PGATOUR.COM's Sean Martin and Paul Hodowanic are joined by Golfbet's Will Gray to discuss the upcoming Presidents Cup, focusing on key storylines, the role of the Canadian players, strategies for the International and United States teams, and predictions for top point scorers.
Talk of the TOUR Golf Podcast
Presidents Cup Preview Roundtable
[upbeat music] - All right, welcome to a special edition of the talk of the tour podcast. It is President's Cup Week. I am Paul Hoedawanik, staff writer for pajayshuhr.com. With me, we've got just on different sides of the media center. We've got this place cornered. We've got Sean Martin lead of pjtour.com. Sean, how are we doing? - Doing well, nice crisp weather in rural Montreal. It feels like fall. I feel like Big Ten football weather. It's perfect. It's just right in my wheelhouse as a Minnesota man. So loving it. And then we've also got Will Gray lead of golf bet, Will. How are you? - I am doing great. It's vest season, four zip season. Not a lot of weather we're used to getting in mid September down in sunny Florida, but it's good to have on a road game every now and then. - You got the vest. Sean's got the like full outer layer. I've got a hoodie on. So we've got the fashion side of it cornered. I know people come to this podcast for fashion and it's layering season. - Yeah. - Well, hoodie layering season, if anyone's just jumping in, we are in Montreal for the President's Cup, kicks off here shortly in the next couple of days, US versus the international team. The three of us convened just a couple of weeks ago talking about the teams. So figured let's get us all back on and preview the event. And I think I just want to start here very general with each of your top storylines for the week. So Will, as our visitor, I'll give you the first call. What's your biggest storyline that you're watching heading into this week? - So I'm not quite as partisan as my friend Ben Everle in terms of the black and yellow shield. My top storyline is going to be close, right? The US has won every single one of these since 2005, you know, it was dramatic down at Royal Melbourne in 2019. It was a close one in South Korea in 2015 in terms of the last two of these that were played away from the US. I'm interested to see if the international team can have a similar bit of momentum and a home field advantage this week because go back to two years, go to quite all of this thing was over Friday night at dinner. And so so muchly, I'm hoping from an entertainment perspective, it's going to get a little bit closer to Saturday and Sunday. But I think it's less about can the internationals win, it's more about can it be close going into Sunday? - I got to push back. Coyle Hollow had one of those moments on Sunday where if you squinted and Xander Shoffley missed a putt, there was possibly a very rocky road to victory for the internationals. They won Saturday and made it close on Sunday singles. - It was minus 10,000, we're talking betting for our lands. This is like, they were up 30 to seven. The different storyline here at the US from betting perspective, it's the world that I'm coming from. They're much shorter favorites this week than they were at Coyle Hollow. So I think the Ozmakers looked at it, maybe a little bit of home field advantage, maybe a little bit of team composition that it's going to be closer to even footing. Internationals, I think, are still prohibitive underdogs, but not to the point where it seems surmountable. - I think the narrative of the tournament, the records bared out, like this has been US dominated, pretty much since its inception outside of a couple of years. But where we've really seen the like rumps for the US team is on US soil, you think, a Liberty National, think to Quail, you can go back many different iterations of the President's Cup, kind of the biggest blowouts. The times when I think that narrative has really been crafted is on US soil, but you mentioned it will, like you go back to the last two times it's been international bound, like South Korea really came down to like some final matches that day, just a one point victory. And then in Rome, Elburn, like the US kind of had to get on their horse just to get themselves back in it and win that one. So that was a scare as well. So I'm also intrigued, like this is the type of environment we're back on international turf, albeit very close to the US. So I'm sure US will have a good fan base, but this maybe has the recipe for a closer team event than we've even seen in recent Ryder Cups. Honestly, the biggest benefit though is no jet lag. South Korea, you're talking about other side of the world, that team at Royal Melbourne in 2019, they were coming off the hero world challenge, going straight into Australia. Even Rome last year for the Ryder Cup team, those players now in hindsight say they got there too late, didn't have time to adjust. We are in the Eastern time zone. This US team has been here since Sunday, and I think that the lack of jet lag is huge for their chances. All right, Sean. Will kind of got the first pick there. I think that was a lot of our top storylines. What else are you really intrigued about? I think the role of driving accuracy for the US team, we've seen it a lot in the Ryder Cup, where when Europe gets their hands on the course setup, when they're hosting, the