(upbeat music) - Welcome to Equating's eventing podcast and listeners, we have another classic show for you. Burley is done and dusted, so we thought this would be the perfect time to go back and listen to when Nicole met Ros. This show was first released back in 2020, February 2020, in fact, and it's a fantastic insight into how Ros has made her way to the top, her thoughts and challenges with motherhood and competing, and her fascinating approach to how she had to learn to go fast across country, because we all know her now as the rider who very often is clear inside the time. She showed her super speedy cross country riding on multiple occasions, but I found it really interesting how she had to learn that skill and it didn't all come naturally to her. So, we hope you enjoy this little look back on the career of Ros Canter. - Welcome to Equating's eventing podcast and a very special episode. Listeners, this is one we have been looking to do for a little while, and we have got for you none other than the world champion. Welcome to Equating's eventing podcast, Ros Canter. - Thank you, hello. - We cannot wait to talk to you about your story, but just does hearing world champion still give you a little shiver? - Yes, definitely. Yes, so properly, well. So, yeah, it's quite odd. - Yeah, I thought it was bad for me to do that actually. Yeah, when I went to do some training with Caroline Moore, who joined me and I'll be, and I still think it's funny that that's what we did. - Yeah, but you did, you are the world champion. We're gonna talk about that a little bit later on in the show, but first of all, talk to me about your childhood growing up. Were you horsey? Did you know you always wanted to ride and to sort of grow up to be an event rider? - Yes, we were horsey, but we didn't grow up on the kind of eventing scene, particularly. My mum owns a farm, and I've got two older sisters, and we spent our childhood packing round the stubble fields and playing Cowboys and Indians and generally having a good time at pony club with our friends. So we were always competitive at riding, but never kind of on a national scale. So yeah, and we spent lots of time playing other sports as well. So I was just very sporty more than particularly horsey. And yeah, I got into it kind of in a bigger way after university. - Bye, other sports. You were a very successful hockey player for a little while, weren't you? - Well, I played first team hockey at university. So I played quite a lot. Yeah, I played quite a lot at university and I played club hockey kind of before and after that. And I did quite a lot of running when I was younger, but a lot less now. - Was there ever any desire to go down a professional route in a different sport? - No, I don't think so, because I always did the riding as well. We never kind of pursued any of the sport in a kind of put enough time into another sport. So no, I don't think there was ever a chance of that. Although I do think if I had access to it more as a young, if I didn't to triathlons in pony club, which we didn't do 'cause our pony club didn't do it, I wouldn't be surprised if I'd gone down the modern pentathlon route. - Okay. - Actually, because I did do one at university, I found the national championships for the university stuff and I took myself off and learned how to fence and shoot and went to have a go. I wasn't too bad at it. So probably, I imagine if I'd got into that at a younger age, I might have gone down that route. But yeah, I just grew up kind of playing sport and having an outdoors lifestyle. And I was always a lot more into the horses and my sisters and absolutely obsessed with watching Babington in the early videos. I got one every Christmas in my stocking and used to sit. That's what I did on Christmas day. I sat and watched the video until I memorized it. - Amazing. - So I was kind of really, I was quite interested, but I don't think it was ever kind of, we didn't know enough as a family to say that's what I wanted to do when I was older. - That was gonna be it for you. What about university? What did you go off to study? - I did sport science at university at Sheffield Hallum. Had a brilliant time, absolutely loved it. And played lots of sports, met lots of good people. - And then came away from university. And that was that when you decided to pursue eventing? - No, probably less so then. I rode all the way through university. So I'd go home at weekends and ride a bit. And we always had the odd pony in for schooling and taught the local children and things. So I always, that was always my summer job really, was with the horses. And then I actually had quite a tricky horse at the time and I wasn't really enjoying it. And my friends were doing me to go traveling. So I went traveling for four months and got the bug. And loved the traveling more than I think I loved riding the horse I had at the time. - Okay. - So when I got hurt, oh, where do I go? I went, I did the kind of standard young persons traveling route, I did Australia, New Zealand, Thailand. - Okay. - And then I got home and my mum said, and I said to mum, I quite like to go off and see other parts of the world. And she said, that's fine, but we need to sell the horse. So if you could hang around for the summer, then you can go and do whatever you like. And that's when I had a dress size session with Judy Gradwell and I asked her if she knew of anybody that needed some help her because I needed to earn some money. And she said, actually, I quite like the way you ride which you come and ride my young horses. And that's how I fell into it. - And that's all how it all started. So you went to do the... And on a, basically, I suppose a short term, so much of initially, but you were there for a good couple of years in the end, weren't you? - I did four years with Judy and never did, it was never a full time thing. I kind of went two or three days a week and go to the horses and then had the yard at home. So kind of gradually the yard built up from just having kind of ponative for schooling and things like that to having better horses and that's how it really all started. - And did you know then that actually eventing was absolutely what you wanted to do and to sort of a career that was your path? - I'm not sure, really. I think deep