have handled it poorly and he could have handled it better. And that way Joe Biden would not have inherited such a terrible economy. - But what you're saying is, in two and a half years Trump was able to do all of this dereliction to America and it wasn't the 12 years of Democrats being in the White House that led to that. - The 12 years of Democrats being in the White House that led to, to what? - You guys have been in the White House for a few years. For Trump it was Obama that was in the White House for eight years and there was Trump who was four years. - Joe Biden now. - Then you don't count, Donald Trump did nothing. - That's why I'm saying two and a half years that Trump was in the White House. When have you prior to COVID? 'Cause we're counting these years and he was in the White and you're saying that he did so much dereliction to America in the two and a half years prior to when COVID started or three years prior to when COVID started in his administration that was worse than the eight years of Obama and four years prior. - Yeah, because if you look at the economy-- - No, you're gonna say, I'm gonna try. - Did you see the economy that he inherited from Barack Obama, he inherited a great economy and he took it into the tank. And so you cannot, you cannot blame Obama. - No, no, no, no, Obama, Obama, Obama, by all means. You have sex too, you're always doing that. - When I was talking about the Obama fallacy, I don't want to get into it. - The fallacy, if you look at the economy-- - Right, and we need to talk-- - Trump learns to speak for themselves. - The economy was better under Barack Obama than it was under Donald Trump. - There was-- - The economy into the tank. Joe Biden had to take us out. Remember, we were in a recession. We were in a hole when Obama took over. And guess what? - I was there. - The black man fixed it. And he's like, here you go, he fixed it. And then, here comes the orange man, takes it into the tank, gives tax cuts to his wealthy friends. And then, all of a sudden, COVID, and he's like, oh, it's going to go away. You can put life inside the body, or whatever. And then, people are saying, oh, well, the groceries on the shelves right now are so expensive. Do you remember when we didn't have groceries on the shelves? Who did that? - We didn't have groceries on the shelves 'cause we weren't able to be producers in America and we relied on other countries to get these-- - We didn't have groceries on the shelves because Donald Trump did not take the pandemic seriously. And he said that it was going to go away and instead of making conditions for a worldwide pandemic, he fixed up the pandemic, he said it's gonna go away. - There's my thought, I can't think it's gonna go on. - Thank you, Donald. - Go on. I really appreciate that. - I just have to check in real time because-- - And you should have to at least let me finish so that you can protect me finish. So what I'm saying is when he said make America great again-- - Or Gretchen, that's all a thing. - I'm just saying, I just say when we're done things. - Of course you are, that's the point. I think that's why you're here. So what we have to do is look at what he said. He said we want to make America great again. When the pandemic hit and we relied on other nations to get essential things into this country, we realized that we weren't producing at a rate that we should have to be able to sustain the people that live here. Like if America only had to eat and live off of everything that we produce here, would we be able to do it? And I think we all know the answer to that post-pandemic. - The answer is yes. And I mean, look at how we're producing oil, that we're producing more oil, natural gas or whatever, than any time in history. - Okay, we need to be because gas prices are so high and I was after-- - No, they're not, they're lower now, they're lower, they're almost back to what-- - Almost, almost doesn't mean-- - Too many, but it's still there. - They're still high. - They're higher than what they were and people are feeling that impact. And when we talk about a recession in Alabama, and we talk about policies that were predicated during that recession-- - The thing Gretchen's frozen-- - The policies when it comes to the housing industry in particular and how we merged some organizations, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and how those organizations didn't allow for private equity to come into the housing industry. And then people who were losing their homes were able to stay in their homes, but not able to own their homes. And then when they were able to get the money to own their homes, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac wouldn't sell them their homes back. And so now we're in a case in a situation where we have a housing shortage as comma layers has talked about, wanting to have three million new homes, we're in a place where we have a housing shortage because most of the owners of the mortgage are these private equity firms that are not only just owning homes, they're also owning mobile homes now. And so we are in some of these situations that have been created and predicated off the backs of the American people based upon the policies that happen either during a recession and or during COVID. And so we have to then reel from all of these things that have happened and pick up the pieces Americans that is have to pick up the pieces and try to figure out how our life is. - I don't, I don't disagree with that. But in order to do that, we have to live in a shared state of reality in facts. Okay, and so it's facts when it's Trump. That's what I know get, it's facts when it's Trump, but it's not facts when it is a Democrat, whether it's Joe Biden or Barack Obama, you call it a fallacy. But when the news appears to be good for Donald Trump, you call it facts, right? And then you call it fallacy for, by the way, U.S. gas prices set to fall under $3 a gallon as election years coming out of a recession, right. Weekly, just so you know, I'm just gonna read this before Greta and I think you need to get in here. This is just gas headlines. Gas prices down 63% this year and 63 down 63 cents in Massachusetts. Rhode Island, gas prices continue to take down. Rhode Island, Massachusetts, gas prices fall 4 cents by AAA's in gas prices take a steep fall across the Delaware Valley. Gas prices continue to drop. - Yeah, I'm really sure. Greta has a great data about election year politics and how these things usually trend and have patterns. But that does not control the gas prices. Donald Trump, anything to go ahead and do. - Yeah, I think it's true though. Look, the thing that really matters, right? Money and freedom in this election, right? Women want freedom over their bodies and people want to be able to pay for stuff. We know that with the Biden-Harris administration, the economy has gotten better. It is not perfect for everybody. And this has been consistent over the past 8, 12 years that we've been studying this. Americans across the board, they have never been the case that everyone is okay. It has never been the case. But what we're looking at right now, moving forward, is an opportunity economy. And a lot of the things that have been done by the Biden-Harris administration have made things demonstrably better. We are on an upwards trajectory. It has not reached everybody. But the impact, for example, of the infrastructure bill has been huge. The CHIPS Act has been huge. The Republicans, one second, so sorry. - The CHIPS