playbook is the same. Narrow Fairways, thick, rough Jim Furik sought firsthand on that team he led in 2018 at the Gulf National. Mike Weir is also going to play from that playbook and grow some thick rough here. They've had a lot of rain, they've had trouble mowing the rock, so it will be healthy and juicy. And that setup has played less of a factor for the international team in the President's Cup, 'cause two of the last three on the road have been at Royal Melbourne, which is not a course that you narrow fairways and grow rough on. That is about short grass, slopes and swales. But I think in response, I think this US team, driving accuracy is actually an advantage. The US gets panned all the time for lack of accuracy, but they have four guys in the top 20 of driving accuracy, Colin Murakawa's second Russell Henley's in the top 10, Brian Harmon, and then actually Scotty Scheffler, a great combination of distance and accuracy. So I think the US has had an advantage in Forsoms, and now they have really four guys, they can anchor Forsoms teams around, because finding the fairways is so important in that format, and I really think that think driving accuracy is gonna be a US strength this week. - A quick spin this morning here at Royal Montreal. The rub is definitely thick in part, but it does seem like it could be one of those weeks where you're better off missing by a lot than a little. Those first five yards off the fairway, that is very lush turf. Then you get further out of 10, 15 yards, you have a better chance of maybe catching a good break, getting a decent line in areas that are more trampled down, especially as we get more fans on site. So maybe that's a mini storyline to consider as the week goes on that you could be punished by a small mess more than a big move. - It's kind of spotty too, like this is trees in some areas, like I think you can tell where the shade is kind of coming on the trees, like some of that is much less down. And I agree with you, like first thing I saw is on the first hole, like right off the fairway on the right side, thick rough. You go five yards further, pretty easy to get out of there, but you've got a lot of raised greens, you've got a lot of bunkers around the greens. So it's gonna be aerial golf. So the more you can be in the fairway, get your ball up high, allow it to spin, I think it's gonna be important. To go to my top storyline, the kind of transition us down the outline is just the Canadians. I'm really interested, three of them obviously, Corey Connors, Taylor Pendreth, Mackenzie Hughes. They feel like the linchpin to this thing for me in every respect on home soil. It could go either way. It could rally them and they could play amazingly, but I think self-admittedly from these guys, this is like the most pressure that they are gonna face, at least in their career up to this point. Pendreth and Connors did not win a match at Quail Hall and Mackenzie Hughes as a rookie. There's a lot of unknowns with those guys, and if it goes right, I think that's how the internationals have to victory opens up if it goes wrong. And the crowd doesn't have their home guys to rally behind. I fear it could get out of hand. So I'm really just interested in how those guys respond, how they play, how the fans kind of rally behind them. 'Cause I think that's gonna be a major, major decider of if this thing is close. They're the literal poster boys. All the advertisers are on town. It shows the US side with Scotty and Xander, the top two players in the world. And then international side, it's Corey Connors and Mackenzie Hughes. Their faces are all over town. I'm sure they've seen it. It's a different kind of pressure, for sure. - Paul, you mentioned Connors and tenders, both where at Quail Hall, two years ago, went 0 and 4. There's definitely a bit of a chip on their shoulder to try and write those wrongs from 2022. But I'm very interested to see the performance of Mackenzie Hughes when we did a post-mortem of the international team at Quail Hall, there was a dearth of putting, and they needed people that could make the thoughts. And it comes up inevitably, in match play, you gotta make your 8, 10, 12 footers. Mackenzie Hughes, I believe, is an effort to write that wrong. He's one that can definitely get hot on the grains. And I think, as you said, if there's a path to victory, so to speak, for the internationals, it's gonna start with players like Mackenzie Hughes, making more plots than the team did two years ago in Charlotte. - Yeah, let's talk about that road to victory. Outside of the Canadians playing well and keeping the juice in this venue. Sean, what do you think is top of mind, if they're gonna win for the first time or if they're gonna keep this streak of keeping it close on international soil, what has to happen for them? - I think, ultimately, they have to keep it close and force them, which I think is a tall task, because as I said earlier, this US team, I feel like, is well suited for that format. But the US has blown them out and force them. They've kept it close in four balls and singles. And so I think that means leaning on your veteran leadership. This is Hideki and Adam Scott. I think anytime the internationals are gonna win, it comes down to those guys really carrying this team and doing well in that leadership. 