What the Health Just Happened?
Workers COMPlicated
Ladies and gentlemen welcome to this week's episode of what the health just happened we talk about all things health care Community business and life the goods the bads the ups the downs the lefts the rights and everything in between We're so fortunate to bring on a variety of guests way smarter than we are to share some healthy verse Not healthy advice and their respective industries and about their ride on this wave called life today We got a friend of ours, right? Would you consume our friends? Yeah strategic partner? You've known for a long time. So He's been a strategic partner of our show sponsors 212 benefits He also happens to be an expert in all things workers comp gains ville and the university of florida Is that accurate? I don't say I know everything about gains on the universe of florida Yes, so simultaneously an agent and owner or just like what do you want owner or agent? Let's go both Okay, both. Yeah, whatever sounds cool. Sure. Uh workers comp specialist. That's the name of the business Kiaan ostivar or ostivar take your pick. How did your dad say it? Ostivar. How do you say it ostivar? How does that happen? It's a long story Whatever reason the first 40 years of my life he always pronounced it as ostivar and then the last 10 years He's decided to change the pronunciation on me. So it's kind of a running joke curve ball. He and I yeah Where's the where's the name from? Uh, it's nilly sir Persian. Okay. Yeah, his dad That's Persian. My mom is Canadian. So get my height for my mom and Other characteristics for my dad like what what character s that say? Yeah, it's worn a podcast, but yeah amount of melanin in my skin Yeah, as far as I tan pretty easily. So he's tan tall and tan your dad's like seven four, right? Actually, no, he's only Well, now he's down to five tan. He used to be you know, five eleven. Um, my mom You did say the height from your mom's side. Correct. Yeah, my mom's got seven brothers and sisters the you know average agent I'm sorry average height of the brothers probably six four six five. So that's where the height comes from Sorry, Ross boys. My kids are dude and from the start Um, I'm the name change too. Did dad go overseas and hear it pronounce a different way like what just one day ten years ago Yeah, I changed my last name. He just just threw me a curve ball like you said and um, you know It's it's it's just a back and forth at this point and he has no recollection of ever pronouncing it the other way Which makes it even more funny. So one day you woke up and he said i'm going to mess with kean pretty much Pretty much kean or kean. There you go. Right now. We'll do a lot of that'll be healthier. Not healthy name pronouncing your name Um, we're gonna talk a lot about workers comp. At least you are. I'm not because I know on a scale of one to ten Zero was it on the scale? Uh, yes, let's say you've negative five for you I wouldn't say negative I've had experiences with it at the fire department I could share stories that I have and how we had to share in paperwork, which I think is relevant So workers comp for 30 plus years agency has been around for 33 years. Uh, I joined uh as a you know partner agent back in 2005 so coming up on 19 years myself Okay, before that you got some cool stories. What was your first job out of college? So actually there's an out of college or in college in college during the summers I worked with a publishing company. We did direct sales during the summertime company called south western publishing Based in Nashville, Tennessee and the summer internship for college students was selling educational books Door to door during the summertime. So in college correct in Gainesville. Yes, we're going door to door No, the way the program was set up was it's typically students from university, Florida would go up north for the summertime So anywhere between states of Iowa, Ohio I've been to Missouri. I've been to vermont and you're basically there for 13 weeks Along with about anywhere between 40 to 60 other students from your respective college And typically two to three students live together and we have an organization that goes out and and markets these books To families in their homes. So yeah, I did that from basically five summers as an undergrad at university of Florida That's great experience. I think for a college age student Get the door slam in your face. Ah, definitely. Do you get cursed at? And definitely situations where there were some some choice words thrown my way. Absolutely. Did you sell a lot of books? I did. I was fortunate enough to just through kind of dumb luck and hard work to do pretty well And that's much my first summer. It was my second summer and beyond. I kind of figured things out I became a sales manager with them worked with them for another four years after college As a recruiting district sales managers. So I was in charge of students at university of Florida Florida state And recruited teams to go out and work in that summer program So any young listeners who don't know a book It's your pages you turn them where you read left to right top to bottom But you actually have a copy of it. You don't listen to someone else. Can we do a role play right now? No, no, no, can you try to sell me a book? That way I say that that could be entertaining But that's relevant that those are important skills sure college student to learn. So let's like I want to hear about what you learn That you still apply today for sure for sure now. I mean the the you know power of persistence You know, they taught us to do anywhere between 25 and 30 presentations a day We're putting in 13 and a half hours of work So you're getting to your first house by 8 a.m. And you're working till 9 9 30 p.m at night Take a few breaks throughout the day, but other than that you're on your own. So You know learning that independence learning that persistence Emotional roller coaster that is you know going door to door and and the you know, whether it's modern day or in the mid 1990s when I was doing it. There's a lot of uh of skills that you are able to engrain in yourself from all that Experience what's harder working in insurance or selling door-to-door books? Wow, they're both both have their challenges, you know, uh, the door-to-door books is probably a little more difficult just because you're young and and you know have Inexperience on your side. I'm thankful that I did it and and it was able to help me pay my way through school graduate debt free and