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(upbeat music) - Max Bankman, I'm the new doctor. - Welcome aboard the Odyssey. - ABC Thursdays. - This ship is heaven. - We're attending to our passenger streams. - I'm in. - From 9-1-1 executive producer, Ryan Murphy comes a splashy new drama on a luxury cruise ship with Joshua Jackson and Don Johnson. - It's your job to keep everyone alive. - She's gonna be fed one, two, three, clear. - I have a pulse. - You're gonna be okay. - Dr. Odyssey, Thursdays, 9/8 Central on ABC and stream on Hulu. (upbeat music) - Slow burn media and evergreen podcast presents. Who killed? A podcast that provides a voice for the voiceless. - Alicia Markovich was only 15 years old when she was last seen here along Dunn Avenue in Blaersville 34 years ago. Right here is Route 22 and this is where a billboard will go up next week for Markovich as her friends and family seek answers into her disappearance. - The disappearance of 15-year-old Alicia Markovich in 1987 has left one of her best friends, Lori Heiner, asking why and how. - It's been uneasy for the last 34 years not knowing where she's at and whether she's even still possibly alive. It's been difficult. - Markovich was last seen leaving her father's house along Dunn Avenue on April 26, 1987 after the pair got into an argument. She wasn't heard from again. On the 24th anniversary of her disappearance in 2011, state police announced they wanted to take a fresh look at the case. Her mother, Marcy Smith, pleading for answers. - I feel like sometimes I don't have a purpose here 'cause I always wanted grandchildren and I always wanted more children but never happened. - But the case remained cold more than three decades later. State police told me today they are looking to see if there are any new developments in the case. - We just decided, you know what? Marcy, she really never had anybody to stand beside her to help her do all this. - Heiner and another friend of Markovich along with her mother want to bring the case back in the spotlight to give her mother closure. Next week, this billboard will be placed along Route 22 in Blairsville. Banners will go up in her hometown of Windber Somerset County with the hope of finding answers and peace. - If you know something and you remember from back then, you know, just call the hotline or call the detectives and let them know if you remember anything. - Friends are also holding a basket party on October 9th in Windber for Markovich with the money going towards banners, yard signs, and billboards as they continue to see justice for Alicia. Reporting in Blairsville, Katelyn Sykes, Pittsburgh's Action News 4. (upbeat music) - Hello and welcome to this week's episode of Who Killed? I'm your host, Bill Huffman. And this is a slow burn media and evergreen podcast production. This week I am joined by a special guest, Lori, who is here to discuss a disappearance from 1987. Thank you so much for joining the show, Lori. - Thank you for having me, Bill. - So, what case are we here to discuss? - I have a friend she's been missing for 34 years and we have decided that we want answers and we want to know why nothing has been done in a long time. - And with that being said, who is your friend and what are some of the details about her case? - Her name is Alicia Markovich. She was 15 when she disappeared. She was on a day visit with her father. It's a Blairsville, Pennsylvania. And nobody has seen her heard from her since. - No, that's, so that's terrible. And from what research I've done, the way that the story kind of goes is that she was, she disappeared and literally nobody saw her ever again. - Nope, no one has seen her. She hasn't contacted anybody. - So, what are some of the efforts your guys are currently doing to help find this person? - Should we stack a billboard up outside of her father's home? It's right along Route 22 there in Blairsville. We just kind of attacked and meet the social media everywhere, just putting her name and her case out there in hopes that something or somebody would know something can come forward after 34 years. - Yeah, you know, what I was thought really interesting about the research that I was doing was what led up to her leaving the home. And that was the disagreement with her dad. And, you know, anytime you see that, and this isn't to point fingers or anything, but anytime you hear that, I mean, kind of hard not to think a little bit about what really happened. - Yeah, 'cause she was a good student. She was an A/B student. So, the argument over the grade just doesn't make any sense. I mean, she-- - So, you see a disparity between what the story relayed to the police. - Absolutely. - It does not match up to what kind of person she was. - No, no. I shared the typical teenager, little rebellious, but we all were back then at age 15. - Everybody is at 15. - Yeah, yeah. - So, I guess that leads me to the question of love. Do you feel like there's been a cover up, or do you feel like there's just been a lack of interest? - They just went by his story that she ran away. Now, she left the house and never looked back. It just, you know, but she would never, she had a boyfriend and one bird. You know, she had, she was very popular. She had a lot of friends. She did, she got along with everybody. Now, I don't know a person that she didn't get along with. - And so, and you said you were really good friends with her. She was one of your best friends. - Yeah. - So, okay, walk me through what happened when she disappeared. I mean, that had been so traumatic and so awful for you. - It seemed, it was kept hush hush from us kids for some reason. - Yeah. - 'Cause you didn't hear a whole lot about the case after she disappeared. I mean, we saw the posters hanging up, but there was really no talk about where she was, what was going on. You know, was anybody trying to find her? But I do know her mom did hang posters up in Blaresville and in Windburr and her and her boyfriend at the time did go do a search in Blaresville looking for her. But it really was not even discussed that much, a bunch with a bunch of us kids and stuff. It just wasn't. - That's so, that's so weird. 