PGATOUR.COM's Sean Martin welcomes 2023 Open Champion Brian Harman and discusses his selection as a captain's pick for the United States Presidents Cup team. He talks about the excitement and relief of receiving the call from Jim Furyk and the honor of playing for him. Brian reflects on his previous close calls and how they have prepared him to be a contributing member of the team.
Talk of the TOUR Golf Podcast
2023 Open Champion Brian Harman on being selected to the 2024 U.S. Presidents Cup Team
[MUSIC PLAYING] Welcome to the Talk of the Tour podcast. I'm Sean Martin. A special guest, we have Brian Harmon on today's podcast, one of six captains picks for Jim Furick's US President's Cup team that will take on the internationals at Royal Montreal later this month. Brian is a three-time PGA Tour winner, including last year's The Open, and also made his debut for the US as a professional in last year's Ryder Cup. So we talked to Brian about being on a US team again, his successful partnership with Max Homa in Rome, and what it was like to get the call from Jim Furick. Please like and subscribe to the podcast in your favorite podcast app, and we'll get to Brian Harmon. We have Brian Harmon with us, a captains pick for this year's President's Cup team. Brian made his Ryder Cup debut last year after winning the 20-23 Open Championship. And as a captain's pick this year after going two and two in Rome, his two points were the second most on the team last year, and Brian's coming off a season where he finished 31st in the FedEx Cup. And Brian just wanted to start off. Where were you when you got the call from Jim Furick? I just woken up Monday morning. We were just piling around the house, man, just waiting for the word. And I think you've been in this position before when the captain's name pops on the phone. What's the initial reaction? And what did you think the news might be? I didn't really let myself think about it a whole lot. I felt like I had a pretty good case, but I would have totally understood one way or the other. But he calls, gives me the good news. It's a sense of relief, but then it's a sense of, all right, well, now it's time to really get to work. And you were an auto-qualifier last year after winning the Open. So this is your first time being a pick. I'm sure love making it on points and merit. But what does it mean that Jim had choices? He could pick anyone and he chose to pick you? Well, I've been on the other side of a fair amount of those phone calls. So that was certainly a nice change of pace. But Jim's an absolute legend. It's going to be a total honor to play for him. I've always respected Jim. Him and I have spent a bunch of time together. I've bounced a lot of ideas off of him over the years. And he's been nothing but a total gentleman and very forthcoming with all sorts of information. So I'm excited to play for Jim. I think Jim's going to be an incredible captain. And you mentioned that you've been close before. I don't think people realize when you're close. I mean, you do things like you're trying on the clothes and getting fitted for the uniforms. And you'd been through that process before where it didn't pay off. What were those years like where you were so close? And was there one team that maybe was especially heartbreaking to not be a part of? I think after being a part of the Ryder Cup, I understood way more. At the time when you don't get picked, you're mad because you want the shot. You're like, why am I not getting shot? I shouldn't have ever gotten picked. Like, I understood after being in the room and seeing how things go and seeing the amount of experience. Like, I wouldn't have been ready if I would have gotten a pick. So I'm not thankful the way that it worked out, but I understand the way that it went. And I feel like I'm more ready to be contributing part of that team than I would have been as a younger man for sure. This year especially was close. It came down to the final hole at BMW, did make a double, to miss out on Tour Championship by one spot. Your agent Jeremy Elliott said it was as down as he's seen you. What was the aftermath of that like? It was brutal, man. Frustrating year, just because I played such good golf and just didn't put it all together. And just knowing that if I were to put it together, it would have turned a good year into a great year. It just never happened for whatever reason. And I was devastated not to make the Tour Championship. But, you know, you look back and it's like I did everything I possibly could. I worked as hard as I could. It just wasn't supposed to happen for some reason. I don't really know why. But something good almost always comes out of really disappointing stuff like that. So I'm really excited about my game. I'm hitting the ball as well as I've ever hit it. The stuff that's kind of held me back in the past. I'm much better at now. Just a matter of tightening up the short game and the putter a little bit. And I feel like that my game can keep getting a little better. You talked about being in the team room and and seeing that experience for the first time. Were there things that surprised you or I guess what was the maybe biggest difference than what you expected? I think I probably spent the majority of my career as a as a younger player, a little too walled off at times, a little too much in the competitive mode where it was just kind of like me versus everybody. That's just always kind of the way I did it. Just wanted to kind of do my own thing. But just open it up and just getting to know guys a little bit better. And that team really helped me sort of open up and be a little bit more of myself, I guess. If that makes sense, kind of hard to explain. But yeah, just being in that locker room. And it's like the only