uh, yeah, that's a awesome experience You are trays ready I love the time that you were able to do that and get through college. What kind of money were you making then? You know the time mind you this is the 30s or 40s, right? Sure. Yeah, when the color tv was not a thing yet for now, um, You know my top summer. I think I made just over 30 30,000 dollars in the summer time in summer So, you know, it's one of those situations where the the opportunity is there if you're willing to You know work hard and put in the time effort energy There may be a lot of things that you learn but just for me knowing that you did that knowing how you work today He's so persistent and stopping in places and just dropping in asking for somebody leaving his card I have to imagine that's from your time selling books. Sure. Yeah, I mean, it's it's a lot of it's just that repetitive You know keep keep persisting keep you know going back and and hopefully you can catch somebody on a good time or a good day and Can make a sale I think not to look I love Advice on sales and how it applies to life, but like you can't take it in personal either Right if somebody slams the door. Go ahead. Sure. No, I mean, that's a huge part of it Is is it's it's not personal and you don't know what situation you're walking up to when you go to somebody's house You know the kid could have just You know blowing up the microwave that could have just had an argument with their spouse They could have been laid off three days ago from their job and they take it out on you because you're the you know Easy victim. So yeah, a lot of it's just kind of compartmentalizing and saying look It's nothing personal just need to go to the next next house and see what I can find there Did you hit every single house? Did you ever skip a house? No, no, you're definitely targeting you know families and this may sound a little strange in this modern day and age But you're targeting folks with typically school-age children. Yeah, it's for the kindergarten up through about education books educational books correct So it's a lot different now. They still have students that that sell these summer They're modern summers, but it's kind of a different approach than what we had back then. This is pre-internet Pre-ring doorbells and all the other stuff pre-social media. It was a little bit easier. Yep All right talking money. Did you have the ability to fluctuate prices so that you kind of like hey Here's what we need to make bottom line But she was the individual gets to choose what you maybe try to target sell that person You know, not really we pretty much stuck by the book when it came to the prices that the company published It's a good pun there. Yeah, just suck by the book just because you may have a you know One of your roommates is over in the next county selling there And if they find out from somebody they talked to then they got a different price for the books and it can be created kind of an awkward situation Nice question sleaze ball. That was Trey by the way. He's a shady sales guy over there getting Do we need to go talk to your other customers that you record for? Okay before we get like I do want to dive deep into workers comp sure that's relevant We're gonna especially for business owners business leaders. There's certain things I think you have to have as a business see you could not have it But you're pretty liable if you don't sure before that should we talk some some gator football real quick, of course Ride or die gator fan, right at born and raised in Gainesville not born and raised But been there since 1993 with the exception of one year We actually lived here in Jacksonville. Then we moved back in 2005 So did you move there to go to college or you move there prior to college? Nope went there from Sarasota grew up in Sarasota and then started college at you I've never left for the most part. Yeah 29 plus years. Yeah, how much has Gainesville changed in 29 years? Quite a bit quite a bit. Yeah, I mean, it's it's a totally different Area around campus There's just a ton of new developments and student housing and everything else that has changed the town for a lot But in some ways there are a lot of ways It's good because it's you know helped the economy and helped a lot of businesses grow and thrive. You're a business. Where are you covering? Organizations so supporting them a workers comp where sure areas. Yeah, I mean, I've got clients stretched from Gainesville up to Lake City over here to Jacksonville down to Leesburg Tampa Sarasota, you know So we don't really have a set area or territory if you're a Florida based Business and you have you know need for workers comp Assistance whether it be problems with claims not being able to secure coverage We're we're there to help. Okay. We're gonna go back to Gainesville and Florida State because I said we have two Seminoles in here and two Gators in here So I think we definitely should talk trash, but we'll hold that. No, we've talked trash. You want to start already? No, I don't know. We'll say that. I'm just curious. So I use I have a quarterback this year Who does your quarterback this year? We got two quarterbacks Congratulations Um, I use chat tbt for some of these questions because I don't even know what to look the number one thing is like mod mod mod mod mod Which by the way, I didn't know what mod stood for What is my do you know what mod is? I have no idea. This is what I got experienced modification factors that accurate. What does it mean? What does it broad stand for it's short for modification? Yeah, um so You mentioned history of the company's been around 30 plus here. You've been there 20 years almost 20 years In 19 a few months. Okay, so what kind of clients organizations people are you working with your company? Who are you working with? Who's a good client for you guys? Sure. Yeah, no, we work with a ton of uh, you know, I call them small to medium-sized businesses anywhere between 10 employees and 150 to 200 Industry-wise you could look at contractors air conditioning electrical Plumbing concrete. We do quite a few of those uh, you know manufacturing companies retail businesses So, yeah, we've got a pretty wide range of of clients that we work with Would you say more blue collar than white collar? Which is always an interesting term by the way for sure now. Yeah, it's a blue and blue and gray collar as they say Gray collar and that's like manufacturing. I guess they call that kind of gray collar, but um, yeah, that's probably Majority of our our