'Cause when I was a kid, you know, we had a girl disappear from the city next door and we were just sort of like inundated with, and that was in '89. So maybe it was just a difference in the era. - Yeah, yeah. - You know, I mean, it's just two years apart, but nonetheless, it's just, I guess it's the height of stranger danger and I can really shock that the police did not put like a more of an effort into finding who was responsible or where she even went. - We don't know if it's because it was a different town. She just disappeared from or we have no idea. - Do you know if her father had any like connections with law enforcement or anything along those lines? - I haven't seen any of that yet. - Okay. - Because they need any research and we've done in the background. - Gotcha. - And I haven't seen any connection between him and the cops yet. - Now, do you feel like the cops have a suspect? - They always tell us that there's nobody's been rolled out, that's always been the answer. Nobody's been rolled out. - I noticed that as their last line is they kind of state what they state and then they go, but nobody's been rolled out. - Yes, yes. - So it's kind of, it's interesting because they're able to like kind of say, for them to say that, I was with the kids in the background, I'm at the background. - Yeah, no, that's fine. (laughs) - I made mind stay in the other room. - Well, there's supposed to be upstairs being quiet, but they're not, they're kids and that's what happens, apparently. So anyway, back to what we were talking about. So Alicia disappears and what was the date exactly? Was it the springtime or? - Yeah, it was April 26, 1987. She was, she usually went on weekend visits with her dad, she never really had too many day visits. So we all thought it was a little kind of odd that that day was picked for her to go with her father because she also was on the high school track team. And that day they were having a car wash fundraiser for the track team. And so I just felt that was kind of weird to take her away from a school function. - So she didn't participate? - No, she went, and her mother decided she was gonna go with her dad that day just because, you know, it's. - Okay, so what was the relationship like that you just, you kind of make it sound like there wasn't a much of one with her dad? - Well, she was a teenager, so, you know, we rather, at that age, we prefer to be with our friends to hang out with our school friends even. And so with that weekend, she went to a wedding the Saturday before she disappeared and why he chose that day to take her. We can only speculate. - Yeah, so, let's go back up to the fact that they kept this quiet. How did they do that? I mean, she's obviously not in school. - Yeah. - And there's gotta be questions about where she went. I mean, do you have those questions? - Yeah, when she first disappeared, I just thought, well, she's with another friend, you know? She's either with her boyfriend or she's at another friend's house. Then you just, sadly, just never heard anything more. - Yeah, rarely, I mean, it's very few and far between. I mean, I can name a couple cases off the top of my head, like Brian Shafer from Ohio State, you know, that just kind of disappears and you never hear from them again. And you don't have, you know, there's no trace of them. You know, like, it's one thing if, I know that they did a search at his house after she disappeared, but, you know, what does that mean? You know, they got-- - Yeah, from when I gathered, but the searches, they just kind of did a walk through, just to see if anything looked the hankier, you know, see if there's anything out of ordinary and then when they didn't see anything, they just kind of went with his theory that she ran away. - Now, there's another thing that's interesting about that day is that he goes out and starts looking for her, apparently. - Yeah. - And eventually calls her mother one in the morning and says, you know, Alicia's gone. - Yeah, she's gone. - That's a weird thing to say. - Yeah, yeah. - And I spoke to one of her friends out in Blairsville that she had back then. And he said that he never saw John that day. He never saw Alicia that day. And he was one of her close friends from Blairsville. - So there's not a lot of tracing of what the father and the daughter were up to on that day. I don't know what he says. - Yeah, and it's a 45 minute drive from one bird of Blairsville. So there's a lot of time. - That's just so weird. So why did the mother, what was the mother's thought about this? I mean, this seems just like, if she wasn't getting along with her dad, why would she allow this to happen on a school event day? - Yeah, she never dreamed that she would never see her again when she went with her dad. She never thought this was something would happen. - Yeah, that's, I mean, of course, I mean, why would you? I mean, it's not like there was anything at that point. - Yeah, 'cause she and him didn't get along, but the majority of time, I guess they did, but I guess going after the child support, that kind of, he was angry about that. And so they were fighting a lot about that. - Yeah, I read that. And that that, I read that her mom said, if your dad brings that up, tell them it's between us. - Yes. - And