'Cause force them, it's such a unique format. Guys really never face it. Four balls, you're playing your own ball. It's more what you're accustomed to. Force them as you're totally out of your element. You need two strong players there. And you do need a little bit of leadership, more so than on four balls, where you can kinda do your own thing. And so I really think Hideki and Adam Scott, who both are playing well, at least Hideki, when healthy. And so I think that's a good sign of internationals, but the pressure really is on those guys to guide that team and lead guys through force them. - I think the experience factor that you mentioned is interesting to note that Matt Del Vecchio on our golf at social team found, Adam Scott is single-handedly played in more present Scott matches than the entire US team. It's an unusual dynamic, I think, from the US. The only team in Bradley has played in a present Scott prior to 2019. There's a lot of fresh blood, so to speak, guys, that played in the last two, one or two, or rookies. So I'll agree with you that they need to lean on their veterans when it comes to portions. But for me, I'm looking more at Thursday. I think it was a very deliberate choice by Mike Weir to lead off with four balls. The internationals have to win three of those five points. I think you have to take a lead into Friday to build that momentum, to build the team room, into thinking that they can win. And then maybe that changes a bit of the intangibles. When you get to the portion session, which since 2007, Sean, as you alluded to, it's 56 1/2 to 23 1/2 for the United States. All of the wrongs that they've had in that format, in the Ryder Cup, have been flipped entirely in the President's Cup. It's been a huge piece of their success year in and year out. So I think Thursday, it's pivotal for the internationals to get off to a hot start, and at least two 1/2 or three of those first five points, and then start to snowball in a positive direction to think that maybe we can hang with them for the next three days. It sounds simple, like, hey, get off to a hot start. But when you're at home, you haven't won one of these in so long, you want the crowd behind you, you want the energy, the internationals believe they can win, but you also want the US to kind of feel a little bit of doubt. I was walking with some of the US groups. They're very laid back, very excited to get going. But if they suddenly are put in a position where they could just be the second team ever to lose, and they start to feel that, that's I think when it starts to kind of be that ball rolling down the hill for the internationals. Like, you have to have the US to feel a little unsafe there, because if they get off to a solid start, even 3, 2, 4, 1, US, that's not the team you want with a head of steam going downhill this week. I think it's paramount that you at least split and you make the US feel like this is a ball game. - Yeah, you got to look at the context too. I think even Quill Hollow was closer than I think people thought it would be. That should have been an easier victory, at least on paper for the United States, than it turned out to be. And then last year in Rome, I mean, you have a US squad that is reeling after getting absolutely just dominated from the get-go in Rome. And if they can't get off to a good start or fall behind early, you're facing the specter of now getting blown out in a Ryder Cup, losing a President's Cup for just the second time, and now the whole infrastructure that we've built over the last decade for the US to find success really comes into question. When you put Keegan Bradley in this awkward spot where he's kind of an experimental pick for captain, much younger than usual and active player, a guy who's playing in this President's Cup, you have him in a position where he has a US team that is now going off back-to-back losses. And I think, well, they're not focusing on that, of course. I do think that's in the back of the mind where, I mean, if the US loses this President's Cup, then the state of the US golf and these international team competitions is not in a good place. - I think Paul, going back to your comments about doubt, I would look at the players from both sides that were on these teams back in 2019, 'cause that doubt was there. Saturday, especially, I think going into Sunday, I mean, the internationals have the Americans on the ropes at Royal Melbourne, and they let them off the hook, as Dennis Green would say. So, I think that Scotty Scheffler from the Americans was not a part of that team, but Sander and Patrick Cantley were, you look back at the international veterans like Edette E. and Adam Scott, do they have the ability to kind of channel some of those vibes and how would the Americans respond a second time if they were to be put in that position where they are behind or potentially trailing going into Sunday? - Let's talk about a couple of the X-Factor players that were kind of keeping an eye on where it could go either way if they sink or swim. For both the US and the international team, Will, who's kind of on your radar as someone that will matter a lot in the scope of this cup? - I think that the international team is in search of a spark plug. If you look back at recent cops, you look back to Seawook Kim, Shushing the Crowd, Tom Kim, two years ago, at Quill Hollow was a big source of emotion. I