time you feel like, you know, you're kind of going to war with somebody. And it's a really good feeling. Any guys that maybe you felt like you learned a different side of them from being in that environment? You know, like I was like Justin Thomas, you know, him and I, we were ever really very close. We both went on tour for however many years. And all of a sudden, like, we play the Ryder Cup together, spend that time together. And it's like, this guy's awesome. This guy's incredible. Like, what fun got a beer out? And then just to get to see, you know, playing with Max and seeing him up close. And, you know, when he was playing so well, and just being like, man, this guy is a total gangster when he gets to go. Like, it just, wow, like, it's just cool to be. Maybe I'll be able to stream with consciousness right now. But for me, it was an incredible experience. People talk about that first tee all the time. What was that first tee at the Ryder Cup? Like, and did it live up to expectations? It's awesome. It is. It's, it's really awesome. I'm not going to call it like nervy. There's like not even a word for it because it like puts this like hypersense of focus because you know, like the gravity of the situation. It seems like it just seems like it like you, you know, it's really important. It just really puts you right where your feet are for me, which is, I think it's incredible. You went two and two, which was the second most points earned on the team. How would you grade your Ryder Cup debut? I wish I could have played a little bit better in the singles. I got beat, you know, Terrell played incredible. I think he just beat me. I wish that played a little bit better. And I think me and Max could have played a little bit better on Friday morning. I think we were just a little shook up Friday morning. We just weren't quite ready to do it. That Aberg-Hovlin team was, was quite a buzz saw, like you said. Hovlin chips in on the first hole and they were kind of off to the race. Yeah, they, they hit the flag stick. It was like three out of the first six holes. They hit the flag stick with a shot of some sort. Max led the team with three and a half points. He had that big putt in singles. We all saw being that close to him. You guys played all three matches together. Yeah. What did he look like? I don't know how much he played with him in regular tour events, but did he look like a different guy than on a regular PGA tour event? Yeah, totally. Well, I just, I've never played with Max like as he's winning a golf tournament. I've never played with Max and I haven't really watched him because usually when he's winning a golf tournament, I'm playing in the golf tournament just to see him and just be a complete competitor and a complete like, you know, he was performing so well. It was really cool. What is it about you two that they sent you out together for all three of your sessions where they're just going for the social media stars or what? Yeah, that's me. Social media star. We do all these analytics and you come up with some potential partners and Max is one of my potential partners and him and I talked about it. I was like, man, how would love to play? That would be fantastic. This time around, you feel like you stick with Max or any other guys you'd love to get the chance to play alongside? Obviously, I know that Max and I have had a lot of success. I don't think there's anyone on that squad that I would have any kind of problem playing with. Everybody's so good these days and everyone's playing well. I'm really excited. I'll go play with anybody. Russell Henley is kind of like you, a guy in his mid 30s making his debut. Y'all are teammates from back in Georgia. What would your advice be to Russ on his first one and do you have any good Russell Henley stories? My advice to him was just to be himself. Russell's a guy that maybe, you know, he's a little more private. He doesn't really put himself out there, but Russell's a really funny guy. He's got a great, great personality and his golf game is world class, especially right now. I play with him the third round in Denver and it's probably as good as I've ever seen it. Super consistent off the tee, making putts, getting up and down when he has to. Looks really good. I'm wondering you played with Scotty at the PGA first two rounds, just being in that arena. What did that show you about what has been key to just Scotty being so successful this year? Well, I think Colin said it perfectly the other day. You know, mentally he, I don't think there's anyone that's on his level and there isn't anyone that probably works harder than Scotty does. He works hard in the gym. He works hard on this potty and he works hard on the short game. The short game doesn't get near the credit that it deserves. That was the most impressive display of short game that I'd seen in a long time at the PGA. So when you couple that with a guy that hits it really good, he's got a really good short game. His putters come a long way in the last couple of years and he loves to do it and he's really content doing it all the time is the best player in the world and all that stuff adds up to him being that way for a long time. And I think as you being the Open Champion, Winden being the US Open Champion, you guys were together, I think seven times this year, anything that you saw in his game or what did you learn about him from spending that much time together playing this season after playing a Ryder Cup together? Yeah, Winden, we were kind of like, you know, I remember us playing together several years ago and both of us were kind of like these periphery players. Like we were both good but hadn't really done much and Winden was really coming to his own. His confidence has gone way up. You can always see