don't, you know, don't get yourself involved. And good advice. - Yeah, right? That's my mom. She never got us involved in child support stuff. That was always between the adults. - Yeah, what do you mean, what are you doing? That's putting a lot of pressure on your child and too much, you know, that's not cool. - Yeah. - At all. So that's just weird. - It is. - And so the mom, I think I read in the 25th anniversary, she was taught, you know, she's been interviewed a number of times, but she talks about, you know, she had, she was raised by her grandparents, right? - Yes, and now, I mean, Marcy, she was quite young when she had Alicia, but her and John were still together for at least nine years after Alicia was born, so. - Okay, so they had been divorced for about six years before she disappeared? - Before they should have disappeared, yeah. - Wow, so she had six years of dealing with child support and all that stuff. That's a lot to handle, especially for her, you know, for Alicia at that age, you know, she's, that's a lot of pressure. I mean, your parents get divorced at nine and then there's this whole child support issue. That just, as a true crime podcaster and researcher, it just reeks of, I don't know if I can believe what I'm hearing. - Yeah, that's why we're asking questions because it's just none of it just makes sense to just take it and not even look into it. It just doesn't make sense. - So they have not like actually, you don't believe they've actually done their due diligence as far as trying to find her? - No, I don't, but that's not put on today's detectives. I just wish today's detectives would just kind of pick it up at the beginning and kind of look at it as a brand new case and work it as a brand new case. Instead of going back 34 years old while they did this, 34 years ago, so we don't have to do that now. Like there's new, there's all kinds of new technology now that they could work with. And that's what we kind of want them to do is just kind of look at it with new eyes. - Yeah, I noticed that they took the baby teeth and they were able to get a DNA profile. And that's very important because even if, you know, the worst case scenario, they find a skeleton or something along those lines, they at least can find answers. And I believe I saw that the information had been loaded into the national database. Is that correct? - Yeah, the donut work it has been, yeah. And I think the FBI database has it too. Yeah, 'cause we've been going through Jane Doe's and we found one that out of Monroe Township, her name's Penny Doe, she had a lot of similarities to Alicia. And so I contacted the Doe network and Mary there, she told me that yeah, she has been compared with Penny Doe and there's no match. - So, I mean, that's got to be very hard to handle as a friend and, you know, like being so close to her. And basically you're scouring John Doe or Jane Doe reports to compare it to your friend. That's just got it. That's just nobody should have to do that. - Yeah, we were a little excited with the Penny Doe one, but you know, it was a little disappointing they weren't a match. - Yeah, I mean, the first case that I covered on my podcast, it's, you know, they have like a little bit of DNA and they just are waiting for that technology to catch up. And that's what they always say, like, we're just waiting for the technology to get to the point where we can use just a piece of it, not the whole thing. And they would usually just, you know, describe it as we've got so much of the DNA to compare it to. But like, again, there's not even a crime scene. So, I mean, if there was a crime scene, clearly this case would be completely different and probably solved at this point. And I mean, when I say crime scene, I mean, someplace that actually, where if they're just doing a walkthrough, you know, that's a little, you know, they can almost dictate, like the father can almost dictate what's going on, and within that search itself. - And a year after Lee should disappear, he claims that his car was stolen and it was found destroyed by fire in the town next. Next, yeah. - Yeah. - All right. - Brand new one-year-old vehicle found the next town burned, destroyed. - Red flag number three, I'm counting up now. - And they just went with the theory that it was stolen. Yeah. - Oh, no. This is not, this is like, I don't want to say Keystone Cops, 'cause it's Pennsylvania, but. - Yeah, right. - I mean, dropping the ball. - Yeah. - How big is the town? Let's start with that. - Flaresville is a small town. There's probably just a couple thousand people. The same with Weinberg. Weinberg's just a couple thousand people. - So is it, Sheriff? - Pennsylvania State. - Okay. So, okay, that's so interesting. And they didn't find anything, you know, they didn't think this was like unusual. And the fact that she's never had any activity on a bank account or anything, in any, you know, trying to get a license or an ID or. - Yeah, no, nothing. They're just running with the theory that she ran away. And we all know she didn't. - That's. - Her mom's very open about her thoughts on it. - So give me some of what her mom thinks, because I would just like to hear from your perspective. - Her mom believes that John knows what happened to her. She always says the last person that saw her is the one that harmed her and is the one that knows where she's at. And what they did to her. She's very open about her feelings on it. - And I noticed that she's gotten, now is she still involved with the investigation and stuff? - As much as she can be, yeah. She's still with everything coming out, like that we've been doing with the awareness. She's kind of resorted back to it. She's distraught over the whole