think this week, it's Minwoo Lee's time to shine. I think there's a lot to like about what he can offer. He's kind of gone very quiet towards the end of the PGA towards season into the playoffs, but I love the notion that he's gonna be just this ball of energy for the internationals that can really play to the crowd. He's got the hairdo, he's got the INT, put into the side of his head literally already. I think that he's a player that from a betting perspective, he's way down the list, probably around six or seven choice for top international points score, but I fully expect Mike Weir to put him out in a four balls match on Thursday, kind of be that emotional spark plug. And if he wins that match, he could really parlay into some positive momentum to where I think Minwoo Lee could play four sessions this week. Maybe he wins three or four and we could see him or three and a half out of four even. And you could potentially see him as a top international points score. At the very least, I think he's gonna be kind of a catalyst for the internationals from an emotional perspective if they're gonna have a cap for victory. - I think it's Scotty Scheffler. O five and three in the last two international team matches. I think you can explain it away a little bit 2022 at the president's cup. You know, Jim Furex cited it. He and Sam Burns may have played better than their record indicated. They just ran into some hot teams. And also Scotty was coming off that career-changing year. He became world number one for the first time and he won a major for the first time. And so exhaustion could have been a factor. And then last year he was in the throes of his putting woes. As you wrote on our website, a great feature of Phil Kenyon, really, it was just, this was the start last year of kind of the work with Phil. And now we have a Scotty who's better than ever. He's won eight times worldwide. He did everything you can do in golf this year. And he's a much better putter. But so now we need to see it in this competition. For Scotty to be winless the last two years, whatever the factors is pretty unfathomable. And I think the US is gonna have to lean on Scotty and Zander because there are some questions at the back of the lineup. And the president's come up with it being four days instead of three, I think you have a better chance of guys playing all five sessions 'cause it's only one 36-hole day. And I think the US is gonna need Scotty and Zander to really carry a lot of weight because there is not maybe the depth that there has been in previous years. - Yeah, and I already talked about the Canadians. I think they're all X factors. But if I'm kind of singling out a single player, Jason Day has gotta play better in these team events. It is historically not been where he's shined. I think he's something like five, 11, and four in these team events. If the international team is gonna do this one of these years, like Jason Day has been pretty much every year, he's been on this team one of the best players and he's consistently not played well, even when he's come in with great form. He's coming in playing all right golf, but if we're talking about the veterans and they kind of need to lead this thing, Jason Day has not been one of those players throughout his past. And I think if the President's Cup is ever gonna turn the tide and the international is gonna win one of these, I think Jason Day kind of reversing course on his history would be a good story. And I think it might be pivotal to the internationals getting it done. - I think biggest difference for Day is his perspective on these events. I think these were maybe more of a burden or at least not a high priority when he was playing his best golf. This is his first President's Cup since 2017. And he looked at 2015, 2016. He was chasing individual titles. He was the number one player in the world. He was on a super dominant run, but I think the focus there was on really patting the resume and you get to these events. And it's just not as important. You've had a long year, you're more folks on your individual successes from that season now having been gone for seven years. And he kind of said this about the Olympics where he said he wished he had gone back in 2016 to Rio. Like he realized back then, maybe he was too wrapped up in his individual accomplishments and he wants to make amends for that. So he played in the Olympics this year. And I think he probably arrives at this President's Cup because I want to contribute to this team. I want to be a part of the team that turns things around to the internationals. And then just one more person I would name, I think the U.S. can survive a couple, not great performances. So maybe it won't matter, but Max Homa to me is just another one that I'm looking at. Did not play well in Memphis, did not play well in Denver, then doesn't even get to the Tour Championship. Plays the Pro Corps out in Napa, misses the cut. You can't really come in with worse form than Max Homa has for one of these teams. And we've kind of anointed him after two, one President's Cup and one Ryder Cup is this next wave of the guys that get up for this event. And it doesn't matter what form they're in, they're just going to turn it on when match play comes and these team environments come up. And so I want to know, is Max Homa that guy? Can he flip