(upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Hey everybody, how you doing? Well, that's good. Whoo, my name is Bill Matts. I am your director of fun and games for the evening, joining me as always. It's Philadelphia's number one hockey beat writer. It is Charlie O'Connor. Charlie, I had to get the first unofficial victory woo in, of course, no post game last night. But the fliers win, I wanna woo. We got it in there and pretty impressive stuff from the fliers in their pre-season debut. We will get into all of that, a nice 6-2 win. Whole bunch of guys, we want to look good, look good. That was cool. But something that was very cool today down at the practice facility, Charlie. Gee Goudreau, father of Johnny and Matt Goudreau of Holly Del fame if you're around my age and played ice hockey in South Jersey. Good chance. He taught you a thing or two, Gee Goudreau did. And he was down, he was with the fliers in the fliers training center today. Chuck, if you want to tell us a little bit about that. 'Cause that was a very cool move by the fliers. Yeah, yeah, it was a, it was really nice, really nice gesture. Apparently it was John Torterrell's idea. John Torterrell called Gee Goudreau. It seems like based on what he said, he called him a couple of weeks ago and made the offer of, hey, do you want to come and basically be a guest coach for a little bit during camp? And understandably, I mean, Gee's obviously going through what is a tragedy I can't even imagine. And he basically told us him at first, he said, I'm not quite sure. I'll let you know. And Torterrell was like, that's fine. Just let me know if you want to do it. And I guess at some point over the last couple of days, he left towards know that he wanted to give it a shot. So today he was here. And obviously the Flyers, you know, extended the invite. He was on the ice. He was, I never, you know, was around Gee when he was doing these things. But apparently he's really, really into skating. He's always telling people to skate. And he was doing the tapping his stick on the ice as the guys were skating around in circles. So it seemed like, you know, he was legitimately enjoying himself. And it seemed like it was a real thrill for him to be out there, you know, coaching in. And unofficial, but official capacity, this is an NHL training camp. And he was out there functionally as a coach. And John Torterrell, you know, we, we rag on him sometimes on the show, I think fairly in terms of some of the things he does to players and how sometimes it can be a bit cruel from the outside. What I will say is that this speaks to the quality of person that he is on a deeper level. That, you know, he knows that that Gee is obviously going through it right now. The whole family is going through it. And just to do that for him, it speaks to the character, John Torterrell. - No, absolutely it's, it's why I have faith. Like when you see him do little stuff like this and John Torterrell has done all sorts of charity work throughout his career, we've talked about it. But it's just those little things that were like, he has the best intentions. Even though we openly call him a maniac on a regular basis and laugh at how ridiculous he can be, it is in service of like doing something good, whether it's just his job or going above and beyond like something today. So hats off to the Flyers organization, Torterrell putting it together, all very cool. And good to see Gee out there, at least doing something he loves for a little bit 'cause yeah, goddamn, like what is there to even say? About the situation. All right, Charlie, on to something that was pretty cool last night. Flyers reversed the way their preseason started last year when they got killed by the Devils. You know, they did the skates, they had a couple scrimmages, the next thing you know. All right, yeah, time for preseason game and they just had nothing in the tank got destroyed. Last night went a little bit different. They win six to two, they outshoot the Capitals, 28, 21. And now listen, like, was this a fully stocked Capitals lineup? No, if you took a shot every time then the announcers mentioned the Hershey Bears, you would have been plastered. But the Flyers did do what they should have done, right? Like I've seen this team lose an exhibition to Lezon and you know what we did make fun of them for it. The Flyers played their game and beaten inferior team. Good, strong marks all around. We're gonna get into some individuals after this. Yeah, I was obviously down in DC for the game. I covered it in person. And I covered last year's game when they played the Devils up in Newark and that was an exhausted team. This team that played this squad that played in that game did not look exhausted. They look fresh, they look like they had jumped. There were a few guys in particular and look like they had a ton of jump. And I think that's an improvement over last year, at least in terms of being able to handle the John Tour de Relicant. Because this is now their third year. Some guys is not their third time. But for some of the vets, it definitely is their third time going through a John Tour de Relicant. And I just get the sense that it's never gonna be easy. The amount of skating he has them do, the first day is obviously awful. And then the next few days, they're basically scrimmageing the whole time. And then when they're not scrimmageing, they're skating around in circles, he runs them hard. But it's clear that they are getting more use to it. They are getting better at preparing for it and they're getting better at managing their energy to survive it. And also to the point where they can go down to DC and beat the crap out of the Capitol's team, which you're right, it was a lot of minor league guys, not a ton of guys that are gonna be seen NHL games anytime soon. But a tired team can still lose to an NHL team, especially when it's the first game of preseason and nobody's in rhythm or anything. And the Flyers went out there and they just took them apart. - I think it was the year they were closing the spectrum, the Fannoms beat the Flyers in like a head-to-head game. It was, I'm pretty sure I saw that happen. Like it again, like Lausanne, we saw what happened. I am glad that they just went out and played their game and did what they were supposed to do. And it allows us now to talk about a whole bunch of guys that we've been talking about all summer and now we actually have, all right, here is a point of information. They have provided us with data, finally, and we can discuss it. And we're gonna start, Charlie, with the guy we talked about last week, Bobby Brink. Bobby Brink, we were like, he's making the team. They're not gonna put him on waivers, but it is a crucial year and a