in science act. - Let her speak. We have spoken for a long time. And I'll let you get an promise, let Gretchen talk. - The thing is, Americans are doing better than they were four years ago. Now, Republicans always hold the advantage on the economy. It's the brand thing, just in the same way that we associate like rainbows and bunnies with Democrats. We associate meat and potatoes with Republicans. This is a brand association thing. The thing that matters at this point right now is that Kamala Harris tells a story about the economy that makes sense to the American people. And the story that makes sense is one about economy, about clearing away barriers to opportunities, connecting with them deeply this day, and continuing the momentum of the Biden-Harris administration. Furthermore, Americans are picking up on this, our data shows consistently that while there is still an advantage to Trump in terms of the economy, in terms of perceptions of the economy, that advantage is decreasing and decreasing and decreasing. And I know you mentioned earlier, Whitley, and it's a very good question. Why is it not showing up in the polls? I'm not gonna lie. Kamala Harris' performance at the debate was incredible. She was dominant, she was strong, she was tough, she was articulate, she was such a clear communicator, which is everyone's looking for from her. She was phenomenal in so many different ways. And she addressed the issues that matter to Americans most. I was hoping to see her 15 points up across that it would just be not be a question. But you have to look back at like 2016, right? Do you remember how everybody said that Hillary Clinton was gonna win and then Trump pulled it out somehow, somehow? Well, if we were to go back in time to 2016, you could have said, why isn't Trump doing better, right? We have to look at other indicators that aren't always apparent in the polls. And everything that I'm looking at shows that she is moving on every single variable that accounts by leaps and bounds steadily, steadily up, up, up, and Donald Trump is going down, down, down. Right now, she is considered by movable voters to be stronger, to be a stronger person, a stronger leader than Donald Trump. And that is going to win her the election. - Okay, this is, since we got to polling, okay? Let's talk about that, 'cause I was gonna do more policies. Well, real quick, before we get to polling, let's do, let's do polling, let's do polling. Because we're there, and I know Gretchen, you've got a, you're very busy. I believe there's new polling from MSNBC. We have Steve Kornacke, I believe, talking on MSNBC about some polling, here it is. - Going on in these polls, break it down for us. This is a snapshot, but what's the story it's telling? - Yeah, let's take a look inside of what you see here. You just showed it, 49, 44, overall, national, that's the number from our new poll here. Now, one component of this is a gender gap, and we're familiar with gender gaps. It's been a feature of American politics really since 1980, but this, if anything like this, actually is what plays out in election day, it would kind of be off the charts as far as gender gaps go. Look at this, among men, Trump is leading Harris by 12 points, 52 to 40 among women. Harris, look at the margin she's running up there right now in our poll, 21 points for Harris among women, that would be a gender gap of 33 points, a 33 point difference there. And again, we saw in 2020 and in 2016, historically high gender gaps, talking about 20 points, low 20s. If you were ever to get anywhere near this, again, that would be off the charts. Now, it's one poll here, and we'll see, you know, if this is something you see continuously through now in the election day, but certainly a gender gap is a feature of this. Now, take a look by race. You see, Trump leading among white voters by nine points, but I think this is the most interesting finding here among black voters. Harris leading in our poll, 85 to 7%. That's significant because in previous polling, among black voters, Trump had been a little bit better on it. - And Steve, can we talk about favorability now? - There we go. So, you know, with the favorability, her numbers are up, his numbers are... She's more favorable, she's not favorable. But here's the thing, all right, because national polls don't win presidential elections, right? That's what wins presidential election or battleground states, right? And winning in the right states. So here's the thing that has some Democrats worried. According to the latest New York Times, Sienna College poll of likely voters conducted between September 17th and September 21st, Trump is leading the vice president in the Sun Belt states of Georgia, Arizona, and North Carolina. So there it is in Arizona, Trump 50, Kamala Harris 45. In Georgia, Trump 49, Kamala Harris 45. In North Carolina, Trump 49, Harris 47. That latest Georgia poll conducted on August, was conducted on August 9th and 14 showed the pair tied at 47% each. Now Trump leads 49 to 45. Arizona, meanwhile, Harris is trailing 45 to 50%. It flipped from August when 49% opted for Harris over Trump. North Carolina, Trump held it in 2020, has similarly swung to a slight Trump lead with the former president gaining three points to lead Harris 49 to 47. So Gretchen, what do you make of those numbers? Because Whitley said, what about the polls? Do you buy those numbers? - Sure, you know what, I buy it, but there's context. One of the things that we're always looking for, there's two big things, right? There's momentum, there's directionality. Are we moving up? Is there ceiling to Kamala Harris's numbers? Is there ceiling to Donald Trump's numbers? And then beyond that, right? We know that polls are always a snapshot. There's other bits that we're looking at, and that's one of the reasons why we're looking at associations of ideal leadership. Because we have done 13 studies to date that shows that these are the things that win people the presidency. And we have seen consistently, that while the polls are doing this, those numbers on the variables of leadership that Americans are looking for, what they're looking for in a president, are going up, up, up, up, up, up, up, up, up, in all of the swings. We're only pulling in the swings right now, and that's what we're seeing. - Okay. - So I'm not worried. - Do you think I believe, and look, I'm not a pollster, this is Don Lemon speaking, okay? And the person who, remember Gretchen, I told you, who predicted a Trump win in 2016, right? And sort of have a feel for these things because I have been doing it so long, and I'm not a political reporter. I just get out and talk to the people. I think that there are hidden Trump votes, right? I think there are hidden Trump votes among black men, and I know that, you know, Steve Bernanke just said 85%. I mean, what it's like, usually, well, not usually, but it has been up to 94%, right? And for Barack Obama, et cetera. I think there is even among women, but I do think that there's a hidden vote among Republican women who actually believe in reproductive rights. They're not gonna tell their husbands, they're not gonna tell their people, right? They're gonna go in and vote for Kamala Harris. But I think there's also a hidden college vote for Donald Trump as well. And so I think all of these things are showing up, I'm not sure if these people show up in the polls. And so, Whitley, I want you to speak to that. Do you agree with me on that? And do you think that, well, Kamala Harris