the switch this week? Or are we going to look back and say, why the heck did Jim Furek pick Homa when he wasn't playing well and this is what we get? Like I think he's got pressure on himself to validate that pick. And I'm just excited to see if he can do it. - Yeah, that's seven, one in one record in the last two Cup matches is huge. But I think this might be the most scrutiny that Homa has ever faced in his career because he knows that if he plays poorly, his selections are going to be questioned, Jim Furek's going to be questioned and he doesn't want to put his captain in that position. And so there's pressure there. I think luckily with match play, you can maybe hide a little bit, you know, you hit a foul ball, you make a double, it's just one hole, it doesn't derail your whole week. Like Adam Scott in 2009, maybe this can be a spark to get things back on track. But Max has maybe the most pressure he's faced in his career on him this week or at least knows there will be scrutiny if he doesn't perform. - I think it's absolutely fascinating to see how he plays and how he responds to the moment. And as you said Paul, you maybe hide in match play, but you don't want to hide a pick, right? If you need, Jim Furek added him for a reason. So it's not like he's going to keep him on the bench until Saturday, but I think of it more, you know, you don't want to put too much pressure on a single week. But as I'm spinning this forward to 2025 and my outlook on Max Holm as an individual, it's going to shift a lot based on how he does this week where if this isn't the bomb that fixes it all, that solves all of his woes, there's a lot of questions for Max going into next year because as you said, he has had just a really rough run through the summer since about April or May. So if getting back in this pauldron and having a chance to be the guy and show these got the dog in him and all that stuff, if that doesn't come to fruition and he has a one in three week or what have you, I think the list of questions from Max to answer just grows longer as we head to 2025. - Yeah, and it's a small sample size. I talked to him after his final day at the BMW and his season was over and he had felt like he had started to kind of fix some things. The drivers been the one biggest weakness and he felt like he had started to figure it out on the back half of that week. It didn't show up at the pro core, but that's a small sample size. And I know this is too, but this is the type of event where you'd like to see him figure that out and leave a good taste in his own mouth and everyone as we look forward to 2025. I want to move on to get just a couple pairings from each of you that you'd like to see or you're intrigued to see if the US will roll out. Sean, I'll start with you. - I'm going to go Scotty Scheffler, Brian Harmon. I've been making the case that Scotty and Sam should get another run together. I think Scotty's iron player and Sam's putting makes sense together, but in Brian Harmon, you have one of the straightest hitters on the team. He's a little bit shorter than Scotty about 10 yards, but he'll put Scotty in the fairway. And that's all you need from him. Scotty's number one in proximity from 150 to 175. So he's a great mid-iron player, as we know, and Brian's an above average putter. So on force, that just seems to make sense for me. So I think pairing him with Harmon could be a good switch if you want to move away from the Sam Burns pairing. On the international side, I think Minwoo Lee and Tom came for the reasons that Will cited earlier, I think would just be a fun vibes-filled pairing probably for four balls. And then I found it curious that three of the international players played the BMW PGA last week. It's a huge international event. But you're also over in England, now flying Sunday to Montreal to start the week. The young Yunnan went over there, he's a past champion. Adam Scott went over, he's a global player. The curious one was Seiwoo Kim, who went over. I don't remember him ever playing a regular DP World Tour event, which makes me wonder if Ben An and Seiwoo is appearing that the internationals are going to lean on. And I kind of like it. Seiwoo, a good short iron player. A guy who makes a bunch of birdies. Who've seen him win places like Wyndham and PGA West, shorter courses where you really attack with wedges. They throw in Ben An on the bomber, who's one of the top five longest players on tour. And all of a sudden you've got sort of that boosted Seiwoo, kind of like we saw when they paired Colin Markow with Dustin Johnson. It's like, hey, let's give you 15 yards off the tee and really let your iron play shine. - Well, what about you? - Yeah, I was up there a few minutes ago. I saw Ben An and Jake's day walking off. But I think Seiwoo was also in that group. So I think any combination of those three could be interesting. - I think that Ben An specifically is an interesting glue guy, potentially for the international, where he can go in a lot of different directions based on how you want to have him serve in four balls versus four balls. And so starting on that side, I do wonder if Mike Weir's going to go with an all Canadian bearing. I think you got at least try it. If not the first day, maybe on Friday, but looking at Corey Connors, I feel like his strength is going to be much more in the four