thing still. She still, she still agrees for Alicia. - Yeah, well, yeah, clearly. I mean, that's one of those things that you don't think you ever get over. I mean, how can, and especially when you don't have anything to go by, when you're looking at, okay, a child who gets killed and that's okay, terrible. And you'll never get over that either, but. - You've got a place to go at least. - And you have at least, you know, in your mind, what happened. - And where they're at. And where they're at, and you can be at peace as much as you possibly can be in that situation. You know, talking to parents that have lost children, it's just, you know, clearly it's something that you're gonna never get over. But if you have like a place to go and mourn, I think that, that does help. But this situation has got to be absolutely awful. And it's good that you guys have stepped up and taken some of the pressure off of Marcy. - Yeah, and she hasn't had much support over the last four to four years either. I mean, she has friends that helped her. Yeah, she's had friends help her put posters up back then. But over the past 30 years, there just hasn't been much support for her to get the word out. - I just can't believe that. Okay, what's the closest major city to Blair'sville? - Pittsburgh. - Oh, okay. So how far are we talking? - When I was home, it took us an hour to get to Blair'sville. And then it takes another hour to get to Wember. - Okay. - So it's an hour difference. - All right. That's so weird. So that's where she was living with her mom in Wember. - In Wember, yeah. - Okay. So she goes, how often would she go and visit her dad? - I believe she had every other weekend visits. - Okay. And so she would typically stay on Saturday night, or would she stay Friday and Saturday night? - Friday, yeah, Friday, Saturday night. - Okay. - And then she'd stay a little longer during the summertime. - So she had a okay relationship with her dad? - I don't think it was horrible, but-- - Anything can happen? - Yeah. - Yeah, I mean, when you get money and lost and love and all that stuff mixed into it, it's tough to not look at that as-- (baby laughing) It's tough not to look at that and just shake your head. I mean, the whole thing seems to be like a-- - Yeah, and it was only a hundred dollar difference that Morrissey was asking for. - Yeah. - Maybe he's going from a hundred dollars to two hundred dollars. And the hearing was that Wednesday after she vanished. - Wow. - Yeah, there was red flag number four. - Red flag number four. Good Lord. I cannot believe that the police did not investigate this thoroughly. Now, I saw that they did it hold a press conference at the, what, 25 year? - Dad, Marcy had one in 2011, so yeah, that was been 25 years. - Okay. And so-- - And he never showed up for it, the father. - I saw that. - That's red flag number five. - Yes, it is, I would agree. Now, I noticed that he moved to Ohio. - Yeah, he had a job there in an assault mine or something rather, more of an assault mine. - Yeah, I'm from Cleveland, so-- - Okay. - I'm very familiar with the assault mines under Lake Erie and it's actually a very, anybody who has never looked into that. It's very wild and the water salt-- - Yeah, I have, yeah, I have looked into it. It's interesting. - Yeah, it's 'cause I sail boats on that lake and to think that there are people mining underneath it is so wild and it would make sense that he would move there for his job. I was just, and I did read that he'd still owns the house though. - Yes. - So does he rent it then? - His wife lives in the farest real house. - Oh, he's, oh, he's a wife. - Yeah. - Okay, so-- - We can call that number six. (laughing) - Well, why did they live in a part? - Yeah, that's another weird part of this whole scenario. - Wow. This is just getting weirder and weirder. - Yeah, the gatekeeper, I guess you can say. - She's the gatekeeper? - That's what I call it. That's my opinion. - Like you feel like she's holding down the fort? - Yeah, 'cause I would never live apart from my husband. - So why is she staying there? I mean, that leads to some major speculations about what's in that house. So what, what has to happen in order to get the police to, I don't know, start asking some more questions. I noticed that with your, you know, the billboard, when the billboard went up, there was talked, you know, they talked to different troopers and whatnot and that they mentioned that they were gonna re-interview people. - Yeah, they did have little bits, but I don't think they did as much as we would like for them too. - Because you know, you want them to interview her father. - Yeah, and just that mother and anybody else that was around back then. And there's still a lot of people in that town from back in 1987. - Now, can I ask, was she married to him, the one that's living in the Blair'sville house now? Was she married to him? - They were dating off and on at the time. - Okay. - And then they married in 2006. - Wow, that's weird. That's weird. So they dated for almost 19 years or before they got married. - Yeah, I mean, everybody's got their own pace. But I wonder if there's some connection 'cause you know, the whole rule of, you know, the wife can't be forced to testify against the husband. - We thought about that one too, yeah. - Yeah, as all favor, you know, all of us crime junkies do, you know. We like to run with all the different theories that we've learned along the way. - Absolutely. And I mean, I've even ran around with the runaway theory for a little bit and then I go, no, she wouldn't run away. You know, it just, you just kind of go through everything in your head of every scenario. - How would she do it at that age? You know, it's not