clientele. I like this question because i'm just curious. Uh, what are some common misconceptions businesses have about workers comp insurance? In florida workers comps kind of unique in that comparing it to your property insurance or liability or auto insurance Where you can go out and get, you know, have a broker get you four or five different quotes from four or five different companies for those different lines of insurance All of them, you know, we're going to have different premiums because they're all going to work off of different rates Workers comps a little bit of the exception in that uh from a commercial lines standpoint All the carriers work off of the same base rates and it's tied to what they call classification code for the employee So a certain, you know classification code for the job duty. It could be an electrical technician It could be, uh, you know, a mechanic at a car dealership They all have a class code assigned to them and then a rate that's assigned to that class code So so ceo of uh, electrician company is a different code than electricians. That's on the field. Yeah, okay Typically the ceo is going to be somebody in the office or maybe does some, you know, visits with clients That's going to be a much lower exposure than somebody that's out wiring buildings and and you know crawling through attics and that sort of thing Okay, so every business that hears this all one or two of you that happen to listen to the show We like to make fun of who actually listens we don't know Um who needs workers comp for their business sure if you're a construction based business Uh, and you have one or more employees, you know, besides the owner officer of the of the company Then by law in florida, you're supposed to carry workers comp If you're a non construction based business, then you're looking at typically four or more employees Uh, and then you're required to carry the coverage by law. So so every company construction one or more people You better find someone like kian for workers comp non construction four or more employees, correct Look at this guys. I'm a workers comp wizard already Um, this is a good question too. I'm just curious. How can a business reduce its workers comp premiums without compromising employee safety Good question. Yeah, so go back to Cable for that. Yeah, that is chat gbt for sure Uh going back to the point I was talking about with the rates Because the rates are set one of the biggest misconceptions that employ a bit the business owners have about this line of insurance is Doesn't really matter who you buy it from whether it's you know an agency that sells all lines of insurance or an agency that maybe sells Just one line of insurance like us Um, and that's probably you know, like I said, the biggest misconception for for most business owners Uh, even though everybody starts with the same rates per hundred dollars of of payroll That class code and rate as I mentioned before Uh, there are cost drivers that end up impacting the bottom line premium that the business is going to pay for their coverage The experience mod or experience mod factor is a big one. That's a cost driver Uh, that's a calculation or formula behind that number that a lot of times can have mistakes or errors in it Uh, there's credits and discounts that are available as well So those things can kind of help you bring the net cost of the insurance down as opposed to just relying on well the rates or the rates Yeah, I love them. I could tell when Trey's ready to ask a question over there head of his face Uh, okay Water or air What would be more expensive to ensure in this particular so like if you did a sure like I mean like up in like if you were On planes and stuff verse working on the on the water. I'm sorry. I didn't free I'm like an idiot. I didn't praise that correctly, but yes. Hey, we really loved having it down here Okay, no like working on boats like ensuring boats. Yeah, maybe planes. Sure. Yeah, it's more expensive For sure. So there's a great question by the way now that we understand Yeah, that's that's fair. Um Believe it or not. It's it's going to be the water water exposure boats exposure. There's actually a separate Federal uh part of workers compensation, uh, not to get into it, but it's a specific federal law that says if you work On navigable waters whether you're on bridges docks or boats There's a certain type of coverage that you have to have and that can be fairly expensive when it comes to workers compensation So yeah, what what about like a again? I love the water fishing in general if you're a fishing charter cap that you got four or five employees What's that? Do you have to carry workers comp for a first mate that might be? Yeah, there's again. It's a federal federal law There's different uh what they call jones act coverage not to get too much into the weeds But it's just a different animal when it comes to the water exposure and the boating exposure One as opposed to the majority of your run-of-the-mill businesses that are going to be electrical, you know on the land uh type, you know exposures Okay, i'm a book. I have a question. Go ahead. So historically in our business obviously insurance rates have always gone up In the workers cub world have they gone up or down? Over time. Yeah, sure. So, uh, they've gone down pretty significantly over the last I guess we're talking 18 years There was some more than i'm sorry. Uh, it was in 2003 that there is some pretty sweeping legislation That was passed in Tallahassee when it came to workers comp reform And it was something that needed to be done because the work comp rates were getting out of control Uh, the classic example is a roofer If you were a roofing contractor in 2002 2003 and you wanted to provide workers compensation for your employees Uh, the rate was close to $50 For every hundred dollars of payroll that you paid out Almost 50 percent of that was was the workers compensation cost Yeah, so it was extremely cost prohibitive to be, uh, a roofing contractor and have workers comp How do you how do you pay the bills and keep the lights? Sure. Yeah, it was it was like I said the system needed reform So they passed some some pretty big, uh, it was a certain bill that that really Reformed workers comp just to give you an idea of what's gone on with the roofing rate It's now down to you know less than I think it's nine dollars per hundred you know here in 2024 So, uh, historically in the last 18 20 years it's come down rates Few few years have gone up, but most of the time they've