is gonna win the black woman vote? It's just not, it's just not in question. - What? Yeah, of course. Whitley, go ahead. And what do you make of the polls that I just read? - So kind of going back to like what Gretchen is saying that people claim that they want. I think a lot of times what dictates our priorities is where we are in our lives, right? And so I've never, and I'm someone who's worked in Republican politics in multiple states, specifically in engaging in minority communities. And I've never seen it the way that it is now. I've never seen this level of support for a Republican candidate, specifically in the black community. Obviously with a black woman, candidate, black Asian India, I don't wanna, her intersectionality of her identity, whatever that is, with a candidate of color. - What do you mean, whatever that is? - I'm just saying, I don't, whatever, she identifies. - But you know, she's black and Indian, right? - Black, Indian, Asian, Jamaican, all the things. So what I'm saying, what I'm seeing though, is I've never seen African Americans that are really, what is as vocal as they bid. It's actually a little bit alarming as someone who does coalition work in coalition building. And so I find it interesting. You say, you know, it's factfulness Republican, and it's fallacy when it's Democrat. But when you talk about some of the things that we've seen with the Democratic party here, when it comes to democracy, when it comes to the switcheroo as she's so delicately put it, which is really just ousting your candidate because he did a bad job and you don't think that he can win, and you need someone that is a winner. And putting that person in place, America has to get to know who she is and what type of leader she will be. So she will either be a leader that parents and mocks the exact same things as Joe Biden has done for America. And if people like that, then they will vote for her. Or she has to cultivate and create her own lane. - Can she do both of those? - I think it would be hard when she takes credit for the positives of the administration, but then leaves out some of the negative-- - Why is it hard asking a question about anything? - No, no, no, I'm saying. - No, we're role-playing, I'll tell you. Ask me a question, I'm Kamala Harris and you are. - But no, but you just fell off a coconut tree, so you're not-- (laughs) - I did it. - In a middle class family. - I'm not a Democrat or a Republican. But I think-- - Tell me about the economy. I grew up in the middle class. - Probably economy, I'm sorry, say again? - No, but this is, I wanna finish this thought really quickly. - Yeah. - And so she has to basically create a brand that I would say wasn't there because I don't necessarily believe she was shining in the administration prior to Biden not being in the race, shining. As in, she was fairly silent and we did not see much-- - That's true. - With the detriment to her in case something like this happened-- - But back with every vice president, you know, that's their thing, that just take a back seat to the person in charge. I mean, look at how much did you hear from Mike Pence? - However, when given a task, a specific task, I think it's really important that they perform on that task. - Yeah. - And I'm not even gonna go into that right now 'cause we may talk about that a little bit later, but just in the grand scheme. So when she was announced, once again, when she was rolled out, it was all of this calamity around Kamala. And it was this big mushroom cloud and people were really, really excited and they were waiting to hear her vision for America. And so she came out building these coalitions usually around people of color, women, men, all of these different identifying factors. So she built these coalitions and then the coalitions began to speak for the campaign and galvanize that grassroots support. So she started at this grassroots level to build these coalitions. Then when people began to ask more questions, it seemed as though she was more of a single issue president and that single issue was reproductive rights. Everything pivoted back to freedom, reproductive rights, free economy, you know, this is really about democracy, right? Protecting democracy, but freedom and reproductive rights. Then the polling began to come out about immigration, about the border, about the economy. And we didn't get actual policies on her website until the day before the debate. So a day before the debate, boom, she gets an issues page on her website. Now, at this point, she had already been in the race almost. - Okay, Whitley, we ain't got all day now. Hurry up. - 30 or 40 days, but people wanted to know what she believed because she was backtracking on things that she had said previously, which is once again, very familiar for her campaign to go back and forth. So she drops the issues on her website. She hasn't necessarily created a brand for herself. And now you're starting to see people in the swing state say, well, I don't know if this is enough. You couple that with leading with the cast of scandal productive rights to her, Oprah. - All right, all right, all right, all right. - And you're saying to me, what you're saying to me is that Kamala Harris is a politician. And Kamala Harris is leaning into what is going to get her to win. Doesn't Donald Trump do that? Donald Trump changed his stance on women's reproductive rights three times in two days. Donald Trump is, Donald Trump, okay. Here's what I'm saying. Let me just, Gretchen Sisley, I'm thanking Gretchen. Okay, just be patient. 'Cause everyone is saying, I need to know what Kamala Harris stands for. I need to know what, and she's telling you what she stands for. Oh, it's just a word south. Can we just? - No, she's saying her values haven't changed, but what does that mean for America? - Please, the world economic forum, please. - What'd you say? I think we're watching a video. - Yeah. - If you win in November, can you commit to prioritizing legislation to make childcare affordable? And if so, what specific piece of legislation will you advance? - Well, I would do that, and we're sitting down, you know, I was somebody, we had Senator Marco Rubio, and my daughter Ivanka was so impactful on that issue. It's a very important issue, but I think when you talk about the kind of numbers that I'm talking about, that, because the childcare is childcare, you couldn't, you know, there's something, you have to have it. In this country, you have to have it. But when you talk about those numbers compared to the kind of numbers that I'm talking about by taxing foreign nations at levels that they're not used to, but they'll get used to it very quickly. And it's not gonna stop them from doing business with us, but they'll have a very substantial tax when they send product into our country. Those numbers are so much bigger than any numbers that we're talking about, including childcare, that it's gonna take care. We're gonna have, I look forward to having no deficits within a fairly short period of time, coupled with the reductions that I told you about on waste and fraud and all of the other things that we've already done in our country. - Okay, yeah. - Can I just say? - Wait, hold on one second. - What did he say there? - I would like, I was actually gonna ask you that Don, look, one of the things that Americans value is a clear communicator. It is a huge thing in this election. And the simple factors Kamala Harris, communiques, clearly, she doesn't have a lot of time because this