like she was some street wise kid from what I read, she was pretty much just a normal girl or the night, you know, she didn't get in trouble and she just kind of. - Yeah, now we're just our typical rebellious teenagers back then, you know, we didn't get any trouble with cops or anything like that. You're just, you know, we'd stay at each other's houses and pretend like we're staying at each other's houses and stay out all night long, you know? That's probably the... - Never did that as a 15 year old, trust me. (laughing) Unfortunately, the first part I probably did, you know, run in the law enforcement every once in a while, but that was just being juvenile stuff, so it's all good. - Yeah, yeah. - That record sealed. - Typical teenage stuff, you know, she wasn't anything unnormal about a teenager. - Yeah, like so if you, okay, you say you ran with the Runaway Theory for a little while, where did you go with it? - I'm not very far. (laughing) She had a boyfriend, you know, and her and her boyfriend got along and she had a lot of girlfriends, you know? We all hung out off and on, you know, she got along with everybody, there was no reason for her just to run up and runway. - So we've talked a lot about her dad's possibility and being involved, you know? Definitely lots of red flags there. Do you give any credence to the theory that she was just randomly picked up? No, your mind is pretty... - Yeah, she had a boyfriend. There was no reason for her to get in a car or the truck was anybody. And her boyfriend had a car. All she had to do was call him. - Yeah, 'cause they say she, you know, she might have gone hitchhiked. - Yeah, all I should do is call her boyfriend. He drove, he had a car. - That's so, okay, again, red flag number seven now. Like, what the heck are the cops doing at this point? They're not doing anything. Like, I mean, hey, my daughter ran away. - It's okay. - And he just, there's the way he talks about her in newspaper articles and stuff. When he was interviewed, it's just off the wall stuff. - Give me an example of that. - One newspaper article we found that he was interviewed in. He said that she was kidnapped into the sex trade and she made the most of it. And she's gonna show up at his doorstep in a Cadillac or something rather, Lincoln, dripping in jewels, you know? It's just, yeah, just off the wall stuff like that. - Oh, that's kind of jumping to some serious conclusions? - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, I've got a daughter and if she disappeared, that's the farthest from my mind is thinking anything like that. It's just out there. - Like, so he's saying she was basically forced to sex trafficking? - And she made the most of it. - She made the most of it, what the hell does that mean? That doesn't make any sense. - Right, right. - No, it's called sex trafficking. - Yeah. - You're kidnapped. - Yeah, yeah. My daughter will never go into Mexico because I was told by a friend who works with protecting children. He said, don't ever take her there. - Don't don't. - 'Cause she's blonde and blue-eyed, you know? - In Mexico, you're saying? - Yeah, she said, he said she's worth a lot of money there and so, yeah, he said. - What a world we live in. - And so it's like, you protect your children. That my point is you protect your children. You know, you don't. - You don't go around saying that they got into the sex trade and made the most of it. - Yeah, yeah. - I don't know. - That's why I was going with that. Do you protect your kids? You don't, it's just the strange comments that were made. - That is extremely strange and disconcerting to say the least. And what's your communication with the police? I mean, do you guys talk to them at all? I mean, do you have like a person at the state police that you've talked to that you can kind of bounce stuff off of? - Yeah, there's Chupa Murdock through the Indiana barracks. We call him when we have questions or any ideas that may come up. - And is he open to talk? And do you about it? - Oh yeah, yeah, he's very open to talking to us. - So is he the person that would be technically in charge of the case at the present moment? - I believe he is at the moment. I know there's another detective that's been looking into the case that he's the one that we've been kind of bouncing our ideas and questioning all of them. - Well, that's great that you guys have at least a source and you can say is this a bunk lead or is this something that we should actually follow up on? 'Cause the big story was, you guys putting up the billboard and I have to say that you've mentioned something in the beginning that you put the billboard nears. - It's like 50 feet from the door that she disappeared from. - And there's a reason for putting it that close? - Oh yeah, we all had a reason behind it. - And what kind of reaction have you had from that? - They weren't happy about it, the people that live in the house there. - Sure, was it a billboard there? Was there a billboard there anyway? - Yeah, there is, there was. - Okay, so it's just the subject matter that they have an issue with. - Yeah, yeah, if you look at pictures of it, it seems you walk out that door, you're looking at a big picture of Alicia. - Now, I didn't see this covered in the news stories, but did they, and I just may have missed it, did they ask you guys about that particular location? - No, the gentleman I called about it, he just, he just, this gave me the price on it, and we got it all together and got it put up there, and the cops, from learn to stand there, they like our idea, you know? And we also put posters up again, all over Glaresville. - I saw some were taken down, what's up with that? - Yeah, I, it's, we're actually a plan for the