gone down You know, we're talking in that decrease of 65 70 plus percent since then because of that So the complete opposite of employed benefits and health insurance pretty much. Okay. Yeah, yeah, um I got a kind of semi silly question here than a serious one. What's the weirdest excuse you've ever heard from an employee filing a workers comp claim Or a couple of like how what kind of crazy things do you yeah? No, we've had some doozies, you know over the years Gosh, you know to take your pick. I mean, I've had folks You know something as as simple as you know, uh, a paper cut that you know, they want to turn into workers comp and and try to get, you know Um, you know compensation for uh, you know, we've had You know questionable, uh, you know, accidents is accidents where there are no witnesses You know somebody claims or they thought there was no witnesses But then there was actually video surveillance and you can see somebody literally, you know falling down almost in slow motion on purpose And then calling out to help, you know, somebody come help me But then they look back at the video and they're like you didn't truly fall you kind of kneel down and then laid down and scream And that was your that was your injury. So yeah, there's there's some interesting folks out there for sure How did how does a business owner like I worked in home health care? for a while just a lot of workers comp claims and some gray areas you can you can actually see if someone's um Applied for workers comp and previous agencies. Mm-hmm. And this is home health care Yeah, and you can see someone they're like they filed for workers comp for seven consecutive companies or how does a business protect that? Like it's not you versed the employee. Yeah, sometimes it's like this is not a legitimate workers comp. Sure situation No, that's that's one of the biggest challenges is who you're who you're trying to uh, you know, you're higher And I think they say 90% of all workers comp claims, you know, are bad hires, you know when it comes down to it. So Yeah, to be able to kind of weed that out. There are some different services that can find like you just mentioned kind of historical Workers comp claims history checks if you will Um, you know, we just had a conversation with a company last week that's developed kind of a pre-hire Questionnaire for employees to help kind of judge their moral compass or their work ethic And one of the things they look at five different things everything from dishonesty to you know, they're You know, courting their amount of safety kind of their safety mindset. They look at things like, you know, just I mentioned dishonesty employee theft All these different factors that are designed to kind of help weed out those folks at the pre-hire level So that you don't get those 20% of employees that cause 80% of your headaches Again, this show we we say health care community business in life I think if you own operated business or you're an executive with an organization like workers comp matters Is it shiny and exciting and you know, we're not wearing diamond necklaces right now, but this stuff this stuff matters Um before I ask the next serious question, we go to commercial break First game of the year, Miami verse, Florida What you call? Gators big. Gator's big. It was big. Wow. How big let's mr. Ostevar's Opinion on this subject That's probably a different conversation. No, I think I think gators by uh by two touchdowns. I think wow I think we're gonna put some uh First some people on notice championship. I'd look let me tell you what my least favorite team in all of the sports is the Miami hurricane So i'm cool with that Uh last serious question here before the commercial break about three minutes left Um, what are the potential long-term impacts on a business if it fails to properly manage its workers compensation claims? Sure It boils down to uh, we'll go back to that experience mod uh factor that we talked about That number is is a you know, annual calculation that every business has that pays a certain amount of premium So if a company is not, you know, doing a good job either with their employee safety program or after they have claims if they're not doing a good job managing those claims But experienced mod factor can end up, you know increasing their net cost of their workers comp premium anywhere between 30 40 50 sometimes Over 100 compared to their industry competitors. So how much time are you left? Okay, um, we love shout outs. I'll go first time. I'm love you. Shout out tomorrow time any shout outs anybody I think i'm good. We'll haul man. We mentioned your dad a few times by the way Um, okay, so prediction on the Miami floor game. What's the prediction on the floor to floor state game? It's gonna be an interesting game, especially in Tallahassee this year. So, um, you know, we've got a brutal schedule. The Gators have a brutal schedule Especially the second half of the season. So, uh, how healthy we are going to that game is probably going to determine how that uh plays out for us Top three favorite Gators of all time. That's tough. Well, you got to go, you know, Tim Tebow number one. That would be yeah, the easy easy answer That's a slam down standpoint. Uh, you got to go Steve Spurrier number two. He did it as both a player, you know, and they Uh, as a coach, obviously national championship winning coach in 1996 Third, let's go Percy Harvin, uh, because I named my dog Percy because of Percy Harvin. So yeah, oh, you got I know your number one Fred Taylor's number one number two probably Tebow and then uh Probably jock was green number three. Okay, why is he? Has a lot of studs that came out of you ask man I really is you know, and I hate losing to them when we do Um Yeah, kian, thanks for joining. That's the first half so far. What am I missing? We got some good stuff the second half health They're not healthy Work comp specialist. That's the name of the business. Correct. And I want to make sure what's austivar Ostevar both of them dad says it one way you say the other take your pick kian. That's what the health just happened All right. Welcome back to the second half of what the health just happened If you miss the first half here your catches on the radio good news is you can find the full episode on your favorite podcast platform Under what the health just happens first half man. We really kind of geeked down on workers comp here At least you did you're kind of a nerd in this space. Aren't you you could say that? Uh, which is that's a