crucial camp for him to kind of just cement himself as a top nine forward for this team. Maybe not be the 13th forward, maybe not be an extra guy. You know, if we named a couple of forwards, like, okay, if they were to kick the door down, whose spot is vulnerable, maybe it's Bobby Brink's. He had the demotion last year. He gets benched in that game, 82. He, like the Brink, went right away and then saw some slipping. We're not quite sure where Torts is right now with Bobby Brink. Hell of a first impression, I thought, a couple of goals. You called him the best player on the ice. - I thought he was. I thought to finish, he was the most impactful. Other guys ended up having similar stat lines. I think Joel Farrey finished with one goal and three assists. So he had the most points of any flyer, but I thought Bobby Brink from the very first shift was the most consistently impactful flyer on the ice on Sunday night, which was great to see. And we talked to John Torterrell a little bit on Bobby Brink. I believe it was the day before. I think it was Saturday. And I asked him, I maybe didn't go at it as direct as I wanted to in my first question. I asked him about Bobby Brink and kind of his thoughts on him and Torts basically said, asked me in a few days. I want to see how he looks in the preseason. And then I straight up said, what I really was getting at was, because I compared to the Camby York. Was he where Camby York was at going into last year's camp? I don't think he quite understood what I was getting at. But then I went back with a second question. I said, really what I was getting at was, at the start of last year's camp, you set up Cam York. You don't know if he's a full-time NHL player yet. And then obviously, Cam York last season, very much proved that he was an NHL player. And I asked, is that where you see Bobby? And Torts basically was just like, yes, that is where I see Bobby. So he's coming into this camp with the belief that Bobby Brink needs to prove that he should be in the lineup for 82 games or however many games he's going to play if he's injured or whatever. And I felt like for this game, the very first preseason game, he could not have made a better first impression. He looked fantastic. - And that was like, absolutely what I saw last night was a guy who was all over the place. He looked great, again, scored the goals. And yeah, for a guy who has something to prove, that's tremendous. And I think it's another, like we said, when we talked about Brink last Thursday or whatever it was, like he's clearly too good for the AHL. When he was playing hurt his first year, he still put up good numbers. He gets demoted last year, 13 points in 13 games. And against a young guy prospect, you know, some NHLers, it's not as if there were no NHLers out there, but depth guys and the Hershey Bears basically, he was the best player on the ice. I think that tells you, like, okay, maybe he's not a full-time NHLer, but he has to be because he's, there's nothing else for him to do with this lower level. Like the NHL is where he has to now make or break it for himself. It's obvious when there's lesser talent out there, he can take advantage of it. And that's what it did last night. And now it just got to carry over to when he plays some more NHLers. Charlie, what does it say about Bobby Brink that he's playing again tonight? One of only, I think, two guys in both lineups. - It's interesting. And that jumped out at me as well, because it was a little odd. Like the two guys who were playing both games, 'cause the Flyers will be playing up in Montreal tonight. I believe it's 7 p.m. I'm not covering that game in person, but apparently there's gonna be a stream on the Philadelphia Flyers website. So if you wanna watch it there, feel free. Hopefully it's of decent quality. I guess we'll find out. The two guys who are playing in both games are Bobby Brink and Ole' Lick Cell. Now, Lick Cell makes sense to him. He's very much on the bubble. He's 25 years old. He's no longer waiver exempt. If he's gonna make the team out of camp, this is gonna be when he does. He needs to get every opportunity possible for them to get as much information possible to make the decision as to whether, do we wanna keep him as the 13th or the 14th forward? Do we wanna risk setting him through waivers, 'cause he's just not that important to us? That makes sense. Brink, on the other hand, was surprised, because not only in our minds, he a locked to at least make the team, but he also had a fantastic game last night. Here's what I think it was, because I specifically asked John Tortorella what the thinking was. He mentioned that Garnet Hathaway was supposed to play in this game. And the reason why he's not is because Garnet Hathaway's wife is like in that weird spot where she might go into labor at any time, but she's not quite in labor yet. And they don't want him to be up in Montreal when they find out that she has to get rushed to the hospital. So he's staying local primarily. People will probably get in Thursday's game because it's local, and they could always pull him out of the lineup if they have to. But I don't think they want him in Montreal in case he's gonna miss the birth of his kit. So I wouldn't be surprised if Brink is the replacement for Hathaway. And also there's an element too, where I met the fliers are intrigued. They saw a really good performance by Brink last night. You have an opportunity to find something else about a guy. Why not throw him back out there and see what he can do? I think that's where they're at. - That was my thinking was, all right, yeah, the Garnet Hathaway thing, that kind of adds another level to it, but they could play literally anybody. You know, there's no shortage of wingers for this team in this organization. That said, I think this is a test for Bobby Brink. What did he struggle with last year? Habits and consistency. That's what we heard. Is he consistent enough? Does he have the same habits day in, day out? All right, you played a great game last night. Congratulations, Bobby, we're happy for you. Go be better tonight. Go can show us that same player two nights in a row. Like I think this is kind of one of those early tests for Bobby Brink, and it's a great spot for him to kind of prove that he has put in the work and improved in the areas the team asked him to in the off season. I think this is a really good early test for Bobby Brink. And as a fan of his, I'm just hoping for another game like that 'cause I wanna see him in the lineup every single night. I think he is one of these guys. No, he's not a first round pick and he's not, yeah, oh man, diamond in the rough in the fifth round, but a second round pick who's put up the numbers he did in college, you're