was an abbreviated election cycle for her. But my goodness, I was just wondering if he was ever gonna get to the point about care. I don't think, I don't think he got, did he get there? - No, but that was my point, is that the standards are different for her than him. And I am a journalist. So I think that people should be our public servants. And if you wanna be a public servant, you wanna be in the highest office in the land, and you should be speaking to the media. So I agree with that. I don't think she needs to be out every day giving white papers and going into specific details about point A4 on page 47. I don't think that anyone needs that. And if people haven't decided or made up their minds at this point, then I don't know what's gonna get them to decide to make up for her. - If people need white papers on who they were gonna vote for for president, Donald Trump would never have been president ever, ever, because his process of that-- - You can't say that you haven't heard or seen Kamala give word salad answers or things that just don't make sense or go into a story about cutting grass and growing up in a middle class family. Like we've seen both candidates do that. There is a difference here though, when looking at leadership, because we know what we get with Donald Trump and the American people. - That's a whole point. - Yeah. - But obviously the polls don't allow us or not understanding it. I think that you guys consistently underestimate what just average everyday people are feeling and what they think and how they view the political system. Because right now, like you said, Don, you were like, she's just being a politician. That's the problem. The problem is for years and for decades, we've seen people just be politicians, which was the appeal to Trump, which is why so many people supported him. 'Cause he just said whatever you wanted to say. And he wasn't a politician and he hadn't been doing this for years. Like you guys are-- - But I said she's just being a politician. - So you think she's a politician? 'Cause you just said that she had to recreate her, that she had to create an image for herself. - I mean, I used to be a resident of California. She's been a politician. - Okay. - I believe that-- - What's wrong with having political experience if you want to be a politician and hold the highest office in the land? Don't you think that should be a prerequisite? Are we quiet? - No, I'm gonna be honest. No, not necessarily to be quite honest. I think in our current political system, when you look at these people who have been in positions-- - And I see you. - I'm here, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. - Well, qualifications don't matter, is that what-- - No, nothing matters anymore. - Nothing matters. - It's because the politics is reform matters. - Just second, it gives us a second. - And if you will let me finish, I can't-- - What is this? - Right, so no, I'm not saying that. - You're saying that I'm trying to be the DEI higher. - Right, right. - And you should be hired for-- - Thank you, and I believe-- - Because we want something different. America wants something different. - This is what I'm saying. What I'm saying is you see career politicians in positions of power year over year, and for decades, and they haven't progressed, not only their communities, but their constituencies, they haven't created policies that have impacted the American people, which is what I have said. They make a career out of this, and there is no impact in what they are doing. And so that's why I think it's great for people who are not politicians who have not been doing this for years, who are not just attempting to maintain and hoard power in these positions and places to jump in the race. And I think that we need servant leaders who are jumping into the race who understand that their constituents should be the ones that are leading on the causes, and they are merely just-- - Let me just ask you this. - Hold on, hold on. (indistinct chatter) Qualifications don't matter. No, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that you are political system is broken and has been for quite some time. And I think that the American people just want to see something different. They're tired of the platitudes. - And why would they go back to Donald Trump if they want to become-- - They're tired of the PR stuff because they don't feel like he's a politician. They feel like-- - They do. - I'm telling you-- - They do. - They already fired him once, get scratching go on. - They do. - Why was they one of them? - If they don't see it, let me tell you. - They associate, forgive me, I hate interrupting. I don't want to be rude. But one of the things that we hear consistently from Americans, they're looking for someone who can unite the country. Donald Trump is not associated with that. They're looking for someone who is not corrupt. Donald Trump is associated with corruption at a massive scale. He is wrong on all the different things that they're looking for. So I hear you about getting something new. Look, Americans need, they need better. Everybody needs better, yes. But I think that to say that Donald Trump is the one that people will go back to and say this is a familiar old stand boy by, it's not the case, it's not the case. - Are you okay with, let me ask you this 'cause you're talking about career politics. She brings up something that I didn't think about. But are you okay with the corruption and all of that and the divisiveness of Donald Trump? Are you okay with that as a, you're Republican, right? You're Republican strategist, so I would assume. Are you okay with that? - With the divisiveness and the things that he says, I'm not okay with the divisiveness within our democracy at all on both sides of the aisle. - No, no, no, I'm not asking about both sides. I mean, with Donald Trump. - No, no, no, hold on, hold on, wait late, please. - No, no, wait late, I'm not gonna do false equivalency. There's no equivalent, it's not equal. Two, you say on both sides of the aisle. - So you're saying that this doesn't happen on the left, that they don't demonize Republicans, that they don't say, things that happen. - Let's talk about Donald Trump, let's talk about Donald Trump. - Hold on, hold on, hold on. - Let's talk about Donald Trump. - Let's talk about Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. - Okay, let's talk about Donald Trump and Kamala. - Then devise that, you don't, you're okay with Donald Trump's divisiveness, his language, his calling her Kamrad Kamala. I've never heard her call her Kamrad Donald. Him calling her Crooked Kamala. You're okay with all of that. You're okay with him wanting to execute the joint chiefs. - No, I think that there should be respect on both sides. I think Donald Trump should respect Kamala and I think Kamala should respect Donald. - I think she does respect him. I think she does. - There's a good sign. - Respecting him doesn't mean, respecting him doesn't mean not calling him for what he is and that which is a threat to democracy. That's not disrespecting him. That's calling him what he is. He's a threat. - He can't take him seriously. - And he takes him seriously. Respect him. - I don't believe him. - Respect him. - Hold on with me. Respecting him is walking up to him on the stage, shaking his hand and say, hi, I'm Kamala Harris. Let's have a great debate. That is respect. Respect is looking him in the face while he's on the stage. - The political system and that Democrats