systems. Maybe you put in with Hendreth or conversely, Hendreth and McKenzie Hughes for four balls. I think you got to try and tap into this foam field advantage and give the crowd something to get riled up with. You can go both ways, right? You put two of the Canadians together or you spread them across three of the five matches and you have the fans kind of have a little bit to sink the teeth into. But I would look for maybe to see an all Canadian duo. And then on the American side, listen to Dave Misigator, I'm very interested to see if we get a Henley Harman UGA bearing. I think that those two guys are both flying under the radar right now. I love Russell Henley this week. I think making his first appearance in the team event for the US as a pro, he's going to be in a position to really thrive. And from walking this course, I think that Brian Harman from off the tee and on the greens is going to be a really good fit for this golf course. When I'm looking at some of the prop markets, if you know, top points score or top wild card pick, essentially, I think Harman is someone that all the captains picks could play potentially four matches. And I see him going three and one or something like that. So interested to see if the two Georgia Bulldogs have a chance to reunite. It's funny, you look at the stats and Harman and Henley are the exact same players. And I feel like we talk and force them about trying to get these complimentary games. But sometimes I think just getting two guys who play the same game can work because then you're hitting from the spots that you would be if you had teed off. And so you're not out of position or in some awkward place that you would have never found yourself playing your own ball. And so Brian, last year was like a 35 year old rookie. Russell this year is a 36 year old rookie, obviously both UGA guys. It's just interesting how identical they are. And I feel like that comfort, like you said, could make them a really strong pairing. Yeah, I was out walking today and everyone was playing their own ball. I don't know if those were the kind of groupings that we're gonna see. But there were a couple kind of intriguing ones in the same pairings. You had like Hadecki and Corey Connors together, which we've seen Hadecki in the past, compared up with Adam Scott, we've seen him get paired up with prominent ball strikers, which I'm not deep in the data. But I found that interesting that they've a lot of times paired Hadecki with another really good ball striker. And so I wonder if Connors could be that kind of compliment to him this year. And I would also love to see like two Canadians like going out first on Thursday. I don't know if that's what they're gonna do, but I would love just like get the crowd into it, just feel the experience right away, put them out there. I'm sure they're all anxious. Like, let's get these guys out, let's get them playing, let's get them feeling the environment. And I think that's how you immediately kind of set the tone. So we'll see if they would do that. And then I would love to see an Adam Scott, Jason Dave Herring at some point. We've only seen it one time in the history of their president's cup playing on the same team together. I have a feeling they kind of want to spread out maybe the veteran experience. But it just feels like those two, before their careers are over, I would love to have seen them play a couple of these things together. And that's just not been a way that they've leaned. So I'm guessing that's not a pairing, but I would love to see it. So that's kind of kind of where my mind goes to. I want to, before we get out of here, I want to get a top point getter from each team predictions for both you. Who do you think will thrive? Let's start with Will. - From my ad in previously with Midwoo, from a betting value perspective, he's kind of off the grid. But listen, assuming trends of how they, I think you can expect it to be maybe a little closer this year than it was at Quill Hall, but remember two years ago, it only took three points to be the top international point getter for seeing him. So maybe you get the three and a half. I could see Midwoo potentially getting three and a half out of four. So I like that, but betting value perspective is someone a little further down the list. From the American side, I'm going to go with Pat gently. I think that Xander and Patrick are going to be tied at the hip through these first four team sessions. So as one goes, so we'll go to the other. The odds makers have Shawty at a little bit of shorter price than they do Patrick Cantley. So essentially, I'm getting a little bit of extra value assuming that Cantley outperformed Shawty in Sunday singles. So that's the direction I'd be going for the US side. - I'm going to go Adam Scott on the international side or a surgeon, Adam Scott, who's coming off a great Fedescom playoffs. He's been sparked by sort of this relationship with Trevor Imelman. They've known each other since they were kids, but lately Trevor's kind of stepped in as a trusted advisor, if you will, and helped him with his game. And I think that's really lit a spark under Adam and he just seems to be ageless. I think he's 44 now and yet he made it to Eastlake again. And on the US side, I think Callum or Akawa, you know, we think Scotty and Xander, but Collins had such a great season, he just didn't win. And I think that an improved short game helps. I think his driving accuracy will be huge here. I am very curious though, despite saying that to see who they pair Callum with, it seems like they're searching for the right fit for him. His first couple of team matches, the formula is put him out in four sums, apparently a long hitter, it was Dustin Johnson at Whistling Straits, it was Cameron Young at Quail Hollow. And then last year they started to dabble with different pairings. So I think hopefully maybe this is the year where they find that fit for Callum or Akawa, they find that team and then he can shine after such a good year. - Do you remember, did he play with Wyndham Clark last year? 