really kind of hoping that you got a little something here out of this second round pick. And I think they did. I just wanna see a little, just wanna see it more. Just wanna see that guy more often that we saw in Bobby Brink. The Uluksel thing is interesting too. Again, that makes sense, but scored a pretty nice goal last night. What'd you think of his game otherwise? - I didn't love it. I thought the goal was great. You know, he's behind the play, gets a nice pass out front, makes a nice move. He went a long way towards redeeming himself with that goal, but the reason why he needed redemption is because I thought for the first two periods, he was not very good. He takes a really bad penalty, puck over the glass, not really under much pressure. I thought defensively, he made some mistakes. He wasn't that noticeable offensively until that play in the third. So I have been impressed by Lixell during the scrimmages, especially the very first day of scrimmages. I think he was really good in those. I was not impressed for the first two periods of Sunday's game. I actually had already had it written up in my thing of I don't think he played that well. And then he scores the goal. And then I'm like, okay, I gotta change my write up because suddenly now I can't just say he was bad. He scored a goal. But I do think that he needs to show more if he wants to make this team. - All right, the next place I want to go. Yeah, a lot of guys I think really stood out last night. We're going to talk about Jet Luchenko. We're going to talk about Joel Faraby, all the guys who put up the numbers. I want to start, I want to go to Carson Bjornison here, Charlie, because I am really starting to like this guy a lot. Every time I watch him, he's good. That's, you know, again, it's not as if he was super tested. He played the third period. He stopped nine out of nine, good for him. And he doesn't turn 20 until next June. So he's going back. You know, it's, there's no room in the NHL and he's not allowed to play in the AHL. If he was a few months older, would he be a phantom right now? - I don't know because I do think there is part of them. They definitely want to see him make a push for Team Canada. I guess in fear for the world juniors, I guess in theory, he could go to the AHL and still be let go for Team Canada. But there's an element too, where I think they do want, I don't think they want to put too much on this guy. Also, he wasn't very good last year. He, and that's not, he might even talking about the, the fact that his numbers weren't very good. Everyone I've talked to has told me he was wildly inconsistent. That yes, he didn't have a ton of support. The Brandon Lee Kings team in front of him was not very good, but he gave up a lot of weak goals. There would be some nights where he just wouldn't have some nights he would be great, he would be on. Some nights he just didn't have. And the guy I saw in development can very much look like that guy, where there were some days where he just couldn't stop beach ball. Team like, and again, maybe this is just a hot streak. I don't know. But it does seem like something may have clicked for him this summer because he went to the World Junior Showcase in Plymouth and apparently excelled. He looked really good. And then from the jump in rookie camp, he's looked really good, it was real good in the rookie games. So far in camp, he's looked like he belongs. Look, he's not an NHL goal. He needs a lot of work and they need to at some point, you know, whether it's next summer in development camp, whether it's next year in the NHL, they're going to need to work with him technique wise and start to molds him into the goalie they think he can be. But I think he's definitely, at least for me, he's done a lot over this past month to raise him in my personal estimation because I came into this rookie camp, not thinking particularly highly, of course, of the artist at all. And now I can see why they're excited about it. Like I get it now, before I was taking them on faith, now I've seen it and I can say, yeah, there's something here. - No, when just looking at and thinking about, like, okay, how do we rank the Flyers goalie prospects like in our head or if we're going to make a depth chart and, you know, if Kolosov was here, I'd have him and Zavragan both ahead of Bjarnison just the way I think about it and watching him play. I mean, yeah, maybe Kolosov's better, but he's not a hockey player right now. So he doesn't count towards the rackings and Zavragan. Yeah, he's looking good in the KHL, but Bjarnison's doing it right in front of me. And I think I'm right there with you where it's like, yeah, he's growing on me. I like what I see and this is kind of where, I know they want guys to have the slow development process, dominate your level, they have goals for him, like push for Team Canada. And that's great if he's able to do that and, you know, just kind of conquer each level as it comes. But I just look at it and I know there's nothing that can be done because AHL, CHL age restrictions exist. But I just look at it and go, all right, you like this guy's tools, you don't like the team in front of him in Brandon. Wouldn't it be nice if you could get your hands on him a year earlier, you know, like, and start turning him into that goalie you want to turn him into? But we must wait because that's the way things are, Charlie. Yeah, that's the way the rules are. He's too young to go to the AHL. I see where you're coming from. I just don't know if he's ready for the AHL and I don't want him to go to the AHL. I wouldn't want him to go to the AHL and just get obliterated. But I do see where you're coming from and that it would be nice to get him working with development coaches on a daily basis, just be in their orbit rather than being far away. I get where you're coming from. I don't necessarily share that wish for him, per se. There's another guy who we're gonna be talking about who I really wish he could go to the AHL. That would be, I think, the ideal for this guy. Instead, they are gonna have a very, very interesting conversation on their hands about him. I don't know if we want to do the Adri before we get into one Jet Luchenko. I want to do just quick on Fadotov, then the Adri did Luchenko. Fadotov stopped 10 of 12. I thought he looked pretty normal for the most part. One time where he kind of lost his net a little bit, but recovered and looked okay. Made a couple of saves directly after that. What did you see in Fadotov? - It's funny, I thought he was mostly fine. - Yeah. - I would say, that said, I talked to people who watched on television. It doesn't seem like you share this, man. A lot of people who watched on television did not come away impressed with