idea of putting a couple cameras up and seeing if it happens again. So they viewed, that's another trick that has been used many times to, you know, catch somebody in the act. And I think the exact same thing happened with another disappearance where they caught the, I don't know, the person that was involved taking down like the missing posters. It's like, I'm dumb, are you? With CCTV everywhere these days. - Yeah, it's, it's, so we started putting them up inside the stores, that would let us, that way they can't be removed. - Right. - It's just, yeah, it, and it happened actually 34 years ago and we should disappear too, the posters were being removed. - Really? - Yeah, yeah, Marcy told us about that. - So Marcy would put up the posters and, next thing you know, they're gone? - They're gone, yeah. - Now, what was his relationship with like the community? I mean, was he like, like, let's see, let's put it this way, was he like somebody that was involved with community stuff? I mean, or... - No, I don't believe he was involved in community stuff now. And the... - Did he have a lot of friends? - I don't believe so, because the few people that I have spoke to said that he was an SOB. - Yeah, that's... So, okay, I'm just trying to wrap my head. I'm trying to make a theory or come up with an idea of how he could have done this without anybody. - I don't know, clearly he's gotten away with it for 34 years. If he's a person involved, you know, please note that that's, you know, we're just... - It's hearsay at the moment, but... - Yes, but when you think about Occam's Razor, where the simplest answer is usually the answer. - Pennsylvania State, please tell us they need substantial evidence to do anything, and that's... - They need a crime scene, a body. - They do, they do, and that's unfortunate. And you can't, I mean, you can't have them chasing, like, you know, okay, here's another red flag, the letter. - Yeah. - What was up with that? - It was supposedly, it's a hoax letter. - Sure, obviously. - I've had somebody tell me that it was written by... - Say it. - The wife, and yeah, so... I asked, I called Murdoch and asked him if it was ever tested for DNA, and he said it was, everything came back and conclusive, so there was nothing... - Chocking. - Yeah, and they looked into the person who was on the postmark on it, and they didn't know who Alicia was, where Blairsboro was, never been to that area of Pennsylvania. - That was in New Hampshire too, right? - Yeah. - I mean, that's just... When I read that, that seemed like, okay, he feels like they're closing in or something, and so he's gonna throw out of a distraction letter, and hey, this came. - Yeah, and if that's what his... It was for him to be thrown off the whole case, he kind of backfired on it, because I think it made it even more obvious. - Well, that's kind of similar to what happened with BTK. BTK wanted to be... He was like, well, why aren't they covering me anymore? So he started communicating with the media. - Yeah. - It's like, idiot, you're gonna get caught, and so... - Yeah. - You're right, I mean, it'll... - It's the narcosistic thoughts. - Absolutely, I can talk myself out of anything. - Yeah, me too. - No, no, no, I'm just saying that's the classic sociopath, like, let's say you did something terrible, and you're like, I got this. You know, like, it's just, you know, 'cause I'm not saying you're a sociopath. (laughing) 'Cause that's what you kind of replied there, but we're not gonna go on that route. (laughing) - No, I just meant that I have my conscience just wouldn't allow me to even, you know, think about anything to do with hurting or harming somebody, or even, you know, it's just not normal. - No, it's not. And there's so many things about this case, it sounds so fishy, and you gotta figure that... (sighing) I mean, if something happened, it was probably a spur of the moment thing, and... - I'd like to think that it was an accident if something didn't happen. I don't wanna think that it was done on purpose. - 'Cause I read, and that's funny you say that, they're not funny, but it's interesting that you say that. Because Marcy even said like, if they even got in a scuffle, it would have been fine. And I'm thinking like, whoa, wait a sec, why are they scuffling? This is a teenage girl and an adult male. - I think that's just hard just trying to kind of wrap her head around the whole thing too. You know, I don't think they ever really scuffled. I think that's just her trying to come up with some kind of theory. - Yeah, that's really just... I mean, it's so, how do I just say this? How can I say this without sounding? Gosh, it just seems like the police absolutely drop the ball and aren't following up with what they need to be doing. And that is asking the right questions. - Yeah, and it's been through a lot of detectives over the years too. It's been through at least five or six. - And I understand that like new cases take precedent and you know, it's just, it is what it is when it comes to that kind of stuff. But with all of these cases that remain unsolved in the country, you'd think that they would put more effort into closing some of these cases because you think about it. - There can't be that many in that area. - Right, just pick like exactly, pick the area of okay, Blair'sville, Windburr, like start with that area and just start re-interviewing people and just go back to square one, start with dad and then... - Since you've lost a seer or something. - Yeah, you have to. - And just kind of go from there. - You know, it's like the last person to see her is always like a suspect and then the person who discovers the body is generally a possible suspect too. You know, they have typically