compliment by the way? Sure. Um kian ostevar depending on how you ask and who pronounces last name Uh agent and owner of work comp specialist specialties include workers compensation coverage Law sensitive plans experience mod factors and return of premium programs pull that from linked in was that accurate? That's accurate We talked some workers comp stuff. I think this is really relevant to any business owner or business leader Again, you can catch the first half on your favorite podcast Health you're not healthy. This is my favorite my favorite part of the show. Okay. I don't care if anyone likes it or not We love it. Hopefully one day you tell us randomly health you're not healthy health. You're not healthy I asked us already uh the florida gators gators football schedule florida gators florida gators football schedule the next two seasons I'm gonna. I'm gonna go healthy. Uh just because You know you come to the university florida if you want to play uh top competition This is an opportunity to you know make your mark and uh, you know god are the days of playing the Little sisters of the poor and some of these other directional schools For four or five of your games each season and uh, yeah, we've got What they're calling is perhaps the toughest uh schedule in the history of college football So this will be this will be a make or break. I am I am not a gator fan But well more than miami Everything i'm saying is the most difficult to your schedule today. It could change Sure. I don't know what the the last five or georgia lsu o miss Two states florida state. I don't know what or they are, but those are our last five games Okay, health they're not healthy selling books door-to-door in college Healthy built some good uh qualities and characteristics and make a little money while i was doing it. Is it pronounced jiff or giff? I'm gonna go with jiff. I say giff. We've got a spare. Okay, health you're not healthy sending memes and gifs to your friends and uh partners I would say healthy. Yeah, a hundred percent gotta gotta bring some levity to the uh stale insurance or all the way What do you use to put joey's face in those gifs too? That's a great answer all kinds of apps that are available I love it. He says the best ones. Um, healthier and not healthy java burrito Definitely healthy by far one of the you know best burrito places locations in savannah and uh hilton head So that's a big thing for them big fan Healthier not healthy ordering an extra menu item from java rio to take home with you After you've had a meal absolutely healthy for sure. Yeah, especially when you live four hours from the closest location One day gains will get one maybe jackson. Okay, health you're not healthy peo is managing workers comp risk You know in certain situations employee leasing slash peos can can be healthy Um, they have for certain companies. They're they're a good fit Um, not for everybody, but it's a case by case basis and and we try to find you know What it's gonna be the best fit for any business that we're working with? I think that's similar to employed benefits, right? Some companies it may make sense to have your health insurance through a peo other times that don't I I love the term Knitches get riches and it's not about getting rich But like if you niche down and it's work on something specifically you are an expert in warmer scott Joey jensen is an expert in employee benefits I don't want to knock peos joey. You want me to knock over now? No, okay. I'm saying I think they make sense for some of these other Otherwise they don't um Okay, so this is a funny question that the chat GBT game you get any more healthy or not healthies No, healthy or not healthy. I have a question, but you go first you go first mind ridiculous If so a peo can manage a work comp risk, right? What happens if they don't want to go to a peo and they get kicked off work comp coverage? Where do they go? So the state of florida has uh, what's called a florida work comp joint underwriting association which is basically a pool of Businesses that for whatever reason could not get coverage through a standard insurance carrier for workers comp And either didn't want to go to a peo or their their history of claims is so bad. No peo wanted them Uh, so it's essentially the option of last resort that by law has to offer coverage to a business If they're in florida and they need workers comp because they meet those two qualifications We talked about earlier as far as employee size. So Um, that's their that's their selling typically. How much more expensive is that? Um, you know anywhere between 75 to 150 more costs, so it's how do you get out of that? Um, obviously better claims for sure. Yeah, you typically need to have a program. Can we show it to a standard carrier? For sure. Yeah, at least maybe you know, one to two years of better claims experience is going to give you enough uh of a track record to be able to find a standard carrier to Get you out of that particular association Is there such a term called consent to bind or bind to consent? Sure consent to rate consent to rate and sent to rate very close CTR Uh, search charge is not to be confused with cte, right? No, okay ctr football Yeah, no ctr. Um, a lot of times we just call it a search charge. It's essentially Uh an additional charge that the state of florida allows a business. Uh, sorry allows a work comp carrier To add to those rates that we talked about before. So you know, a business may have challenging claims history and Underwriter for a carrier looks at it and says if we collect Only the premium that the state allows us to collect. We don't think we you're going to be a profitable account for us So we're going to search charge you or add additional rate on top of the rate that the state says we can charge So that can equal additional 20 30 40 50 percent more But it prevents them from having to go to that jua and also can prevent them from having to go to a peo If they don't want to go that route. So I'm gonna plug again kianos de var his work comp specialist if you have any work comp questions I would highly recommend going to you in your organization You said 10 to 150 10 to 200 typically. Yeah, that's our squeeze a wizard and workers comp again. It's not Glamorous. It's not a marketing team or putting out commercials, but it matters. Mm-hmm can be very Expensive to an organization. So sure I just like the more eyeballs and ears we can drive your way Another chat gpt question you're I kind of like what steps should a business take