don't demonize Republicans and Republicans. - You're not talking about, I'm talking about Donald Trump. We're talking about Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. - What I'm saying is there's a culture within our politics to do this. It didn't just start here. It's been happening within our politics. - I have never, have you ever heard Whitley? - Wait, reach behind it. - You've ever heard. - Which body? What are we talking like, her eyelashes are here? - Right, her eyelashes are too long. Who's part of that? - I've been doing this back and forth. - Hold on, Whitley answered my one question at a time. Who started that fight? - And, listen, we started that fight. - We started that fight. - I mean, he started that fight. - I think that's why we're doing that. - Who started that fight? - And I'm doing my question, please. - Who started that fight? - Marjorie made a comment. - Okay, thank you. - Then with Donald Trump, who started calling people names out of their names and saying they should be put in jail. That the joint chief should be executed. That Hillary Clinton would be best handled by his second and then the first thing. - I never said he didn't hold a thing. - That they had blood coming out of her wherever. - John, the Democrats do it. - Who started that? - The Democrats do it too. You demonize Republicans, Republicans do it. - No, that's not true. That is not true. That is not true. Whitley, Whitley, Whitley. You're okay. - Hold on, no, no, no. If you wanna, we can go through and talk about them. If we just wanna stick with Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. Hold on, let me finish. And if you wanna go through and tell me all of the names that Kamala Harris has called Donald Trump. And I will go and I'll tell you, we'll go through a list. And if you name, okay, so what has Kamala Harris called Donald Trump? - He has to go through a list. - That's what you do. I want to. No, no, I want to go through. - I know. - Okay, so I'll give you one. I'll give you one. I'll give you one. And he has said he's a threat to democracy. Okay, he has called her. - You didn't ask. - Kamala, give me another one. Give me one more. - Five. - Give me another one. Give me another one. - They called him a dictator. - Okay, and so he has called her a corrupt or whatever, crooked Kamala, go on. - Okay, so once, so they've gone back and forth. - They've gone, but I don't keep going. - I'm just saying, that's what you're saying. - That's it. - This is not the oppression of liberty. This is not how many times can you make it? - Yes, it is. - This is about false equivalent to me. It's a whole false equivalent thing. Donald Trump, Donald Trump, - Exactly how he feels. - Incited people to go to the capitol and break into the capitol. - And assassination attempts. And even after those assassination attempts, the threat to democracy was still perpetuated. - Yeah, guess who, guess who were the people who tried to assassinate him? His own people, someone who voted for him. - It's a Republican. - Yes, it's a Republican. - Because who said Donald Trump had disappointed him as a Donald Trump supporter. Are you listening to me? It's his own people. - Let's assassinate. It's okay that there are assassination attempts. - No, it's not okay. - Right, that's what it sounds like. - No, it's not okay. If you're saying that the rhetoric to be taken down, then you're the one that should take down the rhetoric. - That's right. - One of the politicians, none of them should be facing this. - No, you're absolutely right about that. - The Donald Trump should be a work, hold on, but Donald Trump, MAGA, and Republicans are the honest and aware of how Donald Trump is contributing to this environment by calling people what, the enemy of the people, by inciting violence, by pushing, by telling people to go into the Capitol and riot, by trying to overturn an election. It is his own, it is his own, no, no, no, no, no, no. - No, no, no, no. - It is his own people, it is his own people who were trying to kill him. - I just said, listen, listen, listen. You invite me about the people who tried to kill him. - Don't let me to talk over me, listen. - Tell me about the people who tried to kill him. - Be honest. - I am. - Don't ever advocate for violence. - Well, I'm not advocating for violence. - I'm not advocating for violence. - A Democrat, a libertarian, a green party, our political figure shouldn't be facing it. - Who's advocating for violence in the Democratic side? - A type of violence. - Who's advocating for violence? - Who's advocating for violence. - In your crosshairs, in the bull's eye. - And what did he say about that? - Hold on, hold on. - And what did Joe Biden say about that? He said, "I should not have used that language, I'm sorry." Now, what did Donald Trump say about calling him Crooked Joe? Did he apologize for that? - Donald Trump, post the assassination, said, "Everybody needs to tone down the rhetoric." That is exactly- - No, he said, "Democracy to stop calling him what he is." He said, "Democracy to stop calling him what he wants to do." - Donald Trump said it, "You don't like Trump, I get it. - No, I said that I don't like Trump. I don't like life. I like truth." - You definitely see where you stand with your data, but the truth is that there are polls showing that there is a different sentiment among America. And whether you believe me or you believe the people on the streets that are- - I don't believe you. I don't believe you. I don't believe you in Republican. I don't believe you. That's all I'm saying. - I don't believe you or any Republican who says that what Democrats are doing is the same as what Donald Trump and Republicans are doing, 'cause it's not the same thing. - You're making excuses for your own guy. - No, I can't believe it. - You're actually saying that his level- - Let me hear that again. - There are different levels. And I will say that his level- - Different levels from who? - When he attacks his opponents. However, they are both- - Different levels from who? - The same thing. Donald Trump's level of attacking Kamala is a lot higher, but they both attack each other. And I have said this- - All right. That's true. - I think this is- - If I think this is- - You know that we- - We see the numbers for Paris walls that we do, with Americans wanting to bring the country back together. They are tired of all of this yelling. They are tired of all of this- - They are tired of all of this- - They are tired of all of the same calling. - The best thing. - They want to thank Skivit again, and wanted to hear their families again. - You and I have spoken a lot. Like Gretchen Haverick have her say. - I thought Gretchen was here to talk about statistics and data. I didn't even know- - She's been giving you patience. - Absolutely. - I do polling, but I've interviewed over 3,000 Americans. It's all I do. That's why I'm such a good listener on this call, 'cause I listen to American all the time. And I want you to know that Americans are very, very hungry for someone who can bring the country back together. They are very, very moved by someone like- - Like a little from Joe Biden? - They want to see moving forward. This is not- Joe Biden isn't running for president. - Joe Biden, for some kind of man. So the country should be together because he ran on restoring the soul of the man. - They're looking over the precipice, right? They're looking at Chernobyl, and they're looking at the nuclear reactor, and they're going, "No, I don't want