in investigations, that's how they do this stuff. - Yeah, and even go back and interview Paul again, which is her boyfriend at the time. But he's been interviewed and clear it from what I understand anyways, but you know, what's the harm of... We asking questions, yeah? - You never know what you're gonna remember and I know that it's 34 years ago and... But if you get the right detective on the case and they start picking through the discrepancies, then, you know, it's not really hard to build a narrative here. I mean, I feel like the narrative is kind of written itself and that's, and that has been written by her dad. So the fact that they take it as just, you know, proof that... - That face value, yeah. - They just took it at face value and didn't run with it. You know, but things are so different today than they were back to say it would have been completely different type of investigation. - I 100% agree. And with all the stuff that we have nowadays, as far as cameras and every location, pretty much, there's no way that she would have been, you know, missing for this long. - Now, I think if today's day was back then, she would have been found. - And if there was an issue with her dad and they did, you know, have an accident or she had an accident and her dad didn't wanna be blamed for it and, you know, disposed of the body, which is just a terrible thought to think of. But 34 years is a long time to carry that burden if you're that guy. And then let's say it's not him and then all this attention that's been put on him is, you know, it's just adding insult to injury or poor insult in the wound, whatever you wanna call it. - With that being said though, I just feel if that was the case, wouldn't he be helping us a lot more than he does? Or wouldn't he be suing you or something like that if there was- - Helping us keep that billboard up, you know, helping us put out flyers, you know, helping us get the investigation rolling again. - Considering he's the last person to see her, I would agree and he's even said in the article, like, you know, one of the articles is that, you know, kids and parents getting fights and I didn't think that she wouldn't come back. And it's like, all right, well, what kind of traffic comes through Blair'sville that she could have randomly gotten picked up by a stranger 'cause stranger abductions, as we know, are the least likely of scenarios. I mean, if you're gonna get hurt by a family, or hurt by anybody, it's gonna be a family member or somebody close to the family, somebody you know, at least nine out of 10 times. In the 22, about 22, long there, it's pretty busy freeway, highway. You know, somebody would have seen something if she would be down on that highway. - Yeah. - In the trailer park that she would have went to, it's two miles down the highway. - Had she ever hitchhiked? - No, I don't think she's at the hitchhiked. - So where does that come from? - Yeah. - I mean, it's just, even in '87, you knew better. - Yeah. - I mean, it's not 1977. - She's a 15-year-old girl. - That's what I'm saying. Who's putting herself out on the street like that to potentially get, you know, abducted and like that's, she's not an idiot and she's not a child. She's basically a young adult at this point. And yeah, of course, we all made bad decisions. We were 15, but that's just being 15. But I don't know if going and getting some stranger's cars is something that this girl would have done from everything I've read as far as her personality goes. - No, no. She liked to have fun. She was funky, yeah, but she wasn't stupid, not at all. - Yeah, I mean, so who are some of the people that are helping with you with this endeavor to track down Alicia? - There's a few of us were really good friends with her back when she disappeared. And in a few that are, they grew up in our same town of Winber that are helping out. And then we have one girl, Nikki. She's a, she had school for criminology and her uncle was at one time involved in the case. And so that's how she got interested in Alicia's case and she's been helping us also. - Yeah. - It's just a bunch of girls that kind of in some way are involved with Alicia's life, that decided to, it's kind of, see if we can get things. - When did you guys-- - The kind of closure. - When did you guys form this team? - Back in August, it's only been a few months. - Okay, so you're really just getting started. And so there's a lot that could happen. I mean, 'cause pressure is pressure. And as we know, like what you get out of pressure. And we get, you get-- - Yeah, and the social media today too, it's, she's being seen, her case is being seen and read and heard and it's being covered again in the news. So she's had a lot of coverage in the past three months. - Oh, that's great. (chuckles) That's, I think that's the most important thing, is just getting the word out. And a lot of times, every time I've talked to investigators, they've always said that, and this is an Adam Walsh thing, and I've talked, everybody who's listening to this show knows that I'm gonna, what I'm about to say and is that when you have somebody that's missing, you're close to, it's either a family member or your friend, you unfortunately have to be a squeaky wheel and in order to get stuff moving, because again, like I said before, things take precedent when new cases happen and new murders happen and it's just, they only have so much people to work with. And again, it's just great that you're doing what you're doing. Because-- - I'm hoping we'll have some kind of results. - Well, I would say that Alicia would be very proud of what you guys are doing and the fact that you're putting all this effort into finding some closure for her and her