immediately after an employee is injured on the job? Sure. So one of the most basic things is making sure that the there's an investigation done It doesn't have to be anything super fancy It can just be a one-page form that they're writing down kind of what were the circumstances around the claim or the accident Whether any witnesses, you know, if the injured workers available to give there inside of the story If they haven't been taken to a walk-in clinic or in a hospital emergency room Just to try to document and get as many details as possible As soon as possible as soon as possible after the accident or the injury And then of course, you know reporting that particular claim to the insurance carrier By law in the state of florida a business has seven days from when they're made Aware of a claim or an accident to then report that claim to the insurance carrier. What happens if injury occurs Today and then eight days later workers worker comes and says I was injured eight days ago. Yeah At that point you're still better off reporting it to the carrier I would recommend that business check with the employee supervisor and say hey This employee is claiming that eight days ago They got hurt on the job. Did he bring anything to her? She bring any bring any of this to your attention and just include that as part of the accident investigation The actual you know the carrier itself is going to intake the claim and still you know Still pay the claim. It's just a matter of best case scenario You're trying to report it as as soon as your knowledge of that particular Accident takes place, but you do have up to seven days to report it How often this is such a broad question. There's no way to answer it specifically But like how often are employees delaying reporting that and not let me give you a specific example So when I worked at the fire department I stepped off the back of an ambulance where my knee buckled Mm-hmm. I was like man I don't want to say anything because I don't want to get the process, but I did I was like hey I just buckled my knee so they I had to go through all this paperwork all this stuff And there was a poem like I ended up being fine, right? But I almost wish I would have delayed reporting that. Mm-hmm. So does that happen often? It does it does and what we typically recommend is is you still try to encourage employees to Report the claim to their supervisor or somebody you know at a management level if it does happen There is a specific form that we a lot of times will recommend that the the employer have the employee fill out Or it's basically almost like a medical Treatment declaration form so they're acknowledging that they were injured on the job But they're choosing not to seek treatment under workers comp at this time And that what that does is basically kind of holds you know almost like a placeholder of that of you or as the employer Having knowledge of that claim so you're putting that on file And so then three days from now three weeks from now they come back and say I want to get treated under workers comp You've at least got that particular form on file that okay, so same scenario Buckled my knee if coming off the back of the ambulance This is 12 years ago 11 years ago. My knee hurts all the time. Can I go after him? If you're if you're with the same employer you can you can try not see it like this is kind of a joke But yeah, that's right um by law the I mentioned before employer employers have seven days from their knowledge of the accident to report it to the insurance carrier Believe it or not employees have 30 days from the time of the accident to report it to their employer So a lot of times if you're talking months between the time that the accident apparently occurred supposedly occurred And now they're just telling their in supervisor about it 60 days later We see all the time insurance carriers will deny the claim for late reporting if it's passed that 30 days So it's kind of a case-by-case basis. Does that does that reflect on the employer or employee? It's more on the employee just because if you're the employer how are you supposed to know if somebody got hurt if they don't bring it to your attention So yeah in those cases again, we just encourage our our clients to say look, you know, just Encourage your employees. This is the process if you get hurt bring it to your supervisor We'll make a determination at that point if it needs to be filed or not as a claim That's kind of the pivot. I was going to so as an employer It goes back in an agent broker consult not sure the term you use Yeah, but it's education on the front end right customer service So how important is that education on the front end so that someone's not coming 60 90 120 days later, right? Sure. No, it's it's huge. I mean it makes a big difference the other component to that is if a business happens to be a drug-free workplace In the state of florida you can get additional credit or discount off of your workers comp premium If you're willing to have a written drug-free workplace policy in place and then do pre-hire testing as well as post-accident drug testing So the sooner you have knowledge of that incident the sooner you can get that person drug screened as Far as the timing of it in relation to when the accident occurred or injury occurred That's just going to help your your case in the grand scheme of things. This is a weird one. So the state of florida Medical marijuana, right? It's a drug-free workplace, but they have a medical marijuana car. What does that look like sure? Yeah, it's a big a big hot button topic right now for employers When they made marijuana legal with the prescription several years ago, they left language in that particular Bill that talked about or the statute talked about uh because marijuana is still illegal at the federal level You as an employer in the state of florida still have the right to maintain a drug-free workplace and choose to not necessarily you know Recognize marijuana, uh, you know as as a legal substance. So what I tell employers is there's an addendum You can add to your drug-free workplace policy both for applicants that come to the door as well as current employees that may get a medical Marijuana card after they're hired or on board with you That specifically talks about look we understand marijuana is legal in the state of florida However, if you're an applicant to come in to work for us Even if you have a medical marijuana card, we're still going to have you take the drug screen because depending on how much