Fadotov. That a lot of people seem to think that, like, he just doesn't look good. Even when he's making the saves, he doesn't look comfortable. He doesn't look technically sound. I don't know if a six foot seven goalie is ever going to make it look pretty though. But it's kind of one of those things where I guess we're going to find out when the games are real. - No, and that's what this year's about. It is like you put in your state of the franchise. This is a fact finding mission this season and finding out about the two goalies, Fadotov being one of them, is a huge part of this season. And I thought, yeah, like, impressed. I don't know. I don't know. I just thought he looked mostly fine. Like he said, I don't know if I was impressed, but he stopped all the shots. I wanted him to stop. He's going to look awkward because he's six foot seven. Like, I don't know how smooth he's ever going to look. But I thought he was completely fine. If he plays like that as the backup this year, I bet he's okay. That's just kind of where I was with my assessment of Ivan Fadotov. Now, it's only pre-season, Charlie, but we still have our opinions. There's still some people fired up for the season coming. And that's why sometimes we just need to chill. And the best way to chill, it's with that ice cold, Coors Light. Between work, social media, the choices life throws our way, the world. It's no wonder we're more worked up than ever. 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Is it gonna be tough to send him back for this coaching staff who's like, he's a center, we need those. - I think it has to be a conversation though. And it's all credit to Jet Luchenko because I don't think they enter camp believing that he will still look this good, this late. Like, he was real good at development camp, you expect that. He's a first round pick, come on. Like, they're supposed to look real good at development camps when you're a first round pick and you were taking it in the first half of the draft. He was good in rookie camp. When you kind of expect that, you expect again, first round pick. Maybe he gets a little overwhelmed physically, but the one thing you say about Jet Luchenko is he's a workaholic, he's a workout freak, and he physically can handle playing against guys who were 24/25. So, okay, check that box. I really thought that last night was gonna be the first time where you saw, yeah, he's not quite ready. And instead, he was one of the best five or six players on the ice for the Flyers. - An absolute standout without a doubt. Obviously, the skating pops, but what I keep going back to is he's not a small little speedster out there, man. He is a strong guy. He can hold his own and it shows. He comes away with a few assists last night. The playmaking is coming around. Obviously, it's something they want him to work on. You know, work on that creativity. You know, invent new moves and ways of getting to the net and getting the puck towards the net against the lesser competition. But man, this would be one where you go. It would be cool if he could play like 45 games in the AHL and then we see. Like that would be very cool, right? - Yeah, he is the ideal guy where, especially given the fact that Guelph, his team, the Guelph Storm and the OHL, they're not very good. So, he goes back there. He is gonna be essentially asked to carry that team. He's gonna be playing 20 minutes a night. He's gonna be probably feathering Great Pass as a teammate. They can't finish because they're not very good. That's a frustration point. And the fact that I think he's physically capable of holding up in the per game, the AHL would be a great spot for him. Unfortunately, he's too young. He's not allowed. It's NHL or OHL. That's the nature of the agreement between the NHL and the Canadian Hockey Leagues, the Major Junior Leagues, that you have to be 20 years old. Or if you're not 20 years old, the only way you can get brought up to pro game is to play in the NHL. So, that is not allowed. That is straight up, not allowed. So, put that dream out of your head. I just, where I'm at with this right now is, I do think it would be best for his development for him to go back to Juniors, foster that creativity. I don't want him, like, I think he could, I think he could play right now and be, like, a Ryan McCloud type, where he leans on a speed, he forechecks, and he's at perfectly fine 3C. Might be a better 3C right now than Scott Lawton or Ryan Paylay. I do think that he would be better served fostering the creativity where he can make plays and has more time and space. I do think that's better for him. That's it, and this is what brings me back to, I don't know, maybe they will. It's really, really hard for a front office and a coaching staff to go into a room of players, and they all have watched this kid, and they know he's earned it and tell them, "Sorry, yes, we know this guy would make you guys better, a better team, but you can't have it." I'm not saying you can't do it. The Flyers certainly have the ability to say, "Sorry, we're looking for the future." They traded away Sean Walker when they were in the middle of the playoff race. They can do it, but it's hard. It's hard to do. And you know John through the rel. If Luchenko plays this well for another two weeks, John through the rel is gonna be in that room saying, "This guy might be the second best center I have on this team, let alone the third. I need him on this team." Like, "You coach me to win, and we will win more games." If this version of Jet Luchenko is in our lineup at the very least for a couple of weeks, I think it's gonna be an interesting conversation because while the Flyers are certainly still rebuilding, and they are looking towards the future, there are times where you can't lie to the players, and you can't say, "No, he's actually not ready." And I can tell you this, based on what I've heard, like, there are multiple players in that room that are just like, "Damn, this kid can play." Like, this kid's got it, and that's exciting. - All right, two questions for you based on that. One, we touched on this a little, I think last week. Sean Caturier, and Caturier is older than Jet Luchenko, by, like, Caturier turned 19 in, like, December of his rookie year, I believe, and we know Jet just turned 18, like, what, the last week of August or something. - August, yeah, in August. - He is eight freakin' teen, he's a young kid. But do you think Sean Caturier's development? 