down, I probably always wanted to ride horses. It's what I love doing. I probably never thought I was good enough and I don't think that changed particularly whilst I was at Judy's, although with her help and spending time doing young horses, I got a lot more confidence. And I think that's kind of when I started to think, well, actually maybe I do want to do this. Or maybe I thought I could do it well, well enough. But I've kind of suffered a bit with believing in myself, my entire career really. So it wasn't until the last, you know, the last three years, I'd say that I really thought that I was good enough, you know, to make it. So it's been a steady old process. A steady job, what made you change that sort of mindset? Was it something you worked on? Or was it just actually became more confident in yourself and abilities and the structure and team you had around you that actually felt no, the ingredients here are right? - Well, so I'd always been good at the dressage and the show jumping was fairly okay. And I could always ride all the different fences across the country, but I was really out of my comfort zone riding at speed. - Okay. - And when I went to my first birthday with All-Star B, I genuinely walked the course and thought, there's absolutely no way this is going to happen. I thought it was huge. And I just couldn't imagine myself going around. And then Albee is a bit of a legend, as everyone knows. And we did get around quite easily. Actually, he gave me a really good ride. We had a city, 20 penalties, but he was amazing. And then I went back the next year and thought, now you kind of ought to get competitive now 'cause my dressage was good and the show jumped well. So Caroline and I did all my minute markers. And I came back with about 35 time faults, I think. And that was the turning point because I tried to go fast. I went out the stop box thinking I was going to try to get down my minute markers. And people, I think people went inside the time that year and I got 35 time faults. So that was the moment where I kind of sat down with my mum and said, what do you think? Do I just accept that I'm at the top level, I'm just average and maybe I'm better at producing young horses or do I try and find a way to overcome the issue of speed? And so that was the time. And then the next year I came visit Babington. - I was gonna say it was my reason. - Yeah, so from, I mean, that was, you first did Burley 2015, best British first-timer, then you went in 2016, which is the time we're talking about with time penalties. You then go to 2017. So Burley 2016 to Babington 2017 is what, eight months or something? - Yeah. - So what changed in those eight months to go from being actually really struggling with getting the speed going to all of a sudden coming home with 9.6 time penalties around a tough badminton track? - Yeah, so to start, I went to Chris Bartle for some help. I'd heard a few people say, you know, a few of my friends say they'd been up there for lessons and they'd had a great experience. So I thought, well, I'll go and give it a go. And I didn't take courses to start with. I just went up and we watched my videos and he talked me through them. And the thing that's really changed for me is having a system for riding cross-country 'cause we follow the rules and dress our gym. We follow the rules and show jumping and you tend to have a plan. And I never had a plan for cross-country and everyone used to say to me, well, if you're too slow, you just gallop faster. But that just didn't work for me. I couldn't, my brain doesn't work like that. I didn't like it. So what Chris and Caroline and everybody that supports me has helped me to do is create a system or a set of rules that I follow when I ride cross-country. And that's what I do. - What sort of rules are we? - I still don't find, you know, if someone said to just go and gallop at a huge rest and great table, I would find it hard unless I follow my rules. - Can we share the rules or an insight into them? - Yeah, I mean, it's literally just, I've right stepped down when I walked the course. So where I need to be looking, if there's a jump. So say there's a jump, I think, oh God, you know, I'm definitely gonna hook at that or do something stupid. Then instead of telling everybody that I don't like that jump, I don't let myself talk about it anymore. And I just follow my rules. So I'll find something else to look at, find a tree in the distance, try and ride to that. And then I have points where as I get closer to jump, I let my reins go longer so that I can't start to throttle the horse and slow them down, just things like that have really helped. - And it sounds like, I mean, those things actually made a massive difference in a short space of time because you went from the badminton result the way you finished fifth. And I think you were best of the Brits that year, which earned you a call up to the European Championships in Straygon, to going to Straygon, which was your senior debut. And it was a very twisty, tough cross-country track in terms of the time. I mean, twisty and sort of, it was fairly flat, I think, wasn't it? And would perhaps you would almost think wouldn't necessarily suit All Star B, who is massive. And you're all very small on top of them. But actually he came home four seconds over the time and only a couple made the time there. So it was a very, very close. And he was one of the quick rounds of the day. - And I think, to be honest, by getting up to that level and suddenly being competitive and being thrown into that environment where it's very high-pressured has also done me good. I'm good, I'm good under pressure because I follow my rules because I don't want to let anyone down. So I've actually learned to be very good in that environment. So I think the combination of finding assistant work for me and then very quickly going into high-pressured situations that actually kind of reinforced it more than anything. And then I think the other thing that I learned from all of it was that actually, see, I quite like everybody to say, "Oh, was that look really nice?" You look really stylish and I'm one of those people. And actually I've learned that you've just got to get the job done. And in Stregott, I certainly wasn't stylish at times, but I came back and