playing with Winden that he was so talented, he hit the ball so far and he was able to hit some shots that, you know, most guys just can't. And now that he's got the confidence and he's putting great, it's just going to be a snowball for Winden, I think. Do you feel like there's a format in these team competitions that better suits you? Common thought would have you think that I'd be a really good, I enjoy Ultimate Shot, that I would be a better Ultimate Shot player than best ball but I'm usually up there in total birdies on the PGA Tour, which is what's, you know, huge for best ball too but you want to get guys that are similar but you don't want to get guys that have the same game so they're kind of like birdie in the same holes all the time, you need some variety. That's a tough part about making best ball fairings. The analytics, that's a big part of it. Was there anything, I know you can't give away all the secrets but anything about the data that maybe kind of surprised you when they came to you about how to partner guys up and play guys together? No, not really and I think those stack guys are really, really, really helpful but for me I'm just trying to do my job. I can't do their job too so my job is to be ready to play and for whoever I'm playing with to try to make them as comfortable as possible and make them play their best golf and that's all we can do. You feel like Ultimate Shot because of your driving accuracy makes you a good fit, is that why there are other reasons? I think so, just driving accuracy and good putter inside a 10 feet. You talked about the season kind of being close to being a really good one and even statistically it would say it was better than last year in some ways. I think it was your best strokes gained approach season, even your strokes gained totals better. Obviously you'll remember last year for the Open but how do you compare the two seasons and I guess what is it like people don't realize I think maybe you can have a statistically better season this year but people will say well obviously 2023 was his best year. You want a major? Yeah, it's all about timing stuff at the right time and it all came together last year for a couple more weeks than it did this year. I hit the ball better this year, start to finish. I drove the ball better at the end of the year than I've probably ever driven it and I'm hitting it as far as I've ever hit it. My approach play is leaps and bounds better than it was three years ago but the stuff that I've usually do really well putch, it just wasn't quite as consistent as it normally is. When you don't get picked, does that kind of burn you? Does that stay with you if you want to prove people wrong? It certainly does. You just have to try to use that motivation the best that you can. It makes you feel not great but man when it clicks and it starts feeling better it's something else. So you're not considering a career in broadcasting anymore like you were in early 2023? What they do is so hard that I couldn't imagine just thinking that I could quit golf and to start broadcasting and be really good at it. I've spent a little time with kids and smiley when they're doing their show and I did it for like an hour. I'm exhausted. I don't know how you guys do this all day. This is impossible. You've got people talking in your ear, you're trying to keep up with the golf, you can't see anything on the screen, they're asking you which way the putt breaks, this is really tough. So maybe retirement or job for you or that might be off the cards? I'm going to stick to what I'm doing for as long as I can. Once you see the other side, you're like, I don't know about that. It's hard. Obviously, Zach Johnson was a mentor for you. He talked a little about your relationship with Jim. What are some ways he's helped you through your career? I've always asked him short game questions all the time. I think it was like six years in a row, he led the tour in proximity chipping from the rough. And that was always a tough spot for me. I was really, really good out of the bunkers, really, really good chipping from the fairway. But out of the deep rough was something that I'd always struggled with. And so I would always ask Jim, like, "Jim, how the hell are you?" And he's got a way of explaining things that's super helpful. He's very even keel, doesn't get too rattled. He's just a great example for, especially, you know, because Jim coming up, he's got this unique golf swing that if he would have listened to everyone tell him how different his golf swing was, you know, he would have never been as successful as he is, but he believed in what he knew how to do. And he's like, "Well, I'm just going to keep doing this. It's working pretty good. And I'll see where it takes me." And it takes a lot of confidence. It takes a lot of belief and most people don't have that. So what was the tip out of the rough? I can't tell you that. No, Chinesa, you could give anybody chipping advice. We all do it so different. He tries to get steep and hit a draw. Y'all figure that out. You were mentioning him being number one in proximity out of the rough. Do you dive deep into the stats? If something's bothering me, I do. It's just tough, though, because, like, my strokes gained this year, like, around the green doesn't look very good. My putting went down, but my strokes gained ball striking way up. So it's all like a ratio. If you start hitting it really, really, really well, your putting stat is going to look worse unless you're shooting 63 every time. I need someone smarter to explain that to me. It sounds like you guys are getting to Montreal fairly early. Is that a response at all to last year? I know some-- I think even Zach said might have gotten there too late. What's the benefit there