'Cause it took a while for him to become the player he ultimately became, with scoring and Selky level, defense, putting it all together. Do you think Sean Caturier's development was, if not hampered, at least, like, slowed by, by him playing at such a young age and being put into such a specific role at such a young age? - Honestly, yes, and I wanna clarify, I don't think that Caturier will would have become a better player, eventually, if he would have been sent back to the minors or back to juniors, you know, instead of making that team right off the, you know, right out of his draft here. I think he was gonna become what he was gonna become, which was, which is, we'll see what version of him we get this year. But Pete Caturier was a near-point-per-game, Selky level 1-6. I think that was always going to be Caturier ceiling. I don't think they missed out on 100-point Caturier because they kept him and that was wrong. However, I do have a suspicion that he might have gotten to that point faster if they would have let him focus on the creative side of his offensive game, rather than throwing him into a three-c, four-c role right from the jump, because I just think that he got, he started to develop habits, habits of not making the creative play, instead making the safe play, because he's playing with like Zachron Aldo and Matt Greet. And it's like, well, if I make the creative play, they're not going to probably finish it anyway, so I might as well just play it safe. And I do think that had he been pushed quicker in a direction of, no, make the creative play, make the skilled play. I think that breakout that happened, what, like age 25 for him, the big offensive breakout, that maybe happens at 22 or 23. And that's kind of where I'm coming from with Luchenko because I could easily see Luchenko doing the same thing, where he makes the NHL and he just gets in the habit of not making the difficult play, making the easy one. And it's especially important for me with Luchenko because I watched his, I watched his take from last year. I scouted this guy, not as a professional scout, but like, I'm not coming to this blind. And the thing that worried me about him, why I didn't have him in my top-top tier with all those other guys that were in the, you know, that two to 13 range, why he was one tier below that for me, was because the skill, the passing creativity, you could see it, but it wasn't consistent enough. And like, compare him to say Mitchkoff, okay? I'm not worried that Mitchkoff will play safe in the NHL because his skill game is developed. Like, he's gonna try to make those plays because that is part and parcel of who he is, and that is ingrained in his head to try to make skill plays because I can do it. I don't think Luchenko is at a point with his confidence where he knows he's gonna be able to make those plays. Yet, I think he can get there, but I feel like if you throw him in the NHL right now, I worry that he may just plait up. And he may just be like, well, I can do this, and I'm an NHLer, so I'll just keep doing this because it must be good enough. And then maybe you're missing out on some of that offensive creativity that he could develop if you put him in a place where he has time and space. He has the ability to, like, rather than just make the chip, he can make a guy miss. And then make a high danger pass across the slot that in the NHL, he wouldn't even have the opportunity to try to make because the defenseman is just on you. They're bigger and faster and quicker, and there's just less time out there to make plays. I'd like to give him more time to get comfortable making those plays, and I think that's more likely to happen to junior level than it will be in the NHL. - I begrudgingly agree. It's probably for the best for Jet Luchenko and this team in the long-term, which we've been told time and time again, that is the priority, not right now, the long-term for him to go back to juniors. That said, I'm glad you brought up Sean Caturier's line mates from that time when he was young 'cause he was in that 3C 4C role. He's playing a ton with Matt Reed. Now, no disrespect to Matt Reed. Guy had fine really good seasons in the NHL as a goal scorer and a two-way forward. Also, they like, oh yeah, let's try out Zach Ronaldo in a third-line role and put him with koots, it'll work. Like, looking at what the lineup could potentially be, Jet Luchenko would perhaps be centering a line of Joel Faraby and Bobby Brink, you know? - Yeah, yeah. - That's a little different. Like, that is a scoring third line. There is no, oh yeah, just chip it in and chip and change. Like, that's not what that line would be. So maybe there's a possibility it could work, but ultimately, I think it's probably for the best. Did you send him back? Maybe he gets in at the end of the year or something and next year we're off to the races, I guess. It's very, it's very depressing, Charlie, 'cause he could be so much fun. - Well, I'm not ruling out the possibility he makes this team because he's playing well enough that they're gonna have to have a conversation. I guess John Twitter around today, more or less, like, if it gets to the point at the end of camp where he's still playing this well, do you as a head coach even think about the development aspect or are you just going to that meeting and say this guy will make us better right now? And towards kind of rounds about it, but he eventually got back to like, hey, I'm the coach and I'm gonna express my opinion in those meetings and then I understand that Danny and Josie might be looking at contracts and timelines and things like that, but as the coach, I'm gonna express my opinion and then they're gonna decide whether they want to take my opinion or not, but he more or less said without saying it. If Jelly Shaco keeps playing this well, I'm gonna go into that meeting at the end of camp and I'm gonna say we need to keep this guy because he's one of the four best centers right now and I want to win games. Like, hell, I don't even, this might be Johnson Rose last year as an NHL head coach. Like we don't know, every year there's the possibility he might decide to hang him up and if he's watching a guy looking great in preseason and killing it in drills and impressing guys on the team who are long time NHLers, I understand why he's gonna go to that meeting and say, I need this guy. You can't send him back, I need this guy. - I realize, like I'm glad he's like, if he keeps playing this well, like that is a major caveat as well. - It is. - He has to keep really standing out because if there's any reason where it's like, oh yeah, then it's an easy decision for the front office. If it were to happen though, Jet Luchenko plays in three, four preseason games and lights it up, you know, point a game, whatever. One of the best players in the ice clearly looks like he can be in NHL center immediately. Would the flyers, do you think, trade one of maybe like Noah Kates or Scott Lawton? Probably not Lawton at this point. I think he's a flyer