that. "I don't want that. "I want to move away from that. "I remember what that was." - That's what the polls are saying, Gretchen. - I remember what that was. - I remember what that was. I remember that wasn't a lot of Americans do, too, and they're allowed for it to opportunity. - In the battleground states that matter the most, that's not what the polls are saying. She's down in the polls. She slipped post her phenomenon. What did you call it? What did you say her debate performance? You said all of these wonderful things. You got 15 points, and she slipped, and she's continuing to slip. Even, we just read it. It just came out today, dear. And so, if you're going to ignore that, if you're going to ignore that sentiment, and if you're going to ignore the fact that as you even stated in 2016, Hillary Clinton, for all intents and purposes, was going to win that election. And something miraculously happened, and the polls were wrong by over three points. Time and time, again, even in 2020 with Donald Trump loss, the polls were wrong by at least three points. So here you are, once again, in the election cycle, we're telling you-- - You are brilliant. - You are brilliant. - Helen, brilliant. - Helen, brilliant. - But I got to tell you-- - But I got to tell you, you're just flipping there. - That's awesome. - Don't underestimate. Count for it. - Go ahead. - I don't think that Kamala Harris underestimates Donald Trump, and that's why she's running to win. She's running to win the move of goals that are most important to her campaign, and she's taking Americans' concerns seriously. And I hear you, I hear you on being underestimated, but I think if we just look back on that, there was a little bit of a flip-floppy energy, right? Because in 2016, people didn't think that Donald Trump was going to win, and you're saying, no, no, no, there was something there. You're saying you don't think Kamala Harris is going to win. I'm telling you there's something there. I think-- - No, no, no, I'm saying that this entire time, she's been up in the polls that-- - Don, you were just saying she's down in the polls. - No, now the entire time prior to right now, specifically in these swing states, she's either been one or a few points ahead or right there neck and neck, and now in these swing states, she's down. And so what is it that she needs to do to speak to the voters that's not happening post this debate? Now, this is post what you call a stellar performance in this debate. What is not meshing with the American people that her communication style, whether it be her policies, whether it be the way that she's running her campaign, is not connecting? Fix it, adjust it, so that the next time you come on here, there won't be a New York Times Cine poll that comes out saying the exact opposite of what you're saying right now. - Right, right. Well, I appreciate the concern. I mean, there certainly is, there is a building of a relationship with the American people that she is doing. Polls are gonna do this. They're gonna do this up into the election. They just are, right now. - No, we're running the election there. - Yeah, but we've been doing this the whole time. - All right, all right. Y'all are wearing a spot in the comments. I know it's, I love it. Can we talk about, so listen, we need to talk about, 'cause we have some breaking news, okay? - We're breaking up. - Mark Robinson. Do you want to talk about that? - Oh, oh, he's the character. - Mark Robinson, Mr. Black Nazi, all the top operatives of his campaign for North Carolina governor have stepped down just days after the CNN report uncovered inflammatory comments, the candidate made on a porn website, his campaign announced on Sunday evening that his general consulate and senior advisor, his campaign manager, his finance director, his deputy campaign manager have all stepped down from the campaign. So this is the breaking news. I would play a soundbite, but I'm not because, oh, wait, do we have the new soundbite from where he says, I am in the process of retaining aggressive legal counsel to investigate the scene? - Not true. Have you taken steps then to prove it's not you? - We absolutely are, we absolutely are. We're in talks right now, everything up to legal counsel to take CNN to task for what they have done to us. We are going after 'em, okay? We are going to the bathroom for what they've done, but we have five weeks left of this race, folks, and make no mistake about it. We are not gonna let CNN throw us off of our mission. Our mission is to win this race and quite frankly, I am dismayed about the fact, as I said before, think about how many people out there right now, right in this place where we are right now, who are hooked on fentanyl, who are hooked on opioids, and how many will die tonight because of it? Think about what's going on on our border. Think about what's going on on the world stage, and this is what you choose to focus on. You've got these news cameras, news reporters, pens, pencils, your microphones. This is what you're focused on. You're not focused on the things that we talked about, standing up there about our economy. You're not focused on those things. I am. I'm gonna remain focused on those things, and you better understand. I am coming after Folt, CNN, Folt, right. But we don't want to put the people first. And in order to put the people first, in order to put the people first, we've got to concentrate on this campaign. And that is exactly what we're going to do. That's exactly what we're gonna do. - Okay, okay, so here's the new. Mark Robinson denies he's behind the new Africa account. That's what it's called, as you can see there, posting under his name. IP records, right, remember they have all this, right? They have a trail always of fingerprints everywhere, digital ones as well. IP records show the person assessing the account did so from close to his home in North Carolina. So, I mean, Whitley, do you believe what he's saying? - Which part? - Do you think that he had nothing to do with this, and that CNN would make up a story whole cloth and come up with evidence to back so many years and I don't believe that CNN made this stuff up? Wow, I don't know if they're gonna be able to trace down his IP address. I don't believe that that's what's going on. I think that this is a case for all of the young people out there to learn that a post is not a ghost, and the internet is written in ink, and the things that you say consistently can and may be used against you. More specifically, some of the vile comments I've been seeing him trace, seeing his campaign team kind of fall out or leave. I'm really just not surprised, right? Campaigns are run on momentum and morale. And if they don't feel like there's anything left in it for them, if they don't feel like the candidate even has a chance, what's the point in staying? And you see this consistently in campaigns when we work in 2020 with the campaign, when people started, you know, way-framing, people started to leave. - But wait, let me ask you this. And then just up with all due respect, I mean, to cut you off, this is a whole nother show. This is completely different. And I'm just wondering why, you know, it's a, I'm not shaming anybody for their king, right? If he had some sort of kinky, whatever he wanted, like if he wanted to watch porn, that's his business. He's a grown ass man, right? He can do whatever he wants. If it's consenting adults, I had nothing against it. It's really the hypocrisy over, you know, how would