family, whichever kind of closure that may be, which again, I'm using that word very sparingly because there's no such thing. Marcy will never have closure. It's an open wound for the rest of your life, but I just, I think what you guys are doing is great and let's just hope that there are some results from this and that people will start contacting you. Do you have a phone number or like a tip line or an email that people can reach out? - Just to call the Pennsylvania State Police, it's their number is I think 7, 2, 4, 3, 5, 7, 19, 68, I believe it is. - And there are also some Facebook pages, right? - Yeah, the Justice for Alicia Markovich, the Facebook page, that's a group one and then we have a member's page on Facebook and then we're also on Twitter, Instagram. - What's your Twitter handle? - It's Justice for Alicia Markovich and then we're also getting ready to be put up on uncover.com so she'll have a digital file up there also. - Good, good, good. Really sounds like you're doing your due diligence on this. - Trying to cover all the bases. - Somebody has to, right? - Yes. - Well, do you have any final thoughts that you'd like the listeners to know or, you know, just anything about Alicia that you would like to share? - She was a really, really nice person. She was very liked by everybody and she deserves to be home. She deserves to have some rest also. And so if you have any information, just contact the Indiana State Police, Indiana County State Police in Pennsylvania. Let them know if you know of anything. - Yeah, I mean, 'cause a lot of times it's hard to keep things to yourself and you never know when somebody's gonna kind of open up and share something. And so, you know, just remember that everybody, like if you hear something about this case, reach out to the State Police. I mean, even post something on their Facebook page if you feel like you don't wanna be, you know. - Yeah, you can message me, email me, you know, it's-- - What email would they, what email would they email? - Mine is pastsearchor@brithing.net. - Okay. - It's up on the website. - Okay. - It's on Facebook and everything, so you can contact even from Messenger if you wanted to. - Beautiful, beautiful. So you've guys got all your bases covered, got social media, blanketed, and you have a billboard sitting outside of somebody's house that may or may not be involved, but it certainly is a proactive move, I will say, and definitely one that is hard to avoid. - Yeah, and it just happens to be the perfect spot. - Just. - Don't get that very often, the perfect spot. - I tell you what, I think sometimes there are things that are meant to be, and that might just be the thing that brings this case to a close. - Yep, I am hoping we're praying for that. We're hoping 2022 will bring her home. - Well, 2022 has to bring us something positive, so after the past two years, we're really hoping for something, so, you know. Hey, there's a bunch of cases out there that I'd love to see solved, and this is one of them now, so thank you so much for coming on. - And thank you so much for having me. - Yeah, absolutely, and thank you for reaching out, and this is, again, people listening, this is how you can get your cases out there, if you want to reach out to me, you can always go on my website, sloburnmedia, or who killed him in mohalevic.com, and again, I'm open to talk about any of these cases because, you know, trying to give a voice for the voiceless is difficult, especially when the police don't seem to be very active in the investigation. So, Lori, thank you so much, and I appreciate you coming on. - Thank you so much for having us. - Excellent. And thank you guys so much for tuning in this week to episode 150 of Who Killed. I probably wouldn't have been here if it wasn't for the help of a lot of people, and I am very thankful to, oh, my mentors from True Crime Garage, family, to all that support, friends, good stuff. And as you guys know, by now, I do drop new episodes of Who Killed every Friday. If you enjoy this podcast or my other shows, you can directly support them by using my PayPal username @williamhuffman3, or you can contribute to the show via the Venmo app, with my username @bill-huffman-3. Now, every contribution, big or small, does help keep these slow-burn media podcasts running? You can also help support the show by leaving a five-star review on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Those five-stars help keep the important cases that I cover, such as Alicia Markovich, in the spotlight. So, if you'd like to stay up to date on the cases that I have covered, as well as the new shows that I have in the pipeline, please follow me on Twitter @billhuffman3. This case that we covered this week is really tragic, and there's not a lot of information out there. So, if somebody knows something, I just support you contacting your local FBI, or Crime Stoppers, and sharing a tip, because it's only gonna be solved when somebody decides to come forward. So, again, thank you so much for listening. Until next time, as always, be healthy and stay safe. (gentle music) Is the pressure of your wedding day being perfect from sunrise to sunset weighing on your mind? Planning a wedding can be stressful, but it shouldn't be, and that's why we're here to help. On the Bright Shillip podcast, we celebrate love and help you plan your wedding day. We're all about keeping it real and having fun every step of the way. So, whether you're just starting a plan or counting down the days, we're here to help you stay cool, calm, and collected. We have expert tips and amazing guests. Let's get this party started and embrace your inner Bright Shillip. 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