of maybe getting there earlier? How did it affect you guys last year? I just think that we all have such really-- it's just hard to get us all together at the same time, like, in an ideal world, we would take some sort of trip, a place where we could all get away and all spend a little time together. But our schedules, once the year ends, it's so hard. Guys live on the west coast, guys live on the east coast. And so I think that's a move to try to get us all in the same place a little bit sooner so that we can start working on the golf course and working on paroms and really getting ready to play. I think it's a great idea. You mentioned kind of maybe dragging in that first match, were you guys still getting adjusted to time period or time zone and stuff like that in Rome? It's just a lot that goes into the week and until you've played a few, it's hard to know how to pace yourself. And so you show up and you're really excited, but the first day you're there, you probably just need to sleep all day and start getting used to the time. It's tough to go over there. Your agent, Jeremy, not to sell him out, but I think he has some pretty good job security at this point, but he says you're a big reader. And he said you at the open, you had a thousand page book that you were lugging with you across the pond. Yeah. Can you share what that is? Man, I got a little into the sci-fi books. I was watching the Game of Thrones spin off House of Dragon, so I read the book Fire and Blood. It's just like corresponding and I really like the Dune movies. So I read all the Dune books. Was reading a later in life passion for you? Yeah, I hated reading while I was when it mattered. Golf wise, how does that play in? Are you more of a feel or more of a technical guy? Definitely feel guy. Definitely feel guy. The technique stuff has never done great with me. If I'm consciously thinking about a swing or a movement, it rarely works. I have to compartmentalize it. So I have to say like, okay, I'm going to work on this movement for 10 minutes and I'll work on that movement. Well, I'm doing that. I don't judge the outcome of the golf shots. I judge the outcome of how I felt during the movement that I do the movement right and I execute that right. And then after I feel like I've trained that for a second, then I'll go through my routine and hit a golf shot. And before the Ryder Cup, you did play it into Walker Cups, the kind of amateur version of it. What was the best story of maybe especially young Brian Harmon, I think you were the youngest American ever, you know, five, what was the best story of kind of your maybe flash and swag or do you have a good story with Anthony Campbell you played with? Yeah. Okay. We had we had some good times, man. We were probably playing the best golf on that team, him especially. He was he was something else. But yeah, for me, like I felt like I had something to prove. I was kind of a cocky little, you know, whatever I wasn't well liked. I didn't really fit the mold for the quintessential Walker Cup player. I was a guy that they probably wouldn't have normally picked. But you know, I kind of took it out of their hands. I want to play his amateur, which got me to the number one amateur spot. I was 18. They had to put me on there and I heard they couldn't help it. They said to tell me like, Oh, you were the last guy to get picked. Oh, really? Last guy. I certainly enjoyed it. I love the team stuff. I really wanted to make all those teams lucky enough to make a couple and enjoy both of that team with Anthony. I'm assuming you two were not lacking in confidence. I don't know. We weren't. But Anthony and I didn't get along. We bumped heads in junior golf. I didn't think he was that fun to be around. And we played a practice session down in Tampa and we played singles against each other and he killed me. And I just remember us talking like, Hey, I know that we're not like boys or anything, but I think we'd be pretty good partners. So it just shows like, you know, we were both willing to put aside some temporary discomfort. And then once we started partnering up, I mean, the lights, this game, it kind of shows good partnerships can come out of anywhere. That's right. I hope Chris Kirk doesn't mind me telling the story, but him and I tried to play together at a Palmer Cup and didn't play any good. We got boat race the couple of times and we were, you know, best friends and we both just kind of decided like, you know, we just don't make good partners for whatever reason. Were you and Max was it mostly a product of the data last year? It started as a product of the data for sure. Him and I hadn't talked much about playing together, but they felt like we were going to be a really good match play partners. And I was stoked to play with you watching hit the ball and like, yeah, we can work with that. What was the fireiest you saw in your time together? He made a couple of putts that really fired him up. He chipped in for us to be set and Shane on 16. And I mean, he turned away before the ball went in. So in Rome, you did say that you were a big flora and fauna guy. I think you were, you were marveling at the scotch pines. What are we looking out for in Montreal? I don't know. They've got nice bullets up there. They should be turning a little bit. They're big maples up there. They're maple bats. Perfect. Well, I know you'll be looking forward to seeing some maples playing some golf. Congrats on being on another team. And thanks for joining us. Thanks, Sean. We thank Brian for his time, and as always, please like and subscribe to the Talk of the Tour podcast and your favorite app. We will return Tuesday with the venerable John Swan tick, returning to the host here. Thanks for listening, and I'm Sean Martin. (upbeat music)