he gets up on the pulpit and he does, and acts like a preacher, I'm not sure if he's ordained or not. But he gets up there and he talks about, you know, all of these values for people and how transgender people are against God. And then he's admitting that, you know, allegedly in the, that he likes transgender porn and that he had enough fare with his mother's life. And I mean, and, and, something's that are just so creepy that CNN couldn't even report about it. This is completely different. Let me play something. This is JD Vance, and I want you to respond to this, Gretchen. This is JD Vance responding over the weekend. You're comfortable with Mark Robinson as the Republican nominee for governor in North Carolina? Well, if the allegations are pretty far out there, of course, but I know that allegations aren't necessarily reality. And what I'd say is it's ultimately up to Mark Robinson in North Carolina, whether he's going to be their governor and whether he wants to stay in the race. Do you believe him that those were not his posts? I don't not believe him. I don't believe him. I just think that you have to let these things sometimes play out in the court of public opinion. Goodness. So, look, JD Vance, I kind of feel sorry that he has to defend a man like Mark Robinson. Yeah. And, and he's, and if I did something terrible, I'd want JD Vance, maybe, maybe I wouldn't, to defend me in court, maybe. I'm not sure, actually. I think JD Vance has his own issues, but in terms of Mark Robinson, Mark Robinson has had problems for a long time. We've been studying North Carolina for a long time, and the way that he's received by North Carolinians, people do not like him. They think he's weird. I mean, he certainly has a base. Of course, he's running. He has, you know, a group of people that are interested in voting for him, but this isn't surprising that this came out of the woodwork. This is, this is not-- Well, I'm just saying the way that JD Vance, just a better answer would be, I just don't even understand why Mark Robinson was even in there. Why would Republicans would even put him in that position considering the stuff that he said, even before the porn? I mean, look, just, I just want to play a little bit. This is from a panel on CNN discussing Robinson. This was yesterday. Watch. Ask the question, why would someone like that, with these type of views, get to that lofty perch in the first place? I agree, because you're saying you had a much better candidate, and you didn't put him out, because you've lowered the bar so much in the Republican party and what your party should be. You've lowered it, and you've lowered it, and you've lowered it, and you've lowered it, that now you have the low life's left. And that's who's there. Okay. Yeah, go ahead. I just feel like what we're seeing, and I have a lot of Republicans in my life who are near and dear. I grew up as one. I'm no longer, you know, people I love and respect, and I listen to their views, and we, it's good. But I just feel like as a party, Donald Trump and the whole MAGA movement has required Republicans to move to a level of defending the indefensible. I mean, I feel like we're going to get to a point where we look back and go, "Oh my goodness, we were excusing that." I mean, I think it's a bummer for our country. I think it's a bummer for our character, and I think it's a bummer for people who feel compelled to defend things that are just not worth defending. I think we know better as a country, so. That's what I was asking you, basically. Are you okay with when I said are you okay with Donald Trump's rhetoric? Are you okay with defending that sort of behavior? Not in comparison to Democrats, because I'm not okay with defending Democrats' behavior. Even, forget the Republicans, right? If they do something wrong, I'm not okay with defending Democrats. The person that needs to defend and speak for himself on this is Mark Robinson, because we were not in those chat rooms. We were not. I was talking about Donald Trump and Mark Robinson, both of them. I asked you about Donald Trump earlier, and you said it was on both sides, and I said, forget the Democrats, but you're defending. It seems to me that you're defending behavior by something about a person who's indefensible, his behavior's indefensible. And what Gretchen said, maybe you'll look back one day and go, "How could I have defended Donald Trump?" I mean, this man, he raped a woman. He was found liable for raping a woman. Like, how do you defend that? Oh, Donald Trump. No. No, no. Where's the crime? No, liable of raping a woman. Yeah. It was a criminal. I'm not going to go there. I don't want to talk about rape. And the judge said that it was rape. I don't want to. I don't want to. You shouldn't have to talk about rape. You shouldn't have to defend it. You shouldn't have to defend it. You shouldn't have to defend it. When someone is wrong or you happen to each and Carol. It was a civil case. It wasn't criminal. And that's that's that on that. It was a civil case. It was not. I don't believe her. I'm not saying that I don't believe her. If I said that, then you could say that. But that's not what I say. Go back to Mark Robin. Do you believe her? Do you believe her? It's not for me to believe her. I didn't follow the case very close. So I'm not going to say whether or not. But what I will say when it comes to Mark Robinson is the only person that should be defending his actions is him because he was the only person that was there and that was doing it. As you stated, we weren't in the chat rooms. We're not in the form forums. We should be in the policy forums. And that's what the campaign should be about. And unfortunately, that's not what it's about. He was already 10 points behind. So this isn't really going to do much because it didn't look like there was a path to victory anyway. Now, when he pivoted in the video that was a show just now, and then he started talking about fentanyl and opioids and all of that stuff happening. And then you started laughing. I'm hoping that you were laughing at the pivot. And not at that very serious issue. No, I'm laughing at the pivot. Effective by fentanyl and opioids consistently. I was laughing at the pivot and what I was laughing at, because I felt that it was awful for him to be making light of and using that situation to cover for his bad behavior. And that it was, to me, it's embarrassing because people are actually dealing with real issues like fentanyl and opioids and him for him to bring that up was embarrassing for him to me and for the Republican Party who should be saying, should not be making excuses for him. Should be saying, okay, you're done. Before the porn, when he said Dr. King, when he compared Dr. King to a Nazi, when he said that he believed in slavery and that he would own a slave, like that's when the Republican Party should have gotten. So I'm laughing at, you know, there's a difference between laughing along with someone or something that is laughable. No, I understand. I just wanted to make sure that you clarify because I had a change of, I was a little upset. I'm like, is he laughing at fentanyl and opioids or is he laughing? No, nobody would laugh at that. No, no. I'm not going to get into whether or not someone was raped. I don't know that. What I will say is that if anyone has experienced any unwanted sexual contact, that they should do something about it, go to the police and file reports because it is completely illegal. And ask and I am for us in 