'Cause they were in the same grouping this morning. And so I was trying to figure out where maybe he might go. And I saw that one, I think it was with Tony Fino. So I was trying to figure out like, oh, which could any of those guys be someone? So I didn't know maybe Clark was the guy there. - I think the US is moving around on four balls with some of their teams that you see a lot of. For example, you know, we all think Scotty and Sam, Xander and Patrick. And in the last couple of years, they've stuck to those teams in four sums, but then they've started to move around in four balls. And so I think last year a Rome, Callum got Sam, one session in four balls and then also got Xander. And I think with four balls, I think they view it as, that might be one to rest guys when you don't want them to go five sessions. And then four sums, it's such a hard format to find the right fit that I think, when you find a good team, you don't change it. Four balls, I think, because guys are playing their own ball, there's more room to move around. It's a good place to put rookies in 'cause it's a little less pressure. And so I think Callum's been getting some of those guys who maybe their usual four sums partner is resting and he's paired with them. But I think Callum, you just got to find a fit with and I think you can. - Yeah, I will give my top point skaters as well. I agree with you, Sean. I think it's Callum work, how a driving accuracy favors him here. And it just feels like the type of course and he's just been playing really well recently. So I'm going to go call him Mark, how are there? And then for internationals, I'm going to go Sungjay M, just based off recent performance in these team events, Sungjay's five, three and two, like the best record of anyone on the team that has played more than two matches. I think Chris Shamp is eight and how it's the only one over 500 and he's just one, oh and one. So when you talk about consistently playing well in these things despite losing a few, Sungjay's been that guy. And if we're talking about driving accuracy and premium ball striking, like he fits the bill for me there. So I've got Sungjay as my top points getter for the international team. - There's a clear hierarchy on the American side of where the expectations are in terms of Scotty and then Xander, then he get down and he can't lay more at Callum. The odds makers are with you. They're shading towards Sungjay M and Icky Matsuyama. It's got both favorites from the international perspective looking on paper. It's maybe harder to see a clear favorite of who might be the top points for or who might be most likely to play five-section. But I do think as you said, Sungjay M, especially in forsomes is someone that is likely to get a lot of reps this week. - All right, before we're out of here, we gotta get a prediction, a score prediction and winner from both of you. Sean, let's start with you. - I'm gonna go USA 16-14. I think there's some moments where it's close. You have that moment Sunday where you squint and you see a fuzzy path to victory. But I think ultimately the USA wins. I will say US 17-13. Again, looking at what the odds makers are telling us, they've got a point spread essentially to think about it from a team perspective. The line this week is US minus three and a half. That's kind of where the odds makers are putting it, of where they expect things to fall out of 50-50 split. So I think 17-13 is right on that edge. And I think the US covers by the vote. - All right, well, I had 16 and a half, 13 and a half. So right on the other side of that over-under, I think it's close into singles. I'm not so worried about the top end of the international roster. It's just when you compare kind of the bottoms of both the roster, you see the depth advantage that the US has on the nationals, at least on paper. So I think it's close into Sunday singles and then the internationals just can't sustain that throughout the finish and the US finishes, kind of with a comfortable victory. But it's one of those where you see kind of the black or the yellow, I don't know what they're gonna use for the scoreboard, either black or yellow for the internationals. You see a wave briefly and it ultimately fades away. So that's what I have. All right guys, well, I appreciate joining me. I think we gotta go jump in, talk to Mike Wier and Jim Furek for their captain's pressers. So we'll get out of here, but thanks again for joining me. I think we may do something like this on Sunday, recap the event and we'll talk to you guys then. Sounds good, thanks Paul. Thanks, it's gonna be a good week. (upbeat music)