THC is in their prescription They may or may not you know pass that test or fail that test Um, and if they choose if they fail then you as the employer can choose not to hire them at that point any thoughts on if or when Marijuana weed, what's the what do you call? Mary Jane? I don't know. I feel like an old gun now when it's when it's recreational Yeah, and then what is that? What is that? That's a whole nother, you know can of worms Uh, you know other states that have done have made it recreational have uh have that challenge You know, I still think there's going to be some protections built in for employers to be able to say You know kind of like alcohol. You can't show up to work You know with a cracking a beer and walking around and drinking. So why should they allow something to really you know have a kid have a Yeah, um Marijuana that's good. You got something to add to that before it because I gotta I want to talk about this Just real quick. The most common claim. Is it falling? Slips, trips and falls are probably you know one of the top three or four Um, you know strains lifting those types of things really you just well, man a soft tissue You guys have seen the movie friday, right? Of course. Have you seen that movie? I immediately the story you were telling of someone in the store like my back I guess if neither of my mind way that guy, right, which are you for 150,000 which we sell 20 books Correct that's that's this we like to laugh sure. That's that's what I envision her Okay How tall are you six four do you run? Not well, do you cite like what do you do? He's it? I'm not to get weird here like you're in good shape Yeah, no, um gotta garage gym at the house. So you know do a lot of different uh stuff at the house from growing to Exercise bike to those types of things. Okay. Yeah, um is it two two nine zero two nine? How do you pronounce that like how do you this event which I've seen many years and if you're heard again, I'm coming with okay? Or at least each other. We're gonna have to travel together. Sure me on 29 o 29 everything Dot com. I think is the website. Uh, it's an endurance events. I found out about it through a friend of mine who did it two years ago Uh, essentially they give you uh 36 hours to you know, typically they're done at like a Ski resort. So you've got a trail or a mountain that you're essentially hiking up for 36 hours and taking the gondola back down And over and over and over. So up gondola down Yeah, and depending on which mountain it is will depend on the the amount of trips you have to go but the goal is to accumulate An elevation game of 29,000 29 feet, which is the same height as Mount Everest So the thought process being you can climb Mount Everest or the equivalent of without it without having to travel halfway on the world and potentially Uh, you know have all the health complications that come with die. That's a health complication You don't need a sherpa to walk into a sherpa No, so uh, no, it's a wonderful program wonderful company. My wife and I did it in Whistler, Canada last year Um, we trained together. They give you a 20 week training program and it was a lot of fun. We do it again I think at some point. Yes. I probably will. It was just just the challenge of it was uh, it took us 35 and a half hours to complete. Hey, you got it in a bit of wire. That's a fist bump right there. Don't need to hang in So no, it was it was uh, it was by far the most physically taxing thing we've done Ever for both of us, but at the same time it was a sense of accomplishment both of our teenage daughters were there to witness us do it And so that was a lot of fun. That's actually was my next question. What's the most physically demanding thing you've done in your life? Absolutely was that that's it. Yeah, not a bad animal. What about the most mentally taxing thing you've ever done in your life? Selling books door to door. Well, that's it could be that would be that would be emotionally. Yeah, that's emotionally That was probably the most difficult thing. Yeah, and then working in workers comp What's the most difficult thing that you have to deal with on a day-to-day basis monthly weekly sure? Um a lot of it's just just kind of changing folks business owners or people and decision-making capacities Kind of educating them and changing their mindset on on the whole you know, if the rates are the same from company to company What does it matter if I choose you to do workers comp or if I choose joey or somebody else to do my workers comp? So it's just a more of an education thing from that standpoint. I I love joey I would not choose joey to do our workers comp by the way. That's why we need a meal cost. You got a question I think you just raised your hand. Okay. Um, so what what what is the difference? What would you answer that? Hey, listen Keyon we have workers comp with someone else is the price of the same. Why would I pick you for sure? Yeah, so it really boils down to knowledge and service You know if when it comes to service everybody promises service you don't really know until you try You know the knowledge aspect of it. I think is where we separate ourselves You know I use the medical analogy quite quite often when I'm meeting with a with a business owner You know if you twist your knee, you know You can go to a general practitioner and you can try to diagnose what's going on with your knee But you're probably better off going to an orthopedist and somebody that can see you know Really what's truly the issue and get the proper test done get the proper diagnosis done and get you back on the on the road to recovery So what does service look like this is for a business owner throughout the year? So they're like keyon you're my guy That's it after you they switch to you and pick you. What does service look like the next 365 days? Yeah, so I'm a big believer in and You know just really simple things when it comes to to servicing a business It's something as simple as returning emails. Yeah, it seems like a like a a very basic part of of Any service relationship Being there if they have an issue, you know responding in a timely fashion All the other stuff that we do whether it be reviewing the experience mod worksheets for errors Making sure they're with a good, you know carrier Helping them with managing claims all of those things are kind of part and parcel, but you know, I think if you Surveyed 2530 of my clients and said hey, you know What's the reason that you choose to do business with keyon and we're kind of