for life. But just to open up a little bit of space here, like one of these swing centers who can be in that bottom six, like do you think they move them or just go with 14 forwards? That's always a possibility. - I think they would just go with 14 forwards. I would guess it probably pushes Kates out of a lineup, which might happen anyway, especially if they want to Luria in there to be the bodyguard for Michoff, the way that they've been talking since the summer. So Kates might be out of the lineup. Anyway, maybe it pushes the Luria out of the lineup. He has the leg up on Kates at the moment because of that specific reason. I don't know, I just think they like Noah Kates and I don't think they're going to, especially given the fact that even if Luchenko does make the team, that doesn't mean he's going to be here all year. He could just be getting the nine game audition because this is something, I do want to explain this for our listeners of viewers that don't fully understand. - That's good, yeah. - Because when people talk about the nine game audition, the reason why they talk about the nine game audition is this. For junior level guys, you are allowed to give a guy nine games in the NHL before it counts against the first year of his entry level contract. So the way the flyers could theoretically do is they could give him nine games and then send him back to juniors, they were allowed to do that. And then next year, it would still theoretically be year one of the entry level contract rather than year two. And if you're paying attention to things like contention timelines and making it so a guy doesn't necessarily get a raise quicker because you've got a caps to navigate everything like that, that does matter. So there is a chance that Luchenko could make the team stick it out for nine games and they could spread that out too. Like it doesn't have to be the first nine. He could play, you know, he could play two games week one, one game week, week two. And then he could still be here through November. I don't know if they're necessarily gonna do that. I'm just saying it's been done before. Other teams have done that. But point being is that I don't know if you go out and you rush to trade and know a kates, knowing that there is a non-zero chance that by the end of October, you might need them because Luchenko might be going back to Guelph anyway. - Yeah, that's, I'm glad you mentioned that they could spread it out part. 'Cause I wanted, I was gonna ask, do you know if it's individual games or team games and it's individual games? - It is games played. - Yeah, it's games played. That's good and the, as soon as I asked it, I was like, what if they were to send him back? Why would they make that trade? Like I was like, oh yeah, that's stupid. But I was just curious. We tackled that part and now, oh yeah. Before we move on, we're gonna talk about Mishkov. We're gonna talk about some other guys. We gotta talk about True Mark Financial Credit Union, our friends at True Mark, that's right. They want you to know that they get it. The idea of switching from your big bank, where you have all your debit cards, all your accounts linked for your direct deposit and all your auto pay bills, they get that it sounds kind of like a huge pain to maybe switch over to True Mark Financial Credit Union from the bank that you've been at for so long. But they make it super easy for you to do and all you have to do to find out how easy, it's go to truemark.com/phly. Or go into one of their dozens of local branches where you'll get personalized service and find out just how easy it is to make the switch. Now, why should you make the switch? You know the reasons by now. 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That's all like, what if this whole story is building to one scene, Morgan Frost Stanley Cup winner? Like that would be amazing story. What if that's what this whole story has been about the whole time? He's on a line right now with Owen Tippett and Matt Vay, Mitch Kove liked what we saw out of them, some good puck movement on power play and at five on five. Couple of goals for Morgan Frost. What did you like in his game last night? - I just thought he played. I know that's a very hockey cliche, but he just, he looked basically like the same guy from last year. There wasn't much rust there. He just looked like him, which to me in the first game of the preseason, after going through three days of towards death skates, that's pretty darn impressive. - Yeah, that's, I think the chemistry was pretty impressive, just finding ability for Mitch Kove and Frost and Tippett all to find each other. I thought the team's chemistry as a whole looked good considering like Twitter relatives and break out the pucks until day two. And then all of a sudden like, oh yeah, we're heading down to DC to go play a game. I thought they looked all pretty solid. What did you, what did you think of the trio of those guys together? - I didn't mind it. I'm not sure. I think I like the Frost Mitch Kove duo. I don't know if Tippett is the right guy to be the three, just because, I mean, and again, this was first game of the preseason. I want to make any sweeping judgments here, but he very much kind of felt like he was a little bit on an island, and I don't know. Like to me, Tippett is a guy who you want is like the centerpiece of a line, not as just like the other guy. And there were too many shifts where he felt like just the other guy on the line, whereas like Mitch Kove and Frost, they're working their magic passing-wise. And to be clear, I thought Mitch Kove was fine in this game. He did look tired. He definitely didn't have talked about how he had burst in, did you lose me there? - For a second, but you're back. - Okay, but remember how I talked about in the rookie game about how I thought Mitch Kove looked faster than he did in the KHL? And I mentioned it's probably because he was playing through pneumonia or the after effects of the pneumonia through most of that season. That probably sapped some of his speed, his quickness. Well, on Sunday, he looked like the guy from KHL. He looked slower. It wasn't that he looked slow. He just didn't have that same jump. And I do think it's because of the three days of camp. I think that was the reason. I think that, and Don John Turnarella essentially said that today. He said straight up that Mitch Kove looked a little slower. And I think that's just because he's getting used to the fact that my camps are real tough and he's not used that. One of the reasons why I think the flyers on the hull had better legs is because a lot of these guys have been through multiple towards camps. Mitch Kove has it. The one exception, notably, is Luchenko because he looks real fast