2024 to be experiencing anything like that. I am someone that has been a victim of that and I don't take it lightly. But I also don't just agree with people when they say things have happened because I've seen personally in my own life where that has played out and it has not been true. Yeah. Okay. Listen, I understand some of that. But when, you know, when I said that she was found liable for rape or liable for sexual assault, that is true. But you said it was, you said it was not rape. That's what I said. And he wasn't convicted. It was a civil case. I said liable. I said liable. Right. But it wasn't rape. Okay. That's not what the judge said. Okay. You want, you want me to, you want me to just hold on? I just, because I think this is important. Judge clarifies from the Washington Post. Oh, clarifies. Okay. Yes. Trump was found to have raped E. Jean Carroll. That's what the judge says in the case. So he had to clarify because people thought it was sexual assault. After Donald Trump was found liable for sexually abusing and defaming E. Jean Carroll, his legal team and his offenders. Logier frequent talking point. Despite Carroll's claims that Trump had raped her, they noted the jury stopped short of saying he committed that particular offense and said juris opted for a second option sexual abuse. This was a rape claim. That was a rape case all along. The jury rejected that. Made our feelings. Lori Joe Takapina said outside a judge has now clarified that this is basically a legal distinction without a real world difference. He says that what the jury found. Trump did was in fact rape as commonly understood. As commonly a league. Okay. That makes a, that makes a lot more sense. They opted to not offer the rape charge for the sexual assault. And the judge is basically saying, even though that's what this distinction without a difference. This is what it means to everyday people. Yeah. When we get to a more honorable state of affairs where we all can have Thanksgiving together and speak civilly and live in the same truth. I have a great thing. I don't know what's happening in your house. Okay. But listen to this. All right. We're going to move on. We're going to move on because we don't talk about this at our Thanksgiving. We just, we have a good time. Okay. So this, this one thing when we were just talking about it before we go, I just want to, because this was now, you remember the vaunted Ronald Reagan, right? Remember that? And then George Bush was a man of decency, right? Remember what we said? A thousand points of light or whatever he said. And then, you know, the other George Bush and, you know, and then you think about Barack Obama, how he carried himself with dignity and, you know, George Bush, you know, they carried themselves with dignity and then you have this. Roll the coins. Hang on. We get it. The coin. Wait, Lee, we're going to react it in a second. We have no coin. I don't know what's coming. So I know we need to have the coin. There we go. Okay. We are announcing the launch of Trump coins, a true symbol of American greatness. Trump coins are designed by me and minted right here in the USA. This beautiful limited edition coin commemorates our movement, our fight for freedom, prosperity, and putting America first. We always put America first. It's more than just a collector's item, it's a testament to the resilience and strength of the American people, our American patriots that we love so much. This coin is composed of 99.9% pure silver. A beautiful proof finish and it's really something very special. Each coin comes with a certificate of authenticity with my signature to ensure you have purchased a real Trump coin. I've seen a lot of coins out there using my very beautiful face. I'm a very beautiful guy. I'm only kidding. But they are not. Okay. All right. Thank you. Why? Just real quick. Why? Whitley explained to me. Seriously, I want to know why. Because I don't care who was doing it. I'd be like, why are you doing this? Barack Obama was doing this. I'd be like, what is he doing? Wait, why did Trump decide to sell coins? Yeah. Because he wants to. What? That's not cringey for you. Why does he want to sell coins? Why does he want to sell shoes? Why does he? Because he wants to. He's selling merch. Like the same reason why we got Hotties for Harris t-shirts. Like, what do you mean? I'm confused at what you're confused at. Do you see a thing of her going by these Hotties for Harris t-shirt? Harris? Whatever. She's not selling it before we go on. There were 35 days where she didn't have anything on her website, but to donate to volunteer and buy merch. So. Well. So you don't think candidates should have merch and should do that. No, I think it's a little, I think it's a little, a little different. I don't regret him at all for trying to make an honest living. I think that that's part of the pride of being an American and our capitalistic society. Fun. And certainly, you know, he's got to raise funds for his campaign and I don't regret any candidate to do anything that they need to do. But I do think that it is a tricky look. It is a tricky look for him. And so. I'll just leave it at that. It's tricky to sell merchandise. So we will not be seeing you in any Harris Wall's t-shirts. No, you wouldn't ever see me in a Harris Wall's t-shirt. Oh, not you. I'm talking questions. I mean, no, I know, but I need one, but thank you. On the website where she's advertising her merch. No, totally. Totally. We'll see. A lot of them are sold out. So. We're going to get you some silver coins. Okay. Please. Okay. You're really, you're fun. I like this. I mean, a little. It definitely felt like two on one, but I'm used to it. I'm all right. It was just me and you at first. Gretchen is the one who barged in. I know. I know. I was told she was only going to do polls. I know. I'm sorry. I had a lot more feelings. I had to inject, but it's been so nice talking to you. And nice. Yeah. And I can't wait to see what happens on election day. We'll see. Yes. We should do a post election recap. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. All right, guys. Thank you. Click off. Thank you. Bye bye. Thank you. Thank you both. I really appreciate it. Take care. Bye bye. Okay. Whoo. What did y'all think? What did you think? That was some stuff right there, right? That was amazing. Can we tell? Let's talk about because I saw some of the things. I saw some of the things you guys were not. You were not nice. Too. Whitley. But anyways, I thought it was interesting and fun, not fun at all. Says. I've heard stuff. Yeah. Now Don says, Taisha Mills. I know when these comments are going nuts. So. Yeah. Okay. Guys, make sure you hit the thumbs up. And yeah. I talk about all of this. Remember. Right here. We discuss. The double standard in the hypocrisy coming from. Mainly magga. Mainly magga. Make no mistake about it. So that was interesting. You guys want me to have Whitley back? I thought it was fun. It turned into the Whitley show. And I'm going to make your name. Remember Whitley Gilbert. From a different world. Yes. Okay. I'm going to go make dinner for my husband. And I'm going to go make my dog's dinner. And I'm going to have a glass of wine. And I'm going to have a great evening. So you guys do that as well. But I want to continue to hear what you think. But good. Please make sure you hit the thumbs up. And yeah. So. Have a great evening. I'll see you guys tomorrow and hot topic show. Okay. It's a little bit lighter and a little bit more fun.