I got the results. And I've learned that actually that's much more important than looking nice. And everybody's saying that that look great. You've got to go out and get it done. - You don't get it done in style. - No, and at badminton in 2018, it was wet, wasn't it? And quite, the horses got tired and I had a few less than that. I had a very less than perfect jumps towards the end of the course. And I came back, I remember coming through the finish and everyone's saying, "Well done." And I said to Chris Bartle, "God, that felt like, "that felt like one of the worst rounds I've ever ridden." And he turned around and said, "No, Rosie, it was one of your best because you made it happen." And that kind of stuck with me as well, but actually, you know, it's about coming through the finish. And that day I came through the finish and not a lot of people did. So you kind of got to forget the fact that maybe it didn't look the best. So it's all about that, really, with me. - I think that makes, it's a really, really interesting take on it, actually, because like you say, it's very easy to say, "Oh, go cross-country, like just go fast, just kick a bit more, take less pulls." But actually, there's more to it. And it's a system that you've obviously found that works for you and actually has been reinforced by some great results as well, which will no, don't have increased the confidence. - You say you're really good under pressure for a team environment. That is absolutely vital. Straygon was a pressurized environment for Team GB. It was the first gold medal that the team had won in quite some time. Did it give you a bit of a bargain in terms of being a team rider and actually, you thrived under that sort of pressure? - Oh, yeah, definitely. I love the team bit and not all, you know, particularly now that I know that it's a realistic thing that I can actually achieve it. Riding for Great Britain is what I love the most. I'm riding on the team. I like following orders. I like somebody to tell me what's expected of me, and I'll go out and try and do it. So, yeah, I loved it. And obviously, I think from a timing point of view, I was also quite lucky in a way, because Britain were on the earth as I was kind of stepping in. So, so far, I've only had, you know, really positive experiences of being on a team like that. And, yeah, so it was great, really. And, yeah, I want to keep doing it again. - Keep doing it. Talk to me about the following year, 2018, because it was the year that finished with you becoming World Champion. You go to badminton with All Star B in the spring. You said you made it happen. You did. You finished third. You pulled down in the show, jumping. But otherwise, an absolutely impeccable start in the dressage, 23.9, your dressage. You then go to LaMoulin with Zen Shira, who has been an absolute superstar for you at top level over the last few years for another podium finish. Did you feel that actually momentum was building in your favour? Both of the horses were longlisted for the World Games. Did you even imagine at that moment that you would be on the plane, let alone flying home with a gold medal round, you know? - Not really, no. I mean, it was really so much about the team thing in try-on, that the individual, getting the individual gold didn't hit me till the very moment it happened. But, no, I mean, I didn't think I was really going until we got there, to be honest. It's one of those things that are still, I still feel quite inexperienced at that level. And I went to, where did I go? I took Albie to Aston before where it goes, one of our selection events. And I had a terrible show jumping round, I couldn't stop. For whatever reason, Albie's generally half his leap most of the time, and he goes to Aston new walls, which isn't a massive event and gets really excited every time. So I had to do down and find both of the show jumping. - But mainly just Aston new walls, yeah. - Okay. - We did it at Bellton as well, but Bellton's no more, so that's not a problem now, but yeah. Aston new walls seemed to get him going. So yeah, I went round the show just thing and didn't stop and had to down and felt a complete mess. And so I didn't really have, you know, I thought, well, I hope I haven't screwed my chances by what I've just done, but fortunately, they managed to overlook that. So I think running up, actually, to wear guys, I felt a lot of pressure about the show jumping out. Aston kind of knocked me a bit 'cause normally he's so reliable. And so I certainly didn't think it was a given that I was even going. And I felt huge pressure going to harpry on myself, really. I put pressure on myself that I needed to go and jump clear round at harpry if I was going to go to work. Unfortunately, I did that. So then that was kind of a bit of a boost before a wake. - So, but I almost think maybe Aston new walls were a good thing because I certainly didn't rest on my laws after that and I worked pretty hard running up to a wake to make sure that didn't happen again. - Did you revisit the plan? - I revisited the plan and I spent a lot of time in try on revisiting the plan, yeah. But I tried to stay in my own bubble, particularly on show jumping day. I spent a lot of time watching. I tend to try and watch successful performances. So my badminton round the first year in 2017 was a bet around in my 2018 one. And it was around, I thought was as close to perfection as I could get. So I spent all morning at try on watching my back show jumping round, trying to remind myself how I'd done it. - How did it affect you then? - Because obviously try on was a fairly tumultuous sort of event in terms of weather and everything like that. And actually the show jumping being delayed a day. Did that actually make it harder for you? Because it was so out of the usual, I mean, you go to a long format event, you show jump the day after cross country. It's very rare that you have a day off and then jump again the following day. So did that actually make it harder in terms of a mental test for you? - I don't think it was too bad. I mean, we were lucky, you know, we did have, we had a great team, we had a great team around us. So that day went quite quickly really and the weather wasn't great. So when we still had to trotter, so we kind of, it was a steady