regardless. But that guy, I guess, is just a fitness freak. Yeah, that's Luchenko. He's just going to stand out because of the way he skates. But on top of that, the fact that he does have those legs after three days of camp is pretty impressive. And it's yet another, you know, it's another check in the box of like, could this could this dude do it? Like a maligned draft pick at the time. Make this team easy maligned. I think people were just surprised. I, maybe he wasn't maligned. Like people, okay, we see what they're going for. They needed a center. They needed some speed. They liked that. But the decision to not take one of them guys whose names we knew better. Consta Helanias, Zev Buoyam. These are guys whose names we just heard more often. And for better or worse, that means we think that they are better. Like, that's just the way drafts go. And you don't know for years later who's right and who was wrong. But I do think the front office was taking some heat for the selection. Oh, absolutely. I just don't think fans were shitting on Luchenko. I think they were skeptical of the flyers and the decision to take him over guys that were more highly touted. But in the end, and we talked about this multiple times over the last couple of months, in the end, and this is one of the great parts about sports, we're going to find out if they were right or not. If Luchenko is real, real good. And so far, he's passed it every test. He's real, real good. He's going to prove them right. It doesn't matter that he wasn't the chalk pick in that spot. If he's what they think he can be, then we're going to say it was a brilliant pick. Just like had Ron Heckstall taken Murahase in an overnolipatric in the moment, we would have ripped them. It would have been criticized, criticized, criticized. We would have been leading the charge because we were so excited about Nolan Patrick. But two years down the road, we would have been saying thank you Ron because you made the right pick. And this could be the flip side of that. - It absolutely could. I forget where we were going with that. But yeah, it was-- - We were talking about-- - We were talking about Mary. Yeah, it would be funny. We were talking about Mitch Koff, we were talking about Frost. So we can go back to that. I thought Mitch Koff was good in this game. The one thing that really stands out to me so far, and I do think there are other elements of his game that are going to pop over time as he gets more comfortable with his line mates as he starts to get that energy back, 'cause I think that's been sapped a little bit. But the one key part of his game that seems like he's translating very, very quickly. And I believe it was, I think it was Sandheim today who mentioned it without being asked about it, the passing. This guy can pass, and it's really exciting. I haven't tracked any of these games, but there's one stat it's basically called like scoring chance contributions. So it's like how many scoring chances did you create for yourself, where you were the guy who had the scoring chance, but also how many scoring chances did you have the primary pass on? He is setting up so many scoring chances because he's not passing the fuck around the perimeter. He's passing the fuck into the slot, into dangerous areas, you solve that one goal later in the game on the power play, where he basically threads a pass through a checker, too far to be in the bumper, and then that sends the entire penalty kill into a state of chaos, because you shouldn't be able to make that pass. He makes it, and then suddenly everybody's panicking because a guy has the puck in a dangerous area. If Mitch golf from the jump can make those passes, he's gonna score a lot of points early before even the rest of his game even fully comes together. - No, the idea that not only are these good passes, they're impressive just in their execution, they're always an attack. He is trying to get the puck into the dangerous area. He had one from behind the net last night where he just kind of squeaked it right out into the slot, and I don't even think he found anybody, but I was like, if he can do that consistently, yeah, he's just gonna put up points 'cause that's what happens. - Yeah, enough scoring chances set up. Some goals are gonna go in. And I was really happy with that. Speaking of a pass from down low into the bumper though. Bumper Fariby on the power play, Charlie. Four points he had that power play goal picked up three more assists. Fariby's a guy, obviously he was gonna make the team. Like that was, yeah, he's a flyer. But there were the trade talks, the idea that maybe he would be the odd man out 'cause there's not an obvious spot for him in the top six right now. What his role might be, I tackled it a little bit in my video, the three stars video that we put out on social media. Like is he on that third line? Is it like him and Brink with, who knows? Lawton, Poehling, Kate's, you know? Like not maybe Luchenko, who's to say? - Luchenko, yeah. It's just like a very weird spot for Joel Fariby right now where he's trying at least in my eyes to establish a role for himself. Like what does Joel Fariby do for this team? It's XYZ. I like him in that bumper spot on the power play. That's a cool thing. - I do. I think he's the kind of guy where I think everyone has just forgotten. And I get, I truly do get it because he was real, real bad from February on. Basically, since they came back from the All Star Break, he was not good. So I understand why this is going on in people's heads. He was really, really good from October through January, really, really got going in like December and January. He was great. And it's not even like, we talk about him needing a bounce back. Like, or needing a breakout. Like he doesn't even need to get better. He just needs to go back to being the guy he was in the first four months of the season. And the Flyers have a darn good player. And if he can, that was almost entirely to even strength. If he can go back to being that guy even strength, and then the power play gets better just because Mitch Koff is on it and he's making those kind of passes. If he ends up being a guy on that top unit and he's certainly in the mix to be on that top unit. He could be a third line or even strength and a top unit power play guy. He's gonna put up some numbers. I never got low on Joe Fair. Even though he had a real bad finish of the year, I still, even Joe Faraday is a player. I don't even think it's crazy. And I don't think he's gonna get the first look at this. I don't. I don't even think it's that early crazy to think that he could end up on a line with Mitch Koff. Like if it's, if it's Frost Mitch Koff, like I like Faraday more as the left wing on that line