specialists? I think a lot of them would just simply say, you know He does what he says he's gonna do you know He's there when we need him and that's blocking the security kind of a relaxing and tackling business speaking of blocking What were those two gator players that blocked each other? What were their names? Yeah, I think those guys are no longer on the team We have so many blubbers about this We're there. Oh, come on now Do about couple couch guys like oh look at these idiots and we get yeah, right? Do you remember the show um pros versus average joes Yeah, I loved that show. Yeah, I think it'd be funny to have you know, like an average person Okay workers comp related not that serious if workers comp or a movie would it be a drama a comedy or a thriller? I'll be combination hall three. Yeah. Yeah, it would be the lead who'd be the lead actor at it. Oh gosh, Steve Carell Maybe yeah, so he'd be a great. Uh a great that would be a great sitcom actually to worker Fall going around following workers claims. There's who was a sitcom a while ago I think it was only streaming that was specifically about workers comp really Yeah, it was a company and like a Sarasota based sitcom. I heard about I'm not sure I mean not again very long but Oh, man. Yeah Speak this is the chat TV doings. You don't have to answer this if workers comp had to explain itself in a meme What would that meme look like? Wow Yeah, that's something to think about in the next couple days. We're gonna start sending memes. There you go Yeah, joke, man. You you make some hysterical stuff You clearly have a great sense of humor. I think just based off of everything that show he tells me Yeah, um And also kind of a I can say badass too. I think so Yeah, we're not badass We're you and I aren't doing that that Everest climb. It would take me a long time to try would not finish it We're doing it next to your chat. I'm signing you up. No, this is a this is a verbal contract No Um, you missed the part when he said that you would go with him He said he said you could come cheer him on and so he actually doesn't believe that you can physically do it I 100 can do that 100% I will do that Challenge accepted put put the time and effort in the training. Yeah, anybody can do it. Um, except Joey I Love it a couple minutes here left any any big things in the workers comp world that I that's upcoming Um, again, that's a lot to unpack. This is a this is a 10-hour conversation trying to jam at 48 minutes, but yeah I mean, it's we talked about the rates going down Historically, um, I would not be surprised if they decrease again the rates new rates come out every january For that calendar year. So we're probably looking at another small decrease five to seven percent in 2025 Um, a lot of that we didn't talk about why the rates have gone down so much But a lot of it is employers have gotten a much safer in their workplace habits They've understood a lot of them understand the importance of managing their claims when they do happen Um, the attorneys aren't quite as attorney as as uh, motivated to take on work comp You know cases as they used to be so all these different factors have really helped kind of drive the cost down You sit attorneys and trays just chomping at the bid ambulance chasing lawyers. Okay. We were plenty of them by the way No, actually I wanted to ask you talked about like, uh claims going down Does it have to do with work from home and how does it work from home claim work? Yeah, no, that's a good good good question Um, there's a separate classification code for folks that are we called telecommeters That's the old old term before it became work from home Um, it's about the cheapest rate per hundred dollars that you can get so those claims aren't aren't very significant I think it's 11 cents for every hundred dollars of payroll is what somebody who works from home exclusively That's how much the the rate is for workers comp Um, so we don't typically see a lot of claims there But they are potentially covered and it's a matter of making sure that if you are a business owner and you have folks that work from home That you're broker and your carrier or aware of that so that a the proper class code could be on the policy And then b you know, they're their home address believe or not becomes a work site address and you want to have that on the policy as well Man, again, of course we run out of time, but you've mentioned, um, roofers were 50 50 dollars for every $100 a payroll What's the average so $100 a payroll? That sounds like a different common number. What do you think the average across all industries is? Um, if you broke it down, let's say like your artisan trade contractors plumbing electrical hvac You know, they're probably in that three to four dollar range per hundred, you know, probably closer to three nowadays Um, you know restaurants, you know, that rate is down to you know, a dollar and change which restaurant rates used to be About seven dollars per hundred if you are a server in a restaurant so that rate has come down tremendously So yeah, I mean, it's it's one of the situations where yes the rates have gone down But at the same time payrolls continue to go up minimum wage continues to go up so that cost is is you know, it's a calculation It's payroll times the rate in hundreds. That's where your work comp premium number comes from So with raises with competitive nature of of business these days and having the increase pay in order to get good a talent on board You know, it's work comp expense is still a significant line item Look I had fun. This is not this is not Bells and whistles. There's no fireworks in here. No, but this is important for any business owner business leader Um, look, I would say overall badass as a human but definitely a badass in the workers comp world I have a health you're not healthy to round us out if I could you better you better fire it out Health you're not healthy the development of the new jaguar stadium in jackson mill florida Healthy all right. Yeah, great place for florida, Georgia for future years. There you go Look any questions workers comp you can reach out to us here at 212 benefits what the health just happened But uh go directed a key on Work comp specialist. You're based in gainsville cover the entire state of florida I'm not kidding this guy is a wizard and all things workers comp Which really matters If you are a business owner or business leader keon. Thank you for joining us. That's what the health just happened You You You You You [MUSIC PLAYING]