day, but it did kind of fly past quite quickly. And I do try now when I'm not in the zone and needing to think about it, try not to think about stuff too much. So I just tried to switch off on it really a little bit. And, no, I mean, I think I'm lucky that all Star B kind of coped with the day off quite well. He didn't need lots of it. You know, he doesn't get fresh with days off. He's quite used to having quite days at home. So from that point of view, he didn't come out too fresh. And so yeah, we just tried to, tried to relax and not think about it. And it really, it was so much about the team competition that it never really even, even everybody around me, nobody came up to me after the cross country and said, "Oh my God, you could win this." It was just never talks about. So I think it was, we just all tried to stick to our plans for the team medal really. - The team medal played paid off. I mean, there was a moment in the show jumping that the Brits had rolled a couple of poles and sort of the Irish team were creeping a little bit closer, which meant that when you went in to the arena, I think you, I want to say my memory, checking my memory now, I think you had a pole in hand at least to keep the team gold. Was that all you were thinking about at that moment? Did at any point cross your mind that actually I'm going in, I could come away with it, even just an individual medal at the world of Western games. - No, I didn't really think about the individual at all. I had a vague idea about, I knew that it's got quite tense in the team competition, but I, nobody had spoken. I didn't, I kept myself quite away from it all. So I watched the first few and, and then I went back to the stable. So I didn't, nobody kind of came up to me and said, "Well, you've got some to clear around "or you can only have one down." So it was really just trying to stick to the plan. And I remember warming up and the British showed him the team were there, watching William Finnel was watching me warm up. And I was so terrified about warming up in front of him when I went into the main arena. I was quite relieved. - Delighted. - You know, he was probably watching. He'd been watching in the main arena two worlds, to be honest. - Well, I know, I know, but I didn't know that. So it was fine because I was just on my own in the main arena because it's such a big space. So, so I think, stuff like that, I think you know, you all kind of played into it being my day, really. - And how did it, how did it feel? Because you jumped clear around. You, I guaranteed at this point an individual silver medal. Did you think, actually, there's a chance that Ingrid Klimka, who is the reigning European champion, who has won so many things, Hale Bob, one of the best horses in the world, did you think at this moment, well, do you know what actually, individual saw that's amazing? Or were you watching, thinking, good grief, if this could happen, I could be the world champion? - Yeah, that definitely did cross my mind. But it was quite busy in the back and, you know, Albie gets taken off his checks and things like that. So, by the time we'd kind of, I'd got off and seen people and stuff like that, she was kind of already started around. So then I just have kind of that moment of thinking, you know, maybe, maybe this could happen. And then as the round progressed, I thought, you know, I'm not even gonna watch 'cause she's going so well. So I wasn't really watching. I couldn't even see the screen when she was coming to the last fence. And then literally people just started jumping on top of me. So I don't even really remember it, to be honest. - Do you, was it just after that? Was it literally a blur or can you remember it really clearly? - I mean, I can remember it. I just remember just everybody was so kind. Everybody, you know, seemed genuinely happy and there's loads of support. And it was great. My mum and dad were there and Chris. So that was all quite exciting. And then really, after the first 10 minutes growing, 'cause then you go in and do the ceremony and then you do your media. And then you, and that's kind of your next two hours. So my drug's taken forever. So I was just starting my own with a lady in here. So it's probably less glamorous than people think I think. - How was it? - And then I got back to the tables. I got back to the tables and everyone else was drunk 'cause I hadn't had anything to drink. (laughs) - Were you like, how do you wanna second? - Last week, that was- - They all celebrated much more than me. - Amazing. If in terms of coming home, you go away, you are part of a British team, you come home, you've won a team goals and you are the world champion. - How did life change? Did it change or did it literally just be like, no, back home, back to the yard, back to normal? - No, it did change. It definitely changed. And one of the things that was really great about the whole thing was that I think for the first time it kind of hit people or people that I knew or people that knew our family but weren't horsie, saw it and heard about it in the news. And so, you know, Badminton, obviously, is hugely like highly regarded in our sport. It's not necessarily something that a local community that aren't horsie would know about, whereas I definitely saw the impact of it to kind of our community. And to little things like my dad who is supported be the whole way through my career, but he's not horsie. But he went, he's in a choir and he went to choir and he came back and he said, everybody knows about who I was, everybody knows what you did. And so that was really great because, you know, he's very proud anyway, but it impacted him as well and things like that. So that was really special about it, to be honest. And still is, you know, people remember it, which is nice. And then, yeah, I mean, life got very busy, to be honest. And life changed a lot because I was just, I was kind of that it was starting to do well. And then suddenly, you know, I had a lot to do with the media and things like that. And life got almost too busy for a while, a little bit out of control because my business was not set up to deal with that. So we had to make kind of a few changes over the winter. So the rest of the year, I felt a little bit like I was just surviving. But in a good way. And