than I do tip it. I think Faraday is a more balanced player who can score and pass whereas if it's more just a pure shooter. I don't know if I want a pure shooter on a line with, with Mitch Koff. I could see Joel Faraday working out on that line by the same token. He has shown real chemistry dating back to last year with Bobby Brink. So if all he is, the third line or even strength and those two guys just click, he could put up points there too. - He absolutely could. And I think Faraday, like just that little thing, like could he play with Mitch Koff? I think he could. It would depend on the center for me just because with a lefty shooting right wing and then maybe a lefty shooting left wing, like, okay, how do we, how do we make this work here? But yeah, they'd figure that out. Before we wrap up today's show, I'm gonna thank all of our diehards. We could not do what we do here at PHly without you. If you're not a diehard, what are you doing? Go to allphly.com right now, sign up to be a diehard. The amount of content Charlie is pumping out. I made a threat of it today. All of the pre-season stuff that we've done going back to rookie camp. And it's like 20 tweets long. It's ridiculous. You wanna be a diehard to get all of our premium content and so many other benefits. All right, Chuck, is there, before we get to the super chats, is there anyone else who stood out to you last night that we didn't tackle yet? I kind of nailed everybody. I mean, we talked about attending, we talked about Barbie, we talked about Frost. I think, yeah, I think we pretty much nailed everybody. All right, let's hit the super chats. I think we have two so far. This first one is from Adam S. What was up with Tippett out there last night, he looked invisible. Sorry if you've already covered it. I'm a little behind the live stream. And yeah, Charlie talked about this. He did have the nice setup on the on the Farraby goal. It was him down low, right? I think it's like Charlie said, you have two guys in Mitchkov and Frost who dominate the puck. They are guys who have the puck on their stick a lot and there's only one of them. There'll be nights maybe if the three of them stay together. It's, man, Tippett was just outstanding and where the hell was Mitchkov, you know? That could happen as well. Last night, I think that's, it was just kind of three guys who all need the puck. There's only one. - Yeah, and there's also something to remember as well. And it maybe kind of got lost a little bit because most of the big name guys out there played really well in that preseason game. This is preseason. The veterans are not necessarily going out there with the goal of dominating. I mean, obviously they'd like to. They're competitors, it's a hockey game. But, oh, and Tippett just looking meh in the first preseason game is not even close to cause for concern. Like these guys are playing themselves back into rhythm. I don't think they're playing themselves back in a shape because you have to be in incredible shape to survive a John Twitter World training camp. But I think they're playing themselves back into rhythm. You know, just getting their time back and their touch back. And it's in no way shape before my concern that oh, and Tippett didn't look great in this game. I worry a little bit about whether he fits with that line stylistically. And that might be a long term thing. It might not, we'll see. But yeah, I agree. Tippett wasn't anything special in the first preseason game. Just don't forget that it was the first preseason game. - He scored 55 goals over the last two seasons. I expect him to be somewhere between 27 and 30 goals again. Yeah, I can't worry about the preseason for. There's a lot of guys on a like on a bubble where we're not quite sure where they fit. Tippett signed long term and he showed us who he is the last two years. It's definitely not a concern. All right, let's get that next super chat in. From Hatrick, Patrick, I honestly think a player like Luchenko could develop in the NHL just as well unless he's got some sort of maturity issues 'cause he still is very young. And that is. - Oh, he does, so. - Yeah, he's a very mature kid. - Yeah, absolutely. And that's one of the things I think he has going for him is yeah, he makes the team at 18 and he's like, oh, we gotta keep an eye on this kid. Like this was a guy who said, yeah, during the pandemic, all my friends are playing video games. So I built a gym in the garage. Like I do think he is the kind of guy who one has the maturity and two has the work ethic to develop the NHL where it wouldn't just be, all right, I'm good. You know, they set me up on the third line. I'm gonna be a checking center and that's all I am. I think he wants to score and score quite a bit and he would be able to develop. It's probably best to send him back, but man, just looking at what this lineup could be. Faraby Luchenko Brink is a lot more exciting than Faraby Lawton Brink. That's all I'm saying. - Yes, I just, if we're going by, if we're going by like a basic comparison, it's like if you have a kid who shows, you're teaching a how to swim. He's seven years old, you have swimming lessons. First week, he's killing it. Like man, he's picking these things up quick. He's got to end along on staying afloat, master of the doggy paddle, and he's doing the normal strokes fine. So then you throw him into the middle of the ocean where he can't touch the bottom and there's a current. And like, yeah, he might be able to survive for a while because he's just doggy paddle and staying afloat. But is he going to learn breaststroke and butterfly and all those other things there? And maybe, but it's going to be a lot harder than doing it in a more controlled environment where it's not that high pressure. - Charlie is already turning. He's already got ideas of turning his first born into the next Michael Phelps. All right, I believe that does it for super chats and that will do it for our show today. Thank you all for listening. Thank you for hanging out. If you haven't already, you got to hit that subscribe button. Follow us right here on YouTube. Set that reminder bell where we'll be back at four o'clock for all of our non-game day shows this week. We will have post games for the games on Thursday and Saturday this week. So make sure you tune in for those pregame and postgame this year. So make sure you tune in for all of that. Follow us on Twitter @PHLY_Fliers and follow the podcast as well. Just search "PHLY_Fliers" wherever you get your podcast. All right, my name's Bill Matts. That's Charlie O'Connor. Until tomorrow, you stay loose and sexy, Philly. (upbeat music)
Charlie & Bill react to the preseason opener, and what’s next for some key players pushing to make the roster.