then, yeah, and then, and then kind of life changed anyway, really after that. I was going to hate life gets really busy. So we go to the end of 2018. You have another top five at five star with Zen Shearer at Po, which was a brilliant result and gave you big world ranking points, which will come on to. But then life changes for an entirely different reason in the news that you're expecting your first child. Talk is free that because it must be a real sort of adjustment to being competing at top five star level of the world games, to all of a sudden actually scaling back in terms of competing commitments and riding commitments. And it's a whole new challenge. Yeah, completely. And, you know, I wasn't, I wasn't entirely sure whether it was a good time to try and have a baby or not. But Chris and I decided that, you know, we couldn't, we couldn't wait forever and that we wanted to start a family. So, you know, it happened and we were lucky. It happened very quickly for us. So, but yes, life's changed a lot. I can't really remember life before it now. But last year was obviously very different because I didn't compete until August. So I spent a lot of the year. I actually went, I think I probably went to more events the last year than I did when I was actually eventing, trying to run around watching my horses with other riders and helping my girls at home and things like that. But yeah, it was, it was definitely different and a little weird and a bit stressful at times just because you feel like you ought to be doing more and you can't. Did you enjoy it in a weird way or was it quite hard to watch other people ride your horses? I did enjoy parts of it. I think probably looking back in hindsight, if I'd known that I could, I wasn't going to forget how to ride. I might as well act a bit more about it. OK. I think I had this slight fear that everybody else was practicing and I wasn't and that I might forget when I got back on how, how to ride fast cross country and things like that. So probably, I didn't relax as much. Whereas I think if I were to do it, if I did it again or had to have time off, I would be more relaxed about the fact that just because you haven't ridden for six weeks doesn't mean say you're going to forget everything. No. So yeah, I enjoyed parts of it. I'm not sure I loved being pregnant, but. How did you decide which horses went to which riders to be looked after while you were on the sidelines for a bit? Well, I had ideas. And then, obviously, it was all in conjunction with the owners. So when I told the owners and we discussed it, it was kind of a mutual decision. I kind of gave an idea and they said, yes, we agree or we don't agree and we went from there, really. But Tom McEwen did a career of my horses and he's-- when I first spoke to him about it, he said, oh, yeah, you're my sister and she could cover both of those. He's-- honestly, he's got a whole different side businesses for providing maternity cover to me. And he's very good at it, though. Very well. Exactly. And he just laid back and a lovely person. And I knew he would cope with my own as well. And he sat a stage in his career, I suppose, where he is riding lots of horses and is happy, you know, happy and enjoying riding lots of horses. Because that's another thing. You know, these riders don't have to do maternity cover. You know, there's not a huge gain to them apart from, obviously, you know, an extra horse to ride. But I knew both Tom, so Tom Jackson on Tom McEwen, who both helped me, were kind of, you know, they young, aren't they? Young and keen and, like, riding lots of horses. Well, it's better to have that at the same time. Keep me. Yeah, so that's kind of how it works. Well, we'll come on to life as a mother in a moment. But while you were pregnant and on the sidelines, you actually became the first female world number one since, I think, it was Mary King back in 2011. So it was some sort of eight years or something. So you were top of the world rankings, best in the world, and you were actually not able to compete at the time. You were pregnant. How was that feeling of being world number one? Was it something that you've aimed for before? It's not something I've aimed for. And I don't think it's something I really had kind of thought, I had really thought a lot about. I think I don't have the biggest string at the top level. And so I think the big thing that really kind of struck me was how proud I was of my string of horses, because all Starbee and Ventura between them basically helped me to become world number one. And I had one result from another horse. So those two horses are a complete legend for me, and have completely shaped my career. So I think, basically, it was down to them. But it was slightly odd, because I was so detached, you know, I hadn't completed for quite, you know, since the last October. So it felt a little bit odd to be walking around kind of six, seven months pregnant and thinking actually I'm the world number one, because I just felt so far from that at the time. Did it with a little bit odd though? Now, one question that we have spoken about on the podcast, and I know if Durham was on this show, he would absolutely be asking it. Do you think that in the future, there would be a merit and a system of having FEI points frozen for those riders who go off on maternity leave? Obviously, it would have to be managed. You can't just go off for five years, have kids and come back with the same number of points. But do you think there is something there to be done? Because obviously, you couldn't defend your world number ones up, because you weren't competing. But do you think that is something that you should have been able to do? I think it's a very tricky area, because obviously, if you're not competing, whether you're pregnant or not, or if there's another reason, the schools of eventing is possibly different to other schools in that, you know, if you're not confident at it or doing it at the time, then there has to be an element of needing to prove yourself again, because there is that risk involved in it. So I think, from that point of view, there is an argument for the points being dropped. And I wouldn't argue that at all, the fact that my points dropped. I think it's quite depressing that they dropped quite so violently, you know, I went on being... I don't actually know the true number, but I must have gone from being world number one to being down in the hundreds, I would think, within the space of three or four months, which is slightly odd, I think, isn't it? And I think quite how you'd freeze them, I quite how the whole system would work, I don't know, because it works on a rolling year, doesn't it? So if that makes it a little bit tricky in the way they do it, currently. Makes it a bit more complicated. I think there's the advantage in so much as if you look at other sports like tennis, where women do go away, start a family and they come back and their seeding has dropped so significantly that they then have to fight to get back into the competitions at which they were previously competing. And I think that is harder to do to a degree, like in terms of eventing, you are still entitled and qualified to compete at badminton and sort of that level. So I think you still have the ability to go in and pick up points at the level that you would have done before. But I do see both sides of the story, to be fair, I do see Derm's point and I also see your point of you've got to be earning the points to be there. Before we go on to Life as a Mum, can I just give you one incredible, equirating stat on Zen Shearer? So you know we love an equirating stat and you've mentioned Zen Shearer being such a star for you alongside All Star Be at the top level over the years, but he's quite an unassuming little horse. We spoke about him actually on the Poe preview show listener. So if you'd like to listen back, you can do so eventingpodcast.com at the end of last year where he went on for another really, really top result there, but he's actually had. So we, in equirating, have an opposition beaten percentage. So that means the number of opponents that you've come up against and the number of opponents you've actually finished ahead of. Now Zen Shearer has six runs at four and five star levels in 2018 and 2019. So it's over two seasons and it's only taking into account of horses with at least five runs. They've got to have run at the top level a number of times to be on this list. And he actually has the highest opposition beaten percentage of those horses in the world. He's had 351 opponents, beaten 324 of them, 92.3% he's beaten. - Yeah, so he's a loser sergeant. - He's just amazing. Do you want to know some of the horses on this list? Chris Burton's quality per day. SAP Halebob, Ingrid Klimkka is at 91.4%. Oliver Townon's Baltimore class is at 90.1%. You've got Fischer Chipmunk on there, poly star, Waikiki, the Swedish European and world team horse. Like there is an amazing list of horses, but he comes out on top. So good Alfie. - He is absolutely brilliant. He is one of the loves of my life that horse. (laughing) Yeah, he gets a little bit overshadowed sometimes by your cell be quite rightly at times, but he is, yeah. I mean, you wouldn't get a more enthusiastic campaign I don't think, and I think he went hacking with one of my girls today and I said, how was Alfie? And she said he was absolutely wild. And really canted off with her. And I think it's just fantastic that at the age of 16, he has this desire to still go forward and go hacking and do his work, and that's what makes him special really. - I mean, he has an amazing five star record. If you look back at his last four or five five stars, five stars I think, so he was fifth at Po in the autumn. He was 50 year before in 2018. He was third at LaMoulin in 2018. He was seventh at Po in 2017. Ninth at LaMoulin that year as well. I mean, he just has such a consistent record. He really is quite incredible. We'll come on to the horses and their plans for this year, but becoming a mum, so you become the world number one. You're the reigning world champion. And then arguably I'm going to say biggest challenge. Baby Ziggy arrives in the July of 2019. How was it? - Painful. - Painful, yeah. I was going to say that question. - How was the labor? How did it all happen? - No, how was becoming a mum? Because obviously it's a big old lifestyle change in terms of you spend your days outside on the yard, being active, riding, competing. And now you've got a baby in the mix as well. - Yeah, and I hold my hand up and say I wasn't maternal at all. I liked the idea of starting a family, but the reality of finding out I was pregnant was quite a shock. - You're a fine, isn't it? - And I'm not into babies and stuff like that. I've never really felt that desire to need to have, you know, a family. I just knew it was something I wanted to do. So, but I have to say, it is the best thing you can do. And she is fantastic. And I'm thoroughly enjoying it. It adds, definitely adds an extra dimension. It definitely adds an extra level of stress. And it's definitely hard to do everything as well as you want to do everything, but it's definitely worth it. - How do you juggle day-to-day life with? I mean, I personally find the mum juggle really difficult. I don't think, like you say, you ever get anything 100% right, but how does it work in your household with it? - Well, at the moment, Chris is a very hands-on dad, which is very useful, he's taking a bit, he's taking a bit of time out and helping a lot and he's helping a bit with my business and things as well. So, he, Ziggy spends a lot of time with him and she spends a little bit of time with me at the yard, but not huge amounts. I find I'm better to try and separate the two a little bit. If I go and ride, I am in my event ride mode and if I come home or I have Ziggy at the farm, I'm in Ziggy mode and that works well for me. So, we have, we try and have a routine, but we don't really have a routine. Some days, I will get early and go and ride early and then come home and do breakfast and things with her. And other days, I will do breakfast and stay with her in the morning and go in a bit later. So, it kind of depends on the day and depends what I've got on and what teaching I'm doing as well and things like that, but I have a few less sources in than I did previously. I have two absolutely fantastic members of staff and my mum who is extremely hands on with the horses. And so, we kind of muddle through and the one great thing about my pregnancy and having Ziggy was that I learned to really trust the people that work for me and the yard at home runs probably better without me. It runs very smoothly without me. So, I now have great confidence that I can come in late or go home early and everything will be done very well. So, yeah, I'm kind of fortunate. I've got a lot of help. I've got two sisters who love babies and love spending time with Ziggy and they have, she has five nephews and nieces. Six babies in the household or in the family as such. - Yes, all under the age of eight, so it's pretty hard. - Right in the middle of Ziggy, Ziggy is the last, but a Christmas is loud, yeah. - Yes, I can imagine in a good way, in a good way. - Yeah. - Yeah. - How did you find getting back in the saddle and getting back out competing? Because you were, you had Ziggy in the July, you were back out competing in the August, how was it? You obviously remembered how to ride, which was your fear. Did it all come back quite easily? - It didn't, it, yeah, I mean, I went, I competed at Aston Ewalls with Zen Sheer and also I'll be on the one month birthday, which I probably wouldn't recommend. It wasn't the very same as a comfortable experience. - I'm not gonna lie, when Toby was a month old, I was lucky making it out of the house. - Yeah, it was an interesting experience, but I probably wouldn't have managed it on any of those two boys because it was a bit like going for a schooling day. And I know I've had a lot of support from Chris and my mum and things like that, so it was more of a family day out than a competitive event, I would say. But the real kind of motivation for getting out so quickly was that I needed my Olympic qualification. So I wanted, and I knew that the GB Selectors were team that I tried to get it last year, or certainly part of it. So I already had penciled in that Ballon Dennis was going to be my run with All-Star B, which in the four-star long. I said from the word go that I wasn't that keen on taking him to Poe. I just, my gut just told me not to do it. I also I wanted to take Zenshi over there and little Alfie gets quite attached with the people. So he is better to run than the bent on his own. So, and Poe is his event. So I was keen to take Albie to Ballon Dennis. I thought it would be a bit under the radar if I wasn't quite firing off all cylinders and there wouldn't be the pressure there to necessarily go inside the time. I could just really concentrate on getting my qualification. So that was kind of really my motivation for getting out so quickly. The reality is, physically last year, I wasn't anywhere near as strong or fit as I am now. I'm looking back, I feel a little bit lucky that I got the results I got. And I think I was lucky that I was sat on All-Star B and Zenshi over at the event at Poe and Ballon Dennis because I certainly wasn't firing off all of you know, as fit in as healthy as I am now. Although I actually gave Zenshi a probably one of the best-class country riders I've ever given him. I think because I had to stick to my system so much because physically I wasn't strong and mentally I was worrying that I wasn't where I ought to be. So I had to so much sit myself down and well, actually Chris sat myself down, sat me down and said we didn't drive all the way out to Poe Ross for you to do address those tests. So you can really well get on the hooks and go and do it. And it was just what I needed. Was that your Chris or Chris Basel? My Chris, your Chris. I stupidly tried to have a cross country practice fence in the morning because I felt out of practice. So I thought maybe if I jumped a few fences in the morning I might feel better about it. And I went really slowly and didn't ride very well and came off and had a slight meltdown at which point Chris told me that he hadn't driven a baby to sit in a lorry for a week with a baby for me to do a dress size test and withdraw. So I'd rather be able to get on with it. And it obviously worked, I needed. Yeah, it's been a bit different. I've had, you know, giving birth is quite a small run of body, isn't it? Both. If you think what your body goes through to carry a baby and then give birth, it's just, it's no surprise that actually like it's hard. I mean, I'm not a world class athlete. So I, you know, complete credit because it is very, very difficult. And I think the other thing that actually, particularly in the sport of eventing, you know, if you have a baby and then go and play a tennis match, what's the worst that can happen? You're gonna get hit by a tennis ball or somebody's gonna throw a racket. Actually, eventing it is a dangerous sport and your mindset does change. And actually your emotions change and it's being able to manage that and being able to sort of come to terms with it and appreciate that it's a new way of thinking and actually channel it in the right way. So yeah, absolute credit to you for coming back out, back end of last year, obviously massively successful. I mean, you had five international runs in 2019. Rather you won three of them. So I mean, that's a pretty, pretty good strike rate. If you could carry that strike rate on to 2020, I think you'd be delighted. - Yeah, I know, and I think, yeah, I think sometimes I thought we got away with it slightly, but, you know, it was also a credit to my team at home and the other people that have been riding horses, really, that I was able to get on probably at 50% of how well I could ride and the horses still formed. So I've got a lot of other people to thank, probably more than effectively I was riding at the time, but yeah, it kind of worked. And so, and I feel in the last, even in the last six weeks, that I feel pretty much now like a normal person again. So it's quite, it's kind of quite a revelation when you do something and you prepare for it to hurt slightly or to feel a bit weird and suddenly it doesn't. So it's quite nice, it's quite exciting. - So talk to me about 2020 because you've got pretty much all of your Olympic qualification with AllStarB. You would need to do a AllStar short in the spring, which I imagine he would do anyway. So that shouldn't be too dramatic. Zen Shearer would be qualified from his result at Poe. So two horses, almost there in terms of qualifying. What is the plan? Can I ask if AllStarB might be heading to the big badminton? - Yeah, I've just done my entry actually. So he entered and that is the plan. - The plan is quite long wait. - That's quite, there's quite a long way to go. And we're very open-minded, but yeah, obviously the first plan is that I need to get the AllStar short in. - Do you have an idea as to where you'll go for that? - He will go to AllStarB and then go in the markets back up. - Okay, so yeah, and we'll see. He likes badminton and we kind of wanted to have another run there. So we thought we'd go there. I try and face my fast runs for my big events. So I don't, I probably wouldn't run really fast in the spring running up to badminton. So I'll be, I'll be, can run fast over any course. He's, you know, he's very versatile like that, but for me it's important that I don't run him fast every time. - Yeah. - Because he is, he is 17 hands and built a bit by Kunta and I'm five foot two. So yeah, there is a slight strength issue. So it doesn't, it doesn't particularly matter where he runs fast. He can run fast at a short format or a long format, but we tend to save it for the one we want to do well at. - Yeah, that's fair. - So we'll kind of go for the qualification and then, and then badminton will be the aim and less and less, if that happens or many steps on. So yeah, that's it, that's it. - Have you thought about Tokyo and the possibility of going to the Olympics in the summer? - Yes, think about it a lot. - Is it something, are you just, I think it's probably a really stupid question. I was going to say, you're just going to say, right, let's get badminton done. See what happens, what will we will be? Or are you coming out all guns blazing? Do you know what, because actually Zen Shira would very much be a horse in form as well. So you've got two horses at the top level that actually the selectors could have to make a decision between them as well, which is an enviable place to be in. - Yeah, I think realistically, all Star B would be the horse, really. I mean, I'm not thinking about the Olympics in terms of, I definitely think I'm going to go. The British, as everyone knows, are very strong at the moment and there are multiple horses that could have the opportunity to go, so I'm very aware that I need a result in the spring, if I'm even, you know, to be thought of as a potential. So yeah, badminton's an important event, but I think, you know, the big thing I'm trying to do is, you know, like I said earlier, I've got to stick to my system and if I get the result, then that's great, then of course, I would, the Olympics is the dream and that's where I want to get to, but I'm also not, you know, I'm also realistic of the fact that there are plenty of other good people too. And yeah, I've got to do well and it's as simple as that. We all need a result in the spring and if we don't get one, we don't go. And if we don't go, we'll make another plan and go somewhere else, but of course, I'd love to go to Tokyo. - In terms of Sensheera, will he go to La Mulin as a, his sort of spring/summer aim? - Yeah, he will, he will do, I think he'll do a couple of the RMs. - Brilliant. - Because we've got going to market this year, haven't we? - Yeah, and Chatsworth. - I think he will do burn and Chatsworth where he normally just does Chatsworth. - Brilliant. - And then we will plan his season from there. He's 16 this year, so although he's-- - Still taking off with the greens. - He's still taking off with everybody. So I think he's very well, but yeah. We'll enjoy every event we've got with him, I think. - Yeah, absolutely. Rose, we have absolutely loved having you on the show. I could talk to you all night, but I'm very aware you've got a baby to go and put to bed. Can I ask you for our listeners, one horse in your yard that maybe they don't know yet that they need to keep an eye out because you feel is going to be a future star? - Yeah, I've got a seven year old called Is A Lot D-H-I. - Okay, but one of the six year olds-- - I've got a six year old, so I've got some lovely horses in between, actually. I've got some really like up ones that are going to hit the bigger time sooner. But he would be the most talented horse I've ever had on my yard. He's also the sharpest horse I've ever had. It's not a guaranteed, we'll hit the top level. It's a guaranteed that he physically can do it and he could do it very in a special way. I just hope that his brain works with me. Sometimes it doesn't, but he is ultra talented. His talent goes way beyond what's in cheer and all star be have. So if I can keep him on track, then I think he could be very special. - That's very, very high praise. Rose, thank you so much. We have absolutely loved having you on the show it has been a real pleasure. We cannot wait to see where 2020 takes you, but all I will say is you are absolutely smashing it because you are doing brilliantly. And I'm hoping that you are getting plenty of sleep. Is he a good sleeper? - He's a very good sleeper, yes. - Oh, that always helps, it does always help. But yeah, no, you are doing amazingly and we cannot wait to watch you in 2020. Rose, thank you for coming on The Decoratings Eventing Podcast. - Thank you very much, it's been a pleasure. - And we will catch up with you very soon. - And listeners, we hope you've enjoyed This Decoratings Eventing Podcast Special and we will be back with another episode for you very soon. - Welcome to Fairfax & Favour's Quick Fire Questions. Now today's guest is a young road of gold medalist. She is a five star rider. It is none other than Felicity Collins. Are you ready? - I'm ready. - What is your favourite meal? - I like good steak and chips, can't go wrong. - You and me both. - And what Fairfax & Favour item is your go-to when you go out for dinner? - I love the Rockingham ankle boot in Tope. I think it's really stylish and it's quite different as well. - What is your party trick? - Well, I'm not sure if it is a party trick but I'm quite good at the cereal packet challenge, which is a party game. So I like to encourage that game to come out at parties so that I can try and win. - We all want to go to a party you're at now. - Which B is your favourite bangs, boots or belts? - Boots. - Felicity Collins, thank you so much for playing along with Fairfax & Favour's Quick Fire questions. - Thank you very much.
